Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 05:41 AM - Sunday venue (Richard Iddon)
2. 06:06 AM - Re: Sunday venue (Alan Burrows)
3. 06:31 AM - Re: Sunday venue (Richard Iddon)
4. 06:56 AM - door locks (Richard Iddon)
5. 09:46 AM - Re: Sunday venue (Alan Burrows)
6. 09:53 AM - Re: Motorglider wings--HELP! ()
7. 10:58 AM - new owner, new builder (Myron Haluschak)
8. 10:59 AM - Recombinant Gas batteries (Richard Holder)
9. 11:34 AM - Re: Recombinant Gas batteries (Gilles Thesee)
10. 04:37 PM - Re: new owner, new builder (Tony Renshaw)
11. 04:40 PM - Europa Fathers Day (Tony Renshaw)
12. 04:44 PM - Flap Alignment (David Simenauer)
13. 06:21 PM - Re: Motorglider wings--HELP! ()
14. 06:54 PM - Re: new owner, new builder (RobsonPR)
15. 07:04 PM - Re: Flap Alignment (EuropaXSA276@aol.com)
16. 07:15 PM - Re: Flap Alignment (EuropaXSA276@aol.com)
17. 07:36 PM - Re: Flap Alignment (Fred Fillinger)
18. 07:36 PM - Re: Recombinant Gas batteries (Fred Fillinger)
Message 1
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--> Europa-List message posted by: "Richard Iddon" <riddon@sent.com>
Couldn't make it to Turweston today due to low cloud / rain at
Blackpool.
Anyone going to Old Sarum Sunday or anywhere else?
Richard Iddon G-RIXS (100+ hours flying and counting)
Do not archive
Message 2
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--> Europa-List message posted by: "Alan Burrows" <alan@kestrel-insurance.com>
Hi Richard
I had the same problem from the Isle of Man whats on at Old Sarum?
Is there anything going on in the north?
Alan Burrows
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard
Iddon
Subject: Europa-List: Sunday venue
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Richard Iddon" <riddon@sent.com>
Couldn't make it to Turweston today due to low cloud / rain at
Blackpool.
Anyone going to Old Sarum Sunday or anywhere else?
Richard Iddon G-RIXS (100+ hours flying and counting)
Do not archive
==
direct advertising on the Matronics Forums.
==
==
==
Message 3
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--> Europa-List message posted by: "Richard Iddon" <riddon@sent.com>
Alan,
There is a PFA Solent Strut Fly in. Not sure what is on the agenda.
Can't find anything happening in the north and the weather is looking
better for the south tomorrow.
Cheers,
Richard Iddon G-RIXS
Do not archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Alan
Burrows
Subject: RE: Europa-List: Sunday venue
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Alan Burrows"
<alan@kestrel-insurance.com>
Hi Richard
I had the same problem from the Isle of Man whats on at Old Sarum?
Is there anything going on in the north?
Alan Burrows
Message 4
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--> Europa-List message posted by: "Richard Iddon" <riddon@sent.com>
I fitted the 'standard' type door locks with a jubilee clip on the door
push rod as a stop and barrel lock which rotates a cam against it to
stop the handle being turned when door is locked.
I have just experienced a second 'failure' of a barrel lock, caused both
times by staff at the hanger where I keep the plane trying to force the
door handle. (last time was my fault really as I had left the park brake
on and they needed to move the plane). Reluctant to fit a third set and
have the same problem, I wondered if anyone has had success with a
different method of locking?
Richard Iddon G-RIXS
Message 5
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--> Europa-List message posted by: "Alan Burrows" <alan@kestrel-insurance.com>
Ok thanks
Probably wont bother with going to that, it's a bit short notice for me,
special branch clearance etc.I may just fly over to Blackpool or maybe
even East Midlands and pay a visit to the kit car show on at Donington
just across the road. I think there should be a statement about Europa
next week as its now in the hands of a new owner. I am not involved so
I'll leave the official announcement to the new owner who I think will
have the best interests of Europa at heart, so things should start to
look up from now on.
Cheers for Now
Alan
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard
Iddon
Subject: RE: Europa-List: Sunday venue
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Richard Iddon" <riddon@sent.com>
Alan,
There is a PFA Solent Strut Fly in. Not sure what is on the agenda.
Can't find anything happening in the north and the weather is looking
better for the south tomorrow.
