Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 12:45 AM - Re: PFA Feedback (R.C.Harrison)
2. 01:27 AM - Re: PFA Feedback (Alan Burrows)
3. 01:36 AM - Re: PFA Feedback (Jeremy Davey)
4. 01:40 AM - PFA feedback (paul atkinson)
5. 02:17 AM - europa club subscriptions running out (Rowland Carson)
6. 03:31 AM - Re: PFA feedback ()
7. 04:13 AM - FW: PFA Feedback (Alan Burrows)
8. 05:05 AM - Re: FW: PFA Feedback ()
9. 05:25 AM - Increasing Max T/O weight in Holland to 1450 lbs/ 657 kgs (Tim Weert)
10. 06:23 AM - Re: Re: FW: PFA Feedback ()
11. 06:41 AM - Re: Increasing Max T/O weight in Holland to 1450 lbs/ 657 kgs (Fergus Kyle)
12. 06:58 AM - off topic - PFA (Fergus Kyle)
13. 07:26 AM - Mod 70 Weights touching the guide strips (EuropaXSA276@aol.com)
14. 07:32 AM - Re: europa club subscriptions running out (Paul Boulet)
15. 07:41 AM - Re: europa club subscriptions running out (Paul Boulet)
16. 08:18 AM - Re: europa club subscriptions running out (owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com)
17. 08:41 AM - Re: europa club subscriptions running out (David Glauser)
18. 09:09 AM - Re: europa club subscriptions running out (Cory Emberson)
19. 09:20 AM - The price of Bacon Butties (Bryan Allsop)
20. 10:59 AM - WAS Re: PFA Feedback NOW :- Voluntary Services. For British consumption only. (R.C.Harrison)
21. 11:44 AM - Re: WAS Re: PFA Feedback NOW :- Voluntary Services. For British ... (DuaneFamly@aol.com)
22. 12:49 PM - Re: Re: FW: PFA Feedback (Garry)
23. 01:29 PM - Re: europa club subscriptions running out (Rowland Carson)
24. 01:29 PM - europa club newsletter [was: europa club subscriptions running (Rowland Carson)
25. 01:29 PM - europa club membership secretary retirement (Rowland Carson)
26. 01:33 PM - Re: europa club subscriptions running out (Paul Boulet)
27. 01:45 PM - Re: europa club subscriptions running out (Cory Emberson)
28. 03:48 PM - Re: WAS Re: PFA Feedback NOW :- Voluntary Services. (N55XS)
29. 03:53 PM - Re: europa club subscriptions running out (Paul Boulet)
30. 04:13 PM - Re: europa club subscriptions running out (Cory Emberson)
31. 08:22 PM - Re: The price of Bacon Butties (Fergus Kyle)
Message 1
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--> Europa-List message posted by: "R.C.Harrison" <ptag.dev@tiscali.co.uk>
Hi! All
At the expense of continuing this debacle I have to agree with Mark and
Neville, also everyone else has valuable contributions in stating their
opinions but in addition it has to be remembered that all this business
about an "association representing it's members" is somewhat a sham. The
PFA is in my understanding a regulatory branch of the CAA where
membership is compulsory and therefore in effect supposedly a friendly
licensing authority for "Flying for fun". For my humble opinion there
isn't a lot of friendliness about at present on this issue and "others
currently going through the system." The PFA are missing an opportunity
to put out a more human face on this blessed issue. It is preferring to
put it's head "you know where" and continue to allow the "subject jerk"
page space and so called "CREDITS" which ultimately gives him
promotional status which is the kind of "payment" he enjoys, along with
the fact that as a result of the "associated allegations" there is a
huge sum of money been taken out of the aspirations of many would be
builders pockets and the industry that would have swelled the PFA
"membership base" the most important goal needed.
I would call for some sanity to now be engaged and request the PFA to be
considerably and more promptly engaged with the "brotherhood and spirit"
of the diverse talents amongst homebuilders and so be more prepared to
understand the kind of expense and frustrations we have to bear by lots
of the actions it takes. In other systems of regulation our activity is
classed as "experimental" which carries a degree of awe but not
necessarily the level of engineering respect the industry should have.
The PFA should be looking to embrace a position somewhere between that
and which currently prevails even at the expense of loosing a few
pictures!
Sincerely
Bob Harrison (Not loosing my head like all around me YET! But there'll
be a couple of AGM's of interesting content!)
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
NevEyre@aol.com
Subject: Re: Europa-List: PFA Feedback
--> Europa-List message posted by: NevEyre@aol.com
Hi Roger / Gerry / Jeremy / Alan / William / Bob / et all........
I have been just as pissed off that KW is getting photo's ANYWHERE, not
just
in PF [ I would bet real money he IS getting money from the PFA] , and
there
are DOZENS of you out there , who I have spoken with recently, who feel
the
same.
HOW ABOUT ANOTHER FORM OF ATTACK ?
Whether he is getting money for the photo's, it is a comercial venture
he is
operating, do we know anyone in the C.A.A. who can look into the
legality of
useing PFA Permit aircraft, and C.A.A. non public transport cat'
aircraft for
aerial work ?
I know of many ''sorties'' carried out in the Europa demonstrators, if
he
ever recieved ANY money for ANY of those photo's, can we ''get the
ba**ard'' ?
You can also be sure, he will be at Kemble this year, and the PFA will
take
his photo's, unless we can get enough members to make enough noise ?
At the AGM, can someone propose that KW's work is vetoed, and get
enough
members there to force that through ?
Let's pull together on this ?
Cheers,
Nev.
Message 2
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--> Europa-List message posted by: "Alan Burrows" <alan@kestrel-insurance.com>
Bob
I fully agree with your comments, but shouldn't we be addressing these
to Graham Newby not just our own group?
I have passed on my feelings in the strongest possible manner. I have
told him that these "free" photo's he has been receiving were in fact
paid for by Europa and in turn us. even the very expensive digital
camera he managed to walk away with was bought by Europa!
Its only by directing our deep felt concerns directly to him that things
may change, IMHO
So come on guys lets stand up and be counted on this one.
Alan
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
R.C.Harrison
Subject: RE: Europa-List: PFA Feedback
--> Europa-List message posted by: "R.C.Harrison"
--> <ptag.dev@tiscali.co.uk>
Hi! All
At the expense of continuing this debacle I have to agree with Mark and
Neville, also everyone else has valuable contributions in stating their
opinions but in addition it has to be remembered that all this business
about an "association representing it's members" is somewhat a sham. The
PFA is in my understanding a regulatory branch of the CAA where
membership is compulsory and therefore in effect supposedly a friendly
licensing authority for "Flying for fun". For my humble opinion there
isn't a lot of friendliness about at present on this issue and "others
currently going through the system." The PFA are missing an opportunity
to put out a more human face on this blessed issue. It is preferring to
put it's head "you know where" and continue to allow the "subject jerk"
page space and so called "CREDITS" which ultimately gives him
promotional status which is the kind of "payment" he enjoys, along with
the fact that as a result of the "associated allegations" there is a
huge sum of money been taken out of the aspirations of many would be
builders pockets and the industry that would have swelled the PFA
"membership base" the most important goal needed. I would call for some
sanity to now be engaged and request the PFA to be considerably and more
promptly engaged with the "brotherhood and spirit" of the diverse
talents amongst homebuilders and so be more prepared to understand the
kind of expense and frustrations we have to bear by lots of the actions
it takes. In other systems of regulation our activity is classed as
"experimental" which carries a degree of awe but not necessarily the
level of engineering respect the industry should have. The PFA should be
looking to embrace a position somewhere between that and which currently
prevails even at the expense of loosing a few pictures!
Sincerely
Bob Harrison (Not loosing my head like all around me YET! But there'll
be a couple of AGM's of interesting content!)
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
NevEyre@aol.com
Subject: Re: Europa-List: PFA Feedback
--> Europa-List message posted by: NevEyre@aol.com
Hi Roger / Gerry / Jeremy / Alan / William / Bob / et all........ I have
been just as pissed off that KW is getting photo's ANYWHERE, not just
in PF [ I would bet real money he IS getting money from the PFA] , and
there
are DOZENS of you out there , who I have spoken with recently, who feel
the
same.
HOW ABOUT ANOTHER FORM OF ATTACK ?
Whether he is getting money for the photo's, it is a comercial venture
he is
operating, do we know anyone in the C.A.A. who can look into the
legality of
useing PFA Permit aircraft, and C.A.A. non public transport cat'
aircraft for
aerial work ?
I know of many ''sorties'' carried out in the Europa demonstrators, if
he
ever recieved ANY money for ANY of those photo's, can we ''get the
ba**ard'' ? You can also be sure, he will be at Kemble this year, and
the PFA will take
his photo's, unless we can get enough members to make enough noise ? At
the AGM, can someone propose that KW's work is vetoed, and get enough
members there to force that through ?
Let's pull together on this ?
Cheers,
Nev.
Message 3
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--> Europa-List message posted by: "Jeremy Davey" <EuropaFlyer_3@msn.com>
Bob,
Some stuff there I agree with, and some that I'm afraid I violently disagree
with!
The PFA isn't a subsidiary of the PFA, nor is it a monopoly. The system is
that you can build a plane and fly it on a CAA Permit to Fly. The costs
charged by the CAA for allowing you to do this are very high, so amateur
builders have clubbed together and formed the PFA to reduce this cost. If
you don't like the PFA system, you are very welcome to:
1) go direct to the CAA, or
2) try to change the PFA system
I'm trying to do 2), hence I stood for the EC. However, I'm constantly
staggered by the number of folks who are happy to lay into the PFA but run a
mile as soon as the suggestion is raised that they lift a finger to help fix
the problem!
If this issue is to be won with the PFA, it will require effective lobbying.
Someone needs to organise that, and I don't have the time to do anything
more than advise (plane-building, getting married, already helping run the
Europa Club, already trying to sort other things out at the PFA, moving
house, nowhere near retired, etc.).
