---------------------------------------------------------- Europa-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sat 06/16/07: 20 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 12:36 AM - Re: PFA Safety Bulletins (m.clews) 2. 12:50 AM - Grounding (Richard Holder) 3. 11:14 AM - MicroAir Radio (Peter Timm) 4. 11:43 AM - Re: MicroAir Radio (Richard Iddon) 5. 12:05 PM - Re: MicroAir Radio (Jos Okhuijsen) 6. 12:19 PM - Re: MicroAir Radio (Mark Henwick) 7. 02:12 PM - How can I view PFA Safety Bulletin? () 8. 03:15 PM - Re: How can I view PFA Safety Bulletin? (Carl Pattinson) 9. 03:31 PM - Re: How can I view PFA Safety Bulletin? () 10. 05:11 PM - Europa Incident (Bob) 11. 06:28 PM - Re: Europa Incident (Andrew Sarangan) 12. 06:28 PM - Re: Europa Incident (Garry) 13. 06:30 PM - Re: Europa Incident (Fred Klein) 14. 06:33 PM - Re: Europa Incident (Thomas Scherer) 15. 06:40 PM - Europa incident (Fred Klein) 16. 09:08 PM - Re: Europa Incident (D.Hetrick) 17. 10:20 PM - Re: Europa incident (Paul Boulet) 18. 11:08 PM - Re: MicroAir Radio (Richard Scanlan) 19. 11:53 PM - Profound sadness... () 20. 11:54 PM - Re: Europa incident (DuaneFamly@aol.com) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 12:36:52 AM PST US From: "m.clews" Subject: Re: Europa-List: PFA Safety Bulletins David, How's about a Europa Club fly-in to White Waltham, to try out bumpy runway techniques, sometime in July/August. We've a very large grass field,good bar and restaurant (might get a 50% reduction in landing fees) and would be very welcoming! Mike Clews co-ordinator Royal Berks Strut Europa G-OMIK ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 12:50:01 AM PST US From: Richard Holder Subject: Europa-List: Grounding I received the details from the PFA and the CAA today. It was as expected. But ... Francis Donaldson put the following at the bottom of the letter ... "The measures in the new flight safety bulletins are temporary, pending mandatory modification action which will follow in the near future". So hopefully the requirement to have an inspection by a PFA Inspector "every 10 hours" will be overtaken by a permanent fix. Bad timing as the weather just starts to be improving. I can see a lack of flying this summer :-( Richard Holder G-OWWW High Cross ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 11:14:03 AM PST US Subject: Europa-List: MicroAir Radio From: Peter Timm on 07/6/13 9:38 AM, Niels Kock at nielskock@get2net.dk wrote: > > Wise and true words, Ira. > Niels > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "rampil" > To: > Sent: Wednesday, June 13, 2007 2:58 AM > Subject: Europa-List: Re: Transition Training for Monowheel Builders > > >> >> Just my unworthy 2 cents: >> >> The few people I directly know who have looped their monowheels were >> all very experienced pilots with non-trival amounts of time in their a/c >> before their particular accidents. Somehow, I don't believe transition >> training is the whole answer. Conversion to trigear or even to >> conventional >> gear might be the right approach for some builders. >> >> If you aren't dissuaded from flying the monwheel, at least get some glider >> time first. It also is not the full experience of the Europa, but it is >> far >> more available. >> >> -------- >> Ira N224XS >> >> >> >> >> Read this topic online here: >> >> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=118143#118143 >> >> A friend of mine is wiring up his beautiful Jodel and is thinking of installing a MicroAir radio and transponder. Does anyone in our group have any experience with this make? Of particular interest is the performance of the intercom, since the radio seems to be o.k. in glider installations, where engine noise and vibrations are of no concern. Any comments would be greatly appreciated! Peter Timm C-GIET # 110,Classic Mono 912S, Airmaster >> >> >> >> > ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 11:43:54 AM PST US From: "Richard Iddon" Subject: RE: Europa-List: MicroAir Radio Peter, I have had both a Microair radio and transponder installed and working for four years. The radio works fine although I have added a separate voice activated intercom. The transponder does not seem to have the range of some but generally I am happy with it. Service from Microair has been good. I did have a small problem with the transponder in the early days but they sent me an exchange unit FOC. If I were building again I would also look at the Xcom radio as this has vox intercom built in. http://www.mcp.com.au/xcom760/ Hope this helps. Richard Iddon G-RIXS A friend of mine is wiring up his beautiful Jodel and is thinking of installing a MicroAir radio and transponder. Does anyone in our group have any experience with this make? Of particular interest is the performance of the intercom, since the radio seems to be o.k. in glider