Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 02:11 AM - Re: FW: Morning (Alan Burrows)
2. 03:02 AM - Re:MonoTrailer (p-a.austin)
3. 04:16 AM - Avoid Cockpit Module Anxiety (Tony Renshaw)
4. 04:56 AM - Re: Avoid Cockpit Module Anxiety (Gerry Holland)
5. 06:23 AM - Re: FW: New 914 Exhuast muffler and tailpipe (Kevin Klinefelter)
6. 07:37 AM - Re: Avoid Cockpit Module Anxiety (Fergus Kyle)
7. 08:26 AM - Re: Avoid Cockpit Module Anxiety (Jeff Roberts)
8. 08:36 AM - OSHKOSH (Cliff Shaw)
9. 08:48 AM - Jabiru (Graham Singleton)
10. 09:29 AM - Europa performance with Subaru and Catto prop (GLENN CROWDER)
11. 01:57 PM - Europa performance with Subaru and Catto prop (Fergus Kyle)
12. 02:40 PM - 2002 XS N77EU FOR SALE (SPurpura@aol.com)
13. 02:58 PM - Re: Jabiru (R.C.Harrison)
14. 09:47 PM - Re: Thoughts on Becker? (Steve Hagar)
15. 09:50 PM - Throttle setting software (Steve Hagar)
Message 1
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--> Europa-List message posted by: "Alan Burrows" <alan@kestrel-insurance.com>
No just the management..
Alan
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jim Puglise
Subject: RE: Europa-List: FW: Morning
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Jim Puglise"
--> <jimpuglise@comcast.net>
Alan-
Hope you don't see a parallel to Europa!
Jim-A283
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Alan
Burrows
Subject: Europa-List: FW: Morning
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Alan Burrows"
<alan@kestrel-insurance.com>
Hope you all had a good weekend even the one's that didn't make it to
the I.O.M.!!
Any comments ?
THE TEN-SECOND FUNNY: MORE DEAD HORSES
Well, someone's come up with a variant on that supposed old 'Dakota
tribal wisdom' email about what to do when you find you are riding a
dead horse. Here it is:
"The tribal wisdom of the Dakota Indians, passed down from generation to
generation, says that when you discover that you are riding a dead
horse, the best strategy is to dismount. In many organizations, however,
a whole range of far more advanced strategies are often employed, such
as:
1. Change riders
2. Buy a stronger whip
3. Do nothing: "This is the way we have always ridden dead horses" 4.
Visit other companies or countries to see how they ride dead horses 5.
Perform a productivity study to see if lighter riders improve the dead
horse's performance 6. Outsource: Hire a contractor to ride the dead
horse
7. Harness several dead horses together in an attempt to increase the
speed 8. Provide additional funding and/or training to increase the dead
horse's performance 9. Appoint a committee to study the horse and assess
how dead it actually is 10. Re-classify the dead horse as
"living-impaired" 11. Develop a Strategic Plan for the management of
dead horses
12. Rewrite the expected performance requirements for all horses 13.
Modify existing standards to include dead horses 14. Declare that, as
the dead horse does not have to be fed, it is less costly, carries lower
overheads, and therefore contributes substantially more to the bottom
line than many other horses 15. Promote the dead horse to a supervisory
position."
==
direct advertising on the Matronics Forums.
==
==
==
Message 2
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--> Europa-List message posted by: "p-a.austin" <p-a.austin@xtra.co.nz>
Tom,
I have a Trailer never yet assembled, which your welcome to buy, as change
of plan, now part owner of a Hanger.
Peter Austin
Classic #198
----- Original Message -----
From: "Europa-List Digest Server" <europa-list-digest@matronics.com>
Subject: Europa-List Digest: 31 Msgs - 08/12/04
> *
>
> ==================================================
> Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive
> ==================================================
>
> Today's complete Europa-List Digest can be also be found in either
> of the two Web Links listed below. The .html file includes the Digest
> formatted in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked
> Indexes and Message Navigation. The .txt file includes the plain ASCII
> version of the Europa-List Digest and can be viewed with a generic
> text editor such as Notepad or with a web browser.
>
> HTML Version:
>
>
http://www.matronics.com/digest/europa-list/Digest.Europa-List.2004-08-12.ht
ml
>
> Text Version:
>
>
http://www.matronics.com/digest/europa-list/Digest.Europa-List.2004-08-12.tx
t
>
>
> ================================================
> EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive
> ================================================
>
>
> Europa-List Digest Archive
> ---
> Total Messages Posted Thu 08/12/04: 31
>
>
> Today's Message Index:
> ----------------------
>
> 1. 01:35 AM - Re: Wiring query (R.C.Harrison)
> 2. 01:36 AM - Re: Europa "PayPal" to purchase small components (Paul
Bunting)
> 3. 01:57 AM - Re: Flying report OSHKOSH (Simon Smith)
> 4. 01:57 AM - Fw: Loss (R.C.Harrison)
> 5. 01:58 AM - Re: Wiring query (Richard Holder)
> 6. 02:00 AM - Re: Wiring query (Simon Smith)
> 7. 02:07 AM - Re: Loss (R.C.Harrison)
> 8. 04:44 AM - Re: Wiring query (M.J. Gregory)
> 9. 06:48 AM - Re: Flying report OSHKOSH
(Norbert.P.Hoffmann@t-online.de (Norbert P. Hoffmann))
> 10. 07:13 AM - Was Flying report OSHKOSH..Now is oil/water evapouation
temps. (R.C.Harrison)
> 11. 07:15 AM - Re: Exhaust angle (David Buckley)
> 12. 07:15 AM - Re: plexiglas/perspex (David Buckley)
> 13. 07:46 AM - Re: Flying report OSHKOSH (nigel charles)
> 14. 09:10 AM - Undercarriage Lever Stay (DvdPar@aol.com)
> 15. 09:24 AM - Re: Flying report OSHKOSH (Terry Seaver)
> 16. 10:18 AM - Re: Was Flying report OSHKOSH..Now is oil/water
evapouation temps. (Rob Housman)
> 17. 10:40 AM - Re: Was Flying report OSHKOSH..Now is oil/water
evapouation temps. (Simon Smith)
> 18. 11:07 AM - Re: Mono trailer ()
> 19. 11:10 AM - Re: Was Flying report OSHKOSH..Now is oil/water
evapouation temps. (Rob Housman)
> 20. 11:12 AM - Re: Was Flying report OSHKOSH..Now is oil/water
evapouation temps. (Alan Burrows)
> 21. 11:33 AM - Re: Undercarriage Lever Stay (Chuck Popenoe)
> 22. 11:57 AM - Re: Mono trailer (Fergus Kyle)
> 23. 12:08 PM - Re: Aircraft Manual (Rocketman)
> 24. 12:14 PM - Thoughts on administration. (Simon Smith)
> 25. 01:10 PM - Re: Wiring query (Steven Pitt)
> 26. 01:51 PM - Re: Wiring query (Rob Housman)
> 27. 01:55 PM - Misfire (Richard Holder)
> 28. 02:45 PM - Re: Europa "PayPal" to purchase small components
(Peter Grant)
> 29. 04:07 PM - Re: FW: Morning (Jim Puglise)
> 30. 04:56 PM - Re: Was Flying report OSHKOSH..Now is oil/water
evapouation temps. (Paul Boulet)
> 31. 11:18 PM - Thoughts on Becker? (Ronald J. Parigoris)
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 1
_____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 01:35:27 AM PST US
> From: "R.C.Harrison" <ptag.dev@ukonline.co.uk>
> Subject: Re: Europa-List: Wiring query
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "R.C.Harrison"
<ptag.dev@ukonline.co.uk>
>
> Hi! Simon.
> I'm not qualified to make any specific recommendations but find myself
> surprised to see that the replies to date don't raise question about the
> isolator remaining energised.
> My experience is that :-
> a) left energised for long periods it can overheat.?
> b) It will probably "pull" 1/2 amp continious to remain energised so you
> will need a damn good battery to last between start ups.?
> Regards
> Bob Harrison G-PTAG
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Simon Smith" <jodel@nildram.co.uk>
> Subject: Europa-List: Wiring query
>
>
> > --> Europa-List message posted by: "Simon Smith" <jodel@nildram.co.uk>
> >
> >
> > Hi all,
> >
> > I have virtually completed the wiring in accordance with the diagram on
> > Page 25-11 issue 4 which I believe is the latest version. I am using a
> > battery isolator and, after discussion with Andy, I have swapped the
30amp
> > slow blow fuses on the battery feed and regulator feed to 25 amp CB's.
> >
> > I crossed my fingers and powered it up and fortunately everything seems
to
> > work. One thing that I have noticed though is that if the batt master
CB
> is
> > pulled, power is removed from the aircraft but the isolator remains
> > energised (which I think is correct according to the diagram). Does it
> > matter that there is no fuse/cb protecting the isolator?
> >
> > Cheers
> >
> > Simon
> > #504 G-BZTN
> > 80% done 90% left to do!
> >
> >
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 2
_____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 01:36:26 AM PST US
> From: "Paul Bunting" <paul.bunting@developtheweb.com>
> Subject: RE: Europa-List: Europa "PayPal" to purchase small components
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Paul Bunting"
<paul.bunting@developtheweb.com>
>
> Hi Tony,
>
> The only reasons I know of that people don't like to use PayPal on ebay
> is the charge for withdrawing the money (roughly works out at 3% of
> total amount). Some ebayers will add this to the end of auction price,
> some don't and some simply don't use it. The other reason is the limit
> on the amount (to prevent fraud etc) if you are a non-business user I
> think it is around US$2000 per month, some major ebayers may exceed this
> and not want to pay for the business account.
>
> Regards,
>
> Paul
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tony
> Renshaw
> Subject: Europa-List: Europa "PayPal" to purchase small components
>
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: Tony Renshaw
> --> <tonyrenshaw@optusnet.com.au>
>
> Gidday,
> I am going to purchase one of Alan Burrows fuel transfer devices and was
>
> wondering if PayPal is the easy way to go. I haven't looked into it yet,
>
> other than to note one fellow on e-Bay who would not accept PayPal
> payments, reason unknown. So, is this a good way to get a small amount
> of
> money from one side of the world to the other?
>
> Reg
> Tony Renshaw
> Sydney Australia
>
> Classic 236 B.B. Taildragger
> Tail, Wings, Ailerons, Flaps Complete and Connected
> Lower Fuse in Jig, and module most recently installed.
> Tail Torque Tube installed.
> Mass Balance assembly installed and deflections sorted
> Roof Panel between doors completed.
> Photos at:
> http://forum.okhuijsen.org/TonyR
> Intended Engine: 912S CS prop (model undecided)
> Instrumentation: Garmin 296 Colour GPS beneath an electronic Artificial
> Horizon, one that I can trust for short periods IMC, to get out of a
> sticky situation
>
>
> ==
> direct advertising on the Matronics Forums.
> ==
> ==
> ==
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 3
_____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 01:57:50 AM PST US
> From: "Simon Smith" <jodel@nildram.co.uk>
> Subject: RE: Europa-List: Flying report OSHKOSH
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Simon Smith" <jodel@nildram.co.uk>
>
>
> >The hottest I saw the H2O temperature on my engine monitor was 100C and
the
> oil never got
> >that high. I attribute this to the cooling mods I have done to the
intake
> and exit air and the relocation of the oil cooler.
