Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 02:02 AM - Re: Isle of Man Festival of Aviation (Alan Burrows)
2. 02:31 AM - Re: A GUIDE TO AIRCRAFT PAINTING & CORROSION CONTROL (NEEL Jean Philippe)
3. 06:52 AM - engines (Myron Haluschak)
4. 07:59 AM - Re: engines (Thomas Scherer)
5. 08:08 AM - Re: engines (Al Stills)
6. 08:22 AM - Re: engines (Andy Silvester)
7. 09:01 AM - Re: engines (gdhetrick)
8. 10:23 AM - Re: 3 Nico cable? (Fred Fillinger)
9. 10:58 AM - Re: Radio reception (nigel charles)
10. 08:04 PM - Re: Radio reception (Fred Fillinger)
11. 09:12 PM - Re: First flight N214KS (DuaneFamly@aol.com)
Message 1
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Subject: | RE: Isle of Man Festival of Aviation |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Alan Burrows" <alan@kestrel-insurance.com>
The festival is this Saturday and Sunday. Please let me know who intends
coming over and for how long, so I can organise a BBQ if enough of us
attend. Obviously its weather dependant, but so far it looks ok. I will
also organise fuel for those that need it. If you have a nicer aircraft
than mine please don't come! (I won best aircraft last year). The trophy
is a huge thing standing about THREE FEET tall and made of silver. They
wheel it out of the airport display cabinet just for the presentation,
then security staff take it straight back again and you are left with a
silver replica about 6" tall, so it will easily fit in your aircraft for
the journey home. I hope as many of you as possible will make it over
this year as the festival is a growing event, with lots of visiting
aircraft and attractions. AND A BEER TENT for those staying over. It
would be good to have a large contingent of Europa's present once again.
Alan
Ps don't forget to say hello to Kate in your radio calls, for priority
clearances :-)
Message 2
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Subject: | A GUIDE TO AIRCRAFT PAINTING & CORROSION CONTROL |
--> Europa-List message posted by: NEEL Jean Philippe <jeanphilippeneel@yahoo.fr>
bonjour
Is it possible to buy your book from France with paiement by intrenational credit
card?
JPN
europa N273
Garey Wittich <gareywittich2000@yahoo.com> a crit :
--> Europa-List message posted by: Garey Wittich
> This Information comes from my own research which I
did for
> my RV-8A, which I am building. Information applies
to both Aluminum and Composite aircraft. This is the
3th printing.
>
> --------------- ------------- ------------
>
> SAVE YOURSELF hundreds of hours of research time and
> building time, by using the comprehensive
>
> "Guide to Painting & Corrosion Control of Aluminum
> and
> Composite Aircraft"
>
> This book took over 600+ hours of research time by
> me,
> a fussy RV-8A Builder. Contains 69 pages of the
> latest, practical information - summarized and
> gathered from MIL Standards, Paint Shops, Builders
> like you (what worked or didn't), Airframe Mfgs,
> etc.
> Covers products from PP&G, Dupont, Sherwin W'ms,
> Sterling, Poly Fiber, Deft, Randolph Paints, PRC De
> Soto, US Paints, Aircraft Finishing Systems, 3M,
> etc.
>
> Some of the Topics covered in the 30 Sections are:
> * Aircraft Paints vs Auto Paints and Other
> Considerations
> * Corrosion Control
> * Spray Guns - selecting, adjusting, using
> and painting problems
> * Brushes / Rollers used with Primers &
> Paints
> * Prep Methods for Painting - Fiberglass,
> Steel and Aluminum
> * Epoxy Primers for Aluminum - MIL &
> Commercial, Solvent & Water Reducible
> * Primers for Fiberglass & Steel
> * Wash Primers & Self Etching Primers
> * Other Primers - Zinc Chromate,Zinc Oxide,
> Enamel
> * Paint Types: MIL & Non MIL Polyurethanes
> Enamel Types
> Acrylics - Lacquers & Enamels
> * Acid Etch / Conversion Coatings (Alodine)
> * Selecting a Paint Shop
> * 3M Cleaning Pads, Liquid Cleaner
> compatibility
> * Paint Booths and their Construction
> * References - MIL Standards & Tech Orders
> * Directory of Aircraft Paint Mfgs, Distrib-
> utors, etc. E-Mail addresses, phone
> numbers, Application Notes
>
> YOUR AIRPLANE is judged by it's Paint Job and it is
> costly too, so have the latest "Information" in
> order
> to make good decisions. Contains plenty of "Do's"
> and
> "Don'ts" that save you time, money and frustration.
