Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 12:04 AM - Re: It is time... (nico css)
2. 03:54 AM - Re: It is time... (Robert Feldtman)
3. 06:12 AM - Re: It is time... (N395V)
4. 07:21 AM - Re: Re: It is time... (MASON CHEVAILLIER)
5. 08:11 AM - Re: Re: It is time... (WINGFLYER1@aol.com)
6. 09:11 AM - Re: Re: It is time... (Bruce Campbell)
7. 09:51 AM - Re: It is time... (John Vormbaum)
8. 09:52 AM - Re: It is time... (N395V)
9. 10:04 AM - Re: Re: It is time... (John Vormbaum)
10. 10:05 AM - Re: Re: It is time... (John Vormbaum)
11. 12:54 PM - N-152K (Calvin D. Alston)
12. 01:17 PM - Re: N-152K (John Vormbaum)
13. 01:39 PM - Re: N-152K (Calvin D. Alston)
14. 01:54 PM - Re: Re: It is time... (Jim Addington)
15. 02:19 PM - Re: Re: It is time... (Jim Addington)
16. 08:00 PM - Hot offer for CJ-6 aircraft (Nanchang CJ6)
17. 08:03 PM - Re: Re: It is time... (Neal George)
18. 08:55 PM - Re: Re: It is time... (Jim Addington)
19. 09:09 PM - Re: Re: It is time... (Tylor Hall)
20. 09:25 PM - Re: Re: It is time... (L D GIROD)
Message 1
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John,
There is a lot of truth in what you are saying. No one can deny that. But,
if the doctrine that made this country great, practiced by agnostics,
atheists, Buddhists, and all others who wanted to pursue the American dream,
is threatened by a theocratic model, all should be very worried. And that is
what this article was about. The Judeo/Christian economic model is the only
doctrine in the history of man that provides liberty and general wealth for
all who practice it. Never, ever has there been such a successful model.
Does that mean one has to be a Christian or a Jew to practice it? No,
emphatically, no. Demanding that one has to be a Christian or a Jew to be an
American is the injustice perpetrated against the people of this country,
and around the world, that would in the end cost us that liberty and general
wealth. Many of the founding fathers were luke-warm (if at all) Christians,
but they recognized the value of the Judeo/Christian doctrine. This
principle of doctrines is no different than the laws of the land, which is a
doctrine which has its believers and its practitioners-without-belief. The
law doesn't care whether one believes it or not, it will punish its
transgressors. Oppose that to the Judeo/Christian model who has threats and
rewards embedded in it, but the unbelievers do not believe in that model's
God anyway, so the threats are meaningless to them; but the material rewards
are real and measurable for those who practice it, contrary to Islam.
I, for one, practice the California Vehicle Code-doctrine, but I don't
believe that driving slower on the freeway is necessarily safer, so I don't
- in a manner that evades prosecution. If I said I believe it and drive the
way I do, I'll be rightly called a hypocrite. Practicing the Judeo/Christian
economic model is no different. You don't have to believe in it; all you
have to do is believe that it is what it says it is. Do the same with Islam,
believe what it says it is and it will scare you out of your wits.
Agnostics, atheists, and other non-Christians may practice the virtues of
the Judeo/Christian doctrine, but it is not required that they believe in
the law of Moses or that Jesus Christ is their personal savior to reap the
benefits inherent in its practice.
However, when a doctrine becomes as popular as Islam has, and that by
misleading prospects, and by the threat of violence or death upon
dissention, which is clearly pitted against the virtues of the
Judeo/Christian doctrine; and which has its roots in having their believers
living in nothing more than a sandbox by the grace of the clerics who reap
the rewards, then you and I have to be extremely concerned.
You mention the Crusades. You could also cite the Inquisition. To understand
what happened there, you have to look at the doctrine which those folks
followed. They were not adhering to the Judeo/Christian model. Similarly,
Roman Catholics have their own doctrines alongside the Bible, church
tradition and the Magisterium; not saying that believers in the RC doctrine
are not Christians. That means they found ways in which to exercise veto
power over the doctrine that is known as the Judeo/Christian economic model
and it's clear in their elitist hierarchy that the wealth is intended to be
removed from the 'layety' and passed on to the elitists, acting as pseudo
deities. The rights and property of the people are usurped for the
sustenance of the elitist class, which destroys liberty and general wealth.
That's not according to the Judeo/Christian doctrine which is found in the
Bible alone, without any qualifications or additions. Anyone, believer and
unbeliever in any doctrine, should be able to look at a doctrine and
distinguish between the believers and the practitioners. The practitioners
of Islam that have become westernized, are not real muslims. It is the
believers who will come and kill them for their dissent and it is this group
that is growing more rapidly than any other. It is all in the doctrine.
Just my take on it.
Thanks for indulging me.
Nico
_____
From: owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John
Vormbaum
Sent: Monday, May 04, 2009 5:00 PM
Subject: RE: Commander-List: It is time...
Wow, I guess us agnostics, atheists, Buddhist and absurdists are completely
doomed. 9,000,000 Muslims in America? That's 2.8%. Yeah...perhaps we should
restart the Crusades. After all, it did such wonderful things for all
parties the first time around. Plus, things are going great in Iraq &
Afghanistan. Why not expand? That's sarcasm, by the way.
The beauty of America is that immigrants are only what they are for the
original generation. Fashion clothing, the Mall, and capitalism have a
wonderful way of making all their children American. It becomes very very
hard to convince them that they're better off shrugging off western culture
& moving back to the sandbox and living in stone-age conditions. Those kids
would probably die if they weren't within walking distance of a Starbucks.