>
> I thought that is was important that the oil temp did go above 100C / 212F
> to boil off any water vapour in the oil.
>
> Any thoughts?
>
> Simon
> advertising on the Matronics Forums.
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 4
_____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 01:57:50 AM PST US
> From: "R.C.Harrison" <ptag.dev@ukonline.co.uk>
> Subject: Fw: Europa-List: Loss
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "R.C.Harrison"
<ptag.dev@ukonline.co.uk>
>
> Hi! All.
> Yes I believe he is, but don't expect any feed back from him.! At least My
> message didn't get a reply.
> Regards
> Bob Harrison G-PTAG
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "JR (Bob) Gowing" <gowingjr@acr.net.au>
> Subject: Re: Europa-List: Loss
>
>
> > --> Europa-List message posted by: "JR (Bob) Gowing"
<gowingjr@acr.net.au>
> >
> > Brian S.
> >
> > Jim McAvoy is the Aust Representative for Europa - jimca@ozemail.com.au
> and
> > is using Jabiru himself.
> >
> > J R (Bob) Gowing, UK Kit 327 finalising flap mechanism
> > do not archive
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: <EuropaXSA276@aol.com>
> > To: <europa-list@matronics.com>
> > Subject: Re: Europa-List: Loss
> >
> >
> > > --> Europa-List message posted by: EuropaXSA276@aol.com
> > >
> > > Tom. Where do we find information on this Jabaru FWF kit?
> > >
> > > Brian S
> > > A276 Tri Gear. Texas
> > > See my build photos at:
> > > http://forum.okhuijsen.org/BrianS
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 5
_____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 01:58:00 AM PST US
> Subject: Re: Europa-List: Wiring query
> From: Richard Holder <rholder@avnet.co.uk>
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: Richard Holder <rholder@avnet.co.uk>
>
>
> > --> Europa-List message posted by: "R.C.Harrison"
<ptag.dev@ukonline.co.uk>
> >
> > Hi! Simon.
> > I'm not qualified to make any specific recommendations but find myself
> > surprised to see that the replies to date don't raise question about
the
> > isolator remaining energised.
> > My experience is that :-
> > a) left energised for long periods it can overheat.?
> > b) It will probably "pull" 1/2 amp continious to remain energised so you
> > will need a damn good battery to last between start ups.?
> > Regards
> > Bob Harrison G-PTAG
>
> The whole point of the isolator is to ISOLATE !
>
> So when the master switch is turned off the isolator should switch off. In
> fact an isolator can take as much as 1 amp and with only 19 amps max
> available I wouldn't and didn't use one.
>
> I have used a "big red switch" in the main battery cable, which switches
off
> everything (including the starter) except the elevator trim which has its
> own separate CB and runs direct from the battery.
>
> The big red switch is as used on the inside and outside of rally cars and
> has a removable "key" - a lump of red plastic. It should be mounted as
close
> to the battery as possible - mine is at the back of the centre console.
>
> Richard
> Richard F.W. Holder 01279 842804 (POTS)
> Bell House, Bell Lane, 01279 842942 (fax)
> Widford, Ware, Herts, 07860 367423 (mobile)
> SG12 8SH email : rholder@avnet.co.uk
> Europa Classic Tri-gear : G-OWWW, High Cross
> PA-28-181 : Piper Archer : G-JANA, EGSG (Stapleford)
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 6
_____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 02:00:01 AM PST US
> From: "Simon Smith" <jodel@nildram.co.uk>
> Subject: RE: Europa-List: Wiring query
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Simon Smith" <jodel@nildram.co.uk>
>
> Thanks for the explanation.
>
> Simon
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of M.J. Gregory
> Subject: RE: Europa-List: Wiring query
>
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "M.J. Gregory"
> --> <m.j.gregory@talk21.com>
>
> Simon,
>
> A further point to note about Issue 4 of the circuit diagram is that the
30
> amp slow blow fuses for both the battery and the alternator supply cable
> protection are positioned on the firewall side as close as conveniently
> possible to their power sources. This gives maximum protection to the
> cables leading through to the cockpit and bus bars against the possibility
> of a short circuit to ground causing them to smoke. If instead of these
> fuses you have installed circuit breakers that are mounted on your panel,
> then you must take particular care to ensure that you have good physical
> protection for the cables leading up to them. This applies not just to
your
> initial installation, but to any subsequent maintenance or modification
you
> may do that might affect the integrity of these cables during the life of
> the aircraft.
>
> The wiring to engage the isolator is not given a fuse or circuit breaker
to
> protect it because it is on the ground side of the device. In contrast,
> there is protection for the starter relay solenoid circuit because that is
> supplying a positive to cause it to engage.
>
> Regards
>
> Mike
> Europa Club Safety Officer
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Rob Housman" <RobH@hyperion-ef.com>
>
> A common misconception is that fuses or circuit breakers protect devices.
> Not so. The protection is for the wire, or more precisely, the insulation
> on the wire. A given wire-insulation combination can carry a certain
> maximum current for a specified maximum temperature increase, and circuit
> protection devices are selected on this basis.
>
> If in your example the wire is both short in length and physically
protected
> from contacting anything that could make a short circuit in the event the
> insulation is compromised, protection in the form of a fuse or CB is not
> required.
>
>
> Best regards,
>
> Rob Housman
> Europa XS Tri-Gear A070
> Airframe complete
> Irvine, CA
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Simon Smith
> Subject: Europa-List: Wiring query
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Simon Smith" <jodel@nildram.co.uk>
>
>
> Hi all,
>
> I have virtually completed the wiring in accordance with the diagram on
> Page 25-11 issue 4 which I believe is the latest version. I am using a
> battery isolator and, after discussion with Andy, I have swapped the 30amp
> slow blow fuses on the battery feed and regulator feed to 25 amp CB's.
>
> I crossed my fingers and powered it up and fortunately everything seems to
> work. One thing that I have noticed though is that if the batt master CB
is
> pulled, power is removed from the aircraft but the isolator remains
> energised (which I think is correct according to the diagram). Does it
> matter that there is no fuse/cb protecting the isolator?
>
> Cheers
>
> Simon
> #504 G-BZTN
> 80% done 90% left to do!
>
>
> advertising on the Matronics Forums.
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 7
_____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 02:07:53 AM PST US
> From: "R.C.Harrison" <ptag.dev@ukonline.co.uk>
> Subject: Re: Europa-List: Loss
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "R.C.Harrison"
<ptag.dev@ukonline.co.uk>
>
> Hi! Graham.
> You make some valid points but the prop doesn't need to be in the
> inefficient range if there is a CS prop or "wobbly" prop facility.
> The warping heads problem has been addressed on new production but as ever
> with air cooled it needs some exact continious observation, reliable
> monitoring of all cylinders.
> "Horses for courses" I believe is the phrase. I have quite a background
of
> experience but nevertheless wouldn't try extend it to any major Rotax
strip
> down needing the services of specialists. But I was quite happy doing the
> Jabiru. (Back in the box Duncan I know what you are itching to say !)
> Regards
> Bob Harrison G-PTAG
> Regards
> Bob Harrison G-PTAG Europa MKI/Jabiru 3300.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Graham Singleton" <graham@gflight.f9.co.uk>
> Subject: Europa-List: Loss
>
>
> > --> Europa-List message posted by: Graham Singleton
> <graham@gflight.f9.co.uk>
> >
> > At 23:56 10/08/2004 -0700, you wrote:
> > >Loss
> > >
> > >--> Europa-List message posted by: <beecho@beecho.org>
> > >
> > >Hi Larry
> > >All is not lost if Europa doesn't survive. You can get a Jabiru fwf
> > >that is very complete. I am hoping it is also an improvement.. It
> > >appears so to me.
> > >Tom
> >
> > Tom
> > not to me, I'm afraid. The Jab is an attractive option price and
> simplicity
> > wise but it will never be as efficient as a liquid cooled engine. The
prop
> > turns too fast for efficiency too. Worse, the cylinder heads have a
> > reputation for warping unless installation is perfect.
> > Graham
> > (hope I'm wrong but ?)
> >
> >
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 8
_____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 04:44:49 AM PST US
> From: "M.J. Gregory" <m.j.gregory@talk21.com>
> Subject: RE: Europa-List: Wiring query
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "M.J. Gregory" <m.j.gregory@talk21.com>
>
> Steve,
>
> Yes, physical protection includes everything necessary to prevent the
> insulation being breached. This includes the routing of any slack in the
> cables to allow you to remove the panel and disconnect the cables -- where
> does the slack cable rest when the panel is refitted? Could it be
pinched,
> or chafe on anything?
>
> Since you raise the subject of firewall penetration, I strongly commend
Bob
> Nuckolls' AeroElectric Connection and his website
> http://www.aeroelectric.com. Look for the article on firewall
penetration.
> You may not wish to use quite as elaborate a form of protection as
required
> for certified aircraft, but he clearly recommends Firestop/Firesleeve to
> withstand the full 2000 degrees F of a fuel fire. I suspect silicone
> compound may not match this.
>
> Just to clear up a further point from the comments following Simon's
> original posting, the battery isolator solenoid circuit is indeed
> permanently connected to the positive side of the battery, but it is not
> 'energised' until the ground connection is made by the master switch. I'm
> sorry this was not clear from my previous response. On an aircraft this
is
> usually the only power (as opposed to avionics control, e.g. PTT) circuit
> where the switch is on the ground side. Because the isolator is normally
> located immediately adjacent to the battery, no electrical circuit
> protection is needed, although good physical protection such as neoprene
> covers should be provided on any terminals that are permanently live.
>
> Regards
>
> Mike
> Europa Club Safety Officer
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Steven Pitt"
<steven.pitt2@ntlworld.com>
>
> Mike - when you say 'physical protection' are you talking about anti
> chaffing or 'p' clip support? I have put both of my cbs in the panel but
> have tried to anchor every 3-4''.
> Where I breach the firewall I have put in a proper bulkhead seal which I
> will fill with silicone once the panel is finally in.
> Steve Pitt #403
>
> > Europa-List message posted by: "M.J. Gregory" <m.j.gregory@talk21.com>
> >
> > The wiring to engage the isolator is not given a fuse or circuit breaker
> to protect it because it is on the ground side of the device. In
contrast,
> there is protection for the starter relay solenoid circuit because that is
> supplying a positive to cause it to engage.
> >
> > Europa-List message posted by: "Simon Smith" <jodel@nildram.co.uk>
> >
> > if the batt master CB is pulled, power is removed from the aircraft but
> the isolator remains energised (which I think is correct according to the
> diagram). Does it matter that there is no fuse/cb protecting the
isolator?
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 9
_____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 06:48:20 AM PST US
> From: Norbert.P.Hoffmann@t-online.de (Norbert P. Hoffmann)
> Subject: Re: Europa-List: Flying report OSHKOSH
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: Norbert.P.Hoffmann@t-online.de (Norbert
P. Hoffmann)
>
> Am Donnerstag, 12. August 2004 10:57 schrieb Simon Smith:
>
> > I thought that is was important that the oil temp did go above 100C /
212F
> > to boil off any water vapour in the oil.
