Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 04:32 AM - Re: Pitch Torque Tube (Kingsley Hurst)
2. 07:40 AM - P{reparing the fuselage surface (Fergus Kyle)
3. 08:17 AM - Re: Preparing the fuselage surface (Gerry Holland)
4. 08:33 AM - Re: P{reparing the fuselage surface (Fred Fillinger)
5. 10:05 AM - Re: Pitch Torque Tube (M@nsfield)
6. 12:57 PM - Re: counterboring spar (Andrew Sarangan)
7. 01:04 PM - Re: counterboring spar (Jeremy Davey)
8. 01:06 PM - Re: counterboring spar (EuropaXSA276@aol.com)
9. 06:17 PM - Re: counterboring spar (Cliff Shaw)
10. 06:32 PM - Re: counterboring spar (Fergus Kyle)
11. 08:03 PM - Re: counterboring spar (Andrew Sarangan)
Message 1
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Subject: | Re: Pitch Torque Tube |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Kingsley Hurst" <hurstkr@growzone.com.au>
David Simenauer wrote :
> I am about to mount the pitch torque tube to the cockpit module. I have
> the CS09 brackets clamped in position now. My question is about the
> amount of movement I should have. With it in the position I have it now,
> the pitch push rods move about 2.25 inches, 55 mm, forward and back. Is
> this enough? I have looked, but can't find mention of this in the manual.
Dave,
Just measured mine for you. With the full elevator circuit working, the
pitch push rods move a total distance of 48mm (1.9 inches) for an elevator
deflection of 18 degrees. IOW, at the stage you are at, it would seem that
2.25 inches would be about right.
Regards
Kingsley Hurst
Mono Classic 281 in Oz.
Message 2
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Subject: | P{reparing the fuselage surface |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Fergus Kyle" <VE3LVO@rac.ca>
Cheers, from snowy Ontario,
I am at the stage of preparing to apply a paint filler before
finishing the surface for under- and top-coat. When I wash the belly with
the specified soap mix, the water beads (we're talking centre flat belly
area) and there's a greasy shine to the surface. Since the filer is
water-based, it's a no-no. I am figuring it's release coat from the
factory - and I'm going to have to scrub with acetone (usual precautions) or
TSP.
Can any one who's been there or knows better whether I'm on the
right track and if yes - which to use or is either OK?
Ferg #064
Message 3
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Subject: | Re: Preparing the fuselage surface |
--> Europa-List message posted by: Gerry Holland <gnholland@onetel.com>
Ferg Hi!
Whether this is right or not I dont know but this is the way I prepared for
a combination of Super Fill and Super Prime from Polyfiber. Interesting when
the Company who painted the Aircraft received it they sanded off just about
all of it and used their own primer.
Prior to my attempts at filling and priming I cut back the gel coat until it
was a drab non shine surface with glass paper and then washed thoroughly
with Polyfiber 310 Alkaline Cleaner.
It may be worth talking to your Paint shop. Mine, Airborne Composites
carries out many Fiber and Carbon repairs and paints many Gliders and
Composite Aircraft. They would have been happier if I had done nothing with
the Fuselage or wings and left them to fill, profile and paint from scratch.
Not a rip off but based on the facts that they always felt ill at ease
preparing and painting a Homebuilt on the basis that the filling and priming
was completed by the owner. That part of the process is the most important
if the paint job is to last.
I worked with them on my Wings and Fuselage and tend to see their point of
view. Using a pressurised, flow through paint Bay also was a lot more
comfortable when sanding back. I felt like crap when doing it in my workshop
even with a mask.
They very rarely paint for Homebuilts now as getting a happy Customer
through quality at a reasonable price is hard to achieve.
I'm pleased with my results on both quality and price.
Sorry to ramble.
Regards
Gerry
Europa 384 G-FIZY
Trigear with Rotax 912 and Arplast CS Prop.
Dynon EFIS, KMD 150, Icom A-200 and SL70 Transponder.
PSS AoA Fitted.
http://www.g-fizy.com
Mobile: +44 7808 402404
WebFax: +44 870 7059985
gnholland@onetel.com
Message 4
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Subject: | Re: P{reparing the fuselage surface |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Fred Fillinger" <n3eu@comcast.net>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Fergus Kyle" <VE3LVO@rac.ca>
>
> Cheers, from snowy Ontario,
> I am at the stage of preparing to apply a paint filler
before
> finishing the surface for under- and top-coat. When I wash the belly
with
> the specified soap mix, the water beads (we're talking centre flat
belly
> area) and there's a greasy shine to the surface. Since the filer is
> water-based, it's a no-no. I am figuring it's release coat from the
> factory - and I'm going to have to scrub with acetone (usual
precautions) or
> TSP.