_____
From: owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of nico css
Sent: Monday, May 04, 2009 4:47 PM
Subject: Commander-List: It is time...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6-3X5hIFXYU
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List">http://www.matronic
s.com/Navigator?Commander-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: It is time... |
perfect explanation.
bobf
On Tue, May 5, 2009 at 2:01 AM, nico css <nico@cybersuperstore.com> wrote:
> John,
>
> There is a lot of truth in what you are saying. No one can deny that. But,
> if the doctrine that made this country great, practiced by agnostics,
> atheists, Buddhists, and all others who wanted to pursue the American dream,
> is threatened by a theocratic model, all should be very worried. And that is
> what this article was about. The Judeo/Christian economic model is the only
> doctrine in the history of man that provides liberty and general wealth for
> all who practice it. Never, ever has there been such a successful model.
> Does that mean one has to be a Christian or a Jew to practice it? No,
> emphatically, no. Demanding that one has to be a Christian or a Jew to be an
> American is the injustice perpetrated against the people of this country,
> and around the world, that would in the end cost us that liberty and general
> wealth. Many of the founding fathers were luke-warm (if at all) Christians,
> but they recognized the value of the Judeo/Christian doctrine. This
> principle of doctrines is no different than the laws of the land, which is a
> doctrine which has its believers and its practitioners-without-belief. The
> law doesn't care whether one believes it or not, it will punish its
> transgressors. Oppose that to the Judeo/Christian model who has threats and
> rewards embedded in it, but the unbelievers do not believe in that model's
> God anyway, so the threats are meaningless to them; but the material rewards
> are real and measurable for those who practice it, contrary to Islam.
>
> I, for one, practice the California Vehicle Code-doctrine, but I don't
> believe that driving slower on the freeway is necessarily safer, so I don't
> - in a manner that evades prosecution. If I said I believe it and drive the
> way I do, I'll be rightly called a hypocrite. Practicing the Judeo/Christian
> economic model is no different. You don't have to believe in it; all you
> have to do is believe that it is what it says it is. Do the same with Islam,
> believe what it says it is and it will scare you out of your wits. Agnostics,
> atheists, and other non-Christians may practice the virtues of
> the Judeo/Christian doctrine, but it is not required that they believe in
> the law of Moses or that Jesus Christ is their personal savior to reap the
> benefits inherent in its practice.
>
> However, when a doctrine becomes as popular as Islam has, and that by
> misleading prospects, and by the threat of violence or death upon
> dissention, which is clearly pitted against the virtues of the
> Judeo/Christian doctrine; and which has its roots in having their believers
> living in nothing more than a sandbox by the grace of the clerics who reap
> the rewards, then you and I have to be extremely concerned.
>
> You mention the Crusades. You could also cite the Inquisition. To
> understand what happened there, you have to look at the doctrine which those
> folks followed. They were not adhering to the Judeo/Christian model.
> Similarly, Roman Catholics have their own doctrines alongside the Bible,
> church tradition and the Magisterium; not saying that believers in the RC
> doctrine are not Christians. That means they found ways in which to exercise
> veto power over the doctrine that is known as the Judeo/Christian economic
> model and it's clear in their elitist hierarchy that the wealth is intended
> to be removed from the 'layety' and passed on to the elitists, acting as
> pseudo deities. The rights and property of the people are usurped for the
> sustenance of the elitist class, which destroys liberty and general wealth.
> That's not according to the Judeo/Christian doctrine which is found in the
> Bible alone, without any qualifications or additions. Anyone, believer and
> unbeliever in any doctrine, should be able to look at a doctrine and
> distinguish between the believers and the practitioners. The practitioners
> of Islam that have become westernized, are not real muslims. It is the
> believers who will come and kill them for their dissent and it is this group
> that is growing more rapidly than any other. It is all in the doctrine.
>
> Just my take on it.
>
> Thanks for indulging me.
>
> Nico
>
>
> ------------------------------
> *From:* owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:
> owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *John Vormbaum
> *Sent:* Monday, May 04, 2009 5:00 PM
> *To:* commander-list@matronics.com
> *Subject:* RE: Commander-List: It is time...
>
> Wow, I guess us agnostics, atheists, Buddhist and absurdists are
> completely doomed. 9,000,000 Muslims in America? That's 2.8%.
> Yeah...perhaps we should restart the Crusades. After all, it did such
> wonderful things for all parties the first time around. Plus, things are
> going great in Iraq & Afghanistan. Why not expand? That's sarcasm, by the
> way.
>
> The beauty of America is that immigrants are only what they are for the
> original generation. Fashion clothing, the Mall, and capitalism have a
> wonderful way of making all their children American. It becomes very very
> hard to convince them that they're better off shrugging off western culture
> & moving back to the sandbox and living in stone-age conditions. Those kids
> would probably die if they weren't within walking distance of a Starbucks.
>
> ------------------------------
> *From:* owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:
> owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *nico css
> *Sent:* Monday, May 04, 2009 4:47 PM
> *To:* 'art la combe'
> *Subject:* Commander-List: It is time...
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6-3X5hIFXYU
>
>
> *
>
> href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
> href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
> href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c*
>
> *
>
> href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
> href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
> href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c*
>
> *
>
> *
>
>
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: It is time... |
The beauty of America is that immigrants are only what they are for the original
generation. Fashion clothing, the Mall, and capitalism have a wonderful way
of making all their children American. It becomes very very hard to convince them
that they're better off shrugging off western culture & moving back to the
sandbox and living in stone-age conditions. Those kids would probably die if
they weren't within walking distance of a Starbucks.
