Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 03:04 AM - Re: Rotax starting - 912S (P.A.D.Clarke)
2. 10:17 AM - Aircraft painting (Erich Trombley)
3. 12:02 PM - Re: Rotax starting - 912S (Ami McFadyean)
4. 01:14 PM - Re: Aircraft painting (DuaneFamly@aol.com)
5. 03:41 PM - Re: Aircraft painting (n3eu@comcast.net)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Rotax starting - 912S |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "P.A.D.Clarke" <paddyclarke@lineone.net>
Hi Folks,
A bit more on the sprag clutch. It seems to be a problem
particularly on the higher compression 912S, but I know of one higher hour
912 that's affected, so presumably all Rotax engines may eventually be
vulnerable. The symptoms have been well described in previous messages, but
can be positively diagnosed as the sprag clutch using a clamp meter. Rotax
SB-912-042 refers.
A clamp meter can be bought ( in the U.K.) for approx. 90
pounds from Maplin, tho' I think this could well be a candidate for a tool
for the club to own and hire out. Note that it has to be able to measure
DC current.
The other thing that is worth checking is the friction
torque in the gearbox - again SB-912-042 refers.
As David says, Adrian Lloyd at Shobdon did the fix for me,
and, as I have an XS with the greater clearance behind the engine, he
managed to do it with the engine in place. Whether this will be possible on
the classic I don't know. Adrian also fitted the high power starter motor
( amazing difference - amazing price! ) as he is convinced it will help to
stop the problem reoccurring. Again, I have heard that this may not be
possible on the classic due to the restricted space.
It seems that once the problem starts it will only get
worse, and as the symptoms are so unpleasant, causing great concern as to
what is being done to the engine mounts, crankcase, prop, etc., delaying a
fix would appear unwise. I can't recommend Adrian highly enough.
Cheers, Paddy Clarke
----- Original Message -----
From: <RMRRick@aol.com>
Subject: Re: Europa-List: Rotax starting - 912S
Message 2
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| Subject: | Aircraft painting |
--> Europa-List message posted by: Erich Trombley <erichdtrombley@juno.com>
Here it is the big secret on painting and primers. The following is what I have
used on my Europa. The process and products were handed down to me from another
Europa Builder and painting guru (Lynn Elsner) whos Europa is eight years
old and looks as good today as it did the day he painted it. Lynn has been using
this combination of primer and paint for many years on a number of airplanes
and the products have been around for even longer with proven results.
Primer PPG K36 Acrylic Urethane Primer/Sealer.
This is really nice stuff to work with. It is a two part primer that can be rolled
on with ease (much to Lynns surprise). I really love working with it. The
final rolled coat looks so smooth you would swear it was sprayed. And boy
how it sands, nothing finer in my opinion. The fiberglass substrate only needs
to be initially sanded to 80 grit as the primer can easily fill the sanding
marks (PPG recommends 80-150 grit for dry sanding between coats). Prior to painting,
the primer will need to be wet sanded with 320 then 400 grit.
Top coat Sherwin-Williams Aerospace Coatings Acry-Glow Acrylic Urethane
This is a high quality aircraft paint that is chemically resistant to most, if
not all aircraft fluids. Although somewhat expensive it is well worth the cost
($150 gallon including reducers and thinners). This produce is sprayed with
a convention spray gun. I tried rolling it on to no avail (left millions of
tiny bubbles in the paint). The product can also be clear coated for additional
UV protection, which is what I have done. In addition to the UV protection
of the paint and hopefully the substrate, the plane has a professional looking
finish with great depth. Although many nay sayers cite substantial weight increase,I
disagree. When using a clear coat the objective is to apply just enough
color coat to cover the grey primer (usually one tack coat followed by two
full coats). The color coat is then wet sanded (1,000 grit), thus removing
even more weight and surface imperfections, prior to the application of the clear
coat. One tack coat followed by three heavy coats
of clear finishes the painting. Next, the clear coat is wet sanded with 1,000,
1,200 and finally 1,500 (again removing more weight and any surface imperfections).
Finally the surface is polished with a professional polisher and 3M
polishing compound.
Using the above process and never having painted before I have achieved results
that are very satisfactory. Some say great. I am very pleased with paint job
and I did it all my self. Very rewarding indeed!
I have since learned that Phoenix Composites (a builder assist shop in Arizona)
uses the same products without the clear coat. Certainly the clear coat is more
labor intensive; however I believe the additional UV protection and great
looks are worth the effort. One final note, the above products are very user
friendly and have a very steep learning curve. Most mistakes can be easily fixed.
