---------------------------------------------------------- Europa-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Tue 08/21/07: 13 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 01:45 AM - Re: Mandatory Permit Directives....multitude of paperwork.....? (Peter Jeffers) 2. 10:51 AM - Re: Height of shoulder harness support (rampil) 3. 11:04 AM - Mod 73 list (Richard Iddon) 4. 11:51 AM - Re: Re: First solo (Raimo Toivio) 5. 12:34 PM - Re: First solo (josok) 6. 01:05 PM - Re: Height of shoulder harness support (europa flugzeug fabrik) 7. 01:14 PM - Re: Re: First solo (Raimo Toivio) 8. 01:38 PM - Re: Re: First solo (Gilles Thesee) 9. 02:24 PM - Re: flying the mono (Raimo Toivio) 10. 02:34 PM - Re: Re: First solo (Graham Singleton) 11. 02:53 PM - Re: flying the mono (R.C.Harrison) 12. 10:06 PM - Re: First solo (josok) 13. 10:21 PM - Re: flying the mono (josok) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 01:45:45 AM PST US From: "Peter Jeffers" Subject: RE: Europa-List: Mandatory Permit Directives....multitude of paperwork.....? Hi Bob, Sorry if I missed your point. I may now do the same again, so apologies in advance. Firstly I am only an inspector so cannot directly influence the PFA/CAA as to their requirements. All I can do is try to interpret what they say they want! Now as an inspector all I can do is say what I would want entered in the log book re the recent MPD=92s is as follows:- 1. In the main body of the book one entry to say that MPD =85.005 and MPD=85006 (including very brief description like =91tailplane attachment=92 or =91integrity of wing attachment=92) have been complied with together with an approved signature. 2. In the pink pages at the back, one entry each for =85005 & ..006. =85005 annotated recurring @ 10 hr intervals and =85.006, one time. The two above items are completely separate and independent of Mods 72, 73 & 74. It does not matter which items are entered first provided they are correctly dated. I am not aware of any change in the requirements concerning inspection or maintenance of the nose wheel. Suffice it to say that amongst many other things this area requires close inspection at DI, annual, or following any incident. Re the cart & horse bit, I think we will always find situations where this becomes a requirement to =91cover a...e=92! Hopefully this 10 hr thing will moderate to a more lenient period before too long, leaving the pilot to check for him/herself on a day to day basis. Pete _____ From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of R.C.Harrison Sent: 19 August 2007 18:50 Subject: RE: Europa-List: Mandatory Permit Directives....multitude of paperwork.....? Hi! Peter, Thanks for the reply to my question. Basically you have related the situation I had understood but unwittingly skirted my real concern. Let me put it another way:- My question concerns the matter of recording in the airframe book , Since my aircraft has been grounded since May 28th 2006 due to the nose wheel departure accident (which incidentally I have seen no recommendation concerning the friction shimmy adjustment /checks since?) it has now been re-engined and fitted with a new prop. all of which has effectively actioned all the accident repairs that were necessary. At the end of this re-build process all three mods =8572,73, 74 have been signed off as satisfactorily completed =85.to the question=85.is it necessary to write up details of the MPD=92s since the aforementioned mod approvals would therefore be in the vexed book IN FRONT OF THE MPD=92s ? I understand the 10 hour inspection requirements but it seems somewhat =93cart and horse=94 to now write up the MPD=92s ? Further :- Obviously it seems to me somewhat wasteful of PFA inspectors time and our expense to continue with the 10hour inspections especially with my torque tube clamp mod having been fitted too? I respect that the purpose of the inspections was in the interests of our safety but surely there now comes circumstance and time to waive the necessity for continuance albeit with some specific requirements of P1 pre-flight inspections/walk round. Regards Bob Harrison G-PTAG Robt.C.Harrison -----Original Message----- From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Peter Jeffers Sent: 19 August 2007 15:39 Subject: RE: Europa-List: Mandatory Permit Directives....multitude of paperwork.....? Hi Bob, Our illustrious Safety Officer has requested that I, as Club PFA Inspector, reply to your posting. As I interpret the requirements, MPD 2007-006 (integrity of wing attachments, CLASSICS only) is a one off inspection, which if the a/c passes, may be signed off once and for ever. If the a/c does not pass this inspection then it must be grounded forthwith and reference must be made to Europa 2004 for guidance of