---------------------------------------------------------- Europa-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Mon 06/16/08: 17 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 01:55 AM - Re: DOTH - UK pilots only (rick) 2. 02:06 AM - Re: DOTH - UK pilots only (Trevpond@aol.com) 3. 08:14 AM - Re: DOTH - UK pilots only (nigel charles) 4. 08:27 AM - Re: DOTH - UK pilots only (nigel charles) 5. 10:41 AM - Re: DOTH - UK pilots only (Trevpond@aol.com) 6. 10:49 AM - DOTH tomorrow (nigel charles) 7. 11:38 AM - Re: DOTH tomorrow Sturgate (Bryan Allsop) 8. 11:52 AM - Re: DOTH tomorrow (Bryan Allsop) 9. 12:19 PM - Re: DOTH tomorrow (nigel charles) 10. 12:23 PM - Re: DOTH tomorrow (josok) 11. 01:04 PM - Re: FW: For Andy (Raimo Toivio) 12. 02:19 PM - DOTH to Beverley (Bryan Allsop) 13. 02:36 PM - First time in the history (Raimo Toivio) 14. 02:41 PM - Re: CBs & lightning (Raimo Toivio) 15. 03:21 PM - Re: FW: For Andy (Robert C Harrison) 16. 03:42 PM - Re: Re: Europa-List914 Overheating/boiling (Jeff B) 17. 11:03 PM - First Flight (A B Milne) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 01:55:20 AM PST US From: "rick" Subject: RE: Europa-List: DOTH - UK pilots only I'd love to but got to work. Thanks for a great day again. Your field is coming along beautifully. Yours friends and neighbours seemed to enjoy it all to. See you soon Best Wishes Rick PS I think we must get Gerry and Paddy sectioned!. _____ From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of nigel charles Sent: 15 June 2008 16:39 Subject: Europa-List: DOTH - UK pilots only Anyone for a DOTH on Tuesday? Nigel Charles "http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List"http://www.matronics.com/Nav igator?Europa-List "http://www.matronics.com/contribution"http://www.matronics.com/contribution Checked by AVG. 18:02 ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 02:06:09 AM PST US From: Trevpond@aol.com Subject: Re: Europa-List: DOTH - UK pilots only Hi Paddy, Are you going somewhere? Trev Pond G-LINN ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 08:14:14 AM PST US From: "nigel charles" Subject: RE: Europa-List: DOTH - UK pilots only Hi Rick Thanks for your support. Hope you got back OK and your ignition system problems are solved. When I circulated the following emails I only had your old email address so they didn't get through so here they are again. Regards Nigel ------------------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------------------------------------------------ ---------- I would like to thank all of you for participating in the Lydeway BBQ/Fly-In. You made a lot of people very happy. Everyone who wanted to get a flight this year got airborne. It was particularly helpful that there were two 4 seaters as there were a few youngsters who needed the reassurance of their parent to go flying. The ratio of aircraft to local guests was easier this year. We had 15 aircraft which is the highest ever and I think it proved to be a sensible maximum for future years. You all operated very professionally, helping to keep this a safe and enjoyable event. Whilst I can help to coordinate movements on the ground and arrange relative priorites for ground and airborne traffic, the ultimate safety in the air is down to you guys and I thank you for a good job well done. The event raised =A3150 for the MS charity and it was particulary nice to see that two pilots were able to take an MS guest airborne. The sense of freedom this gave when otherwise stuck in a wheelchair was much appreciated. It was also good to have the police helicopter visit. After several years of offering, this was the first time they were able to find a gap in their busy schedule. Sadly as the ambulance funding from the NHS is now in doubt it may be the last time we see them at the event. The parking layout was not quite optimised for so many aircraft. This was the first year that we had enough space to create a 'ramp' area. It is a matter of chance as to the length of the field grass at the time of the event. In retrospect we should have widened it to make it easier to taxy in an out. As it was most of you managed to arrange your positioning to optimise ground movements. I will take this on board for next year's event. If anyone has any suggestions as to how to improve things, particularly from the aviator's perspective, please let me know. Unless anyone tells me other wise I will keep you all on my email list for when it comes time to publicise next year's fly-in. Thanks again. Enjoy your flying. Regards Nigel Charles ------------------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------------------------------------------------ ----------------- I have been asked to include a short article about the Lydeway