>
> Send a check for $26 to (includes Postage within the
> US) to:
> Garey Wittich RV-8A Builder
> 58 Village Parkway
> Santa Monica, CA. 90405
>
>
__________________________________
http://mobile.yahoo.com/learn/mail
---------------------------------
Tlchargez le ici !
Message 3
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--> Europa-List message posted by: "Myron Haluschak" <myron.haluschak@sympatico.ca>
Hello all:
For those able to attend EAA, I hope you enjoyed it and got back safely.
I am always open to looking at other engine possibilities to the Rotax 912S, even
though I know the Europa was designed around a Rotax. If possible, the areas
I would like to see advantages in are : cost, simplicity of operation, a complete
FWF kit, preferrably no baffling, (or at least minimal), direct drive, and
better HP if possible, no weight penalties.
That's quite a list of demands. There is one engine that has been around that seems
to offer alot of what I am looking for. So I am interested in hearing from
anyone who is or has installed a Jabiru 3300 6 - cylinder engine. I have flown
behind both 914 and 912S engines, spoken with happy Europa owners who have
them, but they do admit to their complexity as being one downside, and one mentioned
the regular need to go under the cowling. My first choice for my needs
is the 912S unless something better comes along.
What I found with the Jabiru is a 127 hp (advertised as 120 hp but continually
dinos out to 127 hp) air cooled but with ram air ducts, direct drive, simple light
and modern engine with a FWF kit, and less than the cost of the Rotax. I'm
wondering why more haven't looked at this engine. Certainly they have been around
and their safety record isn't showing a big red flag. I was told by builders
what most have heard... the Europa was built and designed around the Rotax.
If you change that then the flying qualities and all else changes. That's like
Henry Ford saying you can have any colour you want, as long as it's black,
when the Model T first came out. I am interested in hearing comments on both
positive and negative on the Jabiru only, as I am already familiar with the good
and bad for the Rotax.
Thank you
Myron Haluschak USAF
A0149 Monowheel
Message 4
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--> Europa-List message posted by: "Thomas Scherer" <thomas@scherer.com>
Hello Myron,
I would be surprised if a Jabiru owner spends less time under the 'hood'. The Rotax
is a self-contained workhorse with minimal connections or maintenance. Mind
you that Rotax is selling engines that are installed in night-ifr certified
aircraft (Dimona Katana, DA-20).
I would not have three oceans behind a Jabiru - not only for the fact that a Rotax
is much more seasoned - also I still need to see a Jabiru in a Europa that
burns 2 and a quarter gallons of car gas while propelling the plane to 1oo knots
and weighing a mere 58 kg (dry).
You are right - it is called 'Experimental' Aircraft and progress comes from trying
new things, but as far as propulsion goes in a single engine plane ...
be well,
<Thomas, N81EU>
----- Original Message -----
From: "Myron Haluschak" <myron.haluschak@sympatico.ca>
Subject: Europa-List: engines
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Myron Haluschak"
> <myron.haluschak@sympatico.ca>
>
> Hello all:
> For those able to attend EAA, I hope you enjoyed it and got back safely.
> I am always open to looking at other engine possibilities to the Rotax 912S,
> even though I know the Europa was designed around a Rotax. If possible, the
> areas I would like to see advantages in are : cost, simplicity of operation,
a
> complete FWF kit, preferrably no baffling, (or at least minimal), direct
> drive, and better HP if possible, no weight penalties.
