Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 12:57 AM - Gascolator access hatch (Brian Hutchinson)
2. 09:30 AM - Re: Gascolator access hatch (Ron Jones)
3. 09:30 AM - Long / Short wing ASI? (Ronald J. Parigoris)
4. 10:41 AM - Propeller Diameter (Fred R. Klein)
5. 10:52 AM - Re: Gascolator access hatch (Paul McAllister)
6. 11:32 AM - Re: Long / Short wing ASI? (Fred Fillinger)
7. 12:31 PM - Re: Gascolator access hatch (Fred R. Klein)
8. 12:58 PM - Re: Gascolator access hatch (Kevin And Ann Klinefelter)
9. 01:16 PM - Re: Propeller Diameter (Duncan McFadyean)
10. 01:29 PM - Re: Gascolator access hatch (Dave_Miller@avivacanada.com)
11. 01:32 PM - high compression (Terry Seaver)
12. 02:43 PM - Re: Gascolator access hatch (Fred R. Klein)
13. 02:43 PM - Re: Propeller Diameter (Jerry Rehn)
14. 04:10 PM - Re: Gascolator access hatch (Cliff Shaw)
15. 05:10 PM - Replacement Fuel Hose (Kingsley Hurst)
16. 05:17 PM - Re: Gascolator access hatch (Jerry Rehn)
17. 05:52 PM - Re: Gascolator access hatch (Kevin And Ann Klinefelter)
18. 06:20 PM - Roche harbor (Cliff Shaw)
19. 06:21 PM - Re: Replacement Fuel Hose (Paul McAllister)
Message 1
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Subject: | Gascolator access hatch |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Brian Hutchinson" <hutch@hangarbout.fsnet.co.uk>
Hi all,
I plan to install an Andair gascolator somewhere under the rear baggage bay.
I don't fancy the conventional Europa type access hatch with 4 screws to undo
every time I need to check the filter bowl. It appears to me that any hatch would
need to be a fair size, big enough to comfortably get your fingers in to
release the safety clip and locking pin.
Does anyone know if the PFA would accept a 'quick release' hinged panel in this
area of the structure, something similar (but bigger) to the dipstick access
hatch on the cowling? Has anyone already got an approved Mod they would be prepared
to share?
Brian Hutchinson
Lincolnshire
357 mono 912s Airmaster
No forecast finish date yet, but I think I'm now in the last 5 years!
Message 2
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Subject: | Re: Gascolator access hatch |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Ron Jones" <jronjones@lineone.net>
Hi Brian,
I didn't like the idea of a hatch for access to my Andair watsit, either. I
therefore made a tube by wrapping four plys of bid around the tubing left
over from the aileron push-rods. (The tube was well waxwd first, of course!)
The GRP tube is exactly the right inside diam to take a standard fuel
check/tester (the clear plastic sort).
I bonded the tube directly under the Andair which is fitted with the usual
T-shaped drain/test valve.
All I have to do now is bend down, pop the tester up the tube and push to
take a sample!
Hope this helps,
Regds,
Ron Jones.
Message 3
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Subject: | Long / Short wing ASI? |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Ronald J. Parigoris" <rparigor@suffolk.lib.ny.us>
I have a Winter ASI with Short Wing markings.
What have others done when switching to Long Wings to satisfy DAR?
Thx.
Ron Parigoris
Message 4
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Subject: | Propeller Diameter |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Fred R. Klein" <fklein@orcasonline.com>
Hi yu All,
After checking the Archive, it appears that most trigear Europas are flying
with a 3 blade 64" diameter C/S propeller.
I'm still unclear as to whether or not the 64" diameter is appropriate for
the XS mono due to difference in ground clearance.
Can anyone confirm?..or advise on a smaller (say 62") C/S prop for the mono!
Sorry for this elementary question, but I go by the mantra that the only
stupid question is that which is not asked.
Fred
A194
Message 5
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Subject: | Re: Gascolator access hatch |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Paul McAllister" <paul.mcallister@qia.net>
Hi all,
The only comment I would make is that I had a lot of trouble with debris
getting under the seat of the seal and I could never stop the darn thing
dripping. I never use the drain valve any more, I just take the bowl off
the bottom empty it out and put it back.
regards, Paul
> Hi Brian,
> I didn't like the idea of a hatch for access to my Andair watsit, either.
