Europa-List Digest Archive

Mon 09/17/07


Total Messages Posted: 6



Today's Message Index:
----------------------
 
     1. 01:39 AM - Re: Tailplane torque tube bushing question (Kingsley Hurst)
     2. 07:20 AM - Re: Tailplane torque tube bushing question (G&TPowell)
     3. 01:49 PM - Re: Tailplane torque tube bushing question (Laptop JR)
     4. 03:05 PM - Torque Tube CLAMP Mod Prices:- (R.C.Harrison)
     5. 06:42 PM - Dive to Vne (Martin Tuck)
     6. 11:44 PM - Handling characteristics (Rman)
 
 
 


Message 1


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    Time: 01:39:24 AM PST US
    From: "Kingsley Hurst" <hurstkr@redzone.com.au>
    Subject: Re: Tailplane torque tube bushing question
    George, I take it that the TP5 sleeve (at the root end of the tailplane) slides easily along the torque tube TP4 until the torque tube begins to enter TP6 (the sleeve with the pip pin hole). As I see it, there is more than one scenario that could cause this. 1 The TP5 sleeve could be slightly out of alignment causing the torque tube not to want to enter TP6. On forcing the alignment during rigging, TP5 would then bind on the torque tube and jam. 2 TP6 may be slightly out of alignment which would cause it to bind as the torque tube enters it. 3 There may be a slight film of epoxy or similar on the inside of TP6 4 TP6 may have been shrunk. This can happen if grooves were ground around its periphery to enable better bonding (the heat causes the sleeve to shrink - Ask me how I know this !) 5 Any combination of the above. If TP5 is tight all the way along TP4, either 3 or 4 above may apply ?? If TP5 IS indeed tight all the way, will the tailplane fit on the wrong end of TP4 torque tube ? I think it is important to properly identify the problem before trying to determine a fix. Good luck Kingsley in Oz. > I purchased an XS kit in 2003 and never got my Accelerated Stage I kit, > due to the collapse of EMIL. Later, I purchased the tailplanes already > built from a charity that got them from someone's estate. The torque tube > TP4 is extremely tight when I try to put the tailplanes on, and it is > nearly impossible to get the TP4 to seat properly in the TP6 sleeve > already bonded into the tailplanes (the TP12 pins will not seat into the > TP13 bushes, due to the difficulty in getting the torque tube in). If I > can't get the tailplanes on in my shop, I certainly won't be able to get > them on the completed airplane.


    Message 2


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    Time: 07:20:50 AM PST US
    Subject: Re: Tailplane torque tube bushing question
    From: "G&amp;TPowell" <georgepowell@hotmail.com>
    Thanks to all for the replies. To answer the points raised, I did lubricate TP4, but with Teflon white lithium grease, as I saw suggested on another thread. This helped some, but not much. The TP4 does slide through TP5, but not very easily on one side. I did check for epoxy contamination; I believe that both TP5 and TP6 are clean. I opened up the bottom of the tailplane to check the integrity of the TP6 join, and I found that a few blobs of epoxy had dripped between the joints of the foam in the empty foam tube area between TP5 and TP6. I thought that these might be binding the TP4 as it passed through. Removing these little blobs helped a little. With the bottom of the tailplane open, I can easily see the TP4 when it reaches TP6. The serious binding begins when TP4 enters TP6. The points raised by Kingsley seem possible, if not probable. As I did not construct these tailplanes, I don't know how well they were made when the TP5 and TP6 sleeves were set. It seems entirely possible that one or the other (or both) are not in alignment. From visual inspection of the TP6 it does not appear that grooves were cut in it to "key" the epoxy bond, so I don't think that would have contributed to TP6 "shrinking". I am glad I opened up the bottom to check this, as I will now roughen the surface of TP6 with a dremel or drill when doing the layup described in Service Bulletin 006. If I have to remove TP6 (and/or TP5) to reset them, what is the proper technique to do so? Your suggestions are greatly appreciated. George Powell Visit - www.EuropaOwners.org