how to fix the problem. In this instance MPD 2007-006 may not be signed off until such appropriate rectification is carried out. MOD 74 has to be incorporated within 10 hrs from 1st Aug, but in itself does not provide rectification for any fault shown up in the 006 directive. MPD 2007- 005, which refers to tail plane attachment, has to be repeated once every 10 flight hours after the initial successful inspection. There is no relief from this requirement at present. If the a/c failed the initial MPD 2007-005 inspection then it has to be grounded until such time as suitable rectification work has been approved by Europa 2004/PFA, carried out and signed off by a PFA inspector. If the initial failure notice was due only to non compliant pip pin holes then Mod 73 allowed the a/c to fly once more but still requires 10 hr repetitive checking of the other items covered by the directive. If failure was due to any of the other items mentioned, eg movement of TP9 on the torque shaft or excessive movement of the TP12=92s then once more the a/c has to be grounded until such time as this fault can be rectified. Even then it is still subject to repetitive 10 checks as per MPD 2007-005. We all hope that a route forward will soon be forthcoming from PFA/Europa 2004 which will increase the period or remove the requirement all together. So in short, carrying out the Mods73 & 74 does not eliminate the requirement for 10hr tailplane attachment checks. I know it is not the answer you wanted but I hope it helps. Pete Jeffers PFA Insp. _____ From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of R.C.Harrison Sent: 18 August 2007 10:57 Subject: Europa-List: Mandatory Permit Directives....multitude of paperwork.....? Hi! All and particularly our illustrious Safety Officer Mike Gregory. Having now completed mods 72/73/74, not withstanding the necessity for 10 hourly inspections continuing, if those mods are signed off by the Inspector does the MPD=92s still need entering and signing off in the airframe log book or can it be assumed that the mods being signed off superedes the necessity to enter up the MPD=92s? =85=85=85paper and more paper=85=85.. Regards Robt.C.Harrison 17/08/2007 17:43 - The Europa-List Email Forum - "http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List"http://www.matronics.com/ Nav igator?Europa-List "http://forums.matronics.com"http://forums.matronics.com 19/08/2007 07:27 19/08/2007 07:27 ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 10:51:28 AM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Re: Height of shoulder harness support From: "rampil" There are no regulations that pertain to homebuilt AC. There however an Advisory Circular AC21-34H which I can not enclose below because it is 5 Mb and too big for the forum. Find it with google on the FAA site -------- Ira N224XS Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=130124#130124 ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 11:04:21 AM PST US From: "Richard Iddon" Subject: Europa-List: Mod 73 list Results from the implementation of mod 73 have now just about dried up so this is the last time I will publish the list on the forum. I also intend to send a copy to the PFA as suggested previously. Thanks to all who sent me their data. Richard Iddon G-RIXS Name Country Reg Type Hours Landing sfc. Mod 73 progress Disbonding of TP6 Pip Pins Problems found Richard Iddon UK G-RIXS Tri gear 365 Tarmac Completed None found 2in. nothing major Steve Pitt UK G-SMDH Tri gear 46 Grass Completed None found 2in. nothing major Ron Jones UK G-RJWX Mono 320 Both Completed None found Original None Tim Ward NZ ZK-TIM Mono Not done None found Original Very slight movement in starboard TP12. Present on installing (1998)- no worse Danny Shepherd UK G-CERI Tri Gear Completed None found 2in. Pete Jeffers UK G-BVIZ Tri Gear Completed None found 2in. well within limits Brian Davies UK G-DDBD Tri Gear 20 mixed Completed None found 1.9in. none Graham Drake UK G-CCOV Mono 60 Mostly Hard Completed None found 2in. Sarah Attubato UK G-BWDP Mono N/A N/A Completed None found 2in. These are new replacement tailplanes that had already been built David Watts UK G-BXDY Mono 1250 Mostly Grass Completed None found 2in. Nigel Charles UK G-MIME Mono Completed None found 2in. nothing major Mike Clews UK G-OMIK Mono 500 Grass Completed None found Original nothing major Arthur Orchard uk G-JOST Tri Gear 17.5 hrs Tar/Mac completed none found original nothing found Colin Smallwood UK G-DEBR Tri Gear Tarmac W.I.P None found 2in TP5 Port,Moved .25" Outboard Alasdair Milne UK G-CBYN Tri Gear 470 Grass Completed None original none Trev Pond UK G-LINN Tri Gear Grass Completed None found Original none Robert Marston UK G-CDBX Tri Gear 230 Grass Completed None Original