Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 07:58 AM - Re: GPS IFR requirements (DOUGPFLYRV@aol.com)
2. 08:47 AM - Re: GPS IFR requirements (springcanyon)
3. 08:57 AM - Re: GPS IFR requirements (DOUGPFLYRV@aol.com)
4. 09:27 AM - Re: GPS IFR requirements (Richard Dudley)
5. 10:04 AM - Re: GPS IFR requirements (Franz Fux)
6. 12:41 PM - ARC R402A Marker Beacon Receiver (Dave Zilz)
7. 02:47 PM - MD200-306 indicator and dual navs ()
8. 03:13 PM - Re: GPS IFR requirements (DOUGPFLYRV@aol.com)
9. 03:14 PM - Re: GPS IFR requirements (DOUGPFLYRV@aol.com)
10. 03:42 PM - Re: GPS IFR requirements ()
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: GPS IFR requirements |
--> Avionics-List message posted by: DOUGPFLYRV@aol.com
Could someone please advise the email address & phone # for the wing tip
antennas?
Thanks
Doug Preston
#40372
Message 2
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| Subject: | GPS IFR requirements |
--> Avionics-List message posted by: "springcanyon" <springcanyon@mymethow.com>
Hi Doug,
Bob Archer: 310-316-8796 The guy is very helpful. I installed his vor
antenna in my RV-7 wing tip. It was quite straight forward.
Don Owens
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-avionics-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-avionics-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of
DOUGPFLYRV@aol.com
Subject: Re: Avionics-List: GPS IFR requirements
--> Avionics-List message posted by: DOUGPFLYRV@aol.com
Could someone please advise the email address & phone # for the wing tip
antennas?
Thanks
Doug Preston
#40372
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: GPS IFR requirements |
--> Avionics-List message posted by: DOUGPFLYRV@aol.com
Thanks. Had used 1 before in 6A and worked fine. That was several years ago
and I couldn't find his info.
Regards,
Doug
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: GPS IFR requirements |
--> Avionics-List message posted by: Richard Dudley <rhdudley@att.net>
Doug,
They are also available from Aircraft Spruce. That's where I purchased mine.
Regards,
RHDudley
-6A flying
DOUGPFLYRV@aol.com wrote:
>--> Avionics-List message posted by: DOUGPFLYRV@aol.com
>
>Could someone please advise the email address & phone # for the wing tip
>antennas?
>Thanks
>
>Doug Preston
>#40372
>
>
>
>
Message 5
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| Subject: | GPS IFR requirements |
--> Avionics-List message posted by: "Franz Fux" <franz@lastfrontierheli.com>
Hi Doug,
I have a brand new Archer Com wingtip antenna for sale if you are
interested, contact me off list at franz@lastfrontierheli.com
Franz, RV7A wiring
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-avionics-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-avionics-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Richard
Dudley
Subject: Re: Avionics-List: GPS IFR requirements
--> Avionics-List message posted by: Richard Dudley <rhdudley@att.net>
Doug,
They are also available from Aircraft Spruce. That's where I purchased mine.
Regards,
RHDudley
-6A flying
DOUGPFLYRV@aol.com wrote:
>--> Avionics-List message posted by: DOUGPFLYRV@aol.com
>
>Could someone please advise the email address & phone # for the wing tip
>antennas?
>Thanks
>
>Doug Preston
>#40372
>
>
--
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Message 6
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| Subject: | ARC R402A Marker Beacon Receiver |
--> Avionics-List message posted by: "Dave Zilz" <z4t143@hotmail.com>
I'm looking for a Pin Out diagram for an ARC R402A Marker Beacon Receiver. Can
anyone point me to such a document?
Thx
Dave
Message 7
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| Subject: | MD200-306 indicator and dual navs |
INNOCENT GLOBAL 0.0268 1.0000 -4.1053
--> Avionics-List message posted by: <bakerocb@cox.net>
11/20/2005
Hello Old Bob, Right you are (see below) and thanks for the opportunity to
amplify.
When I wrote "You may have runway end location from a data
base....skip...." I had in mind three possible end of runway location
sources using a data base instead of just field lat long printed on the
approach plate, but I did not want to digress that extensively. They are:
1) As you suggest if the GPS has an IFR data base one can call up the
identification of the localizer as a destination and then use an approach
plate's description of the end of the runway from that localizer to provide
end of runway location.
