Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 05:35 AM - Re: Re: Small battery choice (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
2. 11:39 AM - bench power (bobnoffs)
3. 12:26 PM - Manual Battery Switch (C&K)
4. 01:46 PM - Re: bench power (Charlie England)
5. 02:00 PM - Re: bench power (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
6. 02:03 PM - Re: Manual Battery Switch (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
7. 02:18 PM - Re: Manual Battery Switch (rparigoris)
8. 03:58 PM - Re: bench power (bobnoffs)
9. 04:00 PM - Re: AeroElectric-List Digest: 14 Msgs - 01/23/21 (b j)
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| Subject: | Re: Small battery choice |
At 08:41 PM 1/24/2021, you wrote:
><dobrien@microfoundations.com>
>
>Here's what I'm doing. I'm buying two Power-sonics. They're so
>cheap that if they don't work well, it's water under the bridge. I
>can use them in my motorcycle!
>
>I'll report back on the results. Hopefully first start will occur
>in the next two months. Cant wait.
Looking forward to your experience and
observations . . .
Bob . . .
Un impeachable logic: George Carlin asked, "If black boxes
survive crashes, why don't they make the whole airplane
out of that stuff?"
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soon as the weather warms up a little [50 deg] i want to run my avionics and get
limits etc. set. i have decided i do not want a power supply that could fry
something if a knob gets bumped. i have gotten along 50 yrs without a power supply
on my bench and can easily live without a variable source.
anyone see any problems with connecting bench power thru the 'cig lighter' plug
in? it's 18 ga wire and i would never pull more than a few amps.
had i read something that powering an alternate field wire is not healthy?
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=500416#500416
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| Subject: | Manual Battery Switch |
Any recommendations for a reliable single pole manual battery switch
that would replace a traditional battery contactor? This is for a rotax
so starting current is relatively modest. There are lots of them listed
on Amazon, ebay, and automotive suppliers but all of them seem to have
complaints of falling apart or failing to work after a short time. I
would like to mount it on the engine side of the firewall and arrange
mechanical linkage to operable it from inside the cabin.
thanks
Ken
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On 1/25/2021 1:38 PM, bobnoffs wrote:
>
> soon as the weather warms up a little [50 deg] i want to run my avionics and
get limits etc. set. i have decided i do not want a power supply that could fry
something if a knob gets bumped. i have gotten along 50 yrs without a power
supply on my bench and can easily live without a variable source.
> anyone see any problems with connecting bench power thru the 'cig lighter'
plug in? it's 18 ga wire and i would never pull more than a few amps.
> had i read something that powering an alternate field wire is not healthy?
That's how I get 'shore power' to my RV6. But don't just assume that
'it's only a few amps'; verify actual load. My panel is probably pretty
typical for VFR panels with 'glass' flight instruments, and the 18 ga
supply wire gets fairly warm. I've just built another cable using 16 ga,
& will see how that goes. If the field circuit concerns you, just pull
the field CB or open the switch.
I understand your concern about accidental OV, but there are numerous
advantages to a fully controllable supply where you can limit current as
well as voltage.
Charlie
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>anyone see any problems with connecting bench power thru the 'cig
>lighter' plug in?
What is the power source? I used to sell
a power supply in this class for about 3x
the money. Sold quite a few. Builders would
power up accessories on the bench or, on
occasion, power up their airplanes with it.
https://tinyurl.com/y3vww5uv
> it's 18 ga wire and i would never pull more than a few amps.
It can't do anything worse than not work
and you're not going to crash your workbench.
Certainly gazillions of the things are
still in service in automobiles after
about 100 years . . . so why not?
>
> had i read something that powering an alternate field wire
> is not healthy?
Not sure what this question is about . . .
Bob . . .
Un impeachable logic: George Carlin asked, "If black boxes
survive crashes, why don't they make the whole airplane
out of that stuff?"
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| Subject: | Re: Manual Battery Switch |
At 02:25 PM 1/25/2021, you wrote:
>
>Any recommendations for a reliable single pole
>manual battery switch that would replace a
>traditional battery contactor?=C2 This is for a
>rotax so starting current is relatively
>modest.=C2 There are lots of them listed on
>Amazon, ebay, and automotive suppliers but all
>of them seem to have complaints of falling apart
>or failing to work after a short time.=C2 I would
>like to mount it on the engine side of the
>firewall and arrange mechanical linkage to operable it from inside the
cabin.
