Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 01:22 AM - RE : roll trim tab and servo installation (Gilles.Thesee)
2. 01:24 AM - Trailers (Mr Smallwood)
3. 01:28 AM - Trailers (Mr Smallwood)
4. 02:06 AM - Trailers (Mr Smallwood)
5. 02:42 AM - Trailers (Mr Smallwood)
6. 03:03 AM - filler (Graham Singleton)
7. 03:03 AM - filler (Graham Singleton)
8. 03:12 AM - Mid Week Fly In and Landings Voucher Use. (R.C.Harrison)
9. 03:12 AM - First flight (Jac van Heeswijk)
10. 04:14 AM - Re: Mid Week Fly In and Landings Voucher Use. (Trevpond@aol.com)
11. 04:29 AM - Mid Week Fly-ins (Trevpond@aol.com)
12. 07:45 AM - Re: filler (Jeff Roberts)
13. 07:47 AM - Re: GPSpecial (Fergus Kyle)
14. 07:48 AM - Re: filler (Jeff Roberts)
15. 07:49 AM - modification (john butterfield)
16. 07:59 AM - Re: RE : roll trim tab and servo installation (Bob Jacobsen)
17. 09:03 AM - RE : roll trim tab and servo installation (Gilles.Thesee)
18. 09:09 AM - Re: modification (Paul Boulet)
19. 09:49 AM - [PLEASE READ] - Why Do I Have A Fund Raiser Each Year? (Matt Dralle)
20. 11:18 AM - Re: RE : roll trim tab and servo installation (Rowland Carson)
21. 02:45 PM - Re: modification (KARL HEINDL)
22. 02:55 PM - opinions please (Jos Okhuijsen)
23. 03:36 PM - Tips for working with the manual (Jeremy Davey)
24. 03:54 PM - Re: GPSpecial (Jeremy Davey)
25. 04:10 PM - Re: filler ()
26. 04:27 PM - Re: filler (Jeremy Davey)
27. 05:15 PM - Re: GPSpecial (Commerce)
28. 05:19 PM - Re: RE : roll trim tab and servo installation (Richard Holder)
29. 05:57 PM - Re: opinions please (Cliff Shaw)
30. 07:09 PM - Re: Tips for working with the manual (Tom Paul)
31. 07:11 PM - Re: opinions please (Troy Maynor)
32. 07:46 PM - Re: opinions please (Cliff Shaw)
Message 1
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| Subject: | roll trim tab and servo installation |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Gilles.Thesee" <Gilles.Thesee@ac-grenoble.fr>
Hi all,
Please pardon me to jump in. My present project is not a Europa but a Dyn
Aero MCR 4S four seater, with a Rotax 914.
However we share many common concerns and maybe sonebody could ben
interested by our experience with trim tab servos.
The factory provided us with a system not unlike the one described in this
thread : a Futaba S 9001 RC model servo and a command box, to be connected
to the Ray allen stick grips. The command box is said to be derived from a
servo tester.
After installation, we found several shorcomings in the setup :
- The servo only holds position when the ship's power is on.
- When switching the Master on, the servo quickly goes to full travel before
going back to the assigned position.
- Several builders reported erratic uncommanded trim tab movements in flight
at altitude.
- Others reported interference problems with the strobe wires.
- No provision was made for end-of-travel switching.
Our opinion was there's more to the system than just a small servo tester.
On a fairly fast light plane, the trims must behave in flight , and
uncommanded movements are unacceptable. Besides, in case of power failure
the tabs MUST stay put. Besides the Rotax alternator really lacks in output,
and we'd rather not to tax it permanently for a sedom used system.
So we trashed the whole system and bought a RAC T4-5 servo and a tiny double
NAIS relay big as a sugar lump. Although the travel is rather short, the
tests proved satisfactory :
- No power, no movement possible
- No stick grip input, no movement.
- Limit switches are included
- No pulse signal to be interfered with.
- Away with the printed cuircuit and 70 gram box.
Flight tests are still ahead, for we still have the Rotax 914 to install and
rads and intercooler ducts to design.
For what it's worth,
Regards
Gilles
Grenoble, France
Wirng and systems 95% complete and smoke tested
Message 2
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--> Europa-List message posted by: "Mr Smallwood" <ctsmallwood@onetel.net.uk>
Hi All Again
The trailer I outlined in Europa message list dated Nov 13
quoted wrong price Should read 1900 Pounds Sterling
Also my E mail is mailto:ctsmallwood@onetel.net.uk
Regards
Colin Smallwood Kit 232
Message 3
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--> Europa-List message posted by: "Mr Smallwood" <ctsmallwood@onetel.net.uk>
Hi All Again
The trailer I outlined in Europa message list dated Nov 13
quoted wrong price Should read 1900 Pounds Sterling
Also my E mail is mailto:ctsmallwood@onetel.net.uk
Regards
Colin Smallwood Kit 232
Message 4
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--> Europa-List message posted by: "Mr Smallwood" <ctsmallwood@onetel.net.uk>
Hi All Again
The trailer I outlined in Europa message list dated Nov 13
quoted wrong price Should read 1900 Pounds Sterling
Also my E mail is mailto:ctsmallwood@onetel.net.uk
Regards
Colin Smallwood Kit 232
Message 5
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--> Europa-List message posted by: "Mr Smallwood" <ctsmallwood@onetel.net.uk>
Hi All Again
The trailer I outlined in Europa message list dated Nov 13
quoted wrong price Should read 1900 Pounds Sterling
Also my E mail is mailto:ctsmallwood@onetel.net.uk
Regards
Colin Smallwood Kit 232
Message 6
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--> Europa-List message posted by: Graham Singleton <graham@gflight.f9.co.uk>
At 23:56 13/11/2003 -0800, you wrote:
>Do not bother with colloidial silica, we did some ''blind testing'' with a
>number
>of people once, non could tell any difference, I believe the placebo principle
>works here !
>Do not muck about with all this fishing line nonsense !