2) One can call up the actual end of runway waypoint from the GPS IFR data
base if that waypoint is contained therein. Usually in the form of a five
letter missed approach waypoint such as SHENA on the GPS RWY 22 approach to
Culpeper VA Regional (CJR).
3) Or if one is operating with a VFR only GPS that does not contain
internally either of the two IFR data points described above one can get a
compact disc from NACO
http://www.naco.faa.gov/index.asp?xml=naco/catalog/charts/digital/daicd that
contains the latitude and longitude of all navigation aids and put in the
lat long of the localizer as a user identified waypoint and use an approach
plate's description of the end of the runway from that localizer to provide
end of runway location.
A minor technicallity is to realize that the DME antenna is not co located
with the localizer antenna. Instead the DME antenna is usually installed on
the nearby electronics shack that feeds the localizer antenna. Since there
are normally just a few yards between the electronic shack supporting the
DME antenna and the localizer antenna, that distance difference is of no
significance if one is using the localizer antenna lat long location as also
being the DME antenna location.
OC
AeroElectric-List message previously posted by: BobsV35B@aol.com
In a message dated 11/19/2005 12:51:17 P.M. Central Standard Time,
bakerocb@cox.net writes:
<<Note that field location and runway center line can come in varying
degrees
of precision depending upon the information available. You may have runway
end location from a data base and instrument approach quality runway
alignment from an approach plate. You may only have the field location from
a data base or the field lat long printed on an approach plate. You may
only
have the numbers painted on the runway for your runway alignment.
Regardless
of the source or precision the big picture provided can be of value to
you.>>
Good Afternoon OC,
All that you say is consistent with my understanding of the system, but It
may be helpful for folks to realize that you CAN select the site of the
localizer associated DME transceiver.
That is very helpful when shooting an ILS or localizer approach because all
waypoints along that course will be delineated by that DME site.
For the original Garmin units, that site can be found in the waypoint
section listed under the associated identifier. As an example, at Rockford
Illinois (KRFD) LOC (BACK CRS) Rwy 19 approach, the DME site will have
IRFD
as the identifier of the waypoint. I am not sure how they are handling the
480.
When it was an UPSAT unit, they had that waypoint on a dedicated page for
such
locations. In any case, the localizer associated DME site will always use
the same four letter identifier as the approach being executed.
The difficulty using airport identifier delineated waypoints (Airport
Reference Point) is that it is difficult to find where that point is at many
airports. Jeppesen posts them on the airport view at some, but not all,
airports
as the ARP. NACO rarely lists them at all other than giving the long/lat.
Happy Skies, Old Bob
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: GPS IFR requirements |
--> Avionics-List message posted by: DOUGPFLYRV@aol.com
Thanks. I have a question for Mr. Archer.
DP
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: GPS IFR requirements |
--> Avionics-List message posted by: DOUGPFLYRV@aol.com
Thanks, but I am going to use the bent whip for comms.
DP
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: GPS IFR requirements |
INNOCENT GLOBAL 0.4999 1.0000 0.0000
--> Avionics-List message posted by: <bakerocb@cox.net>
11/20/2005
Hello Bill, Thanks for your quick response copied below. Unfortunately I
think that the instructor you referred to gave you some facts jumbled in
with some unsupported opinion BS. There appears to be three issues involved
here. They are aerobatic testing, major modification testing, and IFR
testing.
1) Regarding aerobatic testing here is what FAA Order 8130.2F currently says
should go into the Operating Limitations and what the builder pilot must do:
"(15) This aircraft is prohibited from aerobatic flight, that is, an
intentional maneuver involving
an abrupt change in the aircraft's attitude, an abnormal attitude, or
abnormal acceleration not necessary for normal flight.
NOTE: If the builder states that the aircraft is capable of aerobatic
flight,
limitation 16 will be used in lieu of limitation 15.
(16) This aircraft may conduct aerobatic flight in accordance with the
provisions of 91.303.
