Europa-List Digest Archive

Wed 01/12/05


Total Messages Posted: 30



Today's Message Index:
----------------------
 
     1. 12:52 AM - Rotax 912S Carb Heater (Brian Davies)
     2. 01:59 AM - Re: Rotax 912S Carb Heater (Richard Holder)
     3. 02:13 AM - Autopilot Advice (Alan Burrows)
     4. 02:32 AM - Brake Pipes (Alan Burrows)
     5. 02:34 AM - Re: Rotax 912S Carb Heater (Pete Lawless)
     6. 03:03 AM - Re: Rotax 912S Carb Heater (Brian Davies)
     7. 03:03 AM - Re: Autopilot Advice (Tony Renshaw)
     8. 03:15 AM - Re: Rotax 912S Carb Heater (Richard Iddon)
     9. 04:28 AM - Brake pipes (ivor.phillips)
    10. 06:20 AM - Re: Autopilot Advice (Ken Stribling)
    11. 06:54 AM - Re: Brake Pipes (Fred Fillinger)
    12. 07:00 AM - Re: Autopilot Advice ()
    13. 07:19 AM - Brake pipes (Peter Field)
    14. 08:06 AM - Re: Brake Pipes (Rob Housman)
    15. 08:50 AM - Re: Autopilot Advice (Fred Fillinger)
    16. 09:17 AM - Re: DOTH tomorrow or Friday? (William Mills)
    17. 09:58 AM - Re: Autopilot Advice (Alan Burrows)
    18. 11:23 AM - Re: Brake Pipes (Rowland Carson)
    19. 11:42 AM - 914 wastegate (Tony Krzyzewski)
    20. 01:07 PM - Exhaust pipe flanges - 912S (Sidsel & Svein Johnsen)
    21. 01:45 PM - Re: Autopilot Advice (R.C.Harrison)
    22. 01:52 PM - Re: Rotax 912S Carb Heater (Richard Holder)
    23. 02:10 PM - Re: Rotax 912S Carb Heater (Duncan McFadyean)
    24. 02:24 PM - Re: Rotax 912S Carb Heater (William Mills)
    25. 03:22 PM - Re: DOTH tomorrow or Friday? (R.C.Harrison)
    26. 07:21 PM - Re: Rudder deflection (Fergus Kyle)
    27. 10:18 PM - Squeezing solid rivets (Andrew Sarangan)
    28. 11:15 PM - Re: Exhaust pipe flanges - 912S (nigel charles)
    29. 11:22 PM - Re: Squeezing solid rivets (nigel charles)
    30. 11:48 PM - Re: Squeezing solid rivets (R.C.Harrison)
 
 
 


Message 1


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    Time: 12:52:16 AM PST US
    From: "Brian Davies" <bdavies@dircon.co.uk>
    Subject: Rotax 912S Carb Heater
    --> Europa-List message posted by: "Brian Davies" <bdavies@dircon.co.uk> I have just purchased the Skydrive Coolant Carburetter heater CH-912-3. I see from the instructions that this requires PFA approval. Is there a standard PFA mod number for this or do we have to apply individually @ =A345 a time+weeks of paperwork. Brian Davies kit 454 Mono XS Painting just about finished.


    Message 2


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    Time: 01:59:54 AM PST US
    Subject: Re: Rotax 912S Carb Heater
    From: Richard Holder <rholder@avnet.co.uk>
    --> Europa-List message posted by: Richard Holder <rholder@avnet.co.uk> Brian I just bought it too. I checked with the PFA and they say it is a "standard option" on the 912S and does not require "PFA modification action". I could forward their email if you wish. On the other hand I found that the heater wasn't ready to slide onto the spigot in any sensible way so I have had to send the carbs and the heaters to Skydrive to fit. It didn't feel right so I ducked it :-( I await their return. Richard Richard F.W. Holder 01279 842804 (POTS) Bell House, Bell Lane, 01279 842942 (fax) Widford, Ware, Herts, 07860 367423 (mobile) SG12 8SH email : richard.holder@avnet.co.uk ++++++++ Please note new email address ++++++++ Europa Classic Tri-gear : G-OWWW, High Cross PA-28-181 : Piper Archer : G-JANA, EGSG (Stapleford) > --> Europa-List message posted by: "Brian Davies" <bdavies@dircon.co.uk> > > I have just purchased the Skydrive Coolant Carburetter heater CH-912-3. I see > from the instructions that this requires PFA approval. Is there a standard PFA > mod number for this or do we have to apply individually @ =A345 a time+weeks > of paperwork. > > Brian Davies kit 454 Mono XS > > Painting just about finished. > > > > > > >


