Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 01:52 AM - Europa covers wanted (Cripps, David)
2. 02:09 AM - Re: Rotax Oil Dipstick Change (Davidghillam@aol.com)
3. 02:14 AM - Re: Rotax Oil Dipstick Change (Davidghillam@aol.com)
4. 02:37 AM - Re: Batteries (david joyce)
5. 05:47 AM - Re: Rotax Oil Dipstick Change (Andy Draper)
6. 06:51 AM - Re: LEDs (irampil@notes.cc.sunysb.edu)
7. 07:05 AM - Re: Trailer questions (Neville Eyre)
8. 08:02 AM - Re: Batteries (Neville Eyre)
9. 10:07 AM - Re: Batteries (owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com)
10. 10:30 AM - Re: LEDs (Fred Fillinger)
11. 12:16 PM - Re: Batteries (Ami McFadyean)
12. 03:39 PM - Re: LEDs (irampil@notes.cc.sunysb.edu)
13. 11:41 PM - Re: LEDs (Jos Okhuijsen)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Europa covers wanted |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Cripps, David" <david.cripps@spsystems.com>
Help! Due to ownership changes at our airfield, I am losing my Europa's hangar
space and will need to park outside on the grass for the foreseeable future.
Does anyone have a set of full outdoor covers for a Europa Classic that I could
borrow/hire/buy until the situation is resolved? I have a reflective cockpit
cover but would really like to cover the whole thing up, as much to keep prying
fingers off, as to keep it snug from our wet coastal weather.
Any help gratefully received.
David
GBWJH
Visit SP at stand D103 at the European Wind Energy Conference, Madrid, Spain, 16th
- 19th June 2003
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Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Rotax Oil Dipstick Change |
--> Europa-List message posted by: Davidghillam@aol.com
Andy,
Is there any chance of you being able to offer an exchange dipstick service
at the Rally at Kemble?
Just a thought.
David
G-SHSH
(Test flying complete, awaiting receipt of Permit to Fly)
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Rotax Oil Dipstick Change |
--> Europa-List message posted by: Davidghillam@aol.com
In a message dated 6/20/03 10:31:52 AM GMT Daylight Time,
andy@europa-aircraft.com writes:
> Further to my note below, I stand corrected. Skydrive will supply the
> dipsticks directly, but will require you to contact them to request one.
Andy.
Please ignore previous mail. I'm catching up on mail after being away for a
few days and hadn't read your correction.
Perhaps Skydrive will provide an exchange service at Kemble??
David
Message 4
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--> Europa-List message posted by: "david joyce" <davidjoyce@beeb.net>
Fred, I accept all that, but can't quite visualise what sort of lesion could
wipe out the alternator and battery simultanoeusly, particularly if the
alternator is wired into the system through a fuse or contact breaker. This
seems effectively to give two independent systems with one pump running off
battery even if alternator switch off and the other running off alternator
even if master and alternator switches both off. I don't incidentally have a
battery relay.
It is entirely reasonable to allow for one unlikely event , but the
odds of two unlikely independent events happening simultaneously are such
that I am happy to use gliding for the back up mode. But perhaps I am
missing something and displaying my ignorance! David Joyce----- Original
Message -----
From: Fred Fillinger <fillinger@ameritech.net>
Subject: Re: Europa-List: Batteries
> --> Europa-List message posted by: Fred Fillinger
<fillinger@ameritech.net>
>
> > I am not one bit convinced of the need for a spare
> > battery. The plane carries on flying without a blink if you switch off
> > master and alternator switches!
>
> That's because it's wired as it's supposed to be! It's picking off
> regulator current before fed to the bus, but it's not redundant. If one
> has a battery relay, and the alternator/regulator fails, and the overall
> problem is such the battery must be disconnected, the engine will quit.
> There's no way to wire the 914 pumps to any single electrical system
> which would meet current FAA rules, were this a production A/C. It's
> also interesting to note that this is a relaxation of the rule prior to
> 1965, since way back then one pump must have been engine-driven. Now
> redundant electrical pumps are permitted if there's two independent
> sources of power (spelled batteries).
