Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 02:49 AM - Re: a couple changes... (Bill Bow)
2. 02:49 AM - Re: a couple changes... (Bill Bow)
3. 02:58 AM - Re: Calling center (Bill Bow)
4. 05:32 AM - Re: Calling center (Stephen Crow)
5. 06:09 AM - Re: Calling center (Bill Bow)
6. 06:18 AM - engine (Bill Bow)
7. 06:20 AM - Re: Calling center (Stephen Crow)
8. 03:07 PM - Re: Calling center (Nico van Niekerk)
9. 03:46 PM - Re: Calling center (J.R. Sprayberry)
10. 04:30 PM - Re: Calling center (Andrew & Bridget Watson)
11. 05:59 PM - Re: Calling center (Nico van Niekerk)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: a couple changes... |
--> Commander-List message posted by: "Bill Bow" <bowing74@earthlink.net>
OH
bilbo
----- Original Message -----
From: <CloudCraft@aol.com>
Subject: Re: Commander-List: a couple changes...
> --> Commander-List message posted by: CloudCraft@aol.com
>
> In a message dated 05/16/03 04:45:57 Pacific Daylight Time,
> bowing74@earthlink.net writes:
>
>
> > then I'm not one of the "with you at ....." people either.
>
> I'm with you on that!
>
> Be sure to note the sarcastic, exasperated tone in my voice when I say,
> "Over," used when ATC doesn't answer.
>
> Wing Commander Gordon
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: a couple changes... |
--> Commander-List message posted by: "Bill Bow" <bowing74@earthlink.net>
Timing is everything. I think about 3 am when the "roll on" freighters are
out. It might be well received.
bilbo
----- Original Message -----
From: <CloudCraft@aol.com>
Subject: Re: Commander-List: a couple changes...
> --> Commander-List message posted by: CloudCraft@aol.com
>
> In a message dated 05/16/03 05:05:49 Pacific Daylight Time,
> crunk12@bellsouth.net writes:
>
>
> > My standard modus operandi for those situations is to reply, "Sorry, I
was
> > on the land line".
> >
>
> That's terrific!
>
> Some day I'll have the courage to say, "Thank you for calling (Falcon
_____
> / Commander _______ ). Your call is very important to us. No one is in
to
> take your call right now, but if you leave your Center name, frequency and
a
> brief message, we'll get back to you as soon as we can. Again, thank you
for
> calling and wait for the beep."
>
> Have to pick the right Center ... Albuquerque would like it, but I think
> Cleveland will just hang up and not leave a message.
>
> Wing Commander Gordon
>
>
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Calling center |
--> Commander-List message posted by: "Bill Bow" <bowing74@earthlink.net>
You picked my favorite approach facility(SoCal now). After 12 years of
flying UPS DC-8's into ONT. One controller asked me to hold 250K to Petis
NDB, cleared for the ILS 26L. I advised him I could hold the 250 to Petis
but there would be no chance of impacting the planet anywhere near the
Ontario airport.("The 8" was a little challenged without speedbrakes)
bilbo
----- Original Message -----
From: <MOEMILLS@aol.com>
Subject: Re: Commander-List: Calling center
> --> Commander-List message posted by: MOEMILLS@aol.com
>
> Gents:
>
> As my voice gets older I have noticed that always starting each
transmission
> with "and," and the use of words such as tallyho, Roger, wilco, over, and
> "with you" work much better than they did 20 years ago, although the fraze
> "Roger Wilco, over and out" does not seem to get me any points with
approach
> when they give me long winded instructions, and advise me to call
Hawthorne
> tower.
>
> I agree with always being courtious to ATC. Several years ago Ontario
(CA)
> approach told me to "hold in right turns and expect call back in 20
minutes"
> when I called and asked permission to "clip the corner of their ARSA".
>
> Moe Mills
> N680RR
>
>
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Calling center |
--> Commander-List message posted by: Stephen Crow <k4cpx@arrl.net>
Hey Bilbo buddy......I'll profess my ignorance, but you gotta 'splain that ONT
post???
Steve C.
=======================================
----- Original Message -----
From: Bill Bow
To: commander-list@matronics.com
Sent: Saturday, May 17, 2003 5:57 AM
Subject: Re: Commander-List: Calling center
--> Commander-List message posted by: "Bill Bow" <bowing74@earthlink.net>
You picked my favorite approach facility(SoCal now). After 12 years of
flying UPS DC-8's into ONT. One controller asked me to hold 250K to Petis
NDB, cleared for the ILS 26L. I advised him I could hold the 250 to Petis
but there would be no chance of impacting the planet anywhere near the
Ontario airport.("The 8" was a little challenged without speedbrakes)
bilbo
----- Original Message -----
From: <MOEMILLS@aol.com>
To: <commander-list@matronics.com>
Subject: Re: Commander-List: Calling center
>
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Calling center |
--> Commander-List message posted by: "Bill Bow" <bowing74@earthlink.net>
Sorry,
I was replying to Moe's post which referenced Ontario,Ca approach Control,
now SoCal Approach. We had been flying DC-8's in there for years(more that
10) and they should have had a good idea of what the 8 could and couldn't
do. They can't slow down and go down. They have no speedbrakes, instead
the 8 would reverse the inboard engines to slow down and/or go down, a
procedure the company did not want us to use on a regular basis.