Bob Fairall UK G-BXLK Mono 385 Grass Completed 2" None Geoff Leedham UK G-EOFS tri Gear 320 Grass Completed None found 1.9" None found Stephen Vestuti UK G-CEBV Tri Gear 22 Tarmac Completed Duncan McFadyean UK G-BXII Tail Dragger 360 Mostly grass Completed none found original none Karel Vranken B F-PKRL Mono 60 Both Done 2002 None found Original I did exactly what mod 73 prescribes before doing the lay ups. Richard Holder UK G-OWWW Tri Gear Classic 257 70% Grass Completed Port side disbonded 2in. Some movement between left hand TP12 and TP4 - within limits. Bob Harrison UK G-PTAG Tri Gear 600 Completed None Original Torque tube clamps fitted. Bruno Reith kit 379 D-EUVT XS Mono Just finished Grass Completed Anthony van Eldik UK G-FLOR Mono Classic 217 Grass Completed None Original None David Joyce UK G-XSDJ Mono 510 Both Completed None found Original Nothing significant. Niels Kock DK OY-ODA Mono Completed None Original No slop Roddy Kesterton UK G-IKRK Mono Classic wings 110 Mainly Grass Completed None found 2in. None Michel Auvray Fr F-PFGT Mono 320 Grass Completed None Original None Paddy Clarke UK G-KIMM Mono 670 Mostly Grass Completed None Original None Ian Rickard UK G-IANI Tri Gear 85 Grass Completed None Standard None Terry Clark UK G-IRON Tri Gear 40 Grass Completed None Standard None Niigel Wakeling UK G-FELL Tri Gear Completed None Standard None Herve Henri Remi UK G-CHET Tri Gear Completed None Standard None Bob Gibbs UK G-IBBS Mono Completed None Standard None Roger Anderson UK G-BXTD Classic 472 Mostly Grass Completed No disbonding Original No problems Pete Lawless UK G-RMAC 400 50/50 Completed No disbonding 2in. No problems Bryan Allsop UK G-BYSA Mono 440 Mostly grass Completed None Original No problems Tony Kay UK G-TKAY Classic Completed None No problems Willie Harrison UK G-BZNY Tri Gear 143 Both Completed None No problems 20/08/2007 17:44 ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 11:51:49 AM PST US From: "Raimo Toivio" Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re: First solo Jos, the warmest congratulations! I agree too: I am totally satisfied for the combination of the water thermostat and the water-oil exchanger. Ambient temp is around 20-25C and I see typically water 90C and oil 100C. No matter the power and how long - it can be what so ever between 0-100% and temps are always between limits easily. I think also it is better to fly w/o Evans. I hardly can wait next winter and the future cold flying season: what will be water and oil temp when air is -40C? Probably more ok now than flying WITHOUT thermostat...it is like keeping the window open when very cold. About a year ago I got plenty of warnings concerning water thermostat - I am happy I kept my thoughts. You too? Regards, Raimo ========== ----- Original Message ----- From: "josok" Sent: Sunday, August 19, 2007 7:08 PM Subject: Europa-List: Re: First solo > > Hi Steve, > > Put your hands under your armpits, pull yourself up and finish your plane, i would say. It's more then worth it. If i can possibly help, eventually hands on, let me know and we'll arrange something. That counts for everybody here. I had the luck that at the right moment somebody would be there to give me the little push i needed. Usually they never realized that :-) > > The oil/water heat exchanger seems to work fine. Together with a water thermostat, the oil is always around the 100 Celsius. Today the temperature was 10 c, and i climbed to 7000 feet, 75% power in about 10 minutes. Oil 110, and water 120 c Then down, throttle almost closed, near VNE and the oil came down to 70 C, just like the water. No danger of shock cooling on this one. I had to change the Evans though, because it would run too hot too soon. That problem is gone now, i probably can run 100% forever. But easy does it, something to try later with some more hours on the block. > > Kind Regards, > > Jos Okhuijsen > > > > > > > Visit - www.EuropaOwners.org > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 12:34:03 PM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Re: First solo From: "josok" Thanks Raimo, and all the others who answered in email or forum. Yes, at least in our conditions the exceptional cooling system Pertti came up with, seems to work. Today i climbed at 100% power to 9500 feet, OAT -5 and had 120 C on oil, don't have a coolant meter, the hottest CHT was around 130 C under the spark plug. Then on 55 % a long descent, lowest oil temp was 65 C. 0 % power will probably produce lower temps, but i forgot to try that for some reason :-) There is however an annoying difference, especially on climb out between the front 2 and rear cylinders. Today it showed 40 C difference. Number 3, above the turbo and air inlet is always the hottest. I suspect the naca