Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 02:02 AM - DOTH Sun 18th (Paddy Clarke)
2. 03:38 AM - Re: to Tom Lowsley Re:XS tri-gear project for sale (Trevpond@aol.com)
3. 04:32 AM - Re: to Tom Lowsley Re:XS tri-gear project for sale (R.C.Harrison)
4. 07:41 AM - Re: to Tom Lowsley Re:XS tri-gear project for sale (Andy Silvester)
5. 08:28 AM - Re: to Tom Lowsley Re:XS tri-gear project for sale (DuaneFamly@aol.com)
6. 08:35 AM - Re: to Tom Lowsley Re:XS tri-gear project for sale (DuaneFamly@aol.com)
7. 09:05 AM - Re: to Tom Lowsley Re:XS tri-gear project for sale (GLENN CROWDER)
8. 09:30 AM - ENGINES! (Gerry Holland)
9. 09:40 AM - Re: to Tom Lowsley Re:XS tri-gear project for sale (JEFF ROBERTS)
10. 09:46 AM - Re: Overhead lighting (terrys@cisco.com)
11. 10:00 AM - Re: ENGINES! (Jos Okhuijsen)
12. 10:30 AM - Re: ENGINES! (Gerry Holland)
13. 11:52 AM - Re: ENGINES! (GLENN CROWDER)
14. 12:06 PM - Re: ENGINES! (R.C.Harrison)
15. 12:23 PM - Re: ENGINES! (DuaneFamly@aol.com)
16. 12:26 PM - Re: ENGINES! (Gerry Holland)
17. 12:46 PM - Re: ENGINES! (BEBERRY@aol.com)
18. 12:55 PM - Re: ENGINES! (Gerry Holland)
19. 01:03 PM - Re: ENGINES! (Andy Silvester)
20. 01:05 PM - Re: to Tom Lowsley Re:XS tri-gear project for sale (Milt Black)
21. 02:27 PM - Re: to Tom Lowsley Re:XS tri-gear project for sale (Milt Black)
22. 03:52 PM - Re: to Tom Lowsley Re:XS tri-gear project for sale (N55XS)
23. 06:38 PM - Re: to Tom Lowsley Re:XS tri-gear project for sale (JEFF ROBERTS)
24. 07:44 PM - Re: to Tom Lowsley Re:XS tri-gear project for sale (SPurpura@aol.com)
25. 07:58 PM - Re: ENGINES! (SPurpura@aol.com)
26. 09:37 PM - Monowheel Upstop? ()
27. 09:57 PM - Question about wing tie-downs (Mod 69) (Andrew Sarangan)
28. 10:18 PM - Re: Monowheel Upstop? (Bill & Sue Sisley)
29. 11:12 PM - Re: ENGINES! (nigel charles)
Message 1
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--> Europa-List message posted by: Paddy Clarke <paddyclarke@lineone.net>
Hi All,
Anyone interested in a DOTH to the Wiltshire PFA Flyers fly-in at Lower
Upham on Sun.?. BBQ from 10.30. Briefing from Dudley Pattison on 0799
097 6393 - I've never been there.
Cheers
Paddy Clarke
Europa XS - 404 G-KIMM
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: to Tom Lowsley re:XS tri-gear project for sale |
--> Europa-List message posted by: Trevpond@aol.com
Hi Milt,
I can only quote the designer "the aircraft was designed around the Rotax
engine and it is the only one that delivers the performance with economy"
Trev Pond
kit 598
Message 3
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| Subject: | to Tom Lowsley re:XS tri-gear project for sale |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "R.C.Harrison" <ptag.dev@tiscali.co.uk>
Hi! Trevor
And you forgot to mention that those "in the Colonies" are soon going to
have to look at engine efficiencies especially since the Katrina problem
and they snatched all our reserves and caused the prices to escalate.
My a/c uses about a gallon per hour more than the Rotax and is a source
of great amusement when group flying with Rotax Buffs !!!! Having said
that the Jabiru is a bog standard engine to operate (when you've got the
cooling somewhere right) so there isn't the explicit operational control
needed as per the Rotax as only you now know only too well !