>thanks
There are no doubt some excellent choices
out there but one that I'm familiar with
is Cole-Hersee products. Check out this
puppy.
https://tinyurl.com/yyydc77r
Bob . . .
Un impeachable logic: George Carlin asked, "If black boxes
survive crashes, why don't they make the whole airplane
out of that stuff?"
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| Subject: | Re: Manual Battery Switch |
Hi Ken Not cheap but I'm using a Flaming River FR1013 on the starboard headrest
of Rotax 914 powered Europa. Battery is in rear. I looked at a number of switches,
even bought some and didn't like the looks of them, not robust enough. I'm
not flying yet but do like the looks of the Flaming River. They sell a number
of battery disconnect switches:
https://www.flamingriver.com/battery-disconnect-switches?p=1
Ron P.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=500421#500421
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when i use the 'bench power 'source i plan to only power a small part of my panel
at a time. a couple amps. my questions are1. is there something i may be applying
power to that may cause harm the way i plan to do it and 2. can anything
detrimental happen to the charging system if power is applied to the field wire.
sorry if i wasn't clear. i know this is kind of ambiguous as panel wiring
varies.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=500422#500422
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| Subject: | Re: AeroElectric-List Digest: 14 Msgs - 01/23/21 |
Remove from all lists
Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPad
On Sunday, January 24, 2021, 1:30 AM, AeroElectric-List Digest Server <aero
electric-list@matronics.com> wrote:
*
========================
=C2- Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive
========================
Today's complete AeroElectric-List Digest can also be found in either of th
e
two Web Links listed below.=C2- The .html file includes the Digest format
ted
in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked Indexes
and Message Navigation.=C2- The .txt file includes the plain ASCII versio
n
of the AeroElectric-List Digest and can be viewed with a generic text edito
r
such as Notepad or with a web browser.
HTML Version:
=C2- =C2- http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&
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=C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2
- =C2- =C2- AeroElectric-List Digest Archive
=C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2
- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- ---
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Messages Posted Sat 01/23/21: 14
=C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- ----------------------------------------
------------------
Today's Message Index:
----------------------
=C2- =C2- 1. 11:01 AM - Re: Re: Zeftronics Regulator Connection Questio
n=C2- (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
=C2- =C2- 2. 11:20 AM - Re: Zeftronics Regulator Connection Question=C2
- (racerjerry)
=C2- =C2- 3. 12:15 PM - Small battery choice=C2- (AdventureD)
=C2- =C2- 4. 12:38 PM - Re: Small battery choice=C2- (C&K)
=C2- =C2- 5. 01:05 PM - Re: Zeftronics Regulator Connection Question=C2
- (farmrjohn)
=C2- =C2- 6. 02:51 PM - Re: Stratux RS-232 Wx+Trfc Out to various navig
ators...=C2- (farmrjohn)
=C2- =C2- 7. 02:52 PM - Re: Small battery choice=C2- (Charlie England
)
=C2- =C2- 8. 03:00 PM - Re: Small battery choice=C2- (AdventureD)
=C2- =C2- 9. 03:05 PM - Re: Small battery choice=C2- (AdventureD)
=C2- =C2- 10. 04:04 PM - Re: Small battery choice=C2- (Kelly McMullen
)
=C2- =C2- 11. 04:51 PM - Re: Small battery choice=C2- (user9253)
=C2- =C2- 12. 06:21 PM - Re: Re: Small battery choice=C2- (Charlie En
gland)
=C2- =C2- 13. 07:24 PM - Re: Small battery choice=C2- (user9253)
=C2- =C2- 14. 07:59 PM - Re: Re: Small battery choice=C2- (Charlie En
gland)
________________________________=C2- Message 1=C2- ____________________
_________________
Time: 11:01:59 AM PST US
From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com>
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: Zeftronics Regulator Connection=C2- Q
uestion
I've updated the drawing that was attached to my last
reply to this thread. Interested readers can download
at:
https://tinyurl.com/yxg6hfrj
There are additional nuances to the Cessna alternator
incorporation philosophy that I may add later on
a second page to this drawing . . . will give
a heads-up when posted.