> >
> > Any thoughts?
> >
>
> In a standard installation, the oil temp. sensor measures the oil
temperature
> >after< the cooler. The actual temperature is higher.
>
> Norbert
> D-EUPA
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 10
____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 07:13:29 AM PST US
> From: "R.C.Harrison" <ptag.dev@ukonline.co.uk>
> Subject: Europa-List: Was Flying report OSHKOSH..Now is oil/water
evapouation temps.
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "R.C.Harrison"
<ptag.dev@ukonline.co.uk>
>
> Hi! Guys.
> Sorry to "butt in" but itdoesn't have to boil to evaporate at operating
> temps below boiling the engine crankase breather should loose lots of
water
> vapour.
> However the oil will have been designed to be most effecient in
lubrication
> at the normal operating temps of greater than 100deg C.
> (IMHO) Probably this is why my engine needed replacement piston rings at
452
> hours with the oil temps hardly ever getting over 50-70 deg C
> regaards
> Bob Harrison. G-PTAG
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Norbert P. Hoffmann" <Norbert.P.Hoffmann@t-online.de>
> Subject: Re: Europa-List: Flying report OSHKOSH
>
>
> > --> Europa-List message posted by: Norbert.P.Hoffmann@t-online.de
(Norbert
> P. Hoffmann)
> >
> > Am Donnerstag, 12. August 2004 10:57 schrieb Simon Smith:
> >
> > > I thought that is was important that the oil temp did go above 100C /
> 212F
> > > to boil off any water vapour in the oil.
> > >
> > > Any thoughts?
> > >
> >
> > In a standard installation, the oil temp. sensor measures the oil
> temperature
> > >after< the cooler. The actual temperature is higher.
> >
> > Norbert
> > D-EUPA
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 11
____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 07:15:01 AM PST US
> From: "David Buckley" <davebuckley@zoom.co.uk>
> Subject: RE: Europa-List: Exhaust angle
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "David Buckley"
<davebuckley@zoom.co.uk>
>
> Can you not just fit a tow hook and use in glider mode ? ;)
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dave
> Anderson
> Subject: Europa-List: Exhaust angle
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Dave Anderson" <dja767@charter.net>
>
> I would also like the exhaust to go straight back for drag reasons, but
> the evolution of operating the airplane has led to its current angle -
> quite down oriented. Ease of removing the lower cowl plus mainly keeping
> exhaust fumes away from the cockpit and the wing are the main reasons
> for the angle. I have thought of welding a section on the aft of the
> exhaust to form a fairing shape, but in reality I would never see the
> results in operation. Sometimes you just have to get the thing into the
> air. It is way more fun to fly it with the draggy exhaust than it is to
> stand there looking at it on the ground while pondering all the ways to
> make it go 0.1 knot faster!
>
> I am having withdrawal symptoms right now while waiting for the new carb
> flanges to arrive!
>
>
> Dave
> A227 Mini U2
>
>
> ==
> ==
> ==
> ==
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 12
____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 07:15:06 AM PST US
> From: "David Buckley" <davebuckley@zoom.co.uk>
> Subject: RE: Europa-List: plexiglas/perspex
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "David Buckley"
<davebuckley@zoom.co.uk>
>
> I've been flying my Europa for five years with the significantly brown
> tinted UK plexiglass.
>
> Although I do fly at night and IRF a reasonable amount in other
> aircraft, night IMC and IRF in homebuilt aircraft / kitplanes is not
> permitted in the UK. I have however pushed right up to the limits on a
> few occasions in the Europa. ;)
>
>
> My thought on the matter are as follows:
>
> At night one is actually flying IFR (even if visual) at one could enter
> cloud at anytime. Therefore everything you have to see to conduct a safe
> flight is lit, and an ATC and preferably a Radar service should be used
> whenever possible (IMHO)
>
> Balance that with the risk of fatigue from too much heat/light on a
> sunny day in the Europa greenhouse - it gets very hot without a great
> deal of sun-and probably more time spent flying under these conditions
> than the former- hopefully. Even if light is cut to 25%, I believe you
> should still be able to see nav lights at a respectable distance, and in
> fact I would say a good exterior scan is more important.
>
> Personally I would be happy to stick with the tint. I think the colour
> choice is more critical so as not to blank the Red/ Green nav lights.
>
> Just an opinion.
>
> Regards
>
> Dave
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Fred R.
> Klein
> Subject: Europa-List: plexiglas/perspex
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Fred R. Klein"
> <fklein@orcasonline.com>
>
> Hi All,
>
> I'm missing my windshield and windows, and now that I have some time
> before
> the issue can be dealt with, I'm looking for some advice and counsel as
> to
> whether to go clear, bronze, or grey tint.
>
> Uncertainty was in fact the reason I procrastinated on my order.
>
> Though the bronze is certainly attractive, I'm concerned with regard to
> its
> desireability for night flying.
>
> Looking around my local airport ramp, I find only clear windshields plus
> the
> occasional light blue/green tint in Bonanzas.
>
> Any thoughts?
>
> Fred
> A194
>
>
> ==
> ==
> ==
> ==
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 13
____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 07:46:37 AM PST US
> From: "nigel charles" <nigelcharles@tiscali.co.uk>
> Subject: Re: Europa-List: Flying report OSHKOSH
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "nigel charles"
<nigelcharles@tiscali.co.uk>
>
> >I thought that is was important that the oil temp did go above 100C /
212F
> to boil off any water vapour in the oil.<
>
> Whilst that is obviously a way to ensure that all water is evapourated I
> would be very surprised if all the water doesn't get evapourated with
lower
> temperatures over the length of the average flight. Perhaps if the
aircraft
> had been left for a long time in cool humid conditions it might need
longer
> or hotter temperatures. Water heated to 70-80degC will certainly give off
> water vapour.
>
> Nigel Charles
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 14
____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 09:10:51 AM PST US
> From: DvdPar@aol.com
> Subject: Europa-List: Undercarriage Lever Stay
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: DvdPar@aol.com
>
> I've lost my Alloy angle stay and will replace with new alloy angle. The
Mod
> drawings do not specify the dimensions of the stay, is it 3/4/ by 3/4 or
7/8
> by 7/8???? Any body help? Thanks
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 15
____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 09:24:23 AM PST US
> From: Terry Seaver <terrys@cisco.com>
> Subject: Re: Europa-List: Flying report OSHKOSH
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: Terry Seaver <terrys@cisco.com>
>
> We had a similar concern, i.e. that the oil temp never got higher than
> 180 degF in the winter time. We found that the standard Rotax oil temp
> sender location is in the coolest part of the system, just after the oil
> cooler. We put another temp transducer at the inlet to the oil
> reservoir, and found the oil temp there to be 48 degF hotter (in the
> climb) than at the standard location. The temp was 40 degF hotter there
> in cruise (75%, 5.3 gph). This is all on a mono-wheel XS with Rotax 912S.
>
> regards,
> Terry Seaver
>
>
> Simon Smith wrote:
>
> >--> Europa-List message posted by: "Simon Smith" <jodel@nildram.co.uk>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >>The hottest I saw the H2O temperature on my engine monitor was 100C and
the
> >>
> >>
> >oil never got
> >
> >
> >>that high. I attribute this to the cooling mods I have done to the
intake
> >>
> >>
> >and exit air and the relocation of the oil cooler.
> >
> >I thought that is was important that the oil temp did go above 100C /
212F
> >to boil off any water vapour in the oil.
> >
> >Any thoughts?
> >
> >Simon
> >advertising on the Matronics Forums.
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 16
____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 10:18:22 AM PST US
> From: "Rob Housman" <RobH@hyperion-ef.com>
> Subject: RE: Europa-List: Was Flying report OSHKOSH..Now is oil/water
evapouation
> temps.
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Rob Housman" <RobH@hyperion-ef.com>
>
> An additional assist comes from altitude. The boiling point decreases
with
> altitude so, for example, at 6000 msl pure water boils at about 94 deg C,
at
> 8000 msl 92 deg C, and at 10000 msl 90 deg C. Of course things are not
that
> simple either because the "antifreeze" added to the water raises the
boiling
> point at any given altitude, with the amount of boiling point elevation
> depending on the concentration.
>
>
> Best regards,
>
> Rob Housman
> Europa XS Tri-Gear A070
> Airframe complete
> Irvine, CA
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of R.C.Harrison
> Subject: Europa-List: Was Flying report OSHKOSH..Now is oil/water
> evapouation temps.
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "R.C.Harrison"
<ptag.dev@ukonline.co.uk>
>
> Hi! Guys.
> Sorry to "butt in" but itdoesn't have to boil to evaporate at operating
> temps below boiling the engine crankase breather should loose lots of
water
> vapour.
> However the oil will have been designed to be most effecient in
lubrication
> at the normal operating temps of greater than 100deg C.
> (IMHO) Probably this is why my engine needed replacement piston rings at
452
> hours with the oil temps hardly ever getting over 50-70 deg C
> regaards
> Bob Harrison. G-PTAG
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Norbert P. Hoffmann" <Norbert.P.Hoffmann@t-online.de>
> Subject: Re: Europa-List: Flying report OSHKOSH
>
>
> > --> Europa-List message posted by: Norbert.P.Hoffmann@t-online.de
(Norbert
> P. Hoffmann)
> >
> > Am Donnerstag, 12. August 2004 10:57 schrieb Simon Smith:
> >
> > > I thought that is was important that the oil temp did go above 100C /
> 212F
> > > to boil off any water vapour in the oil.
> > >
> > > Any thoughts?
> > >
> >
> > In a standard installation, the oil temp. sensor measures the oil
> temperature
> > >after< the cooler. The actual temperature is higher.
> >
> > Norbert
> > D-EUPA
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 17
____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 10:40:20 AM PST US
> From: "Simon Smith" <jodel@nildram.co.uk>
> Subject: RE: Europa-List: Was Flying report OSHKOSH..Now is oil/water
evapouation
> temps.
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Simon Smith" <jodel@nildram.co.uk>
>
> Why are you adding anti-freeze to your oil? :)
>
> Simon
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rob Housman
> Subject: RE: Europa-List: Was Flying report OSHKOSH..Now is oil/water
> evapouation temps.
>
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Rob Housman" <RobH@hyperion-ef.com>
>
> An additional assist comes from altitude. The boiling point decreases
with
> altitude so, for example, at 6000 msl pure water boils at about 94 deg C,
at
> 8000 msl 92 deg C, and at 10000 msl 90 deg C. Of course things are not
that
> simple either because the "antifreeze" added to the water raises the
boiling
> point at any given altitude, with the amount of boiling point elevation
> depending on the concentration.
>
>
> Best regards,
>
> Rob Housman
> Europa XS Tri-Gear A070
> Airframe complete
> Irvine, CA
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of R.C.Harrison
> Subject: Europa-List: Was Flying report OSHKOSH..Now is oil/water
> evapouation temps.
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "R.C.Harrison"
> --> <ptag.dev@ukonline.co.uk>
>
> Hi! Guys.
> Sorry to "butt in" but itdoesn't have to boil to evaporate at operating
> temps below boiling the engine crankase breather should loose lots of
water
> vapour. However the oil will have been designed to be most effecient in
> lubrication at the normal operating temps of greater than 100deg C.