Cheers,
Richard Iddon G-RIXS
Do not archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Alan
Burrows
Subject: RE: Europa-List: Sunday venue
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Alan Burrows"
<alan@kestrel-insurance.com>
Hi Richard
I had the same problem from the Isle of Man whats on at Old Sarum? Is
there anything going on in the north?
Alan Burrows
==
direct advertising on the Matronics Forums.
==
==
==
Message 6
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| Subject: | Motorglider wings--HELP! |
--> Europa-List message posted by: <beecho@beecho.org>
Hi Ken
I would be interested in buying them but probably the poor guy that is
wingless needs them more. (If he is wingless..) Are they still in the
boxes? Do you know if they are complete? It sounds like not all are.
Tom Friedland, N96V Atascadero CA
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
kbcarpenter@comcast.net
Subject: Re: Europa-List: Motorglider wings--HELP!
--> Europa-List message posted by: <kbcarpenter@comcast.net>
I have a set of finished glider wings not being used. I would consider
selling them. Am in Knoxville, TN. Contact me off list.
Ken Carpenter
kbcarpenter@comcast.net
----- Original Message -----
From: <ACJARVIS1@aol.com>
Subject: Re: Europa-List: Motorglider wings--HELP!
> --> Europa-List message posted by: ACJARVIS1@aol.com
>
> I certainly can't help but will just record my own tale of woe re
glider
> wings. I bought a 'motor glider kit' and took delivery in Jan 2004 .
I
paid in
> full but opted to have the wings delivered 'a bit later on' when I
could
find
> space for them....well you can work out the rest..no wings full stop.
Caveat
> emptor. Next time use a credit card, never mind the interest.
>
> However I would like to keep the glider wing story alive ....Dave
Anderson
> has shown that the motor glider really does live up to its design
claims.
The
> Europa may be getting old but the stretched version has only just
hatched!
>
> I wonder-
> a) how many sets of long wings are 'out there'?
> b) how many people would be interested in buying the long wings
assuming
> some sort of production is resumed by someone?
> c) what are my chances of finding any decent wings long or short?
>
> PS Jeremy Davey tells me the costs of fulfilling the PFA tests are
maybe
no
> more than
> =A310 000 which shared between a dozen or so owners would be well
worth
> paying...
>
> Andrew Jarvis 599. fuselage and no wings!
>
>
==
==
==
==
Message 7
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| Subject: | new owner, new builder |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Myron Haluschak" <myron.haluschak@sympatico.ca>
Hello all:
My name is Myron Haluschak, and I am the new owner of kit A046. I am a military
pilot who finds the Europa one of the best flying planes on the market, achieving
the best balance of speed, handling, economy, and fun.
I will be building shortly, and want to learn as much as possible from those who
have moved on as well from those who are starting.
All the best and safe building and flying to all
Myron
Message 8
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| Subject: | Recombinant Gas batteries |
--> Europa-List message posted by: Richard Holder <rholder@avnet.co.uk>
A question for the techies out there.
I have a starting problem, and one possibility is that my battery needs
replacing. (I am working through testing other things).
Everyone seems to rave about a form of battery called
"gas recombinant" and the Odyssey has been mentioned.
Now I have a Yuasa NP17-12I battery at the moment which is marked "valve
regulated".
My confusion surrounds the product details shown in various places which
sometimes refers to gas recombinant sealed lead acid batteries and sometimes
as valve regulated sealed lead acid batteries.
Are "gas recombinant" and "valve regulated" the same thing ?
If so am I likely to gain anything from using an Odyssey battery rather than
a new Yuasa battery ?
What sort of life would you expect from a Yuasa ? It is now two years old
and seems to have plenty of capacity (it grinds away for ages !) but not
much initial oooomph !
Gas Recombinant has been feted as having that extra initial ooooomph.
The Yuasa battery is about 40, the Odessey I believe was mentioned on here
at around 80. It would be worth 80 if the plane starts first time with it
!
TIA
Richard
Richard F.W. Holder 01279 842804 (POTS)
Bell House, Bell Lane, 01279 842942 (fax)
Widford, Ware, Herts, 07860 367423 (mobile)
SG12 8SH email : rholder@avnet.co.uk
Europa Classic Tri-gear : G-OWWW, High Cross
PA-28-181 : Piper Archer : G-JANA, EGSG (Stapleford)
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Recombinant Gas batteries |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Gilles Thesee" <Gilles.Thesee@ac-grenoble.fr>
----- Original Message -----
From: "Richard Holder" <rholder@avnet.co.uk>
Subject: Europa-List: Recombinant Gas batteries
> --> Europa-List message posted by: Richard Holder <rholder@avnet.co.uk>
>
> A question for the techies out there.