BBQ/Fly-In for the Europa Club magazine. Do any of you have any digital photos of the event that they could let me have a copy of? Regards Nigel ------------------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------ ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 08:27:20 AM PST US From: "nigel charles" Subject: RE: Europa-List: DOTH - UK pilots only For anyone thinking of joining us, Cathy and I are intending to fly to Sturgate tomorrow (Tuesday). In case of changes of plan we will be contactable on 01380 860620 or 0776 4579 860 until 10am. So far just Pete and Sue Jeffers have shown interest. Paddy might come but he is having some difficulty getting unleaded fuel for his aircraft due to the tanker drivers strike. Regards Nigel Charles -----Original Message----- From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Trevpond@aol.com Sent: 16 June 2008 10:01 Subject: Re: Europa-List: DOTH - UK pilots only Hi Paddy, Are you going somewhere? Trev Pond G-LINN ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 10:41:43 AM PST US From: Trevpond@aol.com Subject: Re: Europa-List: DOTH - UK pilots only Hi Nigel, I'm in for it! regards Trev Pond G-LINN ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 10:49:01 AM PST US From: "nigel charles" Subject: Europa-List: DOTH tomorrow Change of plan. I am told there is no restaurant at Sturgate and I haven't researched whether there is a pub nearby. Also some pilots in the south are having problems getting fuel. Also the weather is looking a bit better in the south so we are now looking at Sandown. Although the restaurant has burnt down we have potential transport for a few people as Pete Jeffers has a car there. If too many want to attend we can change the destination at last minute to Bembridge where there is food. Anyone interested please contact me so we have an idea of numbers. Regards Nigel ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 11:38:27 AM PST US From: Bryan Allsop Subject: RE: Europa-List: DOTH tomorrow Sturgate There was a restaurant there last time I went. Bryan From: nwcmc@tiscali.co.ukTo: europa-list@matronics.comSubject: Europa-List: DOTH tomorrowDate: Mon, 16 Jun 2008 18:46:12 +0100 Change of plan. I am told there is no restaurant at Sturgate and I haven't researched whether there is a pub nearby. Also some pilots in the south are having problems getting fuel. Also the weather is looking a bit better in the south so we are now looking at Sandown. Although the restaurant has bur nt down we have potential transport for a few people as Pete Jeffers has a car there. If too many want to attend we can change the destination at last minute to Bembridge where there is food. Anyone interested please contact me so we have an idea of numbers. Regards Nigel _________________________________________________________________ Search that pays you back! Introducing Live Search cashback. http://search.live.com/cashback/?&pkw=form=MIJAAF/publ=HMTGL/crea=s rchpaysyouback ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 11:52:09 AM PST US From: Bryan Allsop Subject: RE: Europa-List: DOTH tomorrow I have checked ,and you are probably correct about Sturgate now. I really would like to Drop my Hat tomorrow, but Sandown on the Isle of Wig ht could be too much of a reach for me. Isn't there anywhere more central? Best regards. Bryan From: nwcmc@tiscali.co.ukTo: europa-list@matronics.comSubject: Europa-List: DOTH tomorrowDate: Mon, 16 Jun 2008 18:46:12 +0100 Change of plan. I am told there is no restaurant at Sturgate and I haven't researched whether there is a pub nearby. Also some pilots in the south are having problems getting fuel. Also the weather is looking a bit better in the south so we are now looking at Sandown. Although the restaurant has bur nt down we have potential transport for a few people as Pete Jeffers has a car there. If too many want to attend we can change the destination at last minute to Bembridge where there is food. Anyone interested please contact me so we have an idea of numbers. Regards Nigel _________________________________________________________________ Now you can invite friends from Facebook and other groups to join you on Wi ndows Live=99 Messenger. Add now. https://www.invite2messenger.net/im/?source=TXT_EML_WLH_AddNow_Now ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 12:19:06 PM PST US From: "nigel charles" Subject: RE: Europa-List: DOTH tomorrow Sorry Bryan we have already decided to go for Sandown. Pete knows a good restaurant there and has transport from the field. Changing it at this stage is getting too complicated. Had I known earlier that you were in the frame we could have chosen something more central. Perhaps we will catch up with you on a later DOTH. Your choice next