    Message 3


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    Time: 02:13:34 AM PST US
    From: "Alan Burrows" <alan@kestrel-insurance.com>
    Subject: Autopilot Advice
    --> Europa-List message posted by: "Alan Burrows" <alan@kestrel-insurance.com> Ok guys I am down to a choice of two. It's either the Trutrak or the E-Z Pilot anybody have any plus or minus points about either ? I want to ideally track GPS and VOR's (I have an Apollo 30 installed) if that's possible with either unit. All comments gratefully appreciated. Many Thanks Alan


    Message 4


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    Time: 02:32:39 AM PST US
    From: "Alan Burrows" <alan@kestrel-insurance.com>
    Subject: Brake Pipes
    --> Europa-List message posted by: "Alan Burrows" <alan@kestrel-insurance.com> Has anyone got any better solution than the standard plastic pipes used on the Trigear finger brakes. I am thinking of using copper is that the best option or is there something better? Many Thanks Alan


    Message 5


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    Time: 02:34:38 AM PST US
    From: "Pete Lawless" <pete@lawless.info>
    Subject: Rotax 912S Carb Heater
    --> Europa-List message posted by: "Pete Lawless" <pete@lawless.info> Hi I think the 'not fitting' is a standard feature! Mine required some work with a file on the carbs to get them a little less of a square peg and able to fit into the round hole. Another Europa owner on the field had similar problems. However, they do work well and its great not having to remember to turn the thing on and off all the time. Regards Pete -----Original Message----- From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard Holder Subject: Re: Europa-List: Rotax 912S Carb Heater --> Europa-List message posted by: Richard Holder <rholder@avnet.co.uk> Brian I just bought it too. I checked with the PFA and they say it is a "standard option" on the 912S and does not require "PFA modification action". I could forward their email if you wish. On the other hand I found that the heater wasn't ready to slide onto the spigot in any sensible way so I have had to send the carbs and the heaters to Skydrive to fit. It didn't feel right so I ducked it :-( I await their return. Richard Richard F.W. Holder 01279 842804 (POTS) Bell House, Bell Lane, 01279 842942 (fax) Widford, Ware, Herts, 07860 367423 (mobile) SG12 8SH email : richard.holder@avnet.co.uk ++++++++ Please note new email address ++++++++ Europa Classic Tri-gear : G-OWWW, High Cross PA-28-181 : Piper Archer : G-JANA, EGSG (Stapleford) > --> Europa-List message posted by: "Brian Davies" > --> <bdavies@dircon.co.uk> > > I have just purchased the Skydrive Coolant Carburetter heater > CH-912-3. I see from the instructions that this requires PFA > approval. Is there a standard PFA mod number for this or do we have to > apply individually @ =A345 a time+weeks of paperwork. > > Brian Davies kit 454 Mono XS > > Painting just about finished. > > > > > > > -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.


    Message 6


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    Time: 03:03:38 AM PST US
    From: "Brian Davies" <bdavies@dircon.co.uk>
    Subject: Re: Rotax 912S Carb Heater
    --> Europa-List message posted by: "Brian Davies" <bdavies@dircon.co.uk> Thanks for the tip Richard. Brian ----- Original Message ----- From: "Richard Holder" <rholder@avnet.co.uk> Subject: Re: Europa-List: Rotax 912S Carb Heater > --> Europa-List message posted by: Richard Holder <rholder@avnet.co.uk> > > Brian > > I just bought it too. I checked with the PFA and they say it is a "standard > option" on the 912S and does not require "PFA modification action". I could > forward their email if you wish. > > On the other hand I found that the heater wasn't ready to slide onto the > spigot in any sensible way so I have had to send the carbs and the heaters > to Skydrive to fit. It didn't feel right so I ducked it :-( I await their > return. > > Richard > Richard F.W. Holder 01279 842804 (POTS) > Bell House, Bell Lane, 01279 842942 (fax) > Widford, Ware, Herts, 07860 367423 (mobile) > SG12 8SH email : richard.holder@avnet.co.uk > ++++++++ Please note new email address ++++++++ > Europa Classic Tri-gear : G-OWWW, High Cross > PA-28-181 : Piper Archer : G-JANA, EGSG (Stapleford) > > > > --> Europa-List message posted by: "Brian Davies" <bdavies@dircon.co.uk> > > > > I have just purchased the Skydrive Coolant Carburetter heater CH-912-3. I see > > from the instructions that this requires PFA approval. Is there a standard PFA > > mod number for this or do we have to apply individually @ =A345 a time+weeks > > of paperwork. > > > > Brian Davies kit 454 Mono XS > > > > Painting just about finished. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >


    Message 7


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    Time: 03:03:45 AM PST US
    From: Tony Renshaw <tonyrenshaw@optusnet.com.au>
    Subject: Re: Autopilot Advice
    --> Europa-List message posted by: Tony Renshaw <tonyrenshaw@optusnet.com.au> Alan, Do yourself a favor and ring Chuck Busch of Trio. He is a genuine fellow, with a wealth of information. Every negative you can think of has been considered and even simple things like the 2 second refresh rate of a handheld GPS using a NMEA 0183? data stream, in a turn to a given flight planned track or ground track course, has been software modified to negate the inaccuracy. He has 25,000 lines of code, so suffice to say I don't think there is anything he hasn't thought about. He certainly gives me that impression from my meeting. Worth a phone call I reckon, and he will explain to you everything you want to know. It took 10 e-mails with worthy responses before I was convinced, and my gut feel rewarded upon my personal collection of my componentry. Reg Tony Renshaw Sydney P.S. There are those that might choose to call the servo old technology used by Trio. It is, but it isn't standard, and there is a very detailed explanation of why it is better. It is way beyond my understanding, but if you have the knowledge, Chuck has the explanation. The head of the autopilot is streaks ahead, and the accuracy ontrack is consistently less than .01 of a mile as I recall. His target tracking was +/- .1 of a mile, but tests prove it 10 times better than initially targetted. At 09:15 PM 1/12/2005, you wrote: >--> Europa-List message posted by: "Alan Burrows" <alan@kestrel-insurance.com> > >Ok guys I am down to a choice of two. It's either the Trutrak or the E-Z >Pilot anybody have any plus or minus points about either ? >I want to ideally track GPS and VOR's (I have an Apollo 30 installed) if >that's possible with either unit. >All comments gratefully appreciated. >Many Thanks > >Alan > >


    Message 8


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    Time: 03:15:22 AM PST US
    From: "Richard Iddon" <riddon@sent.com>
    Subject: Rotax 912S Carb Heater
    --> Europa-List message posted by: "Richard Iddon" <riddon@sent.com> I was also thinking of fitting these heaters but was a little put off by seeing one Europa which had overheated a little. This caused a pipe feeding the heater to blow off a T piece and all the coolant to drain out. The aircraft did fly for a while with no coolant but the engine subsequently had to be replaced. Anyone else had or heard of any problems with the coolant carb heaters? Richard Iddon G-RIXS -----Original Message----- From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Pete Lawless Subject: RE: Europa-List: Rotax 912S Carb Heater --> Europa-List message posted by: "Pete Lawless" <pete@lawless.info> Hi I think the 'not fitting' is a standard feature! Mine required some work with a file on the carbs to get them a little less of a square peg and able to fit into the round hole. Another Europa owner on the field had similar problems. However, they do work well and its great not having to remember to turn the thing on and off all the time. Regards Pete


    Message 9


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    Time: 04:28:30 AM PST US
    From: "ivor.phillips" <ivor.phillips@ntlworld.com>
    Subject: Brake pipes
    --> Europa-List message posted by: "ivor.phillips" <ivor.phillips@ntlworld.com> I have used Copper- Nickel 90/10 seamless brake pipe throughout except for the run from the reservoir to the master cylinder, Plastic is o/k for this. If correctly supported and clipped it will outlast the airframe IMHO It will take 3100 psi before rupture, so no contest as far as i am concerned, Ivor Phillips XS486 London UK : "Alan Burrows" <Sent: Wednesday, January 12, 2005 10:34 AM Subject: Europa-List: Brake Pipes > --> > > Has anyone got any better solution than the standard plastic pipes used > on the Trigear finger brakes. I am thinking of using copper is that the > best option or is there something better? > Many Thanks >


    Message 10


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    Time: 06:20:14 AM PST US
    From: "Ken Stribling" <ken@striblingranch.com>
    Subject: Autopilot Advice
    --> Europa-List message posted by: "Ken Stribling" <ken@striblingranch.com> I have been flying a RV-6 while building my XS and I can tell you that when I get ready for the auto pilot in my plane it will have an altitude hold on it. I would rather have the altitude hold rather than wings level they change altitude fast especially if you are looking at scenery and not paying attention on long trips. Just my opinion. Ken Stribling -----Original Message----- From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Alan Burrows Subject: Europa-List: Autopilot Advice --> Europa-List message posted by: "Alan Burrows" <alan@kestrel-insurance.com> Ok guys I am down to a choice of two. It's either the Trutrak or the E-Z Pilot anybody have any plus or minus points about either ? I want to ideally track GPS and VOR's (I have an Apollo 30 installed) if that's possible with either unit. All comments gratefully appreciated. Many Thanks Alan


    Message 11


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    Time: 06:54:13 AM PST US
    From: "Fred Fillinger" <n3eu@comcast.net>
    Subject: Re: Brake Pipes
    --> Europa-List message posted by: "Fred Fillinger" <n3eu@comcast.net> > Has anyone got any better solution than the standard plastic pipes used > on the Trigear finger brakes. I am thinking of using copper is that the > best option or is there something better? > Many Thanks > > Alan On the trigear, I don't think you want to use copper, because it work hardens, no? It will flex at the fuselage and down at the caliper, plus during maintenance. I used 3003 aluminum, which is lighter anyway and won't turn an ugly green where exposed to the elements. Reg, Fred F.