>
> I have a starting problem, and one possibility is that my battery needs
> replacing. (I am working through testing other things).
>
> Everyone seems to rave about a form of battery called
>
> "gas recombinant" and the Odyssey has been mentioned.
>
> Now I have a Yuasa NP17-12I battery at the moment which is marked "valve
> regulated".
>
> My confusion surrounds the product details shown in various places which
> sometimes refers to gas recombinant sealed lead acid batteries and
sometimes
> as valve regulated sealed lead acid batteries.
>
> Are "gas recombinant" and "valve regulated" the same thing ?
>
Hmm, yes. But check the maufacturer website.
The terms "starved electrolyte", "valve regulated", "glass mat" etc...alone
or together are a good indication of the correct technology.
The features to look for are electrolyte absorbed in glass mats between the
plates, and a valve regulation permitting the recombination of the gasses.
Such batteries can be installed in any position except upside down, and
their starting current is outstanding.
> If so am I likely to gain anything from using an Odyssey battery rather
than
> a new Yuasa battery ?
>
Check the respective documentation on the web.
> What sort of life would you expect from a Yuasa ? It is now two years old
> and seems to have plenty of capacity (it grinds away for ages !) but not
> much initial oooomph !
>
Did you make sure it is fully charged ? The open circuit voltage should be
around 12.7-12.8 volts.
Hope this helps,
Regards,
Gilles Thesee
Grenoble, France
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: new owner, new builder |
--> Europa-List message posted by: Tony Renshaw <tonyrenshaw@optusnet.com.au>
Gidday Myron,
Well, get ready to learn a lot about yourself, your organisational skills,
your tenaciousness when things get tough, your patience etc.In the first
instance why don't you make sure you have everything, label them all, and
note longhand on th label the role of the component. Group them together
according to the task. This is an arduous task but will save hours later.
Is yours an accelerated kit? The Europa Club I think are the people to talk
to about archived messages. There is a sea of information out there. Just
get on your bike, ride, and when you fall off we'll help pick up the
pieces. Oh, whilst I think of it, build yourself a flat topped bench, and I
said flat, but I meant to say.......................................FLAT !!!!
Mine is 2.4 X 1.2 Metres, on castors and very solidly braced. Ideally it
can be level, but of itself is not imperative. Mine is on castors remember,
so I can push it around. The datum is the benchtop, so that is why flat is
good.
Go for it and let us know what your queries are.
Good luck, and welcome..
At 03:58 AM 9/5/2004, you wrote:
>--> Europa-List message posted by: "Myron Haluschak"
><myron.haluschak@sympatico.ca>
>
>Hello all:
>
>My name is Myron Haluschak, and I am the new owner of kit A046. I am a
>military pilot who finds the Europa one of the best flying planes on the
>market, achieving the best balance of speed, handling, economy, and fun.
>
>I will be building shortly, and want to learn as much as possible from
>those who have moved on as well from those who are starting.
>
>All the best and safe building and flying to all
>
>Myron
>
>
Message 11
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| Subject: | Europa Fathers Day |
--> Europa-List message posted by: Tony Renshaw <tonyrenshaw@optusnet.com.au>
Hey, Europa Dad,
You having a good building day I hope? Maybe not if you are reading this
early, so get out there, as you would say. But, on the other hand, if you
have done something, well, what was it???
Happy fathers day Kinglsey.
Reg
Tony R.
At 04:34 AM 9/4/2004, you wrote:
>--> Europa-List message posted by: "Robert Berube" <bberube@tampabay.rr.com>
>
>The plywood is not glassed over the bush sockets as they may need slight
>realignment for your wings. It must be done following the fit of your
>wings.
>
>Bob Berube
>Flight Crafters
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
>[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
>EuropaXSA276@aol.com
>To: europa-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Europa-List: Spar tip socket installation opinions please
>
>--> Europa-List message posted by: EuropaXSA276@aol.com
>
>Hello Gents:
>I'm requesting opinions on installation procedure of the starboard spar tip
>
>sockets <Ch14> which is located on the port spar.
>
><First let me say that I purchased the quick build cockpit module. The
>socket
>for the port wing and bush behind the passenger seat is already installed.
