---------------------------------------------------------- Commander-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Mon 04/04/11: 6 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 03:02 PM - Re: Re: Single engine procedures. (BillLeff1@aol.com) 2. 04:41 PM - Kudos to Bill Leff (Deneal Schilmeister (MacbookPro)) 3. 08:03 PM - Re: Kudos to Bill Leff (BillLeff1@aol.com) 4. 08:30 PM - Re: Single engine procedures. (stratobee) 5. 09:04 PM - Re: Kudos to Bill Leff (Tylor Hall) 6. 09:04 PM - Re: Re: Single engine procedures. (BillLeff1@aol.com) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 03:02:10 PM PST US From: BillLeff1@aol.com Subject: Re: Commander-List: Re: Single engine procedures. Hey Tyler, The real issue in simulating single engine in Geared engines is detuning of the counterweights. The best way to simulate single engine is to make a smooth power reduction to a minimum of 13 inches using 2400-2600 rpm normal approach RPM is 2600 not 3000 if you want the engine to last. Then do the required flying i.e. flying the missed approach. Just chopping an engine does not simulate a typical engine failure anyway. Practice maneuvering in this configuration to get a feel. It is not quite zero thrust but it is close enough. For landings use this configuration until landing is assured then reduce the power on the good engine and as the throttles become matched reduce both together. Remember do not add extra speed. Fly the numbers. Maintain single engine climb until landing is assured then normal fence speed. There is less drag with one engine feathered so the plane will float. Fortunately a Commander can be just driven on without worrying about wheelbarrowing. The instructor will need to constantly monitor the MP. The starter is protected by a clutch (assuming it is set correctly. So you can't hurt it making air starts anymore than on the ground. As far as Bob Hoover is concerned, his Commander,as well as most Commanders , is equipped with un feathering pumps not accumulators. The only Commanders I have seen equipped with Accumulators ere Continental Powered. In his show he would feather the props at full power cutting the mixture and feathering the props. Then to restart he would put the mixtures forward and when he pushed the prop levers forward which would automatically start the un feathering pumps (his plane was modified for that feature. The reason, I think, he was able to do this to his engines is the Shrike engine just never get that hot in a climb. So, the cylinders don't crack. In a message dated 4/3/2011 11:17:35 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, tylorhall@mac.com writes: --> Commander-List message posted by: Tylor Hall Bill, Thank you for your input on single engine procedures. I have flown with Cate in her 680E, and she is a good stick. It is looking like I may be involved with another 520 to get it flying again. Could you go through the shut down procedure on a geared engine Commander? It appears that you do not want to simulate a single engine as we all did to get our multi engine rating by pulling power back to a near Zero thrust condition. Your post on on April 1 says to pull the mixture to idle cutoff. What next? I have been warned that the engine starter takes a lot out of it to start the engine again. This is a time where the starter could fail due to high stress? Bob Hoover did a lot of engine starts in a 500S, but that is with a direct drive engine and unfeathering accumulators. Tylor Hall On Apr 3, 2011, at 8:38 AM, kitepilot@kitepilot.com wrote: > --> Commander-List message posted by: "kitepilot@kitepilot.com" > > Taildragger? > Half of the story... :) > Once they are flying, you can get as lazy as you would in the dumbest Cessna or Piper. > If you REALLY want to "second nature your feet", get glider time. > As a long time CFI and CFIG, and having 85% of my taildragger time with a glider on tow (you go down faster than you go up... :), NOTHING will teach you coordination as a long-winged, adverse-yaw advocate, turn-stubborn glider will. > By the time I got to multiengine, after hundreds of hours towing and wrestling my feet in gliders, and engine out event was a fairly muscle-memory familiar event. > YMMV > ET > > Cate Chagnot writes: Adam, >> I know it's a long way to go from California but you won't find anyone better to give you training in your Commander than Bill Leff. He trained me in mine and does my re-current training. Well worth the cost and trouble to get to Dayton. Get some time in a taildragger if you can. It will help you deal with an engine out situation since keeping the nose straight with rudder will become automatic. Cate N4278S N180PK -------- >> Cate N4278S 680E >> Skywagon N180PK Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=335835#335835 > > > > ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 04:41:27 PM PST US Subject: Commander-List: Kudos to Bill Leff From: "Deneal Schilmeister (MacbookPro)" Not only does he share his Commander knowledge with us, my old friend Martha Lunken mentions him in the new issue of Flying Magazine. ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 08:03:21 PM PST US From: BillLeff1@aol.com Subject: Re: Commander-List: Kudos to Bill Leff How nice it was of Martha to mention me in her article! I did check here out in Jim's SNJ but she is an old hand at tail draggers and it was no problem for her. She did my single engine ATP check ride in my T-6. Yup: steep turns, a precision approach, a non precision approach a loop and a roll! Also, as to the content of the article, I could not have said it better myself. I have owned my T-6 for almost 36 years and have been flying air shows in it for 35 years. To this day I have never worn a military uniform, ever, while flying my T-6. I was a Army Nat'l Guard helicopter crew chief (unfortunately it was in OH-13's and CH-34's yes there were Hueys too) not a military pilot. I feel it would not be appropriate for me to pass myself of as a military pilot. Even thought I over 22500 hours in everything from gliders to the Airbus I do not pretend to be one of our nations finest! Carry on Martha!!! Bill Leff In a message dated 4/4/2011 7:41:59 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, deneals@deneals.com writes: Not only does he share his Commander knowledge with us, my old friend Martha Lunken mentions him in the new issue of Flying Magazine. (http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List) (http://www.matronics.com/contribution) ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 08:30:52 PM PST US Subject: Commander-List: Re: Single engine procedures. From: "stratobee" Bill, or anyone else, please tell us your real word MP numbers and airspeeds on a regular circuit to land (both engines working). Be interesting to hear as when we ferried mine back with the help of JimBob, I didn't play close attention. -------- Adam Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=336129#336129 ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 09:04:13 PM PST US From: Tylor Hall Subject: Re: Commander-List: Kudos to Bill Leff Bill, Thanks for the information. I printed it out and will take it with me next time. I grew up in Cincinnati. My fist contact with aircraft was hanging on the fence at Lunken Airport and watching the planes land. My time in the USMCR (non flying except for flying in the back) I was in VMR-234 that flew C-119's out of NAS Glenview. One of our C-119's lost an engine on takeoff out of MCAS Cherry Point. He shut down one, kept it flying and was able to make it around and on the ground. He never got above 200' AGL, which is just above the trees. He was loaded, full of fuel and 20+ troops. This is one of those events that I witnessed that make me ask lots of questions. I want to know how to do it right. If you have one engine out for landing, do you wait on putting the gear down until short final? Tylor Hall On Apr 4, 2011, at 9:00 PM, BillLeff1@aol.com wrote: > How nice it was of Martha to mention me in her article! I did check here out in Jim's SNJ but she is an old hand at tail draggers and it was no problem for her. She did my single engine ATP check ride in my T-6. Yup: steep turns, a precision approach, a non precision approach a loop and a roll! > > Also, as to the content of the article, I could not have said it better myself. I have owned my T-6 for almost 36 years and have been flying air shows in it for 35 years. To this day I have never worn a military uniform, ever, while flying my T-6. > > I was a Army Nat'l Guard helicopter crew chief (unfortunately it was in OH-13's and CH-34's yes there were Hueys too) not a military pilot. I feel it would not be appropriate for me to pass myself of as a military pilot. Even thought I over 22500 hours in everything from gliders to the Airbus I do not pretend to be one of our nations finest! > > Carry on Martha!!! > > Bill Leff > > > > In a message dated 4/4/2011 7:41:59 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, deneals@deneals.com writes: > Not only does he share his Commander knowledge with us, my old friend Martha Lunken mentions him in the new issue of Flying Magazine. > > > > href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List > s.matronics.com/">http://forums.matronics.com > p://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contribution > > > > ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 09:04:13 PM PST US From: BillLeff1@aol.com Subject: Re: Commander-List: Re: Single engine procedures. 17 inches and 2600 rpm in the pattern, then plan the approach at 15 inches with gear down and 1/4 flaps. Use flaps to add drag for glide path control landing with full flaps (always). 13 inches minimum until closing throttles at touchdown. Practice until you can do that. Always inspect props after landing to see if the prop spinner bulkhead slipped making the spinner rub on the prop blades. Ruff mags, or a backfire can cause the slip as well. Bill In a message dated 4/4/2011 11:31:12 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, adam@adamfrisch.com writes: --> Commander-List message posted by: "stratobee" Bill, or anyone else, please tell us your real word MP numbers and airspeeds on a regular circuit to land (both engines working). Be interesting to hear as when we ferried mine back with the help of JimBob, I didn't play close attention. -------- Adam Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=336129#336129 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message commander-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Commander-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/commander-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/commander-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.