---------------------------------------------------------- Europa-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Tue 08/05/08: 25 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 01:02 AM - Re: Safety matters including stall and AOA warning units (Mark Burton) 2. 01:22 AM - Re: Maximum flap extension? (David Joyce) 3. 02:01 AM - Re: Ducatti Rectifier/Regulator (Bryan Allsop) 4. 02:07 AM - Re: Maximum flap extension? (G-IANI) 5. 02:07 AM - Re: Re: Safety matters including stall and AOA warning units (Graham Singleton) 6. 02:28 AM - Re: Maximum flap extension? (Graham Singleton) 7. 02:47 AM - Re: Safety matters including stall and AOA warning units (Mark Burton) 8. 05:24 AM - Europa project for sale (bill stevenson) 9. 05:48 AM - Re: Spins (TELEDYNMCS@aol.com) 10. 06:03 AM - Re: Safety matters including stall and AOA warning units (CHUCK RHOADS) 11. 06:19 AM - =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Re=3A_Europa-List=3A_Re=3A_Spins? (Carl Pattinson) 12. 06:22 AM - Re: Re: Spins (William Daniell) 13. 09:34 AM - Redux please (William Daniell) 14. 09:48 AM - Re: Re: Spins () 15. 11:00 AM - Re: Re: Spins (William Daniell) 16. 11:30 AM - Re: Re: Spins (DuaneFamly@aol.com) 17. 11:37 AM - Re: Re: Safety matters including stall and AOA warning units (david miller) 18. 11:52 AM - Re: Maximum flap extension? (Duncan & Ami McFadyean) 19. 12:00 PM - Re: Ducatti Rectifier/Regulator (Duncan & Ami McFadyean) 20. 12:20 PM - Re: Ducatti Rectifier/Regulator (Bill Henderson) 21. 12:23 PM - Bose X Aviation Headset For Sale (Geico266) 22. 01:51 PM - Re: Re: Safety matters including stall and AOA warning units (Robert C Harrison) 23. 01:51 PM - Re: Ducatti Rectifier/Regulator (josok) 24. 03:38 PM - Re: Ducatti Rectifier/Regulator (GTH) 25. 04:08 PM - Re: Ducatti Rectifier/Regulator (Graham Singleton) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 01:02:59 AM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Re: Safety matters including stall and AOA warning units From: "Mark Burton" Folks, Although it is neither an AOA system or a stall warner, my SmartASS unit (www.smartavionics.com) will help the pilot to maintain a safe margin of speed above the stall on approach. I sincerely believe that if such a system had been in use, it may well have been sufficient to prevent some of the stall/spin on approach accidents that have occurred. With a SmartASS working in "speed director mode", on approach, a calm (female) voice talks to you about your speed. If the speed is about right, she occasionally, says "speed good". If the speed is wrong, she says "slow" (or "fast"), if the speed is very wrong, she says "very slow", (or "very fast"). The voice is normally not very intrusive. If the speed is insanely slow/fast you get a loud DING as well. The unit is G sensitive so it factors the vertical acceleration into the speed calculation so if you are pulling G, it reports slowness even if the actual airspeed is correct. When you start using the speed director it seems quite fussy, always telling you to slow down or speed up. But once you have flown a few approaches with it and smoothed out your flying it becomes completely normal to have this little voice in the background making comments and because you are used to listening and reacting to what she tells you (makes a change, eh?), you follow the suggestions and so the approach speed is maintained close to the chosen value with very little effort on the part of the pilot. The point I am making is that once you are used to using it, taking in and reacting to the information presented by the SmartASS becomes so easy it's almost subliminal. From a flight safety point of view, I believe that is good because it frees up some valuable pilot mental effort and allows the pilot to concentrate more on lookout/spatial awareness. A stall warning system is better than nothing because you may hear it and react, but then again, (when the pressure is on) you may not. I have not used an AOA system but I would expect with a good HUD they would be OK when the pilot is looking straight ahead. The audio option could be useful as long as the brain hasn't switched off due to overload. Mark Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=196563#196563 ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 01:22:13 AM PST US From: "David Joyce" Subject: Re: Europa-List: Maximum flap extension? Frans, For the XS mono kit 402 the manual says the aim is to get the flaps to extend to 26-27 degrees. The supplied Europa final inspection sheet stipulates minimum 25 and max 27 degrees. Hope this helps. regards, David Joyce ----- Original Message ----- From: "Frans Veldman" Sent: Monday, August 04, 2008 11:22 PM Subject: Europa-List: Maximum flap extension? > > > Hi, > > I just finished installing the flap drive mechanism. My assumption was > that the strap on the outboard flap hinge determined the maximum flap > extension, i.e. 30 degrees. So when I installed the flap drive tube, I > made slots in the fuselage to accommodate the