Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 01:55 AM - Re: Fuel Outlet Rubber Hose Replacement (david joyce)
2. 04:38 AM - Fuel outlet rubber hose (david joyce)
3. 06:58 AM - Re: Sticky pre-skinned surfaces (Paul Sweeting)
4. 06:58 AM - EGT Specs (irampil@notes.cc.sunysb.edu)
5. 07:34 AM - Wanted: Becker 3201 (Gerry Holland)
6. 09:26 AM - Re: EGT Specs (RMRRick@aol.com)
7. 09:58 AM - Icom IC A200 (Brian Davies)
8. 11:18 AM - Re: Icom IC A200 (R.C.Harrison)
9. 11:25 AM - Re: Wanted: Becker 3201 (R.C.Harrison)
10. 11:37 AM - Re: Icom IC A200 (Ami McFadyean)
11. 11:37 AM - Re: Rotax 912ULS EGT (Ami McFadyean)
12. 11:41 AM - Re: Icom IC A200 (Ami McFadyean)
13. 01:18 PM - Re: Icom IC A200 (Mark Burton)
14. 02:56 PM - Re: Europa-List Digest: 13 Msgs - 05/20/03 (Graham Singleton)
15. 03:29 PM - Re: Icom IC A200 /belly antenna (R.C.Harrison)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Fuel Outlet Rubber Hose Replacement |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "david joyce" <davidjoyce@beeb.net>
Roland, If the split fuel line allowed air in I am surprised that it did not
let a tank full of fuel out and make itself obvious beforehand. David
----- Original Message -----
From: Roland Robinson@tiscali.co.uk <roland.robinson@tiscali.co.uk>
Subject: Re: Europa-List: Fuel Outlet Rubber Hose Replacement
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Roland Robinson@tiscali.co.uk"
<roland.robinson@tiscali.co.uk>
>
> I had a recent bad experience with a Europa just after take-off that I
> eventually traced to what I believe is an original fuel line supplied by
the
> factory. I had completed the annual inspection, which obviously included
> removing and cleaning the fuel filters, I flight tested the plane (at full
> all up weight) and flew for a couple more hours with no problems, then I
set
> out for some circuits (I am low hours on type) - first circuit no problem,
> second circuit just after take-off engine started to run rough, it felt
> almost as if it were on two cylinders. I closed the throttle and looked at
> getting it back on the runway (I operate from Kemble that has a V long
> runway) but was too late. I was picking my field when my friend flying
with
> me suggested trying the throttle again I did and the engine responded -
for
> a while and then ran rough again. We repeated this for a few times and
> gained enough height to make the cross runway. When we finally got the
Pan
> call in the engine of course ran fine on reduced throttle. On landing and
> carrying out some power checks the only discrepancy we could find was a
> approx 200rpm loss in max revs.
>
> Many checks followed dirt in the tank, float bowls, drained tanks,
boroscope
> in tank, check filters again!!- nothing. However when replacing the
filters
> we noticed that there was a short split in the fuel line. In its dark and
> dingy corner under the seat this was not easy to spot. The lines were
> replaced, fuel pressure gauges added and we gingerly went for a test
flight.
> The problem has not recurred.
>
> Why did the problem not occur immediately - here is my theory. I started
the
> test and subsequent flights with full tanks. As the fuel level dropped the
> suction head on the pump reduced and the pump eventually drew air from the
> split in the pipe. (I have since run with less fuel than I normally would
to
> test that this would not happen again). The engine recovered as the
> throttle was closed as the fuel demand reduced the pump demand reduced.
>
> Any other theories out there??
>
> Roly Robinson G-CHAV (Now at Gloucester)
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Brian Davies" <bdavies@dircon.co.uk>
> To: <europa-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: Re: Europa-List: Fuel Outlet Rubber Hose Replacement
>
>
> > --> Europa-List message posted by: "Brian Davies" <bdavies@dircon.co.uk>
> >
> > Europa have changed the hose it supplies, because of poor experience
with
> > the existing. The type provided with my kit was quite thin and flexible
> and
> > cloth braided on the outside. I consulted some auto repair mates and
they
> > said they would not fit it on a car because it would start leaking after
a
> > couple of years.