>If anyone needs further details on this subject, get back to me
It's not often that Neville and I disagree, however,,,,,,,,,,,,, on the odd
occasion we diverge slightly
Colloidal silica, (Cabosil) allows more Expancell to be added without loss
of spreadability, or if you prefer, better spreadability with the same
ratio of resin/expancell. Try this Neville, mix up some resin and filler,
now mix in a spoonful of Cabosil, tell me (privately {:-) if it spreads
easier?
I don't see the point of 1/4 inch thick filler, except to be sure there are
no areas that are too thin. I use 1 1/2 or 2mm strimmer line as a thickness
gauge. After half an hour over again with the spreader to fill in the tram
lines without adding any more filler.
Obviously you can't use this method on steep curves, then I use a serrated
scraper for the first fill, then smooth ove after it settles a bit.
I'm not as young or strong as Neville is so I tend to avoid hard work.
After an overnight cure I then trim off the excess with a small, very sharp
wood plane, (thanks to Kingsly Hurst for passing on that idea). It gets rid
of the outer skin which clogs the paper unless you wait three days. I hope
this helps understanding a little more?
Graham
---
Message 7
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--> Europa-List message posted by: Graham Singleton <graham@gflight.f9.co.uk>
At 23:56 13/11/2003 -0800, you wrote:
>So first find out where the areas are that need 1/4". Unless you like
>filling and sanding!!
>
>Duncan McF.
Exactly!
Graham
---
Message 8
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| Subject: | Mid Week Fly In and Landings Voucher Use. |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "R.C.Harrison" <ptag.dev@ukonline.co.uk>
Hi! Guys.
This weeks fly in to Bourn was successful in spite of Bryan having me think he
had authority to land at Brough British Aerospace Harrier field ! 5 Europa's
made it behind the passing weather front.
Now you will find my achilles heel! I'm useless at remembering names........
Those attending :- Paddy Clark, William Mills, Bryan Allsop, Tony ? with Dari
Saga as passenger, and myself.... when the "tower" was able to contact me on the
OLD FREQUENCY ! Perhaps you all need to amend your records the NEW Bourn Frequency
is 124.35 since March. ("The Flyer" Vouchers still carried the OLD frequency.)
However had I made PPR Contact this would have not been a problem but
over an hour I tried to call them about 20 times always finding the 'phone
engaged.
It was voted that I am to call for the NEXT WEEK FLY IN and I have selected SANDTOFT
(EGCF) Frequency 130.42 Radio Sandtoft. Waddington Zone (127.35) Humberside
Radar*** (119.125) (****NB Incorrectly quoted on current Jeppeson 1:500
000 VFR+GPS CHART) From the South it is important to use Waddington(EGXW) MATZ
since it joins the Conningsby(EGXC) Stub and you need to be over 3500ft or
contact them or risk a new Eurofighter UP THE CHUFF! Lincolnshire also has more
training area than any other county (Excepting North Scotland) so don't fly
at or below the magic number 250ft or it may be a Tonado !
No need to feel threatened, if you talk to them they are very helpfull AND UNDERSTANDING
(need to be with me around!")and remember they are on TERRA FIRMA and
you are "UP HERE risking all!" Keep a good watch ,don't fly with "YOUR HEAD
IN THE OFFICE!.
Sandtoft has a hard runway( 05/23) but microlights also operate and there is a
local flying area NE of the field clear of built up areas. The Co-Ordinates are:-
N53 33.58 W000 51.50. Circuits at 1000' level -LH on 05 RH on 23- ---23 threshold
displaced by 170m due to lamp standards. Fuel 100LL.
Licensed Bar and EXCELLENT lunch facilities.They will be expecting us so let's
not disappoint them !
"Todays Pilot" Magazine carries Free Landing Vouchers plus Lunch Vouchers to the
value of =A32.50.Valid to end of NOVEMBER.
Special point to note .... the 05 Runway is best seen from "final" by approaching
from over a local Golf Course and over the M180 and look for the runway just
to the RIGHT of the MOST LEFT HAND BUILDING WHICH IS THE HANGAR unless they've
built one I don't know off !.( the approach being over an industrial estate,
the remnants of the original airfield).
Since the "Today's Pilot Magazine also carries Wickenby(EGNW) vouchers may I suggest
that you use your Wickenby Vouchers on the same trip and make it a two
centre FLY IN ! (Freq. 122.45) which is under the MATZ stub of Scampton (EGXP
EG(R)-313 the Red Arrows Training Area and Waddington Zone Approach Path.(Not
above 1500ft unless cleared by Waddington Zone. Circuits at 1000ft all left hand.
34/16 - 21/03 Hard Runways.(Don't try to use the OLD RUNWAY EXTENSIONS to
the South or you'll finish up in chicken sheds or mounds of earth !)Fuel 100LL
unless you ask me to have some Mogas unleaded available in MY cans!(NOT FREE
OF CHARGE!)(Co-ordinates N53 19.00 W000 20.98 My base field)
Obviously selection of the "day " has to be left to the last minute due to the
weather factors. So I'm suggesting Wednesday 19th OR Thursday 20th. I will publish
the decision by 1800 hours on TUESDAY 18th Nov.
My Home/Work Number is :- 01472 852498 Or Mobile:- 07973 832741.
I would appreciate some indication of interested flyers for this event?
I also have suggested that you bring along any current vouchers that you haven't
a "hope in hell" of using to pass on to more local flyers with possibility of
using them. For example I passed my BODMIN vouchers to William Mills who has
a much better chance of utilising them. On this question I would also seek to
suggest that should you ever have any such unused vouchers it would help other
Europa Club members if you "declared" such on the forum for interested parties
to ask for them to be sent to them by mail.Flying gets more expensive day
by day and the Magazines make us these kind offers so I feel it is a worth while
effort to accept their generosity?
Regards
Bob Harrison G-PTAG Europa MKI /Jabiru 3300.
