---------------------------------------------------------- Avionics-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Thu 01/17/08: 10 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 11:04 AM - IFR GPS requirements () 2. 11:59 AM - Re: IFR GPS requirements (John Grosse) 3. 12:18 PM - Re: IFR GPS requirements (6440 Auto Parts) 4. 12:20 PM - Re: IFR GPS requirements (FLAGSTONE) 5. 01:57 PM - Re: IFR GPS requirements (Peck Gaillard R Ctr USAFWS/CBD Training) 6. 02:09 PM - Re: IFR GPS requirements (William Gill) 7. 02:10 PM - Re: IFR GPS requirements (NYTerminat@aol.com) 8. 02:42 PM - Re: IFR GPS requirements () 9. 05:08 PM - Re: IFR GPS requirements (Jay Rowe) 10. 11:41 PM - Re: VHF Transmitting Noise (jetboy) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 11:04:40 AM PST US From: Subject: Avionics-List: IFR GPS requirements 1/17/2008 Hello Rick, Thanks for your input and interest in this subject. You wrote: 1) "It depends on what the inspector wrote into you ops limits." The FAA Inspector or DAR is directed by FAA Order 8130.2_ (edition F, with change 3 incorporated is the current version) what to write into the Operating Limitations when issuing the Special Airworthiness Certificate for an amateur built experimental aircraft. His prerogative to ad lib in this specific area (IFR GPS requirements) is extremely limited to non existent. 2) "If he referenced 91.205 as a requirement for IFR flight, then you must get the system tested by an FAA certified shop." and "If not you can proceed as you wish." These two statements are misleading / incorrect. 2A) First off, There is no "if" about it. He most certainly will reference 91.205 as a requirement for IFR flight. He will do this by incorporating this statement into the Operating Limitations: "After completion of phase 1 testing, unless appropriately equipped for night and/or instrument flight in accordance with 91.205, this aircraft is to be operated VFR day only." See paragraph 1 above. 2B) Second, Other than the normal regulatory requirements for periodic inspections of the altitude encoder, the altimeter, and the transponder (these inspection requirements also apply to type certificated aircraft) there is no requirement to "get the system tested by an FAA certified shop." 2C) Third, It is not clear what you mean when you write the word "system". I have prepared a table that serves as a quick reference on this subject: MINIMUM INSTRUMENT AND EQUIPMENT REQUIREMENTS FOR POWERED AMATEUR BUILT EXPERIMENTAL AIRCRAFT. I will email a copy of this table to any reader requesting it. 'OC' Says: "The best investment we can make is the effort to gather and understand knowledge." ------------------------------------------------------- Time: 06:50:54 AM PST US From: "Richard Girard" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: IFR GPS requirements Peter, et al, It depends on what the inspector wrote into you ops limits. If he referenced 91.205 as a requirement for IFR flight, then you must get the system tested by an FAA certified shop. If not you can proceed as you wish. In the Ops Limits I received yesterday, Item 11: "After completion of phase 1 testing, unless appropriately equipped for night and/or instrument flight in accordance with 91.205, this aircraft is to be operated VFR day only." Rick Girard ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 11:59:25 AM PST US From: John Grosse Subject: Re: Avionics-List: IFR GPS requirements I'd like a copy please. John Grosse > > > I have prepared a table that serves as a quick reference on this subject: > > MINIMUM INSTRUMENT AND EQUIPMENT REQUIREMENTS FOR POWERED AMATEUR > BUILT EXPERIMENTAL AIRCRAFT. > > I will email a copy of this table to any reader requesting it. > > ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 12:18:59 PM PST US From: "6440 Auto Parts" Subject: Re: Avionics-List: IFR GPS requirements OC, I did a quick Google and came up with http://www.rainierultralightengines.com/forms/Minimum_Inst_Requirements.pdf By Owen C. Baker, that,s the one, aint it ? Might save you a lot of time sending out individually. Randy ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Grosse" Sent: Thursday, January 17, 2008 1:55 PM Subject: Re: Avionics-List: IFR GPS requirements > > I'd like a copy please. > > John Grosse > >> >> >> I have prepared a table that serves as a quick reference on this subject: >> >> MINIMUM INSTRUMENT AND EQUIPMENT REQUIREMENTS FOR POWERED AMATEUR BUILT >> EXPERIMENTAL AIRCRAFT. >> >> I will email a copy of this table to any reader requesting it. >> >> > > > -- > 269.19.5/1228 - Release Date: 1/16/2008 9:01 AM > > ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 12:20:13 PM PST US From: "FLAGSTONE" Subject: Re: Avionics-List: IFR GPS requirements Ditto Mark ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Grosse" Sent: