Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 12:07 AM - Aileron bellcrank assembly (Keith Hickling)
2. 12:32 AM - Re: Aileron bellcrank assembly (G-IANI)
3. 01:27 AM - Re: Re: 914 Fuel System (BEBERRY@aol.com)
4. 02:40 AM - Re: Re: 914 Fuel System (Simon Smith)
5. 03:39 AM - Rotax ignition check, of course or fine? ()
6. 04:13 AM - MTOW (josok)
7. 07:07 AM - Fuel pumps in series can get blocked (GLENN CROWDER)
8. 07:11 AM - Re: MTOW (Arthur Orchard)
9. 07:18 AM - 914 Fuel System (Ing. Gottfried Komaier)
10. 07:49 AM - Re: 914 Fuel System (Paul McAllister)
11. 07:50 AM - Re: 914 Fuel System (William Daniell)
12. 07:56 AM - Re: Fuel pumps in series can get blocked (ivor.phillips)
13. 09:45 AM - Re: Aileron bellcrank assembly (DuaneFamly@aol.com)
14. 10:35 AM - Re: Aileron bellcrank assembly (NevEyre@aol.com)
15. 12:06 PM - Re: Fuel pumps in series can get blocked (Tony Krzyzewski)
16. 12:18 PM - Re: Strobe light (Rob Housman)
17. 12:18 PM - Re: Aileron bellcrank assembly (Jeff B)
18. 12:20 PM - Re: Rotax ignition check, of course or fine? (Jeff B)
19. 12:27 PM - Re: 914 Fuel System (josok)
20. 12:53 PM - 914 Fuel Pumps. (MICHAEL PARKIN)
21. 12:55 PM - MAC Servo Indicator. (MICHAEL PARKIN)
22. 12:56 PM - Re: Fuel pumps in series can get blocked (Dean Seitz)
23. 01:53 PM - Re: Aileron bellcrank assembly (EuropaXSA276@aol.com)
24. 01:57 PM - Re: 914 Fuel Pumps. (Tony Krzyzewski)
25. 02:05 PM - AW: 914 Fuel Pumps. (Ing. Gottfried Komaier)
26. 02:14 PM - AW: 914 Fuel Pumps. (Ing. Gottfried Komaier)
27. 03:07 PM - Aileron bellcrank assembly (Keith Hickling)
28. 03:07 PM - Re: Re: 914 Fuel System (Jan de Jong)
29. 05:22 PM - Re: AW: 914 Fuel Pumps. (Tony Krzyzewski)
30. 07:58 PM - Re: AW: 914 Fuel Pumps. (MICHAEL PARKIN)
31. 11:06 PM - Re: Re: 914 Fuel System (Michael Grass)
Message 1
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Subject: | Aileron bellcrank assembly |
--> Europa-List message posted by: Keith Hickling <keithhickling@clear.net.nz>
I have just installed the aileron bellcrank assembly on the stbd wing of my XS,
with the long arm of the bellcrank towards the spar as shown in the manual. There
is around 6 mm clearance between the front of the bellcrank arm and the spar,
but I have had to trim the holes in the double rib for the aileron pushrod
right back to spar, and the pushrod is still rubbing quite hard on the front
end of the double rib that is bonded onto the spar (the double rib seems to be
formed as one unit joined at the spar end).
I find this worrying because the bellcrank assembly presumably has constant dimensions
and is mounted on the spar, so if mine binds on the spar, it should always
happen unless I have goofed and assembled it the wrong way. Should it be
mounted with the long arm towards the spar? Have others had to sand back the glass
between the double rib that is bonded to the spar? The alternative would
be to pack out the mounting brackets with washers, but I feel this shouldn't be
necessary.
Help please!
Keith Hickling
Tail, ailerons, flaps completed
Wing reinforcements and W18 plates installed
working on cockpit module
8 months into build
Message 2
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Subject: | Aileron bellcrank assembly |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "G-IANI" <g-iani@ntlworld.com>
Long arm towards the spar is, from memory and the manual, correct.
Sanding the spar between the double ribs should not be necessary.
Have a talk with Andy Draper.