time. Regards Nigel -----Original Message----- From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bryan Allsop Sent: 16 June 2008 19:49 Subject: RE: Europa-List: DOTH tomorrow I have checked ,and you are probably correct about Sturgate now. I really would like to Drop my Hat tomorrow, but Sandown on the Isle of Wight could be too much of a reach for me. Isn't there anywhere more central? Best regards. Bryan _____ From: nwcmc@tiscali.co.uk Subject: Europa-List: DOTH tomorrow Change of plan. I am told there is no restaurant at Sturgate and I haven't researched whether there is a pub nearby. Also some pilots in the south are having problems getting fuel. Also the weather is looking a bit better in the south so we are now looking at Sandown. Although the restaurant has burnt down we have potential transport for a few people as Pete Jeffers has a car there. If too many want to attend we can change the destination at last minute to Bembridge where there is food. Anyone interested please contact me so we have an idea of numbers. Regards Nigel arget=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List p://forums.matronics.com blank>http://www.matronics.com/contribution _____ Now you can invite friends from Facebook and other groups to join you on Windows LiveT Messenger. Add them now! ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 12:23:55 PM PST US Subject: Re: Europa-List: DOTH tomorrow From: "josok" There was food available at Sandown, last time i visited, from kind of a trailer behind the fire damaged restaurant the last time i visited there :-) Regards, Jos Okhuijsen Visit - www.EuropaOwners.org ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 01:04:57 PM PST US From: "Raimo Toivio" Subject: Re: Europa-List: FW: For Andy "force needed near one of the extremities is beyond what i can produce" sounds in my ears like "would become uncontrollable" ;) My plane: I need almost full trim to nose down position when cruising in or near max cruising speed. During take offs and landings I trim to "neutral" postion. That means I never use trim between neutral and max nose upp position. My neutral is a real neutral ie. trim tabs and stabilators are levelled then. Would like to know what happens if I trim max nose upp during 70 kts clean or dirty? If no answers, I will test during my next flight some day. Problem: I am afraid I am strong enough to broke the controls. As well as Jos asked, opinions please! Raimo ----- Original Message ----- From: "josok" Sent: Friday, June 13, 2008 10:49 PM Subject: Europa-List: FW: For Andy > > Words change while being transferred, i have never stated "would become uncontrollable in pitch" What i told Raimo was that the force needed near one of the extremities is beyond what i can produce from a given point to a safe landing. I would appreciate the opinion of others who have run a full test program. They are all different, is it my plane only? > > Regards > > Jos Okhuijsen > > > > > > > Visit - www.EuropaOwners.org > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 02:19:29 PM PST US From: Bryan Allsop Subject: Europa-List: DOTH to Beverley Hi Folks, Since Sandown is a step too far for some of us who are not located down tha t way, Roger Mills and I are having our own Doth at Beverley tomorrow ( Tue sday). All welcome with a mominal arrival at mid-day. Happy flying. Bryan _________________________________________________________________ Now you can invite friends from Facebook and other groups to join you on Wi ndows Live=99 Messenger. Add now. https://www.invite2messenger.net/im/?source=TXT_EML_WLH_AddNow_Now ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 02:36:39 PM PST US From: "Raimo Toivio" Subject: Europa-List: First time in the history All The Finnish Europas in the same hangary! Raimo ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 02:41:58 PM PST US From: "Raimo Toivio" Subject: Re: Europa-List: CBs & lightning Ferg, One friend - a Learjet pilot who I respect - said his minimum is 50 km. That is like your 25 miles. Raimo ----- Original Message ----- From: "Fergus Kyle" Sent: Friday, June 13, 2008 9:29 PM Subject: Europa-List: CBs & lightning > > FWIW: > Many years ago, a wise old owl (now with the angels) said he had > many lightning strikes while delivering heavies over the Indian and Pacific > oceans, some of which caused mayhem and some of which were nominal. In EVERY > case he was within 25 miles of a thunderstorm - CB . > He eventually clicked and refused vehemently (Air Traffic > instructions or no) to come within 25 miles (on the radar by then) - and > never had another. His limit (and then mine) is 25 miles clear of a > thunderstorm below freezing level and 40 miles above that because of jet > wind dispersal of hail from