Message 9
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--> Europa-List message posted by: "Jac van Heeswijk" <jac.vanheeswijk@hetnet.nl>
On Thursday 23 October 2003 Europa Trigear nr. 305 PH-IEN took to the air in the
capable hands of Ivan Shaw. Our good friend and building mate Rob van Essen
saw his plane flying for the first time.
While Ivan had the actual honour, the party was also witnessed by Keith Wilson.
They arrived in two factory demonstrators, a monowheel and a trigear. After an
impressive low pass they landed in formation. Very spectacular for the public!
All this took place at Stadtlohn (EDLS), a small airport in Germany that - for
an obvious reason - calls itself "the Netherlands biggest sport aviation field".
It's situated just at the other side of the dutch border, the area where
Rob lives.
We were together there with some 10 Europa builders, prospective builders, flyers
and friends. On that cold but sunny autumn day it looked a little bit like
a gathering of a dutch Europa Chapiter.
The complete checking procedure was very instructive for us (the future next first
flight candidates).
Congratulations to Rob who finished the job in about 3,5 years. Ivan's first words
after the flight: "Absolutely Marvellous!" Any more comments necessary?
Afterwards Rob took place in the right chair for a second ride and made his personal
maiden flight, rolling out of the plane, after landing, with the traditional
"Europa Grin" (cheek to cheek split) shining from the face. As a conditional
reflex.
Good luck to you Rob and your charming wife Christie. Finally you now are going
to enjoy the real flying excitement. You have a splendid airplane, a marvellous
specimen of the Europa kind, not only because it is brand new, but you built
and finished it so nicely that I really can't remember ever having seen a
more beautiful Europa than yours.
Jack (394)
Place: Stadtlohn (EDLH) (Germany)
Pilot: Ivan Shaw
Engine: Rotax 912S
Propeller: Warp fixed pitch
Empty weight 381 kg.
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Mid Week Fly In and Landings Voucher Use. |
--> Europa-List message posted by: Trevpond@aol.com
Hi Guys,
Having seen the attached re-Sandtoft, and the comment re fuel, I should warn
all incoming traffic that there is very rarely fuel available - it's been 3
months or more since the last came in, so make sure you have enough to call in
somewhere and get some. I keep my current aircraft hangared there and bring
mine in drums!
Hope to join you in your fly-ins next year when my Europa is finished.
Trev Pond
kit 598 Europa Tri-gear 914 G-LINN
Message 11
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| Subject: | Mid Week Fly-ins |
--> Europa-List message posted by: Trevpond@aol.com
Hi Guys,
Having seen the attached re-Sandtoft, and the comment re fuel, I should warn
all incoming traffic that there is very rarely fuel available - it's been 3
months or more since the last came in, so make sure you have enough to call
in
somewhere and get some.=A0 I keep my current aircraft hangared there and bring
mine in drums!
Hope to join you in your fly-ins next year when my Europa is finished.
Trev Pond
kit 598 Europa Tri-gear 914 G-LINN
Message 12
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--> Europa-List message posted by: Jeff Roberts <jeff@rmmm.net>
on 11/15/03 5:41 AM, Graham Singleton at graham@gflight.f9.co.uk wrote:
> --> Europa-List message posted by: Graham Singleton <graham@gflight.f9.co.uk>
>
> At 23:56 13/11/2003 -0800, you wrote:
>> Do not bother with colloidial silica, we did some ''blind testing'' with a
>> number
>> of people once, non could tell any difference, I believe the placebo
>> principle
>> works here !
>> Do not muck about with all this fishing line nonsense !
>> If anyone needs further details on this subject, get back to me
>
> It's not often that Neville and I disagree, however,,,,,,,,,,,,, on the odd
> occasion we diverge slightly
>
> Colloidal silica, (Cabosil) allows more Expancell to be added without loss
> of spreadability, or if you prefer, better spreadability with the same
> ratio of resin/expancell. Try this Neville, mix up some resin and filler,
> now mix in a spoonful of Cabosil, tell me (privately {:-) if it spreads
> easier?
>
> I don't see the point of 1/4 inch thick filler, except to be sure there are
> no areas that are too thin. I use 1 1/2 or 2mm strimmer line as a thickness
> gauge. After half an hour over again with the spreader to fill in the tram
> lines without adding any more filler.
> Obviously you can't use this method on steep curves, then I use a serrated
> scraper for the first fill, then smooth ove after it settles a bit.
>
> I'm not as young or strong as Neville is so I tend to avoid hard work.
> After an overnight cure I then trim off the excess with a small, very sharp
> wood plane, (thanks to Kingsly Hurst for passing on that idea). It gets rid
> of the outer skin which clogs the paper unless you wait three days. I hope
> this helps understanding a little more?
>
> Graham
>
>
> ---
>
>
>
>
>
>
The point I think Nevel is making is up to a 1/4 of an inch. From one that
is done filling and sanding I will say he is right. When you try to put on
the minimum you end up re-filling waiting for cure then re-sanding. It takes
longer! Just make sure to fill until you cant see the weave anywhere. If it
ends up being 1/4 inch its OK! Easier to sand off a lot once than to
re-fill & sand. I did it both ways. Like the second better.
Jeff
Tri Gear A258
Message 13
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--> Europa-List message posted by: "Fergus Kyle" <VE3LVO@rac.ca>
| --> Europa-List message posted by: "Jim Puglise"
<jim_puglise@hotmail.com>|
| Ferg-|
| Carry a fourth. Should you ever go down, they are a super signal mirror
for
| illuminating your position for search aircraft. What would we do without
| AOL? | Jim, FL
Bingo, Jim! So I will.........
Ferg
Message 14
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--> Europa-List message posted by: Jeff Roberts <jeff@rmmm.net>
on 11/15/03 5:45 AM, Graham Singleton at graham@gflight.f9.co.uk wrote:
> --> Europa-List message posted by: Graham Singleton <graham@gflight.f9.co.uk>
>
> At 23:56 13/11/2003 -0800, you wrote:
>> So first find out where the areas are that need 1/4". Unless you like
>> filling and sanding!!