It's a no-no with even solvent-based paint, unless the solvent will
etch into the epoxy, which it won't. My fuse had no release coat, and
the coats I'm familiar with you'll know is there. So just used a
household cleaner and water rinse, then abraded (dry) with an electric
palm sander and fine grit. With the drum effect, the whole
neighborhood will wonder what the heck you're doing. I needed hearing
protection...!
Reg,
Fred F.
Message 5
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From: | "M@nsfield" <nsfield@screaming.net> |
Subject: | Re: Pitch Torque Tube |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "M@nsfield" <nsfield@screaming.net>
Hi David,
A handy tip from Neville is to file a profile in the outer pairs of welded
lugs (where the pitch push rods attach) so there is more rotational movement
before the lugs touch the edge of the CS05 aileron torque tube (where it
sits flush with the CS08 crank).
Don't remove so much as to leave less metal at the side than there is around
the hole - i.e. leave as much metal at the side as there is at the top of
the lug (hard to describe, but I guess you'll understand).
I'll see if I can get a picture of this, but my CM is installed so it might
be a bit cluttered in there...
HTH
PaulM
XS 383
CM in, TP in, off to the front for LG frame.
--> Europa-List message posted by: "David Simenauer"
I am about to mount the pitch torque tube to the cockpit module. I have
the CS09 brackets clamped in position now. My question is about the amount
of movement I should have. With it in the position I have it now, the pitch
push rods move about 2.25 inches, 55 mm, forward and back. Is this enough?
I have looked, but can't find mention of this in the manual.
Thanks,
Dave Simenauer
Book yourself something to look forward to in 2005.
Cheap flights - http://www.tiscali.co.uk/travel/flights/
Bargain holidays - http://www.tiscali.co.uk/travel/holidays/
Message 6
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Subject: | counterboring spar |
--> Europa-List message posted by: Andrew Sarangan <asarangan@yahoo.com>
Thanks for that input. I understand your reasoning, but it would be a
better solution to countersink only as necessary and use a longer bolt.
The spar is only about 1" thick, and I don't like the idea of boring
60% of it away with a 3/4" drill. In fact a diameter of 11/16" to a
depth of 1/4" will comfortably fit the AN4 bolt head and the EURO
washer. So I ordered different lengths of AN4 bolts and will try them
out. They are only 50 cents each. I don't know why the manual wants us
to drill a deeper hole instead of giving us a longer bolt.
--- Kingsley Hurst <hurstkr@growzone.com.au> wrote:
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Kingsley Hurst"
> <hurstkr@growzone.com.au>
>
> > Wouldn't this cause the spar to become
> weaker, which is probably the most critical structure of the
> airplane?
>
> Andrew,
>
> The counter boring is done in the timber in the middle of the spar.
> When a beam is under load, the centreline takes no load. In the case
> of
> the spar under normal +ive G loading, the top of the spar is in
> compression and the bottom is in tension. The middle is neutral.
> The
> timber is only a spacer to hold the top and bottom spar rovings
> apart.
>
> Suggest you just use the bolt called out in the manual and
> countersink
> the hole until the other end of the bolt is just long enough to hold
> the
> parts it has to hold. If it is too long, it will conflict with the
> other bolt in the aluminium bracket when the wings are rigged.
>
> Regards
> Kingsley
> Mono Classic 281 in Oz.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
=====
Andrew Sarangan
http://www.geocities.com/asarangan
Message 7
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Subject: | counterboring spar |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Jeremy Davey" <EuropaFlyer_3@msn.com>
Andrew (et al),
Can I suggest you check your build manual against the latest updates
available online? I've got a feeling that the depth of that counterbore has
been significantly reduced - but only after I did mine :-(
Regards,
Jeremy
Jeremy Davey
Europa Monowheel 537M G-EZZA
Europa Club Vice-Chairman, Webmaster, PFA NC Representative
PFA EC Member
"If you can keep your head when all about you are losing theirs, then it is
possible you haven't grasped the severity of the situation."