In short, are you volunteering?
Regards,
Jeremy
Jeremy Davey
Europa Monowheel 537M G-EZZA
Europa Club Vice-Chairman, Webmaster, PFA NC Representative
PFA EC Member
"If you can keep your head when all about you are losing theirs, then it is
possible you haven't grasped the severity of the situation."
Tail done
Standard XS wings with mods underway
CM installed in fuse (with airbrakes fittings)
1400 build hours to date
Intended fit:
Rotax 914 turbo, Airmaster CS fully-feathering prop
Lots of lights, buttons, switches, gizmos, and alarms
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of R.C.Harrison
Subject: RE: Europa-List: PFA Feedback
--> Europa-List message posted by: "R.C.Harrison" <ptag.dev@tiscali.co.uk>
Hi! All
At the expense of continuing this debacle I have to agree with Mark and
Neville, also everyone else has valuable contributions in stating their
opinions but in addition it has to be remembered that all this business
about an "association representing it's members" is somewhat a sham. The
PFA is in my understanding a regulatory branch of the CAA where
membership is compulsory and therefore in effect supposedly a friendly
licensing authority for "Flying for fun". For my humble opinion there
isn't a lot of friendliness about at present on this issue and "others
currently going through the system." The PFA are missing an opportunity
to put out a more human face on this blessed issue. It is preferring to
put it's head "you know where" and continue to allow the "subject jerk"
page space and so called "CREDITS" which ultimately gives him
promotional status which is the kind of "payment" he enjoys, along with
the fact that as a result of the "associated allegations" there is a
huge sum of money been taken out of the aspirations of many would be
builders pockets and the industry that would have swelled the PFA
"membership base" the most important goal needed.
I would call for some sanity to now be engaged and request the PFA to be
considerably and more promptly engaged with the "brotherhood and spirit"
of the diverse talents amongst homebuilders and so be more prepared to
understand the kind of expense and frustrations we have to bear by lots
of the actions it takes. In other systems of regulation our activity is
classed as "experimental" which carries a degree of awe but not
necessarily the level of engineering respect the industry should have.
The PFA should be looking to embrace a position somewhere between that
and which currently prevails even at the expense of loosing a few
pictures!
Sincerely
Bob Harrison (Not loosing my head like all around me YET! But there'll
be a couple of AGM's of interesting content!)
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
NevEyre@aol.com
Subject: Re: Europa-List: PFA Feedback
--> Europa-List message posted by: NevEyre@aol.com
Hi Roger / Gerry / Jeremy / Alan / William / Bob / et all........
I have been just as pissed off that KW is getting photo's ANYWHERE, not
just
in PF [ I would bet real money he IS getting money from the PFA] , and
there
are DOZENS of you out there , who I have spoken with recently, who feel
the
same.
HOW ABOUT ANOTHER FORM OF ATTACK ?
Whether he is getting money for the photo's, it is a comercial venture
he is
operating, do we know anyone in the C.A.A. who can look into the
legality of
useing PFA Permit aircraft, and C.A.A. non public transport cat'
aircraft for
aerial work ?
I know of many ''sorties'' carried out in the Europa demonstrators, if
he
ever recieved ANY money for ANY of those photo's, can we ''get the
ba**ard'' ?
You can also be sure, he will be at Kemble this year, and the PFA will
take
his photo's, unless we can get enough members to make enough noise ?
At the AGM, can someone propose that KW's work is vetoed, and get
enough
members there to force that through ?
Let's pull together on this ?
Cheers,
Nev.
Message 4
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--> Europa-List message posted by: "paul atkinson" <paul@theatkinsons.demon.co.uk>
Peter
Here is my effort.
Regards
Paul
Dear Graham,
I would like to increase your list by one.
I find that your response below is unsatifactory, if not insulting. The
PFA is about its members, and their opinions matter. The magazine is
incidental to the argument. There are no doubt many good photographers out
there who could, and do, contribute to it. I do not believe anyone would
miss Wilson's contribution (if that's what it is)nor do I believe the
magazine would suffer without it.
This industry is populated almost entirely by honest and trustworthy
people, and I for one would like to keep it that way. The PFA as our
representative body should be taking a lead in this and doing everything
in its power to exclude the likes of Wilson from it.
Please take note.
Regards
Paul Atkinson
Roger
Firstly may I say that the " list " is 2 people.
I must commiserate with anybody who lost money or goods through the
collapse
of Europa, and may I say that apart from the not inconsiderable time we,
the
PFA, spent discussing the airworthiness issues with the CAA and the
processes we put in place before Europa was rejuvinated, we also lost some
$B!r(B1000 in advertising revenue that was unpaid.
Having said all this, the collapse of Europa was a commercial business
issue. Keith Wilson has for many years supplied excellent photographs for
the magazine, and all at no cost to the Association. In fact Popular Flying
would have been a much worse publication over the years without Keiths
input.
I hope this satisfies your request.
Best regards
Graham Newby
Chief Executive
Popular Flying Association
01280 846786
Message 5
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Subject: | europa club subscriptions running out |
--> Europa-List message posted by: Rowland Carson <rowil@clara.net>
A good number of people have already renewed their Europa Club
subscriptions, but some have not yet (see list below). Remember that
if subs are not paid by 1st June, membership will lapse. For members
in UK, or with sterling bank accounts, it reduces the Membership
Secretary's workload (and your own) significantly if you set up a
Standing Order. (Some of the poeple listed below said they were doing
that, but no payment has yet been received.) Please contact me via
<memsec@europaclub.org.uk> if you'd like to help me by setting up a
SO. If your name appears in the following alphabetical list, please
take action soon or your membership will lapse!
Karim Bachu
David Bligh
Paul Boulet
Joseph Brannen
Tony Burbidge
Carl Busuttil-Reynaud
Tim Butterworth
Jag Chaggar
Terry Clark
Mike Costin
Roger Cullum
Alan Day
Dave DeFord
Klaus Dietrich
Scott Dingman
Mike Dolphin
Patrick Farrell
Chris Garner
Dennis Gerow
Dave Glowa
Nigel Graham
Phil Hall
John Hanna
Keith Hartley
Eddie Hatcher
Paul Hawkins
Robert Henderson
Malcolm Hendra
Nigel Henry
Malcolm Hexley
Norbert Hoffmann
Rupert Holdsworth
Gerry Holland
Steven Janicki
Andrew Jarvis
Paul Johnson
Paul Kuntz
Ferg Kyle
John Lambert
Richard Lamprey
Doug Lawton
John Lindsay
Roger Lloyd
Stef Loup
Bruce Ludeman
Robert Marston
Miles McCallum
Mike Midderigh
Dave Moore
John Moore
Rick Morris
Tony Moth
Franz Muggli
Chris Napier
Simon Nash
Colin Noakes
Padhraic O'Conghaile
Sean O'Reilly
John Phillingham
Tam Pho
Ben Price
Jim Punter
Robert Reese
James Riley
Roly Robinson
Brian Robshaw
Peter Robson
Gert Rohrer
Michael Scherf
Ursula Schliessler
Rick Sementilli
Tom Sinclair
Bill Sisley
Henry Smolarek
Doug Steven
Martin Stevens
John Tattersdill
Barry Tennant
Mike Toft
Tony Wakefield
Thomas Walt
Francis Warlomont
Chris Washington
Rob Waters
Peter Waugh
Richard Winkler
Martyn Wiseman
Mike Wiseman
Peter Wood
Brian Wratten
Craig Wright
Rob Zeelenberg
regards
Rowland
--
| Rowland Carson Europa Club Membership Secretary - email for info!
| Europa 435 G-ROWI (750 hours building) PFA #16532
| e-mail <memsec@europaclub.org.uk> website <www.europaclub.org.uk>
Message 6
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Subject: | Re: PFA feedback |
--> Europa-List message posted by: <peter.rees05@ntlworld.com>
Mr Newby seens to be telling everyone that the list is only two names long! (and
as I thought, just sending a stock reply - the words are almost exactly the
same as I received).
One way to prove to him (and maybe used as a fact at the AGM) would be to generate
an 'E-petition' on the club site
We each log in, and simply leave our name, PFA membership number and a few words
simply stating that we don't wish a magazine that is supposed to be published
for the enjoyment of its members to use KWs pictures in the future.
I've no idea how to set this E-petition up but I'm sure that one or some of the
computer whizzos who operate the club site could do so quite quickly
Peter
>
> From: "paul atkinson" <paul@theatkinsons.demon.co.uk>
> Date: 2005/05/26 Thu AM 08:40:08 GMT
> To: "europa-list@matronics.com" <europa-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: Europa-List: PFA feedback
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "paul atkinson" <paul@theatkinsons.demon.co.uk>
>
>
> Peter
>
> Here is my effort.
>
> Regards
>
> Paul
>
>
> Dear Graham,
>
> I would like to increase your list by one.
> I find that your response below is unsatifactory, if not insulting. The
> PFA is about its members, and their opinions matter. The magazine is
> incidental to the argument. There are no doubt many good photographers out
> there who could, and do, contribute to it. I do not believe anyone would
> miss Wilson's contribution (if that's what it is)nor do I believe the
> magazine would suffer without it.
> This industry is populated almost entirely by honest and trustworthy
> people, and I for one would like to keep it that way. The PFA as our
> representative body should be taking a lead in this and doing everything
> in its power to exclude the likes of Wilson from it.
> Please take note.
>
> Regards
>
> Paul Atkinson
>
>
> Roger
> Firstly may I say that the " list " is 2 people.
>
> I must commiserate with anybody who lost money or goods through the
> collapse
> of Europa, and may I say that apart from the not inconsiderable time we,
> the
> PFA, spent discussing the airworthiness issues with the CAA and the
> processes we put in place before Europa was rejuvinated, we also lost some
> $B!r(B1000 in advertising revenue that was unpaid.