> I
> therefore made a tube by wrapping four plys of bid around the tubing left
> over from the aileron push-rods. (The tube was well waxwd first, of
> course!)
> The GRP tube is exactly the right inside diam to take a standard fuel
> check/tester (the clear plastic sort).
> I bonded the tube directly under the Andair which is fitted with the usual
> T-shaped drain/test valve.
> All I have to do now is bend down, pop the tester up the tube and push to
> take a sample!
>
> Hope this helps,
> Regds,
> Ron Jones.
>
>
Message 6
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Subject: | Re: Long / Short wing ASI? |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Fred Fillinger" <n3eu@comcast.net>
> I have a Winter ASI with Short Wing markings.
>
> What have others done when switching to Long Wings to satisfy DAR?
>
> Thx.
> Ron Parigoris
The DAR/ FAA signoff is essentially permission to go flight test for
40 hours to see what the various airspeed limits are, among everything
else. It should make no difference that it's a kit, and the kit mfr
has specified numbers. Maybe your flaps are reflexed a bit. And you
have to determine installation error and instrument accuracy. In the
interest of safety, we should have the right to determine exact stall
speeds. Per the Advisory Circular for homebuilts, (AC 20-27??), the
listing of the required markings/placards further does not mention
ASI.
This doesn't mean one might mark the instrument per Europa during
construction, but only that FAA cannot make you do that.
Reg,
Fred F.
Message 7
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Subject: | Re: Gascolator access hatch |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Fred R. Klein" <fklein@orcasonline.com>
Can't the gascolator be mounted so that the push up drain valve simply
extends thru the underside of the fuselage, albeit w/ a possible split
fairing fore and aft for those who are hypersensitive to parasitic drag?
Fred
A194
Message 8
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Subject: | Re: Gascolator access hatch |
--> Europa-List message posted by: Kevin And Ann Klinefelter <kevann@verizon.net>
Yes, but then if you belly in you may break the valve off and spark a fire.
Kevin
A211
Fred R. Klein wrote:
>--> Europa-List message posted by: "Fred R. Klein" <fklein@orcasonline.com>
>
>Can't the gascolator be mounted so that the push up drain valve simply
>extends thru the underside of the fuselage, albeit w/ a possible split
>fairing fore and aft for those who are hypersensitive to parasitic drag?
>
>Fred
>A194
>
>
>
>
Message 9
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Subject: | Re: Propeller Diameter |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Duncan McFadyean" <ami@mcfadyean.freeserve.co.uk>
A listing of UK prop sizes is shown at
http://www.pfa.org.uk/engineering_services/propeller_substitution.asp
then click on
PFA Information Letter 36
and scroll down to page 14 + 15.
The largest shown is 66" (G-OSLD, 914 tri). I wonder if it performs any
better?
Duncan McF.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Fred R. Klein" <fklein@orcasonline.com>
Subject: Europa-List: Propeller Diameter
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Fred R. Klein"
<fklein@orcasonline.com>
>
> Hi yu All,
>
> After checking the Archive, it appears that most trigear Europas are
flying
> with a 3 blade 64" diameter C/S propeller.
>
> I'm still unclear as to whether or not the 64" diameter is appropriate for
> the XS mono due to difference in ground clearance.
>
> Can anyone confirm?..or advise on a smaller (say 62") C/S prop for the
mono!
>
> Sorry for this elementary question, but I go by the mantra that the only
> stupid question is that which is not asked.
>
> Fred
> A194
>
>
Message 10
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Subject: | Re: Gascolator access hatch |
02/08/2005 04:28:24 PM,
Serialize complete at 02/08/2005 04:28:24 PM
--> Europa-List message posted by: Dave_Miller@avivacanada.com
I've done this with the water drains and gascolator - actually they are
dropped thru the inspection covers
aerodynamic fairings as well !
Dave A061
do not archive
"Fred R. Klein" <fklein@orcasonline.com>
Sent by: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
02/08/05 03:35 PM
Please respond to europa-list
To: <europa-list@matronics.com>
cc:
Subject: Re: Europa-List: Gascolator access hatch
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Fred R. Klein"
<fklein@orcasonline.com>
Can't the gascolator be mounted so that the push up drain valve simply
extends thru the underside of the fuselage, albeit w/ a possible split
fairing fore and aft for those who are hypersensitive to parasitic drag?
