---------------------------------------------------------- Europa-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Thu 07/03/08: 28 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 02:27 AM - Re: Coolant Temps. (Graham Singleton) 2. 03:13 AM - Fw: Re: mod 59 (Herve) 3. 03:24 AM - Fw: Re: mod 59 (Herve) 4. 03:32 AM - Fw: Re: mod 59 (Herve) 5. 04:16 AM - Re: Coolant Temps. (Karl Heindl) 6. 04:45 AM - Rotax fly in & factory tour (conrad) 7. 06:54 AM - Re: Coolant Temps. (Graham Singleton) 8. 07:17 AM - Re: mono brake mounting (Rowland Carson) 9. 07:40 AM - Re: A question on composits (Jeff B) 10. 08:18 AM - Re: mono brake mounting (Robert Borger) 11. 11:51 AM - cowlings (david miller) 12. 01:37 PM - Cooling & Cowling (JEFF ROBERTS) 13. 01:52 PM - Re: Cooling & Cowling (Jeff B) 14. 02:37 PM - Re: A question on composits (karelvranken) 15. 02:37 PM - Re: mono brake mounting (karelvranken) 16. 02:37 PM - Re: Gas Strut door location lug. (karelvranken) 17. 02:53 PM - Re: Cooling & Cowling (Brian Davies) 18. 03:14 PM - Re: Cooling & Cowling (Graham Singleton) 19. 03:36 PM - Re: Cooling & Cowling (karelvranken) 20. 03:47 PM - Re: A question on composits (Paul McAllister) 21. 03:51 PM - Where to get the Rotax 914 TLR Software? (darinh) 22. 04:03 PM - Fw: Carb Heat on Rotax engines: LAA Policy (William Harrison) 23. 04:13 PM - Re: A question on composits (Jeff B) 24. 04:27 PM - Re: Where to get the Rotax 914 TLR Software? (conrad) 25. 04:36 PM - Re: A question on composits (karelvranken) 26. 04:37 PM - Re: Where to get the Rotax 914 TLR Software? (darinh) 27. 05:07 PM - Re: Cooling & Cowling (JEFF ROBERTS) 28. 10:16 PM - Re: A question on composits (Fred Klein) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 02:27:05 AM PST US From: Graham Singleton Subject: Re: Europa-List: Coolant Temps. Karl Heindl wrote: > Graham, > > You have a point there, but don't all Europa Rotaxes have worm clamps > for the thick hoses from the radiator, plus a few more when the > Skydrive kit is installed ? > > Karl Karl you are right but all the hoses Rotax fit on the engine now have clips. It was a Europa factory molded hose that let go on me. Those hoses are fiber reinforced elastomer whereas the Rotax ones are cloth reinforced. Graham ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 03:13:20 AM PST US From: Herve Subject: Fwd: RE: Europa-List: mod 59 >To: europa-list@matronics.com >From: Herve >Subject: Fwd: RE: Europa-List: mod 59 > >Hi Craig >Thank you very much for your advise.Will have a go this week end.You >wouldn't be close to leicester? >Regards >Herve > >From: Herve >>Subject: Fwd: RE: Europa-List: mod 59 >> >> >>>From: "craig bastin" >>>To: >>>Subject: RE: Europa-List: mod 59 >>>Date: Wed, 2 Jul 2008 22:09:56 +1000 >>>Sender: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com >>>X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 7.5.524 [270.4.3/1529] >>> >>> >>>Yes i have done it. It is quite simple >>>undo the nut from the top of the shaft that holds the nose wheel fork >>>remove the fork and all the washers, spacers etc, THE PIN, and in the kit >>>you will find the small steel ring about 1.5mm thick that will slide >>>onto the shaft of the nose wheel fork, slide the whole thing >>>back into gear leg without anything else on there, just the small ring from >>>the kit >>>then put the big ring from the kit on top of the gear leg and a couple of >>>washers on top of the ring >>>then a half inch nut, there SHOULD be a gap under the washers. tighten up >>>the nut until the >>>flat plates on the top of the nose wheel and the bottom of the gear leg >>>touch. This should have the >>>small steel ring inside the bottom of the gear leg. Then remove the nut and >>>washers, remove the >>>nose wheel and the two steel rings (which you no longer need), At this point >>>the inner sleve >>>may be sticking up out the top of the gear leg, if so, cut/file it off till >>>it's nice and flush. >>>put the whole thing back together but this time put the rubber o-ring on top >>>of the shimmy plate, so >>>when you slide the nose wheel back into the leg it will be inside the bottom >>>of the gear leg (where the small steel ring was) >>>then put the washers (new bigger ones from the kit) plus 4 of the old ones >>>on the top with your Castelated Nut (the one with the slots cut in it) >>>on and re-set the tension as per the manual >>> >>>Just so you know, My gear leg already had space for the o-ring in the >>>bottom, so maybe you can just fit the o-ring. >>> >>>hope this helps you, sorry i dont have any pictures, I did it as part of the >>>build and it took about 30 seconds >>> >>>regards >>> >>>craig >>> >>>-----Original Message----- >>>From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com >>>[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Herve >>>Sent: Wednesday, 2 July 2008 6:32 PM >>>To: europa-list@matronics.com >>>Subject: Europa-List: mod 59 >>> >>> >>> >>>Hello >>>I am trying to do mod 59 (nose wheel shimmy damper) and I am a little >>>confuse as to what is what and goes where.Has anyone got some >>>pictures to explain? >>>G.CHET europa xs turbo >>>Herve >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>Checked by AVG. >>>7:23 PM >>> >>>Checked by AVG. >>>7:23 PM >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>-- >>>Checked by AVG. >>>7/1/2008 7:23 PM ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 03:24:33 AM PST US From: Herve Subject: Fwd: RE: Europa-List: mod 59 >Date: Thu, 03 Jul 2008 09:00:10 +0100 >To: europa-list@matronics.com >From: Herve >Subject: Fwd: RE: Europa-List: mod 