Ian Rickard #505 G-IANI XS Trigear
Europa Club Mods Rep (Trigear)
e-mail mods@europaclub.org.uk
or direct g-iani@ntlworld.com
Message 3
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Subject: | Re: RE: 914 Fuel System |
--> Europa-List message posted by: BEBERRY@aol.com
I have followed the recent parallel v series argument with interest. As the
owner of a 914 with pumps in parallel and have no occasion in Europe to fly
above say 7,000ft and then seldom, I wonder if some one more erudite than I
could explain what problems I am likely to encounter and whether I should
consider a modification?
Patrick
Message 4
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Subject: | RE: 914 Fuel System |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Simon Smith" <jodel@nildram.co.uk>
I think that if there was a good reason for the pumps not to be in parallel
then we would have seen an SB mandating the change to series.
Simon
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of BEBERRY@aol.com
Sent: 22 February 2006 09:25
Subject: Re: Europa-List: RE: 914 Fuel System
--> Europa-List message posted by: BEBERRY@aol.com
I have followed the recent parallel v series argument with interest. As the
owner of a 914 with pumps in parallel and have no occasion in Europe to fly
above say 7,000ft and then seldom, I wonder if some one more erudite than I
could explain what problems I am likely to encounter and whether I should
consider a modification?
Patrick
Message 5
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Subject: | Rotax ignition check, of course or fine? |
--> Europa-List message posted by: <rparigor@suffolk.lib.ny.us>
When checking ignition with a constant speed prop, is it preferred to have
the prop:
Fine?
Course?
Both of Course are Fine?
Thx.
Ron Parigoris
Message 6
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--> Europa-List message posted by: "josok" <josok-e@ukolo.fi>
Added a pdf with the factory view about an increase to MTOW to the document storage at http://www.europaowners.org, with thanks to Stefan Ingemarsson.
Regards,
----------------
Message 7
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Cc: gcrowder2@hotmail.com
Subject: | Fuel pumps in series can get blocked |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "GLENN CROWDER" <gcrowder2@hotmail.com>
I switched the pumps on my setup from series to parallel as the Ellison
throttle body
on my Subaru setup only requires 3 psi. One big negative on two pumps in
series is that if
there is a blockage, both pumps are taken out. In the parallel arrangement,
if one pump
gets blocked, the other pump can still deliver fuel.
Glenn
>From: "Craig Ellison" <craig.ellison2@verizon.net>
>To: <europa-list@matronics.com>
>Subject: Re: Europa-List: RE: 914 Fuel System
>Date: Tue, 21 Feb 2006 17:43:31 -0800
>
>--> Europa-List message posted by: "Craig Ellison"
><craig.ellison2@verizon.net>
>
>All,
>
>I too had my system set up in parellel and changed to series after talking
>to John H. One reason I remember of the conversation was about allowing
>proper readings on the fuel pressure/MP differential gauge.
>
>craig ellison
>A205/N205CN
>Almost ready to fly
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "josok" <josok-e@ukolo.fi>
>Sent: Tuesday, February 21, 2006 12:14 AM
>Subject: Europa-List: RE: 914 Fuel System
>
>
> > --> Europa-List message posted by: "josok" <josok-e@ukolo.fi>
> >
> > Hi Dan,
> >
> > The difference is that in the tech talk, just as in the latest issue of
> > the XS 914 engine manual the pumps are operating in serial. This seems
>to
> > be a Rotax requirement. I intend to follow that requirement, although at
> > this time i can't figure out where the advantage is. Anybody with more
> > insight?
> >
> > Kind Regards,
> >
> > Jos Okhuijsen
> > ----------------
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
Message 8
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--> Europa-List message posted by: "Arthur Orchard" <avo@flyingcircus.fsworld.co.uk>
Hi Mike,
As you Know, Richard has carried on this business for some time on
his own voilition I personally have had nothing to do with his affairs,
since the first lot of minies that went astray as, Larry will tell you, I
said that I, was not going to put any more funds in to that escapade, as I
could not afford too, I Will endeavor to convey his words both ways? As to
Points you raised in you're Email to me, Hope everything is fine with you
and you're family,
Regards and Best wishes
Arthur
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of josok
Sent: 22 February 2006 12:09
Subject: Europa-List: MTOW
--> Europa-List message posted by: "josok" <josok-e@ukolo.fi>
Added a pdf with the factory view about an increase to MTOW to the document
storage at http://www.europaowners.org, with thanks to Stefan Ingemarsson.