    Message 12


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    Time: 07:00:32 AM PST US
    From: <peter.rees05@ntlworld.com>
    Subject: Re: Autopilot Advice
    --> Europa-List message posted by: <peter.rees05@ntlworld.com> Hi Alan Weve chatted about this quite a bit off list but for my money, the EZ pilot wins every time (I must get round to starting off the PFA Mod process for fitting ours). Within a few quid, the EZ Piot and Truetrack units are the same price, neither can be fitted under existing recognised mods so, all is equal so far but, look at the features that the EZ pilot offers - I particularly like the 'get me out of IMC' button - just press and hold for 3 seconds - Autopilot comes on, turns you through 180 degrees (in a turn of programmable rate - potential navid owners please note). I've been in contact with the guys at Trio and to be honest, they couldn't be more helpful. I'm want to interface the unit to a skyforce CM2000 - a somewhat obscure colour GPS - Trio say I can send them the GPS and they'll try it or, I can capture the data output and send them the file - the say that if they can make it work, the will. I have no idea how Navaids have kept the stronghold on the market with their valve operated unit (well almost!) - its time for a change! I assume where you are is still covered by the PFA? Im looking to fit one of these, someone else on the list has contacted me about doing the same could we work collectively (or better still, could the europa club take on the unit under their existing / a new mod?) there is no doubt that the unit looks to be the most modern, feature packed offering in the price bracket. I mooted the idea if Europa supplying it as a factory mod with all the requsite hardware to Andy Draper yesterday - he sounded quite enthusiastic about the idea - maybe some pressure there may be of use. ----------------------------------------- Email provided by http://www.ntlhome.com/


    Message 13


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    Time: 07:19:41 AM PST US
    Subject: Brake pipes
    From: "Peter Field" <Peter.Field@hgfield.co.uk>
    --> Europa-List message posted by: "Peter Field" <Peter.Field@hgfield.co.uk> Alan, We discarded the black plastic tube and substituted it with steel braided pipe as used in the performance automotive world. It does require you to change all the fittings but is a very elegant solution to the problem as it offers both strength and flexibility. The supplier we used can be contacted on WWW.thinkauto.com Peter Field


    Message 14


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    Time: 08:06:27 AM PST US
    From: "Rob Housman" <robh@hyperion-ef.us>
    Subject: Brake Pipes
    --> Europa-List message posted by: "Rob Housman" <robh@hyperion-ef.us> Regardless of the material you choose be certain that you use seamless tubing. There are three manufacturing methods used to make hollow shapes. The cheap way is to form a tube from sheet stock and weld the seam (yuk!), a better way is to extrude over a spider die which still has seams at the microstructural level, and the right way for pressure applications is to extrude the metal over a mandrel that is punched through the billet creating a monolithic tube with no seam. Extruded tube is cold drawn to final size. I used brass inside the fuselage and stainless steel on the exterior. McMaster-Carr was my source: Brass Tubing .085" ID, 1/8" OD, .020" Wall, 6' Length, P/N 8950K51 Type 316 Stainless Steel Seamless Tubing 1/8" OD, .085" ID, .02" Wall, P/N 89785K811 There were times while attempting to get the bends oriented correctly that I doubted the wisdom of using rigid metallic tube rather than the factory supplied, very flexible, easy to install plastic. Each time I questioned my choice I remembered how my Lotus caught fire when the plastic hydraulic clutch line ruptured and dumped brake fluid on the exhaust pipe, and my doubts went away. Buy extra lengths of tubing because unless you are an expert at tube bending you will make mistakes. ...and Fred F. is correct that brass will work harden, but so does aluminum and stainless steel. I doubt that there can be sufficient flexure to cause a metallic brake line to fail (if the gear legs flex enough to fracture the brake lines you've got worse problems to worry about). Best regards, Rob Housman Europa XS Tri-Gear A070 Airframe complete Irvine, CA -----Original Message----- From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Alan Burrows Subject: Europa-List: Brake Pipes --> Europa-List message posted by: "Alan Burrows" <alan@kestrel-insurance.com> Has anyone got any better solution than the standard plastic pipes used on the Trigear finger brakes. I am thinking of using copper is that the best option or is there something better? Many Thanks Alan