59 > > >>To: europa-list@matronics.com >>From: Herve >>Subject: Fwd: RE: Europa-List: mod 59 >> >>Hi Craig >>Thank you very much for your advise.Will have a go this week >>end.You wouldn't be close to leicester? >>Regards >>Herve >> >>From: Herve >>>Subject: Fwd: RE: Europa-List: mod 59 >>> >>> >>>>From: "craig bastin" >>>>To: >>>>Subject: RE: Europa-List: mod 59 >>>>Date: Wed, 2 Jul 2008 22:09:56 +1000 >>>>Sender: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com >>>>X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 7.5.524 [270.4.3/1529] >>>> >>>> >>>>Yes i have done it. It is quite simple >>>>undo the nut from the top of the shaft that holds the nose wheel fork >>>>remove the fork and all the washers, spacers etc, THE PIN, and in the kit >>>>you will find the small steel ring about 1.5mm thick that will slide >>>>onto the shaft of the nose wheel fork, slide the whole thing >>>>back into gear leg without anything else on there, just the small ring from >>>>the kit >>>>then put the big ring from the kit on top of the gear leg and a couple of >>>>washers on top of the ring >>>>then a half inch nut, there SHOULD be a gap under the washers. tighten up >>>>the nut until the >>>>flat plates on the top of the nose wheel and the bottom of the gear leg >>>>touch. This should have the >>>>small steel ring inside the bottom of the gear leg. Then remove the nut and >>>>washers, remove the >>>>nose wheel and the two steel rings (which you no longer need), At >>>>this point >>>>the inner sleve >>>>may be sticking up out the top of the gear leg, if so, cut/file it off till >>>>it's nice and flush. >>>>put the whole thing back together but this time put the rubber >>>>o-ring on top >>>>of the shimmy plate, so >>>>when you slide the nose wheel back into the leg it will be inside >>>>the bottom >>>>of the gear leg (where the small steel ring was) >>>>then put the washers (new bigger ones from the kit) plus 4 of the old ones >>>>on the top with your Castelated Nut (the one with the slots cut in it) >>>>on and re-set the tension as per the manual >>>> >>>>Just so you know, My gear leg already had space for the o-ring in the >>>>bottom, so maybe you can just fit the o-ring. >>>> >>>>hope this helps you, sorry i dont have any pictures, I did it as >>>>part of the >>>>build and it took about 30 seconds >>>> >>>>regards >>>> >>>>craig >>>> >>>>-----Original Message----- >>>>From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com >>>>[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Herve >>>>Sent: Wednesday, 2 July 2008 6:32 PM >>>>To: europa-list@matronics.com >>>>Subject: Europa-List: mod 59 >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>Hello >>>>I am trying to do mod 59 (nose wheel shimmy damper) and I am a little >>>>confuse as to what is what and goes where.Has anyone got some >>>>pictures to explain? >>>>G.CHET europa xs turbo >>>>Herve >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>Checked by AVG. >>>>7:23 PM >>>> >>>>Checked by AVG. >>>>7:23 PM >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>-- >>>>Checked by AVG. >>>>7/1/2008 7:23 PM ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 03:32:51 AM PST US From: Herve Subject: Fwd: RE: Europa-List: mod 59 Hi Craig Thank you very much for your advise.Will have a go this week end.You wouldn't be close to leicester? Regards Herve From: Herve >Subject: Fwd: RE: Europa-List: mod 59 > > >>From: "craig bastin" >>To: >>Subject: RE: Europa-List: mod 59 >>Date: Wed, 2 Jul 2008 22:09:56 +1000 >>Sender: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com >>X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 7.5.524 [270.4.3/1529] >> >> >>Yes i have done it. It is quite simple >>undo the nut from the top of the shaft that holds the nose wheel fork >>remove the fork and all the washers, spacers etc, THE PIN, and in the kit >>you will find the small steel ring about 1.5mm thick that will slide >>onto the shaft of the nose wheel fork, slide the whole thing >>back into gear leg without anything else on there, just the small ring from >>the kit >>then put the big ring from the kit on top of the gear leg and a couple of >>washers on top of the ring >>then a half inch nut, there SHOULD be a gap under the washers. tighten up >>the nut until the >>flat plates on the top of the nose wheel and the bottom of the gear leg >>touch. This should have the >>small steel ring inside the bottom of the gear leg. Then remove the nut and >>washers, remove the >>nose wheel and the two steel rings (which you no longer need), At this point >>the inner sleve >>may be sticking up out the top of the gear leg, if so, cut/file it off till >>it's nice and flush. >>put the whole thing back together but this time put the rubber o-ring on top >>of the shimmy plate, so >>when you slide the nose wheel back into the leg it will be inside the bottom >>of the gear leg (where the small steel ring was) >>then put the washers (new bigger ones from the kit) plus 4 of the old ones >>on the top with your Castelated Nut (the one with the slots cut in it) >>on and re-set the tension as per the manual >> >>Just so you know, My gear leg already had space for the o-ring in the >>bottom, so maybe you can just fit the o-ring. >> >>hope this helps you, sorry i dont have any pictures, I did it as part of the >>build and it took about 30 seconds >> >>regards >> >>craig >> >>-----Original Message----- >>From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com >>[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Herve >>Sent: Wednesday, 2 July 2008 6:32 PM >>To: europa-list@matronics.com >>Subject: Europa-List: mod 59 >> >> >> >>Hello >>I am trying to do mod 59 (nose wheel shimmy damper) and I am a little >>confuse as to what is what and goes where.Has anyone got some >>pictures to explain? >>G.CHET europa xs turbo >>Herve >> >> >> >> >> >>Checked by AVG. >>7:23 PM >> >>Checked by AVG. >>7:23 PM >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >>-- >>Checked by AVG. >>7/1/2008 7:23 PM ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 04:16:01 AM PST US From: Karl Heindl Subject: RE: Europa-List: Coolant Temps. Graham=2C What is the implication of using silicone hoses which I and others have ins talled ? I had a couple of small leaks where I refitted Rotax spring clamps (in ground tests). And should there not be a mandatory mod from Europa to change all worm clamps ? The Skydrive kit is installed on many Europas and it has about 8 clamps. Then there are another two clamps for the temperatur e sensor. What type of clamps are used on automobiles ? I am going to investigate the new clamps pointed out by Michael. Karl
> Date: Thu=2C 3 Jul 2008 10:24:03 +0100> From: grahamsingleton@btinternet.com> To: europa-list@matronics.com> Subject: Re Singleton > > Karl Heindl wrote:> > Graham =2C> > > > You have a point there=2C but don't all Europa Rotaxes have worm clamps > > for the thick hoses from the radiator=2C plus a few more when t he > > Skydrive kit is installed ?> > > > Karl> Karl> you are right but all the hoses Rotax fit on the engine now have clips. > It was a Europa factor y molded hose that let go on me. Those hoses are > fiber reinforced elastom > > > ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 04:45:27 AM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Rotax fly in & factory tour From: "conrad" Just received a notice about a Rotax fly in and factory tour. Any one wishing to take the opportunity to see where their engines are made need to register on the official web site. The airfield at Wels is about a 20min drive from the Rotax factory www.rotaxflyin.at Conrad www.conairsports.co.uk Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=191038#191038 ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 06:54:30 AM PST US From: Graham Singleton Subject: Re: Europa-List: Coolant Temps. Karl could be that the clip is the wrong size for the hose. You maybe should ask the hose supplier what size to use? Similarly if you want to use spring clips you need to find out what size the hose needs. There probably should be a mod but don't hold your breath ;-) Graham Karl Heindl wrote: > Graham, > > What is the implication of using silicone hoses which I and others > have installed ? I had a couple of small leaks where I refitted Rotax > spring clamps (in ground tests). And should there not be a mandatory > mod from Europa to change all worm clamps ? The Skydrive kit is > installed on many Europas and it has about 8 clamps. Then there are > another two clamps for the temperature sensor. > What type of clamps are used on automobiles ? > I am going to investigate the new clamps pointed out by Michael. > Karl ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 07:17:33 AM PST US From: Rowland Carson Subject: Re: Europa-List: mono brake mounting At 2008-06-28 21:58 -0400 JohnDHeykoop@aol.com wrote: >There is a metal insert in the tunnel wall (the area you call the >"plain resin area"). The mounting holes need to go in this area, >parallel to the top of the tunnel as shown in the illustration John - thanks for your reply. The metal insert in my cockpit module must be a quite exotic alloy as I can see through it! That's why I said it was a "plain resin" area - obviously it has glass weave too. But now I'm wondering - is my cockpit module faulty? Can anyone else confirm that the brake master cylinder mounting area contains a metal insert as John found on his? regards Rowland -- | Rowland Carson ... that's Rowland with a 'w' ... | http://home.clara.net/rowil/ ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 07:40:52 AM PST US From: Jeff B Subject: Re: Europa-List: A question on composits Paul, Nothing, yet, but I'm leaning toward something along the lines of the Lanceair 235. There's a cover shot of one in the July '08 Kitplanes. The new cowl would, of course, be minus the carb intake underneath. This is probably going to be a lengthy project, as I want to fly several variations to compare the results. When it's finished, the design will certainly be offered to the list. Jeff - Baby Blue Paul McAllister wrote: > > Hi Jeff, > > Would you happen to have any photographs of the cowl design that your > trying to build ? > > Thanks, Paul > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > Checked by AVG. ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 08:18:49 AM PST US From: Robert Borger Subject: Re: Europa-List: mono brake mounting Rowland, I can confirm that my cockpit module had an aluminum plate for the brake master cylinder mount molded into the cockpit module. If you will go to my build web site ( http://www.europaowners.org/N914XL/ ), album Year #2, Q3 2004. Go down the page to the pic "Brake master cylinder bolted in place." The view is from the bottom of the cockpit module. You can plainly see the aluminum plate bonded into the cockpit module. You should contact the factory to see if your CM is correct or defective. If your CM has been bonded in place already, it may be that you just need to bond the appropriate chunk of aluminum to the back side with Araldite and cover with a couple plys of BID. Or, perhaps take the appropriate chunk of aluminum, use