>
> Having said all this, the collapse of Europa was a commercial business
> issue. Keith Wilson has for many years supplied excellent photographs for
> the magazine, and all at no cost to the Association. In fact Popular Flying
> would have been a much worse publication over the years without Keiths
> input.
>
> I hope this satisfies your request.
>
> Best regards
>
> Graham Newby
> Chief Executive
> Popular Flying Association
>
> 01280 846786
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
-----------------------------------------
Email sent from www.ntlworld.com
virus-checked using McAfee(R) Software
visit www.ntlworld.com/security for more information
Message 7
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--> Europa-List message posted by: "Alan Burrows" <alan@kestrel-insurance.com>
Dear Mr Newby
I have just received this copy of your response to Roger Sheridan, which
I must say surprises me greatly. I am amazed at your complete lack of
understanding of the strength of feeling amongst the Europa family! May
I firstly correct some of the points you made in your letter. Those
"free" photo's you have been receiving over the years were in fact paid
for by Europa, even the camera he used was purchased by Europa! At the
time of a lot of the photo shoots he was being paid a substantial salary
by Europa, even the developing of the photo's was paid for by Europa!
This man ran the company into the ground, despite offers of help and
warnings from many well qualified people, including myself, but he knew
better and ignored all. The free work you speak of has been paid for by
us the Europa owners and now you feel it acceptable to rub salt in our
wounds by continuing to use his work for our association. I wonder who
is paying for the present photo's..! Would you please inform me of the
PFA's attitude to aerial photography Work taking place in permit
aircraft, as this was how most of his photographs were produced. I heard
at the last PFA rally from members, that he was still taking deposits
from people right up to the end, knowing he could not possibly deliver
the goods. I'm sure others will come forward with more proof of this if
it is needed. How clever would the PFA feel if Europa owners decided to
make a real issue of this at the next agm which I am sure they will if
this continues. It is not simply a "commercial matter" as you so naively
put it, but a matter of integrity. surely you have a duty to act in the
best interests of your members? It also has to be in the associations
best interests to use people with high moral standards and not simply
"good photographers". This is our association and we expect it to be run
for our benefit in a proper manner and that does not include winding up
the largest single group of owners within the PFA. I would respectfully
suggest you take a look at the whole picture and not simply adopt an
"its free so I'll take it" stance. Overall the PFA produces an excellent
publication, please don't spoil it by alienating your largest group of
readers. As for the list containing only two names please add me to it
making three!
Alan Burrows
Message 8
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Subject: | Re: PFA Feedback |
--> Europa-List message posted by: <peter.rees05@ntlworld.com>
Mr Newby
Following your reply to me yesterday on the matter, please put me as Number 4 on
your list of people objecting to the use of Mr Wilsons photographs - as Alan
says, just becasue they are free, you shouldn't insult your largest group of
members by using them.
Peter Rees
>
> From: "Alan Burrows" <alan@kestrel-insurance.com>
> Date: 2005/05/26 Thu AM 11:23:55 GMT
> To: <graham.newby@pfa.org.uk>
> Subject: FW: Europa-List: PFA Feedback
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Alan Burrows" <alan@kestrel-insurance.com>
>
>
> Dear Mr Newby
>
> I have just received this copy of your response to Roger Sheridan, which
> I must say surprises me greatly. I am amazed at your complete lack of
> understanding of the strength of feeling amongst the Europa family! May
> I firstly correct some of the points you made in your letter. Those
> "free" photo's you have been receiving over the years were in fact paid
> for by Europa, even the camera he used was purchased by Europa! At the
> time of a lot of the photo shoots he was being paid a substantial salary
> by Europa, even the developing of the photo's was paid for by Europa!
> This man ran the company into the ground, despite offers of help and
> warnings from many well qualified people, including myself, but he knew
> better and ignored all. The free work you speak of has been paid for by
> us the Europa owners and now you feel it acceptable to rub salt in our
> wounds by continuing to use his work for our association. I wonder who
> is paying for the present photo's..! Would you please inform me of the
> PFA's attitude to aerial photography Work taking place in permit
> aircraft, as this was how most of his photographs were produced. I heard
> at the last PFA rally from members, that he was still taking deposits
> from people right up to the end, knowing he could not possibly deliver
> the goods. I'm sure others will come forward with more proof of this if
> it is needed. How clever would the PFA feel if Europa owners decided to
> make a real issue of this at the next agm which I am sure they will if
> this continues. It is not simply a "commercial matter" as you so naively
> put it, but a matter of integrity. surely you have a duty to act in the
> best interests of your members? It also has to be in the associations
> best interests to use people with high moral standards and not simply
> "good photographers". This is our association and we expect it to be run
> for our benefit in a proper manner and that does not include winding up
> the largest single group of owners within the PFA. I would respectfully
> suggest you take a look at the whole picture and not simply adopt an
> "its free so I'll take it" stance. Overall the PFA produces an excellent
> publication, please don't spoil it by alienating your largest group of
> readers. As for the list containing only two names please add me to it
> making three!
>
> Alan Burrows
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
-----------------------------------------
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|
Subject: | Increasing Max T/O weight in Holland to 1450 lbs/ 657 kgs |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Tim Weert" <tim.weert@hccnet.nl>
I spoke Andy Draper about weight and balance calculations. He told me that
the 1370 lbs max T/O weight of the Europa is based on structural tests to
8,55 G loading with 1370 lbs of weight. This figure is decreased by a normal
safety factor of 1,5 for composite structures (which gives a G limit of 5,7
G ) and an other 1,5 "PFA superfactor" which is not a CAA requirement but a
PFA requirement. That PFA based extra "Superfactor" gives the limit of 3,8 G
in our books. The "Super factor" is not used for normal certified VLA
aircraft, only for Experimentals in the UK because of this PFA rule.
In the USA and Canada there is no Superfactor of 1,5 times required for
experimentals. Andy told me that due to this there are Europa's flying in
the USA and Canada with a max T/O Weight of 1450 lbs (or 657 kgs). I would
like to try to increase the Max. T/O weight of my Dutch registrated Europa
also to 1450 lbs in my Permit to Fly, but to get it in my Permit to Fly the
Dutch CAA is requiring a copy of a Permit to Fly from an Europa in the USA
and/or Canada with the 1450 lbs figure on it.
Is there someone with this type of Permit to Fly who can sent me a copy
(scan via email) to be able to increase the Max T/O Weight for Europa's in
The Netherlands to 1450 lbs as well?
Thanks!
Regards,
Tim Weert
Heerhugowaard,
The Netherlands,
#460 PH-JAI TG 914 AP332
Email: tim.weert@hccnet.nl
Message 10
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|
Subject: | Re: PFA Feedback |
--> Europa-List message posted by: <peter.rees05@ntlworld.com>
One of the co-owners of Hotel india has just sent the following to Graham Newby
so, he is number 5 on the list of 2 - any more for any more?
Dear Mr Newby,
I would like to add my name to the list of people showing concern at the
complete lack of respect for the Europa community.
The argument that Mr Wilson is not paid for the pictures does not hold any
water. Are you saying you don't care of the origin
of any pictures you use, as long as they are free ? Are you saying you are
happy to rub salt into the wounds of the
Europa community, because you've acquired some decent photos without cost ?
The PFA is there for it's members, and should be supporting it members, not
deploying this 'tough luck, they're free
so we're going to use them' attitude, which quite frankly, stinks.
Regards,
Michael Bullen
M<embership 035377
>
> From: <peter.rees05@ntlworld.com>
> Date: 2005/05/26 Thu PM 12:04:02 GMT
> To: europa-list@matronics.com, graham.newby@pfa.org.uk
> Subject: Re: FW: Europa-List: PFA Feedback
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: <peter.rees05@ntlworld.com>
>
> Mr Newby
>
> Following your reply to me yesterday on the matter, please put me as Number 4
on your list of people objecting to the use of Mr Wilsons photographs - as Alan
says, just becasue they are free, you shouldn't insult your largest group of
members by using them.
>
> Peter Rees
>
>
> >
> > From: "Alan Burrows" <alan@kestrel-insurance.com>
> > Date: 2005/05/26 Thu AM 11:23:55 GMT
> > To: <graham.newby@pfa.org.uk>
> > Subject: FW: Europa-List: PFA Feedback
> >
> > --> Europa-List message posted by: "Alan Burrows" <alan@kestrel-insurance.com>
> >
> >
> > Dear Mr Newby
> >
> > I have just received this copy of your response to Roger Sheridan, which
> > I must say surprises me greatly. I am amazed at your complete lack of
> > understanding of the strength of feeling amongst the Europa family! May
> > I firstly correct some of the points you made in your letter. Those
> > "free" photo's you have been receiving over the years were in fact paid
> > for by Europa, even the camera he used was purchased by Europa! At the
> > time of a lot of the photo shoots he was being paid a substantial salary
> > by Europa, even the developing of the photo's was paid for by Europa!
> > This man ran the company into the ground, despite offers of help and
> > warnings from many well qualified people, including myself, but he knew
> > better and ignored all. The free work you speak of has been paid for by
> > us the Europa owners and now you feel it acceptable to rub salt in our
> > wounds by continuing to use his work for our association. I wonder who
> > is paying for the present photo's..! Would you please inform me of the
> > PFA's attitude to aerial photography Work taking place in permit
> > aircraft, as this was how most of his photographs were produced. I heard
> > at the last PFA rally from members, that he was still taking deposits
> > from people right up to the end, knowing he could not possibly deliver
> > the goods. I'm sure others will come forward with more proof of this if
> > it is needed. How clever would the PFA feel if Europa owners decided to
> > make a real issue of this at the next agm which I am sure they will if
> > this continues. It is not simply a "commercial matter" as you so naively
> > put it, but a matter of integrity. surely you have a duty to act in the
> > best interests of your members? It also has to be in the associations
> > best interests to use people with high moral standards and not simply
> > "good photographers". This is our association and we expect it to be run
> > for our benefit in a proper manner and that does not include winding up
> > the largest single group of owners within the PFA. I would respectfully
> > suggest you take a look at the whole picture and not simply adopt an
> > "its free so I'll take it" stance. Overall the PFA produces an excellent
> > publication, please don't spoil it by alienating your largest group of
> > readers. As for the list containing only two names please add me to it
> > making three!