That has historically been true. The experience in several Europeon countries,
however, has been the oppositte.
The Muslim enclaves have grown and remained separate for several generations to
the opoint where governments are promulgatin laws to accommodate strictly Muslim
needs and wants into their society.
The American Muslim population is not, however, the greatest and most imminent
threat to the United States.
The most imminent threat to our way of life is the United States Government itself,
the elected officials, the lifetime civil servants etc.
I am not talking Repub vs Democrat here. For much of our history the 2 party system
has worked well with most citizens and elected officials being slightly left
or right of center.
Today we find both parties controlled by the extreme left or extreme right.
The current dem government if left unchecked will turn the US into a socialist
state by the end of obamas second term.
The GOP is paralyzed by the agenda of its far right wing nut jobs. Given the current
attitudes in the GOP it is unlikely they will be able to gain enough power
to stop the current government. Iam not so sure life under them would be any
better. Socialism is probably preferable to an intolerant tyranny.
We need a Crusade all right but it needs to be a Crusade against our elected officials
fo9r they are the true enemy of our way of life.
--------
Milt
2003 F1 Rocket
2006 Radial Rocket
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=242774#242774
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: It is time... |
amen. gmc
> Subject: Commander-List: Re: It is time...
> From: Bearcat@bearcataviation.com
> Date: Tue=2C 5 May 2009 06:11:49 -0700
> To: commander-list@matronics.com
>
m>
>
> The beauty of America is that immigrants are only what they are for the o
riginal generation. Fashion clothing=2C the Mall=2C and capitalism have a w
onderful way of making all their children American. It becomes very very ha
rd to convince them that they're better off shrugging off western culture &
moving back to the sandbox and living in stone-age conditions. Those kids
would probably die if they weren't within walking distance of a Starbucks.
>
>
>
> That has historically been true. The experience in several Europeon count
ries=2C however=2C has been the oppositte.
>
> The Muslim enclaves have grown and remained separate for several generati
ons to the opoint where governments are promulgatin laws to accommodate str
ictly Muslim needs and wants into their society.
>
> The American Muslim population is not=2C however=2C the greatest and most
imminent threat to the United States.
>
> The most imminent threat to our way of life is the United States Governme
nt itself=2C the elected officials=2C the lifetime civil servants etc.
>
> I am not talking Repub vs Democrat here. For much of our history the 2 pa
rty system has worked well with most citizens and elected officials being s
lightly left or right of center.
>
> Today we find both parties controlled by the extreme left or extreme righ
t.
>
> The current dem government if left unchecked will turn the US into a soci
alist state by the end of obamas second term.
>
> The GOP is paralyzed by the agenda of its far right wing nut jobs. Given
the current attitudes in the GOP it is unlikely they will be able to gain e
nough power to stop the current government. Iam not so sure life under them
would be any better. Socialism is probably preferable to an intolerant tyr
anny.
>
> We need a Crusade all right but it needs to be a Crusade against our elec
ted officials fo9r they are the true enemy of our way of life.
>
> --------
> Milt
> 2003 F1 Rocket
> 2006 Radial Rocket
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=242774#242774
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
===========
===========
===========
===========
>
>
>
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: It is time... |
Milt , You are right about the biggest threat being our government! We need
to vote ALL of them out and start over. If they have been in congress more
than eight years,vote them out. My biggest concern, is that our population
of those that want entitlements, has exceeded we that want "Common Sense"
government. Even if we vote them out, that population now out number us. WE
have become the MINORITY and will NOT be able to vote them out. So , what
is the solution to save this country short of a revelotion? If the current
Administration has their way , they will try to get our guns and control
all of the financial institutions as well.I have always been optomistic but I
don`t feel that way anymore.What the government has done to this country ,
is CRIMINAL! Gil
**************A Good Credit Score is 700 or Above. See yours in just 2 easy
steps!
=May5509AvgfooterNO115)
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: It is time... |
I think you have to make a distinction between Islam the religion and Islam
the political movement, or Islamism. Remember the most people killed so f
ar by the Islamists have been other Muslims. The thing that makes a large
Muslim population frightening is that so far, for a variety of reasons, "m
oderate muslims" have chosen (for their own safety) not to publicly do bat
tle with the Islamists.
The probable solution is to encourage the mainstreaming of muslims in our
society in the same way that jews (or mormons for that matter) are welcomed
, by and large. The US and western society in general, isn't about a nati
onal or religious identify, so much as a set of principles that we all adhe
re to (play fair, respect the other kids property, no hitting, do unto othe
rs, etc). But in order to do so we need confidently offer our own vision.
The problem *does* come from within, but the Obamunistas are just a side ef
fect. I don't think it is the government per se, so much as the "culture".
We have, as a society allowed ourselves to be propagandized into abandon
ing the idea that we are the Good Guys. Its an irony that while the people
of Iraq and Afghanistan are singing our praises as liberators, even though
they were suspicious of our motives, (they could imagine why we were doing
what we were doing, and couldn't believe we were fighting for right and l
iberty until later they realized we were serious.) that this society movie
s and TV live on a nonstop diet of "evil CIA men", "insane, sadistic, soldi
ers", "psychopathic abusive fathers", etc. that in no way represent even u
nusual examples of our society, confronting pure noble terrorist who just w
ant Goodness to win (Goodness isn't, us, BTW).
