---------------------------------------------------------- Europa-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sun 04/30/06: 17 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 12:28 AM - Re: VOR Aerial / Antenna (Richard Holder) 2. 01:21 AM - Re: VOR Aerial / Antenna (Carl Pattinson) 3. 02:02 AM - Re: Warp Drive (willie.harrison@tinyonline.co.uk) 4. 06:20 AM - Fw: aimaster blades (Robert Borger) 5. 06:20 AM - Re: VOR Aerial / Antenna (Jim Brown) 6. 06:46 AM - Re: Fw: aimaster blades (SteveD) 7. 07:01 AM - Re: VOR Aerial/Antenna (Robert Borger) 8. 07:19 AM - Re: VOR Aerial / Antenna (europa flugzeug fabrik) 9. 07:40 AM - Re: VOR Aerial / Antenna (europa flugzeug fabrik) 10. 07:59 AM - Re: Re: Fw: aimaster blades (Craig Ellison) 11. 11:18 AM - Re: VOR Aerial / Antenna (Paul McAllister) 12. 01:27 PM - Re: Re: Fw: aimaster blades (Tony Krzyzewski) 13. 01:30 PM - Lydeway Fly-In 1st/2nd July 2006 (nigel charles) 14. 01:30 PM - Lydeway Fly-In 1st/2nd July 2006 (nigel charles) 15. 01:53 PM - Re: Fw: aimaster blades (SteveD) 16. 04:19 PM - Re: Re: Fw: aimaster blades (Timothy.P.Ward) 17. 07:26 PM - Re: (no subject) (SPurpura@aol.com) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 12:28:55 AM PST US From: Richard Holder Subject: Re: Europa-List: VOR Aerial / Antenna --> Europa-List message posted by: Richard Holder Peter Rees wrote: > I'm looking at installing a VOR / ILS receiver in > G-MFHI and am looking for some advice on a suitable > aerial. Spruce have some which look like long thin > strips with a BNC in the centre - easy enough to bond > into the back of the fuse. The Bob Archer ones they > offer also look pretty good but as they are designed > for horizontal mounting, may be a bit harder to mount > in the back without having to build a platform over the > rudder cables etc. > > Can anyone who has installed a VOR please let me know > what aerial / antenna you've used and any opinions > about it. > > I believe that the instrument I'm going to fit (Narco > 122) has a marker beacon receiver built in - any ideas > as to a suitable aerial for this would also be > appreciated. I have 3 Bob Archer antennae in G-OWWW. The COM and NAV are the thin strips and I have the "two sided printed circuit board" Transponder antenna. G-OWWW is (mainly) a Classic and the wings were closed when purchased. The COM antenna is placed vertically just behind the fuel filler on the starboard side. The NAV antenna is placed across the top of the fuselage. It is perfectly OK for the ends of the ali strips to be bent out of the horizontal plane. Remember the COM antenna must be vertical and the NAV horizontal as these are the orientation of the radio waves ! The NAV antenna will provide VOR and Localiser information. The Glideslope in a ILS is different altogether and needs extra kit. HTH Richard G-OWWW High Cross ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 01:21:19 AM PST US From: "Carl Pattinson" Subject: Re: Europa-List: VOR Aerial / Antenna --> Europa-List message posted by: "Carl Pattinson" VOR/ ILS We have a single aerial for the VOR/ ILS and the VOR works fine. We havent had the opportunity to test the ILS ever. Its a copper tape dipole aerial mounted horizontally inside the rear fuselage og the AC. (I have loads of spare copper tape if you want to experiment). Personally I cant see the point of having ILS (or VOR) these days on an aircraft like a Europa. GPS does the same job better and its even possible to have pseudo ILS on your GPS receiver that will be nearly as accurate. My understanding is that unless you can test and callibrate your ILS receiver you could never rely on it in a real life situation. I have ----- Original Message ----- From: "Richard Holder" Sent: Sunday, April 30, 2006 8:23 AM Subject: Re: Europa-List: VOR Aerial / Antenna > --> Europa-List message posted by: Richard Holder > > Peter Rees wrote: > >> I'm looking at installing a VOR / ILS receiver in >> G-MFHI and am looking for some advice on a suitable >> aerial. Spruce have some which look like long thin >> strips with a BNC in the centre - easy enough to bond >> into the back of the fuse. The Bob Archer ones they >> offer also look pretty good but as they are designed >> for horizontal mounting, may be a bit harder to mount >> in the back without having to build a platform over the >> rudder cables etc. >> >> Can