---------------------------------------------------------- Europa-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Wed 12/29/04: 16 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 01:36 AM - Re: Can one person maneuver the wings in the shop? (JohnDHeykoop@aol.com) 2. 01:52 AM - FW: Traffic on 25 - enjoy (Alan Burrows) 3. 06:57 AM - Re: Can one person maneuver the wings in the shop? (Chuck Popenoe) 4. 11:29 AM - Re: DOTHs Christmas Period (Duncan McFadyean) 5. 11:59 AM - Re: FWF Options (Duncan McFadyean) 6. 12:02 PM - Re: FWF Options (Duncan McFadyean) 7. 01:30 PM - FWF Options (NevEyre@aol.com) 8. 01:47 PM - LED Wingtip Lights (Andrew Sarangan) 9. 02:26 PM - Re: FWF Options (Tim Ward) 10. 03:20 PM - Re: FWF Options (Richard Holder) 11. 03:53 PM - Re: HD Starter (Cliff Shaw) 12. 04:08 PM - Re: LED Wingtip Lights () 13. 05:13 PM - Email Address (Troy Maynor) 14. 05:49 PM - Re: LED Wingtip Lights (EuropaXSA276@aol.com) 15. 06:40 PM - Re: LED Wingtip Lights (Andrew Sarangan) 16. 06:53 PM - Re: LED Wingtip Lights () ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 01:36:35 AM PST US From: JohnDHeykoop@aol.com Subject: Re: Europa-List: Can one person maneuver the wings in the shop? --> Europa-List message posted by: JohnDHeykoop@aol.com In a message dated 29/12/04 01:53:36 GMT Standard Time, asarangan@YAHOO.COM writes: > Just looking for ideas on how I can maneuver the wings during > construction. Initially I used saw horses and blocks of foam. However, the wings get a lor heavier after fitting the flaps and ailerons, and after nearly dropping a wing on the concrete garage floor I bought an engine hoist. By using the hoist I have been able to do everything on my own, including trial-fitting the wings to the fuselage. John Heykoop XS mono #536 G-JHKP Landing gear installed, and now starting on all the smaller jobs that need to be finished before I can put the top on. 1450 build hours to date. ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 01:52:52 AM PST US From: "Alan Burrows" Subject: Europa-List: FW: Traffic on 25 - enjoy --> Europa-List message posted by: "Alan Burrows" 'Twas the night before Christmas, and out on the ramp, Not an airplane was stirring, not even a Champ. The aircraft were fastened to tie downs with care, In hopes that come morning, they all would be there. The fuel trucks were nestled, all snug in their spots, With gusts from two-forty at 39 knots. I slumped at the fuel desk, now finally caught up, And settled down comfortably, resting my butt. When the radio lit up with much noise and chatter, I turned up the scanner to see what was the matter. A voice clearly heard over static and snow, Called for clearance to land at the airport below. He barked his transmission so lively and quick, I'd have sworn that the call sign he used was "St. Nick." I ran to the panel to turn up the lights, The better to welcome this magical flight. He called his position, no room for denial, "St. Nicholas One, turnin left onto final." And what to my wondering eyes should appear, But a Rutan-built sleigh, with eight Rotax Reindeer! With vectors to final, down the glideslope he came, As he passed all the fixes, he called them by name: "Now Ringo! Now Tolga! Now Trini! and Bacun! On Comet! On Cupid!", what pills was he takin? While controllers were sittin, and scratchin their head, They phoned to my office, and I heard it with dread, The message they left was both urgent and dour: "When Santa pulls in, have him please call the tower." He landed like silk, with the sled runners sparking, Then I heard "Left at Charlie," and "Taxi to parking." He slowed to a taxi, turned off of three-oh And stopped on the ramp with a "Ho, ho-ho-ho..." He stepped out of the sleigh, but before he could talk, I ran out to meet him with my best set of chocks. His red helmet and goggles were covered with frost, And his beard was all blackened from Reindeer exhaust. His breath smelled like peppermint, gone slightly stale, And he puffed on a pipe, but he didn't inhale. His cheeks were all rosy and jiggled like jelly, His boots were as black as a crop-duster's belly. He was chubby and plump, in his suit of bright red, And he asked me to "fill it up, with hundred low-lead." He came dashing in from the snow-covered pump, I knew he was anxious for drainin the sump. I spoke not a