> > The stuff Europa supplied with the fuel drain mod kit was clearly
> superior.
> > I suggest you check with the factory on the spec of the hose they are
now
> > supplying or replace with good quality auto hose.
> >
> > Brian Davies kit 454
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Tony Renshaw" <tonyrenshaw@ozemail.com.au>
> > To: <europa-list@matronics.com>
> > Subject: Europa-List: Fuel Outlet Rubber Hose Replacement
> >
> >
> > > --> Europa-List message posted by: Tony Renshaw
> > <tonyrenshaw@ozemail.com.au>
> > >
> > > Gidday,
> > > I am wondering if the Europa supplied hose is adaquate for this task,
as
> > > mine appears to gape around the reinforcement at the outer edge of the
> > hose
> > > clamp. This may well be normal, but it makes me wonder whether there
is
> a
> > > better quality hose available. Any assistance will certainly be
> > appreciated.
> > > Reg
> > > Tony Renshaw
> > > Sydney Australia
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
Message 2
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| Subject: | Fuel outlet rubber hose |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "david joyce" <davidjoyce@beeb.net>
Thinking more about Roland's problem, I wonder whether he could have had a damaged
end with the inner part seperated from the outer, which allowed a flap to
get pushed in when forcing the hose on to the connector, partially blocking the
lumen, only allowing adequate fuel flow for small throttle openings, and having
no route for a fuel leak to make things obvious. A burst of full throttle
might push the flap a bit further in or simply use up the fuel in the carb bowls.It
is easy to imagine that further handling of the pipe could then produce
a full thickness split. David Joyce
Message 3
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| Subject: | Sticky pre-skinned surfaces |
--> Europa-List message posted by: Paul Sweeting <Paul.Sweeting@ntl.com>
Wasnt it mentioned latex gloves are permeable to the irritant or is this
just the case for pvc based disposible gloves??
Cheers
Paul.
Paul Sweeting
Europa XS Monowheel 558
-----Original Message-----
From: Jeremy Davey [mailto:jeremycrdavey@btinternet.com]
Subject: RE: Europa-List: Sticky pre-skinned surfaces
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Jeremy Davey"
<jeremycrdavey@btinternet.com>
John,
All my Stage 1 components have this to one extent or other. Indeed, at the
time we went into it in great depth with the factory and SP Systems (who
make the resin). Apparently it is a result of contaminants emerging from the
resin and reacting with water out of the atmosphere (which is exacerbated by
slow hardener being used and tallies with your weather report) and will need
to be cleaned up prior to finishing. It is not of structural significance.
Having said it is not structurally significant, it is worth taking
precautions for the sake of your health when handling these (and all)
layups. I generally wear latex gloves when handling cured layups, or wash my
hands promptly afterwards. I do not want to acquire an allergy for the sake
of a few hundred disposable gloves and a little care.
Regards,
Jeremy
Jeremy Davey
Europa XS Monowheel 537M G-EZZA
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ntl Group Limited
Message 4
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05/21/2003 09:55:56 AM,
Serialize complete at 05/21/2003 09:55:56 AM
--> Europa-List message posted by: irampil@notes.cc.sunysb.edu
Per the 912ULS Rotax Operators manual on-line at Kodiaksb,
The max T/O EGT (5 minutes) is 880C
The max Cruise EGT is 850C
If indeed the EIS alarm is 860, you may want to consider resetting it
Ira N224XS
Message 5
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| Subject: | Wanted: Becker 3201 |
--> Europa-List message posted by: Gerry Holland <gnholland@onetel.com>
Looking for a Becker 3201 Transceiver in perfect working order and good
visual condition. Ideally need 2 of these.
