Commander-List Digest Archive

Wed 04/11/07


Total Messages Posted: 3



Today's Message Index:
----------------------
 
     1. 06:57 AM - GSIO-540 - comments, common failures, bugs, running (Philip Guziec)
     2. 07:43 AM - Re: GSIO-540 - comments, common failures, bugs, running (Moe - Ross Racing Pistons)
     3. 09:38 AM - Re: GSIO-540 - comments, common failures, bugs, running (WINGFLYER1@aol.com)
 
 
 


Message 1


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    Time: 06:57:42 AM PST US
    From: Philip Guziec <philipguziec@yahoo.com>
    Subject: GSIO-540 - comments, common failures, bugs, running
    >I don `t profess to be an expert because I have only flown my 680 with the >GSO-480-B1-A6 (340 hp engines ) fifty hours. I can tell you that it is one >powerful machine! The times on my engines are 350 hours and 10 hours on the >props. When I fire the engines up I can hear a little clanging going on due to >the props but after it is warmed up and about 1200 RPM the props are loaded and >you don `t hear anything from the gears. My oil consumption is running about >a third to half quart an hour. It seems to be coming from the breather tube >and not burning any at all. I think maybe I `ll try an air/oil seperator. I >have had nothing but a good experience with the engines thus far. Thanks Gil. I figured 380 hp a side would make for one stellar and quiet performer. What are our operating procedures? Do you leave the mixture levers forward and let the altitude compensation system set the mixture? What power settings are you running in cruise and what's the fuel burn like? I have a few hours on an Aztec F. How do you operate your 680 differently than the Aztec with regards to the geared engines? >I have flown a bit over 500hrs on my 680E Commander (GSO 480B1A6) I have >also ferries a couple of 680s in various states of disrepair and neglect. Even >engines that have been sitting idel for many years come back to life and >perfrome great. Here is the skinny. The GSO 480 is a GERAT ENGINE!!! they almos >alwas make or exceed TBO (1400hr). They are very smooth and very strong >running. I drive a 1967 SS 427 El Camino (among other old muscle cars) and the >Commander will out run most of them on T.O. The engines have pressure carbs >(think throttle body F.I.) These are very depedibal and relatively inexpensive >to overhaul. Good to know, jb. What's the gross on the 680E? How it perform on one engine? One of the big reasons I'm considering an excalibur Tbone is the performance if I lose one on takeoff with four people and bags in the airplane. >Now for the bad news. The geared, supercharged engines can be hurt by >miss handling them. If properly flown, no problem, fly them like their direct >drive brethren, big problem. Learning to properly fly them is no real issue, >but does require a bit of training and discipline. How do they need to be handled differently than the unsupercharged geared engines, and what kind of damage comes about from mishandling? >I have no real experience with the IGSO 540 but have heard little good >about them. I am aware of several premature failures and they seem to seldom >make their TBO (only 1200hr). Can you share the specifics of the failures you've heard about? Are they gearbox, blown jugs, broken cranks? In flight or found during annual? Another question I have is regarding the operation of the geared engines. I understand that you want to keep the gears from chattering near idle power, but do you always need to keep them positively loaded? Can you make sure the props are producing some power or producing some braking, but make sure you don't leave the power near zero thrust? How do you handle reduction to idle on landing? Thanks for all the help. Phil


    Message 2


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    Time: 07:43:43 AM PST US
    From: "Moe - Ross Racing Pistons" <moe@rosspistons.com>
    Subject: GSIO-540 - comments, common failures, bugs, running
    The IGSO540B1A (or C or B) engines are pretty much of a strange animal. I have a little more that 800 hours of flight in a 680F(p). The main problems are: 1. Simmonds fuel injection system. $ 4,000.00 each to overhaul, and the mixture lever requires constant attention on the ground as the pumps use oil pressure to opeate the internal "computer". Only one company in the world can legally overhaul them, and as soon as you get them back take your plane to Morris and get him to "fine tune" them. 2. The ease with which they can be overboosted (even on the ground). 3. If you have an IGSO540B1A it should be converted to an IGSO540B1C (get rid of the mags that use 12 separate coils, and go to normal mags.) This will save you a lot of weight, money, and headaches. 4. They are the shortest TBO of any engine that Lycoming ever built, and the most expensive to overhaul (between $ 42,000.00 and $ 67,000.00 each a couple of years ago). Conventional wisdom rumors are that a top overhaul will be required on each engine at about 600 hours. Figure about $ 125.00 to $ 150.00 per hour for the engines, and you will be OK. 5. Don't ever run one out of fuel while in flight. Restarting takes a long time, and the re-fire is so jerkey, that you stand a good chance of serious injury to the gear box. 6. Taxi can be very hard on the brakes (double so with the air conditioner on) because you want to keep the engine RPM above 1,200 at all times (1,500 is better) If you let someone else start the engines (mechanic for instance) be darn sure that they know not to let the engines idle below 1,200 RPM. 7. At altitude run between 75F and 100F lean of peak at about 65% power. The good news is that they make good power even at a high altitude hot airfield. Ya gotta love 'em to run 'em Moe Mills 680F(p) _____ From: owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of YOURTCFG@aol.com Sent: Tuesday, April 10, 2007 10:04 PM Subject: Re: Commander-List: GSIO-540 - comments, common failures, bugs, running In a message dated 4/10/2007 6:57:03 AM Pacific Daylight Time, philipguziec@yahoo.com writes: GO 480, but I'd be really interested in talking to someone who as actually flown behind GSIO 480s I have flown a bit over 500hrs on my 680E Commander (GSO 480B1A6) I have also ferries a couple of 680s in various states of disrepair and neglect. Even engines that have been sitting idel for many years come back to life and perfrome great. Here is the skinny. The GSO 480 is a GERAT ENGINE!!! they almos alwas make or exceed TBO (1400hr). They are very smooth and very strong running. I drive a 1967 SS 427 El Camino (among other old muscle cars) and the Commander will out run most of them on T.O. The engines have pressure carbs (think throttle body F.I.) These are very depedibal and relatively inexpensive to overhaul. Now for the bad news. The geared, supercharged engines can be hurt by miss handling them. If properly flown, no problem, fly them like their direct drive brethren, big problem. Learning to properly fly them is no real issue, but does require a bit of training and discipline. I have no real experience with the IGSO 540 but have heard little good about them. I am aware of several premature failures and they seem to seldom make their TBO (only 1200hr). jb _____ See what's free at AOL.com <http://www.aol.com?ncid=AOLAOF00020000000503> .


    Message 3


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    Time: 09:38:15 AM PST US
    From: WINGFLYER1@aol.com
    Subject: Re: GSIO-540 - comments, common failures, bugs, running
    Phil, I don`t touch the mixture at all. I let the compensators do their work. I run the engines @ 65% .2600RPM and 30" burns about 17 Gal an hour per engine (34 Gal.) if you want to go faster 40" and 3,000RPM will burn around 40 Gallons an hour both engines. I try to be as easy on the props as I can and do not move them abruptly. I also plan my descent so that the engines and props are always pulling and then ease the props back once I am leveled off. As I said I have only flown the 680 fifty hours and am always trying to learn from you guys with experience. Thanks Gil ************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.




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