Today's Message Index:
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1. 01:24 AM - Re: Is The UK list off the air? (John Cliff)
2. 10:29 AM - Re: Is The UK list off the air? (Matt Dralle)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Is The UK list off the air? |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "John Cliff" <john@crixbinfield.freeserve.co.uk>
[Second time of sending, because the first was rejected by the list server as
it had a particular word (subscribe) at the beginning of a line.]
> > All,
> >
> > First let me say that I appreciate the time and efforts of
> > the people who spend time managing the "old" Europa-Forum.
> > My hobby is building a Europa, whereas those who support
> > this list with their time and efforts choose to spend their
> > hobby-time supporting and managing list-servers.
>
Thank you.
>
> > Because it is a hobby for them, my opinion is that issues
> > other than reliability, security, speed, attachment
> > filtering, and ease of list management are the basis for
> > continuing with list-hosting by AvNet.
> >
> > At one time, I felt strongly that the Europa-Forum managers
> > would certainly like to dump their list-hosting burden and,
> > like me, spend their time on their Europas.
>
Just to state the facts. The 'old' list is run by Aviators Network, a
professional ISP specialising in the aviation field. It was started in 1996
and
Avnet offered to, and have continued to, host it for free. The Europa Club
people concerned with it, principally myself, have no part in its operation -
except for specification of attachment filtering, which is not unlike that used
on the Matronics lists. I can assure you that if I were able to manage and
support it directly it certainly wouldn't be giving erratic service ! My
power
is limited to the ability to approve or deny postings from non-subscribers, to
ssubscribe and unsubscribe people manually (useful when old addresses nolonger
exist) and intervening in non-delivery situations, bounces. I also try to>
offer help and advice with using the list when asked and run a personal website
for pictures and other files relevant to list conversations, for peolple who
don't run their own.
>
> > With that in
> > mind, I talked to Matt at Matronics regarding his ability
> > and willingness to host the old Europa-Forum. As a
> > participant in some of the other aviation lists that he
> > hosts on his servers, I was able to experience the extremely
> > reliable and spam-free hosting-service that he voluntarily
> > provides to the home-built community.
> >
> > Needless to say, Matt was extremely anxious to work with us
> > and I informed the Europa-Forum manager of Matt's interest.
> > Matt, in his enthusiasm, actually put up the "new"
> > Europa-List on his servers prior to any agreement from the
> > Europa-Forum that they would switch.
>
I, too, talked to Matt (about 16 months ago) and he readily agreed to create a
Europa list for us if requested. In the event, the Europa Club wished to
continue with Avnet (with greatly improved software) and I told Matt that. I
haven't heard from him since and don't believe he expected a mass switchover.
> > Obviously the switch-over was never made, and the stated
> > reason as I recall was some issue with the software that
> > Matt uses (or may have used) on his servers.
>
We would have had no issue with Matt's software (or with the exemplary way he
runs his operation).
> > After
> > reflecting on the basis for their decision, I concluded that
> > a switch would kill their hobby. I can relate to that
> > decision since, like them, I have no interest in having an
> > expert build my Europa as doing so would kill the hobby
> > aspect of my endeavors.
>
As wil have been seen, it is not a hobby. It is in fact a bit of a burden. I
do it to put a bit back in return for the advice we all get from more
experienced builders.
> > The choice remains -- continuing with hobbyists whose
> > efforts we appreciate, or switching to a extremely
> > successful, professionally run organization (Matronics) that
> > specializes in hosting aviation-related lists.
>
One thing that weighs with us is that in the event of a split both 'sides'
would
be losers. It is in all our interests that the user community remain united
(for technical discussions, not talking about social matters).
John Cliff
(sort-of-administrator of the 'old' list)
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Is The UK list off the air? |
--> Europa-List message posted by: Matt Dralle <dralle@matronics.com>
At 01:30 AM 2/1/2003 Saturday, you wrote:
>--> Europa-List message posted by: "John Cliff"
><john@crixbinfield.freeserve.co.uk>
> I, too, talked to Matt (about 16 months ago) and he readily agreed to
> create a
> Europa list for us if requested. In the event, the Europa Club wished to
> continue with Avnet (with greatly improved software) and I told Matt
> that. I
> haven't heard from him since and don't believe he expected a mass
> switchover.
>
> John Cliff
Just to be clear, I would be happy to host any or all of the existing
List. Thanks to the generosity of listers, I have been able to build
incredibly high-performance, high-availability systems to host these email
lists and encourage participation and additional subsubscribers. I am also
open to any sort of list creation the members might be interested in, for
example a NA version and a European version. I do think, however, that
having a common list serves both groups better.
In any case, know that I'm here for the Aviation community and will do
whatever I can to assist your communications needs.
Best regards,
Matt Dralle
Matronics Email List Admin.
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