=C2- Bob . . .
=C2- Un impeachable logic: George Carlin asked, "If black boxes
=C2- survive crashes, why don't they make the whole airplane
=C2- out of that stuff?"
________________________________=C2- Message 2=C2- ____________________
_________________
Time: 11:20:46 AM PST US
Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Zeftronics Regulator Connection Question
From: "racerjerry" <gnking2@verizon.net>
Bob, Zeftronics offers an excellent troubleshooting guide for their voltage
regulators
online.=C2- The included diagrams MAY help to clear up some of the myster
y;
unfortunately, it's still a bit opaque for me.=C2- And yes, my guess is "
If it
ain't broke - Don't fix it" still applies.
https://www.zeftronics.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/Z13PS.pdf
--------
Jerry King
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=500385#500385
________________________________=C2- Message 3=C2- ____________________
_________________
Time: 12:15:15 PM PST US
Subject: AeroElectric-List: Small battery choice
From: "AdventureD" <dobrien@microfoundations.com>
Ordering two batteries for my ship (Z14, rear bats).=C2- Some years ago,
the good
doctor recommended three:
> A few exemplar brands and part numbers are:
> Panasonic LC-RD1217
> Odyssey PC680
> Power Sonic PSH-12180FR
The Power Sonic is cheapest (only $60! ... quite a schoke after spending $6
00 on
my Mooney batteries!) and available at Amazon.=C2- I figure there is not
a lot
of difference between these, but wanted to check if anyone had reason to pi
ck
one over the other (or another in same roughly 7"-7"-3" profile).
Cheers,
Dan
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=500386#500386
________________________________=C2- Message 4=C2- ____________________
_________________
Time: 12:38:40 PM PST US
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Small battery choice
From: C&K <yellowduckduo@gmail.com>
I've had very good results from the Dekka power sports batteries for
many years. The last ones I bought were ordered for pickup at Lowes.
American made.
Ken
On 23/01/2021 3:14 PM, AdventureD wrote:
>
> Ordering two batteries for my ship (Z14, rear bats).=C2- Some years ago
, the good
doctor recommended three:
>
>
>> A few exemplar brands and part numbers are:
>> Panasonic LC-RD1217
>> Odyssey PC680
>> Power Sonic PSH-12180FR
>
> The Power Sonic is cheapest (only $60! ... quite a schoke after spending
$600
on my Mooney batteries!) and available at Amazon.=C2- I figure there is n
ot a lot
of difference between these, but wanted to check if anyone had reason to pi
ck
one over the other (or another in same roughly 7"-7"-3" profile).
>
> Cheers,
> Dan
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=500386#500386
>
>
________________________________=C2- Message 5=C2- ____________________
_________________
Time: 01:05:35 PM PST US
Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Zeftronics Regulator Connection Question
From: "farmrjohn" <faithvineyard@yahoo.com>
This installation is not in a Cessna but on an Aircoupe with an O200 engine
wtih
alternator vs. the C90 it came with.=C2- It also does not have the over v
oltage
sensor installed, rather utilizes the EI voltage meter for warning.=C2- I
t looks
like the middle diagram on page 3 of the Zeftronics trouble shooting guide
=C2- would
show what happens and how it works if the alternator control switch is conn
ected
direct to the I terminal vs. the S terminal if I'm interpreting it correctl
y.
John
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=500389#500389
________________________________=C2- Message 6=C2- ____________________
_________________
Time: 02:51:12 PM PST US
Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Stratux RS-232 Wx+Trfc Out to various navig
ators...