anyone who has installed a VOR please let me know >> what aerial / antenna you've used and any opinions >> about it. >> >> I believe that the instrument I'm going to fit (Narco >> 122) has a marker beacon receiver built in - any ideas >> as to a suitable aerial for this would also be >> appreciated. > > I have 3 Bob Archer antennae in G-OWWW. The COM and NAV > are the thin strips and I have the "two sided printed > circuit board" Transponder antenna. > > G-OWWW is (mainly) a Classic and the wings were closed > when purchased. > > The COM antenna is placed vertically just behind the fuel > filler on the starboard side. The NAV antenna is placed > across the top of the fuselage. It is perfectly OK for the > ends of the ali strips to be bent out of the horizontal plane. > > Remember the COM antenna must be vertical and the NAV > horizontal as these are the orientation of the radio waves ! > > The NAV antenna will provide VOR and Localiser > information. The Glideslope in a ILS is different > altogether and needs extra kit. > > HTH > > Richard > G-OWWW High Cross > > > ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 02:02:39 AM PST US From: willie.harrison@tinyonline.co.uk Subject: RE: Europa-List: Warp Drive --> Europa-List message posted by: willie.harrison@tinyonline.co.uk Hello Graham How urgent is your need? I have a ground-adjustable, taper-blade, Warp Drive prop fitted which I was looking for an excuse to replace. It would take me a few weeks to organise an upgrade so let me know if you're interested (01763 263 283). Willie >-- Original Message -- >Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2006 22:40:45 +0100 >From: Graeme Smith >To: europa-list@matronics.com >Subject: Europa-List: Warp Drive > > >--> Europa-List message posted by: Graeme Smith > >Hi, > >Do any of you who have moved up to VP props, happen to have a Warp Drive > >fixed pitch prop with tapered blades that is surplus to requirements? I >am looking for one. > >Thanks, >Graeme Smith > >No 26 > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ Tiscali Broadband from 14.99 with free setup! http://www.tiscali.co.uk/products/broadband/ ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 06:20:45 AM PST US Cc: Robert Borger , dmac11@tlus.net From: Robert Borger Subject: Europa-List: Fwd: aimaster blades --> Europa-List message posted by: Robert Borger Europaphiles, This came in yesterday while I was out. Found it this morning. Is there anyone in the Florida, Georgia, Alabama, etc area that can give the fellow some help? Good building and great flying, Bob Borger Europa Kit #A221 N914XL, XS Mono, Intercooled 914, Airmaster C/S http://www.europaowners.org/N914XL (85%) tail kit done, wings closed, cockpit module installed, pitch system in, landing gear frame in, rudder system in with Singleton Mod, outrigger mod in, Fuselage Top on, lift/drag/flap pins in, wing incidence set, tie bar in, flap drive in, Mod 70 done, baggage bay in. Completing the firewall-aft fuel system and fitting the instrument panel. Working in - 24 Instrument Panel, 25 Electrical, 28 Flaps, 29 Main Gear, 30 Fuel System, 32 Tail, 34 Door Latches & 35 Doors, 37 Finishing. Preparing for ROTAX 914 installation. 3705 Lynchburg Dr. Corinth, TX 76208 Home: 940-497-2123 Cel: 817-992-1117 Begin forwarded message: > From: dmac11@telus.net > Date: April 29, 2006 18:33:58 CDT > To: rlborger@mac.com > Subject: aimaster blades > > > Hi There, > I recently bought a europa xs in Tampa FL. I hired a pilot to > fly it back > to Edmonton, Canada. Well he headed north this morning and had to > land in > Mariana FL. winds were high, on roll out he had a prop strike so he > is stuck > there and in need of some new airmaster blades or a warp drive > prop. I am > hoping to find somthing asap if you think you can help please give > me a call > or message. > Sincerely Dwayne McAllister > > E-mail dmac11@telus.net > ph. 780 474 0034 or cell 780 904 5473 > ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 06:20:57 AM PST US From: "Jim Brown" Subject: Re: Europa-List: VOR Aerial / Antenna --> Europa-List message posted by: "Jim Brown" Peter I have the XS Monowheel. We installed all Bob Archer Antenna's in our Europa. The VOR antenna was installed overhead in the cockpit-baggage area at the suggestion of Bob Archer. We have a Narco Nav 122 VOR / ILS and this