>>
>> Duncan McF.
>
> Exactly!
> Graham
>
>
> ---
>
>
>
>
>
>
The point I think Nevel is making is up to a 1/4 of an inch. From one that
is done filling and sanding I will say he is right. When you try to put on
the minimum you end up re-filling waiting for cure then re-sanding. It takes
longer! Just make sure to fill until you cant see the weave anywhere. If it
ends up being 1/4 inch its OK! Easier to sand off a lot once than to
re-fill & sand. I did it both ways. Like the second better.
Jeff
Tri Gear A258
PS. I sent this twice. For some reason everything I send is getting rejected
lately. Any one know whats going on?
Jeff
Message 15
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--> Europa-List message posted by: john butterfield <jdbutterfield@yahoo.com>
hello all:
I have been trying to decide which aircraft to build
and i am down to the europa and an RV model. All
things point to the europa as my final choice. I am
going to get the tri gear model.
i am wondering if it is possible to modify the cockpit
module so that the area which housed the mono wheel
can be changed so that more room will exist between
the seats. i read somewhere that it is part of the
sturcture and is required for total aircraft strength.
if anyone has any info on this matter i would be
grateful to hear it.
is 600-800 hours really reasonable to build one of
these beautiful machines?
best regards
john Butterfield
los angeles
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: roll trim tab and servo installation |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Bob Jacobsen" <jacobsenra@hotmail.com>
Gilles,
Sounds like your manufacturer, DYN, cheaped out on his choice of
components. A Futaba 9001 has only 54oz of tourqe - I sure wouldn't use it.
On my system I use a Servo with 106oz of torqure. I also use a Custom
Electronics servo tester that has the proper features. When power is
applied the servo dosen't move, but stays in its last position. If power is
lost the servos stays in it's last position. Simple, easy, quick - plus it
has ben Flight tested on many Europas now flying.
I have no idea what a DYN Aero mc4s (or whatever is) but I am sure glad I
built a Europa!!
Best of luck
Bob Jacobsen
A131
>From: "Gilles.Thesee" <Gilles.Thesee@ac-grenoble.fr>
>Reply-To: europa-list@matronics.com
>To: <europa-list@matronics.com>
>Subject: RE : Europa-List: roll trim tab and servo installation
>Date: Fri, 14 Nov 2003 10:21:07 +0100
>
>--> Europa-List message posted by: "Gilles.Thesee"
><Gilles.Thesee@ac-grenoble.fr>
>
>Hi all,
>
>Please pardon me to jump in. My present project is not a Europa but a Dyn
>Aero MCR 4S four seater, with a Rotax 914.
>However we share many common concerns and maybe sonebody could ben
>interested by our experience with trim tab servos.
>
>The factory provided us with a system not unlike the one described in this
>thread : a Futaba S 9001 RC model servo and a command box, to be connected
>to the Ray allen stick grips. The command box is said to be derived from a
>servo tester.
>
>After installation, we found several shorcomings in the setup :
>- The servo only holds position when the ship's power is on.
>- When switching the Master on, the servo quickly goes to full travel
>before
>going back to the assigned position.
>- Several builders reported erratic uncommanded trim tab movements in
>flight
>at altitude.
>- Others reported interference problems with the strobe wires.
>- No provision was made for end-of-travel switching.
>
>Our opinion was there's more to the system than just a small servo tester.
>On a fairly fast light plane, the trims must behave in flight , and
>uncommanded movements are unacceptable. Besides, in case of power failure
>the tabs MUST stay put. Besides the Rotax alternator really lacks in
>output,
>and we'd rather not to tax it permanently for a sedom used system.
>
>So we trashed the whole system and bought a RAC T4-5 servo and a tiny
>double
>NAIS relay big as a sugar lump. Although the travel is rather short, the
>tests proved satisfactory :
>
>- No power, no movement possible
>- No stick grip input, no movement.
>- Limit switches are included
>- No pulse signal to be interfered with.
>- Away with the printed cuircuit and 70 gram box.
>
>Flight tests are still ahead, for we still have the Rotax 914 to install
>and
>rads and intercooler ducts to design.
>For what it's worth,
>Regards
>
>Gilles
>Grenoble, France
>Wirng and systems 95% complete and smoke tested
>
>
Crave some Miles Davis or Grateful Dead? Your old favorites are always
playing on MSN Radio Plus. Trial month free!
Message 17
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| Subject: | roll trim tab and servo installation |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Gilles.Thesee" <Gilles.Thesee@ac-grenoble.fr>
Hi Bob and all,
> Sounds like your manufacturer, DYN, cheaped out on his choice of
> components. A Futaba 9001 has only 54oz of tourqe - I sure wouldn't use
it.
The servo in itself isn't necessarily a bad choice : control forces are very
light on MCRs. But I'm sure the CONTROL BOX is crap.
>
> On my system I use a Servo with 106oz of torqure. I also use a Custom
> Electronics servo tester that has the proper features. When power is
> applied the servo dosen't move, but stays in its last position. If power
is
> lost the servos stays in it's last position.
Do you mean your servo is a non reversal type, with a drive screw or
something ? Or do you still need power applied to hold position, like
ordinary servos ?
Simple, easy, quick - plus it
> has ben Flight tested on many Europas now flying.
>
> I have no idea what a DYN Aero mc4s (or whatever is) but I am sure glad I
> built a Europa!!
I'm sure you made a good choice.
Europas and MCRs are the two top kit sellers in France. The MCR two seaters
are outstanding performers at 230-250 kg empty, while the four seater is of
more conventional dimensions with 360 kg empty and 145 kt cruise on a Rotax
914.
For those interested in what's going on "next door", have a peek at
http://www.avnet.co.uk/lts/pages/mcr4s.htm
Regards,
Gilles
Message 18
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| Subject: | Re: modification |
--> Europa-List message posted by: Paul Boulet <possibletodo@yahoo.com>
Hi John;
Hope to welcome you to the ranks. I live in Malibu and have been building for
3 years. I lost my build partner just a few months after my kit arrived so a
lot of my work has been done by Phoenix Composites at a more than reasonable price.