entire range for the flaps. > > To my dismay, after installation of the actuator, the flaps only use 2/3th > of the available range. The actuator reaches its limit far before the > strap of the outboard flap hinge reaches its limit. > > To be sure, I measured the difference in angle of the flap, between fully > retracted and "fully" extended. This is only 24 degrees! I confirmed this > with a digital gauge. Now I don't see how I can have done something wrong > with this, as long as you don't cut the hinges or reshape the flap drive > tube, you can't alter the maximum flap extension. > > As a further test, I temporarily attached the Europa flap indicator decal > on the flap and wing, and to my surprise this decal tells me that the > flap, fully extended, reaches 30 degrees... > > Several questions cross my mind: > > 1) Is my method to measure the maximum flap extension correct? Does "30 > degrees flaps" actually mean that the flaps have rotated 30 degrees? > > 2) Has anyone else actually measured the maximum flap extension? The build > manual doesn't tell you to measure it, but I suspect I'm not the only one > who wants to measure everything related to the controls. Or does everyone > else just trust the Europa flap indicator decal? > > 3) Why do I only get 24 degrees of flap extension? Maybe on the mono wheel > it is reaching 30 degrees, but on the tri-gear the electrical actuator is > just too short so it limits the flaps to 24 degrees? > > 4) If I drill another hole in the lugs of the flap drive tube, closer to > the rotation center (i.e. truncating the lever action of the lugs) I will > get more flap travel (at the cost of a slight reduction in flap drive > power). Anyone tried this? It seems to me a safe way to fix this problem. > > 5) What is actually the maximum flap extension one can obtain? I suspect > that it is possible to actually get more than 30 degrees if the full > travel allowed by the outboard hinges is fully used. (I'm flying a Cessna > with 40 degrees flaps, and I really love these 40 degrees flaps). Anyone > tried/implemented this? > > Thanks in advance for any answers. > > Frans > > > Visit - www.EuropaOwners.org > > > ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 02:01:12 AM PST US From: Bryan Allsop Subject: RE: Europa-List: Ducatti Rectifier/Regulator Hi Steve=2C My regulator is positioned on the firewall behind the plenum chamber=2C wit hout a heat sink. Last time he did an annual inspection Graham Singleton lo oked at it oddly=2C and asked if I had experienced problems with the regula tor. Apparently overheating had been common problem. I told him that I had not=2C and forgot about it. Only last week I had a radio failure in flight. I noticed that the voltage had dropped and returned to investigate. Sure enough=2C there was no voltag e from the Ducati regulator to the battery. After an hour or two trying to prove to myself that I did not need to buy a new regulator=2C I failed=2C a nd had to spend =A375 + del. to purchase a new one. Retrospectively=2C I can look back and recognise that the failure has been taking place intermittently for more than a year. I can recall odd times wh en the voltage had dropped=2C and I put it down to other things. More recen tly it has taken a little time for the voltage to come up to the charging l evel. It is a bit like old age=2C you begin to accept that visiting the bat hroom in the middle of the night is normal. My recent investigations illustrate that there is quite a history overheati ng problems with Ducati regulators. Hopefully the later models have been im proved. Certainly the back of my unit does not give a good heat sink area. Despite this=2C the regulator has been installed and working for over eight years. This all leads me to suggest that you would be well advised to position the regulator in a way which will minimise heating problems. A good heat sink would be an advantage. Hope this helps. Bryan > From: steven.pitt2@ntlworld.com> To: europa-list@matronics.com> Subject: Europa-List: Ducatti Rectifier/Regulator> Date: Sun=2C 3 Aug 2008 19:33:01 world.com>> > Dear All=2C> I hope I am not repeating a thread but I would a ppreciate input from the > forum on where builders have positioned their re gulators. My reason for > asking is that I may have an intermittent fault i n the electrical generation > system and having done some fault tracing wit h Conrad Beale and Skydrive it > is pointing to the rectifier and the possi bility that it has become 'cooked' > and thus developed the intermittent wo rkings.> My fitment is on the flat above the pilot's footwell=2C but the op inion > expressed so far is that there is not enough air circulation to kee p it > cool=2C especially after landing. I still have the side gills to the top > cowling.> Thanks in anticipation.> Steve Pitt> G-SMDH Trigear XS. > ====================> > > _________________________________________________________________ Get more from your digital life. Find out how. http://www.windowslive.com/default.