> >
> > Alan Burrows
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
> -----------------------------------------
> Email sent from www.ntlworld.com
> virus-checked using McAfee(R) Software
> visit www.ntlworld.com/security for more information
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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|
Subject: | Re: Increasing Max T/O weight in Holland to 1450 lbs/ 657 |
kgs
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Fergus Kyle" <VE3LVO@rac.ca>
Tim,
I may be well off-base for this but, there was a
Canadian-built Europa which was created in Calgary, Alberta and registered
with a Max T/O weight of 1500lb. This I'm told is the result of the rule
which bases the MTO on the wing area, thus permitting a higher weight than
PFA-regulated machines.
Consider this move at an airfield 3500 ft ABL and reaching
summertime temps of over 35deg C. The builder gave me this info at OSH when
we met at the Eur tent. He said they took off at max weight at 35deg many
times and had no trouble with that (he was not a tyro) so it appears that
greater latitude prevails here. Naturalluy one can register at a greater
weight, but use it only for planning for a smooth-air trip for
endurance/range, and still qualify for aeros at a lesser weight. What
overshadows things here is that the ever-voracious givvermint taxes aircraft
annually on its weight. Thus lesser registered weight results in a lesser
financial burden (for the life of the 'plane). Just as a pound weight saved
lasts for the life of the machine, a dollar saved does also. We now pay
taxes on taxes on taxes, so you can imagine the calcs.
Good luck,
Ferg
flamers accepted
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tim Weert" <tim.weert@hccnet.nl>
Subject: Europa-List: Increasing Max T/O weight in Holland to 1450 lbs/ 657
kgs
| --> Europa-List message posted by: "Tim Weert" <tim.weert@hccnet.nl>
|
| I spoke Andy Draper about weight and balance calculations. He told me that
| the 1370 lbs max T/O weight of the Europa is based on structural tests to
| 8,55 G loading with 1370 lbs of weight. This figure is decreased by a
normal
| safety factor of 1,5 for composite structures (which gives a G limit of
5,7
| G ) and an other 1,5 "PFA superfactor" which is not a CAA requirement but
a
| PFA requirement. That PFA based extra "Superfactor" gives the limit of 3,8
G
| in our books. The "Super factor" is not used for normal certified VLA
| aircraft, only for Experimentals in the UK because of this PFA rule.
|
| In the USA and Canada there is no Superfactor of 1,5 times required for
| experimentals. Andy told me that due to this there are Europa's flying in
| the USA and Canada with a max T/O Weight of 1450 lbs (or 657 kgs). I would
| like to try to increase the Max. T/O weight of my Dutch registrated Europa
| also to 1450 lbs in my Permit to Fly, but to get it in my Permit to Fly
the
| Dutch CAA is requiring a copy of a Permit to Fly from an Europa in the USA
| and/or Canada with the 1450 lbs figure on it.
|
| Is there someone with this type of Permit to Fly who can sent me a copy
| (scan via email) to be able to increase the Max T/O Weight for Europa's in
| The Netherlands to 1450 lbs as well?
| Thanks!
|
| Regards,
|
| Tim Weert
| Heerhugowaard,
| The Netherlands,
| #460 PH-JAI TG 914 AP332
| Email: tim.weert@hccnet.nl
|
|
|
|
|
|
Message 12
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|
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Fergus Kyle" <VE3LVO@rac.ca>
Folks -
Those of you involved in the UK in the firm's writhings are
undoubtedly sincere in the intensity of your attitudes. One can sense that
readily.
However for those of us (touched or not by Nameless'
indiscretions) who abide on the outer fringes - NA, SA, AFR, ASIA and AUS -
the results are variously distant, comic, distressing or in one or two
cases, infuriating. Perhaps you can see the attitudes of several hundred
fellow builders being affected by an essentially local event - as is
photgraphy for a national publication.
This is countered here by following the DOTH series for the
pleasure of seeing good friends enjoying their hundred-pound butties........
which distance may stifle here.
Nevertheless, please consider making your campaign on another
URL, or at least on a lesser address list. This will serve to prevent
polarising a fairly cohesive group - to the detriment of us all.
E&OE
Cheers, Ferg
PS: It appears that PFA is an association which has legal and procedural
powers which transcend the term. It is interesting to see the different
impressions various members reveal of the establishment.
Message 13
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|
Subject: | Mod 70 Weights touching the guide strips |
--> Europa-List message posted by: EuropaXSA276@aol.com
Friends:
Question.
How much luck have you all had about centering the balance weight between
the 2 guide strips so they will not touch per the instructions?
I worked on the positioning of the containment bracket < thankfully my top
is not on> for a few hours last night. I could not get bracket positioned to
the point the weight would not at very least brush oh so lightly against the
guides with full range of movement.
There is only about a 2 mm clearance on each side. The weight will certainly
ride against the guides most of the time unless the aircraft be parked and
securely tied down!
In addition it appears that the guide strip could be a bit long than what was
supplied. I will probably have to round off the top of the guide to prevent
any hang ups. I'm thinking of rounding the aft edge as well to prevent a hang
up if the two weight were ever to separate and cause a gap. < I'm thinking
this is why there is a spacer now provided over the old 00M hose clamp>
Anyone else with this problem with guide spacing?
Brian Skelly
Texas
Europa # A276 TriGear
See My build photos at:
http://www.europaowners.org/BrianS
Message 14
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|
Subject: | Re: europa club subscriptions running out |
--> Europa-List message posted by: Paul Boulet <possibletodo@yahoo.com>
Hi Rowland;
Please renew my membership. I'll send you my
Mastercard in two separate emails. The first numbers
are 54994409017 and the card expires 9/05.
Also, can you put my Europa up for sale in the
magazine? It is at www.barnstormers.com and I've also
attached a copy of the text to this email. Thanks
Paul Boulet
--- Rowland Carson <rowil@clara.net> wrote:
> --> Europa-List message posted by: Rowland Carson
> <rowil@clara.net>
>
> A good number of people have already renewed their
> Europa Club
> subscriptions, but some have not yet (see list
> below). Remember that
> if subs are not paid by 1st June, membership will
> lapse. For members
> in UK, or with sterling bank accounts, it reduces
> the Membership
> Secretary's workload (and your own) significantly if
> you set up a
> Standing Order. (Some of the poeple listed below
> said they were doing
> that, but no payment has yet been received.) Please
> contact me via
> <memsec@europaclub.org.uk> if you'd like to help me
> by setting up a
> SO. If your name appears in the following
> alphabetical list, please
> take action soon or your membership will lapse!
>
> Karim Bachu
> David Bligh
> Paul Boulet
> Joseph Brannen
> Tony Burbidge
> Carl Busuttil-Reynaud
> Tim Butterworth
> Jag Chaggar
> Terry Clark
> Mike Costin
> Roger Cullum
> Alan Day
> Dave DeFord
> Klaus Dietrich
> Scott Dingman
> Mike Dolphin
> Patrick Farrell
> Chris Garner
> Dennis Gerow
> Dave Glowa
> Nigel Graham
> Phil Hall
> John Hanna
> Keith Hartley
> Eddie Hatcher
> Paul Hawkins
> Robert Henderson
> Malcolm Hendra
> Nigel Henry
> Malcolm Hexley
> Norbert Hoffmann
> Rupert Holdsworth
> Gerry Holland
> Steven Janicki
> Andrew Jarvis
> Paul Johnson
> Paul Kuntz
> Ferg Kyle
> John Lambert
> Richard Lamprey
> Doug Lawton
> John Lindsay
> Roger Lloyd
> Stef Loup
> Bruce Ludeman
> Robert Marston
> Miles McCallum
> Mike Midderigh
> Dave Moore
> John Moore
> Rick Morris
> Tony Moth
> Franz Muggli
> Chris Napier
> Simon Nash
> Colin Noakes
> Padhraic O'Conghaile
> Sean O'Reilly
> John Phillingham
> Tam Pho
> Ben Price
> Jim Punter
> Robert Reese
> James Riley
> Roly Robinson
> Brian Robshaw
> Peter Robson
> Gert Rohrer
> Michael Scherf
> Ursula Schliessler
> Rick Sementilli
> Tom Sinclair
> Bill Sisley
> Henry Smolarek
> Doug Steven
> Martin Stevens
> John Tattersdill
> Barry Tennant
> Mike Toft
> Tony Wakefield
> Thomas Walt
> Francis Warlomont
> Chris Washington
> Rob Waters
> Peter Waugh
> Richard Winkler
> Martyn Wiseman
> Mike Wiseman
> Peter Wood
> Brian Wratten
> Craig Wright
> Rob Zeelenberg
>
> regards
>
> Rowland
> --
> - email for info!
> <www.europaclub.org.uk>
>
>
>
> browse
> Subscriptions page,
> FAQ,
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 15
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|
Subject: | Re: europa club subscriptions running out |
--> Europa-List message posted by: Paul Boulet <possibletodo@yahoo.com>
oops...forgot to attach the text doc to sell my
plane... it's included on this one. Also the
remaining numbers on my cc are 38919.
Let me know if questions. Thanks
Paul Boulet
--- Rowland Carson <rowil@clara.net> wrote:
> --> Europa-List message posted by: Rowland Carson
> <rowil@clara.net>
>
> A good number of people have already renewed their
> Europa Club
> subscriptions, but some have not yet (see list
> below). Remember that
> if subs are not paid by 1st June, membership will
> lapse. For members
> in UK, or with sterling bank accounts, it reduces
> the Membership
> Secretary's workload (and your own) significantly if
> you set up a
> Standing Order. (Some of the poeple listed below
> said they were doing
> that, but no payment has yet been received.) Please
> contact me via
> <memsec@europaclub.org.uk> if you'd like to help me
> by setting up a
> SO. If your name appears in the following
> alphabetical list, please
> take action soon or your membership will lapse!