    Message 15


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    Time: 08:50:33 AM PST US
    From: "Fred Fillinger" <n3eu@comcast.net>
    Subject: Re: Autopilot Advice
    --> Europa-List message posted by: "Fred Fillinger" <n3eu@comcast.net> > --> Europa-List message posted by: <peter.rees05@ntlworld.com> > I particularly like the 'get me out of IMC' button - just press and > hold for 3 seconds - Autopilot comes on, turns you through 180 degrees.... I don't wish to start a debate over the concept of....if you need an autopilot to 180 out of IMC...and arguable wisdom of periodic dual instruction in that regard. :-) IMO, the issue is how well the thing will do the job in turbulence, as an instrument-rated pilot knows any +/- excursions from what you want it to do don't mean anything. There's conditions where turning the aircraft as per ATC or the approach plate is easier to do manually, since there's simply less thinking to do in the instrument scan. But for a VFR-only pilot, those excursions might be disconcerting, the first of a chain of events potentially leading to a "problem." With such a feature, I think it would be good to thoroughly and periodically test it in turbulence, to get used to what the panel instruments will be doing, so as to better monitor how well the autopilot is bailing you out. Just like an IR pilot would do, with that box optionally doing what the subconscious brain has been trained to do. Reg, Fred F.


    Message 16


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    Time: 09:17:31 AM PST US
    From: "William Mills" <combined.merchants@virgin.net>
    Subject: Re: DOTH tomorrow or Friday?
    --> Europa-List message posted by: "William Mills" <combined.merchants@virgin.net> All midweek DOTHers, The weather still looks good for tomorrow and perhaps also for Friday, but nobody has expressed an interest so far. The choice is Pilot: Beccles, Huddersfield, Sandtoft, Seething, Tatenhill and Flyer: Bodmin, Enstone, and Tatenhill. Anyone interested please drop me a line, or give me a call on 01495 785499. Best wishes, William Do not archive ----- Original Message ----- From: "William Mills" <combined.merchants@virgin.net> Subject: Europa-List: DOTH this week? > --> Europa-List message posted by: "William Mills" <combined.merchants@virgin.net> > > Anyone feel like a DOTH this week? Thursday looks like the best day. Please let me know, > Regards, > William > >


    Message 17


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    Time: 09:58:49 AM PST US
    From: "Alan Burrows" <alan@kestrel-insurance.com>
    Subject: Autopilot Advice
    --> Europa-List message posted by: "Alan Burrows" <alan@kestrel-insurance.com> I whole heartily agree with that. As an IMC rated pilot(not full instrument rated) I am able to fly in IMC conditions with relative ease, when hand flying, trying to stay ahead of where I am going, dealing with ATC and then studying the approach plates add to that a bit of good old fashioned turbulence and you can image things get a little busy. For me the purpose of an autopilot is to ease the workload and free up some space in my limited brain capacity, thus making the whole process less stressful, so the 180 option, whilst not particularly important to me, could potentially be dangerous if it leads a VFR pilot to be over confident where IMC conditions prevail. There is no electronic or mechanical substitute for actually getting practice in IMC conditions with a suitably qualified person on board of course. Alan -----Original Message----- From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Fred Fillinger Subject: Re: Europa-List: Autopilot Advice --> Europa-List message posted by: "Fred Fillinger" <n3eu@comcast.net> > --> Europa-List message posted by: <peter.rees05@ntlworld.com> > I particularly like the 'get me out of IMC' button - just press and > hold for 3 seconds - Autopilot comes on, turns you through 180 degrees.... I don't wish to start a debate over the concept of....if you need an autopilot to 180 out of IMC...and arguable wisdom of periodic dual instruction in that regard. :-) IMO, the issue is how well the thing will do the job in turbulence, as an instrument-rated pilot knows any +/- excursions from what you want it to do don't mean anything. There's conditions where turning the aircraft as per ATC or the approach plate is easier to do manually, since there's simply less thinking to do in the instrument scan. But for a VFR-only pilot, those excursions might be disconcerting, the first of a chain of events potentially leading to a "problem." With such a feature, I think it would be good to thoroughly and periodically test it in turbulence, to get used to what the panel instruments will be doing, so as to better monitor how well the autopilot is bailing you out. Just like an IR pilot would do, with that box optionally doing what the subconscious brain has been trained to do. Reg, Fred F.