Rob Huntington is very free with advice if you want someone locally that's
available Monday thru Saturday. Their number is 480-924-9750. As far as
the tunnel goes it is indeed necessary for the structural rigidity. Also, 600-800
hours is only reasonable if you've built before and are somewhat of an expert
with composites and aircraft building in general. I have about 1200+ hours
into my build. If you're close by I'd be glad to chat with you. My plane
is at the stage where I need to get the FAA paperwork all in order (they sent
it back) so I can start test flying.
Paul Boulet N914PB
john butterfield <jdbutterfield@YAHOO.COM> wrote:
--> Europa-List message posted by: john butterfield
hello all:
I have been trying to decide which aircraft to build
and i am down to the europa and an RV model. All
things point to the europa as my final choice. I am
going to get the tri gear model.
i am wondering if it is possible to modify the cockpit
module so that the area which housed the mono wheel
can be changed so that more room will exist between
the seats. i read somewhere that it is part of the
sturcture and is required for total aircraft strength.
if anyone has any info on this matter i would be
grateful to hear it.
is 600-800 hours really reasonable to build one of
these beautiful machines?
best regards
john Butterfield
los angeles
Message 19
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|
| Subject: | [PLEASE READ] - Why Do I Have A Fund Raiser Each Year? |
--> Europa-List message posted by: Matt Dralle <dralle@matronics.com>
Dear Listers,
I was thinking that perhaps I should explain why I have a Fund Raiser and
also take the opportunity to express why I think the List Services here
provide a far better experience than the commercial equivalents.
I use the List Fund Raiser each year to offset the costs involved with
running a high performance email list site such as this one. With the
annual support from the List members through the PBS-like Fund Raiser, I
have found I can run the entire site without having to inflect any of the
members with those annoying banner ads flashing up all the time trying to
sell Toner Cartridge Refills or other garbage nobody wants or needs. From
the comments I've received over the years regarding the Lists, the great
majority of the members really appreciate the non-commercialism of my List
systems and don't mind my 'go-team-go' banter once a year to encourage
members to support the Lists.
I believe that the Lists services that I provide here offer a great many
benefits over the commercial equivalents in a number of ways. The first
feature I believe to be particularly significant is that you *cannot*
receive a computer v*rus from any of my Lists directly. I've been on a few
other List servers and have been unfortunate enough to download infected
files people have innocently or not-so-innocently included with their
posts. This just can't happen with my Lists; each incoming message is
filtered and attachments stripped off prior to posting. I provide a Photo
and File Share feature that allows members to share files and bitmaps with
other members and everyone can be assured that these files will be
prescanned for any sort of v*rus before they are posted. Safe and
simple. Also, with this photo and file sharing technique, the Archives
don't get loaded up with a huge amounts of bitmap "data" that slows the
Archive Search times.
Another feature of this system is the extensive List Archives that are
available for download, browsing, and searching. The Archives go all the
way back to the very beginning of each List and with the super fast Search
Engine, the huge size of the Archives is a non-issue in quickly finding the
data you're looking for. Another feature of the Archives, in my opinion,
is that they have been primarily stripped of all the useless email header
data and all the other header garbage that seems to build up in a typical
email thread.
I have received an extremely positive response from Listers regarding the
List Browse feature and the consensus is that the format and ease of use is
outstanding. Members report that having the previous 7 days worth of
messages on line for easy browsing and sorting is hugely beneficial. And
again, as with the real time distribution of List email, the messages are
stripped of all the unnecessary email headers and potentially dangerous
v*ruses.
I've been running email Lists and services under the matronics.com domain
since about 1989 starting with RV-List and 30 guys who I knew and who where
also building RVs. It has grown into over 40 different aviation-related
Email Lists and an associated web site that receives over 10,000,000 hits
each year!! Additionally, the List email system forwards well over
90,000,000 (yes, that 90 MILLION) email messages to subscribers each
year! With all the dot.bombs these days, I think there's a lot of value in
supporting a service that has gone the long haul and is still providing and
improving a high quality service at a price that's nearly free.
I have to admit running these Lists is a labor of love and I hope it shows
in the quality of the experience that you receive when you get a List Email
Message, Search the Archives, or use the List Browser. The Lists will be
here for a long time to come. If you just want to lurk a while for free,
that's great and I encourage you to do so. If you use, appreciate, and
receive value from these Lists, then please support them during the Annual
List Fund Raiser!
-----------------------------------------------
The SSL Secure Web Site:
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
-----------------------------------------------
Thank you,
Matt Dralle
Email List Administrator
Message 20
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| Subject: | Re: roll trim tab and servo installation |
--> Europa-List message posted by: Rowland Carson <rowil@clara.net>
On 2003 11 13 at 09:08 -0500, Michael Grass wrote:
>I hope you guys will be able to see the drawing!
Michael - was it supposed to look like this?
12V In--------+--------(1)-7805-(3)--+--------+----- 5Volt out
! (2) ! !
! ! ! !
1000uF +-100nF-+ 100uF
(-) ! (-)
! ! !
! ! !
ground--------+--------------+----------------+------ground
Yours wasn't really legible at my end, but after removing and inserting
some spaces I think I got it correct. I have shortened the line
length slightly to prevent problems with mailers that wrap lines
earlier than usual, and I am posting in plain ASCII text which should
mean it will not suffer any distortion in transmission.
regards
Rowland
--
| Rowland Carson PFA #16532 e-mail <rowil@clara.net>
| 650 hours building Europa #435 G-ROWI
Message 21
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| Subject: | Re: modification |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "KARL HEINDL" <kheindl@msn.com>
Hi John,
Yes, the tunnel is structural, but many trigear builders modify the top part
considerably.
I installed a removable cover on top and a lexan window in the floor for
aerial
photography. The entire tunnel interior is then also usable for storing
things.