>
> Karim Bachu
> David Bligh
> Paul Boulet
> Joseph Brannen
> Tony Burbidge
> Carl Busuttil-Reynaud
> Tim Butterworth
> Jag Chaggar
> Terry Clark
> Mike Costin
> Roger Cullum
> Alan Day
> Dave DeFord
> Klaus Dietrich
> Scott Dingman
> Mike Dolphin
> Patrick Farrell
> Chris Garner
> Dennis Gerow
> Dave Glowa
> Nigel Graham
> Phil Hall
> John Hanna
> Keith Hartley
> Eddie Hatcher
> Paul Hawkins
> Robert Henderson
> Malcolm Hendra
> Nigel Henry
> Malcolm Hexley
> Norbert Hoffmann
> Rupert Holdsworth
> Gerry Holland
> Steven Janicki
> Andrew Jarvis
> Paul Johnson
> Paul Kuntz
> Ferg Kyle
> John Lambert
> Richard Lamprey
> Doug Lawton
> John Lindsay
> Roger Lloyd
> Stef Loup
> Bruce Ludeman
> Robert Marston
> Miles McCallum
> Mike Midderigh
> Dave Moore
> John Moore
> Rick Morris
> Tony Moth
> Franz Muggli
> Chris Napier
> Simon Nash
> Colin Noakes
> Padhraic O'Conghaile
> Sean O'Reilly
> John Phillingham
> Tam Pho
> Ben Price
> Jim Punter
> Robert Reese
> James Riley
> Roly Robinson
> Brian Robshaw
> Peter Robson
> Gert Rohrer
> Michael Scherf
> Ursula Schliessler
> Rick Sementilli
> Tom Sinclair
> Bill Sisley
> Henry Smolarek
> Doug Steven
> Martin Stevens
> John Tattersdill
> Barry Tennant
> Mike Toft
> Tony Wakefield
> Thomas Walt
> Francis Warlomont
> Chris Washington
> Rob Waters
> Peter Waugh
> Richard Winkler
> Martyn Wiseman
> Mike Wiseman
> Peter Wood
> Brian Wratten
> Craig Wright
> Rob Zeelenberg
>
> regards
>
> Rowland
> --
> - email for info!
> <www.europaclub.org.uk>
>
>
>
> browse
> Subscriptions page,
> FAQ,
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 16
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|
Subject: | Re: europa club subscriptions running out |
--> Europa-List message posted by:
You just let that mail go to all on the list, Poul..........
uuuuuuups....
Happy landings
Regards Gert
Gert Dalgaard Soerensen
Stabelvej 9, Haarby
DK 8660 Skanderborg
Denmark
Europa builder No. 151
Europa Classic / Rotax 914
AC reg.: OY-GDS
Phone.: +45 8695 0595
E mail: lgds@post6.tele.dk
http://home19.inet.tele.dk/dalgaard/oygds.jpeg
http://www.oy-reg.dk/billeder/l613.jpg
Den 26/05/2005 kl. 16.40 skrev Paul Boulet:
> --> Europa-List message posted by: Paul Boulet
> <possibletodo@yahoo.com>
>
> oops...forgot to attach the text doc to sell my
> plane... it's included on this one. Also the
> remaining numbers on my cc are 38919.
>
> Let me know if questions. Thanks
> Paul Boulet
> --- Rowland Carson <rowil@clara.net> wrote:
>
>> --> Europa-List message posted by: Rowland Carson
>> <rowil@clara.net>
>>
>> A good number of people have already renewed their
>> Europa Club
>> subscriptions, but some have not yet (see list
>> below). Remember that
>> if subs are not paid by 1st June, membership will
>> lapse. For members
>> in UK, or with sterling bank accounts, it reduces
>> the Membership
>> Secretary's workload (and your own) significantly if
>> you set up a
>> Standing Order. (Some of the poeple listed below
>> said they were doing
>> that, but no payment has yet been received.) Please
>> contact me via
>> <memsec@europaclub.org.uk> if you'd like to help me
>> by setting up a
>> SO. If your name appears in the following
>> alphabetical list, please
>> take action soon or your membership will lapse!
>>
>> Karim Bachu
>> David Bligh
>> Paul Boulet
>> Joseph Brannen
>> Tony Burbidge
>> Carl Busuttil-Reynaud
>> Tim Butterworth
>> Jag Chaggar
>> Terry Clark
>> Mike Costin
>> Roger Cullum
>> Alan Day
>> Dave DeFord
>> Klaus Dietrich
>> Scott Dingman
>> Mike Dolphin
>> Patrick Farrell
>> Chris Garner
>> Dennis Gerow
>> Dave Glowa
>> Nigel Graham
>> Phil Hall
>> John Hanna
>> Keith Hartley
>> Eddie Hatcher
>> Paul Hawkins
>> Robert Henderson
>> Malcolm Hendra
>> Nigel Henry
>> Malcolm Hexley
>> Norbert Hoffmann
>> Rupert Holdsworth
>> Gerry Holland
>> Steven Janicki
>> Andrew Jarvis
>> Paul Johnson
>> Paul Kuntz
>> Ferg Kyle
>> John Lambert
>> Richard Lamprey
>> Doug Lawton
>> John Lindsay
>> Roger Lloyd
>> Stef Loup
>> Bruce Ludeman
>> Robert Marston
>> Miles McCallum
>> Mike Midderigh
>> Dave Moore
>> John Moore
>> Rick Morris
>> Tony Moth
>> Franz Muggli
>> Chris Napier
>> Simon Nash
>> Colin Noakes
>> Padhraic O'Conghaile
>> Sean O'Reilly
>> John Phillingham
>> Tam Pho
>> Ben Price
>> Jim Punter
>> Robert Reese
>> James Riley
>> Roly Robinson
>> Brian Robshaw
>> Peter Robson
>> Gert Rohrer
>> Michael Scherf
>> Ursula Schliessler
>> Rick Sementilli
>> Tom Sinclair
>> Bill Sisley
>> Henry Smolarek
>> Doug Steven
>> Martin Stevens
>> John Tattersdill
>> Barry Tennant
>> Mike Toft
>> Tony Wakefield
>> Thomas Walt
>> Francis Warlomont
>> Chris Washington
>> Rob Waters
>> Peter Waugh
>> Richard Winkler
>> Martyn Wiseman
>> Mike Wiseman
>> Peter Wood
>> Brian Wratten
>> Craig Wright
>> Rob Zeelenberg
>>
>> regards
>>
>> Rowland
>> --
>> | Rowland Carson Europa Club Membership Secretary
>> - email for info!
>> | Europa 435 G-ROWI (750 hours building) PFA #16532
>> | e-mail <memsec@europaclub.org.uk> website
>> <www.europaclub.org.uk>
>>
>>
>>
>> browse
>> Subscriptions page,
>> FAQ,
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
Message 17
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|
Subject: | Re: europa club subscriptions running out |
--> Europa-List message posted by: David Glauser <dglauser@gmail.com>
Everyone, quick - go grab your Aircraft Spruce catalogs! Its order time !
<g>
David
On 5/26/05, owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
<owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com> wrote:
> --> Europa-List message posted by:
>
> You just let that mail go to all on the list, Poul..........
> uuuuuuups....
> Happy landings
> Regards Gert
>
> Gert Dalgaard Soerensen
> Stabelvej 9, Haarby
> DK 8660 Skanderborg
> Denmark
>
> Europa builder No. 151
> Europa Classic / Rotax 914
> AC reg.: OY-GDS
>
> Phone.: +45 8695 0595
> E mail: lgds@post6.tele.dk
> http://home19.inet.tele.dk/dalgaard/oygds.jpeg
> http://www.oy-reg.dk/billeder/l613.jpg
>
>
> Den 26/05/2005 kl. 16.40 skrev Paul Boulet:
>
> > --> Europa-List message posted by: Paul Boulet
> > <possibletodo@yahoo.com>
> >
> > oops...forgot to attach the text doc to sell my
> > plane... it's included on this one. Also the
> > remaining numbers on my cc are 38919.
> >
> > Let me know if questions. Thanks
> > Paul Boulet
> > --- Rowland Carson <rowil@clara.net> wrote:
> >
> >> --> Europa-List message posted by: Rowland Carson
> >> <rowil@clara.net>
> >>
> >> A good number of people have already renewed their
> >> Europa Club
> >> subscriptions, but some have not yet (see list
> >> below). Remember that
> >> if subs are not paid by 1st June, membership will
> >> lapse. For members
> >> in UK, or with sterling bank accounts, it reduces
> >> the Membership
> >> Secretary's workload (and your own) significantly if
> >> you set up a
> >> Standing Order. (Some of the poeple listed below
> >> said they were doing
> >> that, but no payment has yet been received.) Please
> >> contact me via
> >> <memsec@europaclub.org.uk> if you'd like to help me
> >> by setting up a
> >> SO. If your name appears in the following
> >> alphabetical list, please
> >> take action soon or your membership will lapse!