    Message 18


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    Time: 11:23:26 AM PST US
    From: Rowland Carson <rowil@clara.net>
    Subject: Re: Brake Pipes
    --> Europa-List message posted by: Rowland Carson <rowil@clara.net> At 2005-01-12 10:34 +0000 Alan Burrows wrote: >Has anyone got any better solution than the standard plastic pipes used >on the Trigear finger brakes. I am thinking of using copper is that the >best option or is there something better? Alan - I'd be wary of using copper in any situation of potential vibration or flexing, because of its tendency to work-harden and then fracture. I'm guessing that the racing car people will have solutions, probably in aluminium - but I have no specific knowledge to offer, sorry! regards Rowland -- | Rowland Carson PFA #16532 <http://home.clara.net/rowil/aviation/> | 740 hours building Europa #435 G-ROWI e-mail <rowil@clara.net>


    Message 19


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    Time: 11:42:55 AM PST US
    Subject: 914 wastegate
    From: "Tony Krzyzewski" <tonyk@kaon.co.nz>
    Received-SPF: none 0.26 UPPERCASE_25_50 message body is 25-50% uppercase --> Europa-List message posted by: "Tony Krzyzewski" <tonyk@kaon.co.nz> Is the 914 wastegate closed when the wastegaste actuating arm on the front of the turbo is to starboard (ie vertical) or to port? Regards Tony


    Message 20


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    Time: 01:07:29 PM PST US
    From: "Sidsel & Svein Johnsen" <sidsel.svein@oslo.online.no>
    Subject: Exhaust pipe flanges - 912S
    --> Europa-List message posted by: "Sidsel & Svein Johnsen" <sidsel.svein@oslo.online.no> Just a word of caution if you are not already past this stage: The Rotax 912S installation manual states a torque range for the M8 nuts that hold the exhaust pipes in place against the cylinder heads. When you torque the nuts, you will notice that the flanges (the ones held in place by the bolts and nuts, not the bevelled flanges welded to the pipes) begin to bend before you reach the lower limit of the torque stated by Rotax. Do not apply more torque! The flanges (and the rest of the exhaust system) are NOT Rotax parts, and evidently don't take the Rotax stated torque without bending. I checked this with Andy today: It is difficult to explain why Rotax keep stating the torque when the nuts are check-nuts and therefore do not require a minimum torque to stay put. The nuts should, according to Andy, only be torqued to give a tight connection, to avoid exhaust leaks. There is no proven need to torque more, the system will stay in place even though this connection to the cylinder heads is the only place where the entire exhaust system is anchored to the engine. Andy will place a note about this in the next Tech Talk column in the Europa Flyer, and in the f.w. forward manual at next revision. Make a note yourself, already now! Regards, Svein A225 XS Trigear - now in Norway


    Message 21


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    Time: 01:45:31 PM PST US
    From: "R.C.Harrison" <ptag.dev@tiscali.co.uk>
    Subject: Autopilot Advice
    --> Europa-List message posted by: "R.C.Harrison" <ptag.dev@tiscali.co.uk> Hi! Ken I hope you manage to find time to look forward if I'm around ? Best regards for safe flying in 2005 Bob Harrison G-PTAG Europa MKI/Jabiru 3300 Do not archive -----Original Message----- From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ken Stribling Subject: RE: Europa-List: Autopilot Advice --> Europa-List message posted by: "Ken Stribling" <ken@striblingranch.com> I have been flying a RV-6 while building my XS and I can tell you that when I get ready for the auto pilot in my plane it will have an altitude hold on it. I would rather have the altitude hold rather than wings level they change altitude fast especially if you are looking at scenery and not paying attention on long trips. Just my opinion. Ken Stribling


    Message 22


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    Time: 01:52:00 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: Rotax 912S Carb Heater
    From: Richard Holder <rholder@avnet.co.uk>
    --> Europa-List message posted by: Richard Holder <rholder@avnet.co.uk> > I was also thinking of fitting these heaters but was a little put off by > seeing one Europa which had overheated a little. This caused a pipe > feeding the heater to blow off a T piece and all the coolant to drain > out. The aircraft did fly for a while with no coolant but the engine > subsequently had to be replaced. Anyone else had or heard of any > problems with the coolant carb heaters? > > Richard Iddon G-RIXS To be fair this doesn't sound like a problem with the carb heater but with the installation of the same. There are a total of 10 additional jubilee clips to be used, and they have all got to be tight ! SkyDrive turned round my heater to carb fitment this morning and the cost was less than the postage there and back ! So I recommend that if you have any doubt you get SkyDrive to do it. Actually I should have driven it up to Southam and I expect they would have done it while I waited. It would have cost less in fuel than the postage ! Richard Richard F.W. Holder 01279 842804 (POTS) Bell House, Bell Lane, 01279 842942 (fax) Widford, Ware, Herts, 07860 367423 (mobile) SG12 8SH email : richard.holder@avnet.co.uk Europa Classic Tri-gear : G-OWWW, High Cross PA-28-181 : Piper Archer : G-JANA, EGSG (Stapleford)