word, but went straight to my work, I filled up the sleigh, but I spilled, like a jerk. He came out of the restroom, and sighed in relief, Then he picked up a phone for a Flight Service brief. And I thought as he silently scribed in his log, These reindeer could land in an eighth-mile fog. He completed his preflight, from the front to the rear, Then he put on his headset, and I heard him yell, "Clear!" And laying a finger on his push-to-talk, He called up the tower for clearance and squawk. "Take taxi way Charlie, the southbound direction, Turn right three-two-zero at pilot's discretion" He sped down the runway, the best of the best, "Your traffic's a Europa , inbound from the West." Then I heard him proclaim, as he climbed thru the night, "Merry Christmas to all! I have traffic in sight." ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 06:57:56 AM PST US From: "Chuck Popenoe" Subject: RE: Europa-List: Can one person maneuver the wings in the shop? --> Europa-List message posted by: "Chuck Popenoe" With a plug-in wingtip trolley http://members.bellatlantic.net/~cpops/wingtiptrolley.htm single handed maneuvering of fully assembled wings is a snap. The wing is handled by the spar and may be switched from the wing caddy to the plane (and the reverse) with little time or trouble. I would have had a real problem without the trolley, as my wife has let me know emphatically that she doesn't much like to handle heavy wings! Pops A036 -----Original Message----- From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of JohnDHeykoop@aol.com Subject: Re: Europa-List: Can one person maneuver the wings in the shop? --> Europa-List message posted by: JohnDHeykoop@aol.com In a message dated 29/12/04 01:53:36 GMT Standard Time, asarangan@YAHOO.COM writes: > Just looking for ideas on how I can maneuver the wings during > construction. Initially I used saw horses and blocks of foam. However, the wings get a lor heavier after fitting the flaps and ailerons, and after nearly dropping a wing on the concrete garage floor I bought an engine hoist. By using the hoist I have been able to do everything on my own, including trial-fitting the wings to the fuselage. John Heykoop XS mono #536 G-JHKP Landing gear installed, and now starting on all the smaller jobs that need to be finished before I can put the top on. 1450 build hours to date. advertising on the Matronics Forums. ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 11:29:50 AM PST US From: "Duncan McFadyean" Subject: Re: Europa-List: DOTHs Christmas Period --> Europa-List message posted by: "Duncan McFadyean" I received one a few minutes later (at 8.53) but not one that was earlier. D. ----- Original Message ----- From: "William Mills" Subject: Re: Europa-List: DOTHs Christmas Period > --> Europa-List message posted by: "William Mills" > > Just sent you an email re airhood, but it didn't register in the "out box", > so please let me know if you didn't receive it. > Regards, > William > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Duncan McFadyean" > To: > Subject: Re: Europa-List: DOTHs Christmas Period > > > > --> Europa-List message posted by: "Duncan McFadyean" > > > > > Yes, but not before 29/12/04. > > > > Duncan. > > do not archive > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "William Mills" > > To: > > Subject: Europa-List: DOTHs Christmas Period > > > > > > > --> Europa-List message posted by: "William Mills" > > > > > > > > Anyone want to come out to play this week? > > > William > > > Do not archive > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 11:59:20 AM PST US From: "Duncan McFadyean" Subject: Re: Europa-List: FWF Options --> Europa-List message posted by: "Duncan McFadyean" <> About 180 lbs on the hook. i.e. with exhaust, rad., water, oil, oil tanks. Rgds., Duncan McF ----- Original Message ----- From: "Fred R. Klein" Subject: Re: Europa-List: FWF Options > --> Europa-List message posted by: "Fred R. Klein" > > Hey Mike, > > I can give you some short answers, but would prefer to hear from Neil > Varcoe; when I get comments on these issues from him, I'll pass them on. > > You ask, > > > Am I correct in my reading on this option is 75 lbs heavier that the Rotax? > > Alex and Neil say their CAM 125 weighs 231 lbs.; I don't know the weight of > the 912S or the 914. > > > Doesn't this