Had I crossed the NDB(12.6 miles from touchdown) he referenced, at the speed
he referenced(250K), we could not have slowed the airplane to configured and
land at the ONT airport. The controller only gave us about half of the
needed space we needed.
Sorry to get off the "beaten path" with this thing.
hope this makes sense:>)
bilbo
----- Original Message -----
From: "Stephen Crow" <k4cpx@arrl.net>
Subject: Re: Commander-List: Calling center
> --> Commander-List message posted by: Stephen Crow <k4cpx@arrl.net>
>
> Hey Bilbo buddy......I'll profess my ignorance, but you gotta 'splain that
ONT post???
> Steve C.
> =======================================
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Bill Bow
> To: commander-list@matronics.com
> Sent: Saturday, May 17, 2003 5:57 AM
> Subject: Re: Commander-List: Calling center
>
>
> --> Commander-List message posted by: "Bill Bow"
<bowing74@earthlink.net>
>
> You picked my favorite approach facility(SoCal now). After 12 years of
> flying UPS DC-8's into ONT. One controller asked me to hold 250K to
Petis
> NDB, cleared for the ILS 26L. I advised him I could hold the 250 to
Petis
> but there would be no chance of impacting the planet anywhere near the
> Ontario airport.("The 8" was a little challenged without speedbrakes)
>
> bilbo
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <MOEMILLS@aol.com>
> To: <commander-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: Re: Commander-List: Calling center
>
>
> >
>
>
Message 6
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--> Commander-List message posted by: "Bill Bow" <bowing74@earthlink.net>
Well the engine shop called today and I think I am getting an award for
timing. I got all there was to get out of that engine, before it would have
quit. It was supposed to have 800 hours on it. But, when you buy an
airplane with a circuit breaker on the Hobbs meter, I guess you never know.
I got about 75 hours out of it in 2 years, really 18 months, It was broke
the other 6.
At this point they are going to have the cam reground and build an engine
around it. Sure am glad it is one of those "CHEAP" IO-470 Continentals.
bilbo
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Calling center |
--> Commander-List message posted by: Stephen Crow <k4cpx@arrl.net>
Yeah, Bilbo, I understand now. Thanks......But....reverse buckets in flight? No
gear switches to activate? Also how's the new MOH engine coming along? Steve
C.
==============================================
----- Original Message -----
From: Bill Bow
To: commander-list@matronics.com
Sent: Saturday, May 17, 2003 9:09 AM
Subject: Re: Commander-List: Calling center
--> Commander-List message posted by: "Bill Bow" <bowing74@earthlink.net>
Sorry,
I was replying to Moe's post which referenced Ontario,Ca approach Control,
now SoCal Approach. We had been flying DC-8's in there for years(more that
10) and they should have had a good idea of what the 8 could and couldn't
do. They can't slow down and go down. They have no speedbrakes, instead
the 8 would reverse the inboard engines to slow down and/or go down, a
procedure the company did not want us to use on a regular basis.
Had I crossed the NDB(12.6 miles from touchdown) he referenced, at the speed
he referenced(250K), we could not have slowed the airplane to configured and
land at the ONT airport. The controller only gave us about half of the
needed space we needed.
Sorry to get off the "beaten path" with this thing.
hope this makes sense:>)
bilbo
----- Original Message -----
From: "Stephen Crow" <k4cpx@arrl.net>
To: <commander-list@matronics.com>
Subject: Re: Commander-List: Calling center
> --> Commander-List message posted by: Stephen Crow <k4cpx@arrl.net>
>
> Hey Bilbo buddy......I'll profess my ignorance, but you gotta 'splain that
ONT post???
> Steve C.