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_Home2_082008 ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 02:07:41 AM PST US From: "G-IANI" Subject: RE: Europa-List: Maximum flap extension? As David says it should be 26-27 degrees. Mine ended up dead on 27. Ian Rickard G-IANI XS Trigear, 200 hours Europa Club Mods Rep (Trigear) e-mail mods@europaclub.org.uk or direct g-iani@ntlworld.com -----Original Message----- Frans, For the XS mono kit 402 the manual says the aim is to get the flaps to extend to 26-27 degrees. The supplied Europa final inspection sheet stipulates minimum 25 and max 27 degrees. Hope this helps. regards, David Joyce ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 02:07:55 AM PST US From: Graham Singleton Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re: Safety matters including stall and AOA warning units Mark (imho of course) If your SmartASS was couple to AoA it would be even better because it would keep you on the correct speed. AoA is predictive, ASI is "postdictive " if you see what I mean Graham Mark Burton wrote: > > Folks, > > Although it is neither an AOA system or a stall warner, my SmartASS unit (www.smartavionics.com) will help the > > The point I am making is that once you are used to using it, taking in and reacting to the information presented by the SmartASS becomes so easy it's almost subliminal. From a flight safety point of view, I believe that is good because it frees up some valuable pilot mental effort and allows the pilot to concentrate more on lookout/spatial awareness. > > Mark > > ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 02:28:50 AM PST US From: Graham Singleton Subject: Re: Europa-List: Maximum flap extension? Europa factory tried 30degrees on a mono wheel and found that the airplane would lift off too early, (ground effect) so you end up flying without aileron control. That's why 27 is considered the max deflection. Graham David Joyce wrote: > > > Frans, For the XS mono kit 402 the manual says the aim is to get the > flaps to extend to 26-27 degrees. The supplied Europa final inspection > sheet stipulates minimum 25 and max 27 degrees. Hope this helps. > regards, David Joyce > > >> >> >> Hi, >> >> I just finished installing the flap drive mechanism. My assumption >> was that the strap on the outboard flap hinge determined the maximum >> flap extension, i.e. 30 degrees. So when I installed the flap drive >> tube, I made slots in the fuselage to accommodate the entire range >> for the flaps. ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 02:47:39 AM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Re: Safety matters including stall and AOA warning units From: "Mark Burton" Hi Graham, >From what I read, good AOA information is the ultimate indicator of how the wing is doing with respect to airspeed/loading, etc. and, therefore, is the perfect source of information for not only stall warning but also maximising aircraft performance. The problem I have with existing AOA products is the user interface. I won't explain again my thoughts on that, I have expounded them enough already. As for your suggestion that ASI is "postdictive", I understand what you are saying but when you add G to the equation, you have a (near) instantaneous detection of gusts/hamfistedness, etc. The SmartASS (Mk2) is no slower to react than an AOA system. So, I am not going to make a AOA instrument because: a - I have no experience in that field. b - there is already enough AOA systems on the market and I couldn't hope to compete with those mature products (even though, I believe they all could be improved in terms of their UI). c - for approach stall/spin avoidance, the airspeed+G system provides adequate protection and doesn't require any extra hardware (no ports or vanes) apart from the SmartASS box itself. Cheers, Mark Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=196573#196573 ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 05:24:19 AM PST US From: "bill stevenson" Subject: Europa-List: Europa project for sale Hello, I have placed my Europa project up for sale: I currently have too many airplanes and projects. The kit has most glass work, especially the wings, completed in jigs at Flight Crafters in Zephyrhills, FL a company that has built many Europas. The kit is an early one, but has current XS features incorporated. Talk to Bob Berube at Flight Crafters, bberube@tampabay.rr.com or 813.779.1156. Please see ad in Barnstormers.com under Europa in the Experimental section. I estimate that the project is about 49% completed. Price is $19,950. Bill Stevenson ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 05:48:32 AM PST US From: TELEDYNMCS@aol.com Subject: Europa-List: Re: Spins In a message dated 8/5/2008 3:01:53 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, europa-list@matronics.com writes: Secondly - Stall and spin accidents on approach. Low down and in the pattern, these are often fatal. Hi John and All, Adding to John's excellent commentary, over the