Regards,
----------------
Message 9
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--> Europa-List message posted by: "Ing. Gottfried Komaier" <gottfried.komaier@gmx.net>
Jos, Dan, and all,
The discussion of the fuel system is an academical-discussion, but
nevertheless, I will give you more ideas to think about.
First of all, don't think that the pumps in SERIES are only helpful at high
altitudes. Stable fuel-pressure is fine at lower altitudes as well. At the
critical phase of flight
-Take Off - the volume of one pump is more as enough. In this phase of
operation, a higher pressure (or in other words, a stable pressure) is the
important thing. Does one of you checked the fuel-flow of the "Pierburg"
fuel pump? At full power (5800 RPM) the fuel flow of the 914 is ~33l/h.
Have a look at www.msi-motor-service.com and learn more about this pump. In
PARALLEL there is so much fuel going back to the tank. In case of an
pump-failure when operating in SERIES, the second pump works - in this phase
of flight - in the same way as when in PARALLEL. Don't are the fuel pumps on
the 912 (mechanical-electrical) in SERIES, as well? What do you think is the
reason for that? Does one of you would start a discussion on that? I don't
think so. Pierburg fuel-pumps are developed for car- and stationary engines,
not for aircraft-engines. At the beginning of manufacture of the 914 engine,
Rotax take the drawings of Pierburg. Does one of you know, that the original
design of the 914 runs with the mechanical pump, as we can see on the 912
engine? I think the real problem of the 914 fuel pump-design is the
dependence on electricity. What happens in case of an serious
electricity-problem? Then the flight becomes s i l e n t. In this situation,
God gives you a meadow under your wings! The dependence on electricity is
the real and only problem of the 914 fuel system, not the PARALLEL -or
SERIES- design.
Let me know, what you are thinking about this problem.
Regards,
Gottfried
Message 10
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--> Europa-List message posted by: "Paul McAllister" <paul.mcallister@qia.net>
Hi all,
I am a curious to know if the 914 pump can be purchased from any one other
than Rotax? Does anyone know ?
Paul
Message 11
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--> Europa-List message posted by: "William Daniell" <wdaniell@etb.net.co>
Interestingly enough on my Colombian Zenith STOL clone which I fly when I am
not making cock ups on my Europa, I have a turboed 912 (a 912 with a car
turbo bolted on). This has a mechanical pump and an electric pump.
If you turn the electric pump off it will only make about 23inch MP which is
sufficient at 8500msl (Bogota) to maintain altitude but not much more - but
at least the motor does not stop.
I am intending to use this engine in the Europa with two electric pumps - a
main and a manually operated "boost" for critical flight phases.
Will
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ing. Gottfried
Komaier
Sent: Wednesday, February 22, 2006 10:17
Subject: Europa-List: 914 Fuel System
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Ing. Gottfried Komaier"
<gottfried.komaier@gmx.net>
Jos, Dan, and all,
The discussion of the fuel system is an academical-discussion, but
nevertheless, I will give you more ideas to think about.
First of all, don't think that the pumps in SERIES are only helpful at high
altitudes. Stable fuel-pressure is fine at lower altitudes as well. At the
critical phase of flight
-Take Off - the volume of one pump is more as enough. In this phase of
operation, a higher pressure (or in other words, a stable pressure) is the
important thing. Does one of you checked the fuel-flow of the "Pierburg"
fuel pump? At full power (5800 RPM) the fuel flow of the 914 is ~33l/h.
Have a look at www.msi-motor-service.com and learn more about this pump. In
PARALLEL there is so much fuel going back to the tank. In case of an
pump-failure when operating in SERIES, the second pump works - in this phase
of flight - in the same way as when in PARALLEL. Don't are the fuel pumps on
the 912 (mechanical-electrical) in SERIES, as well? What do you think is the
reason for that? Does one of you would start a discussion on that? I don't
think so. Pierburg fuel-pumps are developed for car- and stationary engines,
not for aircraft-engines. At the beginning of manufacture of the 914 engine,
Rotax take the drawings of Pierburg. Does one of you know, that the original
design of the 914 runs with the mechanical pump, as we can see on the 912
engine? I think the real problem of the 914 fuel pump-design is the
dependence on electricity. What happens in case of an serious
electricity-problem? Then the flight becomes s i l e n t. In this situation,
God gives you a meadow under your wings! The dependence on electricity is
the real and only problem of the 914 fuel system, not the PARALLEL -or
SERIES- design.