This also makes access easy to any wiring, fuel lines, rudder cables etc.
for maintenance
and future changes. The rudder cables run inside nylon tubes which are
p-clipped to the
tunnel sides.
To accomodate the throttle, hand operated brake levers, and one or two
instruments or
switches, I recessed the bottom middle of the instrument panel by quite a
large amount
(you need deep space only for radio/transponder, maybe not even that), then
installed
another fixed panel on the freed up tunnel top for the above. My throttle
control is
a conventional push/pull at the bottom of the instrument panel, and does not
intrude
into the tunnel at all.
I have seen other Europas where the tunnel top is used as an extension to
the instrument
panel.
It gives you some ideas.
Karl
>From: john butterfield <jdbutterfield@YAHOO.COM>
>Reply-To: europa-list@matronics.com
>To: europa-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Europa-List: modification
>Date: Fri, 14 Nov 2003 07:49:19 -0800 (PST)
>
>--> Europa-List message posted by: john butterfield
><jdbutterfield@yahoo.com>
>
>hello all:
>I have been trying to decide which aircraft to build
>and i am down to the europa and an RV model. All
>things point to the europa as my final choice. I am
>going to get the tri gear model.
>
>i am wondering if it is possible to modify the cockpit
>module so that the area which housed the mono wheel
>can be changed so that more room will exist between
>the seats. i read somewhere that it is part of the
>sturcture and is required for total aircraft strength.
>
>if anyone has any info on this matter i would be
>grateful to hear it.
>
>is 600-800 hours really reasonable to build one of
>these beautiful machines?
>
>best regards
>john Butterfield
>los angeles
>
>
Message 22
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--> Europa-List message posted by: Jos Okhuijsen <josok@ukolo.fi>
Hi Builders,
On the recommendations in this forum, i ordered some oa. rolls of peel-ply
from Aircraft Spruce. Apart from the fact that these rolls are allready
full of loose fibers in their package, there is an issue with quantities.
Please check the following link, and let me have other opions.
http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/cmpages/peelply.php
And the quiz: If you press the order button, how many rolls do you order
for what price?
Jos Okhuijsen
kit 600
48 hrs.
Message 23
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| Subject: | Tips for working with the manual |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Jeremy Davey" <jeremycrdavey@btinternet.com>
Guys,
I got this on email today and thought it worth passing on to lighten up a
few moments for you - apologies if you think it's spam.
For the benefit of our colonial cousins, the Haynes manuals are
do-it-yourself car repair manuals notorious for comments like: "Once the lid
is on, simply fit bid tapes to the bulkhead/fuselage-roof join".
Cheers,
Jeremy
Haynes: Rotate anticlockwise.
Translation: Clamp with molegrips then beat repeatedly with hammer
.......................anticlockwise.
Haynes: This is a snug fit.
Translation: You will skin your knuckles!........on both hands.
Haynes: This is a tight fit.
Translation: Not a hope in hell matey!
Haynes: As described in Chapter 7...
Translation: That'll teach you not to read through before you start, now you
are looking at scarey photos of the inside of a gearbox.
Haynes: Pry...
Translation: Hammer a screwdriver into...
Haynes: Undo...
Translation: Go buy a tin of WD40 (catering size).
Haynes: Retain tiny spring...
Translation: "Jeez what was that, it nearly had my eye out"!
Haynes: Press and rotate to remove bulb...
Translation: OK - thats the glass bit off, now fetch some good pliers to dig
out that pesky bayonet bit.
Haynes: Lightly...
Translation: Start off lightly and build up till the veins on your forehead
are throbbing. Then re-check the manual because this cannot be 'lightly'
what you are doing now.
Haynes: Weekly checks...
Translation: If it isn't broken don't fix it!
Haynes: Routine maintenance...
Translation: If it isn't broken... it's about to be!
Haynes: One spanner rating.
Translation: Your Mum could do this... so how did you manage to botch it up?
Haynes: Two spanner rating.
Translation: Now you may think that you can do this because two is a low,
tiny, 'ikkle number... but you also thought the wiring diagram was a map of
the Tokyo underground (in fact that would have been more use to you).
Haynes: Three spanner rating.
Translation: But Nova's are easy to maintain right... right? So you think
three Nova spanners has got to be like a 'regular car' two spanner job.
Haynes: Four spanner rating.
Translation: You are seriously considering this aren't you, you pleb!
Haynes: Five spanner rating.
Translation: OK - but don't expect us to ride in it afterwards!!!
Haynes: If not, you can fabricate your own special tool like this...
Translation:
ahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha!!!!
Haynes: Compress...
Translation: Squeeze with all your might, jump up and down on, swear at,
throw at the garage wall, then search in the dark corner of the garage For
whilst muttering "bugger" repeatedly under your breath.
Haynes: Inspect...
Translation: Squint at really hard and pretend you know what you are looking
at, then declare in a loud knowing voice to your wife "Yep, as I thought,
it's going to need a new one"!
Haynes: Carefully...
Translation: You are about to cut yourself!
Haynes: Retaining nut...
Translation: Yes, that's it, that big spherical blob of rust.
Haynes: Get an assistant...
Translation: Prepare to humiliate yourself in front of someone you know.
Haynes: Turning the engine will be easier with the spark plugs removed.
Translation: However, starting the engine afterwards will be much harder.
Once that sinking pit of your stomach feeling has subsided, you can start to
feel deeply ashamed as you gingerly refit the spark plugs.
Haynes: Refitting is the reverse sequence to removal.
Translation: But you swear in different places.
Haynes: Prise away plastic locating pegs...
Translation: Snap off...
Haynes: Using a suitable drift...
Translation: The biggest nail in your tool box isn't a suitable drift!
Haynes: Everyday toolkit
Translation: Ensure you have an RAC Card & Mobile Phone
Haynes: Apply moderate heat...
Translation: Placing your mouth near it and huffing isn't moderate heat.
