Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 12:18 AM - 2010 List of Contributors (Matt Dralle)
2. 06:17 AM - Class B/ Speed (Dan Farmer)
3. 07:25 AM - Re: Class B/ Speed (BobsV35B@aol.com)
4. 08:01 AM - Re: Class B/ Speed (Keith S. Gordon)
5. 09:44 AM - Re: Class B/ Speed (dongirod)
6. 10:33 PM - Re: South African Commanders (cybersuperstore)
Message 1
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| Subject: | 2010 List of Contributors |
Dear Listers,
The 2010 Matronics Email List and Forum Fund Raiser officially ended a couple of
weeks ago and its time that I publish this year's List of Contributors. Its
the people on this list that directly make the Email Lists and Forums possible.
Their generous contributions keep the servers and Internet connection up and
running.
You can still show your support this year and pick up a great gift at the same
time. The Contribution Web Site is fast, easy, and secure:
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
Or, by dropping a personal check in the mail to:
Matt Dralle / Matronics
581 Jeannie Way
Livermore CA 94550
I also want to thank Bob, Jon, and Andy for their generous support through the
supply of great gifts this year!! These guys have some great products and I encourage
you to visit their respective web sites:
Bob Nucklolls - AeroElectric - www.aeroelectric.com
Jon Croke - HomebuiltHELP - www.homebuilthelp.com
Andy Gold - The Builder's Bookstore - www.buildersbooks.com
And finally, I'm proud to present The 2010 Fund Raiser List of Contributors:
http://www.matronics.com/loc/2010.html
Thanks again to everyone that made a Contribution this year!!
Matt Dralle
Matronics Email List and Forum Administrator
Message 2
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Don,
I am not sure if you agree with me or not. FAA 91.117b last sentence reads
"This paragraph (b) does not apply to any operation within class B airspace
area. Such operations shall comply with paragraph (a) of this section" Referring
to P.(a) it limits speed to 250K below 10K.
As to the exemption to exceed 250 for aircraft requirements, I do not know where
to find it, I just know it is done all the time. On a couple occasions I have
been ask to say speed and nothing was said if the reply to ATC was 300K.
dan f
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Class B/ Speed |
Good Morning All,
It has been over twenty-one years since I last flew a "dash thirty" DC-10,
but our company policy at that time was to advise ATC any time we found it
necessary to exceed the 250 knot restriction. Most of the time, we would
just leave some flaps hanging out until we got above ten thousand feet. The
only response I ever got when I did mention the problem was "Thanks United".
Have times changed or was that just my company's way of doing things?
Happy Skies,
Old Bob
In a message dated 12/14/2010 8:17:46 A.M. Central Standard Time,
daniellfarmer@yahoo.com writes:
--> Commander-List message posted by: Dan Farmer <daniellfarmer@yahoo.com>
Don,
I am not sure if you agree with me or not. FAA 91.117b last sentence
reads
"This paragraph (b) does not apply to any operation within class B
airspace
area. Such operations shall comply with paragraph (a) of this section"
Referring
to P.(a) it limits speed to 250K below 10K.
As to the exemption to exceed 250 for aircraft requirements, I do not know
where
to find it, I just know it is done all the time. On a couple occasions I
have
been ask to say speed and nothing was said if the reply to ATC was 300K.
dan f
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Class B/ Speed |
You'll probably note from my tag line that I'm neck deep in Class B ops an
d redesign for Las Vegas. 91.117 allows 250 knots from the SURFACE of the
Class B airport and through Class B airspace. Example: You're departing
Atlanta. You can accelerate to 250 knots right away -- and ATC expects
this.
Houston had an experimental program (via Special FAR) for a number of year
s that allowed 300 knots in Class B. That program is finished.
If your aircraft (DC-10) has a design requirement for a higher speed withi
n Class B that's understood by ATC.
If you exceed 250 knots in Class B in a type that does not need to go fast
er and ATC asks your speed they are not going to violate you. 99% of all
of the ATC guys I work with have the mantra, "We're not traffic cops."
That statement is not made by FSDO inspectors.
In the world of RNAV SIDs and STARs procedure development, "containment"
and turn anticipation is based on an indicated 250 knots in Class B, conv
erted to TAS for the altitude the aircraft is at over the fix, plus a cons
tant tailwind factor, usually 60 knots.
Blow out of containment because you're flying too fast and it could result
in a QA -- Quality Assurance -- report by ATC and those find their way to
FSDO for review.
Keith S. Gordon
Life is not simple anywhere. Probably less so elsewhere.