installations, where engine noise and vibrations are of no concern. Any comments would be greatly appreciated! Peter Timm C-GIET # 110,Classic Mono 912S, Airmaster 15/06/2007 11:31 ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 12:05:55 PM PST US Subject: Re: Europa-List: MicroAir Radio From: "Jos Okhuijsen" Yes, good question Peter That is i can't find anything you wanted to know or were telling about that radio or anything else as a matter of fact. Still i would like to hear from somebody owning such a radio or a XCom about their experience. Did it need any service and how did that go? Regards, Jos Okhuijsen http://www.europaowners.org/kit600 ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 12:19:57 PM PST US From: "Mark Henwick" Subject: RE: Europa-List: MicroAir Radio Hi Peter It will be a while till I get my Europa flying, but I fitted a Microair radio in my CT2K and then removed it due to the electrical engine noise coming through from the Rotax. At the time I was chosing a replacement I decided to get a transponder as well and now have the Filser RT (ATR600) & TX (TRT800). Very happy with them. The Microair intercom was possibly slightly better than the Filser. Mark Henwick >A friend of mine is wiring up his beautiful Jodel and is thinking of >installing a MicroAir radio and transponder. Does anyone in our group have >any experience with this make? Of particular interest is the performance of >the intercom, since the radio seems to be o.k. in glider installations, >where engine noise and vibrations are of no concern. >Any comments would be greatly appreciated! >Peter Timm >C-GIET ># 110,Classic Mono 912S, Airmaster 11:31 ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 02:12:44 PM PST US Subject: Europa-List: How can I view PFA Safety Bulletin? From: Can someone direct this Yank where I can view (or post file): PFA Europa Safety Bulletin 247/FSB-002 dated 18.04.00 I took a look at: http://www.pfa.org.uk/index.asp But couldn't find it. It was referenced in: PFA 247/FSB-006 (how to check movement between TP04 torque tube and TP09 torque tube drive horn) Thanks in advance Ron Parigoris ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 03:15:36 PM PST US From: "Carl Pattinson" Subject: Re: Europa-List: How can I view PFA Safety Bulletin? Here they are. http://www.pfa.org.uk/Engineering%20pdfs/006.pdf and http://www.pfa.org.uk/Engineering%20pdfs/007.pdf ----- Original Message ----- From: Sent: Saturday, June 16, 2007 10:11 PM Subject: Europa-List: How can I view PFA Safety Bulletin? > > Can someone direct this Yank where I can view (or post file): > PFA Europa Safety Bulletin 247/FSB-002 dated 18.04.00 > > I took a look at: > http://www.pfa.org.uk/index.asp > But couldn't find it. > > It was referenced in: > PFA 247/FSB-006 (how to check movement between TP04 torque tube and TP09 > torque tube drive horn) > > Thanks in advance > Ron Parigoris > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 03:31:48 PM PST US Subject: Re: Europa-List: How can I view PFA Safety Bulletin? From: Hello Carl Thx. for the reply. I was able to view 006 and 007, I am looking to view 002. Any ideas? ">> Can someone direct this Yank where I can view (or post file): >> PFA Europa Safety Bulletin 247/FSB-002 dated 18.04.00 >> >> It was referenced in: >> PFA 247/FSB-006 (how to check movement between TP04 torque tube and TP09 >> torque tube drive horn)" Ron Parigoris ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 05:11:18 PM PST US From: "Bob" Subject: Europa-List: Europa Incident I just received a call from a San Francisco newspaper reporter asking questions regarding a Europa XS accident that happened today in the San Fran area. Not sure how he got my name and phone number. I did ask if the owner was identified but he did not have that information. I hate to hear this type of news especially following the tragic loss of William and Paul. We are such as small family of builders and owners that any loss strikes very close to home. Bob Berube ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 06:28:36 PM PST US From: Andrew Sarangan Subject: Re: Europa-List: Europa Incident It seems two more pilots have been lost in the crash due to what appears to be a 180 turn back to the runway. Sad to see this happen so soon after the U.K. incident. If you google "Europa Crash Livermore", there are several write-ups about it. --- Bob wrote: > I just received a call from a San Francisco newspaper reporter asking > questions regarding a Europa XS accident that happened today in the > San Fran area. Not sure how he got my name and phone number. I did > ask if the owner was identified but he did not have that information. > > I hate to hear this type of news especially following the tragic loss > of William and Paul. We are such as small family of builders and > owners that any