it as a template to mark the area on the inside of the CM where it will reside. Cut out the inner layer of BID and remove the layer of foam. Bond the chunk of aluminum in place with Araldite, using Araldite/FLOX to fill any cracks. If necessary, make a FLOX fillet around to provide a transition to the inner skin, and lay up at least two layers of BID on the back side, maybe more. Other folks suggestions as to the number of layups would be welcome. Probably need to overlap the inner skin by at least 1 inch (2.5 cm). I might go 2 inches (5 cm). Of course, be sure to scuff sand every bonding surface, aluminum and fiberglass. Hope this helps. Good building and great flying, Bob Borger Cell: 817-992-1117 (U.S.A access codes) On Thursday, July 03, 2008, at 09:30AM, "Rowland Carson" wrote: > >At 2008-06-28 21:58 -0400 JohnDHeykoop@aol.com wrote: > >>There is a metal insert in the tunnel wall (the area you call the >>"plain resin area"). The mounting holes need to go in this area, >>parallel to the top of the tunnel as shown in the illustration > >John - thanks for your reply. > >The metal insert in my cockpit module must be a quite exotic alloy as >I can see through it! That's why I said it was a "plain resin" area - >obviously it has glass weave too. > >But now I'm wondering - is my cockpit module faulty? Can anyone else >confirm that the brake master cylinder mounting area contains a metal >insert as John found on his? > >regards > >Rowland >-- >| Rowland Carson ... that's Rowland with a 'w' ... >| http://home.clara.net/rowil/ > > ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 11:51:32 AM PST US From: david miller Subject: Europa-List: cowlings Chris Staines made a fairly easy amendment to his lower cowling, by cutting a slit at the bottom and folding it up. Then cutting out a wedge and re-glassing, also moved the inlet back to just in front of the rad. He indicated it may have added a knot or two to the cruise, did not affect cooling. Photo attached ( I hope). Dave C-FBZI, finally about to re-fit my Woodcomp after repair IMG_0211.JPG ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 01:37:53 PM PST US From: JEFF ROBERTS Subject: Europa-List: Cooling & Cowling Since I struggled with the cooling on my 912-S Tri gear for so very long I thought I'd throw my thoughts into this subject. I have found the air cooling of the fins to be inadequate. If you look at the round inlets in relation to where the top of the engine sits you will find they are too low and too outside. After trying everything to get mine to cool on the ground and in the climb I finally got mad and took a drummel tool to the inlets and opened them up a bit to the top and in towards the spinner. For now... she looks a little sad but my CHT's instantly dropped about 10 to 15 degrees. I'm going to work on the inside of these holes next to provide an expanding 1" wall to eliminate any turbulence of the incoming air flow. Believe me I'v tried everything everyone has mentioned here from closing up all the gaps around the rad to closing the gills. Nothing did more for taxi and climb cooling than raising these holes. If you look at all the LSA's with rotax engines the intakes are higher so the air can get to the top of the engine before it's pulled or pushed down through the fins. The real solution would be for rotax to start selling plenums like the Jab's then route the hoses to fit over them. Regards, Jeff R. A258 - N128LJ / Gold Rush 130 hours and enjoying every flight more. PS. Jeff of Baby blue... If your making a mold that turns out successfully try and saving it. I would love a better designed cowl. ;0) ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 01:52:37 PM PST US From: Jeff B Subject: Re: Europa-List: Cooling & Cowling Jeff, Should I end up with a cowl that pleases me, esthetically and does the job on cooling and air speed, I will use it as a plug and build a mold for it. I'm sure you could twist my arm for use of the mold... :) Jeff - Baby Blue JEFF ROBERTS wrote: > Since I struggled with the cooling on my 912-S Tri gear for so very long > I thought I'd throw my thoughts into this subject. I have found the air > cooling of the fins to be inadequate. If you look at the round inlets in > relation to where the top of the engine sits you will find they are too > low and too outside. After trying everything to get mine to cool on the > ground and in the climb I finally got mad and took a drummel tool to the > inlets and opened them up a bit to the top and in towards the spinner. > For now... she looks a little sad but my CHT's instantly dropped about > 10 to 15 degrees. I'm going to work on the inside of these holes next to > provide an expanding 1" wall to eliminate any turbulence of the incoming > air flow. > Believe me I'v tried everything everyone has mentioned here from closing > up all the gaps around the rad to closing the gills. Nothing did more > for taxi and climb cooling than raising these holes. If you look at all > the LSA's with rotax engines the intakes are higher so the air can get > to the top of the engine before it's pulled or pushed down through the > fins. The real solution would be for rotax to start selling plenums like > the Jab's then route the hoses to fit over them. > > > Regards, > > Jeff R. > A258 - N128LJ / Gold Rush 130 hours and enjoying every flight more. > > > PS. Jeff of Baby blue... If your making a mold that turns out > successfully try and saving it. I would love a better designed cowl. ;0) > size=2 color="#000000" face="courier new,courier"> > href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List > href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com > href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contribution > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > Checked by AVG. ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 02:37:56 PM PST US From: "karelvranken" Subject: Re: Europa-List: A question on composits Jeff, In attachment my concept of cowling and inner radiator duct. Best regards, Karel Vranken ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jeff B" Sent: Monday, July 03, 2000 4:37 PM Subject: Re: Europa-List: A question on composits > > Paul, > > Nothing, yet, but I'm leaning toward something along the lines of the > Lanceair 235. There's a cover shot of one in the July '08 Kitplanes. The > new cowl would, of course, be minus the carb intake underneath. This is > probably going to be a lengthy project, as I want to fly several > variations to compare the results. When it's finished, the design will > certainly be offered to the list. > > Jeff - Baby Blue > > Paul McAllister wrote: >> >> >> Hi Jeff, >> >> Would you happen to have any photographs of the cowl design that your >> trying to build ? >> >> Thanks, Paul >> >> >> >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> >> >> Checked by AVG. > > > ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 02:37:56 PM PST US From: "karelvranken" Subject: Re: Europa-List: mono brake mounting Rowland, As you remember perhaps we were in Kirbymoorside the same day to pick up the first stage of our millenium deal. So I think we had similar parts. Also for the cockpit module we have about the same construction. Indeed the reinforced place for the attachment of the brake cylinder is clear glassed as you can see in the pictures attached. The first one is looking as if there is metal inside. But when you put the light underneath then it becomes clear. Note the different position of my brake cylinder and different throttle. Best regards Karel Vranken ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rowland Carson" Sent: Thursday, July 03, 2008 4:05 PM Subject: Re: Europa-List: mono brake mounting > > > At 2008-06-28 21:58 -0400 JohnDHeykoop@aol.com wrote: > >>There is a metal insert in the tunnel wall (the area you call the "plain >>resin area"). The mounting holes need to go in this area, parallel to the >>top of the tunnel as shown in the illustration > > John - thanks for your reply. > > The metal insert in my cockpit module must be a quite exotic alloy as I > can see through it! That's why I said it was a "plain resin" area - > obviously it has glass weave too. > > But now I'm wondering - is my cockpit module faulty? Can anyone else > confirm that the brake master cylinder mounting area contains a metal > insert as John found on his? > > regards > > Rowland > -- > > > ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 02:37:57 PM PST US From: "karelvranken" Subject: Re: Europa-List: Gas Strut door location lug. Bob, In attachment two pics of a modified Ted Gladstone concept. I reinforced the fuselage to accept the harness belts. Best regards, Karel Vranken. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robert C Harrison" Sent: Tuesday, July 01, 2008 7:31 AM Subject: Europa-List: Gas Strut door location lug. > Hi! All > A very inconsiderate flyer at the Stauning Rally and blipped his throttle > spinning round to park whilst in front of G-PTAG with the doors open and > pulled the starboard side gas strut lug off/out of the door. > I recall some different location positions for the lugs on more recent > "ships" can anyone point me in that direction please? > It seems somewhat silly to not use a more up dated position at this point. > Regards > Bob Harrison. G-PTAG > ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 02:53:48 PM PST US From: "Brian Davies" Subject: RE: Europa-List: Cooling & Cowling Jeff, Do you have the Rotax fibre glass cooling cowl fitted to your engine? This picks up the air from the Stbd front inlet and forces it down through the fins. Brian Davies G-DDBD 912S Trigear _____ From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of JEFF ROBERTS Sent: 03 July 2008 21:34 Subject: Europa-List: Cooling & Cowling Since I struggled with the cooling on my 912-S Tri gear for so very long I thought I'd throw my thoughts into this subject. I have found the air cooling of the fins to be inadequate. If you look at the round inlets in relation to where the top of the engine sits you will find they are too low and too outside. After trying everything to get mine to cool on the ground and in the climb I finally got mad and took a drummel tool to the inlets and opened them up a bit to the top and in towards the spinner. For now... she looks a little sad but my CHT's instantly dropped about 10 to 15 degrees. I'm going to work on the inside of these holes next to provide an expanding 1" wall to eliminate any turbulence of the incoming air flow. Believe me I'v tried everything everyone has mentioned here from closing up all the gaps around the rad to closing the gills. Nothing did more for taxi and climb cooling than raising these holes. If you look at all the LSA's with rotax engines the intakes are higher so the air can get to the top of the engine before it's pulled or pushed down through the fins. The real solution would be for rotax to start selling plenums like the Jab's then route the hoses to fit over them. Regards, Jeff R. A258 - N128LJ / Gold Rush 130 hours and enjoying every flight more. PS. Jeff of Baby blue... If your making a mold that turns out