> That's quite a list of demands. There is one engine that has been around that
> seems to offer alot of what I am looking for. So I am interested in hearing
> from anyone who is or has installed a Jabiru 3300 6 - cylinder engine. I have
> flown behind both 914 and 912S engines, spoken with happy Europa owners who
> have them, but they do admit to their complexity as being one downside, and
> one mentioned the regular need to go under the cowling. My first choice for my
> needs is the 912S unless something better comes along.
> What I found with the Jabiru is a 127 hp (advertised as 120 hp but continually
> dinos out to 127 hp) air cooled but with ram air ducts, direct drive, simple
> light and modern engine with a FWF kit, and less than the cost of the Rotax.
> I'm wondering why more haven't looked at this engine. Certainly they have been
> around and their safety record isn't showing a big red flag. I was told by
> builders what most have heard... the Europa was built and designed around the
> Rotax. If you change that then the flying qualities and all else changes.
> That's like Henry Ford saying you can have any colour you want, as long as
> it's black, when the Model T first came out. I am interested in hearing
> comments on both positive and negative on the Jabiru only, as I am already
> familiar with the good and bad for the Rotax.
>
> Thank you
> Myron Haluschak USAF
> A0149 Monowheel
>
>
Message 5
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--> Europa-List message posted by: "Al Stills" <astills@senecawholesale.com>
Myron,
I'm currently installing a Jabiru 3300 into my XS Tri-gear. Very simple install.
I'm using Suncoast Sport Planes FF kit. A new design on the cowl that looks
great and should do the job better than the factory cowl. Weight appears to be
the same if not a slight amount less. The engine is a beautiful piece of work.
I've not finished the complete install yet so have done no run ups but have
seen the engine in their plane and I think it will be a winner in the Europa.
Cost wise... a little less than the Rotax when I bought mine. The only baffling
I've had to do is from the cowl to the oil cooler that was pretty simple.
Al Stills
N625AZ
Message 6
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--> Europa-List message posted by: "Andy Silvester" <andy@suncoastjabiru.com>
Myron,
Thanks for considering the Jabiru engine. As the USA Supplier of Europa /
Jabiru 3300 installation packages we saw quite a few Europa builders at the
booth at Oshkosh and were hopefully able to provide information and
experiences. Suncoast Sportplanes, Inc had an OEM supply agreement with
Europa before their demise in UK and this led to the development by us of a
complete 'firewall-forward' package including mount (produced by Jabiru),
cowlings and all other required installation items. I've worked very closely
with Flight Crafters (they are literally next door to my location here) and
through their feedback and many other 'direct sale' customers I'm confident
we have a product which meets or exceeds the needs of its market. I monitor
this list on a daily basis and have been careful to avoid performance
predictions or sales hype. Instead, I prefer to let owners here share their
experiences of both product and service and I'm sure there will be more
contributions soon from happy Jabiru owners. The new installation has been
successfully fitted to a monowheel Europa which flew from here very
recently, and I know the owner was happy with performance. More Tri-gear
examples are nearing completion so news and experiences will be published
here soon. Feel free to contact me for more info.
Andy Silvester
Suncoast Sportplanes, Inc.
39248 South Ave. Zephyrhills, FL 33542
Tel: 813 779 2324 Fax: 813 779 2246
www.suncoastjabiru.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Myron Haluschak
Subject: Europa-List: engines
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Myron Haluschak"
<myron.haluschak@sympatico.ca>
Hello all:
For those able to attend EAA, I hope you enjoyed it and got back safely.
I am always open to looking at other engine possibilities to the Rotax 912S,
even though I know the Europa was designed around a Rotax. If possible, the
areas I would like to see advantages in are : cost, simplicity of operation,
a complete FWF kit, preferrably no baffling, (or at least minimal), direct
drive, and better HP if possible, no weight penalties.