years while I was operating a glider tow club I took dozens and dozens of folks for glider rides. Many of these folks were power only pilots and had never been in a glider before. Personally, I like doing spins in gliders. Spins are a great way to get down at the end of the day in a glider. Very often when doing rides I would spin down if I had another pilot on board. Of course, I always ask if they want to do a spin before I "show them their toes." One of the things I've noticed when I've done spins with power only pilots, and it's been almost universal, is power only pilots, unless they have military training, seem to genuinely fear spins. I can see this fear from the back seat when the pilot/passenger tightly grips hand holds in the cockpit, or if they get really quiet just as you enter the spin. This is not a good thing because if you fear something it usually means that you don't understand it. I believe the root of this fear is because spins, generally speaking, are not taught in power planes and most pilots rarely, if ever, practice spins. Student pilots are told what a spin is, how to recover, then are usually told to avoid them. Stall/spin recovery is taught in gliders, though. Spin training is also available in power planes. I would suggest that anyone who is uncertain of, or anyone who has genuine fear of spins, go take spin training and rid yourself of that fear. Most glider schools offer spin training and most aerobatic flight instructors also offer spin training. There are many bad habits pilots have in regard to spins, particularly in terms of spin recovery. These bad habits, like trying to stop the spin by applying opposite aileron, will make a bad situation much worse when close to the ground. Pilots can avoid these bad habits with the proper spin training. Everyone should learn the correct spin entry and recovery techniques so well that they become second nature. It's just an added arrow in your quiver of piloting skills and a skill that might one day save your life. Much like aerobatics, spins shouldn't be feared, unless, of course, you are too close to the ground to recover. Like aerobatics and unusual attitude recovery training, proper spin training will assist you in not ever putting yourself into a position where a spin will kill you. That's my 2 cents. Regards, John Lawton Whitwell, TN (TN89) N245E - Flying **************Looking for a car that's sporty, fun and fits in your budget? Read reviews on AOL Autos. (http://autos.aol.com/cars-BMW-128-2008/expert-review?ncid=aolaut00050000000017 ) ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 06:03:40 AM PST US From: CHUCK RHOADS Subject: Re: Europa-List: Safety matters including stall and AOA warning units =0A-__________________________________________________________=0AChuck Rh oads=0Acfrhoads@yahoo.com=0A322 Links Dr.=0ASimpsonville, KY 40067=0A(502) 410-1357=0A=0A=0A=0A----- Original Message ----=0AFrom: "DuaneFamly@aol.com " =0ATo: europa-list@matronics.com=0ASent: Monday, Augu st 4, 2008 10:49:24 PM=0ASubject: Re: Europa-List: Safety matters including stall and AOA warning units=0A=0AGood morning John,=0A-=0AIf you happen to have a pix of your mirror setup I would be very interested. I have mount ed my AOA LED display on the instrument panel as high and close to center a s possible, but have been giving thought as to a poor man's HUD by mounting it from inside the IM and have it reflect on the windshield. But I am not sure if it's bright enough for this task, so a properly located mirror may be much better.=0A-=0AThanks in advance. =0A-=0AMike Duane A207A=0ARedd ing, California=0AXS Conventional Gear=0AJabiru 3300A=0ASensenich R64Z N=0A Ground Adjustable Prop=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A________________________________=0ALoo king for a car that's sporty, fun and fits in your budget? Read reviews on ===========0A=0A=0A ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 06:19:30 AM PST US From: "Carl Pattinson" Subject: Europa-List: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Re=3A_Europa-List=3A_Re=3A_Spins? X-mailer: iAVMailScanner 1.5.4.5 It is worth noting that many Europas in the stall (especially flaps down) will drop a wing. Some power pilots try to correct this with aileron which stalls the wing further to a point where a spin is inevitable. Thereafter if the correct recovery action (ie: full opposite rudder) isnt taken the aircraft may enter into a spiral dive. My initial flying was in gliders where spin training was mandatory, so it never really bothered me. When I did my PPL my instructor mentioned that spin training wasnt compulsory but never the less, demonstrated several spins (in a Tomahawk !!!) and then a spiral dive to show me the difference. Carl Pattinson G-LABS I ----- Original Message ----- From: TELEDYNMCS@aol.com To: europa-list@matronics.com Sent: Tuesday, August 05, 2008 1:45 PM Subject: Europa-List: Re: Spins In a message dated 8/5/2008 3:01:53 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, europa-list@matronics.com