successfully try and saving it. I would love a better designed cowl. ;0) Checked by AVG. 19:02 ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 03:14:15 PM PST US From: Graham Singleton Subject: Re: Europa-List: Cooling & Cowling Jeff I fiddled with Jab 6 baffles and plenums for weeks. Finally Tony Higgins told us to put a box below the air filter plenum to give non curving airflow into the mouth of the carburetter. That cured the very uneven CHTs instantly. It seems all the cooling problems were caused by uneven mixture distribution from the single carb on the Jab. Tony never says anything on here unfortunately. Graham JEFF ROBERTS wrote: > Since I struggled with the cooling on my 912-S Tri gear for so very > long I thought I'd throw my thoughts into this subject. I have found > the air cooling of the fins to be inadequate. If you look at the round > inlets in relation to where the top of the engine sits you will find > they are too low and too outside. After trying everything to get mine > to cool on the ground and in the climb I finally got mad and took a > drummel tool to the inlets and opened them up a bit to the top and in > towards the spinner. For now... she looks a little sad but my CHT's > instantly dropped about 10 to 15 degrees. I'm going to work on the > inside of these holes next to provide an expanding 1" wall to > eliminate any turbulence of the incoming air flow. > Believe me I'v tried everything everyone has mentioned here from > closing up all the gaps around the rad to closing the gills. Nothing > did more for taxi and climb cooling than raising these holes. If you > look at all the LSA's with rotax engines the intakes are higher so the > air can get to the top of the engine before it's pulled or pushed down > through the fins. The real solution would be for rotax to start > selling plenums like the Jab's then route the hoses to fit over them. > > > Regards, > > Jeff R. > A258 - N128LJ / Gold Rush 130 hours and enjoying every flight more. ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 03:36:27 PM PST US From: "karelvranken" Subject: Re: Europa-List: Cooling & Cowling Jeff, If you are a good eater you need a good bowel movement. You may create openings in the cowling for air entree, if you don't create an excit the air will stay immobile under the cowling. For instance: if you enlarge the forward round inlets as I did then the surface for air intake enlarges by the square diameter. Second thing to do like I did: In the original cowling concept I felt some warm air entering trough the wheel well and the landing gear arm sleeve. After my modification I can put the Jeppensen airfield leaves on the sleeve and they stay fixed because there is a suction outwards now. I also measured under cowling temperatures and after my mods they are the same as outside temperatures + - 5=B0C. Terry Seaver experimented also in this matter and finaly cut down the end of the inner aluminium duct. I wish you courage and fun during your experiment. Best regards, Karel Vranken, F-PKRL actually 160 hours. 912 ULS Airmaster CSU ----- Original Message ----- From: JEFF ROBERTS To: europa-list@matronics.com Sent: Thursday, July 03, 2008 10:34 PM Subject: Europa-List: Cooling & Cowling Since I struggled with the cooling on my 912-S Tri gear for so very long I thought I'd throw my thoughts into this subject. I have found the air cooling of the fins to be inadequate. If you look at the round inlets in relation to where the top of the engine sits you will find they are too low and too outside. After trying everything to get mine to cool on the ground and in the climb I finally got mad and took a drummel tool to the inlets and opened them up a bit to the top and in towards the spinner. For now... she looks a little sad but my CHT's instantly dropped about 10 to 15 degrees. I'm going to work on the inside of these holes next to provide an expanding 1" wall to eliminate any turbulence of the incoming air flow. Believe me I'v tried everything everyone has mentioned here from closing up all the gaps around the rad to closing the gills. Nothing did more for taxi and climb cooling than raising these holes. If you look at all the LSA's with rotax engines the intakes are higher so the air can get to the top of the engine before it's pulled or pushed down through the fins. The real solution would be for rotax to start selling plenums like the Jab's then route the hoses to fit over them. Regards, Jeff R. A258 - N128LJ / Gold Rush 130 hours and enjoying every flight more. PS. Jeff of Baby blue... If your making a mold that turns out successfully try and saving it. I would love a better designed cowl. ;0) http://forums.matronics.com ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 03:47:42 PM PST US From: "Paul McAllister" Subject: Re: Europa-List: A question on composits Hi Karel, Nice looking modification. Do you have the radiators directly behind each other or to you have the rear one dropped down by 40 mm ? Paul On Thu, Jul 3, 2008 at 4:28 PM, karelvranken wrote: > Jeff, > In attachment my concept of cowling and inner radiator duct. > Best regards, > Karel Vranken > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jeff B" > To: > Sent: Monday, July 03, 2000 4:37 PM > Subject: Re: Europa-List: A question on composits > > >> >> Paul, >> >> Nothing, yet, but I'm leaning toward something along the lines of the >> Lanceair 235. There's a cover shot of one in the July '08 Kitplanes. The >> new cowl would, of course, be minus the carb intake underneath. This is >> probably going to be a lengthy project, as I want to