penalty negate any baggage carrying? > > Alex's ship is approved for 1500 lb gross weight. > > > I would be interested in what the final cost of an install like this would > > save people that are looking at the Rotax. > > Though the CAM 125 still retails for US$11,250.00, Firewall Forward Aero > Engines, Alex Bowman, and Neil Varcoe have incurred significant development > costs which, if possible, they would like to recoup if a short "run" of > Europa installations are produced. Our present effort to get a group > together to move ahead is the result of some prodding by Tony Renshaw after > my postings some months ago. A price for a CAM 125 fwf package is not known > at this time. Alex and Neil have said before that they recognise that the > price would have to be comparable to the Rotax. My hunch is that the > comparatively low price of the CAM 125 engine will be offset by the > relatively high cost for the mods, special FG moldings and hardware. > Personally, I'm attracted more to the prospect of optimal performance and > trouble-free operation than I am to the possibility of significant cost > savings over the Rotax. > > At this time I have a list of six builders who have expressed an interest in > this endeavor; I spoke w/ Bob Masters of FWF today, and he's heard from two > more, so I'm optomistic that if the economics work, we'll be going ahead. > > BTW, what's your situation vis a vis powerplant? > > Fred > > > on 12/27/04 11:29 AM, DuaneFamly@aol.com at DuaneFamly@aol.com wrote: > > > --> Europa-List message posted by: DuaneFamly@aol.com > > > > Good morning Fred, > > > > Am I correct in my reading on this option is 75 lbs heavier that the Rotax? > > Doesn't this penalty negate any baggage carrying? However, I would be > > interested in what the final cost of an install like this would save people > > that are > > looking at the Rotax. > > > > Mike Duane A207 > > Redding, California > > XS Conventional Gear > > Just about to put the top on but still finding little things to do before > > that. > > ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 12:02:29 PM PST US From: "Duncan McFadyean" Subject: Re: Europa-List: FWF Options --> Europa-List message posted by: "Duncan McFadyean" <> Be interested to know how you've evaluated this! Of course, there are no known failures of the VTEC system itself; but that's in cars. Duncan McF. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Fred R. Klein" Subject: Re: Europa-List: FWF Options > --> Europa-List message posted by: "Fred R. Klein" > > Mike, > > You write and I comment: > > > I am getting the last little details taken > > care of in order to put the top of the canoe on. I keep going through the > > emails about things to do and reread the manual and I am still finding little > > things. > > I only wish I was as far along on my build!..and I'm sure the care and > attention to detail you're doing at this point will serve you well. > > > As for power plant, right now I am looking towards the 912S. I am not one to > > reinvent the wheel and take a pioneering risk of a new design unless I am > > getting a significant break on power, range, or cost. > > Well...I don't consider myself as a wheel-reinventor...though I taught > myself to fly 30 years ago in one of the very early foot-launched biplane > ultralights, my mantra at the time was to cautiously "manage the degree of > novelty" as I transitioned from pure hang gliding; that fit my definition of > "pioneering". In the case at hand, Alex and Neil have been the pioneers, but > even so, they've worked w/ an engine which has been around a while and the > basic Honda VTEC is sound. As I see it, w/ the CAM 125, I'm anticipating a > modest increase in power, some improvement in reliability, maintenance, and > tweaking which some (NOT ALL!) Rotaxes seem to need, and though costs have > yet to be determined precisely, I don't expect any savings. > > > My wife even talked me into a conventional gear so she would not be afraid of > > my landings in a mono. > > I share some of your wife's concerns; I'm giving some thought to going > conventional myself as I think of the satisfying feeling of nailing the > upwind wheel on the runway in a stiff crosswind (sigh)! > > Happy landings! > > Fred > A194 > > ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 01:30:49 PM