Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 05:10 AM - Re: Aerobatics (Jim Butcher)
2. 12:34 PM - Re: to build or not to build (hedley brown)
3. 02:32 PM - Re: to build or not to build (James Nelson)
4. 03:30 PM - Re: Aerobatics (Pete Lawless)
5. 03:36 PM - Re: to build or not to build (Chuck Popenoe)
Message 1
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--> Europa-List message posted by: "Jim Butcher" <europa@triton.net>
As US builders who want to eventually do aerobatics in our Europa but need
to get training first, we have been concerned about the requirement to
demonstrate the maneuvers during the 40 hr test period. At SNF we picked up
the latest copy of the FAA "Amateur Built Aircraft Reference Material" book.
In the rear of that book is a copy of 8130.2E which is the FAA instruction
book for their inspectors. Section 125d(3) Flight Test Areas, Aerobatics
states "Those aircraft owners/operators wishing to include new aerobatic
maneuvers will need to make a request for a new flight test area and follow
the same conditions noted in paragraph 125d(2) above." So this means after
we complete our 40 hr test period and get aerobatic training, we can have
the ops limits for our aircraft changed to include demonstrated aerobatic
maneuvers. Thought other builders might not be aware of this.
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: to build or not to build |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "hedley brown" <hedley@hedleybrown.flyer.co.uk>
My philosophy was 'I've never started something I didn't finish, and I'm
not going to start now' which carried me through the 7th build-year and into
my 7th decade; the only trouble is, now that I can add that scalp to
learning to fly after retirement, and with 150 hours on the Europa, I don't
find much practical use for it. It gets you very swiftly to airfields in the
middle of nowhere. The flying literature abounds with scare stories; I decry
my personal ability to keep out of trouble; my wife isn't keen. There is a
bit of an adrenalin flood, produced by sheer apprehension and terror with
increased underwear turnover, but where's the payback for all those years of
self-immolation.
Finish it, with whatever professional help is necessary, and be frank
with yourself about the resultant benefits. But PLEASE stay on the web
group; we would miss you greatly. H
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jeff Roberts" <jeff@rmmm.net>
Subject: Re: Europa-List: to build or not to build
> --> Europa-List message posted by: Jeff Roberts <jeff@rmmm.net>
>
> Perfectly said Rowland. The ultimate perspective. Made me feel great about
> my own build.
>
> Jeff
> A258
> Do not archive
>
> > Tom - nobody else can give you permission to spend your time in this
> > way, it's got to be your own decision.
> >
> > One of the things that tipped me over when I had some doubts was the
> > following scenario posed by someone who had no knowledge of
> > aeroplanes or engineering at all, but knew a lot about people.
> >
> > If on your deathbed you had convenient time to review your life
> > decisions, how do you think you would feel about your aeroplane
> > build/not build choice? Would you be saying
> > (a) "I know it seemed the sensible idea NOT to build, but I really
> > wish I'd tried to build an aeroplane after all"
> > or
> > (b) "I know I didn't finish it (because I died/got epoxy
> > allergy/spent too much time with my family) but I'm glad I gave it a
> > try and risked the experience"
> >
> > Looking forward now, which of those two would you rather be able to
> > say? And of course there's the 3rd one we all hope we can quote
> > instead - "I built it and I can fly around in it"!
> >
> > If all us builder nuts were making decisions based on cold hard
> > facts, I think there'd be very few of us tackling the job.
> >
> > regards
> >
> > Rowland
>
>
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: to build or not to build |
--> Europa-List message posted by: James Nelson <europajim@juno.com>
Chuck,
Are you looking for a completed Europa? I just have one with
trailer for sale. :-(((( I am in need for a larger aircraft and my
wife wants to fly with me to greater distances with (more luggage) a
bigger load. So It's on the block. Its in Trade-A-Plane with a web site
with much details on it. I had a great time building the Mono-wheel and
it flys so nice. Just what they said it would. I've got +75 hours on
it.
Jim Nelson
On Sat, 1 May 2004 19:30:50 -0400 "Chuck Popenoe" <cpops@verizon.net>
writes:
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Chuck Popenoe"
> <cpops@verizon.net>
>
> Tom- I think that you have received some good advice, but I'll throw
> in my
> $.02 worth----my experience follows...
>
> This thread really hits home for me! Some wise one once said that
> you can't
> build a Europa and expect to continue in your previous lifestyle,.
> I began
> A-036 back in '96 and started out with great enthusiasm. I have
> since
> recorded about 1000 hours effort, working almost entirely by myself,
> and I
> may now be as much as 1/3 finished. My problem is that I have far
> too many
> interests, which always conflict with building! I have built 3 tube
> &
> fabric aircraft, all of which I still own and fly. My last project,
> an Avid
> Flyer, took me about 1200 hours to complete. I also have my own
> business
> to run, which takes a good bit of my time. We also have a 38'
> cruising
> ketch and a mountain vacation home. In my free time I always have
> the
> difficult choice, do I want to go flying, sailing or up to the
> mountain or,
> should I fill & sand on the Europa project. Unfortunately, the
> choice is
> always too easy--the Europa loses out.