If you have one available please e-mail me at: gnholland@onetel.com
Can pay cash or swap both for Brand new 'boxed' Microair 760 with all
Documentation.
Regards
Gerry
Gerry Holland
Europa 384
G-FIZY
+44 7808 402404
gnholland@onetel.com
Message 6
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--> Europa-List message posted by: RMRRick@aol.com
Hi Ira
Thanks for the thought. I set the EGT just below take off and slightly above
cruise max deliberately to give me some prior indication before a problem.
It seemed to work as with the damaged silencer the reading took a big jump from
770 ish to 860 + or more in one go in the climeout. The EGT increase was not
progressive but quite jumpy so I don't think it's safe to sail too close to
the wind. With just a manual gauge I may have missed it but with a flashing
red light right in my eye line (part of the EIS set up) and a flashing EIS EGT
reading it could not be missed.
Regards
Rick
G-RIKS
Off to see my son race in East London SA for a week so off line till the
27th.
Message 7
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--> Europa-List message posted by: "Brian Davies" <bdavies@dircon.co.uk>
Does any one know of a UK supplier for the Icom IC A200 transceiver? I know I
can get it from the US but it would be nice to have UK supplier support.
Brian Davies kit 454
Message 8
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--> Europa-List message posted by: "R.C.Harrison" <ptag.dev@ukonline.co.uk>
Hi! Brian.
I'm pretty sure that the ICOM IC A200 is no longer approved gear for new
installations. Quite frankly on my experiences on a "grp ship" I consider
that to be a good decision by the CAA.
Mine is still poor on reception depending on engine shadow even with a new
belly mounted antenae at about 140.! Believe me I have tried every thing to
solve the problem and find myself needing to fly most often with the squelch
facility off. The squelch control is automatic and can not be regulated
freely by an in flight control making it IMHO unfit for purpose.
I'm given to understand that the Microair set is the best thing since sliced
bread, suggest you investigate further.Mendholson supplied mine.
Otherwise I have an ICOM IC A 200 you can pay me for!!!!
Regards
Bob Harrison
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Brian Davies
Subject: Europa-List: Icom IC A200
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Brian Davies" <bdavies@dircon.co.uk>
Does any one know of a UK supplier for the Icom IC A200 transceiver? I know
I can get it from the US but it would be nice to have UK supplier support.
Brian Davies kit 454
Message 9
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| Subject: | Wanted: Becker 3201 |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "R.C.Harrison" <ptag.dev@ukonline.co.uk>
Hi! Gerry.
Brian Davies may be interested to buy the Microair at :-
bdavies@dircon.co.uk
I've just suggested a Microair to him in lieu of my crap experiences with an
ICOM IC A200.
However if you want somewhere to throw the Micrair I'm your man !
Regards
Bob Harrison G-PTAG
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Gerry
Holland
Subject: Europa-List: Wanted: Becker 3201
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Icom IC A200 |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Ami McFadyean" <ami@mcfadyean.freeserve.co.uk>
Waters and Stanton in Essex.
Tel. 01702 206835/204965.
Just to tease you, they recently sold-off their pre-TSO'd stock of A200s for
299 each!
Duncan McF
----- Original Message -----
From: "Brian Davies" <bdavies@dircon.co.uk>
Subject: Europa-List: Icom IC A200
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Brian Davies" <bdavies@dircon.co.uk>
>
> Does any one know of a UK supplier for the Icom IC A200 transceiver? I
know I can get it from the US but it would be nice to have UK supplier
support.
>
> Brian Davies kit 454
>
>
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Rotax 912ULS EGT |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Ami McFadyean" <ami@mcfadyean.freeserve.co.uk>
Glad I don't have any baffles in my silencer!
Duncan mcF.
----- Original Message -----
From: <RMRRick@aol.com>
Subject: Re: Europa-List: Rotax 912ULS EGT
> A replacement box solved all the problems. Andy, the silencer
> manufacturer and the PFA have been told. The back pressure from a
displaced
> baffle was leaning the mixture. It was also blowing off the silencer from
the
> starboard downpipe.