Fred
A194
Message 11
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|
Subject: | high compression |
--> Europa-List message posted by: Terry Seaver <terrys@cisco.com>
Hi all,
We have a Europa XS with Rotax 912S that has been flying about 400
hours. During our annual inspections we have been taking the cylinder
compressions using an automotive compression tester. The first two
inpections found the compression to be about 180 psi per cylinder.
during the last inspection (about 10 months ago) the compression
readings went up about 15-20 psi. At the time we thought this was
probably the fault of the compression gauge, but now wonder if it might
instead be real.
We have had more difficult starting this past year or two than
when the plane/engine were new. We have changed plugs, balanced carbs,
dissasmbled and cleaned the carbs, and installed a new battery, all to
no avail. I wonder if it could be the increased compression causing
starting problems. Also, aren't you more likely to get detonation as
the compression goes up?
If/when carbon and/or lead deposits build up on the head and
pistons, the compression will go up. We have heard back yard mechanic
stories about pouring water or ATF (automatic trans fluid) down the carb
while the engine is running to clear the deposits out. An auto mechanic
friend says higher compression from carbon deposits can make a car fail
a smog test (nitrous oxide emissions), and is fixed by filling the
cylinders with a special cleaner overnight, then running some more thru
the carb the next day.
Has anyone seen their Rotax compression go up?
If so, did it start harder, and what did you do to fix it?
regards,
Terry Seaver
A135 / N135TD
Message 12
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Subject: | Re: Gascolator access hatch |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Fred R. Klein" <fklein@orcasonline.com>
Kevin,
Excellent point!..and admirable forethought!..recessing it might just be
worth the trouble!
Fred
A194
DO NOT ARCHIVE
on 2/9/05 12:58 PM, Kevin And Ann Klinefelter at kevann@verizon.net wrote:
> --> Europa-List message posted by: Kevin And Ann Klinefelter
> <kevann@verizon.net>
>
> Yes, but then if you belly in you may break the valve off and spark a fire.
>
> Kevin
> A211
>
>
>> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Fred R. Klein" <fklein@orcasonline.com>
>>
>> Can't the gascolator be mounted so that the push up drain valve simply
>> extends thru the underside of the fuselage, albeit w/ a possible split
>> fairing fore and aft for those who are hypersensitive to parasitic drag?
>>
>> Fred
>> A194
>>
>>
Message 13
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Subject: | Re: Propeller Diameter |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Jerry Rehn" <rehn@rockisland.com>
Fred,64 inch is what I have. Provided by Airmaster. I understood that is
what performed best during their tests.
Jerry 914 XS Mono
----- Original Message -----
From: "Fred R. Klein" <fklein@orcasonline.com>
Subject: Europa-List: Propeller Diameter
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Fred R. Klein"
> <fklein@orcasonline.com>
>
> Hi yu All,
>
> After checking the Archive, it appears that most trigear Europas are
> flying
> with a 3 blade 64" diameter C/S propeller.
>
> I'm still unclear as to whether or not the 64" diameter is appropriate for
> the XS mono due to difference in ground clearance.
>
> Can anyone confirm?..or advise on a smaller (say 62") C/S prop for the
> mono!
>
> Sorry for this elementary question, but I go by the mantra that the only
> stupid question is that which is not asked.
>
> Fred
> A194
>
>
>
Message 14
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|
Subject: | Re: Gascolator access hatch |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Cliff Shaw" <flyinggpa@comcast.net>
You will have a lot of aluminum and rubber to ware away before the water
drains start dragging the runway. If an planed gear up is made the fuel
shut-off should have been turned off. Just my thoughts.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Fred R. Klein" <fklein@orcasonline.com>
Subject: Re: Europa-List: Gascolator access hatch
Do not archive
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Fred R. Klein"
> <fklein@orcasonline.com>
>
> Kevin,
>
> Excellent point!..and admirable forethought!..recessing it might just be
> worth the trouble!
>
> Fred
> A194
>
> DO NOT ARCHIVE
>
> on 2/9/05 12:58 PM, Kevin And Ann Klinefelter at kevann@verizon.net wrote:
>
>> --> Europa-List message posted by: Kevin And Ann Klinefelter
>> <kevann@verizon.net>
>>
>> Yes, but then if you belly in you may break the valve off and spark a
>> fire.
