---------------------------------------------------------- CorvairEngines-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Thu 01/27/11: 7 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 02:06 AM - Re: Re: CorvairEngines-5th bearing (roy szarafinski) 2. 06:25 AM - Re: Re: CorvairEngines-5th bearing (Rick Lindstrom) 3. 09:05 AM - Re: Re: CorvairEngines-5th bearing (MRus597999@aol.com) 4. 09:47 AM - Re: Re: CorvairEngines-5th bearing (Rick Lindstrom) 5. 10:09 AM - Re: Re: CorvairEngines-5th bearing (Barry Davis) 6. 10:24 AM - Re: Re: CorvairEngines-5th bearing (Scott Black) 7. 06:04 PM - Re: William Wynne out of Business? (Fulco, Neal (NA)) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 02:06:37 AM PST US From: roy szarafinski Subject: Re: CorvairEngines-List: Re: CorvairEngines-5th bearing Well I need to apologize to Mike and the list, I was a little chapped about opinions being touted as facts. Forgive my satire. Roy On Jan 26, 2011, at 10:02 PM, John Bolding wrote: > A little more homework on the subject might be helpful to understand > the difference. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: MRus597999@aol.com > To: corvairengines-list@matronics.com > Sent: Wednesday, January 26, 2011 7:09 PM > Subject: Re: CorvairEngines-List: William Wynne out of Business? > > >> We're trying to save money in the experimental market and that's > why I say all things being equal I will go with the lowest price. > > ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 06:25:00 AM PST US Subject: Re: CorvairEngines-List: Re: CorvairEngines-5th bearing From: Rick Lindstrom Brother Roy! The latest KITPLANES (finally) contains the Experimotive column I wrote about Dan, you, and Mark. In this piece I thought I did a pretty good job of describing the difference between the different bearing offerings. Let me see if I can get a PDF of the article to you, it might help correct some of the perceptions that people hold about price being the final determining factor. Rick On Thu, Jan 27, 2011 at 2:04 AM, roy szarafinski wrote: > Well I need to apologize to Mike and the list, I was a little chapped about > opinions being touted as facts. > Forgive my satire. > Roy > On Jan 26, 2011, at 10:02 PM, John Bolding wrote: > > A little more homework on the subject might be helpful to understand the > difference. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From:MRus597999@aol.com > To:corvairengines-list@matronics.com > Sent:Wednesday, January 26, 2011 7:09 PM > Subject:Re: CorvairEngines-List: William Wynne out of Business? >>>We're trying to save money in the experimental marketand that's why I >>> say all things being equalI will go with the lowest price. > > > href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?CorvairEngines-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?CorvairEngines-List > href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com > href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contribution > > ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 09:05:24 AM PST US From: MRus597999@aol.com Subject: Re: CorvairEngines-List: Re: CorvairEngines-5th bearing I apologize for being misinformed. I read the Kitplane article after I visited Roy's website. It does appear he has an excellent product and is well worth the reasonable price he is asking. It has been some time since I visited the site and it looks like he has and is creating some other very excellent products for the Corvair conversion. I am still working on upgrading my 601xl airframe and am a few months away from finishing it. I was already to start on my corvair when the FAA stopped all Zenith builders in their tracks. Maybe that's a good thing. I am going to really examine Roy's 5th bearing again. Mike Russell In a message dated 1/27/2011 6:25:09 A.M. Pacific Standard Time, tigerized@gmail.com writes: --> CorvairEngines-List message posted by: Rick Lindstrom Brother Roy! The latest KITPLANES (finally) contains the Experimotive column I wrote about Dan, you, and Mark. In this piece I thought I did a pretty good job of describing the difference between the different bearing offerings. Let me see if I can get a PDF of the article to you, it might help correct some of the perceptions that people hold about price being the final determining factor. Rick On Thu, Jan 27, 2011 at 2:04 AM, roy szarafinski wrote: > Well I need to apologize to Mike and the list, I was a little chapped about > opinions being touted as facts. > Forgive my satire. > Roy > On Jan 26, 2011, at 10:02 PM, John Bolding wrote: > > A little more homework on the subject might be helpful to understand the > difference. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: MRus597999@aol.com > To: corvairengines-list@matronics.com > Sent: Wednesday, January 26, 2011 7:09 PM > Subject: Re: CorvairEngines-List: William Wynne out of Business? >>> We're trying to save money in the experimental market and that's why I >>> say all things being equal I will go with the lowest price. > > > href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?CorvairEngines-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?CorvairEngines-List > href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com > href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contribution > > ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 09:47:50 AM PST US Subject: Re: CorvairEngines-List: Re: CorvairEngines-5th bearing From: Rick Lindstrom IMHO, if you're engine is already mounted and running, Dan's solution is, indeed, "better than air" and will prevent your crankshaft from developing a split personality. If you're still building your engine, then I'd seriously consider Roy's solution and take advantage of his line boring skill and his beautifully machined, servicable bearing. In the grand scheme of things, the difference in money spent pales when considering that both solutions will prevent you from a forced landing, or worse, somewhere. Again, this is just the opinion of a loud-mouthed journalist. On Thu, Jan 27, 2011 at 9:02 AM, wrote: > I apologize for being misinformed. I read the Kitplane article after I > visited Roy's website. It does appear he has an excellent product and is > well worth the reasonable price he is asking. It has been some time since I > visited the site and it looks like he has and is creating some other very > excellent products for the Corvair conversion. I am still working on > upgrading my 601xl airframe and am a few months away from finishing it. I > was already to start on my corvair when the FAA stopped all Zenith builders > in their tracks. Maybe that's a good thing. I am going to really examine > Roy's 5th bearing again. > > Mike Russell > > In a message dated 1/27/2011 6:25:09 A.M. Pacific Standard Time, > tigerized@gmail.com writes: > > > > Brother Roy! > > The latest KITPLANES (finally) contains the Experimotive column I > wrote about Dan, you, and Mark. In this piece I thought I did a pretty > good job of describing the difference between the different bearing > offerings. > > Let me see if I can get a PDF of the article to you, it might help > correct some of the perceptions that people hold about price being the > final determining factor. > > Rick > > On Thu, Jan 27, 2011 at 2:04 AM, roy szarafinski wrote: >> Well I need to apologize to Mike and the list, I was a little chapped >> about >> opinions being touted as facts. >> Forgive my satire. >> Roy >> On Jan 26, 2011, at 10:02 PM, John Bolding wrote: >> >> A little more homework on the subject might be helpful to understand the >> difference. >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From:MRus597999@aol.com >> To:corvairengines-list@matronics.com >> Sent:Wednesday, January 26, 2011 7:09 PM >> Subject:Re: CorvairEngines-List: William Wynne out of Business? >>>>We're trying to save money in the experimental marketand that's why I >>>> say all things being equalI will go with the lowest price. >> >> >> >> href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?CorvairEngines-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?CorvairEngines-List >> href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com >> >> href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contribution >> >> >> >> >> >> >> - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS >> ================================================ - List >> Contribution Web Site sp; >> ================================================== > > ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 10:09:30 AM PST US From: "Barry Davis" Subject: RE: CorvairEngines-List: Re: CorvairEngines-5th bearing Don't forget to check out the Aeromax bearing. Some good pictures are on a website www.awesometrvl.com Down at the bottom of the first page. bed -----Original Message----- From: owner-corvairengines-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-corvairengines-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rick Lindstrom Sent: Thursday, January 27, 2011 12:45 PM Subject: Re: CorvairEngines-List: Re: CorvairEngines-5th bearing --> IMHO, if you're engine is already mounted and running, Dan's solution is, indeed, "better than air" and will prevent your crankshaft from developing a split personality. If you're still building your engine, then I'd seriously consider Roy's solution and take advantage of his line boring skill and his beautifully machined, servicable bearing. In the grand scheme of things, the difference in money spent pales when considering that both solutions will prevent you from a forced landing, or worse, somewhere. Again, this is just the opinion of a loud-mouthed journalist. On Thu, Jan 27, 2011 at 9:02 AM, wrote: > I apologize for being misinformed. I read the Kitplane article after I > visited Roy's website. It does appear he has an excellent product and > is well worth the reasonable price he is asking. It has been some time > since I visited the site and it looks like he has and is creating some > other very excellent products for the Corvair conversion. I am still > working on upgrading my 601xl airframe and am a few months away from > finishing it. I was already to start on my corvair when the FAA > stopped