---------------------------------------------------------- Europa-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Wed 03/09/05: 12 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 12:54 AM - Re: Controlled air space article (mark.henwick) 2. 01:23 AM - Re: Controlled air space article (Alan Burrows) 3. 01:29 AM - Now this one really needs sharing..! (Alan Burrows) 4. 03:21 AM - Re: Aircraft Winching (David Joyce) 5. 04:44 AM - Classic engine mount wanted (Bill Henderson) 6. 07:20 AM - Re: Aircraft Winching (John & Paddy Wigney) 7. 08:52 AM - Re: 912S with the Classsic (nigel charles) 8. 11:32 AM - Avoiding landing fees by diverting (simon miles) 9. 03:24 PM - The certified Europa? (Tim Weert) 10. 05:40 PM - Re: The certified Europa? (Rob Housman) 11. 06:27 PM - Re: Avoiding landing fees by diverting (DuaneFamly@aol.com) 12. 07:46 PM - Re: The certified Europa? (Rick Audy) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 12:54:41 AM PST US From: "mark.henwick" Subject: RE: Europa-List: Controlled air space article --> Europa-List message posted by: "mark.henwick" Ah ha! One I can answer at last. It was Flyer magazine Feb 2004, they used an Aztec and a 172. Article concludes no problem generally but 'doubts about Manchester' which didn't feature in their test route. Mark Henwick Building s l o w l y - reinforcing the wings at the moment --> Europa-List message posted by: "MR!PAUL MITCHELL" --> Gents, Some time last year I remember reading an article in ??? magazine (This is the question) where two guys of very different experience had flown a set route round Southern England, asking for and mostly getting crossing clearance for Southampton, London city, Stanstead and Luton ATZ while flying VMC. They flew a C150 with the experienced guy on the radio and them reversed the route in a twin with the inexperienced guy on the radio. Do any of you remember the article and if so what book and date. Thanks. Paul Mitchell -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. 08/03/2005 ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 01:23:05 AM PST US From: "Alan Burrows" Subject: RE: Europa-List: Controlled air space article --> Europa-List message posted by: "Alan Burrows" Just as an aside to this thread. I was on a flight from Guernsey to Shoreham last week and had to divert into Southampton due to weather (snow and very low vis.). When we landed at Southampton we were told they would not wave the landing fee as we had not called a Mayday or Pan so it was not considered an "emergency divert". They were quite insistent, but so were we about not paying and after having the matter referred to the airport manager we won the day. Anyone else experienced this kind of nonsense ? Alan -----Original Message----- From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of MR!PAUL MITCHELL Subject: Europa-List: Controlled air space article --> Europa-List message posted by: "MR!PAUL MITCHELL" --> Gents, Some time last year I remember reading an article in ??? magazine (This is the question) where two guys of very different experience had flown a set route round Southern England, asking for and mostly getting crossing clearance for Southampton, London city, Stanstead and Luton ATZ while flying VMC. They flew a C150 with the experienced guy on the radio and them reversed the route in a twin with the inexperienced guy on the radio. Do any of you remember the article and if so what book and date. Thanks. Paul Mitchell ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 01:29:55 AM PST US From: "Alan Burrows" Subject: Europa-List: Now this one really needs sharing..! --> Europa-List message posted by: "Alan Burrows" A photographer from a well-known national magazine was assigned to cover the recent Southern California fires. The magazine wanted to show some of the heroic work of the firefighters as they battled the blazes. When the photographer arrived, he realized that the smoke was so thick that it would seriously impede or make it impossible for him to photograph anything from ground-level. So he requested permission to rent a plane and take photos from the air. His request was approved, and arrangements were made. He was told to report to a nearby airport, where a single-engine plane would be waiting for him. He arrived at the airport and saw a plane warming up near the gate. He jumped in with his bag and shouted, "Let's go!" The pilot swung the plane into the wind, and within minutes they were in the air. The photographer said, "Fly over the park and make two or three low passes so I can take some pictures." "Why?" asked the pilot. "Because I am a photographer for a national magazine," he responded, "and I need some close-up shots." The pilot was silent for a moment; finally he stammered, "So, you're telling me you're not the instructor. ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 03:21:49 AM PST US From: "David Joyce" Subject: Re: Europa-List: Aircraft Winching --> Europa-List message posted by: "David Joyce" Steve, I use a hand winch to get my mono in its covered trailer and find it entirely satisfactory. The actual amount of effort involved in winding it up the ramp is so little that I wouldn't personally consider a motorised version. The winch strap has a hook on the end of it and I simply hook this on to the two looped ends of a circular strop placed round the tailwheel spring and leading back over the solid metal bit which limits rotation of the tail wheel fork unit. The winch is fixed to the frame in front of the front wall of the enclosed part of the trailer and the strap gets into the trailer thru a small flap. There is a small door in the front wall of the trailer, and opening this allows you to see what you are up to while winching it in. Regards David Joyce, G-XSDJ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steve Crimm" Subject: Europa-List: Aircraft Winching > --> Europa-List message posted by: "Steve Crimm" > > Flight, > > I am considering getting an electric strap winch to assist in loading my > monowheel onto it's trailer. For those who utilize a winch I have these > questions: > > 1. Where do you attach the winch strap/cable to the aircraft so it doesn't > damage the aircraft? > > 2. What type of attachment do you use if you pull using the landing gear? > > 3. Are there any secrets learner from experience that will assist me in > setting up a winch on my trailer? > > Thanks, > > Steve Crimm > A058 > N15JN > > > ________________________________________________________________________ > Doctors.net.uk e-mail protects you from viruses and unsolicited messages > _______________________________________________________________________ > > ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 04:44:05 AM PST US From: "Bill Henderson" Subject: Europa-List: Classic engine mount wanted --> Europa-List message posted by: "Bill Henderson" I'm looking for a Europa classic engine mount (for Rotax 912). If someone has one for sale, please contact me at europabill@bellsouth.net Thanks, Bill Henderson A010 Monowheel Classic ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 07:20:38 AM PST US From: John & Paddy Wigney Subject: Europa-List: Re: Aircraft Winching --> Europa-List message posted by: John & Paddy Wigney Hi Steve, I replaced the tail wheel spring attach bolt (AN5-21A) with an AN44-21A eye bolt. I just put a shackle into the eye and pull on that with a trailer winch. The eye is also useful as a tie down point. Cheers, John N262WF, mono XS, 912S Mooresville, North Carolina <<<<<<<<< From: "Steve Crimm" Subject: Europa-List: Aircraft Winching Flight, I am considering getting an electric strap winch to assist in loading my monowheel onto it's trailer. For those who utilize a winch I have these questions: 1. Where do you attach the winch strap/cable to the aircraft so it doesn't damage the aircraft? 2. What type of attachment do you use if you pull using the landing gear? 3. Are there any secrets learner from experience that will assist me in setting up a winch on my trailer? Thanks, Steve Crimm A058 N15JN >>>>>>>>>>> ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 08:52:39 AM PST US From: "nigel charles" Subject: RE: Europa-List: 912S with the Classsic --> Europa-List message posted by: "nigel charles" >Intend to look at the larger starter and see what is under the cover. I just wonder if the cover over the end can be cut away a little and reshaped to accommodate the engine mount on the classic.< Been there, done it. There is insufficient space. The upper bolt of the starter would protrude inside the aperture of the starboard upper engine mount. I concluded that it is impractical to modify the engine mount and have decided to modify my Classic to XS firewall forward specification. This gives several advantages: 1. Access to the rear of the engine is much easier. 2. Starter removal and even sprag clutch change is possible with the engine fitted. 3. Lower cowl removal and refitting is easier as the radiators do not need detaching. 4. Prop ground clearance is improved reducing blade damage from stones during taxy and slightly less chance of prop strike. The main disadvantages are: 1. Price 2. Work required to complete modification. Nigel Charles ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 11:32:09 AM PST US From: "simon miles" Subject: Europa-List: Avoiding landing fees by diverting --> Europa-List message posted by: "simon miles" Alan, Why do you consider this attitude to be nonsense? You go flying - it costs. I am always amazed that any pilot thinks that they deserve a free landing when things go pear-shaped. Airports such as the three mentioned in your account are not charitable organisations so why should you get a free landing even if the circumstances are beyond your