That's quite a list of demands. There is one engine that has been around
that seems to offer alot of what I am looking for. So I am interested in
hearing from anyone who is or has installed a Jabiru 3300 6 - cylinder
engine. I have flown behind both 914 and 912S engines, spoken with happy
Europa owners who have them, but they do admit to their complexity as being
one downside, and one mentioned the regular need to go under the cowling. My
first choice for my needs is the 912S unless something better comes along.
What I found with the Jabiru is a 127 hp (advertised as 120 hp but
continually dinos out to 127 hp) air cooled but with ram air ducts, direct
drive, simple light and modern engine with a FWF kit, and less than the cost
of the Rotax. I'm wondering why more haven't looked at this engine.
Certainly they have been around and their safety record isn't showing a big
red flag. I was told by builders what most have heard... the Europa was
built and designed around the Rotax. If you change that then the flying
qualities and all else changes. That's like Henry Ford saying you can have
any colour you want, as long as it's black, when the Model T first came out.
I am interested in hearing comments on both positive and negative on the
Jabiru only, as I am already familiar with the good and bad for the Rotax.
Thank you
Myron Haluschak USAF
A0149 Monowheel
Message 7
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--> Europa-List message posted by: "gdhetrick" <gdh@isp.com>
Myron,
Love my Jabiru 3300! It came complete with a FWF kit including the prop! I
believe you will find quite a few AC equipped with this engine. Sonex seem
to have standardized on it. A few "growing pains" but all sorted out.
Dale
A140 Tri-gear w/3300
----- Original Message -----
From: "Myron Haluschak" <myron.haluschak@sympatico.ca>
Subject: Europa-List: engines
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Myron Haluschak"
> <myron.haluschak@sympatico.ca>
>
> Hello all:
> For those able to attend EAA, I hope you enjoyed it and got back safely.
> I am always open to looking at other engine possibilities to the Rotax
> 912S, even though I know the Europa was designed around a Rotax. If
> possible, the areas I would like to see advantages in are : cost,
> simplicity of operation, a complete FWF kit, preferrably no baffling, (or
> at least minimal), direct drive, and better HP if possible, no weight
> penalties.
> That's quite a list of demands. There is one engine that has been around
> that seems to offer alot of what I am looking for. So I am interested in
> hearing from anyone who is or has installed a Jabiru 3300 6 - cylinder
> engine. I have flown behind both 914 and 912S engines, spoken with happy
> Europa owners who have them, but they do admit to their complexity as
> being one downside, and one mentioned the regular need to go under the
> cowling. My first choice for my needs is the 912S unless something better
> comes along.
> What I found with the Jabiru is a 127 hp (advertised as 120 hp but
> continually dinos out to 127 hp) air cooled but with ram air ducts, direct
> drive, simple light and modern engine with a FWF kit, and less than the
> cost of the Rotax. I'm wondering why more haven't looked at this engine.
> Certainly they have been around and their safety record isn't showing a
> big red flag. I was told by builders what most have heard... the Europa
> was built and designed around the Rotax. If you change that then the
> flying qualities and all else changes. That's like Henry Ford saying you
> can have any colour you want, as long as it's black, when the Model T
> first came out. I am interested in hearing comments on both positive and
> negative on the Jabiru only, as I am already familiar with the good and
> bad for the Rotax.
>
> Thank you
> Myron Haluschak USAF
> A0149 Monowheel
>
>
>
Message 8
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Subject: | Re: 3 Nico cable? |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Fred Fillinger" <n3eu@comcast.net>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Ronald J. Parigoris":
>
> The monowheel manual calls for 2 nicos per thimble
> for tailwheel cables.
>
> If 2 is better than 1, is 3 better than 4?
>
If properly swaged, the cable is supposed to break first
under tension. If two are used, it's insurance in case the
first one is not quite compressed enough (possibly like my
swages). So I guess whimsically, if 3-4 are really needed,
it says a lot about my first two. Meaning my 3rd and 4th
are...?. :-)
Reg,
Fred F.