>>
>> Kevin
>> A211
>>
>>
>>> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Fred R. Klein"
>>> <fklein@orcasonline.com>
>>>
>>> Can't the gascolator be mounted so that the push up drain valve simply
>>> extends thru the underside of the fuselage, albeit w/ a possible split
>>> fairing fore and aft for those who are hypersensitive to parasitic drag?
>>>
>>> Fred
>>> A194
>>>
>>>
>
>
>
Message 15
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|
Subject: | Replacement Fuel Hose |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Kingsley Hurst" <hurstkr@growzone.com.au>
All,
I am contemplating exchanging the Europa supplied fuel hoses with
automotive fuel injection hose to SAE30R9 specification.
This hose does not have any SS braiding so could others tell me what
they have done to protect unbraided hose in the wheel well of their
monos please.
Any ideas gratefully received thanks.
Kingsley
Message 16
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|
Subject: | Re: Gascolator access hatch |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Jerry Rehn" <rehn@rockisland.com>
Cliff, you are probably right, however most (general aviation) that land
gear up discover the gear is up when their prop hits the ground! I mounted
my gascolator 4 inches above the bottom of fuse. with an access door just
below. One needs to lay under the plane to check it but I believe you do
when the drains are below anyway. Not a big deal. BTW I have never found
water in my gascolator . Have you? Why don't you fly up to Roche one of thes
days?
Jerry
----- Original Message -----
From: "Cliff Shaw" <flyinggpa@comcast.net>
Subject: Re: Europa-List: Gascolator access hatch
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Cliff Shaw" <flyinggpa@comcast.net>
>
>
> You will have a lot of aluminum and rubber to ware away before the water
> drains start dragging the runway. If an planed gear up is made the fuel
> shut-off should have been turned off. Just my thoughts.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Fred R. Klein" <fklein@orcasonline.com>
> To: <europa-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: Re: Europa-List: Gascolator access hatch
> Do not archive
>
>> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Fred R. Klein"
>> <fklein@orcasonline.com>
>>
>> Kevin,
>>
>> Excellent point!..and admirable forethought!..recessing it might just be
>> worth the trouble!
>>
>> Fred
>> A194
>>
>> DO NOT ARCHIVE
>>
>> on 2/9/05 12:58 PM, Kevin And Ann Klinefelter at kevann@verizon.net
>> wrote:
>>
>>> --> Europa-List message posted by: Kevin And Ann Klinefelter
>>> <kevann@verizon.net>
>>>
>>> Yes, but then if you belly in you may break the valve off and spark a
>>> fire.
>>>
>>> Kevin
>>> A211
>>>
>>>
>>>> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Fred R. Klein"
>>>> <fklein@orcasonline.com>
>>>>
>>>> Can't the gascolator be mounted so that the push up drain valve simply
>>>> extends thru the underside of the fuselage, albeit w/ a possible split
>>>> fairing fore and aft for those who are hypersensitive to parasitic
>>>> drag?
>>>>
>>>> Fred
>>>> A194
>>>>
>>>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
Message 17
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|
Subject: | Re: Gascolator access hatch |
--> Europa-List message posted by: Kevin And Ann Klinefelter <kevann@verizon.net>
Thanks...but I just copied Paul McAllister thanks to his web-site.
Kevin A211
almost done with the primer, soon to learn how to paint an airplane
Fred R. Klein wrote:
>--> Europa-List message posted by: "Fred R. Klein" <fklein@orcasonline.com>
>
>Kevin,
>
>Excellent point!..and admirable forethought!..recessing it might just be
>worth the trouble!
>
>Fred
>A194
>
>DO NOT ARCHIVE
>
>on 2/9/05 12:58 PM, Kevin And Ann Klinefelter at kevann@verizon.net wrote:
>
>
>
>>--> Europa-List message posted by: Kevin And Ann Klinefelter
>><kevann@verizon.net>
>>
>>Yes, but then if you belly in you may break the valve off and spark a fire.
>>
>>Kevin
>>A211
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>>--> Europa-List message posted by: "Fred R. Klein" <fklein@orcasonline.com>
>>>
>>>Can't the gascolator be mounted so that the push up drain valve simply
>>>extends thru the underside of the fuselage, albeit w/ a possible split
>>>fairing fore and aft for those who are hypersensitive to parasitic drag?