>Only thing left for me to do in Ch 14 it to install the starboard tip socket
>and
>the bush behind the pilot seat.>
>
>Per the manual I set the module on it's front and attempted to test fit the
>wings with supports on each end. I spent the better part of the morning on
>this!
>
>Question 1:
> After about 3 hours of work, it occurred to me that, since I only need
>install the starboard socket I could simply bolt the spars together and
>achieve the
>proper alignment without wrestling with the module and wing supports.
>This proceeder sound OK to you folks?
>
>Question 2:
>Will it still be necessary to install both wings into the cockpit module
>when
>it comes time to put the bushing the seat back. I'm thinking that if my
>alignment is OK with the 2 spars then it should line up just fine.
>
>****
>On a side note I noticed that the factory did not install the bush
>reinforcement pads on the seat back < page 14-3> before gluing the port
>socket tip on...
> Anyone know if this procedure has been eliminated from the most recent
>updates?
>
>Thanks in advance!
>
>
>Brian S
>A276 Tri Gear. Texas
>See my build photos at:
>http://forum.okhuijsen.org/BrianS
>
>
Message 12
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--> Europa-List message posted by: "David Simenauer" <dsimenauer@cox.net>
I am in the process of fitting the flap into the right wing on a trigear. The
FL1 and FL2 hinges line up well with the W18 plates. The manual calls for the
FL3 (outboard) hinge to line up mid way between the two W18 plates. Mine does
not line up centered between the W18 plates. It is about 4mm right of center.
Is it necessary that the outboard hinge is exactly centered or just somewhere
between the two W18 plates?
Dave Simenauer
A101
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: Motorglider wings--HELP! |
--> Europa-List message posted by: <kbcarpenter@comcast.net>
The wings are finished with polyurethane, high gloss. I have flown with
them about 45 hours. There are no boxes for them. I have them wrapped and
on a support frame.
Ken
----- Original Message -----
From: <beecho@beecho.org>
Subject: RE: Europa-List: Motorglider wings--HELP!
> --> Europa-List message posted by: <beecho@beecho.org>
>
> Hi Ken
> I would be interested in buying them but probably the poor guy that is
> wingless needs them more. (If he is wingless..) Are they still in the
> boxes? Do you know if they are complete? It sounds like not all are.
> Tom Friedland, N96V Atascadero CA
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
> kbcarpenter@comcast.net
> To: europa-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Europa-List: Motorglider wings--HELP!
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: <kbcarpenter@comcast.net>
>
> I have a set of finished glider wings not being used. I would consider
> selling them. Am in Knoxville, TN. Contact me off list.
> Ken Carpenter
> kbcarpenter@comcast.net
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <ACJARVIS1@aol.com>
> To: <europa-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: Re: Europa-List: Motorglider wings--HELP!
>
>
> > --> Europa-List message posted by: ACJARVIS1@aol.com
> >
> > I certainly can't help but will just record my own tale of woe re
> glider
> > wings. I bought a 'motor glider kit' and took delivery in Jan 2004 .
> I
> paid in
> > full but opted to have the wings delivered 'a bit later on' when I
> could
> find
> > space for them....well you can work out the rest..no wings full stop.
> Caveat
> > emptor. Next time use a credit card, never mind the interest.
> >
> > However I would like to keep the glider wing story alive ....Dave
> Anderson
> > has shown that the motor glider really does live up to its design
> claims.
> The
> > Europa may be getting old but the stretched version has only just
> hatched!
> >
> > I wonder-
> > a) how many sets of long wings are 'out there'?
> > b) how many people would be interested in buying the long wings
> assuming
> > some sort of production is resumed by someone?
> > c) what are my chances of finding any decent wings long or short?
> >
> > PS Jeremy Davey tells me the costs of fulfilling the PFA tests are
> maybe
> no
> > more than
> > =A310 000 which shared between a dozen or so owners would be well
> worth
> > paying...
> >
> > Andrew Jarvis 599. fuselage and no wings!
> >
> >
>
>
> ==
> ==
> ==
> ==
>
>
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: new owner, new builder |
--> Europa-List message posted by: RobsonPR <robsonpr@clear.net.nz>
Is that an Australian word, "tenaciousness"? We in New Zealand usually say
"tenacity".
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tony Renshaw" <tonyrenshaw@optusnet.com.au>
Subject: Re: Europa-List: new owner, new builder
> --> Europa-List message posted by: Tony Renshaw
<tonyrenshaw@optusnet.com.au>
>
> Gidday Myron,
> Well, get ready to learn a lot about yourself, your organisational skills,
> your tenaciousness when things get tough, your patience etc.In the first
> instance why don't you make sure you have everything, label them all, and
> note longhand on th label the role of the component. Group them together
> according to the task. This is an arduous task but will save hours later.