Let me know, what you are thinking about this problem.
Regards,
Gottfried
Message 12
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Subject: | Re: Fuel pumps in series can get blocked |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "ivor.phillips" <ivor.phillips@ntlworld.com>
Glen that is not actually the case, If one Pump became blocked, ( There
are small mesh filters on the inlet) the second pump would draw its
fuel around the Bi-pass pipe and Non-return valve,
But i agree i would also prefer the Parallel system,
On the Pierburg website there no mention of running these pumps in series ,
schematics only show parallel, Makes you wonder!!!
> I switched the pumps on my setup from series to parallel as the Ellison
> throttle body
> on my Subaru setup only requires 3 psi. One big negative on two pumps in
> series is that if
> there is a blockage, both pumps are taken out. In the parallel
> arrangement,
> if one pump
> gets blocked, the other pump can still deliver fuel.
>
Ivor Phillips
Message 13
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Subject: | Re: Aileron bellcrank assembly |
--> Europa-List message posted by: DuaneFamly@aol.com
Keith,
My bellcrank clears the rib fine by about 5mm.....no where near
rubbing......the pivot bolt measures about 55mm from the rib and the mounting bolt
closest
to the rib and on the spar side is 25mm from the rib. I hope this helps.
Mike Duane
Redding, California
XS Conventional Gear
Jabiru 3300
Message 14
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Subject: | Re: Aileron bellcrank assembly |
--> Europa-List message posted by: NevEyre@aol.com
Hi Keith,
Interference [ or not ] of the push rod with the double rib forward web, is
dependent on the thickness of the Redux glue line between the web and the
spar, [ as supplied].Chances are yours has a thick glue line ?
I have seen many that needed the hole relieved all the way to the web, and
some that needed the belcrank brackets to be shimmed aft'.
Use alloy shims, as thick as required, the same size as the flange of the
bracket [ washers will not do !]
Hope this helps ?
Cheers,
Nev.
Message 15
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Subject: | Re: Fuel pumps in series can get blocked |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Tony Krzyzewski" <tonyk@kaon.co.nz>
The reason for the change to series based pumps is to bring the fuel pressure down
to that specified by Rotax. If you measure the differential fuel pressure
to airbox pressure as recommended then you'll find that the pressure delivered
by parallel pumps is too high.
Having said that. There are many 914's flying with parallel pumps as this is what
Rotax used to show in the installation manual.
Unless you intend retrofitting the UMA pressure sensor there is no need to change.
For new installations the Rotax manual now shows pumps in series with bypass valves
Tony
Message 16
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--> Europa-List message posted by: "Rob Housman" <robh@hyperion-ef.us>
You are in luck because of my bad luck (I got screwed by the crooks at
Goldwing). I have an incomplete and useless kit of strobes. In addition to
the clear strobe for the tail I have some miscellaneous hardware and wiring.
Whatever you want is available for the cost to ship the stuff to you.
Contact me off-list to arrange shipment.
Best regards,
Rob Housman
A070
Airframe complete
Irvine, CA
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of JonSmith
Sent: Monday, February 20, 2006 2:39 AM
Subject: Europa-List: Strobe light
--> Europa-List message posted by: "JonSmith" <jon.smith680@tesco.net>
Hi everyone!
My plane has a fin mounted strobe - well it did until recently cos I smashed
it off on the garage door. (As they say, an inch can make all the
difference!)
It is/ was a "Goldwing", (Goldwing ATL I think it was called). I'm pretty
sure they're not made now as I've not seen adverts for a long time. Just
wondering if anyone by good chance might have one they're not going to use
anymore or otherwise know where there might be one lying around? I need the
glass and the plastic light fitting. The glass is clear, not frosted and
perfectly round - ie not aerodynamically shaped.
