Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 06:50 AM - Rookie Question on RV-10 Battery Ground (Thomas Klammer)
2. 08:23 AM - Re: Primary Power Diagram RV-14 (Mudfly)
3. 10:23 AM - Re: Re: Building fusible links for FAT wires (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
4. 10:34 AM - Re: Rookie Question on RV-10 Battery Ground (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
5. 10:46 AM - Re: Re: Primary Power Diagram RV-14 (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
6. 10:47 AM - Re: Re: Building fusible links for FAT wires (Charlie England)
7. 04:50 PM - Re: Primary Power Diagram RV-14 (Mudfly)
8. 07:10 PM - Re: Primary Power Diagram RV-14 (johnbright)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Rookie Question on RV-10 Battery Ground |
Hi, I am reading Bobs book and am no longer sure about what a quality battery ground
looks like. Do I just install a short jumper between the battery negative
and the airframe? Or do I need to run a long wire from the battery negative
up to the firewall/instrument panel ground bus?
Tom
Sent from my iPhone
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Primary Power Diagram RV-14 |
[quote="johnbright"]Any chance of a future episode switching the acres of breakers
for fuses? (except for alternator fields with crowbar OV protection) Would
make the physical implementation easier and save panel space.[/quote]
"Acres of Breakers" ..could be an interesting episode:). I know it makes
sense.
The RV14 has a nice spot on the fwd/center tunnel for CBs or Fuses. Most
builders seem to use CBs. Doesn't make it right. I do have a couple that I
would like to collar for quick identification in case I need to pull them. I
will
give it more consideration as my planning continues. Never know.
I'm heading out to work for a few days. I will take my diagrams and review
all comments and recommendations.
I'm considering removing the two shunts and replacing with one hall effect
sensor. Also, I will review wire and CB/Fuse sizing.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=510234#510234
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Building fusible links for FAT wires |
>My load analysis for four cylinder SDS EFI+I ship shows 44A with both
>pumps running in addition to pitot heat, seat heat, lambda sensor,
>landing nav and strobe lights, dual Skyview and its accessories
>so in reality 8 awg is not a problem.
8AWG wire has 0.63 milliOhms/ft. At 60A full alternator
load, this would drop 60 x 0.00063 = 0.038 or 38 milliVolts
per foot of b-lead. A trivial significance even if you
were able to achieve this unlikely operating load.
You are correct, this single conductor hanging out in the air
would not be at risk for compromise in your proposed
configuration.
My drawings tend to show 4AWG throughout the FAT wire
matrix because it works in the full constellation of
situations. It minimizes the need to scrounge up
little chunks of assorted wire sizes, terminals and
crimp tools just to satisfy some design goal for
'optimizing' wire sizes . . . especially since 'optimal'
has no industry wide definition. The weight penalties
for a slightly oversized wire are very small
while the fabrication and procurement benefits for
'one size fits all' are significant.
My '87 pick-em-up truck has an 10AWG b-lead feeder.
Alternators for that truck could be as beefy as 90A!
Hmmmm . . . 90A x 0.001 ohms/ft x 2 feet is 0.180
volts . . . ho hum. The wire is hanging out in a big
breeze.
Speaking of crimp tools . . .
A few years ago I snapped up a Harbor Freight
offering for a hand-held, hydraulic crimping
tool that came with a set of hex dies. The
dies proved to be next to useless . . . too
large of step between the graduation of sizes.
Took the thing back to HF.
A new kid on the block has appeared on Amazon,
et. als. with a more granular selection of hex
dimensions. I'm doing some test crimps on various
combinations of materials and developing a
process by which the OBAM aircraft builder's
probability of reliable crimps is very high.
Here's one of many examples:
https://tinyurl.com/2e8evels
There are offerings with more than 9 die
sets but these tend to add big honk'n
dies for wire that your airplane could
could not lift!
Watch this space . . .
Bob . . .
Un impeachable logic: George Carlin asked, "If black boxes
survive crashes, why don't they make the whole airplane
out of that stuff?"
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Rookie Question on RV-10 Battery Ground |
At 08:49 AM 2/18/2023, you wrote:
<t_klammer@yahoo.com>
>
>Hi, I am reading Bob=99s book and am no longer
>sure about what a quality battery ground looks
>like. Do I just install a short jumper between
>the battery negative and the airframe? Or do I
>need to run a long wire from the battery
>negative up to the firewall/instrument panel ground bus?