> Is yours an accelerated kit? The Europa Club I think are the people to
talk
> to about archived messages. There is a sea of information out there. Just
> get on your bike, ride, and when you fall off we'll help pick up the
> pieces. Oh, whilst I think of it, build yourself a flat topped bench, and
I
> said flat, but I meant to say.......................................FLAT
!!!!
> Mine is 2.4 X 1.2 Metres, on castors and very solidly braced. Ideally it
> can be level, but of itself is not imperative. Mine is on castors
remember,
> so I can push it around. The datum is the benchtop, so that is why flat is
> good.
> Go for it and let us know what your queries are.
> Good luck, and welcome..
>
>
> At 03:58 AM 9/5/2004, you wrote:
> >--> Europa-List message posted by: "Myron Haluschak"
> ><myron.haluschak@sympatico.ca>
> >
> >Hello all:
> >
> >My name is Myron Haluschak, and I am the new owner of kit A046. I am a
> >military pilot who finds the Europa one of the best flying planes on the
> >market, achieving the best balance of speed, handling, economy, and fun.
> >
> >I will be building shortly, and want to learn as much as possible from
> >those who have moved on as well from those who are starting.
> >
> >All the best and safe building and flying to all
> >
> >Myron
> >
> >
>
>
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: Flap Alignment |
--> Europa-List message posted by: EuropaXSA276@aol.com
In a message dated 9/4/2004 6:44:55 PM Central Standard Time,
dsimenauer@cox.net writes:
am in the process of fitting the flap into the right wing on a trigear. The
FL1 and FL2 hinges line up well with the W18 plates. The manual calls for the
FL3 (outboard) hinge to line up mid way between the two W18 plates. Mine
does not line up centered between the W18 plates. It is about 4mm right of
center. Is it necessary that the outboard hinge is exactly centered or just
somewhere between the two W18 plates?
Hi Dave:
The FL 3 needs to be centered. You will put spacers between the arms that are
equal in length. You want to make sure of a smooth and operation with no
binding.
Too far to the right? Depending on where you are standing, that could be
inboard or out.
Try changing the configuration of the side that the W20 and W19 attache to
the FL1 and FL3 that should move the flap in or out about 4 mm. You can also
change the side that the FL1 and FL3 bolt to the W18's for further adjustments.
Brian S
A276 Tri Gear. Texas
See my build photos at:
http://forum.okhuijsen.org/BrianS
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: Flap Alignment |
--> Europa-List message posted by: EuropaXSA276@aol.com
In a message dated 9/4/2004 9:05:17 PM Central Standard Time,
EuropaXSA276@aol.com writes:
that the W20 and W19 attache to
Attache....
That would be "attach" Dave! As in Connect...
Time for this cowboy to go to bed!
I have been doing wing pirouettes all day installing cockpit module
bushings... I'm pooped!
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Brian S
A276 Tri Gear. Texas
See my build photos at:
http://forum.okhuijsen.org/BrianS
Message 17
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| Subject: | Re: Flap Alignment |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Fred Fillinger" <n3eu@comcast.net>
> The manual calls for the FL3 (outboard) hinge to line up mid way
> between the two W18 plates. Mine does not line up centered between
> the W18 plates. It is about 4mm right of center. Is it necessary
that the
> outboard hinge is exactly centered or just somewhere between the two
> W18 plates?
>
> Dave Simenauer
It appears for the trigear they simply reworked what was there on the
monowheel. I don't think all that beef is needed out there at all, so
centering does nothing structurally. I'd grind down one spacer and
add washers to the other to make up for 1/4" in off-centering.
Reg,
Fred F.
Message 18
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| Subject: | Re: Recombinant Gas batteries |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Fred Fillinger" <n3eu@comcast.net>
Richard Holder wrote:
> ...
> Now I have a Yuasa NP17-12I battery at the moment which is marked
> "valve regulated".
> ...
> What sort of life would you expect from a Yuasa ? It is now two
years old
> and seems to have plenty of capacity (it grinds away for ages !) but
not
> much initial oooomph !
>
According to Yuasa's web site, the NP series is unfortunately a deep
cycle battery, not a starting battery. You should have a battery
which has a cranking amps spec, such as the Odyssey.
Reg,
Fred F.
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