all Zenith builders in their tracks. Maybe that's a good > thing. I am going to really examine Roy's 5th bearing again. > > Mike Russell > > In a message dated 1/27/2011 6:25:09 A.M. Pacific Standard Time, > tigerized@gmail.com writes: > > > > Brother Roy! > > The latest KITPLANES (finally) contains the Experimotive column I > wrote about Dan, you, and Mark. In this piece I thought I did a pretty > good job of describing the difference between the different bearing > offerings. > > Let me see if I can get a PDF of the article to you, it might help > correct some of the perceptions that people hold about price being the > final determining factor. > > Rick > > On Thu, Jan 27, 2011 at 2:04 AM, roy szarafinski wrote: >> Well I need to apologize to Mike and the list, I was a little chapped >> about opinions being touted as facts. >> Forgive my satire. >> Roy >> On Jan 26, 2011, at 10:02 PM, John Bolding wrote: >> >> A little more homework on the subject might be helpful to understand >> the difference. >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From:MRus597999@aol.com >> To:corvairengines-list@matronics.com >> Sent:Wednesday, January 26, 2011 7:09 PM >> Subject:Re: CorvairEngines-List: William Wynne out of Business? >>>>We're trying to save money in the experimental marketand that's >>>>why I say all things being equalI will go with the lowest price. >> >> >> >> href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?CorvairEngines-List">http:// >> www.matronics.com/Navigator?CorvairEngines-List >> href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com >> >> href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com >> /contribution >> >> >> >> >> >> >> - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS >> ================================================ - List >> Contribution Web Site sp; >> ================================================== > > ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 10:24:15 AM PST US From: Scott Black Subject: Re: CorvairEngines-List: Re: CorvairEngines-5th bearing It is interesting to note that pretty much all of the crank failures have been in higher performance airplanes like the KR and Sonex (Cleanex)? The common theory has been that this is a function of aircraft speed and rpm. I have a pet theory (doesn't everyone?) that it is not the airplane, but the type of flying that is doing in these cranks where 40 yrs of flying in Piets did not. When an airplane is in level flight at low aircraft aoa both the up and down going blades see similar blade aoas. When pulling G, such as in a tight turn, the down going and up going blade see substantially different blade aoa, and hence blade loading (known as P factor). This means that every revolution is a brutal bending cycle on the prop. I know from flying 65hp champs that I tended to be a bit gentle when just tooling around. But when flying something with a bit more "hair" it is lots of fun to bank and yank. So I think it is the style of flying that has as much to do with the crank failures as anything. Aerobatics would be a certain fast track to a silent landing. As for the different 5th bearings, one would need to have some specialized knowledge to understand the relationship between bending loads and bearing clearance to determine the advantage of the different options. Theoretically the line bored precision installation should be better, but it might also be that once you have even a crude 5th bearing on there the improvement is so vast that the benefit from the extra tolerance is in the wash. I think anyone who says they know for sure would have to have some hard numbers (i.e. test data) or they are just guessing. It comes down to engineering judgement and experience and it will be a few 1000 flight hrs before this experience starts to be built up. Right now it is fortunate that there are several different approaches being taken. If failures start to turn up in one type then valuable knowledge will be tained. Hopefully any design shortcomings will show up during an inspection and not result in an incident. ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 06:04:20 PM PST US Subject: CorvairEngines-List: Re: William Wynne out of Business? From: "Fulco, Neal (NA)" Like others, I too had to wait a good while to get some of the parts I had ordered from WW. But I eventually got them all. I think WW does so much of the work himself to keep costs down, that many items are backlogged. About WW, a couple of years ago at Oshkosh, I was at the WW display and I saw a part on display that I eventually was going to buy. WW said "take it." I didn't have the cash on me at that point and WW said to just take it. " I know you're good for it." Quite nice of him. Not many people would do that. Neal ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message corvairengines-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/CorvairEngines-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/corvairengines-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/corvairengines-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.