> >>
> >> Karim Bachu
> >> David Bligh
> >> Paul Boulet
> >> Joseph Brannen
> >> Tony Burbidge
> >> Carl Busuttil-Reynaud
> >> Tim Butterworth
> >> Jag Chaggar
> >> Terry Clark
> >> Mike Costin
> >> Roger Cullum
> >> Alan Day
> >> Dave DeFord
> >> Klaus Dietrich
> >> Scott Dingman
> >> Mike Dolphin
> >> Patrick Farrell
> >> Chris Garner
> >> Dennis Gerow
> >> Dave Glowa
> >> Nigel Graham
> >> Phil Hall
> >> John Hanna
> >> Keith Hartley
> >> Eddie Hatcher
> >> Paul Hawkins
> >> Robert Henderson
> >> Malcolm Hendra
> >> Nigel Henry
> >> Malcolm Hexley
> >> Norbert Hoffmann
> >> Rupert Holdsworth
> >> Gerry Holland
> >> Steven Janicki
> >> Andrew Jarvis
> >> Paul Johnson
> >> Paul Kuntz
> >> Ferg Kyle
> >> John Lambert
> >> Richard Lamprey
> >> Doug Lawton
> >> John Lindsay
> >> Roger Lloyd
> >> Stef Loup
> >> Bruce Ludeman
> >> Robert Marston
> >> Miles McCallum
> >> Mike Midderigh
> >> Dave Moore
> >> John Moore
> >> Rick Morris
> >> Tony Moth
> >> Franz Muggli
> >> Chris Napier
> >> Simon Nash
> >> Colin Noakes
> >> Padhraic O'Conghaile
> >> Sean O'Reilly
> >> John Phillingham
> >> Tam Pho
> >> Ben Price
> >> Jim Punter
> >> Robert Reese
> >> James Riley
> >> Roly Robinson
> >> Brian Robshaw
> >> Peter Robson
> >> Gert Rohrer
> >> Michael Scherf
> >> Ursula Schliessler
> >> Rick Sementilli
> >> Tom Sinclair
> >> Bill Sisley
> >> Henry Smolarek
> >> Doug Steven
> >> Martin Stevens
> >> John Tattersdill
> >> Barry Tennant
> >> Mike Toft
> >> Tony Wakefield
> >> Thomas Walt
> >> Francis Warlomont
> >> Chris Washington
> >> Rob Waters
> >> Peter Waugh
> >> Richard Winkler
> >> Martyn Wiseman
> >> Mike Wiseman
> >> Peter Wood
> >> Brian Wratten
> >> Craig Wright
> >> Rob Zeelenberg
> >>
> >> regards
> >>
> >> Rowland
> >> --
> >> | Rowland Carson Europa Club Membership Secretary
> >> - email for info!
> >> | Europa 435 G-ROWI (750 hours building) PFA #16532
> >> | e-mail <memsec@europaclub.org.uk> website
> >> <www.europaclub.org.uk>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> browse
> >> Subscriptions page,
> >> FAQ,
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 18
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|
Subject: | europa club subscriptions running out |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Cory Emberson" <bootless@earthlink.net>
ROFL! (Oregon Aero for me - I've always wanted an ejection seat!)
:-)
Do Not Archive
--> Europa-List message posted by: David Glauser <dglauser@gmail.com>
Everyone, quick - go grab your Aircraft Spruce catalogs! Its order time !
<g>
David
On 5/26/05, owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
<owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com> wrote:
> --> Europa-List message posted by:
>
> You just let that mail go to all on the list, Poul..........
> uuuuuuups....
> Happy landings
> Regards Gert
>
> Gert Dalgaard Soerensen
> Stabelvej 9, Haarby
> DK 8660 Skanderborg
> Denmark
>
> Europa builder No. 151
> Europa Classic / Rotax 914
> AC reg.: OY-GDS
>
> Phone.: +45 8695 0595
> E mail: lgds@post6.tele.dk
> http://home19.inet.tele.dk/dalgaard/oygds.jpeg
> http://www.oy-reg.dk/billeder/l613.jpg
>
>
> Den 26/05/2005 kl. 16.40 skrev Paul Boulet:
>
> > --> Europa-List message posted by: Paul Boulet
> > <possibletodo@yahoo.com>
> >
> > oops...forgot to attach the text doc to sell my
> > plane... it's included on this one. Also the
> > remaining numbers on my cc are 38919.
> >
> > Let me know if questions. Thanks
> > Paul Boulet
> > --- Rowland Carson <rowil@clara.net> wrote:
> >
> >> --> Europa-List message posted by: Rowland Carson
> >> <rowil@clara.net>
> >>
> >> A good number of people have already renewed their
> >> Europa Club
> >> subscriptions, but some have not yet (see list
> >> below). Remember that
> >> if subs are not paid by 1st June, membership will
> >> lapse. For members
> >> in UK, or with sterling bank accounts, it reduces
> >> the Membership
> >> Secretary's workload (and your own) significantly if
> >> you set up a
> >> Standing Order. (Some of the poeple listed below
> >> said they were doing
> >> that, but no payment has yet been received.) Please
> >> contact me via
> >> <memsec@europaclub.org.uk> if you'd like to help me
> >> by setting up a
> >> SO. If your name appears in the following
> >> alphabetical list, please
> >> take action soon or your membership will lapse!
> >>
> >> Karim Bachu
> >> David Bligh
> >> Paul Boulet
> >> Joseph Brannen
> >> Tony Burbidge
> >> Carl Busuttil-Reynaud
> >> Tim Butterworth
> >> Jag Chaggar
> >> Terry Clark
> >> Mike Costin
> >> Roger Cullum
> >> Alan Day
> >> Dave DeFord
> >> Klaus Dietrich
> >> Scott Dingman
> >> Mike Dolphin
> >> Patrick Farrell
> >> Chris Garner
> >> Dennis Gerow
> >> Dave Glowa
> >> Nigel Graham
> >> Phil Hall
> >> John Hanna
> >> Keith Hartley
> >> Eddie Hatcher
> >> Paul Hawkins
> >> Robert Henderson
> >> Malcolm Hendra
> >> Nigel Henry
> >> Malcolm Hexley
> >> Norbert Hoffmann
> >> Rupert Holdsworth
> >> Gerry Holland
> >> Steven Janicki
> >> Andrew Jarvis
> >> Paul Johnson
> >> Paul Kuntz
> >> Ferg Kyle
> >> John Lambert
> >> Richard Lamprey
> >> Doug Lawton
> >> John Lindsay
> >> Roger Lloyd
> >> Stef Loup
> >> Bruce Ludeman
> >> Robert Marston
> >> Miles McCallum
> >> Mike Midderigh
> >> Dave Moore
> >> John Moore
> >> Rick Morris
> >> Tony Moth
> >> Franz Muggli
> >> Chris Napier
> >> Simon Nash
> >> Colin Noakes
> >> Padhraic O'Conghaile
> >> Sean O'Reilly
> >> John Phillingham
> >> Tam Pho
> >> Ben Price
> >> Jim Punter
> >> Robert Reese
> >> James Riley
> >> Roly Robinson
> >> Brian Robshaw
> >> Peter Robson
> >> Gert Rohrer
> >> Michael Scherf
> >> Ursula Schliessler
> >> Rick Sementilli
> >> Tom Sinclair
> >> Bill Sisley
> >> Henry Smolarek
> >> Doug Steven
> >> Martin Stevens
> >> John Tattersdill
> >> Barry Tennant
> >> Mike Toft
> >> Tony Wakefield
> >> Thomas Walt
> >> Francis Warlomont
> >> Chris Washington
> >> Rob Waters
> >> Peter Waugh
> >> Richard Winkler
> >> Martyn Wiseman
> >> Mike Wiseman
> >> Peter Wood
> >> Brian Wratten
> >> Craig Wright
> >> Rob Zeelenberg
> >>
> >> regards
> >>
> >> Rowland
> >> --
> >> | Rowland Carson Europa Club Membership Secretary
> >> - email for info!
> >> | Europa 435 G-ROWI (750 hours building) PFA #16532
> >> | e-mail <memsec@europaclub.org.uk> website
> >> <www.europaclub.org.uk>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> browse
> >> Subscriptions page,
> >> FAQ,
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 19
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|
Subject: | The price of Bacon Butties |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Bryan Allsop" <bryan@blackballclub.com>
Sorry Fergus! The exchange rate may not be good, but my bacon butty and
coffee cost less than two pounds on Wednesday.
Cheers, Dother Bryan.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Fergus Kyle" <VE3LVO@rac.ca>
Subject: Europa-List: off topic - PFA
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Fergus Kyle" <VE3LVO@rac.ca>
>
> Folks -
> Those of you involved in the UK in the firm's writhings are
> undoubtedly sincere in the intensity of your attitudes. One can sense that
> readily.
> However for those of us (touched or not by Nameless'
> indiscretions) who abide on the outer fringes - NA, SA, AFR, ASIA and
> AUS -
> the results are variously distant, comic, distressing or in one or two
> cases, infuriating. Perhaps you can see the attitudes of several hundred
> fellow builders being affected by an essentially local event - as is
> photgraphy for a national publication.
> This is countered here by following the DOTH series for the
> pleasure of seeing good friends enjoying their hundred-pound
> butties........
> which distance may stifle here.
> Nevertheless, please consider making your campaign on another
> URL, or at least on a lesser address list. This will serve to prevent
> polarising a fairly cohesive group - to the detriment of us all.
> E&OE
> Cheers, Ferg
> PS: It appears that PFA is an association which has legal and procedural
> powers which transcend the term. It is interesting to see the different
> impressions various members reveal of the establishment.
>
>
>
Message 20
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|
Subject: | PFA Feedback NOW :- Voluntary Services. For British |
consumption only.
--> Europa-List message posted by: "R.C.Harrison" <ptag.dev@tiscali.co.uk>
I registered my disappointment of the association of the PFA Mag with
Wilson about two months ago it is still valid and will be for ever, Mr.
Newby please listen up.....
Sorry, you American guys but we are sympathising for a lot of your
buddys, just turn it off if you don't like it.
Now to Jeremy Davey....
"In short, are you volunteering?......."
I just may have, up to about 3 weeks ago but I have no wish to be part
of the management of any organisation that has dished up what has
prevailed over me behind the scenes from this group in this period.
If my perception or even suggestions are wrong or incorrect then why
hasn't my communications from 23rd April, 28th April and accompanying
letter which was sent with my application for a cable retention "variant
option" to Mod. 70 dated 12th May received the courtesy of either a
reply, acknowledgement or a 'phone call even now? Except when I called I
was arrogantly told to "make a written application send 45 and get in
the queue."