scoop and the shroud over cyl 3 to work against each other. Maybe i have to close the gap around the air filter in the air filter chamber. Anybody to offer any insight before i try? Regards, Jos Okhuijsen Visit - www.EuropaOwners.org ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 01:05:28 PM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Re: Height of shoulder harness support From: "europa flugzeug fabrik" Just go to faa.gov, and in the search box, type: AC 21-34. F-- Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=130159#130159 ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 01:14:50 PM PST US From: "Raimo Toivio" Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re: First solo Jos, ***0 % power will probably produce lower temps, but i forgot to try that for some reason :-) *** sorry - I meant idle power and prop windmilling. BTW I have seen real 0% when I practised standing prop landings. I have some nice pics where a standing blade is visible. I did not record water & oil temps in that situation! I was quite a busy in the cockpit. ***There is however an annoying difference, especially on climb out between the front 2 and rear cylinders. Today it showed 40 C difference. Number 3, above the turbo and air inlet is always the hottest. I suspect the naca scoop and the shroud over cyl 3 to work against each other. Maybe i have to close the gap around the air filter in the air filter chamber. Anybody to offer any insight before i try?*** Have you noticed those gills are almost useless? I just tried and covered them and saw nothing influence. Of course they look nice anyway! Do you have an extra air "shroud" over your (all) cylinders? It is fitted very tight over the engine and it is glass fiber made. I am not sure - maybe it is only for 912S ? I think it has a big role to equalize temps between front and rear cylinders. Regards, Raimo ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 01:38:08 PM PST US From: Gilles Thesee Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re: First solo Raimo Toivio a crit : > Do you have an extra air "shroud" over your (all) cylinders? > It is fitted very tight over the engine and it is glass fiber made. > I am not sure - maybe it is only for 912S ? > I think it has a big role to equalize temps between front and > rear cylinders. > Raimo and all, The Rotax shroud can be installed on any 91X engine. We are using one on our 914 project. We took great care to seal it as best as possible, so that every molecule going into the inlet is used for cylinder cooling. BTW we are using the regular Rotax pickup points and published temperatures for cylinder heads, so I don't know how they correlate to spark plug probe measurements. Best regards, -- Gilles http://contrails.free.fr ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 02:24:34 PM PST US From: "Raimo Toivio" Subject: Re: Europa-List: flying the mono Jos it was a real joy to read your flying experiences. Mostly like mines. ***From the very start of the build people have been trying to convince me to change to a tri-gear*** Me too! And I have to confess: little before maiden flight I thought I have made a terrible wrong decision when building a mono (or any plane!). But when seeing Dirk van Oyen landing easily when it was 13G19 sidewind it helped me much. Dirk gave a 5 minute phone training to my instructor Jyrki Laukkanen and that was enough for him. After couple of landings together it was my time to my solo. No problems. It was a dazzling experience. Those horrible mono stories are just a stories. There are people who never learn to use zipper or phone. But we still have zippers and phones. ***It's as simple as riding a bike. *** I can only confirm. And I am always concentrated when riding a cykle (yes, yes, yes - I now even bikes can bite, my leg has broken once in a bike accident). *** There are two ways to take off in this plane, easy and dirty and neat and a bit more difficult*** What makes it "dirty" to keep the tailwheel grounded until airborn? I do understand it looks nice when tailwheeler is leveled during take-off procedur. So far I do it anyway with that dirty way - I do want to have a full controlability against possible sudden side wind gusts and keep the tail down until whole plane is airborne. It tooks typically only 180 m. ***MTOV the speeds were 65 on final, 60 on the numbers, and 55-50 flare. > Single it works out nice with 5 to 8 knots below that. *** As I told earlier, I use all the time 75 knots, even alone far from MTOW. That is only to avoid unexpected stalling and in the other hand: if I am capable enough to land with that speed, I can surely do it succesfully with lower speeds! That was something what my instructor learned to me. Maybe those very sad and unnecessary