anvil tops. I spent many an hour guessing at > distances when I had airborne radar to play with since I knew one day I'd go > without. We don't need to fuss too much here over in winter as CBs don't > convene and FZ of 18k is mostly above our need - but summertime my minimum > goes to 25 miles no matter what the challenge. > JMF - just my feelings. > Ferg > A064 > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 03:21:42 PM PST US From: "Robert C Harrison" Subject: RE: Europa-List: FW: For Andy Hi! Raimo. I have some limited experience with the trim system "going out of sync..." Since it was initially thought to be a wiring problem I endured it for a while with discussions ensuing with the trim controller company. The problem appeared to be that the system would not reverse until it reached fully to the maximum limit. Initially I would hold the pitch control and be brave enough to operate the trim motor to the maximum deflection point and then it would reverse. I then really desperately tried not to trim back for it to happen again. During all these test circumstances I was most concerned for the strength of the trim system and ultimately getting caught out trying to land in the failed mode. Finally I used to let the aircraft fly with the maximum trim out location hands off.. until the control was able to reverse. The Ray Allen Company then got to do some serious reasoning about the problem and asked me to return the motor and the control unit to them. They tested out the motor and their relay deck and discovered a fault in the relay deck and replaced it free of charge. I've had no problems since. Of course by not resisting the forces the control system was not stressed however it would have been impossible to land. Regards Bob Harrison G-PTAG -----Original Message----- From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Raimo Toivio Sent: 16 June 2008 21:15 Subject: Re: Europa-List: FW: For Andy "force needed near one of the extremities is beyond what i can produce" sounds in my ears like "would become uncontrollable" ;) My plane: I need almost full trim to nose down position when cruising in or near max cruising speed. During take offs and landings I trim to "neutral" postion. That means I never use trim between neutral and max nose upp position. My neutral is a real neutral ie. trim tabs and stabilators are levelled then. Would like to know what happens if I trim max nose upp during 70 kts clean or dirty? If no answers, I will test during my next flight some day. Problem: I am afraid I am strong enough to broke the controls. As well as Jos asked, opinions please! Raimo ----- Original Message ----- From: "josok" Sent: Friday, June 13, 2008 10:49 PM Subject: Europa-List: FW: For Andy > > Words change while being transferred, i have never stated "would become uncontrollable in pitch" What i told Raimo was that the force needed near one of the extremities is beyond what i can produce from a given point to a safe landing. I would appreciate the opinion of others who have run a full test program. They are all different, is it my plane only? > > Regards > > Jos Okhuijsen > > > > > > > Visit - www.EuropaOwners.org > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 03:42:40 PM PST US From: Jeff B Subject: Re: Europa-List: RE: Europa-List914 Overheating/boiling Sorry for the late reply, but here is a possible problem. I have seen, on occasion, the impeller in a water pump loosen itself from the shaft and virtually stop pumping fluid. I know it's very rare, but still a possibility to explore, should you not be able to resolve the issue by other means... Jeff - Baby Blue rparigor@suffolk.lib.ny.us wrote: > > Hi G-IANI > > "Even with short warm up and taxi it will boil slightly as you clime out" > > "Has anyone got any ideas that might help" > > Will the system hold 1.2 bar pressure? If pressure drops boiling temp will > go down. I had a pressure cap on my 1992 Volvo turbo Station Wagon get a > very small hairline crack perhaps a year ago and what you describe is bout > what happened to me. > > Pretty easy to check are radiator fins restricting? Has any hose or > fitting changed to cause a restriction? > > Harder to check, is radiator internal restricting? Is water pump working > properly? > > Good Luck > Ron Parigoris > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > Checked by AVG. ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 11:03:42 PM PST US From: "A B Milne" Subject: Europa-List: First Flight Another Europa XS Trigear is on its way to join the UK fleet. G - CEYK flew from Oxford for the first time on Saturday last. No dramas, just the interest provided by having myself as builder on his first as a test pilot. 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