Our schools teach a curriculum that could be described as "America: Bad Ide
a, or Horrible Mistake". Apparently as soon as we got independent, we del
iberately gave the Indians blankets infected with smallpox to kill them. Ev
en though we didn't know about what caused smallpox until the 1860's. The
n industrialization caused America to enslave all the workers who labored w
ith their children without pay in coal mines while starving. This continu
ed until we started all of the wars, and then there was a beautiful growth
of socialism ("caring") that started when Franklin Rooseveldt freed the sla
ves, and continued until Richard Nixon and Ronald Reagan and George Bush st
arted all the wars again (they were Republicans, and you know they love to
do that). Of course, they were opposed by peace-loving people everywhere i
Insert picture of Jane Fonda with Ho Chi Minh).
In these books, we only hear a little bit about what America stands for, an
d usually in a very distorted way. For example "All men are created Equal"
is usually described as saying "it isn't right that some people get more t
han others", and the Constitution is only referenced as a source of "rights
" that it guarantees for example, the right to free TV and free health care
. Free speech means pornography is protected, but not that you can say any
thing "mean" about people in office, that just wouldn't be right unless the
y are "evil war mongers" , ie Republicans.
When we can get things like that under control, it will be relatively stra
ightforward to fix the government and live in harmony with whatever religio
us minority.
From: owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-commander-lis
t-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of WINGFLYER1@aol.com
Sent: Tuesday, May 05, 2009 8:08 AM
Subject: Re: Commander-List: Re: It is time...
Milt , You are right about the biggest threat being our government! We need
to vote ALL of them out and start over. If they have been in congress more
than eight years,vote them out. My biggest concern, is that our population
of those that want entitlements, has exceeded we that want "Common Sense"
government. Even if we vote them out, that population now out number us. WE
have become the MINORITY and will NOT be able to vote them out. So , what
is the solution to save this country short of a revelotion? If the current
Administration has their way , they will try to get our guns and control al
l of the financial institutions as well.I have always been optomistic but I
don`t feel that way anymore.What the government has done to this country ,
is CRIMINAL! Gil
________________________________
A Good Credit Score is 700 or67171/aol?redir=http://www.freecreditreport.
com/pm/default.aspx?sc=668072%26hmpgID=115%26bcd=May5509AvgfooterNO11
5>See yours in just 2 easy steps!
Message 7
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Hi Nico,
That's a compelling take on things. You are far more versed in the various
religions than I am. Raised in an agnostic household (but baptized
Presbyterian and growing up under the basic Judeo/Christian tenets that you
mention) I had very little focused exposure to religious studies. My post
was essentially a knee-jerk reaction to more propaganda. I'm pro-2nd
Amendment in a big way; I could probably be labeled a lightweight
paranoid...but I don't advocate war or genocide. The next few years are
going to be very interesting, I think (isn't that a Buddhist curse, may you
live in interesting times?). I find myself unable to predict a resolution.
Thanks for clarifying your point of view. As much as this is a forum for
Commanders, I continually find myself exposed to other very interesting
material
Cheers,
/John
_____
From: owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of nico css
Sent: Tuesday, May 05, 2009 12:01 AM
Subject: RE: Commander-List: It is time...
John,
There is a lot of truth in what you are saying. No one can deny that. But,
if the doctrine that made this country great, practiced by agnostics,
atheists, Buddhists, and all others who wanted to pursue the American dream,
is threatened by a theocratic model, all should be very worried. And that is
what this article was about. The Judeo/Christian economic model is the only
doctrine in the history of man that provides liberty and general wealth for
all who practice it. Never, ever has there been such a successful model.
Does that mean one has to be a Christian or a Jew to practice it? No,
emphatically, no. Demanding that one has to be a Christian or a Jew to be an
American is the injustice perpetrated against the people of this country,
and around the world, that would in the end cost us that liberty and general
wealth. Many of the founding fathers were luke-warm (if at all) Christians,
but they recognized the value of the Judeo/Christian doctrine. This
principle of doctrines is no different than the laws of the land, which is a
doctrine which has its believers and its practitioners-without-belief. The
law doesn't care whether one believes it or not, it will punish its
transgressors. Oppose that to the Judeo/Christian model who has threats and
rewards embedded in it, but the unbelievers do not believe in that model's
God anyway, so the threats are meaningless to them; but the material rewards
are real and measurable for those who practice it, contrary to Islam.
I, for one, practice the California Vehicle Code-doctrine, but I don't
believe that driving slower on the freeway is necessarily safer, so I don't
- in a manner that evades prosecution. If I said I believe it and drive the
way I do, I'll be rightly called a hypocrite. Practicing the Judeo/Christian
economic model is no different. You don't have to believe in it; all you
have to do is believe that it is what it says it is. Do the same with Islam,
believe what it says it is and it will scare you out of your wits.
Agnostics, atheists, and other non-Christians may practice the virtues of
the Judeo/Christian doctrine, but it is not required that they believe in
the law of Moses or that Jesus Christ is their personal savior to reap the
benefits inherent in its practice.
However, when a doctrine becomes as popular as Islam has, and that by
misleading prospects, and by the threat of violence or death upon
dissention, which is clearly pitted against the virtues of the
Judeo/Christian doctrine; and which has its roots in having their believers
living in nothing more than a sandbox by the grace of the clerics who reap
the rewards, then you and I have to be extremely concerned.