control - I assume the weather you encountered wasn't forecast? Presumably you anticipated paying a landing fee on arrival at Shoreham, so what caused you so much grief about paying one at Southampton? Yours in amazement, Simon Miles ----- Original Message ----- From: "Alan Burrows" Subject: RE: Europa-List: Controlled air space article > --> Europa-List message posted by: "Alan Burrows" > > > Just as an aside to this thread. I was on a flight from Guernsey to > Shoreham last week and had to divert into Southampton due to weather > (snow and very low vis.). When we landed at Southampton we were told > they would not wave the landing fee as we had not called a Mayday or Pan > so it was not considered an "emergency divert". They were quite > insistent, but so were we about not paying and after having the matter > referred to the airport manager we won the day. Anyone else experienced > this kind of nonsense ? > > Alan > ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 03:24:01 PM PST US From: "Tim Weert" Subject: Europa-List: The certified Europa? --> Europa-List message posted by: "Tim Weert" Just a question.... Is Ivan Shaw involved in the Liberty LX2 project or did Liberty Aerospace steel the Europa design ? According the pictures at the website the Liberty LX2 is a Europa XS "hightop" with a lot of modifications and a aluminium wing and tailplane. They fitted the Teledyne Continental IOF 240-B See: http://www.libertyaircraft.com Check the performance and specification data. The Max TOW is increased to 1653 lbs / 750 kg ! May be some of you are able to learn us more about the relationship between the Europa XS and the Liberty LX2. Regards, Tim Weert Heerhugowaard, The Netherlands 460 PH-JAI XS TG 914 AP332 ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 05:40:06 PM PST US From: "Rob Housman" Subject: RE: Europa-List: The certified Europa? --> Europa-List message posted by: "Rob Housman" Search the archives using, for example, "Liberty & Shaw" for your search string (without the quotes of course) and you will find some messages on this subject. The similarities between the two aircraft are not a coincidence nor was the Europa "borrowed" from Ivan. Note that the major structural difference between the designs is the Cr-Mo steel tube truss around the cabin and the use of carbon fiber rather than glass in the composite. Best regards, Rob Housman Europa XS Tri-Gear A070 Airframe complete Irvine, CA -----Original Message----- From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Tim Weert Subject: Europa-List: The certified Europa? --> Europa-List message posted by: "Tim Weert" Just a question.... Is Ivan Shaw involved in the Liberty LX2 project or did Liberty Aerospace steel the Europa design ? According the pictures at the website the Liberty LX2 is a Europa XS "hightop" with a lot of modifications and a aluminium wing and tailplane. They fitted the Teledyne Continental IOF 240-B See: http://www.libertyaircraft.com Check the performance and specification data. The Max TOW is increased to 1653 lbs / 750 kg ! May be some of you are able to learn us more about the relationship between the Europa XS and the Liberty LX2. Regards, Tim Weert Heerhugowaard, The Netherlands 460 PH-JAI XS TG 914 AP332 ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 06:27:57 PM PST US From: DuaneFamly@aol.com Subject: Re: Europa-List: Avoiding landing fees by diverting --> Europa-List message posted by: DuaneFamly@aol.com Alan, I agree with Simon......where do you think you are?.....in the States? :-) Do Not Archive Mike ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 07:46:21 PM PST US From: "Rick Audy" Subject: Re: Europa-List: The certified Europa? Seal-Send-Time: Wed, 9 Mar 2005 22:45:08 -0500 --> Europa-List message posted by: "Rick Audy" Hello all, here are 2 good related links: http://www.pilotfriend.com/aircraft%20performance/new%20site2/s_page/gallery1.htm http://www.planeandpilotmag.com/content/2004/july/liberty.html (It's only 140K I bet a lot of us will drop our kits and jump to this) Rick ----- Original Message ----- From: Tim Weert To: europa-list@matronics.com Sent: Wednesday, March 09, 2005 18:22 Subject: Europa-List: The certified Europa? --> Europa-List message posted by: "Tim Weert" > Just a question.... Is Ivan Shaw involved in the Liberty LX2 project or did Liberty Aerospace steel the Europa design ? According the pictures at the website the Liberty LX2 is a Europa XS "hightop" with a lot of modifications and a aluminium wing and tailplane. They fitted the Teledyne Continental IOF 240-B See: http://www.libertyaircraft.com Check the performance and specification data. The Max TOW is increased to 1653 lbs / 750 kg ! May be some of you are able to learn us more about the relationship between the Europa XS and the Liberty LX2. Regards, Tim Weert Heerhugowaard, The Netherlands 460 PH-JAI XS TG 914 AP332