I converted my garage into a spry booth with filtered inlet air and a couple
of box fans with filters for the exit air (didnt want overspray on the vehicles
parked in the driveway). You will need a breath air system such as the
Hobby Air since the paint contains nasty chemicals that a respirator is unable
to cope with.
Well I hope the above has been helpful.
Regards,
Erich Trombley
N28ET Classic Mono 914
Las Vegas, NV
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Rotax starting - 912S |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Ami McFadyean" <ami@mcfadyean.freeserve.co.uk>
How is it that the higher power starter motor does not put a higher load on
the sprag clutch, which would lead to the earlier demise of the clutch? This
assumes that the clutch is the victim rather than the cause, which seems to
be the case.Or is it that the violent starting (and the 'standard' but less
violent stopping) is the sole cause?
Many of the other factors that Rotax list as "remedies" would seem to be
appropriate in the first instance and there must be a compromise somewhere
between spinning the motor fast enough to generate a good spark etc and
spinning it excessively fast.
By the way, I'm having ENORMOUS problems with hot starting at the moment,
which doesn't seem to be related to any of the related issues discussed at
length on this and parallel forums. Hope its not another symptom of the
clutch problem (there's no banging and shaking, just no firing at all). Any
ideas out there?
Duncan McF.
----- Original Message -----
From: "P.A.D.Clarke" <paddyclarke@lineone.net>
Subject: Re: Europa-List: Rotax starting - 912S
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "P.A.D.Clarke"
<paddyclarke@lineone.net>
>
> Hi Folks,
> A bit more on the sprag clutch. It seems to be a problem
> particularly on the higher compression 912S, but I know of one higher hour
> 912 that's affected, so presumably all Rotax engines may eventually be
> vulnerable. The symptoms have been well described in previous messages,
but
> can be positively diagnosed as the sprag clutch using a clamp meter. Rotax
> SB-912-042 refers.
> A clamp meter can be bought ( in the U.K.) for approx. 90
> pounds from Maplin, tho' I think this could well be a candidate for a tool
> for the club to own and hire out. Note that it has to be able to measure
> DC current.
> The other thing that is worth checking is the friction
> torque in the gearbox - again SB-912-042 refers.
> As David says, Adrian Lloyd at Shobdon did the fix for
me,
> and, as I have an XS with the greater clearance behind the engine, he
> managed to do it with the engine in place. Whether this will be possible
on
> the classic I don't know. Adrian also fitted the high power starter motor
> ( amazing difference - amazing price! ) as he is convinced it will help to
> stop the problem reoccurring. Again, I have heard that this may not be
> possible on the classic due to the restricted space.
> It seems that once the problem starts it will only get
> worse, and as the symptoms are so unpleasant, causing great concern as to
> what is being done to the engine mounts, crankcase, prop, etc., delaying a
> fix would appear unwise. I can't recommend Adrian highly enough.
> Cheers, Paddy Clarke
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <RMRRick@aol.com>
> To: <europa-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: Re: Europa-List: Rotax starting - 912S
>
>
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Aircraft painting |
--> Europa-List message posted by: DuaneFamly@aol.com
Erich,
Before I head off to S-N-F today, could you please tell us where you
purchased your undercoat, paint, and clear coat?
Mike Duane A207
Redding, California
XS Conventional Gear
CM & rudder pedals with cables installed. Tailwheel complete. Wing pins and
tie bar installed. Working on baggage bay. Conventional gear assembled and soon
to be fitted.
But Sun-N-Fun comes soon!
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Aircraft painting |
--> Europa-List message posted by: n3eu@comcast.net
Erich Trombley wrote:
>
> Here it is the big secret on painting and primers....
(lots of good stuff snipped)
> The color coat is then wet sanded (1,000 grit), thus removing
> even more weight and surface imperfections, prior to the
> application of the clear coat.
I'd advise doing that only if paint mfr says it's OK. One major paint
mfr says clear over base within so many hours, else trouble. I tried
what you did once, but the clear failed in about 5 years, just like the
mfr said it might.
I'd like to add that the paints you cited are available from the major
mfr's as automotive coatings, and I think it's a stretch to say one brand
is superior for our purposes nor has much changed, based on many I've
used periodically since 1960.
Also, I've tried to find product literature that says what's really
special about their "aerospace coatings." Only luck so far is the
military cites problems with leading edge abrasion (from dust) on
supersonic aircraft, and the Space Shuttle gets hit with major UV.
Reg,
Fred F.
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