Haynes: Index
Translation: List of all the things in the book but the thing you want to
do!
Jeremy Davey
Europa Monowheel 537M G-EZZA
Message 24
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--> Europa-List message posted by: "Jeremy Davey" <jeremycrdavey@btinternet.com>
Pop a Van Morrison CD out of the autochanger you have, of course, fitted in
the baggage bay and use that? :-)
Jeremy Davey
Europa Monowheel 537M G-EZZA
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jim Puglise
Subject: Re: Europa-List: GPSpecial
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Jim Puglise" <jim_puglise@hotmail.com>
Ferg-
Carry a fourth. Should you ever go down, they are a super signal mirror for
illuminating your position for search aircraft. What would we do without
AOL?
Jim, FL
>From: "Fergus Kyle" <VE3LVO@rac.ca>
>Reply-To: europa-list@matronics.com
>To: "EUROPALIST" <europa-list@matronics.com>,
><aeroelectric-list@matronics.com>
>Subject: Europa-List: GPSpecial
>Date: Wed, 12 Nov 2003 12:29:38 -0500
>
>--> Europa-List message posted by: "Fergus Kyle" <VE3LVO@rac.ca>
>
>There you go............
>Jim Weir in the latest (must be DEC03) issue, tried out an AOL CD-ROM disc
>as a groundplane for his GPS, on his hightech garbage-can antenna test
>range, and found a barely measureable difference from carefully-fashioned
>aluminum sheet.
> I consider my model Europa to be high-tech since it will incorporate 3
>AOL discs - one under the fuel selector handle, one under the GPS antenna
>and one under the TXR stub - for now anyway.
>Cheers, Ferg
>Europa Mono #A064
>
>
Great deals on high-speed Internet access as low as $26.95.
https://broadband.msn.com (Prices may vary by service area.)
Message 25
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--> Europa-List message posted by: <europa@nimbus.geog.ox.ac.uk>
> PS. I sent this twice. For some reason everything I send is getting
> rejected lately. Any one know whats going on?
It may be that it was rejected by one of the servers of the people
subscribed to the list and not rejected by the list itself.
Cheers,
Mark.
Message 26
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--> Europa-List message posted by: "Jeremy Davey" <jeremycrdavey@btinternet.com>
We seem to be getting a lot of this recently, so perhaps a little emphasis
is required?
If anyone posts to the list and gets a rejection, can they please NOT RESEND
THEIR EMAIL. What is happening is the list server resends your email out to
each of the list members on your behalf - think of it as a post office
service that photocopies and distributes your newsletter for you.
Coincidentally several of the list members' email addresses have gone duff
at the same time - so anyone who submits a post is getting one email for
each failure. Think of these as newsletters returned as "not known at this
address". Your emails ARE STILL ARRIVING IN EVERYONE ELSE'S INBOX. If you
repeat your email 5 times thinking it has not arrived, everyone gets 5
copies of it, you get 5 times as many "bounces" (or undeliverable
newsletters), and everyone gets irritated with your spam!
HTH!
Jeremy
Jeremy Davey
Europa Monowheel 537M G-EZZA
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
europa@nimbus.geog.ox.ac.uk
Subject: Re: Europa-List: filler
--> Europa-List message posted by: <europa@nimbus.geog.ox.ac.uk>
> PS. I sent this twice. For some reason everything I send is getting
> rejected lately. Any one know whats going on?
It may be that it was rejected by one of the servers of the people
subscribed to the list and not rejected by the list itself.
Cheers,
Mark.
Message 27
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|
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Commerce" <commerce@ukonline.co.uk>
For our part we found AOL to be generous sponsors in providing unlimited
quantities of nicely matched 1.3mm shims for levelling the cradle, the flap
cores and lots more.
Bill & Sue
465
Message 28
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| Subject: | Re: roll trim tab and servo installation |
--> Europa-List message posted by: Richard Holder <rholder@avnet.co.uk>
Sorry chaps
Unless you use a fixed pitch font such as Courier, and it is displayed as a
fixed pitch font, you will rarely get these things to line up. A space is
narrow, a hyphen is wider, and a w wider still.
Each proportional font has different actual widths and not the same
necessarily for one letter between fonts !
Richard the pedant
> --> Europa-List message posted by: Rowland Carson <rowil@clara.net>
>
> On 2003 11 13 at 09:08 -0500, Michael Grass wrote:
>
>> I hope you guys will be able to see the drawing!
>
> Michael - was it supposed to look like this?
>
> 12V In--------+--------(1)-7805-(3)--+--------+----- 5Volt out
> ! (2) ! !
> ! ! ! !
> 1000uF +-100nF-+ 100uF
> (-) ! (-)
> ! ! !
> ! ! !
> ground--------+--------------+----------------+------ground
>
> Yours wasn't really legible at my end, but after removing and inserting
> some spaces I think I got it correct. I have shortened the line
> length slightly to prevent problems with mailers that wrap lines
> earlier than usual, and I am posting in plain ASCII text which should
> mean it will not suffer any distortion in transmission.
>
> regards
>
> Rowland
Message 29
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|
| Subject: | Re: opinions please |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Cliff Shaw" <flyinggpa@comcast.net>
Jos
I have been there and don that. The catalog appears to say that you get
multiple roles of the narrower peel-ply. But, The fine print at the top
says that this is what is required for a average airplane kit. Order one,
get one role (with strings).
Cliff Shaw
1041 Euclid ave.
Edmonds WA 98020
(425) 776-5555
N229WC "Wile E Coyote"
New Email:" flyinggpa@comcast.net "
Message 30
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|
| Subject: | Re: Tips for working with the manual |
--> Europa-List message posted by: Tom Paul <tom@tompaul.com>
A good laugh! Thanks.
On 11/14/03 6:35 PM, "Jeremy Davey" <jeremycrdavey@btinternet.com> wrote:
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Jeremy Davey"
> <jeremycrdavey@btinternet.com>
>
> Guys,
>
>
> I got this on email today and thought it worth passing on to lighten up a
> few moments for you - apologies if you think it's spam.