PST US From: NevEyre@aol.com Subject: Europa-List: FWF Options --> Europa-List message posted by: NevEyre@aol.com Hi All, Watching the thread on FWF options.....just my two penny's worth.... For those of you wanting to ''save money'' by not going for the Rotax series of engines, that ''saving'' is going to cost you dearly.....either in time...or your life.... I have installed, and been involved in the setting up and testing of more than 20 Rotax's in 912 / 912S and 914 form, apart from the initial shakedown period, with a few minor tweaks and adjustments, they have all gone well, and needed virtually no remedial work on them to keep them going.I have maintained the ''Factory'' planes, apart from oil / filter changes, and looking at / cleaning the plugs, they have all run with hardly a glitch. Some out there have had problems with starter motors, we had a oil seal leak on a Turbo, [ which was fully rebuilt by a turbo repair shop for 270 pounds sterling, in 2 days], so where are the reliability problems ? Most of the ''problems'' I have heard about were down to poor installation / maintenence. If you go the Subaru route, you WILL have a failure at some point, the only question is WHEN ? [There was one a few weeks ago, airframe totalled, crew OK].This powerplant is too heavy, it , as I have mentioned before, will spoil the fine handling. The Honda system described, will also be too heavy [ despite it sitting well aft in the footwell]. I seem to remember a CAM / Honda system mooted a dozen or so years ago that was going to be ''the answer'' to every homebuilder's dream. What happened that time 'round ? The modified Automotive power unit salesman will quote you figures like'' these motors will go for 150,000 miles'' [ or some similar figure] but in a car, they are only running at about 40 percent power for the majority of that time. When you run them at figures around 90 percent / 100 percent, time will come down to HOURS ! [ I have raced cars and boats for years, everyone else in the pits had the same experience] The weight issue also needs to be looked at. Whilst you may be able to convince your Aviation Authority that you can fly at heavier weights, convincing gravity, and the materials in the airframe is a little harder ! Whilst the plane will fly at weights as high as 1700 lbs, again I say, you will have spoilt what could have been the nicest flying plane you may have flown. Here is a quick test for you. Go buy one of those electric free flight models, fly it around your local park, then add, say 15 percent weight in clay to it, and fly it again.[ Let me know how you got on ?} The structure has been tested[ with a ''composite construction'' factor added] for operations to 1370 lbs, again there is a very large reserve built in, but why deliberately eat into that ? With most of these ''wonder powerplants'', figure on tinkering for a couple of hours on the ground, for every hour in the air, this also applies to a certain six cylinder aircraft motor, you will need to be as good an engineer as you are a pilot to get high hours with that one [ it so happens, the person who champions that installation, over here in the UK, IS a good engineer]. I look with interest at all of the options, but everytime, the Rotax comes back on top. I have no ties with Rotax, just in case some of you think that may be the case. It just saddens me to see you guys [ and gals] put your money and time into something that may dissapoint you later[ and by then, you wouldn't admit it anyway ?] Stuff a Rotax on the front, [work at your day job a few hours longer each week to pay for it, if you have to], and go fly with what was intended. Cheers, Nev. ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 01:47:34 PM PST US From: Andrew Sarangan Subject: Europa-List: LED Wingtip Lights --> Europa-List message posted by: Andrew Sarangan So far I know of two sources for LED lights. CreativAir and GS-Air. Web sites are: http://www.creativair.com/ and http://www.gs-air.com CreativAir nav lights has to be mounted on the leading edge of the wingtip, and has the option of including a landing light. GS-Air nav lights must be mounted at the center of the wingtip, and includes a strobe and a rearward-looking white light, and it come in a preformed plexiglas housing. Are there other sources? Does Europa still sell the wingtip lenses? Which design would be most compatible with the Europa XS wing? I am looking for any general advice in this regard. Thanks everyone, and Happy New Year to everybody!! ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 02:26:35 PM PST US From: "Tim Ward" Subject: Re: Europa-List: FWF Options --> Europa-List message posted by: "Tim Ward" Well said Nev. All the best for the New Year. Seems like a Europa maybe just the thing to escape the potential force of a tsunami as well with a reliable engine that starts!! Cheers, Tim Tim Ward 12 Waiwetu Street, Fendalton, Christchurch, 8005 New Zealand. Ph +64 3 3515166 Mobile 021 0640221 ward.t@xtra.co.nz ----- Original Message ----- From: Subject: Europa-List: FWF Options > --> Europa-List message posted by: NevEyre@aol.com > > Hi All, > Watching the thread on FWF options.....just my two penny's worth.... > For those of you wanting to ''save money'' by not going for the Rotax > series > of engines, that ''saving'' is going to cost you dearly.....either in > time...or your life.... > I have installed, and been involved in the setting up and testing of more > than 20 Rotax's in 912 / 912S and 914 form, apart from the initial > shakedown > period, with a few minor tweaks and adjustments, they have all gone well, > and > needed virtually no remedial work on them to keep them going.I have > maintained the > ''Factory'' planes, apart from oil / filter changes, and looking at / > cleaning the plugs, they have all run with hardly a glitch. > Some out there have had problems with starter motors, we had a oil seal > leak > on a Turbo, [ which was fully rebuilt by a turbo repair shop for 270 > pounds > sterling, in 2 days], so where are the reliability problems ? Most of the > ''problems'' I have heard about were down to poor installation / > maintenence. > If you go the Subaru route, you WILL have a failure at some point, the > only > question is WHEN ? [There was one a few weeks ago, airframe totalled, crew > OK].This powerplant is too heavy, it , as I have mentioned before, will > spoil the > fine handling. > The Honda system described, will also be too heavy [ despite it sitting > well > aft in the footwell]. > I seem to remember a CAM / Honda system mooted a dozen or so years ago > that > was going to be ''the answer'' to every homebuilder's dream. What happened > that > time 'round ? > The modified Automotive power unit salesman will quote you figures like'' > these motors will go for 150,000 miles'' [ or some similar figure] but in > a car, > they are only running at about 40 percent power for the majority of that > time. > When you run them at figures around 90 percent / 100 percent, time will > come > down to HOURS ! [ I have raced cars and boats for years, everyone else in > the > pits had the same experience] > The weight issue also needs to be looked at. Whilst you may be able to > convince your Aviation Authority that you can fly at heavier weights, > convincing > gravity, and the materials in the airframe is a little harder ! > Whilst the plane will fly at weights as high as 1700 lbs, again I say, you > will have spoilt what could have been the nicest flying plane you may have > flown. Here is a quick test for you. Go buy one of those electric free > flight > models, fly it around your local park, then add, say 15 percent weight in > clay to > it, and fly it again.[ Let me know how you got on ?} > The structure has been tested[ with a ''composite construction'' factor > added] for operations to 1370 lbs, again there is a very large reserve > built in, > but why deliberately eat into that ? > With most of these ''wonder powerplants'', figure on tinkering for a > couple > of hours on the ground, for every hour in the air, this also applies to a > certain six cylinder aircraft motor, you will need to be as good an > engineer as > you are a pilot to get high hours with that one [ it so happens, the > person who > champions that installation, over here in the UK, IS a good engineer]. > I look with interest at all of the options, but everytime, the Rotax comes > back on top. > I have no ties with Rotax, just in case some of you think that may be the > case. It just saddens me to see you guys [ and gals] put your money and > time into > something that may dissapoint you later[ and by then, you wouldn't