    Message 23


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    Time: 02:10:21 PM PST US
    From: "Duncan McFadyean" <ami@mcfadyean.freeserve.co.uk>
    Subject: Re: Rotax 912S Carb Heater
    --> Europa-List message posted by: "Duncan McFadyean" <ami@mcfadyean.freeserve.co.uk> <<There are a total of 10 additional jubilee > clips to be used, and they have all got to be tight !>> Its not just the tightness, but also the absence of any sensible barb or joggle on the end of some of the pipe fittings in the kit! Duncan McF. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Richard Holder" <rholder@avnet.co.uk> Subject: Re: Europa-List: Rotax 912S Carb Heater > --> Europa-List message posted by: Richard Holder <rholder@avnet.co.uk> > > > I was also thinking of fitting these heaters but was a little put off by > > seeing one Europa which had overheated a little. This caused a pipe > > feeding the heater to blow off a T piece and all the coolant to drain > > out. The aircraft did fly for a while with no coolant but the engine > > subsequently had to be replaced. Anyone else had or heard of any > > problems with the coolant carb heaters? > > > > Richard Iddon G-RIXS > > To be fair this doesn't sound like a problem with the carb heater but with > the installation of the same. There are a total of 10 additional jubilee > clips to be used, and they have all got to be tight ! > > SkyDrive turned round my heater to carb fitment this morning and the cost > was less than the postage there and back ! > > So I recommend that if you have any doubt you get SkyDrive to do it. > > Actually I should have driven it up to Southam and I expect they would have > done it while I waited. It would have cost less in fuel than the postage ! > > Richard > Richard F.W. Holder 01279 842804 (POTS) > Bell House, Bell Lane, 01279 842942 (fax) > Widford, Ware, Herts, 07860 367423 (mobile) > SG12 8SH email : richard.holder@avnet.co.uk > Europa Classic Tri-gear : G-OWWW, High Cross > PA-28-181 : Piper Archer : G-JANA, EGSG (Stapleford) > >


    Message 24


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    Time: 02:24:18 PM PST US
    From: "William Mills" <combined.merchants@virgin.net>
    Subject: Re: Rotax 912S Carb Heater
    --> Europa-List message posted by: "William Mills" <combined.merchants@virgin.net> Richard, The early Tee pieces had no ridges to grip the pipe, but this was subsequently changed for a correct fitting. Perhaps Darry's was the early version and was never changed. My carb heater has worked successfully for about 650 hours now and I certainly would not be without it. Regards, William ----- Original Message ----- From: "Richard Iddon" <riddon@sent.com> Subject: RE: Europa-List: Rotax 912S Carb Heater > --> Europa-List message posted by: "Richard Iddon" <riddon@sent.com> > > I was also thinking of fitting these heaters but was a little put off by > seeing one Europa which had overheated a little. This caused a pipe > feeding the heater to blow off a T piece and all the coolant to drain > out. The aircraft did fly for a while with no coolant but the engine > subsequently had to be replaced. Anyone else had or heard of any > problems with the coolant carb heaters? > > Richard Iddon G-RIXS > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Pete > Lawless > To: europa-list@matronics.com > Subject: RE: Europa-List: Rotax 912S Carb Heater > > --> Europa-List message posted by: "Pete Lawless" <pete@lawless.info> > > Hi > > I think the 'not fitting' is a standard feature! Mine required some > work with a file on the carbs to get them a little less of a square peg > and able to fit into the round hole. Another Europa owner on the field > had similar problems. > > However, they do work well and its great not having to remember to turn > the thing on and off all the time. > > Regards > > Pete > >


    Message 25


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    Time: 03:22:31 PM PST US
    From: "R.C.Harrison" <ptag.dev@tiscali.co.uk>
    Subject: DOTH tomorrow or Friday?
    --> Europa-List message posted by: "R.C.Harrison" <ptag.dev@tiscali.co.uk> Hi! William G-PTAG Still grounded but now with a tank inspection/mop out hole in the tank top! Shouldn't be too long now.! Regards Bob H Do not archive Robt.C.Harrison -----Original Message----- From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of William Mills Subject: Re: Europa-List: DOTH tomorrow or Friday? --> Europa-List message posted by: "William Mills" <combined.merchants@virgin.net> All midweek DOTHers, The weather still looks good for tomorrow and perhaps also for Friday, but nobody has expressed an interest so far.


    Message 26


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    Time: 07:21:30 PM PST US
    From: "Fergus Kyle" <VE3LVO@rac.ca>
    Subject: Re: Rudder deflection
    --> Europa-List message posted by: "Fergus Kyle" <VE3LVO@rac.ca> Garrett, Don't think it was 20mm but in the ballpark. Do as the others say and don't forget some space for paint. Good Luck Ferg ----- Original Message ----- From: "Garry Copeland" <garrett.copeland@btinternet.com> Subject: Europa-List: Rudder deflection | --> Europa-List message posted by: "Garry Copeland" <garrett.copeland@btinternet.com> | | Can anyone tell me how much they had to cut back (forward?) the fin trailing | edge close out on the port side to allow the full rudder deflection? | | It looks as if I will have to cut away more than 15 to 20 mm relative to the | starboard side to allow the rudder to swing to port. | | | Thanks in advance. | | | Garry Copeland | | | | | | |