>>>
>>>Fred
>>>A194
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>
>
>
>
Message 18
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|
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Cliff Shaw" <flyinggpa@comcast.net>
Jerry
Would that be a "Drop of the Hat" fly-in? :) I think Betty and I will be
able to fly out tomorrow afternoon. How about that?
By the way, I have made a couple flights trying to compare air speed with
and with out the wheel pants and gear leg fairings. I am not a test pilot.
It seems that conditions are a bit different each time I fly. I first flew
on a very cold day with only the gear leg fairings. I used the Dynow D10 to
read OAT and pressure altitude. I was at 3000 PA every time I took these
readings. The first flight I got 129K. Then I flew with the gear leg fairing
off, and got 126K. Today I flew, had a little bit more fuel onboard, about
the same temperature as the last flight. With every thing faired up and a
"good" paint job on my wheel pants, I got 139K. I did not expect to see that
much increase. I said I am not a test pilot, so can't explain what reason
for the 13K difference. Maybe I just had a good day today. It was "severe
clear" and sunny. Very present to fly.
Cliff Shaw
1041 Euclid ave.
Edmonds, WA 98020
425 776 5555
http://www.europaowners.org/WileE
Planning to fly Wednesday again. Fly when I can and having fun !
Do Not Archive
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jerry Rehn" <rehn@rockisland.com>
Subject: Re: Europa-List: Gascolator access hatch
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Jerry Rehn" <rehn@rockisland.com>
>
> Cliff, you are probably right, however most (general aviation) that land
> gear up discover the gear is up when their prop hits the ground! I mounted
> my gascolator 4 inches above the bottom of fuse. with an access door just
> below. One needs to lay under the plane to check it but I believe you do
> when the drains are below anyway. Not a big deal. BTW I have never found
> water in my gascolator . Have you? Why don't you fly up to Roche one of
> thes
> days?
> Jerry
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Cliff Shaw" <flyinggpa@comcast.net>
> To: <europa-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: Re: Europa-List: Gascolator access hatch
>
>
>> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Cliff Shaw" <flyinggpa@comcast.net>
>>
>>
>> You will have a lot of aluminum and rubber to ware away before the water
>> drains start dragging the runway. If an planed gear up is made the fuel
>> shut-off should have been turned off. Just my thoughts.
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Fred R. Klein" <fklein@orcasonline.com>
>> To: <europa-list@matronics.com>
>> Subject: Re: Europa-List: Gascolator access hatch
>> Do not archive
>>
>>> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Fred R. Klein"
>>> <fklein@orcasonline.com>
>>>
>>> Kevin,
>>>
>>> Excellent point!..and admirable forethought!..recessing it might just be
>>> worth the trouble!
>>>
>>> Fred
>>> A194
>>>
>>> DO NOT ARCHIVE
>>>
>>> on 2/9/05 12:58 PM, Kevin And Ann Klinefelter at kevann@verizon.net
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> --> Europa-List message posted by: Kevin And Ann Klinefelter
>>>> <kevann@verizon.net>
>>>>
>>>> Yes, but then if you belly in you may break the valve off and spark a
>>>> fire.
>>>>
>>>> Kevin
>>>> A211
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Fred R. Klein"
>>>>> <fklein@orcasonline.com>
>>>>>
>>>>> Can't the gascolator be mounted so that the push up drain valve simply
>>>>> extends thru the underside of the fuselage, albeit w/ a possible split
>>>>> fairing fore and aft for those who are hypersensitive to parasitic
>>>>> drag?
>>>>>
>>>>> Fred
>>>>> A194
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
Message 19
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|
Subject: | Re: Replacement Fuel Hose |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Paul McAllister" <paul.mcallister@qia.net>
Kingsley,
With a bit of patience you can get the braid off the old hose and thread it
onto the new stuff. Just put on some leather gloves, it will only take an
hour or so.
Paul
----- Original Message -----
From: "Kingsley Hurst" <hurstkr@growzone.com.au>
>
> I am contemplating exchanging the Europa supplied fuel hoses with
> automotive fuel injection hose to SAE30R9 specification.
>
> This hose does not have any SS braiding so could others tell me what
> they have done to protect unbraided hose in the wheel well of their
> monos please.
>
> Any ideas gratefully received thanks.
>
> Kingsley
>
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