Best Regards,
Jon Smith
G-TERN
----------------
Message 17
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Subject: | Re: Aileron bellcrank assembly |
--> Europa-List message posted by: Jeff B <topglock@cox.net>
I had a clearance problem in both of my wings. I shimmed the bellcrank
out with two .063" shims and trimmed out the holes in the ribs. All is
well with 140 hours in the air...
Jeff - N55XS
141 hours...
Keith Hickling wrote:
> --> Europa-List message posted by: Keith Hickling <keithhickling@clear.net.nz>
>
> I have just installed the aileron bellcrank assembly on the stbd wing of my XS,
with the long arm of the bellcrank towards the spar as shown in the manual.
There is around 6 mm clearance between the front of the bellcrank arm and the
spar, but I have had to trim the holes in the double rib for the aileron pushrod
right back to spar, and the pushrod is still rubbing quite hard on the front
end of the double rib that is bonded onto the spar (the double rib seems to
be formed as one unit joined at the spar end).
>
> I find this worrying because the bellcrank assembly presumably has constant dimensions
and is mounted on the spar, so if mine binds on the spar, it should
always happen unless I have goofed and assembled it the wrong way. Should it be
mounted with the long arm towards the spar? Have others had to sand back the
glass between the double rib that is bonded to the spar? The alternative would
be to pack out the mounting brackets with washers, but I feel this shouldn't
be necessary.
>
> Help please!
>
> Keith Hickling
>
> Tail, ailerons, flaps completed
> Wing reinforcements and W18 plates installed
> working on cockpit module
> 8 months into build
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
--
Message 18
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Subject: | Re: Rotax ignition check, of course or fine? |
--> Europa-List message posted by: Jeff B <topglock@cox.net>
Ron,
If you're referring to ingition at run up, I do the mag check in fine
pitch, then go my prop check, cycling it through at 4000 rpm.
Jeff - N55XS
141 hours
rparigor@suffolk.lib.ny.us wrote:
> --> Europa-List message posted by: <rparigor@suffolk.lib.ny.us>
>
> When checking ignition with a constant speed prop, is it preferred to have
> the prop:
> Fine?
> Course?
> Both of Course are Fine?
>
> Thx.
> Ron Parigoris
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
--
Message 19
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Subject: | RE: 914 Fuel System |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "josok" <josok-e@ukolo.fi>
Completely agree, that there is probably more risk of running out of electrical
power then loosing both pumps. I understand that the output of one pump will
be enough even while departing. For those who missed something: In the new serial
pumps drawings are check valves parallel to the pumps.
Thanks all non-lurkers for bringing up ideas and facts. The blocked fuel supply
made me think. If both pumps are running, as at departure, and they are in parallel,
the flow will be more then twice as needed. If there is some half-blockage,
like Bob Harrison experienced, this increased fuel flow could more easily
suck in more debris and lead to a full block.
My solution for having (almost) always electricity to drive at least one pump is
to have 2 completely independent electrical systems. That is the original generator,
regulator and (small) battery, and a second generator with built in regulator
and separate battery. Both pumps and the avionics will be wired to 3
position toggle switches, pos up circuit one, pos middle off, pos down circuit
2. At departure and landing pump one will be on circuit one, and pump 2 on circuit
2. Power to the pumps will be indicated by a led.
I am still thinking about a relay system that cuts the generators and avionics
off, while connecting both batteries to get maximum cranking power at start. Will
probably decide against it, because the extra components will add error possibilities.
Kind Regards,
Jos Okhuijsen
----------------
Message 20
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--> Europa-List message posted by: "MICHAEL PARKIN" <mikenjulie.parkin@btopenworld.com>
I am not sure whether it was Europa or not, but I heard that someone was investigating
putting the manual fuel pump on the 914 with electrical back up pumps
for the high demand situation. Sounds like a good idea to me.