writes: Secondly - Stall and spin accidents on approach. Low down and in the pattern, these are often fatal. Hi John and All, Adding to John's excellent commentary, over the years while I was operating a glider tow club I took dozens and dozens of folks for glider rides. Many of these folks were power only pilots and had never been in a glider before. Personally, I like doing spins in gliders. Spins are a great way to get down at the end of the day in a glider. Very often when doing rides I would spin down if I had another pilot on board. Of course, I always ask if they want to do a spin before I "show them their toes." One of the things I've noticed when I've done spins with power only pilots, and it's been almost universal, is power only pilots, unless they have military training, seem to genuinely fear spins. I can see this fear from the back seat when the pilot/passenger tightly grips hand holds in the cockpit, or if they get really quiet just as you enter the spin. This is not a good thing because if you fear something it usually means that you don't understand it. I believe the root of this fear is because spins, generally speaking, are not taught in power planes and most pilots rarely, if ever, practice spins. Student pilots are told what a spin is, how to recover, then are usually told to avoid them. Stall/spin recovery is taught in gliders, though. Spin training is also available in power planes. I would suggest that anyone who is uncertain of, or anyone who has genuine fear of spins, go take spin training and rid yourself of that fear. Most glider schools offer spin training and most aerobatic flight instructors also offer spin training. There are many bad habits pilots have in regard to spins, particularly in terms of spin recovery. These bad habits, like trying to stop the spin by applying opposite aileron, will make a bad situation much worse when close to the ground. Pilots can avoid these bad habits with the proper spin training. Everyone should learn the correct spin entry and recovery techniques so well that they become second nature. It's just an added arrow in your quiver of piloting skills and a skill that might one day save your life. Much like aerobatics, spins shouldn't be feared, unless, of course, you are too close to the ground to recover. Like aerobatics and unusual attitude recovery training, proper spin training will assist you in not ever putting yourself into a position where a spin will kill you. That's my 2 cents. Regards, John Lawton Whitwell, TN (TN89) N245E - Flying ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Looking for a car that's sporty, fun and fits in your budget? Read reviews on AOL Autos. ========= ========= ========= ========= ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ No viruses found in this incoming message Scanned by iolo AntiVirus 1.5.4.5 http://www.iolo.com _______________________________________ No viruses found in this outgoing message Scanned by iolo AntiVirus 1.5.4.5 http://www.iolo.com ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 06:22:01 AM PST US From: "William Daniell" Subject: RE: Europa-List: Re: Spins I would thoroughly concur. I did an =93unusual attitudes=94 course in St Augustine in an extra 300 and would thoroughly recommend it. great fun and huge confidence builder. From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of TELEDYNMCS@aol.com Sent: Tuesday, August 05, 2008 07:46 Subject: Europa-List: Re: Spins In a message dated 8/5/2008 3:01:53 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, europa-list@matronics.com writes: Secondly - Stall and spin accidents on approach. Low down and in the pattern, these are often fatal. Hi John and All, Adding to John's excellent commentary, over the years while I was operating a glider tow club I took dozens and dozens of folks for glider rides. Many of these folks were power only pilots and had never been in a glider before. Personally, I like doing spins in gliders. Spins are a great way to get down at the end of the day in a glider. Very often when doing rides I would spin down if I had another pilot on board. Of course, I always ask if they want to do a spin before I "show them their toes." One of the things I've noticed when I've done spins with power only pilots, and it's been almost universal, is power only pilots, unless they have military training, seem to genuinely fear spins. I can see this fear from the back seat when the pilot/passenger tightly grips hand holds in the cockpit, or if they get really quiet just as you enter the spin. This is not a good thing because if you fear something it usually means that you don't understand it. I believe the root of this fear is because spins, generally speaking, are not taught in power planes and most pilots rarely, if ever, practice spins. Student pilots are told what a spin is, how to recover, then are usually told to avoid them. Stall/spin recovery is taught in gliders, though. Spin training is also available in power planes. I