fatal low-height-near-runway type-accidents have also affected me to do so. I think we both are very happy. I have had flights almost every day, sometimes by Europa and sometimes by Cessna. You can be sure Cessna is very boring after Europa - have you tried? It is like compareing Volvo 242 year model 1980 and a new Alfa Romeo 2-seater. But there are still situations man prefer Volvo more than Alfa... Anyway - should we meet Jos somewhere each others and shake our hands? And study our planes - maybe there is still something usefull to give for us. The middle point between Tampere and Ivalo is about Kuusamo EFKS is not it? How about there, before a real autumn? Wishes, Raimo ========= ----- Original Message ----- From: "josok" Sent: Monday, August 20, 2007 1:15 AM Subject: Europa-List: flying the mono > > First the disclaimer: This is a report of my personal experience, and might not at all be of any help to anybody. There are several good instructions on the net written by excellent long time pilots. > My flying history is not very long. Less then 4 years ago i saw an interesting program on the Discovery channel, Mark Evans building and learning to fly hi9s Europa in 20 sequels of half an hour. That started a chain of events, leading to the experience of really flying my own built plane by myself today. Only after the start of the build, i went to Napels, FL to get my PPL. It took 65 hours, most of those hours doing touch and goes. I had great difficulties in landing. I complained about either my lack of learning capability or my instructors lack instructional skills to an outsider instructor. He told me, it's like riding a bike. You can't tell somebody when to push the handle-bar to prevent the bike from falling over. I thought %&#/, does not help me, flying is definitely not riding a bike. But the next morning, all landings were fine, and i was doing solo in the afternoon. It was probably the push i needed. > >From the very start of the build people have been trying to convince me to change to a tri-gear. My good friend and low time pilot Cliff Shaw changed to a tri-gear. A couple of days ago i found an introduction by him on another forum, where he explains that he was not a good enough pilot for a mono. It did not help, it's possible to kill yourself in any plane. Or bathtub. But it all added up to the fear-factor. Dave and William came flying to Ivalo in their planes and i had a ride in them. Both frightened me with vicious stalls, although easily corrected. Both landed concentrated, but without a glitch. Last year i had to pick up a trailer and happened to be able to join Andy on his last working day in the factory. He kindly let me try to land the mono, and it was a disaster. Not one time even close. I had been sitting and driving in my car for close to 3000 km, and was not in the best condition after one night sleep. Not a good idea. > Then, almost all of a sudden my kit was ready and approved for test flight. Ivan took it in the air and was happy with it. On the 3rd or so flight Ivan took it through a shake out, that convinced me that his creation and my build would take anything that i will do with it. His landings were concentrated, effortless and smooth. We had agreed that he would train our club's instructor, and Pentti, the instructor and Ivan were happy in half an hour. Pentti then could take all the time needed to get me through the learning process. > There are two ways to take off in this plane, easy and dirty and neat and a bit more difficult. Pentti of course wants it the good way, and raised the tail wheel at 30 knots. At that moment you are really flying on one wheel, the outriggers are off the runway, directional control is by rudder only, far less effective then the tail wheel and the plane has to be kept level with the ailerons. Then all of a sudden it's off and seems to rise vertically, because of the low nose attitude with flaps. At 65 gear and flaps up, and it's like another boost kicks in. Some training is needed here too, because it is fairly difficult to keep one hand steady on the stick and push hard on the gear lever. It was one of the stages the onlookers liked most, pushing both offers spectacular scenes :-). The easy method is to just keep back pressure on, and it will fly itself off the runway. Then an immediate pitch down change has to happen because otherwise speed and flying will end. Already in th > is stage it becomes clear that the flying controls are quite effective and sensitive at low speeds. It is very easy to over control. It has to be flown with 2 fingers, not a hand. > Landing is easy if the speeds and alignment are nailed. Coming in too fast, and it will float forever. If there is only a little bit too much throttle, it will never land. Throttle