> (IMHO) Probably this is why my engine needed replacement piston rings at
452
> hours with the oil temps hardly ever getting over 50-70 deg C regaards Bob
> Harrison. G-PTAG
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Norbert P. Hoffmann" <Norbert.P.Hoffmann@t-online.de>
> Subject: Re: Europa-List: Flying report OSHKOSH
>
>
> > --> Europa-List message posted by: Norbert.P.Hoffmann@t-online.de
> > --> (Norbert
> P. Hoffmann)
> >
> > Am Donnerstag, 12. August 2004 10:57 schrieb Simon Smith:
> >
> > > I thought that is was important that the oil temp did go above 100C
> > > /
> 212F
> > > to boil off any water vapour in the oil.
> > >
> > > Any thoughts?
> > >
> >
> > In a standard installation, the oil temp. sensor measures the oil
> temperature
> > >after< the cooler. The actual temperature is higher.
> >
> > Norbert
> > D-EUPA
>
>
> advertising on the Matronics Forums.
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 18
____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 11:07:31 AM PST US
> From: <beecho@beecho.org>
> Subject: RE: Europa-List: Mono trailer
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: <beecho@beecho.org>
>
> Paul, I have not called the flakey guy as he does not appear to be
> someone that I would want to send money to...
> I have asked the forum for plans with no response... There are a number
> of trailer makers around here as this is rather rural country with lots
> of ranches, etc. Do you think you could copy the trailer sufficient
> for someone to build them?
> Tom
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
> beecho@beecho.org
> Subject: Europa-List: Mono trailer
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: <beecho@beecho.org>
>
> Does anyone have plans for a monowheel trailer they would be willing to
> share? I will have to have one custom built and there aren't any close
> by to copy.
>
> Tom Friedland A079 N96V
>
>
> ==
> ==
> ==
> ==
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 19
____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 11:10:30 AM PST US
> From: "Rob Housman" <RobH@hyperion-ef.com>
> Subject: RE: Europa-List: Was Flying report OSHKOSH..Now is oil/water
evapouation
> temps.
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Rob Housman" <RobH@hyperion-ef.com>
>
> No, no, not deliberately, but ONLY if the coolant manages to get into the
> oil - I should have made that clear. Atmospheric moisture, as you clearly
> understand, is quite pure, except here in the LA Basin, that is ;-)
>
>
> Best regards,
>
> Rob Housman
> Europa XS Tri-Gear A070
> Airframe complete
> Irvine, CA
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Simon Smith
> Subject: RE: Europa-List: Was Flying report OSHKOSH..Now is oil/water
> evapouation temps.
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Simon Smith" <jodel@nildram.co.uk>
>
> Why are you adding anti-freeze to your oil? :)
>
> Simon
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rob Housman
> Subject: RE: Europa-List: Was Flying report OSHKOSH..Now is oil/water
> evapouation temps.
>
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Rob Housman" <RobH@hyperion-ef.com>
>
> An additional assist comes from altitude. The boiling point decreases
with
> altitude so, for example, at 6000 msl pure water boils at about 94 deg C,
at
> 8000 msl 92 deg C, and at 10000 msl 90 deg C. Of course things are not
that
> simple either because the "antifreeze" added to the water raises the
boiling
> point at any given altitude, with the amount of boiling point elevation
> depending on the concentration.
>
>
> Best regards,
>
> Rob Housman
> Europa XS Tri-Gear A070
> Airframe complete
> Irvine, CA
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of R.C.Harrison
> Subject: Europa-List: Was Flying report OSHKOSH..Now is oil/water
> evapouation temps.
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "R.C.Harrison"
> --> <ptag.dev@ukonline.co.uk>
>
> Hi! Guys.
> Sorry to "butt in" but itdoesn't have to boil to evaporate at operating
> temps below boiling the engine crankase breather should loose lots of
water
> vapour. However the oil will have been designed to be most effecient in
> lubrication at the normal operating temps of greater than 100deg C.
> (IMHO) Probably this is why my engine needed replacement piston rings at
452
> hours with the oil temps hardly ever getting over 50-70 deg C regaards Bob
> Harrison. G-PTAG
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Norbert P. Hoffmann" <Norbert.P.Hoffmann@t-online.de>
> Subject: Re: Europa-List: Flying report OSHKOSH
>
>
> > --> Europa-List message posted by: Norbert.P.Hoffmann@t-online.de
> > --> (Norbert
> P. Hoffmann)
> >
> > Am Donnerstag, 12. August 2004 10:57 schrieb Simon Smith:
> >
> > > I thought that is was important that the oil temp did go above 100C
> > > /
> 212F
> > > to boil off any water vapour in the oil.
> > >
> > > Any thoughts?
> > >
> >
> > In a standard installation, the oil temp. sensor measures the oil
> temperature
> > >after< the cooler. The actual temperature is higher.
> >
> > Norbert
> > D-EUPA
>
>
> advertising on the Matronics Forums.
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 20
____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 11:12:14 AM PST US
> From: "Alan Burrows" <alan@kestrel-insurance.com>
> Subject: RE: Europa-List: Was Flying report OSHKOSH..Now is oil/water
evapouation
> temps.
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Alan Burrows"
<alan@kestrel-insurance.com>
>
> Obviously it's a "cool" plane :-)
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Simon Smith
> Subject: RE: Europa-List: Was Flying report OSHKOSH..Now is oil/water
> evapouation temps.
>
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Simon Smith" <jodel@nildram.co.uk>
>
> Why are you adding anti-freeze to your oil? :)
>
> Simon
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rob Housman
> Subject: RE: Europa-List: Was Flying report OSHKOSH..Now is oil/water
> evapouation temps.
>
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Rob Housman" <RobH@hyperion-ef.com>
>
> An additional assist comes from altitude. The boiling point decreases
> with altitude so, for example, at 6000 msl pure water boils at about 94
> deg C, at 8000 msl 92 deg C, and at 10000 msl 90 deg C. Of course
> things are not that simple either because the "antifreeze" added to the
> water raises the boiling point at any given altitude, with the amount of
> boiling point elevation depending on the concentration.
>
>
> Best regards,
>
> Rob Housman
> Europa XS Tri-Gear A070
> Airframe complete
> Irvine, CA
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of R.C.Harrison
> Subject: Europa-List: Was Flying report OSHKOSH..Now is oil/water
> evapouation temps.
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "R.C.Harrison"
> --> <ptag.dev@ukonline.co.uk>
>
> Hi! Guys.
> Sorry to "butt in" but itdoesn't have to boil to evaporate at operating
> temps below boiling the engine crankase breather should loose lots of
> water vapour. However the oil will have been designed to be most
> effecient in lubrication at the normal operating temps of greater than
> 100deg C.
> (IMHO) Probably this is why my engine needed replacement piston rings at
> 452 hours with the oil temps hardly ever getting over 50-70 deg C
> regaards Bob Harrison. G-PTAG
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Norbert P. Hoffmann" <Norbert.P.Hoffmann@t-online.de>
> Subject: Re: Europa-List: Flying report OSHKOSH
>
>
> > --> Europa-List message posted by: Norbert.P.Hoffmann@t-online.de
> > --> (Norbert
> P. Hoffmann)
> >
> > Am Donnerstag, 12. August 2004 10:57 schrieb Simon Smith:
> >
> > > I thought that is was important that the oil temp did go above 100C
> > > /
> 212F
> > > to boil off any water vapour in the oil.
> > >
> > > Any thoughts?
> > >
> >
> > In a standard installation, the oil temp. sensor measures the oil
> temperature
> > >after< the cooler. The actual temperature is higher.
> >
> > Norbert
> > D-EUPA
>
>
> advertising on the Matronics Forums.
>
>
> ==
> direct advertising on the Matronics Forums.
> ==
> ==
> ==
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 21
____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 11:33:00 AM PST US
> From: "Chuck Popenoe" <cpops@verizon.net>
> Subject: RE: Europa-List: Undercarriage Lever Stay
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Chuck Popenoe" <cpops@verizon.net>
>
> I made mine out of 3/4 angle, and cut down the athwartship leg to about
1/2"
>
> Pops A036
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
DvdPar@aol.com
> Subject: Europa-List: Undercarriage Lever Stay
>
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: DvdPar@aol.com
>
> I've lost my Alloy angle stay and will replace with new alloy angle. The
> Mod
> drawings do not specify the dimensions of the stay, is it 3/4/ by 3/4 or
7/8
>
> by 7/8???? Any body help? Thanks
>
>
> advertising on the Matronics Forums.
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 22
____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 11:57:46 AM PST US
> From: "Fergus Kyle" <VE3LVO@rac.ca>
> Subject: Re: Europa-List: Mono trailer
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Fergus Kyle" <VE3LVO@rac.ca>
>
> Tom,
> I have a monowheel trailer straight from UK, but there are no
> plans with it; just an assembly diagram with parts numbers. I could
measure
> some distances for you but don't know the metal dimensions too well and
> local regs might render them insufficient.
> Someone else might do a better reply........
> Cheers, Ferg
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <beecho@beecho.org>
> Subject: RE: Europa-List: Mono trailer
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 23
____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 12:08:24 PM PST US
> From: Rocketman <topglock@cox.net>
> Subject: Re: Europa-List: Aircraft Manual
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: Rocketman <topglock@cox.net>
>
> Joseph J. Like wrote:
>
> >--> Europa-List message posted by: "Joseph J. Like" <n952jl@cox.net>
> >
> >Rob,
> >I would love to have a pdf version of the POH. I'm kit A086. I
> >purchased by stage one from someone who had a change of life and could
> >not start the project. That was five years ago. Stage two and three
> >were purchased from lakeland.
> >
> >My XS kit did not come with a POH as they were not written at that
> >time. I know I'm building a Mono instead of a Tri but I would love to
> >have a copy anyway.
> >
> >Joseph J. Like
> >A086
> >joelike@cox.net
> >N952JL@cox.net
> >
> >
> >
>
> Joseph,
>
> My Europa came with a mono POH. I'm building a Tri gear, so have no
> need for it, except for the cover. I'd be happy to send it to you, if
> you'd like. Contact me, off list and provide your shipping info.
>
> --
> Jeff - A055
> http://www.n55xs.com
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 24
____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 12:14:04 PM PST US
> From: "Simon Smith" <jodel@nildram.co.uk>
> Subject: Europa-List: Thoughts on administration.
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Simon Smith" <jodel@nildram.co.uk>
>
>
> Hi all,
>
> Just a thought on the subject of the Administrators banking cheques that
> were being held by EMIL.
> I know that it is an offence to trade when insolvent and I suppose that,
by
> not banking cheques for goods that they could not supply, they were not
> committing an offence.
> Surely, by the same logic, the administrators by banking the cheques have
> committed the same offence, unless of course they are going to supply the
> ordered goods!
>
> Any thoughts from any of our legal eagles out there?
>
> Simon
>
> Do not archive
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 25
____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 01:10:25 PM PST US
> From: "Steven Pitt" <steven.pitt2@ntlworld.com>
> Subject: Re: Europa-List: Wiring query
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Steven Pitt"
<steven.pitt2@ntlworld.com>
>
> So what have other Europa owners done about wires thro the firewall. Bob
> Nuckolls article is very interesting although he is looking at metal
> aircraft (no doubt the same philosophy applies to the phenolic firewall in
> the Europa). Is the suggestion that 'firestop' putty is used and if so
where
> do you get it from.