admit > it > anyway ?] > Stuff a Rotax on the front, [work at your day job a few hours longer each > week to pay for it, if you have to], and go fly with what was intended. > Cheers, > Nev. > > > ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 03:20:51 PM PST US Subject: Re: Europa-List: FWF Options From: Richard Holder --> Europa-List message posted by: Richard Holder > Well said Nev. > All the best for the New Year. > Seems like a Europa maybe just the thing to escape the potential force of a > tsunami as well with a reliable engine that starts!! > Cheers, > Tim The rider here is that if you have a 912S then you need the HD starter motor because within a few hours you will screw up your sprag clutch if you don't ! Mine starts beautifully now - absolutely on the button down to (so far) 2 degrees C, which is more than can be said for last winter. Rotax say the standard starter is OK if it is installed correctly (I believe they mean with short battery runs) and if you have a low inertia propellor. The Airmaster is NOT low inertia. Of course they would say that because any other statement (or the provision of the HD starter on all new 912Ss) would have several of us claiming a replacement starter from them - and indeed the price of a new sprag clutch. XS firewall forward set-up (even on a classic fuselage) can accept a HD clutch AND the starter and the sprag clutch can be changed without removing the engine. Or rather Adrian Lloyd at Shobdon can do it with his specialised tools. Classic firewall forward can't even accept the HD starter, and removing any starter involves removing the engine. Richard Richard F.W. Holder 01279 842804 (POTS) Bell House, Bell Lane, 01279 842942 (fax) Widford, Ware, Herts, 07860 367423 (mobile) SG12 8SH email : rholder@avnet.co.uk Europa Classic Tri-gear : G-OWWW, High Cross PA-28-181 : Piper Archer : G-JANA, EGSG (Stapleford) ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 03:53:16 PM PST US From: "Cliff Shaw" Subject: Europa-List: Re: HD Starter --> Europa-List message posted by: "Cliff Shaw" > > Rotax say the standard starter is OK if it is installed correctly (I > believe > they mean with short battery runs) and if you have a low inertia > propellor. > The Airmaster is NOT low inertia. All I second that and sugest that the type of battery is even more important. Don't scrimp on your battery. ODICY Is what I use. Cliff Shaw 1041 Euclid ave. Edmonds, WA 98020 425 776 5555 ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 04:08:53 PM PST US From: Subject: RE: Europa-List: LED Wingtip Lights --> Europa-List message posted by: Andrew Graham Singleton sells very nice XS wingtip lenses at a reasonable price. I have them and the Creative Air Leds. Tom Friedland -----Original Message----- From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Andrew Sarangan Subject: Europa-List: LED Wingtip Lights --> Europa-List message posted by: Andrew Sarangan So far I know of two sources for LED lights. CreativAir and GS-Air. Web sites are: http://www.creativair.com/ and http://www.gs-air.com CreativAir nav lights has to be mounted on the leading edge of the wingtip, and has the option of including a landing light. GS-Air nav lights must be mounted at the center of the wingtip, and includes a strobe and a rearward-looking white light, and it come in a preformed plexiglas housing. Are there other sources? Does Europa still sell the wingtip lenses? Which design would be most compatible with the Europa XS wing? I am looking for any general advice in this regard. Thanks everyone, and Happy New Year to everybody!! advertising on the Matronics Forums. -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 05:13:28 PM PST US From: "Troy Maynor" Subject: Europa-List: Email Address --> Europa-List message posted by: "Troy Maynor" Hi All, Does anyone know John Hurst's email address? (John are you out there?) Troy Maynor Do not archive ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 05:49:07 PM PST US From: EuropaXSA276@aol.com Subject: Re: Europa-List: LED Wingtip Lights --> Europa-List message posted by: EuropaXSA276@aol.com In a message dated 12/29/2004 3:48:38 PM Central Standard Time, asarangan@YAHOO.COM writes: So far I know of two sources for LED lights. CreativAir and GS-Air. Web sites are: http://www.creativair.com/ and