Regards
Bob Harrison G-PTAG Europa MKI/Jabiru 3300
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
Trevpond@aol.com
Subject: Re: Europa-List: to Tom Lowsley re:XS tri-gear project for sale
--> Europa-List message posted by: Trevpond@aol.com
Hi Milt,
I can only quote the designer "the aircraft was designed around the
Rotax
engine and it is the only one that delivers the performance with
economy"
Trev Pond
kit 598
Message 4
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| Subject: | to Tom Lowsley re:XS tri-gear project for sale |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Andy Silvester" <andy@suncoastjabiru.com>
Yeah, Trev, and the P-51 Mustang was designed for the Allison engine. Let's
see how many instances we can find where a product has been improved, or
let's say "Changed to meet the Customer's requirements" without detriment.
Oops! The top just came off my Can of Worms..........
Andy
Suncoast Sportplanes, Inc.
www.suncoastjabiru.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
Trevpond@aol.com
Subject: Re: Europa-List: to Tom Lowsley re:XS tri-gear project for sale
--> Europa-List message posted by: Trevpond@aol.com
Hi Milt,
I can only quote the designer "the aircraft was designed around the Rotax
engine and it is the only one that delivers the performance with economy"
Trev Pond
kit 598
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: to Tom Lowsley re:XS tri-gear project for sale |
--> Europa-List message posted by: DuaneFamly@aol.com
Milt,
One item of interest to many of those that might be thinking of an
alternative is price. When all is said and done.....what would be the typical
cost of
a Jabiru 3300 power plant with FWF kit compared to a Rotax 912S power plant
with FWF kit? Here in the States.
Mike Duane A207A
Redding, California
XS Conventional Gear
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: to Tom Lowsley re:XS tri-gear project for sale |
--> Europa-List message posted by: DuaneFamly@aol.com
In a message dated 9/16/2005 4:33:36 A.M. Pacific Standard Time,
ptag.dev@tiscali.co.uk writes:
Jabiru is a bog standard engine to operate
Hey Bob,
Could you translate this into Colonial English?
Thanks.
Mike Duane A207A
Redding, California
XS Conventional Gear
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: to Tom Lowsley re:XS tri-gear project for sale |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "GLENN CROWDER" <gcrowder2@hotmail.com>
Hey Sam, as far as a Rotax being the engine of choice, that is just your
opinion.
I am quite happy with my Subaru EA81 and would not swap it for even 4
Rotaxes!
And thats my opinion. Glenn 300 hrs +
--> Europa-List message posted by: SPurpura@xxxxxxx
AS FAR AS A JABIRU BEING THE ENGINE OF CHOISE,THAT IS JUST YOR OPINION.
I AM QUITE HAPPY WITH MY ROTAX 914 AND WOULD NOT SWAP IT FOR EVEN 2
JABIRU'S.
AND THAT'S MY OPINION. SAM N77EU 350 HRS+
Message 8
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--> Europa-List message posted by: Gerry Holland <gholland@gemini-resourcing.com>
Regarding Engines!
It's your choice everyone! No wonder it is so easy to start Wars!
I couldn't give a Tinkers curse as long as the bloody thing keeps the Prop
turning.
End of Rant!....... NO it's not.
Why not discuss the superiority of Mono Wheel over Trigear over
Conventional.
The best Prop?
Oh! I forgot.....That's a choice too!
Enough!!!!
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: to Tom Lowsley re:XS tri-gear project for sale |
--> Europa-List message posted by: JEFF ROBERTS <jeff@rmmm.net>
Hey guys!
Sounds like your all satisfied with your Europa and would not swap them
for 3 other airplanes, but your hung up on the front end. You've all
made me glad I am closer to the first flight of A248!
Regards
Jeff
912S not sure of how I'll like it yet.
On Sep 16, 2005, at 11:04 AM, GLENN CROWDER wrote:
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "GLENN CROWDER"
> <gcrowder2@hotmail.com>
>
> Hey Sam, as far as a Rotax being the engine of choice, that is just
> your
> opinion.
> I am quite happy with my Subaru EA81 and would not swap it for even 4
> Rotaxes!
> And thats my opinion. Glenn 300 hrs +
>
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: SPurpura@xxxxxxx
>
> AS FAR AS A JABIRU BEING THE ENGINE OF CHOISE,THAT IS JUST YOR OPINION.