Aerobatics must not be attempted until sufficient flight experience has been
gained to establish that the aircraft is satisfactorily controllable and in
compliance with 91.319(b). The aircraft may only conduct those aerobatic
flight maneuvers that have been satisfactorily accomplished during flight
testing and recorded in the aircraft maintenance records by use of the
following, or a similarly worded, statement: "I certify that the following
aerobatic maneuvers have been test flown and that the aircraft is
controllable throughout the maneuvers' normal range of speeds, and is safe
for operation. The flight-tested aerobatic maneuvers are _________,
_________, __________, and __________."
NOTE: Aerobatic flights may be permitted in the assigned test area. The
applicant should be advised that aerobatics or violent maneuvers should not
be attempted until sufficient flight experience has been gained to establish
that the aircraft is satisfactorily controllable. These operating
limitations may
be modified to include only those aerobatics/maneuvers that have been
satisfactorily accomplished and recorded in the aircraft records during the
flight test period. These aerobatic maneuvers should be permitted upon
leaving the assigned test area. Appropriate limitations identifying the
aerobatics/maneuvers and conditions under which they may be performed
should be prescribed. The FAA may witness aerobatic maneuvers if deemed
necessary."
That should cover the issue of ".....skip.....you had to perform all the
manuvers in the test phase
that you were going to use in the 'grown up airplane' phase." The instructor
was correct for aerobatic testing.
2) Regarding major modification testing here is what FAA Order 8130.2F
currently says should go into the Operating Limitations and what the builder
pilot must do:
"(19) After incorporating a major change as described in 21.93, the
aircraft owner is required
to reestablish compliance with 91.319(b) and notify the geographically
responsible FSDO of the
location of the proposed test area. The aircraft owner must obtain
concurrence from the FSDO
as to the suitability of the proposed test area. If the major change
includes installing a different
type of engine (reciprocating to turbine) or a change of a fixed-pitch from
or to a controllable propeller, the aircraft owner must fill out a revised
Form 8130-6 to update the aircraft's file in the FAA Aircraft Registry. All
operations must be conducted under day VFR conditions in a sparsely
populated area. The aircraft must remain in flight test for a minimum of 5
hours. The FSDO may require additional time (more than 5 hours) depending on
the extent of the modification. Persons nonessential to the flight must not
be carried. The aircraft owner must make a detailed logbook entry describing
the change before the test flight. Following satisfactory completion of the
required number of flight hours in the flight test area, the pilot must
certify in the records that the aircraft has been shown to comply with
91.319(b). Compliance with 91.319(b) must be recorded in the aircraft
records with the following, or a similarly worded, statement: "I certify
that the prescribed flight test hours have been completed and the aircraft
is controllable throughout its normal range of speeds and throughout all
maneuvers to be executed, has no hazardous characteristics or design
features, and is safe foroperation. The following aircraft operating data
has been demonstrated during the flight testing:speeds Vso ______, Vx
______, and Vy ______, and the weight ______, and CG location ______ at
which they were obtained.""
The instructor was correct to the extent that there is a requirement for
reentering the test phase, but that requirement exists only after a major
modification to the aircraft.
3) Regarding IFR testing here is what FAA Order 8130.2F currently says
should go into the Operating Limitations and what the builder pilot must do:
"(8) After completion of phase I flight testing, unless appropriately
equipped for night
and/or instrument flight in accordance with 91.205, this aircraft is to be
operated under VFR, day only."
That is it. As you can see the instructor's position regarding required
instrument flight testing is not supported by the pertinent basic documents.
But any rational builder-pilot should make every reasonable effort to
properly equip and test his airplane for IFR flight, if that is his goal,
and to comply with the appropriate provisions of the AIM and relevant
Advisory Circulars. Not because the FAA has set up the administrative
machinery to force him to do so, but because it is in his, and the amateur
builder's community, best interest to do so.
OC
----- Original Message -----
From: "William" <wschertz@ispwest.com>
Subject: Re: GPS IFR requirements
>I took the Sport air course on test flying your project, and I believe the
>statement was that you had to perform all the manuvers in the test phase
>that you were going to use in the 'grown up airplane' phase. i.e. if you
>are going to do loops, you must do a loop in the test phase and state that
>in your list of things done. When asked about IFR and the fact that you
>can't have a safety pilot along, the instructor stated that you 'do the
>ILS' under VFR conditions, verifying that the equipment does what it is
>supposed to do.
> At a separte point, i asked if you wanted to extend a performance point,
> and he stated that you take it back to test phase, do the tests, and then
> bring it out.
> Bill Schertz KIS Cruiser # 4045
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