Thursday, January 17, 2008 11:55 AM Subject: Re: Avionics-List: IFR GPS requirements > > I'd like a copy please. > > John Grosse > > > > > > > I have prepared a table that serves as a quick reference on this subject: > > > > MINIMUM INSTRUMENT AND EQUIPMENT REQUIREMENTS FOR POWERED AMATEUR > > BUILT EXPERIMENTAL AIRCRAFT. > > > > I will email a copy of this table to any reader requesting it. > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 01:57:28 PM PST US Subject: RE: Avionics-List: IFR GPS requirements From: "Peck Gaillard R Ctr USAFWS/CBD Training" I have prepared a table that serves as a quick reference on this subject: > > > > MINIMUM INSTRUMENT AND EQUIPMENT REQUIREMENTS FOR POWERED AMATEUR > > BUILT EXPERIMENTAL AIRCRAFT. > > > > I will email a copy of this table to any reader requesting it. Me too! Gaillard.peck.ctr@nellis.af.mil Thanks, Gail Peck RV-8 (tail almost complete) -----Original Message----- From: owner-avionics-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-avionics-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of FLAGSTONE Sent: Friday, January 18, 2008 12:19 AM Subject: Re: Avionics-List: IFR GPS requirements Ditto Mark ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Grosse" Sent: Thursday, January 17, 2008 11:55 AM Subject: Re: Avionics-List: IFR GPS requirements > > I'd like a copy please. > > John Grosse > > > > > > > I have prepared a table that serves as a quick reference on this subject: > > > > MINIMUM INSTRUMENT AND EQUIPMENT REQUIREMENTS FOR POWERED AMATEUR > > BUILT EXPERIMENTAL AIRCRAFT. > > > > I will email a copy of this table to any reader requesting it. > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 02:09:32 PM PST US From: "William Gill" Subject: RE: Avionics-List: IFR GPS requirements I'd like a copy please. Thanks. Bill -----Original Message----- From: owner-avionics-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-avionics-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Peck Gaillard R Ctr USAFWS/CBD Training Sent: Thursday, January 17, 2008 3:55 PM Subject: RE: Avionics-List: IFR GPS requirements Training" I have prepared a table that serves as a quick reference on this subject: > > > > MINIMUM INSTRUMENT AND EQUIPMENT REQUIREMENTS FOR POWERED AMATEUR > > BUILT EXPERIMENTAL AIRCRAFT. > > > > I will email a copy of this table to any reader requesting it. Me too! Gaillard.peck.ctr@nellis.af.mil Thanks, Gail Peck RV-8 (tail almost complete) -----Original Message----- From: owner-avionics-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-avionics-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of FLAGSTONE Sent: Friday, January 18, 2008 12:19 AM Subject: Re: Avionics-List: IFR GPS requirements Ditto Mark ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Grosse" Sent: Thursday, January 17, 2008 11:55 AM Subject: Re: Avionics-List: IFR GPS requirements > > I'd like a copy please. > > John Grosse > > > > > > > I have prepared a table that serves as a quick reference on this subject: > > > > MINIMUM INSTRUMENT AND EQUIPMENT REQUIREMENTS FOR POWERED AMATEUR > > BUILT EXPERIMENTAL AIRCRAFT. > > > > I will email a copy of this table to any reader requesting it. > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 02:10:44 PM PST US From: NYTerminat@aol.com Subject: Re: Avionics-List: IFR GPS requirements I would like one too please. Bob Spudis In a message dated 1/17/2008 3:02:06 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, grosseair@comcast.net writes: --> Avionics-List message posted by: John Grosse I'd like a copy please. John Grosse > > > I have prepared a table that serves as a quick reference on this subject: > > MINIMUM INSTRUMENT AND EQUIPMENT REQUIREMENTS FOR POWERED AMATEUR > BUILT EXPERIMENTAL AIRCRAFT. > > I will email a copy of this table to any reader requesting it. **************Start the year off right. Easy ways to stay in shape. http://body.aol.com/fitness/winter-exercise?NCID=aolcmp00300000002489 ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 02:42:28 PM PST US Subject: RE: Avionics-List: IFR GPS requirements From: Gail, It's probably easier to post it, but yes, I'd like a copy. Thanks Do Not Archive -----Original Message----- From: owner-avionics-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-avionics-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Peck Gaillard R Ctr USAFWS/CBD Training Sent: Thursday, January 17, 2008 4:55 PM Subject: RE: Avionics-List: IFR GPS requirements --> Training" I have prepared a table that serves as a quick reference on this subject: > > > > MINIMUM INSTRUMENT AND EQUIPMENT REQUIREMENTS FOR POWERED AMATEUR > > BUILT EXPERIMENTAL AIRCRAFT. > > > > I will email a copy of this table to any reader requesting it. Me too! Gaillard.peck.ctr@nellis.af.mil Thanks, Gail