    Message 27


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    Time: 10:18:37 PM PST US
    From: Andrew Sarangan <asarangan@YAHOO.COM>
    Subject: Squeezing solid rivets
    --> Europa-List message posted by: Andrew Sarangan <asarangan@yahoo.com> Is there a way to squeeze these rivets without buying a rivet squeezer? A bench vice, perhaps? A rivet squeezer runs for about $130 which seems hardly worth it considering the small number of rivets, and I don't know anyone who owns one of these to borrow from. Having gotten used to the pop rivets, I was surprised to find these rivets in the kit. Any advice is appreciated. ===== Andrew Sarangan http://www.geocities.com/asarangan


    Message 28


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    Time: 11:15:50 PM PST US
    From: "nigel charles" <nigelcharles@tiscali.co.uk>
    Subject: Exhaust pipe flanges - 912S
    --> Europa-List message posted by: "nigel charles" <nigelcharles@tiscali.co.uk> >When you torque the nuts, you will notice that the flanges (the ones held in place by the bolts and nuts, not the bevelled flanges welded to the pipes) begin to bend before you reach the lower limit of the torque stated by Rotax. Do not apply more torque! The flanges (and the rest of the exhaust system) are NOT Rotax parts, and evidently don't take the Rotax stated torque without bending. I checked this with Andy today: It is difficult to explain why Rotax keep stating the torque when the nuts are check-nuts and therefore do not require a minimum torque to stay put. The nuts should, according to Andy, only be torqued to give a tight connection, to avoid exhaust leaks. There is no proven need to torque more, the system will stay in place even though this connection to the cylinder heads is the only place where the entire exhaust system is anchored to the engine. Andy will place a note about this in the next Tech Talk column in the Europa Flyer, and in the f.w. forward manual at next revision.< Although it seems unlikely the nuts can work loose. In the first year I had one manifold (the front stbd) come loose enough to allow sooting of the head due to gases escaping. It needed about 3 turns of the nut before it even touched the flange. I know that I am not the only case and have checked the nuts regularly since. The latest nuts are slightly different (copper coloured for identification purposes) so might stay put better. One thought is, if there is enough thread available, lock the nut with an extra half nut. Nigel Charles


    Message 29


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    Time: 11:22:13 PM PST US
    From: "nigel charles" <nigelcharles@tiscali.co.uk>
    Subject: Squeezing solid rivets
    --> Europa-List message posted by: "nigel charles" <nigelcharles@tiscali.co.uk> >Is there a way to squeeze these rivets without buying a rivet squeezer? A bench vice, perhaps? A rivet squeezer runs for about $130 which seems hardly worth it considering the small number of rivets, and I don't know anyone who owns one of these to borrow from. Having gotten used to the pop rivets, I was surprised to find these rivets in the kit. Any advice is appreciated.< I found that I got good results using the following technique: Use an appropriate sized drill to drill a shallow hollow in the top of a flat area on your bench vice. Place the assembly head down so that the rivet head is supported in the hollow. Carefully hammer the rivet until the desired grip is achieved. Nigel Charles


    Message 30


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    Time: 11:48:38 PM PST US
    From: "R.C.Harrison" <ptag.dev@tiscali.co.uk>
    Subject: Squeezing solid rivets
    --> Europa-List message posted by: "R.C.Harrison" <ptag.dev@tiscali.co.uk> Hi! Andrew. It is accepted practice to use a small hammer and a hollowed head anvil giving back support. They need to be hit flat and expanded to a specific diameter which stops well short of them beginning to split. I suggest you do one or two as a learning curve exercise. When on your work piece I suggest doing them diametrically opposite when working on tubing and probably get a number partially started to ensure complete alignment prior to final riveting into place. If you are working on the torque tubes under the cockpit module be sure to arrange the radial displacement of all the rivets so to not have any at "clock positions" 12 o'clock and 6 o'clock. Otherwise you may get into "collision mode" with the torque tubes and the internal aileron tubes on maximum travel positions. Regards Bob Harrison G-PTAG -----Original Message----- From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Andrew Sarangan Subject: Europa-List: Squeezing solid rivets --> Europa-List message posted by: Andrew Sarangan <asarangan@yahoo.com> Is there a way to squeeze these rivets without buying a rivet squeezer? A bench vice, perhaps? A rivet squeezer runs for about $130 which seems hardly worth it considering the small number of rivets, and I don't know anyone who owns one of these to borrow from. Having gotten used to the pop rivets, I was surprised to find these rivets in the kit. Any advice is appreciated. ===== Andrew Sarangan http://www.geocities.com/asarangan




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