---------------------------------------------------------- Commander-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Wed 10/31/07: 15 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 01:26 AM - Re: Commander training (nico css) 2. 05:29 AM - Re: Commander training (CloudCraft@aol.com) 3. 06:28 AM - Re: Commander training (MASON CHEVAILLIER) 4. 07:35 AM - Re: Commander training (BillLeff1@aol.com) 5. 07:40 AM - Re: Commander training (BillLeff1@aol.com) 6. 07:40 AM - Re: Engine Failures Update (BillLeff1@aol.com) 7. 11:41 AM - Engine Analyzer (Randy Dettmer, AIA) 8. 11:54 AM - Re: Engine Analyzer (Robert Feldtman) 9. 12:49 PM - Re: Engine Analyzer (MASON CHEVAILLIER) 10. 02:28 PM - Re: Engine Analyzer (John Vormbaum) 11. 02:32 PM - Re: Engine Analyzer (Randy Dettmer, AIA) 12. 02:46 PM - Re: Engine Analyzer (MASON CHEVAILLIER) 13. 02:55 PM - Re: Engine Analyzer (John Vormbaum) 14. 03:03 PM - Re: Engine Analyzer (Randy Dettmer, AIA) 15. 09:34 PM - Re: Engine Analyzer (BillLeff1@aol.com) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 01:26:23 AM PST US From: "nico css" Subject: RE: Commander-List: Commander training Was that cop going for his gun or did he pull his cuffs? The video ends as he holds something in his hand that looks suspiciously like cuffs. Bill, were you cuffed for that? As a side-note. Why did they make that other guy pull over? It would be interesting to hear. Nico -----Original Message----- From: owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Catherine Chagnot Sent: Tuesday, October 30, 2007 6:40 PM Subject: Re: Commander-List: Commander training Hi All, I trained in my 680E with Bill Leff and just want to say that he's more than knowledgeable, and that the training was through and very professional. I don't know of anyone that has his range of experience and knowledge of Commanders, nor such an absolute command of the aircraft. I'll be going back to Bill on a regular basis for recurrent training. I was up in fond du Lac recently and saw where he landed on the highway when he lost the engine on his T-6. It's really hard to believe how low those wires were that he flew under and that he was able to put the plane down safely on that crowded highway. Proof of the kind of pilot he is was in that landing.......If you haven't seen the 'cop-cam' video of the landing you click here to see it. The video doesn't show the wires he flew under (unbelievably low) nor the bounce over the cop car that took the movie. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8K-NFM2wgmw Cate ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 05:29:15 AM PST US From: CloudCraft@aol.com Subject: Re: Commander-List: Commander training In a message dated 31-Oct-07 01:27:07 Pacific Daylight Time, nico@cybersuperstore.com writes: As a side-note. Why did they make that other guy pull over? It would be interesting to hear. They pulled that other guy over for driving on the runway. ~KG~ ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 06:28:17 AM PST US From: MASON CHEVAILLIER Subject: RE: Commander-List: Commander training he was a witness. From: CloudCraft@aol.comDate: Wed, 31 Oct 2007 08:28:29 -0400Subject: Re: C ommander-List: Commander trainingTo: commander-list@matronics.com In a message dated 31-Oct-07 01:27:07 Pacific Daylight Time, nico@cybersupe rstore.com writes: As a side-note. Why did they make that other guy pull over? It would be int eresting to hear. They pulled that other guy over for driving on the runway. ~KG~ ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 07:35:12 AM PST US From: BillLeff1@aol.com Subject: Re: Commander-List: Commander training In the unedited cop video the white car cut passed and cut off the police cars. They were not happy. They did let them go because they were foreign visitors going to OSH. They stopped to take a picture! Bill ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 07:40:00 AM PST US From: BillLeff1@aol.com Subject: Re: Commander-List: Commander training The officer was turning down the volume on the radio that was on his belt. As he cane up to me he said "Man I about peed in my pants!" All of the police were very friendly and professional. The local Patrol Post was selling the video for $5. The city sent me a bill for $36 for oil dry the fireman put under the plane. The State charged $1600 for the sign I hit. Bill ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 07:40:41 AM PST US From: BillLeff1@aol.com Subject: Re: Commander-List: Engine Failures Update I agree. Bill ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 11:41:42 AM PST US From: "Randy