> Does the same idea apply where you use a bolt thro the wall - should this
be
> caulked in with putty? I was guided to put a threaded bar thro the
firewall
> for the positive and negative feeds (my battery is in the back) but no
> mention was made of fire precautions.
> As ever one question shows how large the knowledge gap is!!!!
> Steve Pitt #403
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "M.J. Gregory" <m.j.gregory@talk21.com>
> Subject: RE: Europa-List: Wiring query
>
>
> > --> Europa-List message posted by: "M.J. Gregory"
<m.j.gregory@talk21.com>
> >
> > Steve,
> >
> > Yes, physical protection includes everything necessary to prevent the
> > insulation being breached. This includes the routing of any slack in
the
> > cables to allow you to remove the panel and disconnect the cables --
where
> > does the slack cable rest when the panel is refitted? Could it be
> pinched,
> > or chafe on anything?
> >
> > Since you raise the subject of firewall penetration, I strongly commend
> Bob
> > Nuckolls' AeroElectric Connection and his website
> > http://www.aeroelectric.com. Look for the article on firewall
> penetration.
> > You may not wish to use quite as elaborate a form of protection as
> required
> > for certified aircraft, but he clearly recommends Firestop/Firesleeve to
> > withstand the full 2000 degrees F of a fuel fire. I suspect silicone
> > compound may not match this.
> >
> > Just to clear up a further point from the comments following Simon's
> > original posting, the battery isolator solenoid circuit is indeed
> > permanently connected to the positive side of the battery, but it is not
> > 'energised' until the ground connection is made by the master switch.
I'm
> > sorry this was not clear from my previous response. On an aircraft this
> is
> > usually the only power (as opposed to avionics control, e.g. PTT)
circuit
> > where the switch is on the ground side. Because the isolator is
normally
> > located immediately adjacent to the battery, no electrical circuit
> > protection is needed, although good physical protection such as neoprene
> > covers should be provided on any terminals that are permanently live.
> >
> > Regards
> >
> > Mike
> > Europa Club Safety Officer
> > --> Europa-List message posted by: "Steven Pitt"
> <steven.pitt2@ntlworld.com>
> >
> > Mike - when you say 'physical protection' are you talking about anti
> > chaffing or 'p' clip support? I have put both of my cbs in the panel but
> > have tried to anchor every 3-4''.
> > Where I breach the firewall I have put in a proper bulkhead seal which I
> > will fill with silicone once the panel is finally in.
> > Steve Pitt #403
> >
> > > Europa-List message posted by: "M.J. Gregory" <m.j.gregory@talk21.com>
> > >
> > > The wiring to engage the isolator is not given a fuse or circuit
breaker
> > to protect it because it is on the ground side of the device. In
> contrast,
> > there is protection for the starter relay solenoid circuit because that
is
> > supplying a positive to cause it to engage.
> > >
> > > Europa-List message posted by: "Simon Smith" <jodel@nildram.co.uk>
> > >
> > > if the batt master CB is pulled, power is removed from the aircraft
but
> > the isolator remains energised (which I think is correct according to
the
> > diagram). Does it matter that there is no fuse/cb protecting the
> isolator?
> >
> >
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 26
____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 01:51:52 PM PST US
> From: "Rob Housman" <RobH@hyperion-ef.com>
> Subject: RE: Europa-List: Wiring query
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Rob Housman" <RobH@hyperion-ef.com>
>
> First for the easy part. Bolts through the firewall, especially when a
> washer is used on both sides of the firewall so there is a tight seal,
will
> not allow any flame to penetrate. I consider this good practice.
>
> My preference was to use 'Lectric Bob's stainless steel tube scheme to
carry
> the electrical wires through the firewall, with putty to provide a seal.
In
> order to do this with the Rotax 914 (with large connectors, not easily
> removed, on some of the cables) I had to cut the tubing lengthwise to
> provide clearance, and them put it back together with stainless steel hose
> clamps. Not elegant but effective. My variation on this theme uses off
the
> shelf grab bars (those used in handicapped-accessible restrooms throughout
> the US) which are conveniently provided with welded flanges that
facilitate
> mounting to the firewall for the stainless steel tubing. See catalog
number
> 2823K32 at http://www.mcmaster.com. Note that this item has a flanged
elbow
> at each end and that in order to allow for the kerf in the longitudinal
cut,
> and reassembly to a round tube, both elbows are used with the kerf loss
just
> slightly offset from the centerline.
>
> Choke and throttle cables can be sealed with any of the "Cable Safe"
> fittings from Aircraft Spruce and others. These fittings also keep the
> cable sheaths from moving fore and aft.
>
> Of course all this concern for maintaining the integrity of the firewall
> seems a bit inconsistent with the monstrous holes required to allow the
> rudder cables to pass through that abominable stainless steel firewall
> assembly at the forward end of the tunnel. OK, so I exaggerate a bit (not
> the abominable part), but I'd wager that any flames forward of the
firewall
> will manage to toast your toes through those gaps. I have not been able
to
> come up with anything better, unfortunately. I hope someone has and tells
> us about it.
>
>
> Best regards,
>
> Rob Housman
> Europa XS Tri-Gear A070
> Airframe complete
> Irvine, CA
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Steven Pitt
> Subject: Re: Europa-List: Wiring query
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Steven Pitt"
<steven.pitt2@ntlworld.com>
>
> So what have other Europa owners done about wires thro the firewall. Bob
> Nuckolls article is very interesting although he is looking at metal
> aircraft (no doubt the same philosophy applies to the phenolic firewall in
> the Europa). Is the suggestion that 'firestop' putty is used and if so
where
> do you get it from.
> Does the same idea apply where you use a bolt thro the wall - should this
be
> caulked in with putty? I was guided to put a threaded bar thro the
firewall
> for the positive and negative feeds (my battery is in the back) but no
> mention was made of fire precautions.
> As ever one question shows how large the knowledge gap is!!!!
> Steve Pitt #403
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "M.J. Gregory" <m.j.gregory@talk21.com>
> Subject: RE: Europa-List: Wiring query
>
>
> > --> Europa-List message posted by: "M.J. Gregory"
<m.j.gregory@talk21.com>
> >
> > Steve,
> >
> > Yes, physical protection includes everything necessary to prevent the
> > insulation being breached. This includes the routing of any slack in
the
> > cables to allow you to remove the panel and disconnect the cables --
where
> > does the slack cable rest when the panel is refitted? Could it be
> pinched,
> > or chafe on anything?
> >
> > Since you raise the subject of firewall penetration, I strongly commend
> Bob
> > Nuckolls' AeroElectric Connection and his website
> > http://www.aeroelectric.com. Look for the article on firewall
> penetration.
> > You may not wish to use quite as elaborate a form of protection as
> required
> > for certified aircraft, but he clearly recommends Firestop/Firesleeve to
> > withstand the full 2000 degrees F of a fuel fire. I suspect silicone
> > compound may not match this.
> >
> > Just to clear up a further point from the comments following Simon's
> > original posting, the battery isolator solenoid circuit is indeed
> > permanently connected to the positive side of the battery, but it is not
> > 'energised' until the ground connection is made by the master switch.
I'm
> > sorry this was not clear from my previous response. On an aircraft this
> is
> > usually the only power (as opposed to avionics control, e.g. PTT)
circuit
> > where the switch is on the ground side. Because the isolator is
normally
> > located immediately adjacent to the battery, no electrical circuit
> > protection is needed, although good physical protection such as neoprene
> > covers should be provided on any terminals that are permanently live.
> >
> > Regards
> >
> > Mike
> > Europa Club Safety Officer
> > --> Europa-List message posted by: "Steven Pitt"
> <steven.pitt2@ntlworld.com>
> >
> > Mike - when you say 'physical protection' are you talking about anti
> > chaffing or 'p' clip support? I have put both of my cbs in the panel but
> > have tried to anchor every 3-4''.
> > Where I breach the firewall I have put in a proper bulkhead seal which I
> > will fill with silicone once the panel is finally in.
> > Steve Pitt #403
> >
> > > Europa-List message posted by: "M.J. Gregory" <m.j.gregory@talk21.com>
> > >
> > > The wiring to engage the isolator is not given a fuse or circuit
breaker
> > to protect it because it is on the ground side of the device. In
> contrast,
> > there is protection for the starter relay solenoid circuit because that
is
> > supplying a positive to cause it to engage.
> > >
> > > Europa-List message posted by: "Simon Smith" <jodel@nildram.co.uk>
> > >
> > > if the batt master CB is pulled, power is removed from the aircraft
but
> > the isolator remains energised (which I think is correct according to
the
> > diagram). Does it matter that there is no fuse/cb protecting the
> isolator?
> >
> >
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 27
____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 01:55:35 PM PST US
> Subject: Europa-List: Misfire
> From: Richard Holder <rholder@avnet.co.uk>
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: Richard Holder <rholder@avnet.co.uk>
>
> Well team, after 12 or more hours misfire-free I feel confident enough to
> announce that I have (finally) found my misfire. It was not the throttle
> linkages or the throttle box.
>
> When my co-builder (now deceased) Nigel put the fuel pipes in for the
carbs
> he used the #2 fuel pipe from Europa, rubber with a stainless steel
> braiding. He connected pipe to the carb banjos and ran the pipe under the
> carb to the standard t-pieces mounted on the engine mounting cross member.
>
> He insulated the pipe with "air conditioning" type insulation (a better
> quality than "central heating" insulation.
>
> The pipe (with insulation) ran approximately 1 1/2 inches from the exhaust
> manifold.
>
> During our very hot summer last year (100 degrees !) the insulation
"melted"
> on this most critical piece of the fuel pipe - nearest to the exhaust
> manifold [on the starboard side where the air has more restrictions to its
> flow because of the oil dry sump tank]
>
> This heated the stainless steel which promptly conducted the heat up
> UNDERNEATH the insulation, so negating the insulation !
>
> In the climb the fuel was flowing quickly enough to avoid any
vapourization
> problems, but when I buttoned off in the cruise at the top of the climb -
> lower fuel flow - vapourization - misfire; which would normally go away
(as
> things cooled down).
>
> So each change last autumn/winter which seemed to improve/fix it was just
> the cooler weather. It was fine in Feb and Mar and came back in April when
> the temps went up.
>
> The pipe has now been changed to the #3 pipe (which is rubber with an
> insert, no braiding) (#1 pipe had blue cotton braiding) and the pipe goes
> OVER the carb. I have no insulation on it and I have had no trouble
> whatsoever in temps up to 27 Celsius since.
>
> I feel pretty stupid about all my previous "fixes" but I am positive now
> that I have really done it. There was an obvious bit of melted insulation
> near the exhaust manifold which was hidden and only some lateral thinking
> and a grope under there brought it to light.