> It seems that I had an isolated bad silencer.
>
> Regards Rick
> G-RIKS
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Icom IC A200 |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Ami McFadyean" <ami@mcfadyean.freeserve.co.uk>
Bob,
Any more details of the belly-mounted antenna? The fin mounted version is
poor with any radio if the receiving station is infront (like an airfield
that is being flown towards!).
Duncan McF
----- Original Message -----
From: "R.C.Harrison" <ptag.dev@ukonline.co.uk>
Subject: RE: Europa-List: Icom IC A200
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "R.C.Harrison"
<ptag.dev@ukonline.co.uk>
>
> Hi! Brian.
> I'm pretty sure that the ICOM IC A200 is no longer approved gear for new
> installations. Quite frankly on my experiences on a "grp ship" I consider
> that to be a good decision by the CAA.
> Mine is still poor on reception depending on engine shadow even with a new
> belly mounted antenae at about 140.! Believe me I have tried every thing
to
> solve the problem and find myself needing to fly most often with the
squelch
> facility off. The squelch control is automatic and can not be regulated
> freely by an in flight control making it IMHO unfit for purpose.
> I'm given to understand that the Microair set is the best thing since
sliced
> bread, suggest you investigate further.Mendholson supplied mine.
> Otherwise I have an ICOM IC A 200 you can pay me for!!!!
> Regards
> Bob Harrison
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Brian Davies
> To: europa-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Europa-List: Icom IC A200
>
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Brian Davies" <bdavies@dircon.co.uk>
>
> Does any one know of a UK supplier for the Icom IC A200 transceiver? I
know
> I can get it from the US but it would be nice to have UK supplier support.
>
> Brian Davies kit 454
>
>
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: Icom IC A200 |
--> Europa-List message posted by: Mark Burton <markb@ordern.com>
Hello Brian,
I have been using an ICOM IC A200 with a Bob Archer antenna glued to
the inside of my Europa fuselage for a few years now and its
performance is absolutely first class.
I regularly pick up good quality transmissions from other aircraft
over 100 miles away and have never been told my transmissions are less
than 5's.
The automatic squelch works just fine.
Regards,
Mark
From: "R.C.Harrison" <ptag.dev@ukonline.co.uk>
Subject: RE: Europa-List: Icom IC A200
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "R.C.Harrison" <ptag.dev@ukonline.co.uk>
>
> Hi! Brian.
> I'm pretty sure that the ICOM IC A200 is no longer approved gear for new
> installations. Quite frankly on my experiences on a "grp ship" I consider
> that to be a good decision by the CAA.
> Mine is still poor on reception depending on engine shadow even with a new
> belly mounted antenae at about 140.! Believe me I have tried every thing to
> solve the problem and find myself needing to fly most often with the squelch
> facility off. The squelch control is automatic and can not be regulated
> freely by an in flight control making it IMHO unfit for purpose.
> I'm given to understand that the Microair set is the best thing since sliced
> bread, suggest you investigate further.Mendholson supplied mine.
> Otherwise I have an ICOM IC A 200 you can pay me for!!!!
> Regards
> Bob Harrison
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Brian Davies
> To: europa-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Europa-List: Icom IC A200
>
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Brian Davies" <bdavies@dircon.co.uk>
>
> Does any one know of a UK supplier for the Icom IC A200 transceiver? I know
> I can get it from the US but it would be nice to have UK supplier support.
>
> Brian Davies kit 454
>
>
>
>
>
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: Europa-List Digest: 13 Msgs - 05/20/03 |
--> Europa-List message posted by: Graham Singleton <graham@gflight.f9.co.uk>
At 23:56 20/05/2003 -0700, you wrote:
>Hi Roly
>I had an almost identical experience flying a PA28 from Redhill. Applied
>full power, which I got until I was 50' off the ground and out of runway.