changes, especially in the level or nose up part of the flare produce pitch changes, unless corrected, which are difficult. Dead stick landing is easier, because it will land. A little bit of power helps though, because if the tail wheel is first, and the main gear high, it will bounce acceptable, and keeping the stick back, will stay on the runway the second time. Ballooning up with no power is worse. The easy thing in the whole process is the controllability. Even in the stall-horn the plane is fully controllable. And, on the downside, still easy to over control. For me, that was the difficult part, to get the jerking out of the system. Close to MTOV the speeds were 65 on final, 60 on the numbers, and 55-50 flare. > Single it works out nice with 5 to 8 knots below that. Proper alignment is probably the most important one. If it touches down aligned it's all very simple. If not, swiveling starts, and at occasions i was happy we were trying this on a 40 meter wide runway. My instructor was convinced that my left leg was longer, because i would always veer off to the left. I was simply looking over the nose of the very round cowl, instead of straight ahead. Today there was a bug on the windscreen to help with the alignment, before i wash it off, i will pencil a pointer there. The right method to get an out-of line-landing right is -again- not to over control. Take a point half way of the real center, get it there, and kick it once more. This particular concrete runway has the extra difficulty of a high camber. Even at MTOV the outriggers do not touch both. That causes rocking from one side to the other, which in turn mixes up my giros. No correction is needed for that rocking, it does not c > hange the direction. Oh, and of course, always stick back! It's as simple as riding a bike. It took me close to 100 landings to feel comfortable. I had a lot of fear, and now while i know i have to be alert to do it right, i enjoy it all the way. > > Kind Regards, > > Jos Okhuijsen > > > > > > > Visit - www.EuropaOwners.org > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 02:34:51 PM PST US From: Graham Singleton Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re: First solo Raimo & Jos imho it is complicated by the different mixtures the cylinders receive cause by the convoluted shape of the inlet manifolds. Heavy unvapourised fuel droplets will tend to be sent forward at open throttle The butterfly will change things at part throttle settings. You will probably notice that the hottest cylinder changes at different power settings Graham Raimo Toivio wrote: > It is fitted very tight over the engine and it is glass fiber made. > I am not sure - maybe it is only for 912S ? > I think it has a big role to equalize temps between front and > rear cylinders. > > Regards, Raimo > ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 02:53:53 PM PST US From: "R.C.Harrison" Subject: RE: Europa-List: flying the mono Hi! Raimo/Jos This looks for all the world like the first Finnish "Doth" ! Regards Bob H G-PTAG Do not archive. Robt.C.Harrison -----Original Message----- From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Raimo Toivio Sent: 21 August 2007 22:31 Subject: Re: Europa-List: flying the mono Jos it was a real joy to read your flying experiences. Mostly like mines. ***From the very start of the build people have been trying to convince me to change to a tri-gear*** Me too! And I have to confess: little before maiden flight I thought I have made a terrible wrong decision when building a mono (or any plane!). But when seeing Dirk van Oyen landing easily when it was 13G19 sidewind it helped me much. Dirk gave a 5 minute phone training to my instructor Jyrki Laukkanen and that was enough for him. After couple of landings together it was my time to my solo. No problems. It was a dazzling experience. Those horrible mono stories are just a stories. There are people who never learn to use zipper or phone. But we still have zippers and phones. ***It's as simple as riding a bike. *** I can only confirm. And I am always concentrated when riding a cykle (yes, yes, yes - I now even bikes can bite, my leg has broken once in a bike accident). *** There are two ways to take off in this plane, easy and dirty and neat and a bit more difficult*** What makes it "dirty" to keep the tailwheel grounded until airborn? I do understand it looks nice when tailwheeler is leveled during take-off procedur. So far I do it anyway with that dirty way - I do want to have a full controlability against possible sudden side wind gusts and keep the tail down until whole plane is airborne. It tooks typically only 180 m. ***MTOV the speeds were 65 on final, 60 on the numbers, and 55-50 flare. > Single it works out nice with 5 to 8 knots below