>
> I am planning replacement of all the s/s braided pipe and some blue
braided
> pipe with the #3 pipe. Unfortunately I don't have enough and my recent
(last
> 6 weeks) orders to EMIL have not produced any pipe, for the obvious
reasons
> :-( I only asked for them to contact me for my cc number and didn't send
> them a cheque. So my priority will be to replace the blue braided stuff in
> the tunnel as it is very petrol-smelly whenever I open up after a night in
> the hanger. There is no smell in use, ground or in the air.
>
> Of course this might all be another optimistic failure, but as I say I
have
> done 12 hours at least with it in the current state.
>
> One day I will get to a fly-in, I have much more confidence in it now !
>
> Richard
> Richard F.W. Holder 01279 842804 (POTS)
> Bell House, Bell Lane, 01279 842942 (fax)
> Widford, Ware, Herts, 07860 367423 (mobile)
> SG12 8SH email : rholder@avnet.co.uk
> Europa Classic Tri-gear : G-OWWW, High Cross
> PA-28-181 : Piper Archer : G-JANA, EGSG (Stapleford)
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 28
____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 02:45:51 PM PST US
> From: "Peter Grant" <peter@us-eurolink.co.uk>
> Subject: RE: Europa-List: Europa "PayPal" to purchase small components
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Peter Grant" <peter@us-eurolink.co.uk>
>
> If it's any help, I use it all the time and it works very well. If you
buy
> and sell on eBay you'll often find that you don't need to withdraw money,
> just use it to pay for other things!
>
> Regards
> Peter Grant
> +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
> 10 The Sidings, Horncastle LN9 5UA
> Tel: 01507 523180 Fax: 01507 525888 Mobile: 07774 923160
> +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
> G-OGAN Europa TriGear Build No: 100
> Rebuilt after serious prang with long XS wings and Airmaster VP prop.
Rotax
> 912S. 150 hours.
> This email is intended for the sole use of
> the addressee. If you have received this email in error, please contact
the
> sender and delete the message. Sorry, no liability for misuse of this
email
> however caused. Outgoing emails are automatically checked by Norton
> Anti-Virus.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Paul Bunting
> Subject: RE: Europa-List: Europa "PayPal" to purchase small components
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Paul Bunting"
> <paul.bunting@developtheweb.com>
>
> Hi Tony,
>
> The only reasons I know of that people don't like to use PayPal on ebay
> is the charge for withdrawing the money (roughly works out at 3% of
> total amount). Some ebayers will add this to the end of auction price,
> some don't and some simply don't use it. The other reason is the limit
> on the amount (to prevent fraud etc) if you are a non-business user I
> think it is around US$2000 per month, some major ebayers may exceed this
> and not want to pay for the business account.
>
> Regards,
>
> Paul
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tony
> Renshaw
> Subject: Europa-List: Europa "PayPal" to purchase small components
>
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: Tony Renshaw
> --> <tonyrenshaw@optusnet.com.au>
>
> Gidday,
> I am going to purchase one of Alan Burrows fuel transfer devices and was
>
> wondering if PayPal is the easy way to go. I haven't looked into it yet,
>
> other than to note one fellow on e-Bay who would not accept PayPal
> payments, reason unknown. So, is this a good way to get a small amount
> of
> money from one side of the world to the other?
>
> Reg
> Tony Renshaw
> Sydney Australia
>
> Classic 236 B.B. Taildragger
> Tail, Wings, Ailerons, Flaps Complete and Connected
> Lower Fuse in Jig, and module most recently installed.
> Tail Torque Tube installed.
> Mass Balance assembly installed and deflections sorted
> Roof Panel between doors completed.
> Photos at:
> http://forum.okhuijsen.org/TonyR
> Intended Engine: 912S CS prop (model undecided)
> Instrumentation: Garmin 296 Colour GPS beneath an electronic Artificial
> Horizon, one that I can trust for short periods IMC, to get out of a
> sticky situation
>
>
> ==
> direct advertising on the Matronics Forums.
> ==
> ==
> ==
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 29
____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 04:07:55 PM PST US
> From: "Jim Puglise" <jimpuglise@comcast.net>
> Subject: RE: Europa-List: FW: Morning
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Jim Puglise" <jimpuglise@comcast.net>
>
> Alan-
>
> Hope you don't see a parallel to Europa!
>
> Jim-A283
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Alan Burrows
> Subject: Europa-List: FW: Morning
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Alan Burrows"
> <alan@kestrel-insurance.com>
>
>
> Hope you all had a good weekend even the one's that didn't make it to
> the I.O.M.!!
>
> Any comments ?
>
> THE TEN-SECOND FUNNY: MORE DEAD HORSES
>
> Well, someone's come up with a variant on that supposed old 'Dakota
> tribal wisdom' email about what to do when you find you are riding a
> dead horse. Here it is:
>
> "The tribal wisdom of the Dakota Indians, passed down from generation to
> generation, says that when you discover that you are riding a dead
> horse, the best strategy is to dismount. In many organizations, however,
> a whole range of far more advanced strategies are often employed, such
> as:
>
> 1. Change riders
> 2. Buy a stronger whip
> 3. Do nothing: "This is the way we have always ridden dead horses" 4.
> Visit other companies or countries to see how they ride dead horses 5.
> Perform a productivity study to see if lighter riders improve the dead
> horse's performance 6. Outsource: Hire a contractor to ride the dead
> horse
>
> 7. Harness several dead horses together in an attempt to increase the
> speed 8. Provide additional funding and/or training to increase the dead
> horse's performance 9. Appoint a committee to study the horse and assess
> how dead it actually is 10. Re-classify the dead horse as
> "living-impaired" 11. Develop a Strategic Plan for the management of
> dead horses
>
> 12. Rewrite the expected performance requirements for all horses 13.
> Modify existing standards to include dead horses 14. Declare that, as
> the dead horse does not have to be fed, it is less costly, carries lower
> overheads, and therefore contributes substantially more to the bottom
> line than many other horses 15. Promote the dead horse to a supervisory
> position."
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 30
____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 04:56:37 PM PST US
> From: Paul Boulet <possibletodo@YAHOO.COM>
> Subject: RE: Europa-List: Was Flying report OSHKOSH..Now is oil/water
evapouation
> temps.
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: Paul Boulet <possibletodo@yahoo.com>
>
> you guys kill me
> paul boulet n914pb
> do not archive
> --- Alan Burrows <alan@kestrel-insurance.com> wrote:
>
> > --> Europa-List message posted by: "Alan Burrows"
> > <alan@kestrel-insurance.com>
> >
> > Obviously it's a "cool" plane :-)
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
> > [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On
> > Behalf Of Simon Smith
> > To: europa-list@matronics.com
> > Subject: RE: Europa-List: Was Flying report
> > OSHKOSH..Now is oil/water
> > evapouation temps.
> >
> >
> > --> Europa-List message posted by: "Simon Smith"
> > <jodel@nildram.co.uk>
> >
> > Why are you adding anti-freeze to your oil? :)
> >
> > Simon
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
> > [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On
> > Behalf Of Rob Housman
> > To: europa-list@matronics.com
> > Subject: RE: Europa-List: Was Flying report
> > OSHKOSH..Now is oil/water
> > evapouation temps.
> >
> >
> > --> Europa-List message posted by: "Rob Housman"
> > <RobH@hyperion-ef.com>
> >
> > An additional assist comes from altitude. The
> > boiling point decreases
> > with altitude so, for example, at 6000 msl pure
> > water boils at about 94
> > deg C, at 8000 msl 92 deg C, and at 10000 msl 90 deg
> > C. Of course
> > things are not that simple either because the
> > "antifreeze" added to the
> > water raises the boiling point at any given
> > altitude, with the amount of
> > boiling point elevation depending on the
> > concentration.
> >
> >
> > Best regards,
> >
> > Rob Housman
> > Europa XS Tri-Gear A070
> > Airframe complete
> > Irvine, CA
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
> > [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com]On
> > Behalf Of R.C.Harrison
> > To: europa-list@matronics.com
> > Subject: Europa-List: Was Flying report OSHKOSH..Now
> > is oil/water
> > evapouation temps.
> >
> > --> Europa-List message posted by: "R.C.Harrison"
> > --> <ptag.dev@ukonline.co.uk>
> >
> > Hi! Guys.
> > Sorry to "butt in" but itdoesn't have to boil to
> > evaporate at operating
> > temps below boiling the engine crankase breather
> > should loose lots of
> > water vapour. However the oil will have been
> > designed to be most
> > effecient in lubrication at the normal operating
> > temps of greater than
> > 100deg C.
> > (IMHO) Probably this is why my engine needed
> > replacement piston rings at
> > 452 hours with the oil temps hardly ever getting
> > over 50-70 deg C
> > regaards Bob Harrison. G-PTAG
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Norbert P. Hoffmann"
> > <Norbert.P.Hoffmann@t-online.de>
> > To: <europa-list@matronics.com>
> > Subject: Re: Europa-List: Flying report OSHKOSH
> >
> >
> > > --> Europa-List message posted by:
> > Norbert.P.Hoffmann@t-online.de
> > > --> (Norbert
> > P. Hoffmann)
> > >
> > > Am Donnerstag, 12. August 2004 10:57 schrieb Simon
> > Smith:
> > >
> > > > I thought that is was important that the oil
> > temp did go above 100C
> > > > /
> > 212F
> > > > to boil off any water vapour in the oil.
> > > >
> > > > Any thoughts?
> > > >
> > >
> > > In a standard installation, the oil temp. sensor
> > measures the oil
> > temperature
> > > >after< the cooler. The actual temperature is
> > higher.
> > >
> > > Norbert
> > > D-EUPA
> >
> >
> > advertising on the Matronics Forums.
> >
> >
> > ==
> > direct advertising on the Matronics Forums.
> > ==
> > ==
> > ==
> >
> >
> >
> > Contributions
> > any other
> > Forums.
> >
> > http://www.matronics.com/chat
> >
> > http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> > http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Europa-List.htm
> > http://www.matronics.com/archives
> > http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> > http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 31
____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 11:18:25 PM PST US
> From: "Ronald J. Parigoris" <rparigor@suffolk.lib.ny.us>
> Subject: Europa-List: Thoughts on Becker?
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Ronald J. Parigoris"
<rparigor@suffolk.lib.ny.us>
>
> Any Thoughts on Becker AR4201 Transceiver and ATC 4401 (175W) Transponder?
>
> thx.
>
> ron parigoris
> A-265
>
>
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|
| Subject: | Avoid Cockpit Module Anxiety |
--> Europa-List message posted by: Tony Renshaw <tonyrenshaw@optusnet.com.au>
Gidday,
Below is the way to put a module in, and avoid the pitfalls and anxieties I
have experienced. The problem is that the manual is written for people who
take 3 steps forwards and 1 back, which is completely discriminatory for
those of us that take 3 steps forward and 2 back. Without doubt when you
put your module in there is a couple of things you need to be told.
Firstly, the gap between module and boat needs to be identified and written
on the boat, in an area that isn't going to be covered up with glue.