http://www.gs-air.com I would be interested in hearing about anyone's experience with the GS-Air three in one position and strobe system. Brian Skelly Texas Europa # A276 TriGear See My build photos at: http://www.europaowners.org/BrianS ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 06:40:51 PM PST US From: Andrew Sarangan Subject: RE: Europa-List: LED Wingtip Lights --> Europa-List message posted by: Andrew Sarangan I thought that CreativAir LEDs came with its own housing. Did you have to dismantle it and install it in Graham's lens? Do you have a photo you could share? Thanks! --- beecho@beecho.org wrote: > --> Europa-List message posted by: > > Andrew > Graham Singleton sells very nice XS wingtip lenses at a reasonable > price. I > have them and the Creative Air Leds. > Tom Friedland > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Andrew > Sarangan > To: europa-list@matronics.com > Subject: Europa-List: LED Wingtip Lights > > > --> Europa-List message posted by: Andrew Sarangan > > > So far I know of two sources for LED lights. CreativAir and GS-Air. > Web > sites are: http://www.creativair.com/ and http://www.gs-air.com > CreativAir nav lights has to be mounted on the leading edge of the > wingtip, > and has the option of including a landing light. GS-Air nav lights > must be > mounted at the center of the wingtip, and includes a strobe and a > rearward-looking white light, and it come in a preformed plexiglas > housing. > > Are there other sources? > > Does Europa still sell the wingtip lenses? Which design would be most > compatible with the Europa XS wing? I am looking for any general > advice in > this regard. > > Thanks everyone, and Happy New Year to everybody!! > > > advertising on the Matronics Forums. > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > > > -- > No virus found in this outgoing message. > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > > > > > > > > > ===== Andrew Sarangan http://www.geocities.com/asarangan ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 06:53:50 PM PST US From: Subject: RE: Europa-List: LED Wingtip Lights --> Europa-List message posted by: Andrew As far as I know, Creative Air does not supply lenses. I have no photos because I have not yet cut the wingtips to install them. Graham has some very nice installation photos. I did not elect to put Creative Air landing lights in their units as I found it much less expensive to do my own with cheepo halogen lights from the auto supply store. Tom -----Original Message----- From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Andrew Sarangan Subject: RE: Europa-List: LED Wingtip Lights --> Europa-List message posted by: Andrew Sarangan I thought that CreativAir LEDs came with its own housing. Did you have to dismantle it and install it in Graham's lens? Do you have a photo you could share? Thanks! --- beecho@beecho.org wrote: > --> Europa-List message posted by: > > Andrew > Graham Singleton sells very nice XS wingtip lenses at a reasonable > price. I have them and the Creative Air Leds. > Tom Friedland > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Andrew > Sarangan > To: europa-list@matronics.com > Subject: Europa-List: LED Wingtip Lights > > > --> Europa-List message posted by: Andrew Sarangan > > > So far I know of two sources for LED lights. CreativAir and GS-Air. > Web sites are: http://www.creativair.com/ and http://www.gs-air.com > CreativAir nav lights has to be mounted on the leading edge of the > wingtip, > and has the option of including a landing light. GS-Air nav lights > must be > mounted at the center of the wingtip, and includes a strobe and a > rearward-looking white light, and it come in a preformed plexiglas > housing. > > Are there other sources? > > Does Europa still sell the wingtip lenses? Which design would be most > compatible with the Europa XS wing? I am looking for any general > advice in this regard. > > Thanks everyone, and Happy New Year to everybody!! > > > advertising on the Matronics Forums. > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > > > -- > No virus found in this outgoing message. > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > > > > > > > > > ===== Andrew Sarangan http://www.geocities.com/asarangan advertising on the Matronics Forums. -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.