loss strikes very close to home. > > Bob Berube ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 06:28:46 PM PST US From: "Garry" Subject: Re: Europa-List: Europa Incident Bob, as I recall Bill Stewart sold his Europa to a guy in San Francisco. Perhaps it is he. Garry ----- Original Message ----- From: Bob To: europa-list@matronics.com Sent: Saturday, June 16, 2007 8:09 PM Subject: Europa-List: Europa Incident I just received a call from a San Francisco newspaper reporter asking questions regarding a Europa XS accident that happened today in the San Fran area. Not sure how he got my name and phone number. I did ask if the owner was identified but he did not have that information. I hate to hear this type of news especially following the tragic loss of William and Paul. We are such as small family of builders and owners that any loss strikes very close to home. Bob Berube ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 06:30:06 PM PST US Subject: Re: Europa-List: Europa Incident From: Fred Klein All, This in from KGO talk radio in SFO; via Google: TWO KILLED IN LIVERMORE PLANE CRASH Two people were killed when a home-built airplane crashed shortly after takeoff from the Livermore airport Saturday morning. Federal Aviation Administration spokesman Ian Gregor tells KGO the Europa SX departed around 8:30 a.m. and was just 200 or 300 feet off the ground when the pilot decided to turn back. After making a 180-degree turn the plane crashed about 25 yards short of the runway, Gregor said. The plane erupted in flames, making it difficult to immediately identify the people on board. The FAA is investigating. On Saturday, June 16, 2007, at 05:09 PM, Bob wrote: > I just received a call from a San Francisco newspaper reporter asking > questions regarding a Europa XS accident that happened today in the > San Fran area.- Not sure how he got my name and phone number.- I did > ask if the owner was identified but he did not have that information. > - > I hate to hear this type of news especially following the tragic loss > of William and Paul.- We are such as small family of builders and > owners that any loss strikes very close to home. > - > Bob Berube -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 06:33:17 PM PST US From: "Thomas Scherer" Subject: Re: Europa-List: Europa Incident Sad. Very sad. http://www.nbc11.com/news/13516086/detail.html ----- Original Message ----- From: Bob To: europa-list@matronics.com Sent: Saturday, June 16, 2007 5:09 PM Subject: Europa-List: Europa Incident I just received a call from a San Francisco newspaper reporter asking questions regarding a Europa XS accident that happened today in the San Fran area. Not sure how he got my name and phone number. I did ask if the owner was identified but he did not have that information. I hate to hear this type of news especially following the tragic loss of William and Paul. We are such as small family of builders and owners that any loss strikes very close to home. Bob Berube ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 06:40:03 PM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Europa incident From: Fred Klein \Homemade Plane Crashes, Kills Two People Onboard KNTV-TV Updated: 2 hours, 26 minutes ago SAN FRANCISCO - Two people are dead after the homemade plane they were in crashed Saturday just short of a runway in Livermore, Federal Aviation Administration spokesman Ian Gregor reported. Gregor said two people departed around 8:30 a.m. from the Livermore Municipal Airport in a Europa XS, an aircraft built from a kit of pre-made parts. The plane got between 200 and 300 feet off the ground before the pilot made a 180-degree turn to head back to the airport and crashed 25 feet short of the runway, according to Gregor. There was "intense, post-crash fire and both people onboard were killed," Gregor said. An FAA investigator will check out the mechanical condition of the plane, talk to witnesses and review communications between air traffic controllers and the pilot, Gregor reported. "As far as I know, there was no communication after takeoff between the pilot and the tower," Gregor said. Gregor said the pilot did not file a flight plan, which is not required, so they are not sure of the identities of the deceased. -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 09:08:20 PM PST US From: "D.Hetrick" Subject: Re: Europa-List: Europa Incident After reading about the crash, I called my friend Ken Hill who flies out of Livermore. His wife Sandy, who was sobbing, told me it was, in fact, her husband Ken who had died in the crash. Ken was a terrific guy, former military pilot with a lot of hours. Another terrible loss. Dale Hetrick ----- Original Message ----- From: "Andrew Sarangan" Sent: Saturday, June 16, 2007 6:26 PM Subject: Re: Europa-List: Europa Incident > > > It seems two more