Does anyone know anything about it.
regards,
Mike
Message 21
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Subject: | MAC Servo Indicator. |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "MICHAEL PARKIN" <mikenjulie.parkin@btopenworld.com>
Does anyone have an old, unwanted and broken LED type position indicator that comes
with the MAC servo. It doesn't matter if it is in the bottom of the gash
box. I need one for an experiment.
cheers,
Mike
Message 22
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Subject: | Fuel pumps in series can get blocked |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Dean Seitz" <daseitz@cfl.rr.com>
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tony Krzyzewski
Sent: Wednesday, February 22, 2006 3:03 PM
Subject: Re: Europa-List: Fuel pumps in series can get blocked
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Tony Krzyzewski" <tonyk@kaon.co.nz>
<< For new installations the Rotax manual now shows pumps in series with
<< bypass valves
If one pump can bypass the other with the check valves then they are not
really in series. Not sure what it is called but it's a combination of
series and parallel. Each pump can pump around the other but each pump also
helps the other with pressure and suction.
Dean
Message 23
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Subject: | Re: Aileron bellcrank assembly |
--> Europa-List message posted by: EuropaXSA276@aol.com
Hi Keith.
I had the same problem. If you look at my build photos in "Chapter Eight
Starboard Wing" you can see two bar shims behind the crank brackets. They move
the assembly aft and give you the clearance you need.
Hope that helps...
Tailwinds
Brian Skelly
Europa XS TriGear #A276
North Texas USA
You can see my build photos at:
www.europaowners.org/brians
Message 24
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Subject: | Re: 914 Fuel Pumps. |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Tony Krzyzewski" <tonyk@kaon.co.nz>
With regard to putting a mechanical pump back on to the 914.
I investigated this some time ago and found that non of the pump drive gearing
is present in the 914 gearbox so it would be a major mod
Tony.
Message 25
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--> Europa-List message posted by: "Ing. Gottfried Komaier" <gottfried.komaier@gmx.net>
Mike,
Here is the way I'll doing. I have the mechanical pump as a standby-pump on
the engine. The fuel is going through the pump all the time in bypass, that
means all the fuel which is going through the mechanical pump goes via a
electrical valve back to the tank. In an electrical emergency, the valve
closes and the pump keeps the engine running up to ~2000m and ~55% power.
The fuel-pressure (Airbox pressure + 0,35 bar) is secured up to this
altitude and power setting. You can check the Airbox-Differential-pressure
with the new "uma"-gauge. www.umainstruments.com This instrument is the only
indicator for the fuel pressure on 914 engines which makes sense.
For checking the bypass-system the electrical pumps can switched off
momentarily after engine start.
Regards,
Gottfried
-----Ursprngliche Nachricht-----
Von: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] Im Auftrag von MICHAEL
PARKIN
Gesendet: Mittwoch, 22. Februar 2006 21:52
An: Europa-List@Matronics.Com
Betreff: Europa-List: 914 Fuel Pumps.
--> Europa-List message posted by: "MICHAEL PARKIN"
--> <mikenjulie.parkin@btopenworld.com>
I am not sure whether it was Europa or not, but I heard that someone was
investigating putting the manual fuel pump on the 914 with electrical back
up pumps for the high demand situation. Sounds like a good idea to me.
Does anyone know anything about it.
regards,
Mike
Message 26
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--> Europa-List message posted by: "Ing. Gottfried Komaier" <gottfried.komaier@gmx.net>
Tony,
all the 914 have the eccenter for the pump-drive installed.This is the
status since around 2003. I can't say how the situation was before.
Regards,
Gottfried
-----Ursprngliche Nachricht-----
Von: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] Im Auftrag von Tony
Krzyzewski
Gesendet: Mittwoch, 22. Februar 2006 22:56
An: europa-list@matronics.com
Betreff: Re: Europa-List: 914 Fuel Pumps.
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Tony Krzyzewski" <tonyk@kaon.co.nz>
With regard to putting a mechanical pump back on to the 914.
I investigated this some time ago and found that non of the pump drive
gearing is present in the 914 gearbox so it would be a major mod
Tony.
Message 27
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Subject: | Aileron bellcrank assembly |
--> Europa-List message posted by: Keith Hickling <keithhickling@clear.net.nz>
Hi Nev, Ron and others,
Many thanks for your responses. It is reassuring to hear others have experienced
this. Yes, the glue line between the web of the double rib and spar is quite
thick. Alloy shims the width of the bracket flanges sounds good - washers would
not support the brackets so firmly I guess.