You mention the Crusades. You could also cite the Inquisition. To understand
what happened there, you have to look at the doctrine which those folks
followed. They were not adhering to the Judeo/Christian model. Similarly,
Roman Catholics have their own doctrines alongside the Bible, church
tradition and the Magisterium; not saying that believers in the RC doctrine
are not Christians. That means they found ways in which to exercise veto
power over the doctrine that is known as the Judeo/Christian economic model
and it's clear in their elitist hierarchy that the wealth is intended to be
removed from the 'layety' and passed on to the elitists, acting as pseudo
deities. The rights and property of the people are usurped for the
sustenance of the elitist class, which destroys liberty and general wealth.
That's not according to the Judeo/Christian doctrine which is found in the
Bible alone, without any qualifications or additions. Anyone, believer and
unbeliever in any doctrine, should be able to look at a doctrine and
distinguish between the believers and the practitioners. The practitioners
of Islam that have become westernized, are not real muslims. It is the
believers who will come and kill them for their dissent and it is this group
that is growing more rapidly than any other. It is all in the doctrine.
Just my take on it.
Thanks for indulging me.
Nico
_____
From: owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John
Vormbaum
Sent: Monday, May 04, 2009 5:00 PM
Subject: RE: Commander-List: It is time...
Wow, I guess us agnostics, atheists, Buddhist and absurdists are completely
doomed. 9,000,000 Muslims in America? That's 2.8%. Yeah...perhaps we should
restart the Crusades. After all, it did such wonderful things for all
parties the first time around. Plus, things are going great in Iraq &
Afghanistan. Why not expand? That's sarcasm, by the way.
The beauty of America is that immigrants are only what they are for the
original generation. Fashion clothing, the Mall, and capitalism have a
wonderful way of making all their children American. It becomes very very
hard to convince them that they're better off shrugging off western culture
& moving back to the sandbox and living in stone-age conditions. Those kids
would probably die if they weren't within walking distance of a Starbucks.
_____
From: owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of nico css
Sent: Monday, May 04, 2009 4:47 PM
Subject: Commander-List: It is time...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6-3X5hIFXYU
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List">http://www.matronic
s.com/Navigator?Commander-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List">http://www.matronic
s.com/Navigator?Commander-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: It is time... |
> what is the solution to save this country short of a revolotion?
I used to think the Northwest militia movement were nutjobs but now I understand
where they are coming from. I think you are correct in that the entitled outnumber
the workers and innovators.
I think if Texas ever really secedes from the union I will move there.
I vision one day the US consisting of New England and California while the remaining
states become the new Confederacy.
--------
Milt
2003 F1 Rocket
2006 Radial Rocket
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=242796#242796
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: It is time... |
Milt,
I agree completely. The last 16 years have seen unprecedented growth in
government, which is surprising given that there have been both rep & dem
administrations. I am a true Federalist; I think gov't. should be kept as
small as possible. We are indeed outnumbered by those feeling entitled.
I notice the common thread in my posts is that I am unable to offer
solutions. I don't know that both parties moving more to the center will
solve it. I know for sure that staying to the far right or left won't. I
have to assume that public opinion is like a pendulum, swinging with
regularity between poles. WWI, Roaring 20's, FDR, WWII, McCarthyism, Free
Love, etc. etc. I guess we're in a far left phase now, although there are
some peculiarities (like how gun control has become a no-start for the
dems). I imagine that pendulum will stay to the left for at least another 3
years.
/J
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of N395V
Sent: Tuesday, May 05, 2009 6:12 AM
Subject: Commander-List: Re: It is time...
--> <Bearcat@bearcataviation.com>
The beauty of America is that immigrants are only what they are for the
original generation. Fashion clothing, the Mall, and capitalism have a
wonderful way of making all their children American. It becomes very very
hard to convince them that they're better off shrugging off western culture
& moving back to the sandbox and living in stone-age conditions. Those kids
would probably die if they weren't within walking distance of a Starbucks.
That has historically been true. The experience in several Europeon
countries, however, has been the oppositte.
The Muslim enclaves have grown and remained separate for several generations
to the opoint where governments are promulgatin laws to accommodate strictly
Muslim needs and wants into their society.
The American Muslim population is not, however, the greatest and most
imminent threat to the United States.
The most imminent threat to our way of life is the United States Government
itself, the elected officials, the lifetime civil servants etc.
I am not talking Repub vs Democrat here. For much of our history the 2 party
system has worked well with most citizens and elected officials being
slightly left or right of center.
Today we find both parties controlled by the extreme left or extreme right.
The current dem government if left unchecked will turn the US into a
socialist state by the end of obamas second term.
The GOP is paralyzed by the agenda of its far right wing nut jobs. Given the
current attitudes in the GOP it is unlikely they will be able to gain enough
power to stop the current government. Iam not so sure life under them would
be any better. Socialism is probably preferable to an intolerant tyranny.
We need a Crusade all right but it needs to be a Crusade against our elected
officials fo9r they are the true enemy of our way of life.
--------
Milt
2003 F1 Rocket
2006 Radial Rocket
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=242774#242774
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: It is time... |
Wow, great posts this morning. I've never seen this much typing out of the
Commander-list membership ever!
usually in a very distorted way. For example "All men are created Equal" is
usually described as saying "it isn't right that some people get more than
others"
Bruce, your above quote absolutely nails the current problem with the views
of the American public at present. It appears to me that many think there is
actually an amendment guaranteeing the right to a large flatscreen TV.