Peck RV-8 (tail almost complete) -----Original Message----- From: owner-avionics-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-avionics-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of FLAGSTONE Sent: Friday, January 18, 2008 12:19 AM Subject: Re: Avionics-List: IFR GPS requirements Ditto Mark ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Grosse" Sent: Thursday, January 17, 2008 11:55 AM Subject: Re: Avionics-List: IFR GPS requirements > > I'd like a copy please. > > John Grosse > > > > > > > I have prepared a table that serves as a quick reference on this subject: > > > > MINIMUM INSTRUMENT AND EQUIPMENT REQUIREMENTS FOR POWERED AMATEUR > > BUILT EXPERIMENTAL AIRCRAFT. > > > > I will email a copy of this table to any reader requesting it. > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 05:08:03 PM PST US From: "Jay Rowe" Subject: Re: Avionics-List: IFR GPS requirements Please send me a copy. Jay Rowe jfrjr@roadrunner.com ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; ; Sent: Thursday, January 17, 2008 2:01 PM Subject: Avionics-List: IFR GPS requirements > > 1/17/2008 > > Hello Rick, Thanks for your input and interest in this subject. You wrote: > > 1) "It depends on what the inspector wrote into you ops limits." > > The FAA Inspector or DAR is directed by FAA Order 8130.2_ (edition F, with > change 3 incorporated is the current version) what to write into the > Operating Limitations when issuing the Special Airworthiness Certificate for > an amateur built experimental aircraft. His prerogative to ad lib in this > specific area (IFR GPS requirements) is extremely limited to non existent. > > 2) "If he referenced 91.205 as a requirement for IFR flight, then you must > get the > system tested by an FAA certified shop." and "If not you can proceed as you > wish." > > These two statements are misleading / incorrect. > > 2A) First off, There is no "if" about it. He most certainly will reference > 91.205 as a requirement for IFR flight. He will do this by incorporating > this statement into the Operating Limitations: "After completion of phase 1 > testing, unless appropriately equipped for night and/or instrument flight in > accordance with 91.205, this aircraft is to be operated VFR day only." See > paragraph 1 above. > > 2B) Second, Other than the normal regulatory requirements for periodic > inspections of the altitude encoder, the altimeter, and the transponder > (these inspection requirements also apply to type certificated aircraft) > there is no requirement to "get the system tested by an FAA certified shop." > > 2C) Third, It is not clear what you mean when you write the word "system". > > I have prepared a table that serves as a quick reference on this subject: > > MINIMUM INSTRUMENT AND EQUIPMENT REQUIREMENTS FOR POWERED AMATEUR BUILT > EXPERIMENTAL AIRCRAFT. > > I will email a copy of this table to any reader requesting it. > > 'OC' Says: "The best investment we can make is the effort to gather and > understand knowledge." > > ------------------------------------------------------- > > Time: 06:50:54 AM PST US > From: "Richard Girard" > Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: IFR GPS requirements > > Peter, et al, It depends on what the inspector wrote into you ops limits. If > he referenced 91.205 as a requirement for IFR flight, then you must get the > system tested by an FAA certified shop. If not you can proceed as you wish. > In the Ops Limits I received yesterday, Item 11: > "After completion of phase 1 testing, unless appropriately equipped for > night and/or instrument flight in accordance with 91.205, this aircraft is > to be operated VFR day only." > > Rick Girard > > > > > > > > -- 1/17/2008 11:12 AM > > ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 11:41:19 PM PST US Subject: Avionics-List: Re: VHF Transmitting Noise From: "jetboy" Bill, Another thing to check is that the sidetone produced by the IC 200 is not adding to any sidetone provided by the PS intercom. There might be instructions about this on the PS engineering site. The IC 200 can be withdrawn from its tray, on the top cover there will be an adjustment hole marked "S-tone" which you can reset all the way back or fwd as the case may be, to prevent the radio putting a sample of your voice into the earphones during transmission. I expect the intercom already does this for you, so you dont require it twice. Ralph -------- Ralph - CH701 / 2200a Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=158970#158970 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message avionics-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Avionics-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/avionics-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/avionics-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.