Regards,
Keith Hickling,
Dunedin,
New Zealand.
Tail, ailerons, flaps completed
Wing reinforcements and W18 plates installed
working on cockpit module
8 months into build
Nev wrote:
--> Europa-List message posted by: NevEyre@aol.com
Hi Keith,
Interference [ or not ] of the push rod with the double rib forward web, is
dependent on the thickness of the Redux glue line between the web and the
spar, [ as supplied].Chances are yours has a thick glue line ?
I have seen many that needed the hole relieved all the way to the web, and
some that needed the belcrank brackets to be shimmed aft'.
Use alloy shims, as thick as required, the same size as the flange of the
bracket [ washers will not do !]
Hope this helps ?
Cheers,
Nev.
Message 28
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Subject: | Re: RE: 914 Fuel System |
--> Europa-List message posted by: Jan de Jong <jan.de.jong@xs4all.nl>
I wonder if there have been electric fuel pump changes. The series vs.
parallel recommendation may have something to do with the
characteristics of the fuel pumps: more "flow source" (offering constant
flow, any required pressure) or more "pressure source" (offering
constant pressure, any required flow). In the first case you would want
a series connection, in the second a parallel one.
Just a thought.
Cheers,
Jan de Jong
461, second wing.
Message 29
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Subject: | Re: 914 Fuel Pumps. |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Tony Krzyzewski" <tonyk@kaon.co.nz>
Gottfried
Thanks for the update re the pump fitting. Mine is an earlier engine and all I
have is an empty space under the cover where the mechanical pump would sit.
Tony
Message 30
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Subject: | Re: 914 Fuel Pumps. |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "MICHAEL PARKIN" <mikenjulie.parkin@btopenworld.com>
Tony,
My aircraft predates 2003 also - another busted flush I guess.
regards,
MP
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tony Krzyzewski" <tonyk@kaon.co.nz>
Sent: Thursday, February 23, 2006 1:16 AM
Subject: Re: AW: Europa-List: 914 Fuel Pumps.
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Tony Krzyzewski" <tonyk@kaon.co.nz>
>
> Gottfried
>
> Thanks for the update re the pump fitting. Mine is an earlier engine and
> all I have is an empty space under the cover where the mechanical pump
> would sit.
>
> Tony
>
>
>
Message 31
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Subject: | Re: RE: 914 Fuel System |
--> Europa-List message posted by: "Michael Grass" <M.Grass@comcast.net>
I like to approach the problem by analyzing the possible failure modes. Not
knowing the exact function principle of the Pierburg pump from Rotax, I take
the assumption that at any time a pump could fail mechanically in a way that
the pump will not crate pressure and also will not block the fuel flow in
the reverse direction.In the original parallel design you are in trouble now
because you have a short circuit through the defective pump and you are no
longer able to maintain pressure.
The second failure could be: Clogging up filter elements. The two pumps in
series will produce a higher pressure. This could might be helpful if the
filter starts to clog up and might could still get you over the fence.
Just my penny of thoughts.
Michael Grass
A266 Trigear Detroit.
Building stopped, way to cold in Michigan
----- Original Message -----
From: "Simon Smith" <jodel@nildram.co.uk>
Sent: Wednesday, February 22, 2006 5:33 AM
Subject: RE: Europa-List: RE: 914 Fuel System
> --> Europa-List message posted by: "Simon Smith" <jodel@nildram.co.uk>
>
> I think that if there was a good reason for the pumps not to be in
> parallel
> then we would have seen an SB mandating the change to series.
>
> Simon
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
> BEBERRY@aol.com
> Sent: 22 February 2006 09:25
> To: europa-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Europa-List: RE: 914 Fuel System
>
>
> --> Europa-List message posted by: BEBERRY@aol.com
>
>
> I have followed the recent parallel v series argument with interest. As
> the
>
> owner of a 914 with pumps in parallel and have no occasion in Europe to
> fly
>
> above say 7,000ft and then seldom, I wonder if some one more erudite than
> I
>
> could explain what problems I am likely to encounter and whether I should
> consider a modification?
>
> Patrick
>
>
>
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