>Engine spluttered, throttled back, it ran fine. later diacovered that it
>was a poorly fitted fuel union that
>leaked and thus allowed air into the fuel system
>So I think that your theory is quite sound.
>Ed
Roly & Ed
Your theory is indeed sound IMHO. A slight leak on the upstream side of the
pumps may be undetected because so little fuel seeps out it may not be
noticed in the general smell of fuel in the cabin. {:-( However at low
tank levels, air will be sucked in to the line, this will displace fuel,
the air passes through the tiny leak easier than fuel does so its volume
may easily result in a severe loss of fuel pressure. Remember the electric
pump won't pump air very effectively anyway, the air expands in response to
the pressure reduction caused by the pump so displaces more fuel.
I recommend checking for air in the fuel flow by pumping with the electric
pump from a low tank level into a long , clear pvc tube. Air bubbles will
be easily visible in the fuel flow.
This happened to G-KWIP in the very early days, I have to say that Neville
was the one who suggested this test and it worked. Others blamed our non
standard (at that time) fuel vapour return, hot air system, whatever. The
cause was a poorly installed joint in the metal fuel lines. Just like Ed's
Piper.
Graham
---
Message 15
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| Subject: | Icom IC A200 /belly antenna |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "R.C.Harrison" <ptag.dev@ukonline.co.uk>
Hi! Duncan./Brian Davies/Gerry and all.
The belly mounted antenna I now have is CI-122 from Adams Aviation at
140.13 incl VAT. recommended by "Ash" the guy who used to do the panels for
RD Aviation. As you perhaps noticed
it sweeps backwards in a manner which clears my trailer floor when I winch
the a/c backwards.
However I'm not convinced that the improvement over the standard copper tape
in the fin close out is particularly worth the expense and effort, but as
yet another attempt to improve my ICOM IC A200 RECEPTION it just adds to the
list of things to try because "you name it I've tried it" with many
professional people having been involved with VSWR meters you name it, but
of course I have the Jabiru 3300 engine installation which may be the cause
of the reception problem.
OK some lucky folks sing praises of the ICOM but I must speak as to my
misfortunes, and I would expect that the CAA have taken their action on
informed experiences, and "good gear" doesn't get sold off at bum prices for
no reason ?
Ivor Phillips is suggesting the following alternative to be investigated by
anyone on the point of making a purchase............. before you commit your
self to the Microair look at this radio from Australia
http://www.mcp.com.au/xcom760/online-sales/main-page.html
read the spec about monitoring two channels at once.
There are some things that I dearly wish I had the opportunity and cash to
revisit.
Yes, hope to see you at Kemble, Gerry!
Regards
Bob Harrison G-PTAG Europa MKI/Jabiru 3300
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Ami McFadyean"
<ami@mcfadyean.freeserve.co.uk>
Bob,
Any more details of the belly-mounted antenna? The fin mounted version is
poor with any radio if the receiving station is infront (like an airfield
that is being flown towards!).
Duncan McF
>
> Hi! Brian.
> I'm pretty sure that the ICOM IC A200 is no longer approved gear for new
> installations. Quite frankly on my experiences on a "grp ship" I consider
> that to be a good decision by the CAA.
> Mine is still poor on reception depending on engine shadow even with a new
> belly mounted antenae at about 140.! Believe me I have tried every thing
to
> solve the problem and find myself needing to fly most often with the
squelch
> facility off. The squelch control is automatic and can not be regulated
> freely by an in flight control making it IMHO unfit for purpose.
> I'm given to understand that the Microair set is the best thing since
sliced
> bread, suggest you investigate further.Mendholson supplied mine.
> Otherwise I have an ICOM IC A 200 you can pay me for!!!!
> Regards
> Bob Harrison
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Brian Davies" <bdavies@dircon.co.uk>
>
> Does any one know of a UK supplier for the Icom IC A200 transceiver? I
know
> I can get it from the US but it would be nice to have UK supplier support.
>
> Brian Davies kit 454
>
>
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