that. *** As I told earlier, I use all the time 75 knots, even alone far from MTOW. That is only to avoid unexpected stalling and in the other hand: if I am capable enough to land with that speed, I can surely do it succesfully with lower speeds! That was something what my instructor learned to me. Maybe those very sad and unnecessary fatal low-height-near-runway type-accidents have also affected me to do so. I think we both are very happy. I have had flights almost every day, sometimes by Europa and sometimes by Cessna. You can be sure Cessna is very boring after Europa - have you tried? It is like compareing Volvo 242 year model 1980 and a new Alfa Romeo 2-seater. But there are still situations man prefer Volvo more than Alfa... Anyway - should we meet Jos somewhere each others and shake our hands? And study our planes - maybe there is still something usefull to give for us. The middle point between Tampere and Ivalo is about Kuusamo EFKS is not it? How about there, before a real autumn? Wishes, Raimo ========= ----- Original Message ----- From: "josok" Sent: Monday, August 20, 2007 1:15 AM Subject: Europa-List: flying the mono > > First the disclaimer: This is a report of my personal experience, and might not at all be of any help to anybody. There are several good instructions on the net written by excellent long time pilots. > My flying history is not very long. Less then 4 years ago i saw an interesting program on the Discovery channel, Mark Evans building and learning to fly hi9s Europa in 20 sequels of half an hour. That started a chain of events, leading to the experience of really flying my own built plane by myself today. Only after the start of the build, i went to Napels, FL to get my PPL. It took 65 hours, most of those hours doing touch and goes. I had great difficulties in landing. I complained about either my lack of learning capability or my instructors lack instructional skills to an outsider instructor. He told me, it's like riding a bike. You can't tell somebody when to push the handle-bar to prevent the bike from falling over. I thought %&#/, does not help me, flying is definitely not riding a bike. But the next morning, all landings were fine, and i was doing solo in the afternoon. It was probably the push i needed. > >From the very start of the build people have been trying to convince me to change to a tri-gear. My good friend and low time pilot Cliff Shaw changed to a tri-gear. A couple of days ago i found an introduction by him on another forum, where he explains that he was not a good enough pilot for a mono. It did not help, it's possible to kill yourself in any plane. Or bathtub. But it all added up to the fear-factor. Dave and William came flying to Ivalo in their planes and i had a ride in them. Both frightened me with vicious stalls, although easily corrected. Both landed concentrated, but without a glitch. Last year i had to pick up a trailer and happened to be able to join Andy on his last working day in the factory. He kindly let me try to land the mono, and it was a disaster. Not one time even close. I had been sitting and driving in my car for close to 3000 km, and was not in the best condition after one night sleep. Not a good idea. > Then, almost all of a sudden my kit was ready and approved for test flight. Ivan took it in the air and was happy with it. On the 3rd or so flight Ivan took it through a shake out, that convinced me that his creation and my build would take anything that i will do with it. His landings were concentrated, effortless and smooth. We had agreed that he would train our club's instructor, and Pentti, the instructor and Ivan were happy in half an hour. Pentti then could take all the time needed to get me through the learning process. > There are two ways to take off in this plane, easy and dirty and neat and a bit more difficult. Pentti of course wants it the good way, and raised the tail wheel at 30 knots. At that moment you are really flying on one wheel, the outriggers are off the runway, directional control is by rudder only, far less effective then the tail wheel and the plane has to be kept level with the ailerons. Then all of a sudden it's off and seems to rise vertically, because of the low nose attitude with flaps. At 65 gear and flaps up, and it's like another boost kicks in. Some training is needed here too, because it is fairly difficult to keep one hand steady on the stick and push hard on the gear lever. It was one of the stages the onlookers liked most, pushing both offers spectacular scenes :-). The easy method is to just keep back pressure on, and it will fly itself off the runway. Then an immediate pitch down change has to happen because otherwise speed and flying will end. Already in! th > is stage it becomes clear that the