NBAA Access Committee
Las Vegas Airspace Users' Council, NBAA Rep
Las Vegas RNAV Optimization Work Group, NBAA Rep
Las Vegas Class B Redesign Committee, NBAA Rep
-----Original Message-----
From: Dan Farmer <daniellfarmer@yahoo.com>
Sent: Tue, Dec 14, 2010 6:14 am
Subject: Commander-List: Class B/ Speed
Don,
I am not sure if you agree with me or not. FAA 91.117b last sentence rea
ds
"This paragraph (b) does not apply to any operation within class B airspa
ce
area. Such operations shall comply with paragraph (a) of this section" Ref
erring
to P.(a) it limits speed to 250K below 10K.
As to the exemption to exceed 250 for aircraft requirements, I do not know
where
to find it, I just know it is done all the time. On a couple occasions I
have
been ask to say speed and nothing was said if the reply to ATC was 300K.
dan f
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Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Class B/ Speed |
Dan
I agree with you, it is my understanding, that to exceed the 250
limitations, it's as simple as a radio call. Lots of references when I
Googled "Class B airspeed restrictions"
As I think back on the statement I made about flying between MIA and Nassau
MANY years ago, I think what happened was the speeding up above 250 when 6
miles offshore but below 10K, but you were still in the TCA so therefore
could not. Been a long time, but I think that is what happened.
Don
-----Original Message-----
From: Dan Farmer
Sent: Tuesday, December 14, 2010 9:14 AM
Subject: Commander-List: Class B/ Speed
Don,
I am not sure if you agree with me or not. FAA 91.117b last sentence reads
"This paragraph (b) does not apply to any operation within class B airspace
area. Such operations shall comply with paragraph (a) of this section"
Referring
to P.(a) it limits speed to 250K below 10K.
As to the exemption to exceed 250 for aircraft requirements, I do not know
where
to find it, I just know it is done all the time. On a couple occasions I
have
been ask to say speed and nothing was said if the reply to ATC was 300K.
dan f
Message 6
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| Subject: | South African Commanders |
Folks,
Carl Dollenberg responded to some of my posts on a website somewhere about
Commanders in South Africa. The latest post to our Facebook page
(http://www.facebook.com/#!/pages/Aero-Commander/144424762275884) contains
pictures that I took a while ago and Carl was kind enough to fill in the
blanks. The other 690 was KZY whose pictures I will post as soon as I
stumble upon them.
Sir Barry, perhaps you knew of the fate of a Commander (JRF) on its way to
the U.S. Carl's abbreviated account is below. I invited Carl to join our
chat list should he be so inclined.
Thanks
Nico
Hi Nico,
That is one of ESCOM's 1000's. They have KZY and KZZ. ZS-KZX was sold to
the US a few years back. The SA Weather Service have ZS-JRA (11284) and
ZS-JRB (11248) that are used for weather modification. ZS-JRH (Ex ESCOM
Kimberly) is now being used as a geographical survey aircraft.
ZS-JRC is standing almost derelict at Grand Central as V5-MGF.
ZS-JRD was exported to the US in the 80's
ZS-JRF went missing en-route to the US somewhere between Windhoek and Gabon,
There is still no word as to what happened to the aircraft. It is presumed
that they were either shot down over Angola or ditched of the Angolan Coast.
Tony Geddy(sp) and Slim Bird were the crew involved
ZS-JRZ Exported to the US in the 80's
I will speak to my father who knew all the commanders in SA and find out
their fate.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of dongirod
Sent: Tuesday, December 14, 2010 9:43 AM
Subject: Re: Commander-List: Class B/ Speed
--> <dongirod@bellsouth.net>
Dan
I agree with you, it is my understanding, that to exceed the 250
limitations, it's as simple as a radio call. Lots of references when I
Googled "Class B airspeed restrictions"
As I think back on the statement I made about flying between MIA and Nassau
MANY years ago, I think what happened was the speeding up above 250 when 6
miles offshore but below 10K, but you were still in the TCA so therefore
could not. Been a long time, but I think that is what happened.
Don
-----Original Message-----
From: Dan Farmer
Sent: Tuesday, December 14, 2010 9:14 AM
Subject: Commander-List: Class B/ Speed
--> <daniellfarmer@yahoo.com>
Don,
I am not sure if you agree with me or not. FAA 91.117b last sentence reads
"This paragraph (b) does not apply to any operation within class B airspace
area. Such operations shall comply with paragraph (a) of this section"
Referring
to P.(a) it limits speed to 250K below 10K.
As to the exemption to exceed 250 for aircraft requirements, I do not know
where to find it, I just know it is done all the time. On a couple
occasions I have been ask to say speed and nothing was said if the reply to
ATC was 300K.
dan f
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