> I AM QUITE HAPPY WITH MY ROTAX 914 AND WOULD NOT SWAP IT FOR EVEN 2
> JABIRU'S.
> AND THAT'S MY OPINION. SAM N77EU 350 HRS+
>
>
Message 10
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| Subject: | Overhead lighting |
--> Europa-List message posted by: terrys@cisco.com
Hi Jeff,
On our overhead, I used four of the black 'eyeball' adjustable lights
from ACS, although they use small incandescent bulbs (100mA each), not
LEDs. I wired the front two to the nav light switch, as they are used
for panel lights. The rear two are map lights, with individual rocker
switches, wired to the master switch power.
To see this schematically, see page 2 of our wiring diagram at the
following location;
http://terryseaver.home.comcast.net/wire_diag.pdf
Regards,
Terry Seaver
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of JEFF
ROBERTS
Subject: Europa-List: Overhead lighting
--> Europa-List message posted by: JEFF ROBERTS <jeff@rmmm.net>
I wanted to wire my overhead consel with 4 of the Black single LED
lights sold in ACS. Just wondering if others used these before and if
you would have any method for wiring them that a non electronics type
like me would understand. Should they be wired in series?
Also I have been struggling with a choke cable I like. Any thoughts on
what others have used and like? I am planning on going from one to two
on the firewall like my throttle so I was looking for a pull knob but
with a cable and not a wire like in some motorcycles. Any info would be
greatly appreciated.
Thanks,
Jeff
A258
Paint complete and very close to cranking it up.
Message 11
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--> Europa-List message posted by: "Jos Okhuijsen" <josok-e@ukolo.fi>
Good idea, and good that everybody likes his engine of choice. Now if we
please could hear some arguments if it is not a secret? I like my empty
space there up front,and like to know what i should like to choose. Pfft.
:-)
Regards,
Jos Okhuijsen
Message 12
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--> Europa-List message posted by: Gerry Holland <gholland@gemini-resourcing.com>
Jos Hi!
> Good idea, and good that everybody likes his engine of choice. Now if we
> please could hear some arguments if it is not a secret? I like my empty
> space there up front,and like to know what i should like to choose.
I know that dilemma as do many others. I guess where you are geographically
placed parts and service item supply is important as well as exchange rates
affecting costs.
List out all the known Europa Power plants and apply weighting based on:
Unit Cost
Weight
Availability
Track record
Match to preferred Prop
Operating area and environment
Fuel consumption
It will at least narrow down the choice.
Regards
Gerry
How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday
Message 13
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--> Europa-List message posted by: "GLENN CROWDER" <gcrowder2@hotmail.com>
Hey Gerry! Thats easy!
Get the 140 hp Dual Port Fuel Injected EA81 with redundant injection here:
(about $9K US)
http://www.ramengines.com/
RAM Performance, Ltd.
Get the Marcotte M150 redrive with 2.04/1 ratio and SAE2 hub here: (abt $4K
US)
http://www.geocities.com/marcotte004/page2.htm
The Marcotte redrive allows conventional clockwise prop rotation and has
only 1" of
crankshaft to prophub offset - necessary to allow room for cooling system
Get the Catto 3 bladed 64 x 62 composite prop (SAE2 hub) from here: (about
$1500 US)
http://www.cattoprops.com/
Catto Home
I have this prop and it goes right to redline at 8000 ft so 140 hp will
require more prop
This is a 180 mph or better setup @ 6.5 gph WOT with no turbo worries!
My monowheel with the 125 hp engine does 175 mph GPS @ 8000 ft, cruises 150
mph @ 5 gph
and has very light and friendly handling - empty weight 940 lb.
Glenn
>From: Gerry Holland <gholland@gemini-resourcing.com>
>Reply-To: europa-list@matronics.com
>To: <europa-list@matronics.com>
>Subject: Re: Europa-List: ENGINES!
>Date: Fri, 16 Sep 2005 18:17:12 +0100
>
>--> Europa-List message posted by: Gerry Holland
><gholland@gemini-resourcing.com>
>
>Jos Hi!