As I see it you picked up the challenge of being on the EC and you'll be
judged on whether the PFA are ultimately listening or not. From where I
stand I can't see a flutter of a move towards inclusiveness, or signs of
a user caring organisation other than an authoritarian regulator which
you and Rickard have even tried to extend through the Europa Club.
(Excepting the representation and lobbying on our behalf at the
International Organisations who are frustrating our sport of which we
get limited information)
If the "membership base" is to flourish tinkering at the edges changing
titles like "flying for fun" or inviting members to go the CAA way isn't
going to improve it, just hard work to enable and encourage greater
numbers of home builders to indulge is what's needed. This means less
time taken to make simple engineering decisions and just a little bit of
communication about the subject matter of a builders view point, problem
or suggestion. We "the membership" have to be able to relate to
newcomers truthfully as to how we see the PFA, in good light or bad and
my experiences have only been good when I've managed to get one to one
direct verbal communication with the Chief Engineer. IMHO the rest of
the team need to take a leaf out of his book.
Bob Harrison.
Message 21
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|
Subject: | Re: PFA Feedback NOW :- Voluntary Services. For British |
...
--> Europa-List message posted by: DuaneFamly@aol.com
Bob, et al,
Since I am in the USA, I have no weight with the PFA. There are many people
throughout the world that have been screwed by this man that are also not
members. However, I do feel that, as a group, we should show solidarity when
"morally reprehensible" acts are undertaken against citizen of our flying
community. I don't see how the PFA, or any group, cannot see the disdain for this
man held by our group due to his actions and feel that shunning him would help
prevent his ability to re-enter any flying business again. While he did not
get jail time because a legal law was not broken, he broke a moral law and
his shunning would be a moral penalty that could serve a purpose.
Mike Duane A207
Redding, California
XS Conventional Gear
Top On! Now going forward by working in the aft portion of the fuselage.
I am so glad I built that shelf behind the BB bulkhead.
Message 22
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|
Subject: | Re: PFA Feedback |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Garry" <garrys@tampabay.rr.com>
Dear Mr. Newby,
Please add my name to the list of people (Europa Owners) who oppose any
association of the PFA with Keith Wilson. There's an old saying, that "we
are known by the company we keep". Mr. Wilson is a snake of the lowest
order, and if the PFA associates with him, then....................
Garry Stout
----- Original Message -----
From: <peter.rees05@ntlworld.com>
Subject: Re: Re: FW: Europa-List: PFA Feedback
> --> Europa-List message posted by: <peter.rees05@ntlworld.com>
>
> One of the co-owners of Hotel india has just sent the following to Graham
> Newby so, he is number 5 on the list of 2 - any more for any more?
>
>
> Dear Mr Newby,
>
> I would like to add my name to the list of people showing concern at the
> complete lack of respect for the Europa community.
>
> The argument that Mr Wilson is not paid for the pictures does not hold any
> water. Are you saying you don't care of the origin
> of any pictures you use, as long as they are free ? Are you saying you
> are
> happy to rub salt into the wounds of the
> Europa community, because you've acquired some decent photos without cost
> ?
>
> The PFA is there for it's members, and should be supporting it members,
> not
> deploying this 'tough luck, they're free
> so we're going to use them' attitude, which quite frankly, stinks.
>
> Regards,
>
> Michael Bullen
> M<embership 035377
>
>
>>
>> From: <peter.rees05@ntlworld.com>
>> Date: 2005/05/26 Thu PM 12:04:02 GMT
>> To: europa-list@matronics.com, graham.newby@pfa.org.uk
>> Subject: Re: FW: Europa-List: PFA Feedback
>>
>> --> Europa-List message posted by: <peter.rees05@ntlworld.com>
>>
>> Mr Newby
>>
>> Following your reply to me yesterday on the matter, please put me as
>> Number 4 on your list of people objecting to the use of Mr Wilsons
>> photographs - as Alan says, just becasue they are free, you shouldn't
>> insult your largest group of members by using them.
>>
>> Peter Rees
>>
>>
>> >
>> > From: "Alan Burrows" <alan@kestrel-insurance.com>
>> > Date: 2005/05/26 Thu AM 11:23:55 GMT
>> > To: <graham.newby@pfa.org.uk>
>> > Subject: FW: Europa-List: PFA Feedback
>> >
>> > --> Europa-List message posted by: "Alan Burrows"
>> > <alan@kestrel-insurance.com>
>> >
>> >
>> > Dear Mr Newby
>> >
>> > I have just received this copy of your response to Roger Sheridan,
>> > which
>> > I must say surprises me greatly. I am amazed at your complete lack of
>> > understanding of the strength of feeling amongst the Europa family! May
>> > I firstly correct some of the points you made in your letter. Those
>> > "free" photo's you have been receiving over the years were in fact paid
>> > for by Europa, even the camera he used was purchased by Europa! At the
>> > time of a lot of the photo shoots he was being paid a substantial
>> > salary
>> > by Europa, even the developing of the photo's was paid for by Europa!
>> > This man ran the company into the ground, despite offers of help and
>> > warnings from many well qualified people, including myself, but he knew
>> > better and ignored all. The free work you speak of has been paid for by
>> > us the Europa owners and now you feel it acceptable to rub salt in our
>> > wounds by continuing to use his work for our association. I wonder who
>> > is paying for the present photo's..! Would you please inform me of the
>> > PFA's attitude to aerial photography Work taking place in permit
>> > aircraft, as this was how most of his photographs were produced. I
>> > heard
>> > at the last PFA rally from members, that he was still taking deposits
>> > from people right up to the end, knowing he could not possibly deliver
>> > the goods. I'm sure others will come forward with more proof of this if
>> > it is needed. How clever would the PFA feel if Europa owners decided to
>> > make a real issue of this at the next agm which I am sure they will if
>> > this continues. It is not simply a "commercial matter" as you so
>> > naively
>> > put it, but a matter of integrity. surely you have a duty to act in the
>> > best interests of your members? It also has to be in the associations
>> > best interests to use people with high moral standards and not simply
>> > "good photographers". This is our association and we expect it to be
>> > run
>> > for our benefit in a proper manner and that does not include winding up
>> > the largest single group of owners within the PFA. I would
>> > respectfully
>> > suggest you take a look at the whole picture and not simply adopt an
>> > "its free so I'll take it" stance. Overall the PFA produces an
>> > excellent
>> > publication, please don't spoil it by alienating your largest group of
>> > readers. As for the list containing only two names please add me to it
>> > making three!
>> >
>> > Alan Burrows
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>>
>> -----------------------------------------
>> Email sent from www.ntlworld.com
>> virus-checked using McAfee(R) Software
>> visit www.ntlworld.com/security for more information
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
> -----------------------------------------
> Email sent from www.ntlworld.com
> virus-checked using McAfee(R) Software
> visit www.ntlworld.com/security for more information
>
>
>
Message 23
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|
Subject: | Re: europa club subscriptions running out |
--> Europa-List message posted by: Rowland Carson <rowil@clara.net>
At 2005-05-26 07:31 -0700 Paul Boulet wrote:
>Please renew my membership. I'll send you my
>Mastercard
Paul - thanks for the renewal. Apologies to everyone on the Matronics
list for replying here, but I think there are things that everyone
needs to be aware of.
First, I counsel against sending card numbers (or bank details) in
e-mail messages unless you use PGP or encryption of equivalent
strength. Yes, people have previously sent me their card numbers in
plain-text e-mail, some using a similar splitting tactic, and (as far
as I know) none have suffered ill as a result. However, there is a
first time for everything!
Second, this illustrates the care needed when replying to messages on
e-mail lists. Please think before hitting that "reply" button. You
may have to copy and paste the address you really need if the reply
should go to an individaul instead of the whole list. (But we all
know that - we read Matt Dralle's usage guidelines every month, don't
we?)
Third, your card number is now available on (I believe) 3 archives
open to public access. I suggest that you ask Matt Dralle, Andrew
Sarangan, and (possibly) Steve Dunsmuir to excise these 2 messages
from their archives as soon as possible. I'd ask that everyone else
who received them from the list please delete them from their own
machines too, please, as a courtesy to Paul.
regards
Rowland
--
| Rowland Carson Europa Club Membership Secretary - email for info!
| Europa 435 G-ROWI (750 hours building) PFA #16532
| e-mail <memsec@europaclub.org.uk> website <www.europaclub.org.uk>
Message 24
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|
Subject: | europa club newsletter [was: europa club subscriptions running |
out]
--> Europa-List message posted by: Rowland Carson <rowil@clara.net> out]
At 2005-05-26 07:31 -0700 Paul Boulet wrote:
>can you put my Europa up for sale in the
>magazine? It is at www.barnstormers.com and I've also
>attached a copy of the text to this email
Paul - please contact the editor of The Europa Flyer direct at
<editor@europaclub.org.uk> with all submissions, editorial or
advertising.
Your attachment was stripped off by the list server; you'll need to
re-send it direct to the editor, please.
regards
Rowland
--
| Rowland Carson Europa Club Membership Secretary - email for info!
| Europa 435 G-ROWI (750 hours building) PFA #16532
| e-mail <memsec@europaclub.org.uk> website <www.europaclub.org.uk>
Message 25
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|
Subject: | europa club membership secretary retirement |
--> Europa-List message posted by: Rowland Carson <rowil@clara.net>
Most Europa Club members should by now have received EF44 and seen my
piece announcing my retirement as Membership Secretary. Unfortunately
it got a bit truncated, so I am posting it here in its entirety, to
help anyone who might be considering volunteering as my successor.