>
> I would love to have the finished Europa-- without doubt the finest
> handling
> plane that I've ever flown. However, I'm now pushing 72 and at my
> present
> build rate, I could be pushing up daisys before getting to fly my
> baby.
> I've just now made the terrible decision to give it up and to
> reluctantly
> put my project up for sale. This has been one of the most
> difficult
> decisions of my life! It's hard to give up your dream, but buying a
> finished
> one would make more sense for me at this time. Anyone have a nice
> one with
> trailer for sale?
>
> Sadly,
>
> Pops A-036
> classic monowheel
>
> All flying surfaces completed and fitted, wings not yet filled &
> sanded.
> Upgrade to 1370 lb. MTOW completed. Undercarriage, baggage bay,
> tailwheel &
> all controls finished. Top not yet bonded on--a few items inside
> left to
> finish.
>
>
>
=
>
=
>
=
>
=
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 4
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--> Europa-List message posted by: "Pete Lawless" <pete@lawless.info>
Hi All
I am interested in the US approach to aerobatic authorisation for the
Europa. From the discussions it does not seem to include any proof that the
aeroplane is strong enough. From this side of the pond the theory seems to
be that if you can demonstrate a manoeuvre in the first 40 hours without
ripping the wings off then all is ok. Am I missing some hidden point?
I did do some aeros with Pete Clark in G-YURO on the demo flight in 1992(?),
but subsequently discovered that the Europa would not be cleared in the UK,
as I understood, because of differences in construction from the
demonstrator.
Pete
---
Message 5
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| Subject: | to build or not to build |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Chuck Popenoe" <cpops@verizon.net>
Hi Jim-
I've enjoyed having your expert input on lots of build matters! How much
are you asking, and how can I access the info on Trade-a-plane. I'm not a
member. Do you have the info on another location?
Thanks!
Pops
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of James Nelson
Subject: Re: Europa-List: to build or not to build
--> Europa-List message posted by: James Nelson <europajim@juno.com>
Chuck,
Are you looking for a completed Europa? I just have one with
trailer for sale. :-(((( I am in need for a larger aircraft and my
wife wants to fly with me to greater distances with (more luggage) a bigger
load. So It's on the block. Its in Trade-A-Plane with a web site with much
details on it. I had a great time building the Mono-wheel and it flys so
nice. Just what they said it would. I've got +75 hours on it.
Jim Nelson
On Sat, 1 May 2004 19:30:50 -0400 "Chuck Popenoe" <cpops@verizon.net>
writes:
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Chuck Popenoe"
> <cpops@verizon.net>
>
> Tom- I think that you have received some good advice, but I'll throw
> in my
> $.02 worth----my experience follows...
>
> This thread really hits home for me! Some wise one once said that
> you can't
> build a Europa and expect to continue in your previous lifestyle,.
> I began
> A-036 back in '96 and started out with great enthusiasm. I have
> since
> recorded about 1000 hours effort, working almost entirely by myself,
> and I
> may now be as much as 1/3 finished. My problem is that I have far
> too many
> interests, which always conflict with building! I have built 3 tube
> &
> fabric aircraft, all of which I still own and fly. My last project,
> an Avid
> Flyer, took me about 1200 hours to complete. I also have my own
> business
> to run, which takes a good bit of my time. We also have a 38'
> cruising
> ketch and a mountain vacation home. In my free time I always have
> the
> difficult choice, do I want to go flying, sailing or up to the
> mountain or,
> should I fill & sand on the Europa project. Unfortunately, the
> choice is
> always too easy--the Europa loses out.
>
> I would love to have the finished Europa-- without doubt the finest
> handling
> plane that I've ever flown. However, I'm now pushing 72 and at my
> present
> build rate, I could be pushing up daisys before getting to fly my
> baby.
> I've just now made the terrible decision to give it up and to
> reluctantly
> put my project up for sale. This has been one of the most
> difficult
> decisions of my life! It's hard to give up your dream, but buying a
> finished
> one would make more sense for me at this time. Anyone have a nice
> one with
> trailer for sale?
>
> Sadly,
>
> Pops A-036
> classic monowheel
>
> All flying surfaces completed and fitted, wings not yet filled &
> sanded.
> Upgrade to 1370 lb. MTOW completed. Undercarriage, baggage bay,
> tailwheel &
> all controls finished. Top not yet bonded on--a few items inside
> left to
> finish.
>
>
>
=
>
=
>
=
>
=
>
>
>
>
>
>
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