would suggest that anyone who is uncertain of, or anyone who has genuine fear of spins, go take spin training and rid yourself of that fear. Most glider schools offer spin training and most aerobatic flight instructors also offer spin training. There are many bad habits pilots have in regard to spins, particularly in terms of spin recovery. These bad habits, like trying to stop the spin by applying opposite aileron, will make a bad situation much worse when close to the ground. Pilots can avoid these bad habits with the proper spin training. Everyone should learn the correct spin entry and recovery techniques so well that they become second nature. It's just an added arrow in your quiver of piloting skills and a skill that might one day save your life. Much like aerobatics, spins shouldn't be feared, unless, of course, you are too close to the ground to recover. Like aerobatics and unusual attitude recovery training, proper spin training will assist you in not ever putting yourself into a position where a spin will kill you. That's my 2 cents. Regards, John Lawton Whitwell, TN (TN89) N245E - Flying Checked by AVG. 04-Aug-08 19:23 ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 09:34:32 AM PST US From: "William Daniell" Subject: Europa-List: Redux please Can anyone in the USA sell me 4 Redux kits please? Thanks Will Checked by AVG. 19:23 ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 09:48:09 AM PST US Subject: RE: Europa-List: Re: Spins From: Hi William "> I would thoroughly concur. I did an unusual attitudes course in St > Augustine in an extra 300 and would thoroughly recommend it. great fun and > huge confidence builder." I agree that it is a great idea to get spin training first hand. The only thing I would like to add is that just because you spun in a plane many times does not mean you know exactly how the plane you are flying may exactly react as far as spin entry and recovery??? Many know that with all other things the same (weight and air density) a more aft CG will make spin entry easier and a spin harder to recover than with a more forward CG. Some know that with all other things the same (Air density and CG) the heavier the weight of the aircraft spin entry will be easier and harder to recover from a spin than in a lighter weight aircraft. Fewer yet know that all other things the same (Weight and CG) that the thinner the air spin entry will be easier and harder to recover from a spin compared to flying in thicker air. Air will get thinner the higher you go, the warmer the air, and the more moist the air is. If you know how your airplane for a given CG and weight handles spin recovery with a density altitude of 3K, it will most definite be far less forgiving with a density altitude of 12K. Think about it, if you put an airspeed indicator on the rudder measuring the rotational speed lets say it would normalize at 20 knots (????). It would normalize at 20 knots with a density altitude of 1K or 25K, its just at 25K you would be spinning like a pinwheel (much faster RPM)! Add to equation that the rudder to stop the spin is airspeed dependent as well and you should get the idea. If you added a more aft CG, and more weight so the rotational inertia is greater you may very well have a airplane that is in an unrecoverable spin. You don't have to go to extremes, go on a trip and push weight to limit, have CG pretty aft, and land at a high elevation airport, or even a lower elevation airport but it is hot and humid and you have an airplane that you may not know as intimate as you may think. I spoke to a P-51 (the hot I think it was the G model) WW2 test pilot and he spoke of his 2 weeks of testing by the book. His commander let him take it up to fool around with after he did such a good job, but warned to not break it. He rocketed up to ~ 20K to meet up with 2 other friends and figured he would loop and meet them upside down. Horror set in when he was going to meet nose to nose with him being upside down. He pulled on the stick, stalled and entered a spin so fast he could not believe it. He did many a spin, never that high. Spin was unrecoverable, he said he was spinning so fast it was amazing. He decided at 8K to jump. He opened canopy and unbuckled and when he stood on seat to get out plane, it began to fly, so he got back in. His buddy was following him down and he was so dizzy and disoriented he could not fly the plane. His buddy followed him and told him what to do with controls for 20 or so minutes and he was then able to land safely. I am not mentioning this to scare anyone, just to bring awareness so you are more confident to know how your plane might react configured in conditions you never experienced before. After Europa building often I go flying my model at night at the Local High School. Often will get in many dozens of spins from high altitudes. Sometimes the model for a given CG and weight would not even enter a spin, sometimes it would just be wanting to spin and if you entered would be unrecoverable and would make