>
> > Good idea, and good that everybody likes his engine of choice. Now if we
> > please could hear some arguments if it is not a secret? I like my empty
> > space there up front,and like to know what i should like to choose.
>
>I know that dilemma as do many others. I guess where you are geographically
>placed parts and service item supply is important as well as exchange rates
>affecting costs.
>
>List out all the known Europa Power plants and apply weighting based on:
>Unit Cost
>Weight
>Availability
>Track record
>Match to preferred Prop
>Operating area and environment
>Fuel consumption
>
>It will at least narrow down the choice.
>
>Regards
>
>Gerry
>
>
>How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday
>
>
Message 14
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--> Europa-List message posted by: "R.C.Harrison" <ptag.dev@tiscali.co.uk>
Heh ! Gerry stop winding folks up!!!
Bob H .
Do not archive.
Robt.C.Harrison
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gerry
Holland
Subject: Europa-List: ENGINES!
--> Europa-List message posted by: Gerry Holland
<gholland@gemini-resourcing.com>
Regarding Engines!
It's your choice everyone! No wonder it is so easy to start Wars!
I couldn't give a Tinkers curse as long as the bloody thing keeps the
Prop
turning.
End of Rant!....... NO it's not.
Why not discuss the superiority of Mono Wheel over Trigear over
Conventional.
The best Prop?
Oh! I forgot.....That's a choice too!
Enough!!!!
Message 15
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--> Europa-List message posted by: DuaneFamly@aol.com
To All That Wish To Offer Facts,
Please do not turn this into a pole pissing contest. This forum helps many
people that come to a questionable point in their build to get informed input
from those that have already done it. This is usually in the form of "I did it
this way because......." and then they state factual information to the best
of their ability and let others make their own decision based on facts.
Let's keep away from "I did it this way and it's best, so there :-P" with no
supportive input.
Gerry's list is a good start. Populate the list with information and any
other worthwhile categories so that we may make a decision.
Mike Duane A207A
Redding, California
XS Conventional Gear
Do Not Archive
Message 16
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--> Europa-List message posted by: Gerry Holland <gholland@gemini-resourcing.com>
Bob Hi!
> Heh ! Gerry stop winding folks up!!!
It's the West of England way of cooling a situation! That and a 3 foot
scaffold pole!!
Regards
Gerry
do not archive
Message 17
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--> Europa-List message posted by: BEBERRY@aol.com
Mono versus Tri? Great. Well for me it's the Tri Gear, for no better reason
that I like aeroplanes to look like aeroplanes and ships like ships etc etc.
Patrick
Message 18
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--> Europa-List message posted by: Gerry Holland <gholland@gemini-resourcing.com>
No Patrick!
> Mono versus Tri? Great. Well for me it's the Tri Gear, for no better reason
> that I like aeroplanes to look like aeroplanes and ships like ships etc etc.
It doesn't matter. It was frustration Joke!
Regards
Gerry
Do not archive
How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday
Message 19
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--> Europa-List message posted by: "Andy Silvester" <andy@suncoastjabiru.com>
I think the last few posts about choice of engines (and associated
questions) provides me the opportunity to respond from the Jabiru front.
This email list (in my opinion) isn't the place for the 'hard sell' or an
extended "my engine's better than yours" confrontation on subjective terms.
It is the home of many happy Europa / Rotax owners and I expect the usual
defensive comments from them. (I can take it!). However, I'm trying to
address questions and concerns from people who have yet to make an engine
choice.
I recognize and respect that the Rotax has been the majority leader for the
Europa; it's a great engine and the gearbox and fluid cooling systems are
there for good and well-defended reasons. However (!) I find more owners
wanting less complexity, lower RPMs and what they see and hear is a more
'traditional' air-cooled direct drive engine which is easy to maintain, has
a good TBO and track-record and is supported by a responsive service and
spares network.