Secondly, unlike me, after going to this trouble you need to take note of
this, and moreso, place enough mix so that it exudes out to that depth, not
place that much glue and when you push it down, there isn't enough
material. My anxiety is that the glue would exude into areas I wouldn't
want it, but that is "incorrect". I measured accurately gaps of 1-2 mm and
put in 1-2 mm of redux. There is only 4 areas that matter, and all the rest
is incidental weight. Now, no one argue about this until you have read the
rest of this, because I can certify, undeniably, this is an area of the
build where you shouldn't be worried about weight. So, why not worry about
weight.............................because, what is the ramification if you
don't put in enough redux? Ok, here goes. Oh, I forgot to stress point 2,
you MUST, MUST, MUST, MUST, MUST, MUST, MUST, MUST, MUST, MUST, MUST, MUST,
MUST, MUST, MUST, MUST, MUST, MUST, MUST ( do you believe me that I am
serious!!) use a bright light such as a trouble light, an incandescent bulb
on a long cord, beneath the module to show up voids. Had I known I had
voids like I do, I could have addressed the issues whilst I still had a wet
cockpit module base, and a wet boat. The problem now is that I have a dried
out boat, and a dried out underside of the cockpit module, with air in
between. Now, I probably have enough of direct bonding, if I choose to
consider that the flanges are probably 100% bigger than they need to be, to
cater for the vagaries of homebuilding, but I can't put my wife and kids in
mine unless I have the "right amount" of residual "safety". So, how do I
fix it? Well, firstly I get the "bloody trouble light which scorned me as I
left it unemployed, hanging from the wall behind me as I bonded in the
module, and "use it". This is the biggest piece of advice. Please, don't
"not use" a trouble light. Voids, and the future anxiety and consequence
thereof are a real bugger. Well, to fix things you drill many holes, 1/2 of
which are a lesser diameter to exude air, and you spend the next few hours
going over every joint filling up all the voids. Then, you worry. Now worry
is what you don't want to do if you are a homebuilder. So, how do you not
worry when you have stuffed up? You put back "equivalent strength". Easy,
but heavy. Actually easy it is not, as a lot of the areas are awkward and
now inaccessible. I am going to use 2 or 3 ply BID straps on the front and
back of the seat portion of the module, the 2 spanwise ribs that have the
tank and flight controls within them. These straps will run from the bottom
of the boat up to the sill top, the middle of the fuse. I am going to
overlap the flanges of the module onto the adjacent skins, however remember
that the loads are now going outward laterally from the point that takes
the load. I should add that my module takes the load of my undercarriage up
through it, as I have a taildragger, but nevertheless this is irrelevant
to the conscience of a dedicated "perfectionist in undoing builder induced
problems". I could simply build a rib that runs around the top of the fuse
in an arch that transfers any upward force of the module into the space
immediately above the join in the fuse, which of course is continually
narrowing vertically.
There is a simple answer for you........................don't cheapskate on
the redux as the gain is not worth having. Be wary of the areas around
where the flight control bearings are, as you don't want to glue everything
up, and I can honestly say I didn't do that. Its a real sh*t to do
something that is unable to be undone, and have anxieties. So, be wary of
prioritising with "cocked up priorities". A light weight a/c is not all
that it is cracked up to be. If you disagree, well ..........tell me
directly, because those of us that go 3 forward and 2 back need to know this!
Reg
Tony Renshaw
Sydney Australia
Classic 236 B.B. Taildragger
Tail, Wings, Ailerons, Flaps Complete and Connected
Lower Fuse in Jig, and module most recently installed.
Tail Torque Tube installed.
Mass Balance assembly installed and deflections sorted
Roof Panel between doors completed.
Photos at:
http://forum.okhuijsen.org/TonyR
Intended Engine: 912S CS prop (model undecided)
Instrumentation: Garmin 296 Colour GPS beneath an electronic Artificial
Horizon, one that I can trust for short periods IMC, to get out of a sticky
situation
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Avoid Cockpit Module Anxiety |
--> Europa-List message posted by: Gerry Holland <gnholland@onetel.com>
Tony Hi!
> Below is the way to put a module in, and avoid the pitfalls and anxieties I
> have experienced. The problem is that the manual is written for people who
> take 3 steps forwards and 1 back, which is completely discriminatory for
> those of us that take 3 steps forward and 2 back.
You have many more friends than you would imagine!!
Regards
Gerry
Europa 384 G-FIZY
Trigear with Rotax 912 and Arplast CS Prop.
Engine very near to starting.
Painting completed. Vinyl design scheme to be added.
Completing Wiring to Panel.
Dynon EFIS, KMD 150, Icom A-200 and SL70 Transponder. AoA Fitted.
Shoulder Width Mod. Heater Unit constructed and fitted.
http://www.g-fizy.com
+44 7808 402404
gnholland@onetel.com
Message 5
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|
| Subject: | FW: New 914 Exhuast muffler and tailpipe |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Kevin Klinefelter" <kevann@gte.net>
Thanks for all the comments on this subject. I think I'll aim the tailpipe
at about the 4:00 position, the cowl goes on and off well enough, and cut
off the "bump" for the old style muffler.
Dave, I hear ya, I should just paint the damn thing and fly it!
Kevin
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of
europa@triton.net
Subject: Re: Europa-List: FW: New 914 Exhuast muffler and tailpipe
--> Europa-List message posted by: europa@triton.net
Hi Kevin,
I forgot to add that we had to bump out the lower cowl to clear the front
starboard exhaust pipe. I got a drawing from Martin at AirMaster that
shows the cowl needs to be 1" behind the prop flange. When put in place,
the cowl hit the exhaust.
Jim & Heather A185
Message 6
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|
| Subject: | Re: Avoid Cockpit Module Anxiety |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Fergus Kyle" <VE3LVO@rac.ca>
Avoid Cockpit Module Anxiety
| --> Europa-List message posted by: Tony Renshaw
<tonyrenshaw@optusnet.com.au>
|
| Gidday,
| Below is the way to put a module in, and avoid the pitfalls and anxieties
I
| have experienced. The problem is that the manual is written for people who
| take 3 steps forwards and 1 back, which is completely discriminatory for
| those of us that take 3 steps forward and 2 back. Without doubt when you
| put your module in there is a couple of things you need to be told.
| Firstly, the gap between module and boat needs to be identified and
written
| on the boat, in an area that isn't going to be covered up with glue.
| Secondly, unlike me, after going to this trouble you need to take note of
| this, and moreso, place enough mix so that it exudes out to that depth,
not
| place that much glue and when you push it down, there isn't enough
| material. My anxiety is that the glue would exude into areas I wouldn't
| want it, but that is "incorrect". I measured accurately gaps of 1-2 mm and
| put in 1-2 mm of redux. There is only 4 areas that matter, and all the
rest
| is incidental weight. Now, no one argue about this until you have read the
| rest of this, because I can certify, undeniably, this is an area of the
| build where you shouldn't be worried about weight. So, why not worry about
| weight.............................because, what is the ramification if
you
| don't put in enough redux? Ok, here goes. Oh, I forgot to stress point 2,
| you MUST, MUST, MUST, MUST, MUST, MUST, MUST, MUST, MUST, MUST, MUST,
MUST,
| MUST, MUST, MUST, MUST, MUST, MUST, MUST ( do you believe me that I am
| serious!!) use a bright light such as a trouble light, an incandescent
bulb
| on a long cord, beneath the module to show up voids. Had I known I had
| voids like I do, I could have addressed the issues whilst I still had a
wet
| cockpit module base, and a wet boat. The problem now is that I have a
dried
| out boat, and a dried out underside of the cockpit module, with air in
| between. Now, I probably have enough of direct bonding, if I choose to
| consider that the flanges are probably 100% bigger than they need to be,
to
| cater for the vagaries of homebuilding, but I can't put my wife and kids
in
| mine unless I have the "right amount" of residual "safety". So, how do I
| fix it? Well, firstly I get the "bloody trouble light which scorned me as
I
| left it unemployed, hanging from the wall behind me as I bonded in the
| module, and "use it". This is the biggest piece of advice. Please, don't
| "not use" a trouble light. Voids, and the future anxiety and consequence
| thereof are a real bugger. Well, to fix things you drill many holes, 1/2
of
| which are a lesser diameter to exude air, and you spend the next few hours
| going over every joint filling up all the voids. Then, you worry. Now
worry
| is what you don't want to do if you are a homebuilder. So, how do you not
| worry when you have stuffed up? You put back "equivalent strength". Easy,
| but heavy. Actually easy it is not, as a lot of the areas are awkward and
| now inaccessible. I am going to use 2 or 3 ply BID straps on the front and
| back of the seat portion of the module, the 2 spanwise ribs that have the
| tank and flight controls within them. These straps will run from the
bottom
| of the boat up to the sill top, the middle of the fuse. I am going to
| overlap the flanges of the module onto the adjacent skins, however
remember
| that the loads are now going outward laterally from the point that takes
| the load. I should add that my module takes the load of my undercarriage
up
| through it, as I have a taildragger, but nevertheless this is irrelevant
| to the conscience of a dedicated "perfectionist in undoing builder induced
| problems". I could simply build a rib that runs around the top of the fuse
| in an arch that transfers any upward force of the module into the space
| immediately above the join in the fuse, which of course is continually
| narrowing vertically.
| There is a simple answer for you........................don't cheapskate
on
| the redux as the gain is not worth having. Be wary of the areas around
| where the flight control bearings are, as you don't want to glue
everything
| up, and I can honestly say I didn't do that. Its a real sh*t to do
| something that is unable to be undone, and have anxieties. So, be wary of
| prioritising with "cocked up priorities". A light weight a/c is not all
| that it is cracked up to be. If you disagree, well ..........tell me
| directly, because those of us that go 3 forward and 2 back need to know
this!
| Tony Renshaw
| Sydney Australia
Tony,
You are a lot wiser I presume. I was. For the second challenge
in the gluing and pasting enterprise - putting the top on -
[a] Ensure you have spacers inside the top which flex it outboard so that
when presented to the canoe, will hold it well out for prior inspection to
ensure proper 420 application (once you spang 'em together the adhesive goes
all over the place) AND strings to pull 'em out of the way when mated;
[b] Masking tape along every intended glue line about 3mm outside the
edge, so that you can 'scoop' excess shortly after initial application, and
then strip the tape when 1 hour old to prevent excessive slop. This requires
careful planning for the nether regions in the back;
[c] Do not use unfloxed fresh adhesive for plugging cleco/screwholes or
expect large globules to dribble down the inside. The waste hurts..........
Cheers for better gluing,
Ferg
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Avoid Cockpit Module Anxiety |
--> Europa-List message posted by: Jeff Roberts <jeff@rmmm.net>
on 8/13/04 6:16 AM, Tony Renshaw at tonyrenshaw@optusnet.com.au wrote:
> --> Europa-List message posted by: Tony Renshaw <tonyrenshaw@optusnet.com.au>
>
> Gidday,
> Below is the way to put a module in, and avoid the pitfalls and anxieties I
> have experienced. The problem is that the manual is written for people who
> take 3 steps forwards and 1 back, which is completely discriminatory for
> those of us that take 3 steps forward and 2 back.
The people at Europa have known for years of better and more complete ways
of doing things that would lower these types of anxieties. Nevel has been
great at sharing them with us on a as needed bases. Thanks Nev! But they
still never found their way into the manual. Remember the term in the video,
(No prior building knowledge is assumed). If this company gets resurrected
and these kits are to be sold to people under the pretense of no prior
building knowledge needed. The manual needs fixed!
My friend building a RV has full size drawings all over his shop walls.