/J
_____
From: owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bruce
Campbell
Sent: Tuesday, May 05, 2009 9:10 AM
Subject: RE: Commander-List: Re: It is time...
I think you have to make a distinction between Islam the religion and Islam
the political movement, or Islamism. Remember the most people killed so far
by the Islamists have been other Muslims. The thing that makes a large
Muslim population frightening is that so far, for a variety of reasons,
"moderate muslims" have chosen (for their own safety) not to publicly do
battle with the Islamists.
The probable solution is to encourage the mainstreaming of muslims in our
society in the same way that jews (or mormons for that matter) are welcomed,
by and large. The US and western society in general, isn't about a
national or religious identify, so much as a set of principles that we all
adhere to (play fair, respect the other kids property, no hitting, do unto
others, etc). But in order to do so we need confidently offer our own
vision.
The problem *does* come from within, but the Obamunistas are just a side
effect. I don't think it is the government per se, so much as the
"culture". We have, as a society allowed ourselves to be propagandized
into abandoning the idea that we are the Good Guys. Its an irony that while
the people of Iraq and Afghanistan are singing our praises as liberators,
even though they were suspicious of our motives, (they could imagine why we
were doing what we were doing, and couldn't believe we were fighting for
right and liberty until later they realized we were serious.) that this
society movies and TV live on a nonstop diet of "evil CIA men", "insane,
sadistic, soldiers", "psychopathic abusive fathers", etc. that in no way
represent even unusual examples of our society, confronting pure noble
terrorist who just want Goodness to win (Goodness isn't, us, BTW).
Our schools teach a curriculum that could be described as "America: Bad
Idea, or Horrible Mistake". Apparently as soon as we got independent, we
deliberately gave the Indians blankets infected with smallpox to kill them.
Even though we didn't know about what caused smallpox until the 1860's.
Then industrialization caused America to enslave all the workers who labored
with their children without pay in coal mines while starving. This
continued until we started all of the wars, and then there was a beautiful
growth of socialism ("caring") that started when Franklin Rooseveldt freed
the slaves, and continued until Richard Nixon and Ronald Reagan and George
Bush started all the wars again (they were Republicans, and you know they
love to do that). Of course, they were opposed by peace-loving people
everywhere iInsert picture of Jane Fonda with Ho Chi Minh).
In these books, we only hear a little bit about what America stands for, and
usually in a very distorted way. For example "All men are created Equal" is
usually described as saying "it isn't right that some people get more than
others", and the Constitution is only referenced as a source of "rights"
that it guarantees for example, the right to free TV and free health care.
Free speech means pornography is protected, but not that you can say
anything "mean" about people in office, that just wouldn't be right unless
they are "evil war mongers" , ie Republicans.
When we can get things like that under control, it will be relatively
straightforward to fix the government and live in harmony with whatever
religious minority.
From: owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
WINGFLYER1@aol.com
Sent: Tuesday, May 05, 2009 8:08 AM
Subject: Re: Commander-List: Re: It is time...
Milt , You are right about the biggest threat being our government! We need
to vote ALL of them out and start over. If they have been in congress more
than eight years,vote them out. My biggest concern, is that our population
of those that want entitlements, has exceeded we that want "Common Sense"
government. Even if we vote them out, that population now out number us. WE
have become the MINORITY and will NOT be able to vote them out. So , what is
the solution to save this country short of a revelotion? If the current
Administration has their way , they will try to get our guns and control all
of the financial institutions as well.I have always been optomistic but I
don`t feel that way anymore.What the government has done to this country ,
is CRIMINAL! Gil
_____
A Good Credit Score is 700
or67171/aol?redir=http://www.freecreditreport.com/pm/default.aspx?sc=668072%
26hmpgID=115%26bcd=May5509AvgfooterNO115>See yours in just 2 easy steps!
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
http://forums.matronics.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
Message 11
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Hi Guys;
I am new to the list. I am the owner of two commander 500a's N-152K and
N-1260B. I'm glad Al Hoffman showed me where to find all the commander
aficionados. I have heard that Sir Barry is the history guy and was
wondering if he knows anything about my birds. If any of you guys have any
questions about me or the planes please feel free to let me know and I'll do
my best.
Look forward to some feedback.
Dale Alston
Whitehouse Aviation Inc.
Message 12
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Hi Dale, welcome to the board! TWO Commanders, wow, you must be truly
mentally unbalanced :-). Hope to see you at our yearly fly-in in Sept.
Standby and I'm sure you'll get an interesting email from Sir Barry!
Cheers,
/John
_____
From: owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Calvin D.
Alston
Sent: Tuesday, May 05, 2009 12:54 PM
Subject: Commander-List: N-152K
Hi Guys;
I am new to the list. I am the owner of two commander 500a's N-152K and
N-1260B. I'm glad Al Hoffman showed me where to find all the commander
aficionados. I have heard that Sir Barry is the history guy and was
wondering if he knows anything about my birds. If any of you guys have any
questions about me or the planes please feel free to let me know and I'll do
my best.
Look forward to some feedback.
Dale Alston
Whitehouse Aviation Inc.
Message 13
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Hi John,
Mentally unbalanced is an understatement. What happened is the commander I
wanted was out of my reach, or overpriced depending on whether you're the
seller or buyer. Anyway I bought a lesser quality airplane and 6 months
later the one I REALLY wanted came back on the market at 40K less than my
last offer so I jumped and ended up with two. My wife agrees with you about
the unbalanced state of my mind. But I tell her if one is good two has to be
better, right?