Message 9
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--> Europa-List message posted by: "nigel charles" <nigelcharles@tiscali.co.uk>
I can also vouch for the ANR headset conversions. I converted my own
Peltor headsets using a kit of parts. It was very easy and only took a
couple of hours. It is worth providing a power source from the a/c
supply to avoid the need for batteries. You need is a regulator chip
which will step down the 12-14 volts to 9 volts.
Nigel Charles
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-
>>server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard Holder
>>Sent: Monday, August 01, 2005 17:12
>>To: europa-list@matronics.com
>>Subject: Re: Europa-List: Radio reception
>>
>>--> Europa-List message posted by: Richard Holder
<rholder@avnet.co.uk>
>>
>>> And finally - what is a good ANR headset for use in an aircraft with
a
>>> Rotax engine - the BOSE (I have tried 2 diffrerent headsets)
emphasises
>>> the higher pitched aprt of the engine noise?
>>
>>Despite opening myself up for advertising :
>>
>>I do ANR conversions for DC and Peltor type headsets. In
>>my Europa I have two of these headsets - just cheap
>>headsets, which have the conversion and which takle their
>>power from the aircraft (no batteries)..
>>
>>Others on the Flyer Forum have tested these conversions
>>and they report that they are better at noise reduction
>>than the Bose. The Bose is VERY light but that allows
>>extraneous noise in there. In fcat everyone raves about them !
>>
>>I have done over 90 of these conversions so far.
>>
>>The advantage (other than the quietness) is that you don't
>>end up with yet another headset !
>>
>>Contact me direct if you are interested in more
>>information - numbers in my signature --
>>
>>Richard
>>Richard F.W. Holder 01279 842804 (POTS)
>>Bell House, Bell Lane, 01279 842942 (fax)
>>Widford, Ware, Herts, 07860 367423 (mobile)
>>SG12 8SH email : richard.holder@avnet.co.uk
>>Europa Classic Tri-gear : G-OWWW, High Cross
>>PA-28-181 : Piper Archer : G-JANA, EGSG (Stapleford)
>>
>>
>>
>>
Message 10
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Subject: | Re: Radio reception |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Fred Fillinger" <n3eu@comcast.net>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "nigel charles"
<nigelcharles@tiscali.co.uk>
>
> I can also vouch for the ANR headset conversions. I
converted my own
> Peltor headsets using a kit of parts. It was very easy and
only took a
> couple of hours.
I too added the anr-headsets.com kit to an old Peltor 7004
that had been long gathering dust, because I was using the
David Clark ANR, and I wanted to try something else. David
Clarks are rather heavier than about anything, especially
against Peltors, and the DC's tend to clamp tighter. The
Peltor + ANR has different nuances in the audio effect than
DC, and I slightly prefer DC overall, though they say many
are a bit better now. But the comfort of the Peltor tips
the scales easy for me. I also added to the Peltor the
gel-filled ear seals, which improves things audio-wise and
comfort. This is in an AA-5 whose cockpit noise is
comparatively lower than similar planes, and the DC has the
effect of letting in more valve train noise (higher freq).
The Peltor + ANR seems less so, so it's possible this will
work well in a Europa/Rotax. IOW, a comfy headset +
affordable conversion kit.
Reg,
Fred F.
Message 11
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Subject: | Re: First flight N214KS |
--> Europa-List message posted by: DuaneFamly@aol.com
Ken,
I am so disappointed to have missed your first flight. I would have rented a
172 and flown down to see the grand event. Dave and Terry have flown up here
to Redding for a visit and we shared burgers and stories enough to keep me
going on my XS. Right now I am keeping my accountant/billpayer/spouse happy with
a
two month loop trip through OR, WA, Canada, MT (am presently in Glacier NP),
WY, and UT. I should be back after the end of this month. So if you need a
place to test your HOT! weather takeoffs and landing, please feel free to email
me and I'll put on the burgers.
Mike Duane
XS Conventional Gear
Really need to get back home and back to building!
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