>
> One partial solution is to wire one pump "off-master" - direct to
> battery. Satisfactory if one will never leave the A/C with it still
> switched on. Not an independent source of power, but redundant if the
> rest of the electrical system has failed and battery still good.
>
> For full compliance the FAA has approved, as a separate independent
> power source, a simple pack of dated alkaline "D" cells. I believe this
> will provide enough alternate power to a pump to get to some nearby
> airport if the main electrical system has smoked.
>
> Not trying to convince; just suggestions for any builder considering
> options.
>
> Fred F.
>
>
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Rotax Oil Dipstick Change |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Andy Draper" <andy@europa-aircraft.com>
Hi David,
Kemble will be too late as the last date for return to avoid a 10 pound charge
is 30th June. Send your old dipstick with your engine type and number, aircraft
type and your name and address to Skydrive and they will supply you with a
new one by return.
Regards
Andy
>>> <Davidghillam@aol.com> 06/23/03 10:13am >>>
--> Europa-List message posted by: Davidghillam@aol.com
In a message dated 6/20/03 10:31:52 AM GMT Daylight Time,
andy@europa-aircraft.com writes:
> Further to my note below, I stand corrected. Skydrive will supply the
> dipsticks directly, but will require you to contact them to request one.
Andy.
Please ignore previous mail. I'm catching up on mail after being away for a
few days and hadn't read your correction.
Perhaps Skydrive will provide an exchange service at Kemble??
David
Message 6
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06/23/2003 09:50:54 AM
--> Europa-List message posted by: irampil@notes.cc.sunysb.edu
Yes super bright LEDs are available, too bright for me to look at when
on with 15 ma, but they do get brighter still with pulsing. I don't think
10 kHz is going to interfere with much on an aircraft. PWM makes a nice
efficient way to dim the light as well.
Ira N224XS in paint shop
Warp Drive Props still on BackOrder!!!!!
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Trailer questions |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Neville Eyre" <Neville@europa-aircraft.com>
Answers below
>>> "Ronald J. Parigoris" <rparigor@suffolk.lib.ny.us> 06/21/03 11:46am >>>
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Ronald J. Parigoris" <rparigor@suffolk.lib.ny.us>
Easy way to protect exposed portion of wing spars when wings are living on trailer
exposed to UV?
To protect the spars against UV, paint them with the recomended White PPG paint,
which has 98% UV barrier in it.
Cheers,
Nev.
Thanks
Ron Parigoris
Message 8
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--> Europa-List message posted by: "Neville Eyre" <Neville@europa-aircraft.com>
Hi All,
All the people involved with electricity over the years have got it wrong....Faraday...
Ohm... Voltair...Watt etc have got it wrong.
Electricity is purely high pressure smoke....batteries come filled with the high
pressure smoke, and whatever is connected to it will function.....
If the smoke is allowed to escape from the wires....... they stop working...a fact
that cannot be argued with?
>>> <DJA727@aol.com> 06/22/03 06:19pm >>>
--> Europa-List message posted by: DJA727@aol.com
In a message dated 6/22/2003 9:58:14 AM Pacific Standard Time,
fillinger@ameritech.net writes:
> My only question is if the alternator or regulator fails, AND there's
> the smell of smoke and abnormal readings on amps/volts, one should
> disconnect the battery at the battery relay, not just disconnect the
> alternator and wait to see if the smoke goes away. What then will cause
> the engine to continue to run? If one doesn't have a relay, and the
> smoke is electrical but no circuit protector pops, there's no way to
> stop the smoke without waiting for the battery to discharge or a
> necessary circuit to go open through heating. Then the engine quits.
>
Fred,
I have designed mine with a rather complicated arrangement of busses, and I
have my pumps on a "hot" bus for each of two electrical systems. In the event
of electrical smoke/fire -- the procedure is to shut down the electrical
system, except for the fuel pumps. The hot busses are protected by slow blow fuses.