fly several variations >> to compare the results. When it's finished, the design will certainly be >> offered to the list. >> >> Jeff - Baby Blue >> >> Paul McAllister wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> Hi Jeff, >>> >>> Would you happen to have any photographs of the cowl design that your >>> trying to build ? >>> >>> Thanks, Paul >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>> >>> >>> Checked by AVG. >> >> >> >> >> > ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 03:51:02 PM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Where to get the Rotax 914 TLR Software? From: "darinh" Does anyone know if there is a downloadable version of the Turbo and TCU monitoring software? If not, where can I buy it or get a copy? The manual states it comes on a 3.5" floppy...um, anyone remember what floppy is! [Wink] It has got to be a download somewhere. -------- Darin Hawkes Series 7 (Final Assembly) 914 Turbo Kaysville, Utah Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=191160#191160 ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 04:03:11 PM PST US From: William Harrison Subject: Europa-List: Fwd: Carb Heat on Rotax engines: LAA Policy See below. So now we know... Begin forwarded message: > From: "engineering" > Date: 3 July 2008 17:07:32 BDT > To: > Cc: "Gretta Medley" > Subject: RE: Carb Heat on Rotax engines: Mod application 10427; FAO > Andy Draper/Francis Donaldson > > Dear Willie, > > The Skydrive carb heat kit may be fitted to a Rotax 900 series engine > without reference to LAA Engineering. The installation must be > checked > and approved by an LAA inspector though. > > With Ian Rickard's valued assistance, I am in the throes of getting > this > mod on the list of Standard Mods list that is shown on the web site. > > Best regards > Andy Draper > Design Engineer > Light Aircraft Association > > ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 04:13:41 PM PST US From: Jeff B Subject: Re: Europa-List: A question on composits Karel, Great stuff! Thanks... Jeff - Baby Blue karelvranken wrote: > Jeff, > In attachment my concept of cowling and inner radiator duct. > Best regards, > Karel Vranken > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jeff B" > To: > Sent: Monday, July 03, 2000 4:37 PM > Subject: Re: Europa-List: A question on composits > > >> >> Paul, >> >> Nothing, yet, but I'm leaning toward something along the lines of the >> Lanceair 235. There's a cover shot of one in the July '08 Kitplanes. >> The new cowl would, of course, be minus the carb intake underneath. >> This is probably going to be a lengthy project, as I want to fly >> several variations to compare the results. When it's finished, the >> design will certainly be offered to the list. >> >> Jeff - Baby Blue >> >> Paul McAllister wrote: >>> >>> >>> Hi Jeff, >>> >>> Would you happen to have any photographs of the cowl design that your >>> trying to build ? >>> >>> Thanks, Paul >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>> >>> >>> Checked by AVG. >> >> >> >> >> > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > Checked by AVG. ________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________ Time: 04:27:51 PM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Re: Where to get the Rotax 914 TLR Software? From: "conrad" The software is down loadable from the Rotax aircraft engines web site. www.rotax-aircraft-engines.com Go to the download section, in the drop down table select engine type "914". Look for a file called TLR***. You will need to know which TCU you have to get the correct software. If you can give me the TCU part number I should be able to tell you which version of software you need. Conrad Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=191168#191168 ________________________________ Message 25 ____________________________________ Time: 04:36:40 PM PST US From: "karelvranken" Subject: Re: Europa-List: A question on composits Paul, I didn't use the original cubic radiator for the coolant. The surface is greater and only 1,5" thick with the same contents. I didn't need to lower the oil radiator. Using the Evans coolant I notice normally in cruise 100C for oil and 110C for coolant. In hot summer like last year in Italy by 41C on the tarmac the temperatures rose with 10C. Oil is changed every 50 hours and I use actually Shell Advance 4. Next I will change to the Aeroshell Sport plus. I always use Mogas 98 without alcohol. Best regards, Karel Vranken, F-PKRL 912 ULS Airmaster CSU. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Paul McAllister" Sent: Friday, July 04, 2008 12:44 AM Subject: Re: Europa-List: A question on composits > > > Hi Karel, > > Nice looking modification. Do you have the radiators directly behind > each other or to you have the rear one dropped down by 40 mm ? > > Paul > > On Thu, Jul 3, 2008 at 4:28 PM, karelvranken > wrote: >> Jeff, >> In attachment my concept of cowling and inner radiator duct. >> Best regards, >> Karel Vranken >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jeff B" >> To: >> Sent: Monday, July 03, 2000 4:37 PM >> Subject: Re: Europa-List: A question on composits >> >> >>> >>> Paul, >>> >>> Nothing, yet, but I'm leaning toward something along the lines of the >>> Lanceair 235. There's a cover shot of one in the July '08 Kitplanes. >>> The >>> new cowl would, of course, be minus the carb intake underneath. This is >>> probably going to be a lengthy project, as I want to fly several >>> variations >>> to compare the results. When it's finished, the design will certainly >>> be >>> offered to the list. >>> >>> Jeff - Baby Blue >>> >>> Paul McAllister wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Hi Jeff, >>>> >>>> Would you happen to have any photographs of the cowl design that your >>>> trying to build ? >>>> >>>> Thanks, Paul >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>>> >>>> >>>> Checked by AVG. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> > > > ________________________________ Message 26 ____________________________________ Time: 04:37:50 PM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Re: Where to get the Rotax 914 TLR Software? From: "darinh" Conrad, Thanks, I found what I need. -------- Darin Hawkes Series 7 (Final Assembly) 914 Turbo Kaysville, Utah Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=191171#191171 ________________________________ Message 27 ____________________________________ Time: 05:07:49 PM PST US From: JEFF ROBERTS Subject: Re: Europa-List: Cooling & Cowling Brian, When I bought my kit from Florida in 2002 I was told I didn't need it. Most people then didn't do the third opening. If I had to do it over I would have not listened to them but hind sight? Jeff R. A258 - N128LJ / Gold Rush 125 hours and climbing slowly. On Jul 3, 2008, at 4:50 PM, Brian Davies wrote: > Jeff, > > Do you have the Rotax fibre glass cooling cowl fitted to your engine? > This picks up the air from the Stbd front inlet and forces it down > through the fins. > > Brian Davies > G-DDBD 912S Trigear > > From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of JEFF > ROBERTS > Sent: 03 July 2008 21:34 > To: europa-list@matronics.com > Subject: Europa-List: Cooling & Cowling > > Since I struggled with the cooling on my 912-S Tri gear for so very > long I thought I'd throw my thoughts into this subject. I have found > the air cooling of the fins to be inadequate. If you look at the round > inlets in relation to where the top of the engine sits you will find > they are too low and too outside. After trying everything to get mine > to cool on the ground and in the climb I finally got mad and took a > drummel tool to the inlets and opened them up a bit to the top and in > towards the spinner. For now... she looks a little sad but my CHT's > instantly dropped about 10 to 15 degrees. I'm going to work on the > inside of these holes next to provide an expanding 1" wall to > eliminate any turbulence of the incoming air flow. > Believe me I'v tried everything everyone has mentioned here from > closing up all the gaps around the rad to closing the gills. Nothing > did more for taxi and climb cooling than raising these holes. If you > look at all the LSA's with rotax engines the intakes are higher so the > air can get to the top of the engine before it's pulled or pushed down > through the fins. The real solution would be for rotax to start > selling plenums like the Jab's then route the hoses to fit over them. > > > Regards, > > Jeff R. > A258 - N128LJ / Gold Rush 130 hours and enjoying every flight more. > > > PS. Jeff of Baby blue... If your making a mold that turns out > successfully try and saving it. I would love a better designed cowl. > ;0) ________________________________ Message 28 ____________________________________ Time: 10:16:08 PM PST US Subject: Re: Europa-List: A question on composits From: Fred Klein On Wednesday, Jul 2, 2008, at 17:38 US/Pacific, Rman wrote: > I've successfully made a mold from my current cowl, and want to make > a new cowl. One that I can cut up and modify. My question is, what > is the best cloth and resin to use to build the cowl? Any ideas on > what is used in the stock Europa cowl and how many layers of cloth are > used? Jeff...great idea... If memory serves, I seem to recall reading that the stock cowl is made of FG and vinyl-ester resin; heat resistance and cure time may be the reasons, but by all means get more info from an authoritative source. I do know that Alex Bowman used vinyl-ester resin on his custom cowl, but I'm not sure of the reasoning behind the decision to use it. If you do make up a production mold, my local composite guru recommends "molding cloth" which is a fairly heavy tight weave; for my special wingroot fairing/fillet molds, I've used four layers of Acft Spruce P/N 7781-50...it's a bitch to wet out w/ Aeropoxy and I've had to really work at getting out the air bubbles, but the surface is pretty smooth when cured. Since the mold is long and has no tight radii, I've had to add an armature of triangulated tongue depressor sticks to maintain the exact desired shape, but hey, with no real experience behind me, I'm learning as I go. > I've just got this nagging idea, in my head that a well designed cowl > will improve cooling, air speed, weight and appearance. Am I wrong?: > :) Though I'm not sure it's fair to say that Baby Blue needs a nose job, I also seem to recall comments on this forum to the effect that the stock XS cowl was designed under some time/deadline pressure and that the results were less than optimum. IMHO...and it's just opinion...cooling drag may be higher than need be...and the aesthetics of the radiator inlet can be much improved. I've always admired the Suncoast/Jab cowling on John Lawton's ship with its Mooney/Lancair-style inlets, and I like Karel's modifications as well. Go for it Jeff, Fred -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message europa-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Europa-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/europa-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/europa-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.