flying controls are quite effective and sensitive at low speeds. It is very easy to over control. It has to be flown with 2 fingers, not a hand. > Landing is easy if the speeds and alignment are nailed. Coming in too fast, and it will float forever. If there is only a little bit too much throttle, it will never land. Throttle changes, especially in the level or nose up part of the flare produce pitch changes, unless corrected, which are difficult. Dead stick landing is easier, because it will land. A little bit of power helps though, because if the tail wheel is first, and the main gear high, it will bounce acceptable, and keeping the stick back, will stay on the runway the second time. Ballooning up with no power is worse. The easy thing in the whole process is the controllability. Even in the stall-horn the plane is fully controllable. And, on the downside, still easy to over control. For me, that was the difficult part, to get the jerking out of the system. Close to MTOV the speeds were 65 on final, 60 on the numbers, and 55-50 flare. > Single it works out nice with 5 to 8 knots below that. Proper alignment is probably the most important one. If it touches down aligned it's all very simple. If not, swiveling starts, and at occasions i was happy we were trying this on a 40 meter wide runway. My instructor was convinced that my left leg was longer, because i would always veer off to the left. I was simply looking over the nose of the very round cowl, instead of straight ahead. Today there was a bug on the windscreen to help with the alignment, before i wash it off, i will pencil a pointer there. The right method to get an out-of line-landing right is -again- not to over control. Take a point half way of the real center, get it there, and kick it once more. This particular concrete runway has the extra difficulty of a high camber. Even at MTOV the outriggers do not touch both. That causes rocking from one side to the other, which in turn mixes up my giros. No correction is needed for that rocking, it does no! t c > hange the direction. Oh, and of course, always stick back! It's as simple as riding a bike. It took me close to 100 landings to feel comfortable. I had a lot of fear, and now while i know i have to be alert to do it right, i enjoy it all the way. > > Kind Regards, > > Jos Okhuijsen > > > > > > > Visit - www.EuropaOwners.org > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 10:06:07 PM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Re: First solo From: "josok" Hi Raimo, Closed and filled the gills before paint. I was talking to Ivan about them, and he knew them to be useless in flight, but had them to vent the cowlings after shutdown. I open the inspection covers instead, if there is no wind and a warm day. Have the shroud, and would measure coolant, which Rotax decided to name CHT, but 2 consequitive software versions of the Dynon Flightdeck had a bug and did/do not show that sensor properly. They located the bug they say, and it will be cured in the next software version, that is about 6 monts away. I did use the oil temp indication, which uses the same sensor, to find out the difference between CHT and Rotax CHT, it's about 10 to 15 degrees. CHT follows much faster, as can be expected. The Dynon went black after 6 hours flight time, and i installed the standard VDO analog as replacement during the repair time, to keep the flight test program going. The VDO meters confirmed the temperatures. Options now are to seal the gap between cowling and shroud, seal the gap between air filter housing and turbo, partially or fully close the standard inlet openings in the top cowling. Although temperatures are well within limits now, i really want to get the temperature differences on the engine smaller, for stress reasons. Regards, Jos Visit - www.EuropaOwners.org ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 10:21:48 PM PST US Subject: Re: Europa-List: flying the mono From: "josok" Looks like fun, a Finnish DOTH :-) But w'll handle it off list, as there is little chance that more will join. On second thouight... There are certainly Swedes and Norwegians in a days flying range. Don't like Kuusamo, because it's like flying over the sea, no place to go between Ivalo and Kuusamo for almost the whole duration of the flight. Even with 25 hours without a glitch, don't want to tempt fate yet. How about EFKK, it's not too far from Sweden either? Regards, Jos Okhuijsen Visit - www.EuropaOwners.org ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message europa-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Europa-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/europa-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/europa-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.