From: "farmrjohn" <faithvineyard@yahoo.com>
Instead if a USB port for the RS232 out would it be possible to utilize the
ethernet
port with something like:=C2- https://tinyurl.com/yyqm2fgz
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=500390#500390
________________________________=C2- Message 7=C2- ____________________
_________________
Time: 02:52:25 PM PST US
From: Charlie England <ceengland7@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Small battery choice
On Sat, Jan 23, 2021 at 2:20 PM AdventureD <dobrien@microfoundations.com>
wrote:
> dobrien@microfoundations.com>
>
> Ordering two batteries for my ship (Z14, rear bats).=C2- Some years ago
, the
> good doctor recommended three:
>
>
> > A few exemplar brands and part numbers are:
> > Panasonic LC-RD1217
> > Odyssey PC680
> > Power Sonic PSH-12180FR
>
>
> The Power Sonic is cheapest (only $60! ... quite a schoke after spending
> $600 on my Mooney batteries!) and available at Amazon.=C2- I figure the
re is
> not a lot of difference between these, but wanted to check if anyone had
> reason to pick one over the other (or another in same roughly 7"-7"-3"
> profile).
>
> Cheers,
> Dan
>
Hi Dan,
I've run Power Sonic, and at least 2 or 3 other 'no name' brands in a/c
over the past 20+ years (probably everything *except* Odyssey), and I've
never been able to detect any 'real world' difference among the brands. I
buy the cheapest version I can find at the time, and it 'just works'. FWIW,
there's been some internet chatter lately among the RV-x drivers that the
current (pardon the pun) crop of Odysseys have had less than stellar
lifespans (and they obviously extract a premium from your pocketbook). I've
always gotten 4-6 years out of the no-name versions, with the only
exception being one that had a pin hole in the case (shipping damage that I
missed prior to installation). Even it lasted about a year before I noticed
diminished capacity.
FWIW, there are some higher AH versions available in almost identical case
sizes. The naming convention=C2- for most is like the PowerSonic:
12(voltage)18(AH)followed by another zero. If=C2- you search for '12200 S
LA
battery' or '12220 SLA battery' (and read the specs carefully), you can get
a 20 AH or 22AH that will fit in the same space, for about the same money.
One thing to notice on the 'no names' is that many are intended for deep
discharge applications (powered wheelchairs, etc), and will have slightly
higher internal resistance than a PC680 'starting battery'. By going to a
20 AH or 22AH version, the internal impedance will be roughly the same as
the PC680 (meaning same or better CCA), and the battery's *capacity* (total
energy content) will be 10%-15% greater than a PC680 (stuff will run longer
after an alternator failure).
My experience since late in the last century; YMMV, etc etc.
Charlie
________________________________=C2- Message 8=C2- ____________________
_________________
Time: 03:00:54 PM PST US
Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Small battery choice
From: "AdventureD" <dobrien@microfoundations.com>
A bit more on this -- with the redundancy I have in the Z14 system, I am no
t looking
for a high $$ battery.=C2- I am happy to change one out every year IF the
batteries
do a good job cranking the engine.=C2- I have a high compression IO550,
and the ability to close the cross feed to crank.=C2- How can I tell from
the data
sheets whether these batteries either alone or in combination are up to the
task?=C2- The Power Sonic datasheet reports a max of 270 amps for 5 secon
ds.=C2- There
seems to be all kinds of different reports online about what is required to
start an engine.=C2- I don't want to get batters that aren't up to the ta
sk.
Any thoughts appreciated.
Dan
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=500392#500392
________________________________=C2- Message 9=C2- ____________________
_________________
Time: 03:05:39 PM PST US
Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Small battery choice
From: "AdventureD" <dobrien@microfoundations.com>
Charlie, what engine are you cranking?
Best,
Dan
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=500393#500393
________________________________=C2- Message 10=C2- ___________________
_________________
Time: 04:04:17 PM PST US
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Small battery choice
From: Kelly McMullen <kellym@aviating.com>
Certainly not my experience. In aircraft, in Aridzona the typical
Concorde or Gill is good for 3-3.5 years. I have an Odyssey in my
homebuilt...a bigger 925 which has served well for 6 years. My tug uses
batteries in the size you are talking about. The manufacturer put in
Duracells. I tried generic and got 4 months. Paid twice as much for the
Duracells, and they are doing quite well.