I would be able to get rid of everything except the pumps in the event of an
electrical fire, and not lose the engine at the same time. I suppose I got
carried away with all this, but I have to keep my mind working on an involved
electrical system reminiscent of the Boeing days.
Dave
Message 9
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--> Europa-List message posted by:
Ooohhhhhh, it's that simple...???
Regards Gert
Gert Dalgaard Soerensen
Europa builder No. 151
Europa Classic / Rotax 914
AC reg.: OY-GDS
E mail: lgds@post6.tele.dk
http://home19.inet.tele.dk/dalgaard/oygds.jpeg
mandag 23. jun 2003 kl. 17:18 skrev Neville Eyre:
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Neville Eyre"
> <Neville@europa-aircraft.com>
>
> Hi All,
> All the people involved with electricity over the years have got it
> wrong....Faraday... Ohm... Voltair...Watt etc have got it wrong.
> Electricity is purely high pressure smoke....batteries come filled
> with the high pressure smoke, and whatever is connected to it will
> function.....
> If the smoke is allowed to escape from the wires....... they stop
> working...a fact that cannot be argued with?
>
>>>> <DJA727@aol.com> 06/22/03 06:19pm >>>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: DJA727@aol.com
>
> In a message dated 6/22/2003 9:58:14 AM Pacific Standard Time,
> fillinger@ameritech.net writes:
>
>> My only question is if the alternator or regulator fails, AND there's
>> the smell of smoke and abnormal readings on amps/volts, one should
>> disconnect the battery at the battery relay, not just disconnect the
>> alternator and wait to see if the smoke goes away. What then will
>> cause
>> the engine to continue to run? If one doesn't have a relay, and the
>> smoke is electrical but no circuit protector pops, there's no way to
>> stop the smoke without waiting for the battery to discharge or a
>> necessary circuit to go open through heating. Then the engine quits.
>>
>
> Fred,
>
> I have designed mine with a rather complicated arrangement of busses,
> and I
> have my pumps on a "hot" bus for each of two electrical systems. In
> the event
> of electrical smoke/fire -- the procedure is to shut down the
> electrical
> system, except for the fuel pumps. The hot busses are protected by
> slow blow fuses.
> I would be able to get rid of everything except the pumps in the event
> of an
> electrical fire, and not lose the engine at the same time. I suppose I
> got
> carried away with all this, but I have to keep my mind working on an
> involved
> electrical system reminiscent of the Boeing days.
>
> Dave
>
>
> _-
> ======================================================================
> _-
> ======================================================================
> _-
> ======================================================================
> _-
> ======================================================================
>
>
Message 10
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--> Europa-List message posted by: Fred Fillinger <fillinger@ameritech.net>
> Yes super bright LEDs are available, too bright for me to look at when
> on with 15 ma, but they do get brighter still with pulsing. I don't think
> 10 kHz is going to interfere with much on an aircraft.
>
> Ira N224XS in paint shop
I wouldn't bet on that! A square wave is the fundamental freq plus the
sum of all harmonics, each 3dB down I recall. If used to pulse a series
string of LEDs, and say a voltage swing of 10V, you can easily get a few
microvolts in the harmonics to annoy a VHF receiver whose antenna is a
few feet away.
Fred F.
Message 11
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--> Europa-List message posted by: "Ami McFadyean" <ami@mcfadyean.freeserve.co.uk>
Not sure what the single failure mode is here that would cause such grief.
Alternator diodes tend to fail open circuit. Failed regulator may put many
additional volts on the bus to the extent that other things pop, although
the battery will act as a swamp until it boils dry or the alternator is
isolated.
A fuse (to protect the wiring) in the alternator line would prevent the
battery discharging through any short circuit there; further the battery
wiring would logically be stouter than that to the alternator, making it
unlikely in the extreme that it was that that was burning.
A shorted battery cell is cannot be isolated from itself.
Duncan mcF.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Fred Fillinger" <fillinger@ameritech.net>
Subject: Re: Europa-List: Batteries
> --> Europa-List message posted by: Fred Fillinger
<fillinger@ameritech.net>
>
> >> "........ if there's two independent
> >>sources of power (spelled batteries)......"