    Message 3


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    Time: 01:49:53 PM PST US
    From: "Laptop JR" <jrgowing@bigpond.net.au>
    Subject: Re: Tailplane torque tube bushing question
    And Kingsley and George If one of the bushes are out of line, only tightening when the second is mounted on the tube - then a heat cure while mounted might free them by letting them go into alignment? JR (bob) Gowing also in Oz do not archive ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kingsley Hurst" <hurstkr@redzone.com.au> Sent: Monday, September 17, 2007 6:36 PM Subject: Re: Europa-List: Tailplane torque tube bushing question > <hurstkr@redzone.com.au> > > George, > > I take it that the TP5 sleeve (at the root end of the tailplane) slides > easily along the torque tube TP4 until the torque tube begins to enter TP6 > (the sleeve with the pip pin hole). > > As I see it, there is more than one scenario that could cause this. > > 1 The TP5 sleeve could be slightly out of alignment causing the torque > tube not to want to enter TP6. On forcing the alignment during rigging, > TP5 would then bind on the torque tube and jam. > > 2 TP6 may be slightly out of alignment which would cause it to bind as > the torque tube enters it. > > 3 There may be a slight film of epoxy or similar on the inside of TP6 > > 4 TP6 may have been shrunk. This can happen if grooves were ground > around its periphery to enable better bonding (the heat causes the sleeve > to shrink - Ask me how I know this !) > > 5 Any combination of the above. > > If TP5 is tight all the way along TP4, either 3 or 4 above may apply ?? > If TP5 IS indeed tight all the way, will the tailplane fit on the wrong > end of TP4 torque tube ? > > I think it is important to properly identify the problem before trying to > determine a fix. > > Good luck > Kingsley in Oz. > > >> I purchased an XS kit in 2003 and never got my Accelerated Stage I kit, >> due to the collapse of EMIL. Later, I purchased the tailplanes already >> built from a charity that got them from someone's estate. The torque >> tube TP4 is extremely tight when I try to put the tailplanes on, and it >> is nearly impossible to get the TP4 to seat properly in the TP6 sleeve >> already bonded into the tailplanes (the TP12 pins will not seat into the >> TP13 bushes, due to the difficulty in getting the torque tube in). If I >> can't get the tailplanes on in my shop, I certainly won't be able to get >> them on the completed airplane. > > >


    Message 4


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    Time: 03:05:20 PM PST US
    From: "R.C.Harrison" <ptag.dev@tiscali.co.uk>
    Subject: Torque Tube CLAMP Mod Prices:-
    I am pleased to announce the availability of prices of the parts to effect this modification. Should you be interested and haven't received pricing details today please e-mail me direct with your request. Best regards Bob Harrison. Robt.C.Harrison


    Message 5


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    Time: 06:42:46 PM PST US
    From: Martin Tuck <MJKTuck@cs.com>
    Subject: Dive to Vne
    Hi Guys, The 'Dive to Vne' as part of the UK annual inspection was mentioned again. In my mind Vne is a maximum design speed for the aircraft, first calculated and then demonstrated by the manufacturer (probably with some margin) as part of the 'proof of design' test program. It is a test that takes the airframe close to the outer edge of the envelope and I don't think one to be undertaken lightly particularly by your average private pilot. The test has two possible outcomes and to me a positive result is not worth the risk of the alternative. Is there anyway the PFA can persuade the CAA to rethink the need for this test as part of an annual check - or at least set some standards as to who can perform the test, no passengers, entry and exit altitudes, wearing of helmet/parachute in case the test proves negative, etc. Maybe a requirement to dive to 90% of Vne would be a satisfactory compromise? Regards, Martin Tuck N152MT Wichita, Kansas


    Message 6


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    Time: 11:44:52 PM PST US
    From: Rman <topglock@cox.net>
    Subject: Handling characteristics
    All, There is a very good article in this months Kitplanes (page 19) in which one of the test pilots gives the Europa very high ratings in the handling category. Puts it right up there with some of the best. He also credits Ivan Shaw as being one of the top designers in experimental aviation... Jeff - Baby Blue 329 hours




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