Dettmer, AIA" Subject: Commander-List: Engine Analyzer I am looking at installing an engine analyzer on my 680F when I hang the re-built engines in several weeks. Any advice out there on recommended systems and prices..?? John Vormbaum, I believe that you had a system installed on your 500B. What system was it and how much did it cost..?? I am also interested in any advice from you experienced geared Commander guys about recommended procedures for breaking in and operating the new engines. You can believe that I will want to be VERY conservative in treating those engines with TLC. Thanks. Randy Dettmer, AIA 680F / N6253X 663 Hill Street, San Luis Obispo, CA 93405 805 541 4864 / Fax 805 541 4865 http://www.dettmerarchitecture.com/ ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 11:54:52 AM PST US From: "Robert Feldtman" Subject: Re: Commander-List: Engine Analyzer ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 12:49:19 PM PST US From: MASON CHEVAILLIER Subject: RE: Commander-List: Engine Analyzer rd, i have found the JPI units to be very helpful on three different aircra ft. mason From: rcdettmer@charter.netTo: commander-list@matronics.comSubject: Command er-List: Engine AnalyzerDate: Wed, 31 Oct 2007 11:40:52 -0700 I am looking at installing an engine analyzer on my 680F when I hang the re -built engines in several weeks. Any advice out there on recommended syste ms and prices..?? John Vormbaum, I believe that you had a system installed on your 500B. What system was it and how much did it cost..?? I am also interested in any advice from you experienced geared Commander guys about r ecommended procedures for breaking in and operating the new engines. You c an believe that I will want to be VERY conservative in treating those engin es with TLC. Thanks. 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It cost ~$5k IIRC, and it's worth every penny. You could do it for less, but I added on the optional fuel totalizer, and I love it. The JPI is a very capable unit (moreso than the EI units I compared them to) and I really like the software that comes with it, allowing you to download all your flight history & engine behavior. I HIGHLY recommend it. If nothing else, it'll pay for itself in fuel in a few years. /John MASON CHEVAILLIER wrote: > rd, i have found the JPI units to be very helpful on three different > aircraft. mason > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > From: rcdettmer@charter.net > To: commander-list@matronics.com > Subject: Commander-List: Engine Analyzer > Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2007 11:40:52 -0700 > > I am looking at installing an engine analyzer on my 680F when I > hang the re-built engines in several weeks. Any advice out there > on recommended systems and prices..?? John Vormbaum, I believe > that you had a system installed on your 500B. What system was it > and how much did it cost..?? I am also interested in any advice > from you experienced geared Commander guys about recommended > procedures for breaking in and operating the new engines. You can > believe that I will want to be VERY conservative in treating those > engines with TLC. Thanks. > > > > Randy Dettmer, AIA > > 680F / N6253X > > > > > > *663 Hill Street, San Luis Obispo, CA 93405* > > *805 541 4864 / Fax 805 541 4865* > > *http://www.dettmerarchitecture.com/*** > > > > > __________ NOD32 2521 (20070911) Information __________ > ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 02:32:45 PM PST US From: "Randy Dettmer, AIA" Subject: RE: Commander-List: Engine Analyzer Was that $5K installed or uninstalled..?? Thanks. RD 663 Hill Street, San Luis Obispo, CA 93405 805 541 4864 / Fax 805 541 4865 http://www.dettmerarchitecture.com/ -----Original Message----- From: owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of John Vormbaum Sent: Wednesday, October 31, 2007 2:26 PM Subject: Re: Commander-List: Engine Analyzer Hi Randy, I had the JPI EDM-760 Twin engine analyzer put in my airplane last year. It cost ~$5k IIRC, and it's worth every penny. You could do it for less, but I added on the optional fuel totalizer, and I love it. The JPI is a very capable unit (moreso than the EI units I compared them to) and I really like the software that comes with it, allowing you to download all your flight history & engine behavior. I HIGHLY recommend it. If nothing else, it'll pay for itself in fuel in a few years. /John MASON CHEVAILLIER wrote: > rd, i have found the JPI units to be very helpful on three different > aircraft. mason > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- -- > From: rcdettmer@charter.net > To: commander-list@matronics.com > Subject: Commander-List: Engine Analyzer > Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2007 11:40:52 -0700 > > I am looking at installing an engine analyzer on my 680F when I > hang the re-built engines in several weeks. Any advice out there > on recommended systems and prices..?? John Vormbaum, I believe > that you had a system installed on your 500B. What system was it > and how much did it cost..?? I am also interested in any advice > from you experienced geared Commander guys about recommended > procedures for breaking in and operating the new engines. You can > believe that I will want to be VERY conservative in treating those > engines with TLC. Thanks. > > > Randy Dettmer, AIA > > 680F / N6253X > > > *663 Hill Street, San Luis Obispo, CA 93405* > > *805 541 4864 / Fax 805 541 4865* > > *http://www.dettmerarchitecture.com/*** > > > __________ NOD32 2521 (20070911) Information __________ > ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 02:46:53 PM PST US From: MASON CHEVAILLIER Subject: RE: Commander-List: Engine Analyzer rd, one unit per side has worked out well. mason to see commander aero inst all google 2001M > Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2007 14:26:12 -0700> From: john@vormbaum.com> To: comma nder-list@matronics.com> Subject: Re: Commander-List: Engine Analyzer> > -- Randy,> > I had the JPI EDM-760 Twin engine analyzer put in my airplane la st year. > It cost ~$5k IIRC, and it's worth every penny. You could do it f or less, > but I added on the optional fuel totalizer, and I love it. The J PI is a > very capable unit (moreso than the EI units I compared them to) a nd I > really like the software that comes with it, allowing you to downloa d > all your flight history & engine behavior.> > I HIGHLY recommend it. If nothing else, it'll pay for itself in fuel in > a few years.> > /John> > > MASON CHEVAILLIER wrote:> > rd, i have found the JPI units to be very help ful on three different > > aircraft. mason> >> >> >> > -------------------- ----------------------------------------------------> > From: rcdettmer@cha rter.net> > To: commander-list@matronics.com> > Subject: Commander-List: En gine Analyzer> > Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2007 11:40:52 -0700> >> > I am looking a t installing an engine analyzer on my 680F when I> > hang the re-built engi nes in several weeks. Any advice out there> > on recommended systems and pr ices..?? John Vormbaum, I believe> > that you had a system installed on you r 500B. What system was it> > and how much did it cost..?? I am also intere sted in any advice> > from you experienced geared Commander guys about reco mmended> > procedures for breaking in and operating the new engines. You ca n> > believe that I will want to be VERY conservative in treating those> > engines with TLC. Thanks.> >> > > >> > Randy Dettmer, AIA> >> > 680F / N625 3X> >> > > >> > > >> > *663 Hill Street, San Luis Obispo, CA 93405*> >> > * 805 541 4864 / Fax 805 541 4865*> >> > *http://www.dettmerarchitecture.com/ ***> >> > > >> >> >> > __________ NOD32 2521 (20070911) Information _______ ================> > > ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 02:55:46 PM PST US From: John Vormbaum Subject: Re: Commander-List: Engine Analyzer Installed, had it done during my last annual. Randy Dettmer, AIA wrote: > > Was that $5K installed or uninstalled..?? Thanks. > > RD > > > 663 Hill Street, San Luis Obispo, CA 93405 > 805 541 4864 / Fax 805 541 4865 > http://www.dettmerarchitecture.com/ > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of John Vormbaum > Sent: Wednesday, October 31, 2007 2:26 PM > To: commander-list@matronics.com > Subject: Re: Commander-List: Engine Analyzer > > > Hi Randy, > > I had the JPI EDM-760 Twin engine analyzer put in my airplane last year. > It cost ~$5k IIRC, and it's worth every penny. You could do it for less, > but I added on the optional fuel totalizer, and I love it. The JPI is a > very capable unit (moreso than the EI units I compared them to) and I > really like the software that comes with it, allowing you to download > all your flight history & engine behavior. > > I HIGHLY recommend it. If nothing else, it'll pay for itself in fuel in > a few years. > > /John > > > MASON CHEVAILLIER wrote: > >> rd, i have found the JPI units to be very helpful on three different >> aircraft. mason >> >> >> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >> > -- > >> From: rcdettmer@charter.net >> To: commander-list@matronics.com >> Subject: Commander-List: Engine Analyzer >> Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2007 