It's quite true to say that certainly in UK there was little support for the
Jabiru from Europa's Manufacturer and Designer and Rotax was, and maybe
continues to be 'the engine of choice' there. By comparison here in USA my
perception (and I have witnessed both sides) is that owners and builders,
who, let's face it, have a huge candy-store variety of parts, avionics and
engines are not as 'persuaded' to follow the herd. A few early Jabiru sales
to individual builders began (about 3-4 years ago) to influence Europa
Management in USA, and I got involved with them to develop an installation
that would convince even The Boss in UK!. Shortly after getting OEM
agreements with Europa in Lakeland, the Company folded. Before and since
then our progress has been steady and I'm now confident we have an
installation that compares very well with Rotax. These things always take
longer than we'd wish, but we are starting to get real feedback from owners
who are very pleased with their Jabiru power and performance in all
respects.
I'm holding-off publishing real numbers here as I'd prefer Europa owners to
give their feedback directly. You probably wouldn't believe me anyway!
However, I can report that through attention to installation methods and
cowling design, cooling issues (perceived or real) have been overcome as
well as the belief that Jabirus are way-less fuel efficient than the Rotax.
The gap has been narrowed, for certain. Inevitably, engines today are better
than early ones; Jabiru make no apology for improving their product and the
billet-machined construction throughout has allowed them to make these
changes relatively. If facts are required, here's a few:
1. 6 - cylinder air-cooled direct drive engine developing max. power at 3300
rpm
2. Engine installed weight is 180lbs
3. Since carburetor jetting change and other production mods., measured
power on new engines is 127hp.
4. Cruise RPM is around 2700 - 2900 depending on prop, which will usually
have a diameter of between 58" and 62". Cruise fuel burn is between 5 and
5.5 US gallons per hour (4.2 - 4.6 UK gph).
5. Current cost of the engine is $14,900.00 US and the installation kit
complete with 2-blade 58 x 62 Sensenich prop. is about $3250.
We work (literally) alongside Flightcrafters here, who know more about
Europas than I ever will and they have fitted about 6 Jabirus to date. Some
remain in construction but a Monowheel has flown about 50 hours with our
installation setup and a tri-gear XS just completed its first flight last
weekend. No complaints as far as I know!
Again, I prefer to have owners report their own findings but in my view the
installation package is a success and I'm happy to defend it alongside the
competition.
Andy
Suncoast Sportplanes, Inc.
39248 South Ave. Zephyrhills, FL 33542
Tel: 813 779 2324 Fax: 813 779 2246
www.suncoastjabiru.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gerry Holland
Subject: Re: Europa-List: ENGINES!
--> Europa-List message posted by: Gerry Holland
<gholland@gemini-resourcing.com>
Jos Hi!
> Good idea, and good that everybody likes his engine of choice. Now if we
> please could hear some arguments if it is not a secret? I like my empty
> space there up front,and like to know what i should like to choose.
I know that dilemma as do many others. I guess where you are geographically
placed parts and service item supply is important as well as exchange rates
affecting costs.
List out all the known Europa Power plants and apply weighting based on:
Unit Cost
Weight
Availability
Track record
Match to preferred Prop
Operating area and environment
Fuel consumption
It will at least narrow down the choice.
Regards
Gerry
How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday
Message 20
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| Subject: | to Tom Lowsley re:XS tri-gear project for sale |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Milt Black" <black333@dslextreme.com>
Hi Trev, Your point is well taken. Again, I have nothing against the Rotax.
I would ony remind you that the North American P-51 was designed around the
Allison engine and only "came alive" and gained it's reputation as the best
fighter of WWII after switching to the Rolls Royce Merlin. The list of
aircraft whose performance and economy were improved by an engine switch or
replacement is endless. Choice is a good thing. It's one of the important
elements that drives research and developement. My best to you and to your
Europa. Milt Black
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of
Trevpond@aol.com
Subject: Re: Europa-List: to Tom Lowsley re:XS tri-gear project for sale
--> Europa-List message posted by: Trevpond@aol.com
Hi Milt,
I can only quote the designer "the aircraft was designed around the Rotax
engine and it is the only one that delivers the performance with economy"
Trev Pond
kit 598
--
Message 21
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| Subject: | to Tom Lowsley re:XS tri-gear project for sale |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Milt Black" <black333@dslextreme.com>
Hi Mike, To get an up-to-date price comparison I suggest you contact Andy
Sylvester at Suncoast Sportplanes in Florida. E-mail
<andy@suncoastjabiru.com>. Being the Jab dealer, he can quote the exact
prices for the engine and the firewall forward kit. Incidentally, this new
cowling/kit is really nice, better aesthetically, better cooling,ctc. It
looks very similar to the front end of the Lancair. Being his main
competitor, and located practically next store to a Europa dealer, I'm sure
that he can quote you "chapter-and-verse", or come awfully close to what the
Eupopa firewall fwd and Rotax would cost. Or, get on the Europa web page. I
believe prices are quoted. Just make sure that you convert pounds to
dollars. I believe it's about one to two, One pound equaling two dollars.