combination is working very well for us over the past 6years. Jim Brown N398JB ----- Original Message ----- From: "Peter Rees" Sent: Saturday, April 29, 2006 6:10 PM Subject: Europa-List: VOR Aerial / Antenna > --> Europa-List message posted by: "Peter Rees" > > > Gents > > I'm looking at installing a VOR / ILS receiver in G-MFHI and am looking > for > some advice on a suitable aerial. Spruce have some which look like long > thin > strips with a BNC in the centre - easy enough to bond into the back of the > fuse. The Bob Archer ones they offer also look pretty good but as they are > designed for horizontal mounting, may be a bit harder to mount in the back > without having to build a platform over the rudder cables etc. > > Can anyone who has installed a VOR please let me know what aerial / > antenna > you've used and any opinions about it. > > I believe that the instrument I'm going to fit (Narco 122) has a marker > beacon receiver built in - any ideas as to a suitable aerial for this > would > also be appreciated. > > Regards > > Peter > > > ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 06:46:49 AM PST US Subject: Europa-List: RE: Fwd: aimaster blades From: "SteveD" --> Europa-List message posted by: "SteveD" I've been trying to look up http://www.airmasterpropellers.com/ since I got this email and the site is down. Airmaster is still in business right? Or did I miss something..... Steved ---------------- Visit EuropaOwnersForum http://www.europaowners.org/ ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 07:01:45 AM PST US Cc: Robert Borger , Peter Rees From: Robert Borger Subject: Europa-List: Re: VOR Aerial/Antenna --> Europa-List message posted by: Robert Borger Peter, If you go to my build page (URL in signature block), thence to Year #3, Q1 2004 and on to page 2, you can see how I installed both of my Nav antennas. One is installed in the aft lower fuselage, the second in the overhead area above the baggage bay. Each antenna served both VOR, Localizer and Glideslope through a Bob Archer splitters located behind the instrument panel (see Year #3, Q3, page 6, bottom of the page). I run all my antenna cables down the port side and all my electrical wiring down the starboard side. I bet you could use a copper tape NAV antenna mounted across the fuselage floor or roof behind the baggage bay. It would probably be easier to install. Especially if you spend some extra USD or GBP and go for one of those nice ones already made up with a BNC connector built in. You might even splurge for two of them and have a separate VOR/LOC antenna (upper) & GS antenna (lower) and forget the splitter. Good building and great flying, Bob Borger Europa Kit #A221 N914XL, XS Mono, Intercooled 914, Airmaster C/S http://www.europaowners.org/N914XL (85%) tail kit done, wings closed, cockpit module installed, pitch system in, landing gear frame in, rudder system in with Singleton Mod, outrigger mod in, Fuselage Top on, lift/drag/flap pins in, wing incidence set, tie bar in, flap drive in, Mod 70 done, baggage bay in. Completing the firewall-aft fuel system and fitting the instrument panel. Working in - 24 Instrument Panel, 25 Electrical, 28 Flaps, 29 Main Gear, 30 Fuel System, 32 Tail, 34 Door Latches & 35 Doors, 37 Finishing. Preparing for ROTAX 914 installation. 3705 Lynchburg Dr. Corinth, TX 76208 Home: 940-497-2123 Cel: 817-992-1117 ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 07:19:23 AM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Re: VOR Aerial / Antenna From: "europa flugzeug fabrik" --> Europa-List message posted by: "europa flugzeug fabrik" carl(at)flyers.freeserve. wrote: > Personally I cant see the point of having ILS (or VOR) these days on an aircraft like a Europa. GPS does the same job better and its even possible to have pseudo ILS on your GPS receiver that will be nearly as accurate. > > My understanding is that unless you can test and callibrate your ILS receiver you could never rely on it in a real life situation. The NAV-122 has a very good reputation, and they are not cheap here even on eBay -- "working when removed." :D An approach plate in visual conditions on an ILS tests everything. A GPS with approaches, with WAAS (vertically guided approaches) is really expensive, for just emergency use or keeping a rating current, if that's the intent. If I ever got caught in unforecast conditions and needed a quick approach clearance, the GPS is the last thing I'd like to fiddle with to get set up, whilst conversing with Approach Control. Plus, w/o WAAS, the GPS approaches may not give you much for minimums. We got one here at the home field which is 1100 feet, a/k/a VFR! Fred F. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=31810#31810 ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 07:40:28 AM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Re: VOR Aerial / Antenna From: "europa flugzeug fabrik" --> Europa-List message posted by: "europa flugzeug fabrik" peter.rees01(at)tiscali.c wrote: > Spruce have some which look like long thin strips with a BNC in the centre... That is a plain dipole, but compromised in providing one length for COM and NAV. Straight legs are not ideal either. However, the negative effect probably isn't much, and copper tape may not be much different, unless each cut and tuned to mid-band with a VSWR meter. > I believe that the instrument I'm going to fit (Narco 122) has a marker beacon receiver built in - any ideas as to a suitable aerial for this would also be appreciated. A "boat" type marker antenna would be the easiest route. The NAV-122 has more than enough sensitivity for this compromised device. For GS antenna, I would make a dipole by splitting the end of RG-58 coax, 7.5" each of shield and center conductor. Find a place somewhere on the plastic instrument panel which works in testing. Like behind the flat part of the right side of the panel, provided a big battery isn't on the other side. Fred F. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=31813#31813 ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 07:59:51 AM PST US From: "Craig Ellison" Subject: Re: Europa-List: RE: Fwd: aimaster blades --> Europa-List message posted by: "Craig Ellison" I think Airmaster is still going. I got their web site by going to www.propellor.com craig ellison N205CN It's a plane according to the FAA ----- Original Message ----- From: "SteveD" Sent: Sunday, April 30, 2006 6:45 AM Subject: Europa-List: RE: Fwd: aimaster blades > --> Europa-List message posted by: "SteveD" > > I've been trying to look up http://www.airmasterpropellers.com/ since I > got this email and the site is down. Airmaster is still in business right? > Or did I miss something..... > > Steved > ---------------- > Visit EuropaOwnersForum http://www.europaowners.org/ > > > ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 11:18:27 AM PST US From: "Paul McAllister" Subject: RE: Europa-List: VOR Aerial / Antenna --> Europa-List message posted by: "Paul McAllister" Peter Rees wrote: > I'm looking at installing a VOR / ILS receiver in > G-MFHI and am looking for some advice on a suitable Peter, I have a Narco 122 installed in my Europa. I have a single whip antenna for the Marker Beacon and a Bob Archer VOR Antenna mounted in the roof. I use a splitter for the glideslope antenna. Unlike Jim Brown's, mine works "just okay". I seem to have a distinct lack of localizer sensitivity, although the VOR woks fine. I haven't invested a lot of time in debugging it and I suspect at the end of the day it probably won't be an antenna location issue. An alternative location is the wing, although it means you have one more cable to connect / disconnect when you install / remove the wings. You will also need to give some thought as to how service the antenna, for example if you have to replace the coaxial cable. As far as the comments about GPS / WAAS, at this time I am not bought in. WAAS enabled approach certified GPS units are expensive. I have an Apollo GX60 approach certified box, and yes, they are cool but there can be an awful lot of button pushing going on compared to a LOC/GS or a VOR/Alpha approach. Regards, Paul ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 01:27:35 PM PST US Subject: RE: Europa-List: RE: Fwd: aimaster blades From: "Tony Krzyzewski" --> Europa-List message posted by: "Tony Krzyzewski" Well they were still in business ten minutes ago and the web site is working. Tony ======================================================================== = I've been trying to look up http://www.airmasterpropellers.com/ since I got this email and the site is down. Airmaster is still in business right? Or did I miss something..... Steved ---------------- Visit EuropaOwnersForum http://www.europaowners.org/ ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 01:30:26 PM PST US From: "nigel charles" Subject: Europa-List: Lydeway Fly-In 1st/2nd July 2006 --> Europa-List message posted by: "nigel charles" This email is only of interest to UK subscribers to the forum. We are now approaching 2 months to go to the Lydeway Fly-In. The event is planned to be on Saturday 1st July with Sunday 2nd as a backup day in case of bad weather. To keep the event manageable I normally limit attendance to 10-12 aircraft so confirmed bookings are essential. For those not familiar the deal is a free landing and BBQ (including one passenger) in exchange for giving 2 short joyride flights for local residents attending the BBQ. Whilst this is primarily a Europa event I usually include several other aircraft types to add variety. So I can predict how many slots to offer elsewhere it would help me if any Europa owners wishing to attend reply to this email. I will allocate slots later (early June) with briefing instructions. As I usually get a few last minute cancellations I will keep a reserve list. Please indicate if you would like to go on this list should you not make the initial selection. Completion of the form below would help me with the administration. Regards Nigel Charles NAME .............. AIRCRAFT TYPE ....... REGISTRATION ......... HOME AIRFIELD ........ AVAILABILITY . SATURDAY / SUNDAY / RESERVE ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 01:30:40 PM PST US From: "nigel charles" Subject: Europa-List: Lydeway Fly-In 1st/2nd July 2006 --> Europa-List message posted by: "nigel charles" This email is only of interest to UK subscribers to the forum. We are now approaching 2 months to go to the Lydeway Fly-In. The event is planned to be on Saturday 1st July with Sunday 2nd as a backup day in case of bad weather. To keep the event manageable I normally limit attendance to 10-12 aircraft so confirmed bookings are essential. For those not familiar the deal is a free landing and BBQ (including one passenger) in exchange for giving 2 short joyride flights for local residents attending the BBQ. Whilst this is primarily a Europa event I usually include several other aircraft types to add variety. So I can predict how many slots to offer elsewhere it would help me if any Europa owners wishing to attend reply to this email. I will allocate slots later (early June) with briefing instructions. As I usually get a few last minute cancellations I will keep a reserve list. Please indicate if you would like to go on this list should you not make the initial selection. Completion of the form below would help me with the administration. Regards Nigel Charles NAME .............. AIRCRAFT TYPE ....... REGISTRATION ......... HOME AIRFIELD ........ AVAILABILITY . SATURDAY / SUNDAY / RESERVE ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 01:53:49 PM PST US Subject: Europa-List: RE: Fwd: aimaster blades From: "SteveD" --> Europa-List message posted by: "SteveD" Their website came back about an hour after I posted. Must have been something askew between here and there. Kept getting server errors on connect. Oh well, I love a happy ending. Now we're just working out details to get Dwayne some blades, and his ferry pilot unstuck and back to the frozen north..... Chat Later, Steved ---------------- Visit EuropaOwnersForum http://www.europaowners.org/ ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 04:19:08 PM PST US From: "Timothy.P.Ward" Subject: Re: Europa-List: RE: Fwd: aimaster blades --> Europa-List message posted by: "Timothy.P.Ward" Steve, Try again, I just got in using your link. Still in business. Cheers, Tim do not archive > > From: "SteveD" > Date: 2006/05/01 Mon AM 01:45:17 GMT+12:00 > Subject: Europa-List: RE: Fwd: aimaster blades > > --> Europa-List message posted by: "SteveD" > > I've been trying to look up http://www.airmasterpropellers.com/ since I got this email and the site is down. Airmaster is still in business right? Or did I miss something..... > > Steved > ---------------- > Visit EuropaOwnersForum http://www.europaowners.org/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 07:26:05 PM PST US From: SPurpura@aol.com Subject: Re: Europa-List: (no subject) --> Europa-List message posted by: SPurpura@aol.com VOLTAGE REGULATOR