11:40:52 -0700 >> >> I am looking at installing an engine analyzer on my 680F when I >> hang the re-built engines in several weeks. Any advice out there >> on recommended systems and prices..?? John Vormbaum, I believe >> that you had a system installed on your 500B. What system was it >> and how much did it cost..?? I am also interested in any advice >> from you experienced geared Commander guys about recommended >> procedures for breaking in and operating the new engines. You can >> believe that I will want to be VERY conservative in treating those >> engines with TLC. Thanks. >> >> >> >> Randy Dettmer, AIA >> >> 680F / N6253X >> >> >> >> >> >> *663 Hill Street, San Luis Obispo, CA 93405* >> >> *805 541 4864 / Fax 805 541 4865* >> >> *http://www.dettmerarchitecture.com/*** >> >> >> >> >> >> __________ NOD32 2521 (20070911) Information __________ >> >> > > > __________ NOD32 2521 (20070911) Information __________ > > > ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 03:03:06 PM PST US From: "Randy Dettmer, AIA" Subject: RE: Commander-List: Engine Analyzer I am getting quoted over $8K by my shop in Salinas - $4345 for the unit from JPI (including a $300 JPI rebate) and about $4K to install. I am looking at 12 pair of wires from each engine (or more) routed to the panel. Is that the same for your installation..?? 663 Hill Street, San Luis Obispo, CA 93405 805 541 4864 / Fax 805 541 4865 http://www.dettmerarchitecture.com/ -----Original Message----- From: owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of John Vormbaum Sent: Wednesday, October 31, 2007 2:53 PM Subject: Re: Commander-List: Engine Analyzer Installed, had it done during my last annual. Randy Dettmer, AIA wrote: > > Was that $5K installed or uninstalled..?? Thanks. > > RD > > > 663 Hill Street, San Luis Obispo, CA 93405 > 805 541 4864 / Fax 805 541 4865 > http://www.dettmerarchitecture.com/ > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of John Vormbaum > Sent: Wednesday, October 31, 2007 2:26 PM > To: commander-list@matronics.com > Subject: Re: Commander-List: Engine Analyzer > > > Hi Randy, > > I had the JPI EDM-760 Twin engine analyzer put in my airplane last year. > It cost ~$5k IIRC, and it's worth every penny. You could do it for less, > but I added on the optional fuel totalizer, and I love it. The JPI is a > very capable unit (moreso than the EI units I compared them to) and I > really like the software that comes with it, allowing you to download > all your flight history & engine behavior. > > I HIGHLY recommend it. If nothing else, it'll pay for itself in fuel in > a few years. > > /John > > > MASON CHEVAILLIER wrote: > >> rd, i have found the JPI units to be very helpful on three different >> aircraft. mason >> >> >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- - >> > -- > >> From: rcdettmer@charter.net >> To: commander-list@matronics.com >> Subject: Commander-List: Engine Analyzer >> Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2007 11:40:52 -0700 >> >> I am looking at installing an engine analyzer on my 680F when I >> hang the re-built engines in several weeks. Any advice out there >> on recommended systems and prices..?? John Vormbaum, I believe >> that you had a system installed on your 500B. What system was it >> and how much did it cost..?? I am also interested in any advice >> from you experienced geared Commander guys about recommended >> procedures for breaking in and operating the new engines. You can >> believe that I will want to be VERY conservative in treating those >> engines with TLC. Thanks. >> >> >> >> Randy Dettmer, AIA >> >> 680F / N6253X >> >> >> >> >> >> *663 Hill Street, San Luis Obispo, CA 93405* >> >> *805 541 4864 / Fax 805 541 4865* >> >> *http://www.dettmerarchitecture.com/*** >> >> >> >> >> >> __________ NOD32 2521 (20070911) Information __________ >> >> > > > __________ NOD32 2521 (20070911) Information __________ > > ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 09:34:08 PM PST US From: BillLeff1@aol.com Subject: Re: Commander-List: Engine Analyzer Do not run on ground except to check operation and leaks. In the air lots of airspeed, lots of power and lots of fuel. This will seat the rings in without glazing the cylinder walls. Make fine adjustments after break-in flight. Again don't let it get hot on the ground while making the adjustments. The Overhauled fuel injectors will be 10% rich because they are set up for 680FL's with Big air Scoops. Lean it on ground for proper operation, get it in the air and adjust it later. 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