> =======================================
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Bill Bow
> To: commander-list@matronics.com
> Sent: Saturday, May 17, 2003 5:57 AM
> Subject: Re: Commander-List: Calling center
>
>
> --> Commander-List message posted by: "Bill Bow"
<bowing74@earthlink.net>
>
> You picked my favorite approach facility(SoCal now). After 12 years of
> flying UPS DC-8's into ONT. One controller asked me to hold 250K to
Petis
> NDB, cleared for the ILS 26L. I advised him I could hold the 250 to
Petis
> but there would be no chance of impacting the planet anywhere near the
> Ontario airport.("The 8" was a little challenged without speedbrakes)
>
> bilbo
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <MOEMILLS@aol.com>
> To: <commander-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: Re: Commander-List: Calling center
>
>
> >
>
>
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Calling center |
--> Commander-List message posted by: "Nico van Niekerk" <nico@cybersuperstore.com>
I always wondered what would happen if one were to put a turboprop or a jet
in reverse thrust in flight. Will it rip the engines off the pylons?
----- Original Message -----
From: "Stephen Crow" <k4cpx@arrl.net>
Subject: Re: Commander-List: Calling center
> --> Commander-List message posted by: Stephen Crow <k4cpx@arrl.net>
>
> Yeah, Bilbo, I understand now. Thanks......But....reverse buckets in
flight? No gear switches to activate? Also how's the new MOH engine coming
along? Steve C.
> ==============================================
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Bill Bow
> To: commander-list@matronics.com
> Sent: Saturday, May 17, 2003 9:09 AM
> Subject: Re: Commander-List: Calling center
>
>
> --> Commander-List message posted by: "Bill Bow"
<bowing74@earthlink.net>
>
> Sorry,
>
> I was replying to Moe's post which referenced Ontario,Ca approach
Control,
> now SoCal Approach. We had been flying DC-8's in there for years(more
that
> 10) and they should have had a good idea of what the 8 could and
couldn't
> do. They can't slow down and go down. They have no speedbrakes,
instead
> the 8 would reverse the inboard engines to slow down and/or go down, a
> procedure the company did not want us to use on a regular basis.
>
> Had I crossed the NDB(12.6 miles from touchdown) he referenced, at the
speed
> he referenced(250K), we could not have slowed the airplane to configured
and
> land at the ONT airport. The controller only gave us about half of the
> needed space we needed.
>
> Sorry to get off the "beaten path" with this thing.
>
> hope this makes sense:>)
> bilbo
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Stephen Crow" <k4cpx@arrl.net>
> To: <commander-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: Re: Commander-List: Calling center
>
>
> > --> Commander-List message posted by: Stephen Crow <k4cpx@arrl.net>
> >
> > Hey Bilbo buddy......I'll profess my ignorance, but you gotta 'splain
that
> ONT post???
> > Steve C.
> > =======================================
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: Bill Bow
> > To: commander-list@matronics.com
> > Sent: Saturday, May 17, 2003 5:57 AM
> > Subject: Re: Commander-List: Calling center
> >
> >
> > --> Commander-List message posted by: "Bill Bow"
> <bowing74@earthlink.net>
> >
> > You picked my favorite approach facility(SoCal now). After 12 years
of
> > flying UPS DC-8's into ONT. One controller asked me to hold 250K to
> Petis
> > NDB, cleared for the ILS 26L. I advised him I could hold the 250 to
> Petis
> > but there would be no chance of impacting the planet anywhere near
the
> > Ontario airport.("The 8" was a little challenged without
speedbrakes)
> >
> > bilbo
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: <MOEMILLS@aol.com>
> > To: <commander-list@matronics.com>
> > Subject: Re: Commander-List: Calling center
> >
> >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Calling center |
--> Commander-List message posted by: "J.R. Sprayberry" <capnspray@hotmail.com>
Nico, As Bilbo said the DC-8 was approved for the inboards to be put in
reverse, and as for the Turbo Props, the L-188 Lockeed Electra was approved
for all four in reverse if needed, or lets say flat pitch which was about 2'
reverse pitch. at 1500 ft. when the end of the runway disappeared under the
nose, you could land on the first 500ft. of runway. Please don't quote me on
the specifics because it was only 38 years ago. huh
JR Spray
N198JW
AC680FP
----- Original Message -----
From: "Nico van Niekerk" <nico@cybersuperstore.com>
Subject: Re: Commander-List: Calling center
> --> Commander-List message posted by: "Nico van Niekerk"
<nico@cybersuperstore.com>
>
> I always wondered what would happen if one were to put a turboprop or a
jet
> in reverse thrust in flight. Will it rip the engines off the pylons?
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Stephen Crow" <k4cpx@arrl.net>
> To: <commander-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: Re: Commander-List: Calling center
>
>
> > --> Commander-List message posted by: Stephen Crow <k4cpx@arrl.net>
> >
> > Yeah, Bilbo, I understand now. Thanks......But....reverse buckets in
> flight? No gear switches to activate? Also how's the new MOH engine
coming
> along? Steve C.