pilots have been lost in the crash due to what > appears to be a 180 turn back to the runway. Sad to see this happen so > soon after the U.K. incident. If you google "Europa Crash Livermore", > there are several write-ups about it. > > > --- Bob wrote: > >> I just received a call from a San Francisco newspaper reporter asking >> questions regarding a Europa XS accident that happened today in the >> San Fran area. Not sure how he got my name and phone number. I did >> ask if the owner was identified but he did not have that information. >> >> I hate to hear this type of news especially following the tragic loss >> of William and Paul. We are such as small family of builders and >> owners that any loss strikes very close to home. >> >> Bob Berube > > > -- > 4:01 PM > > ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 10:20:04 PM PST US From: Paul Boulet Subject: Re: Europa-List: Europa incident Oh my God.... Paul Boulet, N914PB, Malibu, CA Fred Klein wrote: \Homemade Plane Crashes, Kills Two People Onboard KNTV-TV Updated: 2 hours, 26 minutes ago SAN FRANCISCO - Two people are dead after the homemade plane they were in crashed Saturday just short of a runway in Livermore, Federal Aviation Administration spokesman Ian Gregor reported. Gregor said two people departed around 8:30 a.m. from the Livermore Municipal Airport in a Europa XS, an aircraft built from a kit of pre-made parts. The plane got between 200 and 300 feet off the ground before the pilot made a 180-degree turn to head back to the airport and crashed 25 feet short of the runway, according to Gregor. There was "intense, post-crash fire and both people onboard were killed," Gregor said. An FAA investigator will check out the mechanical condition of the plane, talk to witnesses and review communications between air traffic controllers and the pilot, Gregor reported. "As far as I know, there was no communication after takeoff between the pilot and the tower," Gregor said. Gregor said the pilot did not file a flight plan, which is not required, so they are not sure of the identities of the deceased. -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 11:08:58 PM PST US From: "Richard Scanlan" Subject: RE: Europa-List: MicroAir Radio Peter, has your friend considered the Icom IC-A200? We bought one for Our Emeraude, it is very clear with great range(picks up a French airfield on some days)and about 200 less than the Microair. So impressed I've just bought one for my Mono. A radio engineer who is helping me with the wiring is not very complimentary of the Microair. Richard Scanlan 103 Mono -----Original Message----- From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard Iddon Sent: 16 June 2007 19:43 Subject: RE: Europa-List: MicroAir Radio Peter, I have had both a Microair radio and transponder installed and working for four years. The radio works fine although I have added a separate voice activated intercom. The transponder does not seem to have the range of some but generally I am happy with it. Service from Microair has been good. I did have a small problem with the transponder in the early days but they sent me an exchange unit FOC. If I were building again I would also look at the Xcom radio as this has vox intercom built in. http://www.mcp.com.au/xcom760/ Hope this helps. Richard Iddon G-RIXS A friend of mine is wiring up his beautiful Jodel and is thinking of installing a MicroAir radio and transponder. Does anyone in our group have any experience with this make? Of particular interest is the performance of the intercom, since the radio seems to be o.k. in glider installations, where engine noise and vibrations are of no concern. Any comments would be greatly appreciated! Peter Timm C-GIET # 110,Classic Mono 912S, Airmaster 15/06/2007 11:31 ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 11:53:27 PM PST US From: Subject: Europa-List: Profound sadness... I am so very sorry to hear about the Europa crash in Livermore. Ken was a wonderful gentleman and we will miss him greatly. Who was with him? I am stunned and don't even know what else to say at this time. kim ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 11:54:28 PM PST US From: DuaneFamly@aol.com Subject: Re: Europa-List: Europa incident Terry Seaver and Dave DeFord fly an XS Mono out of Livermore. If they haven't posted here by the morning, I'll try giving them a call to see if they have any further information. Mike Duane A207A Redding, California XS Conventional Gear Jabiru 3300 Sensenich R64Z N Ground Adjustable Prop ************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message europa-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Europa-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/europa-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/europa-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.