$27,000.00 is a lot of money. We deserve the best manual possible with the
best methods of doing things explained in text and drawn out. I don't want
to here any excuses about the PFA making manual changes impossible. There is
no excuse for lack of safety! I also have had it explained to me another
way. (Our manual is one of the best out there. You have apparently never
seen others). No I was one of the morons that believed your tape. No Prior
Building Knowledge is assumed!
Thank God for Flight Crafters, this forum, and local flying friends.
Jeff
A258
Starting primer and seeing the light at the end of the tunnel, but I know
there are lots that never will.
PS. Don't get me wrong I love this plane.
Message 8
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|
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Cliff Shaw" <flyinggpa@comcast.net>
Kingsley
Thanks for the kind words ! It is really worth the effort to build an
Europa. It is fun to fly !!!!
Cliff Shaw
1041 Euclid ave.
Edmonds, WA 98020
425 776 5555
----- Original Message -----
From: "Kingsley Hurst" <hurstkr@growzone.com.au>
Subject: RE: Europa-List: Flying report OSHKOSH
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Kingsley Hurst"
<hurstkr@growzone.com.au>
>
> Cliff Shaw wrote :
>
> > The wife and I have just completed the biggest adventure of our life .
> . . . . . . . . .
>
> Cliff,
>
> It heartens me to read of your adventure and the air of excitement it
> conveys.
>
> This is exactly the sort of thing I am looking forward to doing myself
> one day cause that is what I reckon all this home building business is
> about.
>
> If I wasn't at work at the moment, I'd be back on the job with renewed
> enthusiasm so thanks for sharing your experience with us.
>
> Regards
> Kingsley Hurst
> Mono Classic 281 in Oz
>
>
Message 9
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|
--> Europa-List message posted by: Graham Singleton <graham@gflight.f9.co.uk>
At 23:56 12/08/2004 -0700, you wrote:
>Hi! Graham.
>You make some valid points but the prop doesn't need to be in the
>inefficient range if there is a CS prop or "wobbly" prop facility.
Bob
at 3,300 rpm the prop tips are getting close to the supercritical range,
hence a lot of noise, and noise is wasted energy.
Graham
Message 10
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| Subject: | Europa performance with Subaru and Catto prop |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "GLENN CROWDER" <gcrowder2@hotmail.com>
I finally had time to go out on a nice day and do some speed
tests with a new Catto 3 bladed composite fixed pitch prop on my
Subaru EA81 powered Europa Classic monowheel.
Its been nothing but rain, thunderstorms and wind for a
month in the afternoons. Yesterday we got baseball size hail in
places! I had a flight a week ago Sunday - first flight with the Catto
prop and it was a hot day. 92 degrees at 10 in the morning and DA
was already 8470 ft! Field elev is 5090 ft. I had to wait behind four
other planes so that didn't help my engine temps just prior to takeoff.
Takeoff roll was noticeably longer than the WD and after popping off, I
held it under 50 ft for a while and slowly retracted the flaps as
it built up speed. Once 80 mph attained then started to climb
steeply. Climb rate settled on 1200 fpm for the first fifteen
hundred feet or so and then I climbed a little less steeply. Once
up to altitude, I leveled off and noticed oil temps were getting
high, around 240 degrees F. I started to get worried and slowed
down to hopefully drop oil temps. After about 10 minutes, temp
came down to about 225 and I started a speed run. Unfortunately,
my GPS had not locked on since takeoff. My ASI reads way low at
any kind of speed so that is of no use but wound it out to just under
redline (5600 rpm) and it seemed faster but I really couldn't tell without
a GPS. I decided to go back and land, pull the cowl and check
everything over. Nothing was wrong but I decided to do a mod on my oil
cooler setup and add an exit duct for the oil cooler. Before, the hot
air just emptied inside the cowl. This mod took a week and I also
added a duct to hopefully cool the alternator better.
Today was supposed to be fairly cool, 73 F and there was no
wind. DA was 6740, much better than the other day. Climb was even
better (1350) and oil temps were down. At 7600 ft I started a
speed run. It takes some time to build up speed. I trim it down ,
then let speed build up but then have to trim it down some more as
the plane starts climbing at 800 fpm. I have to do this several
times until the plane does not want to climb, then carefully watch
the VSI while tweaking the throttle and leaning the mixture for
best power. The faster the Europa goes, the more sensitive the
elevator is and is fairly difficult to get a smooth consistent run
without diving or climbing, especially if there are any bumps. The
air was very smooth so I got some good runs. 168 mph one way and
172 the other (no fudging or diving to gain speed first). I only
did two runs but I will do more next time. I did not try the new
cowl flap arrangement that allows me to partially block off the
cooling flow (and drag) at speed. I will try that next time.
Basically I feel I have gained a solid 20 mph over the best WD
performance. This was after tweaking and tweaking the WD until I
didn't think I could get any more out of it. Also, the best climb
I could get from the WD at the highest speed setting was 900 fpm in
the summer and 1100 fpm in the winter. The Catto was supremely
smooth. With the WD, it seemed as though blade flex would cause
some rude and rough reactions at times, particularly when it was hot.
I wanted to see what speeds I would get at 75% power, and
throttled back to 5000 rpm. Speeds settled around 150-155 mph.
This was better than my top speed before, so I am very happy. Fuel
burn at 5000 rpm was showing 5.3 gal/hr but I haven't calibrated
the fuel computer yet, so that may not be accurate. WOT fuel burn
showed 6.2 gph. Fuel burn at 4000 rpm was about 4 gph.
Tomorrow I will install the Speed fairing kit and then do another
test. I am really liking the Catto right now but there is a noticeably
longer
takeoff roll but I didn't think it was excessive, maybe 800 ft, up from
maybe 600 ft before at my elevation with no wind. I only fly from a 4700 ft
paved runway, so taking off of grass with a passenger on a hot day could
possibly get interesting!
One small negative with the Catto is that he will only make a SAE2 (maybe
SAE1
as well, I'm not sure) pattern, so I had to make an adapter to convert from
the
Rotax 4 inch pattern to SAE2 (4 3/4"). I don't see why a similiar prop
wouldn't help the Rotax 912/914 just as much. For me, I like the Catto far
better
than the NSI CAP 140 cockpit adjustable prop that I originally had on the
plane,
although takeoff roll was shorter with the NSI/WD setup.
Glenn Crowder
Golden, Colorado
USA
Get ready for school! Find articles, homework help and more in the Back to
Message 11
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| Subject: | Europa performance with Subaru and Catto prop |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Fergus Kyle" <VE3LVO@rac.ca>
----- Original Message -----
From: "GLENN CROWDER" <gcrowder2@hotmail.com>
Subject: Europa-List: Europa performance with Subaru and Catto prop
"..............The air was very smooth so I got some good runs. 168 mph one
way and 172 the other (no fudging or diving to gain speed first). I only
did two runs but I will do more next time. .................." Glenn
Crowder Golden, Colorado
Glenn,
Thanks for the rundown on your combination power/prop! It was
interesting to read of the changes you made, and the speeds you acquired,
especially for the altitude and temps you experience in Colorado. I used to
look down from the 30ks enroute from Toronto to LAX at the countriside and
wonder how the Europa would do there.........
However, I don't think it's 'cheating' to dive for a higher
cruise speed, or starting from a higher engine power and reducing at higher
speed. There's a lot of pallaver about the procedure but I thought we
covered that a few months ago, and feel it's an acceptable method of
acquiring a higher continuous cruise where achieved.
May you go to even greater speeds as developments occur! Keep up
the info to us wantas, though...........
Ferg
A064
Message 12
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|
| Subject: | 2002 XS N77EU FOR SALE |
UPPERCASE_75_100@matronics.com, message@matronics.com, body@matronics.com,
is@matronics.com, uppercase@matronics.com
--> Europa-List message posted by: SPurpura@aol.com
2002 EUROPA XS MONOWHEEL, 300 TT ,ROTAX 914 TURBO
WHIRLWIND C/S PROP ,APOLLO 360 =D8 GPS MOVING MAP
GARMIN GNC250XL-COM/GPS WITH MOVING MAP
GARMIN GTX327 SOLID STATE TRANSPONDER
GRAND RAPIDS EIS ENGINE MONITOR WITH FUEL FLOW
PS300 STEREO INTERCOM,WITH VOICE RECORD
PIONEER AM/FM CD PLAYER
ELECTRIC A/I & TURN COORDINATOR
ELECTRIC AILERON & ELEVATOR TRIM ON THE STICK
KING ELT, PANEL LIGHTS,NAV LIGHTS,WHEELEN STROBES
LONG RANGE FUEL TANK & FACTORY SPEED KIT
CUSTOM TRAILER,AIRCRAFT RIGGS IN 15 MIN
ASKING PRICE OF $95K SAM 909-989-1520
Message 13
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|
--> Europa-List message posted by: "R.C.Harrison" <ptag.dev@ukonline.co.uk>
Yes, Graham that's why mine is limited to 2900 RPM .
Regards
Bob H G-PTAG
----- Original Message -----
From: "Graham Singleton" <graham@gflight.f9.co.uk>
Subject: Europa-List: Jabiru
> --> Europa-List message posted by: Graham Singleton
<graham@gflight.f9.co.uk>
>
> At 23:56 12/08/2004 -0700, you wrote:
> >Hi! Graham.
> >You make some valid points but the prop doesn't need to be in the
> >inefficient range if there is a CS prop or "wobbly" prop facility.
>
> Bob
> at 3,300 rpm the prop tips are getting close to the supercritical range,
> hence a lot of noise, and noise is wasted energy.
> Graham
>
>
Message 14
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|
| Subject: | Thoughts on Becker? |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Steve Hagar" <hagargs@earthlink.net>
Ron
I have installed these units in my aircraft. The manuals are very
informative and complete. The plane hasn't flown yet. However when I turn
the radio on inside the garage the clarity and reception appear to e much
better than when I stand on the roof of the house with my handheld Icom.
That's about the only form of calibration I have right now. Before I bought
the units I asked the same questions over the forum that you are asking and
received nothing but positive replies. A German friend of mine says that
Becker stuff is top of the line. I haven't done anything with the
transponder as of yet.
Steve Hagar
A143
Mesa, AZ
> [Original Message]
> From: Ronald J. Parigoris <rparigor@suffolk.lib.ny.us>
> To: <europa-list@matronics.com>
> Date: 8/12/04 11:17:37 PM
> Subject: Europa-List: Thoughts on Becker?
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Ronald J. Parigoris"
<rparigor@suffolk.lib.ny.us>
>
> Any Thoughts on Becker AR4201 Transceiver and ATC 4401 (175W) Transponder?
>
> thx.
>
> ron parigoris
> A-265
>
>
Message 15
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|
| Subject: | Throttle setting software |
1.2 WHY_WAIT BODY: What are you waiting for
0.5 MIME_BOUND_NEXTPART Spam tool pattern in MIME boundary
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Steve Hagar" <hagargs@earthlink.net>
Does anyone out there have the throttle setting software for the 914 they can
e-mail me? Also any tips or issues on its use?
Thanks
Steve
A143
Mesa, AZ
Steve Hagar
hagargs@earthlink.net
Why Wait? Move to EarthLink.
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