> > ==============================================
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: Bill Bow
> > To: commander-list@matronics.com
> > Sent: Saturday, May 17, 2003 9:09 AM
> > Subject: Re: Commander-List: Calling center
> >
> >
> > --> Commander-List message posted by: "Bill Bow"
> <bowing74@earthlink.net>
> >
> > Sorry,
> >
> > I was replying to Moe's post which referenced Ontario,Ca approach
> Control,
> > now SoCal Approach. We had been flying DC-8's in there for years(more
> that
> > 10) and they should have had a good idea of what the 8 could and
> couldn't
> > do. They can't slow down and go down. They have no speedbrakes,
> instead
> > the 8 would reverse the inboard engines to slow down and/or go down, a
> > procedure the company did not want us to use on a regular basis.
> >
> > Had I crossed the NDB(12.6 miles from touchdown) he referenced, at the
> speed
> > he referenced(250K), we could not have slowed the airplane to
configured
> and
> > land at the ONT airport. The controller only gave us about half of
the
> > needed space we needed.
> >
> > Sorry to get off the "beaten path" with this thing.
> >
> > hope this makes sense:>)
> > bilbo
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Stephen Crow" <k4cpx@arrl.net>
> > To: <commander-list@matronics.com>
> > Subject: Re: Commander-List: Calling center
> >
> >
> > > --> Commander-List message posted by: Stephen Crow <k4cpx@arrl.net>
> > >
> > > Hey Bilbo buddy......I'll profess my ignorance, but you gotta
'splain
> that
> > ONT post???
> > > Steve C.
> > > =======================================
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: Bill Bow
> > > To: commander-list@matronics.com
> > > Sent: Saturday, May 17, 2003 5:57 AM
> > > Subject: Re: Commander-List: Calling center
> > >
> > >
> > > --> Commander-List message posted by: "Bill Bow"
> > <bowing74@earthlink.net>
> > >
> > > You picked my favorite approach facility(SoCal now). After 12
years
> of
> > > flying UPS DC-8's into ONT. One controller asked me to hold 250K
to
> > Petis
> > > NDB, cleared for the ILS 26L. I advised him I could hold the 250
to
> > Petis
> > > but there would be no chance of impacting the planet anywhere near
> the
> > > Ontario airport.("The 8" was a little challenged without
> speedbrakes)
> > >
> > > bilbo
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: <MOEMILLS@aol.com>
> > > To: <commander-list@matronics.com>
> > > Subject: Re: Commander-List: Calling center
> > >
> > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Calling center |
--> Commander-List message posted by: Andrew & Bridget Watson <andrew.bridget@shaw.ca>
Nico, I don't know if you remember the Pretoria Skydiving guys at
Wonderboom - they used to fly a Pilatus Porter and the pilot used to race
the guys down - he'd put the nose down and come down vertically, pull out
about 50 feet from the ground, land and taxi up to the fuel pumps before the
first skydiver hit the ground. Apparently the Porter is one of the few
aircraft that you can put in beta power while airborne.
It always scared the hell out of me when he did that.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Nico van Niekerk" <nico@cybersuperstore.com>
Subject: Re: Commander-List: Calling center
> --> Commander-List message posted by: "Nico van Niekerk"
<nico@cybersuperstore.com>
>
> I always wondered what would happen if one were to put a turboprop or a
jet
> in reverse thrust in flight. Will it rip the engines off the pylons?
>
Message 11
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|
| Subject: | Re: Calling center |
--> Commander-List message posted by: "Nico van Niekerk" <nico@cybersuperstore.com>
You're right, Andrew. I had forgotten about that. Mike Snoyman (he died last
year I think) and those guys. I remember the Pilatus standing on its nose
all the way down. I did a few flights for them in a C206 and a C182 but I
have never flown the Pilatus.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Andrew & Bridget Watson" <andrew.bridget@shaw.ca>
Subject: Re: Commander-List: Calling center
> --> Commander-List message posted by: Andrew & Bridget Watson
<andrew.bridget@shaw.ca>
>
> Nico, I don't know if you remember the Pretoria Skydiving guys at
> Wonderboom - they used to fly a Pilatus Porter and the pilot used to race
> the guys down - he'd put the nose down and come down vertically, pull out
> about 50 feet from the ground, land and taxi up to the fuel pumps before
the
> first skydiver hit the ground. Apparently the Porter is one of the few
> aircraft that you can put in beta power while airborne.
>
> It always scared the hell out of me when he did that.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Nico van Niekerk" <nico@cybersuperstore.com>
> To: <commander-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: Re: Commander-List: Calling center
>
>
> > --> Commander-List message posted by: "Nico van Niekerk"
> <nico@cybersuperstore.com>
> >
> > I always wondered what would happen if one were to put a turboprop or a
> jet
> > in reverse thrust in flight. Will it rip the engines off the pylons?
> >
>
>
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