>
>
> For the benefit of our colonial cousins, the Haynes manuals are
> do-it-yourself car repair manuals notorious for comments like: "Once the lid
> is on, simply fit bid tapes to the bulkhead/fuselage-roof join".
>
>
> Cheers,
>
> Jeremy
>
>
> Haynes: Rotate anticlockwise.
>
> Translation: Clamp with molegrips then beat repeatedly with hammer
> .......................anticlockwise.
>
>
> Haynes: This is a snug fit.
>
> Translation: You will skin your knuckles!........on both hands.
>
>
> Haynes: This is a tight fit.
>
> Translation: Not a hope in hell matey!
>
>
> Haynes: As described in Chapter 7...
>
> Translation: That'll teach you not to read through before you start, now you
> are looking at scarey photos of the inside of a gearbox.
>
>
> Haynes: Pry...
>
> Translation: Hammer a screwdriver into...
>
>
> Haynes: Undo...
>
> Translation: Go buy a tin of WD40 (catering size).
>
>
> Haynes: Retain tiny spring...
>
> Translation: "Jeez what was that, it nearly had my eye out"!
>
>
> Haynes: Press and rotate to remove bulb...
>
> Translation: OK - thats the glass bit off, now fetch some good pliers to dig
> out that pesky bayonet bit.
>
>
> Haynes: Lightly...
>
> Translation: Start off lightly and build up till the veins on your forehead
> are throbbing. Then re-check the manual because this cannot be 'lightly'
> what you are doing now.
>
>
> Haynes: Weekly checks...
>
> Translation: If it isn't broken don't fix it!
>
>
> Haynes: Routine maintenance...
>
> Translation: If it isn't broken... it's about to be!
>
>
> Haynes: One spanner rating.
>
> Translation: Your Mum could do this... so how did you manage to botch it up?
>
>
> Haynes: Two spanner rating.
>
> Translation: Now you may think that you can do this because two is a low,
> tiny, 'ikkle number... but you also thought the wiring diagram was a map of
> the Tokyo underground (in fact that would have been more use to you).
>
>
> Haynes: Three spanner rating.
>
> Translation: But Nova's are easy to maintain right... right? So you think
> three Nova spanners has got to be like a 'regular car' two spanner job.
>
>
> Haynes: Four spanner rating.
>
> Translation: You are seriously considering this aren't you, you pleb!
>
>
> Haynes: Five spanner rating.
>
> Translation: OK - but don't expect us to ride in it afterwards!!!
>
>
> Haynes: If not, you can fabricate your own special tool like this...
>
> Translation:
>
> ahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha!!!!
>
>
> Haynes: Compress...
>
> Translation: Squeeze with all your might, jump up and down on, swear at,
> throw at the garage wall, then search in the dark corner of the garage For
> whilst muttering "bugger" repeatedly under your breath.
>
>
> Haynes: Inspect...
>
> Translation: Squint at really hard and pretend you know what you are looking
> at, then declare in a loud knowing voice to your wife "Yep, as I thought,
> it's going to need a new one"!
>
>
> Haynes: Carefully...
>
> Translation: You are about to cut yourself!
>
>
> Haynes: Retaining nut...
>
> Translation: Yes, that's it, that big spherical blob of rust.
>
>
> Haynes: Get an assistant...
>
> Translation: Prepare to humiliate yourself in front of someone you know.
>
>
> Haynes: Turning the engine will be easier with the spark plugs removed.
>
> Translation: However, starting the engine afterwards will be much harder.
> Once that sinking pit of your stomach feeling has subsided, you can start to
> feel deeply ashamed as you gingerly refit the spark plugs.
>
>
> Haynes: Refitting is the reverse sequence to removal.
>
> Translation: But you swear in different places.
>
>
> Haynes: Prise away plastic locating pegs...
>
> Translation: Snap off...
>
>
> Haynes: Using a suitable drift...
>
> Translation: The biggest nail in your tool box isn't a suitable drift!
>
>
> Haynes: Everyday toolkit
>
> Translation: Ensure you have an RAC Card & Mobile Phone
>
>
> Haynes: Apply moderate heat...
>
> Translation: Placing your mouth near it and huffing isn't moderate heat.
>
>
> Haynes: Index
>
> Translation: List of all the things in the book but the thing you want to
> do!
>
>
> Jeremy Davey
>
>
> Europa Monowheel 537M G-EZZA
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 31
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--> Europa-List message posted by: "Troy Maynor" <wingnut54@charter.net>
Cliff and all,
Everytime I order I end up with the stuff being too thick to lay down in and
around corners. Wish I knew where that dark blue stuff about an inch and
half wide came from. It was thin too.
Troy
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Cliff Shaw
Subject: Re: Europa-List: opinions please
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Cliff Shaw" <flyinggpa@comcast.net>
Jos
I have been there and don that. The catalog appears to say that you get
multiple roles of the narrower peel-ply. But, The fine print at the top
says that this is what is required for a average airplane kit. Order one,
get one role (with strings).
Cliff Shaw
1041 Euclid ave.
Edmonds WA 98020
(425) 776-5555
N229WC "Wile E Coyote"
New Email:" flyinggpa@comcast.net "
Message 32
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| Subject: | Re: opinions please |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Cliff Shaw" <flyinggpa@comcast.net>
Troy
I still have some of the stringy stuff. I preferred to cut my own strips
from a role of the thin peal-ply I bought from Aircraft Spruce. (You know I
vacuumed bagged all my large lay-ups)
Cliff Shaw
1041 Euclid ave.
Edmonds WA 98020
(425) 776-5555
N229WC "Wile E Coyote"
New Email:" flyinggpa@comcast.net "
>
> Cliff and all,
> Everytime I order I end up with the stuff being too thick to lay down in
and
> around corners. Wish I knew where that dark blue stuff about an inch and
> half wide came from. It was thin too.
> Troy
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