On 1/23/2021 3:45 PM, Charlie England wrote:
>
>
> On Sat, Jan 23, 2021 at 2:20 PM AdventureD <dobrien@microfoundations.com
> <mailto:dobrien@microfoundations.com>> wrote:
>
>=C2- =C2-
> Hi Dan,
>
> I've run Power Sonic, and at least 2 or 3 other 'no name' brands in a/c
> overthe past 20+ years (probably everything *except* Odyssey), and I've
> never been able to detect any 'real world' difference among the brands.
> I buy the cheapest version I can find at the time, and it 'just works'.
> FWIW, there's been some internet chatter lately among the RV-x drivers
> that the current (pardon the pun) crop of Odysseyshave had less than
> stellar lifespans (and they obviously extract a premium from your
> pocketbook). I've always gotten 4-6 years out of the no-name versions,
> with the only exception being one that had a pin holein the case
> (shipping damage that I missed prior to installation). Even it lasted
> about a year before I noticed diminished capacity.
>
> FWIW, there are some higher AH versions available in almost identical
> case sizes. The naming convention for most is like the PowerSonic:
> 12(voltage)18(AH)followed by another zero. If you search for '12200 SLA
> battery' or '12220 SLA battery' (and read the specs carefully), you can
> get a 20 AH or 22AH that will fit in the same space, for about the same
> money. One thing to notice on the 'no names' is that many are intended
> for deep discharge applications (powered wheelchairs, etc), and will
> have slightly higher internal resistance than a PC680 'starting
> battery'. By going to a 20 AH or 22AH version, the internal impedance
> will be roughly the same as the PC680 (meaning same or better CCA), and
> the battery's *capacity* (total energy content) will be 10%-15% greater
> than a PC680 (stuff will run longer after an alternator failure).
>
> My experience since late in the last century; YMMV, etc etc.
>
> Charlie
________________________________=C2- Message 11=C2- ___________________
_________________
Time: 04:51:36 PM PST US
Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Small battery choice
From: "user9253" <fransew@gmail.com>
Compare the weight.=C2- Some batteries made in China claim to be 18 or 22
AH.=C2-
But when you look at the weight, they weigh less than a PC680 (15.4 pounds)
.
One deceiving trick is to use a larger case than necessary to hold the meag
er contents.
--------
Joe Gores
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=500395#500395
________________________________=C2- Message 12=C2- ___________________
_________________
Time: 06:21:40 PM PST US
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: Small battery choice
From: Charlie England <ceengland7@gmail.com>
On 1/23/2021 5:04 PM, AdventureD wrote:
>
> Charlie, what engine are you cranking?
>
> Best,
> Dan
>
O-320 8.5-1 compression for most of that time. Joe makes a reasonable
point for reality checks, but if you parallel a pair, just about
anything you purchase would crank just about any engine you choose.
Charlie
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________________________________=C2- Message 13=C2- ___________________
_________________
Time: 07:24:56 PM PST US
Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Small battery choice
From: "user9253" <fransew@gmail.com>
Here is another option: Mighty Max ML22-12GEL 12 Volt 22 AH
Can be ordered from Home Depot or Lowes
--------
Joe Gores
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=500398#500398
________________________________=C2- Message 14=C2- ___________________
_________________
Time: 07:59:13 PM PST US
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: Small battery choice
From: Charlie England <ceengland7@gmail.com>
On 1/23/2021 9:23 PM, user9253 wrote:
>
> Here is another option: Mighty Max ML22-12GEL 12 Volt 22 AH
> Can be ordered from Home Depot or Lowes
>
> --------
> Joe Gores
That looks like a reasonable option to me.
One measure for comparison (the easiest to find) is CCA (cold cranking
amps). A harder one to find in docs is internal resistance (impedance).
The PC680 is 7 milliohms (0.007). Most of the no-name stuff will be
around 0.008-0.015. The MM referenced is 0.014, which is still plenty
good enough to crank a 4 cyl Lyc, and would probably crank a 6 without
too much effort.
Odyssey
https://www.odysseybattery.com/products/ods-agm16l-battery-pc680/
MightyMax
https://smile.amazon.com/Mighty-Max-Battery-Brand-Product/dp/B01JNYYXII/ref
=smi_www_rco2_go_smi_g4368549507?_encoding=UTF8&%2AVersion%2A=1&%2Aen
tries%2A=0&ie=UTF8
Charlie
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