Dale
_____
From: owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John
Vormbaum
Sent: Tuesday, May 05, 2009 4:15 PM
Subject: RE: Commander-List: N-152K
Hi Dale, welcome to the board! TWO Commanders, wow, you must be truly
mentally unbalanced :-). Hope to see you at our yearly fly-in in Sept.
Standby and I'm sure you'll get an interesting email from Sir Barry!
Cheers,
/John
_____
From: owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Calvin D.
Alston
Sent: Tuesday, May 05, 2009 12:54 PM
Subject: Commander-List: N-152K
Hi Guys;
I am new to the list. I am the owner of two commander 500a's N-152K and
N-1260B. I'm glad Al Hoffman showed me where to find all the commander
aficionados. I have heard that Sir Barry is the history guy and was
wondering if he knows anything about my birds. If any of you guys have any
questions about me or the planes please feel free to let me know and I'll do
my best.
Look forward to some feedback.
Dale Alston
Whitehouse Aviation Inc.
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List">http://www.matronic
s.com/Navigator?Commander-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
08:05:00
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: It is time... |
Milt,
Go to this site, you may want to move here any way.
Jim A
> A friend, look at this, has sent you an e-mail link to a story on the
> Tyler Paper's Web site.
>
> Your friend says,
>
> http://www.tylerpaper.com/article/20090428/NEWS01/904280322
riginal Message-----
From: owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of N395V
Sent: Tuesday, May 05, 2009 11:52 AM
Subject: Commander-List: Re: It is time...
> what is the solution to save this country short of a revolotion?
I used to think the Northwest militia movement were nutjobs but now I
understand where they are coming from. I think you are correct in that the
entitled outnumber the workers and innovators.
I think if Texas ever really secedes from the union I will move there.
I vision one day the US consisting of New England and California while the
remaining states become the new Confederacy.
--------
Milt
2003 F1 Rocket
2006 Radial Rocket
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=242796#242796
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: It is time... |
I always heard that God created man and Smith & Wesson made them equal.
Pardon my insert.
Jim A
_____
From: owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John
Vormbaum
Sent: Tuesday, May 05, 2009 12:01 PM
Subject: RE: Commander-List: Re: It is time...
Wow, great posts this morning. I've never seen this much typing out of the
Commander-list membership ever!
usually in a very distorted way. For example "All men are created Equal" is
usually described as saying "it isn't right that some people get more than
others"
Bruce, your above quote absolutely nails the current problem with the views
of the American public at present. It appears to me that many think there is
actually an amendment guaranteeing the right to a large flatscreen TV.
/J
_____
From: owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bruce
Campbell
Sent: Tuesday, May 05, 2009 9:10 AM
Subject: RE: Commander-List: Re: It is time...
I think you have to make a distinction between Islam the religion and Islam
the political movement, or Islamism. Remember the most people killed so far
by the Islamists have been other Muslims. The thing that makes a large
Muslim population frightening is that so far, for a variety of reasons,
"moderate muslims" have chosen (for their own safety) not to publicly do
battle with the Islamists.
The probable solution is to encourage the mainstreaming of muslims in our
society in the same way that jews (or mormons for that matter) are welcomed,
by and large. The US and western society in general, isn't about a
national or religious identify, so much as a set of principles that we all
adhere to (play fair, respect the other kids property, no hitting, do unto
others, etc). But in order to do so we need confidently offer our own
vision.
The problem *does* come from within, but the Obamunistas are just a side
effect. I don't think it is the government per se, so much as the
"culture". We have, as a society allowed ourselves to be propagandized
into abandoning the idea that we are the Good Guys. Its an irony that while
the people of Iraq and Afghanistan are singing our praises as liberators,
even though they were suspicious of our motives, (they could imagine why we
were doing what we were doing, and couldn't believe we were fighting for
right and liberty until later they realized we were serious.) that this
society movies and TV live on a nonstop diet of "evil CIA men", "insane,
sadistic, soldiers", "psychopathic abusive fathers", etc. that in no way
represent even unusual examples of our society, confronting pure noble
terrorist who just want Goodness to win (Goodness isn't, us, BTW).
Our schools teach a curriculum that could be described as "America: Bad
Idea, or Horrible Mistake". Apparently as soon as we got independent, we
deliberately gave the Indians blankets infected with smallpox to kill them.
Even though we didn't know about what caused smallpox until the 1860's.
Then industrialization caused America to enslave all the workers who labored
with their children without pay in coal mines while starving. This
continued until we started all of the wars, and then there was a beautiful
growth of socialism ("caring") that started when Franklin Rooseveldt freed
the slaves, and continued until Richard Nixon and Ronald Reagan and George
Bush started all the wars again (they were Republicans, and you know they
love to do that). Of course, they were opposed by peace-loving people
everywhere iInsert picture of Jane Fonda with Ho Chi Minh).
In these books, we only hear a little bit about what America stands for, and
usually in a very distorted way. For example "All men are created Equal" is
usually described as saying "it isn't right that some people get more than
others", and the Constitution is only referenced as a source of "rights"
that it guarantees for example, the right to free TV and free health care.
Free speech means pornography is protected, but not that you can say
anything "mean" about people in office, that just wouldn't be right unless
they are "evil war mongers" , ie Republicans.
When we can get things like that under control, it will be relatively
straightforward to fix the government and live in harmony with whatever
religious minority.