Tail done
Standard XS wings with mods underway
CM installed in fuse (with airbrakes fittings)
1250 build hours to date
Intended fit:
Rotax 914 turbo, Airmaster CS fully-feathering prop
Lots of lights, buttons, switches, gizmos, and alarms
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Andrew Sarangan
Subject: RE: Europa-List: counterboring spar
--> Europa-List message posted by: Andrew Sarangan <asarangan@yahoo.com>
Thanks for that input. I understand your reasoning, but it would be a
better solution to countersink only as necessary and use a longer bolt.
The spar is only about 1" thick, and I don't like the idea of boring
60% of it away with a 3/4" drill. In fact a diameter of 11/16" to a
depth of 1/4" will comfortably fit the AN4 bolt head and the EURO
washer. So I ordered different lengths of AN4 bolts and will try them
out. They are only 50 cents each. I don't know why the manual wants us
to drill a deeper hole instead of giving us a longer bolt.
--- Kingsley Hurst <hurstkr@growzone.com.au> wrote:
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Kingsley Hurst"
> <hurstkr@growzone.com.au>
>
> > Wouldn't this cause the spar to become
> weaker, which is probably the most critical structure of the
> airplane?
>
> Andrew,
>
> The counter boring is done in the timber in the middle of the spar.
> When a beam is under load, the centreline takes no load. In the case
> of
> the spar under normal +ive G loading, the top of the spar is in
> compression and the bottom is in tension. The middle is neutral.
> The
> timber is only a spacer to hold the top and bottom spar rovings
> apart.
>
> Suggest you just use the bolt called out in the manual and
> countersink
> the hole until the other end of the bolt is just long enough to hold
> the
> parts it has to hold. If it is too long, it will conflict with the
> other bolt in the aluminium bracket when the wings are rigged.
>
> Regards
> Kingsley
> Mono Classic 281 in Oz.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
=====
Andrew Sarangan
http://www.geocities.com/asarangan
Message 8
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Subject: | Re: counterboring spar |
--> Europa-List message posted by: EuropaXSA276@aol.com
Hi Andrew:
I did the same. I only counter bored the hole to the bolt head depth.
Perhaps a few mm more.
Warning! Do not flox the hole per the instructions at this time. That pivot
my need some adjustment when setting your wings!
Brian Skelly
Texas
Europa # A276 TriGear
See My build photos at:
http://www.europaowners.org/BrianS
Message 9
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Subject: | Re: counterboring spar |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Cliff Shaw" <flyinggpa@comcast.net>
Andrew:
I second that advice. (forgot to say that when I replayed earlier)
I aligned the pivot bolt hole with the pivot bolt on the CM by slipping a
short piece of brass tubing over the bolt and sliding it out to locate where
the other bolt should have been. (mine was OK on the starboard side but off
on the port side by an 1/8")
Cliff Shaw
1041 Euclid ave.
Edmonds, WA 98020
425 776 5555
http://www.europaowners.org/WileE
> Hi Andrew:
> I did the same. I only counter bored the hole to the bolt head depth.
> Perhaps a few mm more.
> Warning! Do not flox the hole per the instructions at this time. That
> pivot
> my need some adjustment when setting your wings!
>
>
> Brian Skelly
Message 10
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Subject: | Re: counterboring spar |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Fergus Kyle" <VE3LVO@rac.ca>
Andrew Sarangan et al
"So I ordered different lengths of AN4 bolts and will try them
| out. They are only 50 cents each. I don't know why the manual wants us
| to drill a deeper hole instead of giving us a longer bolt."!
Andrew,
Just as long as you have ordered bolts of the same specification
as the original........... There are bolts and other bolts which I'm sure
you know. I'm not presuming your ignorance, just making myself feel good!
Ferg
Message 11
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Subject: | Re: counterboring spar |
--> Europa-List message posted by: Andrew Sarangan <asarangan@yahoo.com>
Correct me if I am wrong, but AN4-XXA is a 1/4-28 cadmium bolt. I am
getting these from Aircraft Spruce. Am I mistaken?
--- Fergus Kyle <VE3LVO@rac.ca> wrote:
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Fergus Kyle" <VE3LVO@rac.ca>
>
> Andrew Sarangan et al
>
> "So I ordered different lengths of AN4 bolts and will try them
> us
>
> Andrew,
> Just as long as you have ordered bolts of the same
> specification
> as the original........... There are bolts and other bolts which I'm
> sure
> you know. I'm not presuming your ignorance, just making myself feel
> good!
> Ferg
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
=====
Andrew Sarangan
http://www.geocities.com/asarangan
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