Also,get a list of what is included in each kit and engine package, to make
sure that you're comparing "apples to apples". Good hunting! Milt Black
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of
DuaneFamly@aol.com
Subject: Re: Europa-List: to Tom Lowsley re:XS tri-gear project for sale
--> Europa-List message posted by: DuaneFamly@aol.com
Milt,
One item of interest to many of those that might be thinking of an
alternative is price. When all is said and done.....what would be the
typical cost of
a Jabiru 3300 power plant with FWF kit compared to a Rotax 912S power plant
with FWF kit? Here in the States.
Mike Duane A207A
Redding, California
XS Conventional Gear
--
Message 22
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| Subject: | Re: to Tom Lowsley re:XS tri-gear project for sale |
--> Europa-List message posted by: N55XS <topglock@cox.net>
Jeff,
If you like performance and ease of operation, you're going to love your
912S. My tri gear's acceleration is very impressive; pushes you well
back into the seat and she climbs at around 1000 fpm at 1400 lbs, when
coupled with an AirMaster...
I looked, very hard at all the engines and FWFs being used in Europas
and chose the 912S. My reasons for choosing the 912S are: The kit was
designed around it, making installation a breeze. Performance, well,
see above. I wanted to fly my beauty, NOW! and didn't want to spend
extra time fidgiting with a non-standard installation. I'm not saying
that the other available engines aren't fine and I very well might
experiment with another engine, should I build another Europa. I just
wanted to get under way with the least possible hassles. The 912S has
provided me with that ability and has done so spectacularly.
Hope I haven't stepped on any toes... ;)
Jeff - N55XS
60+ hours and going out again tomorrow with that special grin, still on my face...
JEFF ROBERTS wrote:
>--> Europa-List message posted by: JEFF ROBERTS <jeff@rmmm.net>
>
>Hey guys!
>Sounds like your all satisfied with your Europa and would not swap them
>for 3 other airplanes, but your hung up on the front end. You've all
>made me glad I am closer to the first flight of A248!
>Regards
>Jeff
>912S not sure of how I'll like it yet.
>
>On Sep 16, 2005, at 11:04 AM, GLENN CROWDER wrote:
>
>
>
>>--> Europa-List message posted by: "GLENN CROWDER"
>><gcrowder2@hotmail.com>
>>
>>Hey Sam, as far as a Rotax being the engine of choice, that is just
>>your
>>opinion.
>>I am quite happy with my Subaru EA81 and would not swap it for even 4
>>Rotaxes!
>>And thats my opinion. Glenn 300 hrs +
>>
>>
>>--> Europa-List message posted by: SPurpura@xxxxxxx
>>
>>AS FAR AS A JABIRU BEING THE ENGINE OF CHOISE,THAT IS JUST YOR OPINION.
>>I AM QUITE HAPPY WITH MY ROTAX 914 AND WOULD NOT SWAP IT FOR EVEN 2
>>JABIRU'S.
>>AND THAT'S MY OPINION. SAM N77EU 350 HRS+
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
Message 23
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| Subject: | Re: to Tom Lowsley re:XS tri-gear project for sale |
--> Europa-List message posted by: JEFF ROBERTS <jeff@rmmm.net>
Thanks for the encouragement Jeff. Looking forward to flying even more.
Regards,
Jeff
A258
On Sep 16, 2005, at 5:50 PM, N55XS wrote:
> --> Europa-List message posted by: N55XS <topglock@cox.net>
>
> Jeff,
>
> If you like performance and ease of operation, you're going to love
> your
> 912S. My tri gear's acceleration is very impressive; pushes you well
> back into the seat and she climbs at around 1000 fpm at 1400 lbs, when
> coupled with an AirMaster...