MEMBERSHIP SECRETARY JOB
With the intention of devoting my time more single-mindedly to
getting my Europa finished and flying, I have decided that it is time
for me to retire as Membership Secretary. I have been in the job
since Autumn 1995, when I took over from founder members Ron & Kath
Swinden. I was still in full-time work, although anticipating
retirement the following year. The biggest and most tedious part of
the job then was stuffing the newsletters into envelopes, addressing
and posting them. Now, that is all delegated to a professional
printing house. The job has become much more varied, with time spent
on keeping track of Europa-related matters and people worldwide, as
well as banking and posting stuff. My database for maintaining all
the information has grown from the 3 tables that Ron sent to me (not
as an e-mail attachment - direct modem-to-modem using XMODEM!) to a
complex system of over 30 tables inter-related in many complex ways.
I have set myself the task, by the 2005 AGM, of improving the human
interface so that it can be run by anyone, without any special
database programming knowledge. As an earnest of my faith in its
robustness, I will undertake to carry out any future maintenance
needed on the database.
The Membership Secretary needs to be a signatory to the Club bank
account, and so will need to be a UK resident. I believe that a
minimal level of computer and internet competency is also a
pre-requisite. From my own experience, it might be easier for a
retired person who is already flying their Europa to do this work -
but we won't turn away a young firebrand in full-time work looking
for a challenge! As with most people in the Committee, the job has
become what I have made of it, and I have taken on or created some
aspects that may not need to be done, or at least may not need to be
done by the same person. To help members consider whether they should
think about volunteering for the job, here are the aspects I consider
to be central to the Membership Secretary job:
Maintain the register of paid-up members, ensuring that address and
other details are kept up-to-date, and that memberships are lapsed
when subscriptions are not paid on time.
Maintain records of payments received by cheque, credit card or
standing order, keeping them associated correctly with the paying
member.
Pay into the Club's bank account, or pass to the treasurer, all
payments received.
Send a welcome pack (including Hints & Tips, list of Members,
newsletter index, latest newsletter(s), membership badge and form
confirming all details) to each new member upon joining.
Provide addressing information or labels as required to the printer
of the newsletter, and to other Committee members wishing to
communicate with the Club membership.
Create membership renewal reminders to go out with the March
newsletter each year.
Maintain the Members-only access mechanism on the Club website.
Keep the stock of newsletter back issues and sell to members as required.
Respond to requests about joining the Club by sending an information
pack (including a brief description of the Club and its Officers, a
copy of the current Constitution, an application form and a Rescue
Service form) by e-mail or on paper as appropriate.
Distribute the list of Rescue Service volunteers to all Committee
members at least 4 times a year.
Report to, and attend, the 4 Committee meetings required to be held each year.
Report to the Club AGM.
Keep records of expenses incurred in connection with Committee duties
and submit claims to the Treasurer.
Many of the above tasks are handled completely, or at least
supported, by automated aspects of the membership database system. I
am hoping soon to incorporate online clearing of credit-card
payments, thus reducing the need for physical visits to the bank. If
you think that you could tackle the work listed above, then please
get in touch with me (or any Committee member) to discuss it in more
detail without obligation. I intend to prepare fuller descriptions of
the tasks to help potential candidates assess the scope of their
commitment. Prior to the AGM, the Committee will be discussing the
list of other things that I presently do, to see which might be done
by other people, or which might be discarded altogether without
detriment to the operation of the Europa Club.
I have enjoyed being your Membership Secretary. I volunteered for not
entirely altruistic reasons, thinking that being in this position
would ensure that I had good access to information that would help me
avoid mistakes on my own project. That has certainly proved true, but
I have tried to be unselfish, and to ensure that no member is at a
disadvantage because of lack of information. There have been some
"exciting" times, and I have had the chance to meet and talk with
some very significant people in the worlds of aviation and
engineering. The Committee has always supported me and kept me on the
rails when I was in danger of going off at right-angles to
everything. I hope the new incumbent will find that it's interesting,
it's fun (well some of the time at least), and that they will make as
many friends as I have in the doing of it.
regards
Rowland
--
| Rowland Carson Europa Club Membership Secretary - email for info!
| Europa 435 G-ROWI (750 hours building) PFA #16532
| e-mail <memsec@europaclub.org.uk> website <www.europaclub.org.uk>
Message 26
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Subject: | Re: europa club subscriptions running out |
--> Europa-List message posted by: Paul Boulet <possibletodo@yahoo.com>
my apologies to all...guess I got the dummie award today
Paul Boulet
do not archive
Message 27
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|
Subject: | europa club subscriptions running out |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Cory Emberson" <bootless@earthlink.net>
I just hope you don't have any fallout with your CC#! I promise I won't
call the Psychic Hotline with it. :-)
do not archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Paul Boulet
Subject: Re: Europa-List: europa club subscriptions running out
--> Europa-List message posted by: Paul Boulet <possibletodo@yahoo.com>
my apologies to all...guess I got the dummie award today
Paul Boulet
do not archive
Message 28
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|
Subject: | Re: PFA Feedback NOW :- Voluntary Services. |
For British consumption only.
--> Europa-List message posted by: N55XS <topglock@cox.net>
R.C.Harrison wrote:
>--> Europa-List message posted by: "R.C.Harrison" <ptag.dev@tiscali.co.uk>
>
> I registered my disappointment of the association of the PFA Mag with
>Wilson about two months ago it is still valid and will be for ever, Mr.
>Newby please listen up.....
>Sorry, you American guys but we are sympathising for a lot of your
>buddys, just turn it off if you don't like it.
>
>Now to Jeremy Davey....
>
>"In short, are you volunteering?......."
>
>I just may have, up to about 3 weeks ago but I have no wish to be part
>of the management of any organisation that has dished up what has
>prevailed over me behind the scenes from this group in this period.
>If my perception or even suggestions are wrong or incorrect then why
>hasn't my communications from 23rd April, 28th April and accompanying
>letter which was sent with my application for a cable retention "variant
>option" to Mod. 70 dated 12th May received the courtesy of either a
>reply, acknowledgement or a 'phone call even now? Except when I called I
>was arrogantly told to "make a written application send 45 and get in
>the queue."
>As I see it you picked up the challenge of being on the EC and you'll be
>judged on whether the PFA are ultimately listening or not. From where I
>stand I can't see a flutter of a move towards inclusiveness, or signs of
>a user caring organisation other than an authoritarian regulator which
>you and Rickard have even tried to extend through the Europa Club.
> (Excepting the representation and lobbying on our behalf at the
>International Organisations who are frustrating our sport of which we
>get limited information)
>If the "membership base" is to flourish tinkering at the edges changing
>titles like "flying for fun" or inviting members to go the CAA way isn't
>going to improve it, just hard work to enable and encourage greater
>numbers of home builders to indulge is what's needed. This means less
>time taken to make simple engineering decisions and just a little bit of
>communication about the subject matter of a builders view point, problem
>or suggestion. We "the membership" have to be able to relate to
>newcomers truthfully as to how we see the PFA, in good light or bad and
>my experiences have only been good when I've managed to get one to one
>direct verbal communication with the Chief Engineer. IMHO the rest of
>the team need to take a leaf out of his book.
>
>Bob Harrison.
>
>
>
>
Bob,
Feel free to speek for this American when roughing up the PFA because of
Wilson. Better yet, why don't one or two of you British chaps bring ol'
Wilson to the US and be sure to visit my place, when you do. ;)
do not archive
--
Jeff - A055
Waiting for a prop...
--
Message 29
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Subject: | europa club subscriptions running out |
--> Europa-List message posted by: Paul Boulet <possibletodo@yahoo.com>
To all concerned... I cancelled my credit card...no fraudulent charges were on
it either.
Hard to believe the FAA allows guys like me to fly instrument rated, eh?
Paul Boulet, Europa for sale (what a great way to advertise it for sale!) N914PB... see it at www.barnstormers.com
Cory Emberson <bootless@earthlink.net> wrote:
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Cory Emberson"
I just hope you don't have any fallout with your CC#! I promise I won't
call the Psychic Hotline with it. :-)
do not archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Paul Boulet
Subject: Re: Europa-List: europa club subscriptions running out
--> Europa-List message posted by: Paul Boulet
my apologies to all...guess I got the dummie award today
Paul Boulet
do not archive
Message 30
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|
Subject: | europa club subscriptions running out |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Cory Emberson" <bootless@earthlink.net>
>>To all concerned... I cancelled my credit card...no fraudulent charges
were on it either.<<
Good to hear that no one in cyberspace took advantage.
>>Hard to believe the FAA allows guys like me to fly instrument rated, eh?<<
Reminds me of a radio talk show host who was talking about the errant Cessna
150 last week, and whether he (the host) would ever consider flying:
"Sometimes I stand in front of my refrigerator door for five minutes, trying
to remember what I went there for. I should not be allowed to fly!" <grin>
Yours in the human race,
Cory
do not archive, fer gosh sakes :-)
Paul Boulet, Europa for sale (what a great way to advertise it for sale!)
N914PB... see it at www.barnstormers.com
Cory Emberson <bootless@earthlink.net> wrote:
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Cory Emberson"
I just hope you don't have any fallout with your CC#! I promise I won't
call the Psychic Hotline with it. :-)
do not archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Paul Boulet
Subject: Re: Europa-List: europa club subscriptions running out
--> Europa-List message posted by: Paul Boulet
my apologies to all...guess I got the dummie award today
Paul Boulet
do not archive
Message 31
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|
Subject: | Re: The price of Bacon Butties |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Fergus Kyle" <VE3LVO@rac.ca>
| Sorry Fergus! The exchange rate may not be good, but my bacon butty and
| coffee cost less than two pounds on Wednesday.
|
| Cheers, Dother Bryan.
Bryan,
The only way I can think that you paid but two quid is if you
walked to it mon ami. If however you flew, there's gas, oil, insurance, PFA
fees, wear and tear and perhaps EU fees yet to be levied. Don't forget the
magazine with the landing fee pass. That's how the hundred dollar hamburger
began..............
Cheers, Ferg
If I took another coffee, I'd have to add the medical fees (parking, gas,
oil, w&t, etc)
then there's that great favourite, the income tax you gave the givvermint
for the amount you spent....... it's all gone.
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