> >
> > Possibly, under the FARs.
> > JAR-E is more relaxed and only calls for two independent sources of
> > electrical power; there is nothing that explicitly prohibits one of
these
> > being the engine-driven generator, so long as the electrical system can
> > allow each to operate independently of the other
> >
> > Duncan McF.
>
> JAR-E would then be loose! In again reading our old and new regs, I see
> now that the artful change in wording is now such that the 914 probably
> can't be certified at all either. It may be significant in that the
> only such approval here has been on a motorglider.
>
> My only question is if the alternator or regulator fails, AND there's
> the smell of smoke and abnormal readings on amps/volts, one should
> disconnect the battery at the battery relay, not just disconnect the
> alternator and wait to see if the smoke goes away. What then will cause
> the engine to continue to run? If one doesn't have a relay, and the
> smoke is electrical but no circuit protector pops, there's no way to
> stop the smoke without waiting for the battery to discharge or a
> necessary circuit to go open through heating. Then the engine quits.
>
> Fred F.
Message 12
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06/23/2003 06:39:02 PM
--> Europa-List message posted by: irampil@notes.cc.sunysb.edu
All that you say is true under those circumstances.
Another approach might be:
no more than 2 leds in series since if one goes, they
all stay dark
I put bypass caps on anything with sharp transitions,
and we are talking 10
4 harmonics to the nav/com
range
Course, ADF would be more likely affected, but I
would not consider putting such an Antique Direction
Flubber in my plane ;-)
--> Europa-List message posted by: Fred Fillinger <fillinger@ameritech.net>
> Yes super bright LEDs are available, too bright for me to look at when
> on with 15 ma, but they do get brighter still with pulsing. I don't think
> 10 kHz is going to interfere with much on an aircraft.
>
> Ira N224XS in paint shop
I wouldn't bet on that! A square wave is the fundamental freq plus the
sum of all harmonics, each 3dB down I recall. If used to pulse a series
string of LEDs, and say a voltage swing of 10V, you can easily get a few
microvolts in the harmonics to annoy a VHF receiver whose antenna is a
few feet away.
Fred F.
Message 13
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--> Europa-List message posted by: Jos Okhuijsen <josok@ukolo.fi>
Some simple math:
4 harmonics -> 4 x 3 db = -12 db
12 V -12 dB = 750 mV over any wiring carrying the load.
If the length of the wiring comes anything close to the wavelength, half
or quarter of the comm freq's, adding a working antenna to this
transmitter design, you might be a nuisance to anything in quite a
reasonable range in addition to your own problems. Bypass capacitors?
Will load (overload?) the square wave generator.
Jos Okhuijsen
irampil@notes.cc.sunysb.edu wrote:
>--> Europa-List message posted by: irampil@notes.cc.sunysb.edu
>
>
>All that you say is true under those circumstances.
>Another approach might be:
> no more than 2 leds in series since if one goes, they
> all stay dark
> I put bypass caps on anything with sharp transitions,
> and we are talking 10
>4 harmonics to the nav/com
> range
> Course, ADF would be more likely affected, but I
> would not consider putting such an Antique Direction
> Flubber in my plane ;-)
>
>
>--> Europa-List message posted by: Fred Fillinger <fillinger@ameritech.net>
>
>
>
>>Yes super bright LEDs are available, too bright for me to look at when
>>on with 15 ma, but they do get brighter still with pulsing. I don't think
>>10 kHz is going to interfere with much on an aircraft.
>>
>>Ira N224XS in paint shop
>>
>>
>
>I wouldn't bet on that! A square wave is the fundamental freq plus the
>sum of all harmonics, each 3dB down I recall. If used to pulse a series
>string of LEDs, and say a voltage swing of 10V, you can easily get a few
>microvolts in the harmonics to annoy a VHF receiver whose antenna is a
>few feet away.
>
>Fred F.
>
>
>
>
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