>
> I looked, very hard at all the engines and FWFs being used in Europas
> and chose the 912S. My reasons for choosing the 912S are: The kit was
> designed around it, making installation a breeze. Performance, well,
> see above. I wanted to fly my beauty, NOW! and didn't want to spend
> extra time fidgiting with a non-standard installation. I'm not saying
> that the other available engines aren't fine and I very well might
> experiment with another engine, should I build another Europa. I just
> wanted to get under way with the least possible hassles. The 912S has
> provided me with that ability and has done so spectacularly.
>
> Hope I haven't stepped on any toes... ;)
>
> Jeff - N55XS
> 60+ hours and going out again tomorrow with that special grin, still
> on my face...
>
>
> JEFF ROBERTS wrote:
>
>> --> Europa-List message posted by: JEFF ROBERTS <jeff@rmmm.net>
>>
>> Hey guys!
>> Sounds like your all satisfied with your Europa and would not swap
>> them
>> for 3 other airplanes, but your hung up on the front end. You've all
>> made me glad I am closer to the first flight of A248!
>> Regards
>> Jeff
>> 912S not sure of how I'll like it yet.
>>
>> On Sep 16, 2005, at 11:04 AM, GLENN CROWDER wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>> --> Europa-List message posted by: "GLENN CROWDER"
>>> <gcrowder2@hotmail.com>
>>>
>>> Hey Sam, as far as a Rotax being the engine of choice, that is just
>>> your
>>> opinion.
>>> I am quite happy with my Subaru EA81 and would not swap it for even 4
>>> Rotaxes!
>>> And thats my opinion. Glenn 300 hrs +
>>>
>>>
>>> --> Europa-List message posted by: SPurpura@xxxxxxx
>>>
>>> AS FAR AS A JABIRU BEING THE ENGINE OF CHOISE,THAT IS JUST YOR
>>> OPINION.
>>> I AM QUITE HAPPY WITH MY ROTAX 914 AND WOULD NOT SWAP IT FOR EVEN 2
>>> JABIRU'S.
>>> AND THAT'S MY OPINION. SAM N77EU 350 HRS+
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
Message 24
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| Subject: | Re: to Tom Lowsley re:XS tri-gear project for sale |
--> Europa-List message posted by: SPurpura@aol.com
I DONT THINK YOU COULD SWAP A SUBARU MOTOR
FOR 1 VOLKSWAGON MOTOR AS FAR AS THAT GOES.
SAM N77EU
Message 25
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--> Europa-List message posted by: SPurpura@aol.com
THIS FORUM IS MEANT FOR EUROPA BUILDERS & OWNERS.
IF YOU ARE SELLING AN ENGINE YOU SHUOULD PAY MATRONICS
FOR YOUR ADVERTIZING OR PLACE AN ADD
IN THE MAGAZINES AND LEAVE US TO OUR AIRCRAFT.
SAM N77EU
Message 26
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| Subject: | Monowheel Upstop? |
--> Europa-List message posted by: <rparigor@suffolk.lib.ny.us>
Just got the gear lever gates installed.
When positioned in the up gate the swingarm is even with the bottom of
fuse. If I push up on the swingarm, to simulate negative Gs, the caliper
mashes into the rudder cables and also hits a starbord rudder guide.
These bad things happen if I push up bout 3/4"
I am thinking to install a up stop on the port side of the tunnel just
forward of the airbrake horn, made of 1/4 tufnal and contacting the
swingarm just where the swingarm is closest to the tunnel. Position would
where tire needs to be raised about 1/4" to contact this stop.
Comments?
Thx.
Ron Parigoris
Message 27
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| Subject: | Question about wing tie-downs (Mod 69) |
--> Europa-List message posted by: Andrew Sarangan <asarangan@yahoo.com>
I am installing the wing tiedowns (Mod 69). It calls for Araldite 420
and flox for bonding the tiedown assembly. Is there any reason why
Aeropoxy flox cannot be used?
The reason I ask is, I figure the Araldite is better left unopened
(even though they are past the expiration date) until I need them for
closing the wings and bonding the fuselage.