From: owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
WINGFLYER1@aol.com
Sent: Tuesday, May 05, 2009 8:08 AM
Subject: Re: Commander-List: Re: It is time...
Milt , You are right about the biggest threat being our government! We need
to vote ALL of them out and start over. If they have been in congress more
than eight years,vote them out. My biggest concern, is that our population
of those that want entitlements, has exceeded we that want "Common Sense"
government. Even if we vote them out, that population now out number us. WE
have become the MINORITY and will NOT be able to vote them out. So , what is
the solution to save this country short of a revelotion? If the current
Administration has their way , they will try to get our guns and control all
of the financial institutions as well.I have always been optomistic but I
don`t feel that way anymore.What the government has done to this country ,
is CRIMINAL! Gil
_____
A Good Credit Score is 700
or67171/aol?redir=http://www.freecreditreport.com/pm/default.aspx?sc=668072%
26hmpgID=115%26bcd=May5509AvgfooterNO115>See yours in just 2 easy steps!
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
http://forums.matronics.com
<>
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List">http://www.matronic
s.com/Navigator?Commander-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
Message 16
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| Subject: | Hot offer for CJ-6 aircraft |
Part number Description Chinese Description Quantity Unit PriceUSD
1 DZ-5 Spark Plugs 200 22
2 QS-2 Brake valve differential 4 420
3 BG12-1A Instrument altimeter 1 191
4 FL-3 Compass amplifier 5 137
5 ZH-4 Instrument compass indicator 3 82
6 GY-1 Fuel pressure 2 119
7 ZWH-1 Instrument cyl. Temp 4 101
8 ZZ30-1C Instrument tach single needle 29 131
9 DH-2 Boost coil 6 135
10 TS-1 Prop governer 4 465
11 CP-15 Petrol Pumb(gasoline) 2 412
12 CB-32A Engine oil pump 4 691
13 BC10 Instrument vsi (rate of climb) 5 88
14 BAV-3 Instrument current voltage 1 100
15 BYJ-1 Instrument manifold press 4 82
16 CSR-1 Air radiator 4 505
17 H2-6112-00A/1 2 Oil house R/H 4 674
18 Propeller blade 4 3236
19 BDP-2B Instrument Horizon 2 1026
20 301 Clock front cockpit 2 336
21 2UC2-7 Instrument oil indicator 1 494
22 BYQ80-1A Air pressure guage 2 52
23 QS-1 Brake valve reducing 7 150
24 KY-2C Air Compressor 2 382
25 SB-1 Pump manual fuel wobble pump 2 138
26 QHQ-14 Carburetor 2 121
Contact:Tally MSN:liutiantian1987@hotmail.com
--------
Tally:86-13468610692
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=242879#242879
Message 17
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| Subject: | Re: It is time... |
Close, Jim -
God created all men; Sam Colt made them equal.
Neal
From: owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jim
Addington
Sent: Tuesday, May 05, 2009 4:19 PM
Subject: RE: Commander-List: Re: It is time...
I always heard that God created man and Smith & Wesson made them equal.
Pardon my insert.
Jim A
Message 18
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| Subject: | Re: It is time... |
I knew it was one of those guys but a good Smith & Wesson will sure help.
Jim
_____
From: owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Neal George
Sent: Tuesday, May 05, 2009 9:58 PM
Subject: RE: Commander-List: Re: It is time...
Close, Jim -
God created all men; Sam Colt made them equal.
Neal
From: owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jim
Addington
Sent: Tuesday, May 05, 2009 4:19 PM
Subject: RE: Commander-List: Re: It is time...
I always heard that God created man and Smith & Wesson made them equal.
Pardon my insert.
Jim A
Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: It is time... |
"My airplane is protected by Smith and Wesson"
Bumper sticker
Tylor Hall
On May 5, 2009, at 9:54 PM, Jim Addington wrote:
> I knew it was one of those guys but a good Smith & Wesson will sure
> help.
> Jim
>
> From: owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com
> ]On Behalf Of Neal George
> Sent: Tuesday, May 05, 2009 9:58 PM
> To: commander-list@matronics.com
> Subject: RE: Commander-List: Re: It is time...
>
> Close, Jim '
>
> God created all men; Sam Colt made them equal.
>
> Neal
>
> From: owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com
> ]On Behalf Of Jim Addington
> Sent: Tuesday, May 05, 2009 4:19 PM
> To: commander-list@matronics.com
> Subject: RE: Commander-List: Re: It is time...
>
> I always heard that God created man and Smith & Wesson made them
> equal.
> Pardon my insert.
> Jim A
>
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Message 20
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| Subject: | Re: It is time... |
I have always heard that Mr. Colt made all men equal, BUT, that my
insurances agents are Mr. Smith and Mr. Wesson.
Don
----- Original Message -----
From: Jim Addington
To: commander-list@matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, May 05, 2009 11:54 PM
Subject: RE: Commander-List: Re: It is time...
I knew it was one of those guys but a good Smith & Wesson will sure
help.
Jim
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
From: owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Neal
George
Sent: Tuesday, May 05, 2009 9:58 PM
To: commander-list@matronics.com
Subject: RE: Commander-List: Re: It is time...
Close, Jim -
God created all men; Sam Colt made them equal.
Neal
From: owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jim
Addington
Sent: Tuesday, May 05, 2009 4:19 PM
To: commander-list@matronics.com
Subject: RE: Commander-List: Re: It is time...
I always heard that God created man and Smith & Wesson made them
equal.
Pardon my insert.
Jim A
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