Check out the Obrien battery installation photos
here:
https://tinyurl.com/2ysep667
A robust electrical connection to airframe is
sufficient. Also, note the welding cable
jumpers off the battery terminals . . . even
if you choose 22759 FAT wires for everything
else, welding cable battery leads make life
much more pleasant for removal/replacement
of batteries.
Bob . . .
Un impeachable logic: George Carlin asked, "If black boxes
survive crashes, why don't they make the whole airplane
out of that stuff?"
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Primary Power Diagram RV-14 |
At 10:23 AM 2/18/2023, you wrote:
<shawntedwards@hotmail.com>
>
>[quote="johnbright"]Any chance of a future
>episode switching the =9Cacres of breakers=9D
>for fuses? (except for alternator fields with
>crowbar OV protection) Would make the physical
>implementation easier and save panel space.[/quote]
Here's a couple of pieces I wrote a few years back . . .
https://tinyurl.com/yrc7kv7d
https://tinyurl.com/fbma3s4x
Breakers tend to occupy valuable panel space
that might be useful for other purposes. They
are a temptation to troubleshoot a non-responsive
system in flight . . . almost as bad as texting.
They're expensive compared to fuses yet they
contribute nothing extra to reduction of risk.
Bob . . .
Un impeachable logic: George Carlin asked, "If black boxes
survive crashes, why don't they make the whole airplane
out of that stuff?"
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Building fusible links for FAT wires |
> A new kid on the block has appeared on Amazon,
> et. als. with a more granular selection of hex
> dimensions. I'm doing some test crimps on various
> combinations of materials and developing a
> process by which the OBAM aircraft builder's
> probability of reliable crimps is very high.
>
> Here's one of many examples:
>
> https://tinyurl.com/2e8evels
>
> There are offerings with more than 9 die
> sets but these tend to add big honk'n
> dies for wire that your airplane could
> could not lift!
>
> Watch this space . . .
>
> Bob . . .
>
I've got a similar unit; biggest issue for me was that the dies are
labeled in metric sizes, with no cross reference. So when I was using it
I had to 'guestimate' which die set to use. Looks like the current
selection has a cross reference.
Charlie
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Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Primary Power Diagram RV-14 |
Here's a couple of pieces I wrote a few years back . . .
[url=https://tinyurl.com/yrc7kv7d] https://tinyurl.com/yrc7kv7d[/url]
[url=https://tinyurl.com/fbma3s4x] https://tinyurl.com/fbma3s4x[/url]
Breakers tend to occupy valuable panel space
that might be useful for other purposes. They
are a temptation to troubleshoot a non-responsive
system in flight . . . almost as bad as texting.
They're expensive compared to fuses yet they
contribute nothing extra to reduction of risk.
Bob . . .
Un impeachable logic: George Carlin asked, "If black boxes
survive crashes, why don't they make the whole airplane
out of that stuff?"[/quote]
Thanks Bob,
Good info. I'd like to say I never reset a CB. It is a natural reaction, especially
under stress, to want to immediately solve the problem.
Something about just seeing that CB popped make most want to
push it back in with out thinking. A fuse would definitely force you to
focus on more important things.
I'm moving fuse research and placement ideas to my To Do list.
Shawn
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=510243#510243
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Primary Power Diagram RV-14 |
[quote="nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelect"]At 10:23 AM 2/18/2023, you wrote:
> -->
> Here's a couple of pieces I wrote a few years back . . .
>
> https://tinyurl.com/yrc7kv7d (https://tinyurl.com/yrc7kv7d)
In the link above Bob speaks of his rule #2 of his system reliability list, here
are the others three. https://docs.google.com/document/d/1fwaXzXEBKR_Zm20XM3ZFv3y7zT4h-XBKu4ByTtEqdjM/edit
--------
John Bright, RV-6A, at FWF, O-360
Z-101 single batt dual alt SDS EM-5-F.
john_s_bright@yahoo.com, Newport News, Va
https://drive.google.com/folderview?id=1u6GeZo6pmBWsKykLNVQMvu4o1VEVyP4K
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=510244#510244
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