Andrew Sarangan
http://www.sarangan.org
Message 28
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Received-SPF: None (dbmail-mx1.orcon.net.nz: domain of bill.sue@zip.co.nz
does not designate permitted sender hosts)
receiver=dbmail-mx1.orcon.net.nz;
client-ip=219.88.139.120;
envelope-from=<bill.sue@zip.co.nz>;
helo=billsue;
| Subject: | Re: Monowheel Upstop? |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Bill & Sue Sisley" <bill.sue@zip.co.nz>
That's what I did, works a treat!
Sue and Bill
XS Mono
914/Airmaster
350hrs
----- Original Message -----
From: <rparigor@suffolk.lib.ny.us>
Subject: Europa-List: Monowheel Upstop?
> --> Europa-List message posted by: <rparigor@suffolk.lib.ny.us>
>
> Just got the gear lever gates installed.
>
> When positioned in the up gate the swingarm is even with the bottom of
> fuse. If I push up on the swingarm, to simulate negative Gs, the caliper
> mashes into the rudder cables and also hits a starbord rudder guide.
>
> These bad things happen if I push up bout 3/4"
>
> I am thinking to install a up stop on the port side of the tunnel just
> forward of the airbrake horn, made of 1/4 tufnal and contacting the
> swingarm just where the swingarm is closest to the tunnel. Position would
> where tire needs to be raised about 1/4" to contact this stop.
>
> Comments?
>
> Thx.
> Ron Parigoris
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 29
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--> Europa-List message posted by: "nigel charles" <nigelcharles@tiscali.co.uk>
>Thats easy!
>> Get the 140 hp Dual Port Fuel Injected EA81 with redundant injection
>>here:<
Very easy if you want to substitute baggage capability for engine
weight. The extra weight also means the battery has to be in the tail to
keep the C of G within limits. This increases the pitch inertia which
degrades the handling characteristics slightly.
For those who are new to the forum and are trying to make an engine
choice the following might be a useful summary:
Subaru - too heavy, NSI (the company producing the engine/gearbox
package) have a poor customer relations record.
BMW - nice engine but torsional vibration proved to be a too difficult
problem to overcome after exhaustive development work.
Mid West Rotary - very smooth and light but excessive fuel consumption
and very difficult to set up to run smoothly at all rpm's.
Wilksch Diesel - lovely engine with many original design patents. It is
very fuel efficient and cheap to run due to much cheaper jet fuel. This
is an engine to watch in the future for the replacement of
Lyco/Continentals but it is just too heavy for the Europa. The radiator
adds significantly to the frontal area which may increase drag.
Lyco/Continental - too heavy and high fuel consumption.
Jabiru - the only workable alternative to the Rotax for the Europa. True
it is simpler. If you want a simple aircraft you would probably not have
chosen the Europa in the first place. Although it has a higher power
output it is at 3300rpm which is too high for the prop to use
efficiently so the performance advantage is negated. Being aircooled the
fuel efficiency is slightly down on the Rotax. Some cooling issues were
apparent from the cowling mods seen on early aircraft. It definitely has
a price advantage which is the one area which lets the Rotax down. If I
was cost limited I would sooner spend it on the engine rather than
expensive avionics.
Rotax - still the most suitable engine for the aircraft if rather
expensive. As Ivan Shaw said in the early days of the Europa 'there is
more work in developing the engine for the airframe than designing the
airframe in the first place'. The P51 argument would be relevant if
there was an engine that was significantly more suited to the airframe
but so far this is not the case.
Choice of versions of the Rotax
912 - very fuel efficient but a little underpowered for the Europa
especially at max weight with high density altitudes. Using a VP prop
helps to extract maximum power at take-off without affecting cruise
performance.
912S - the extra 20hp make all the difference. Probably the first choice
for most Rotax users. Make sure the higher power starter is installed to
help prevent kickbacks on start due to the higher compression ratio.
914 Turbo - yet more performance but at a price and increased
complexity. Probably the best engine for those who regularly operate at
high density altitudes. However the 912S with a VP prop will give
adequate performance up to density altitudes of at least 10,000ft and
will comfortably exceed Vno at low altitudes.
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