a hole in the ground. Elevation of field is bout 80MSL. It was the thickness of air, hot and humid makes spin entry very easy, cold and dry far harder. After learning plane and understanding what was going on, I can adjust CG to make it perform as I want. Ron Parigoris Andy mentioned in a letter I saw some time ago that if you fly above 1370 up to 1450, limit CG less aft by 1" and less forward by 1". Probably not a bad idea, but if you are at aft CG for 1370 and flying at 1525 you better be on your best behavior. If you are flying into Denver at 1525 and 1370 aft CG when it is very hot and humid, better best your best behavior. Not much different than flying a tailwheel sometimes, strong gusty cross from right on hard runway comes to mind, if you don't let things get out of hand things work out nicely. For those that things worked out nicely for, I am sure they knew what they were in for, and compensated. Of course you could try and avoid undesirable things as hard as you can, but be prepared in case you must deal with. ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 11:00:49 AM PST US From: "William Daniell" Subject: RE: Europa-List: Re: Spins Leaves me quite pensive given that our field is at 8500'. The instructors won't do spins up here. -----Original Message----- From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of rparigor@suffolk.lib.ny.us Sent: Tuesday, August 05, 2008 11:44 Subject: RE: Europa-List: Re: Spins Hi William "> I would thoroughly concur. I did an unusual attitudes course in St > Augustine in an extra 300 and would thoroughly recommend it. great fun and > huge confidence builder." I agree that it is a great idea to get spin training first hand. The only thing I would like to add is that just because you spun in a plane many times does not mean you know exactly how the plane you are flying may exactly react as far as spin entry and recovery??? Many know that with all other things the same (weight and air density) a more aft CG will make spin entry easier and a spin harder to recover than with a more forward CG. Some know that with all other things the same (Air density and CG) the heavier the weight of the aircraft spin entry will be easier and harder to recover from a spin than in a lighter weight aircraft. Fewer yet know that all other things the same (Weight and CG) that the thinner the air spin entry will be easier and harder to recover from a spin compared to flying in thicker air. Air will get thinner the higher you go, the warmer the air, and the more moist the air is. If you know how your airplane for a given CG and weight handles spin recovery with a density altitude of 3K, it will most definite be far less forgiving with a density altitude of 12K. Think about it, if you put an airspeed indicator on the rudder measuring the rotational speed lets say it would normalize at 20 knots (????). It would normalize at 20 knots with a density altitude of 1K or 25K, its just at 25K you would be spinning like a pinwheel (much faster RPM)! Add to equation that the rudder to stop the spin is airspeed dependent as well and you should get the idea. If you added a more aft CG, and more weight so the rotational inertia is greater you may very well have a airplane that is in an unrecoverable spin. You don't have to go to extremes, go on a trip and push weight to limit, have CG pretty aft, and land at a high elevation airport, or even a lower elevation airport but it is hot and humid and you have an airplane that you may not know as intimate as you may think. I spoke to a P-51 (the hot I think it was the G model) WW2 test pilot and he spoke of his 2 weeks of testing by the book. His commander let him take it up to fool around with after he did such a good job, but warned to not break it. He rocketed up to ~ 20K to meet up with 2 other friends and figured he would loop and meet them upside down. Horror set in when he was going to meet nose to nose with him being upside down. He pulled on the stick, stalled and entered a spin so fast he could not believe it. He did many a spin, never that high. Spin was unrecoverable, he said he was spinning so fast it was amazing. He decided at 8K to jump. He opened canopy and unbuckled and when he stood on seat to get out plane, it began to fly, so he got back in. His buddy was following him down and he was so dizzy and disoriented he could not fly the plane. His buddy followed him and told him what to do with controls for 20 or so minutes and he was then able to land safely. I am not mentioning this to scare anyone, just to bring awareness so you are more confident to know how your plane might react configured in conditions you never experienced before. After Europa building often I go flying my model at night at the Local High School. Often will get in many dozens of spins from high altitudes. Sometimes the model for a given CG and weight would not even enter a spin, sometimes it would just be wanting to spin and if you entered would be unrecoverable and would make a hole in the ground. Elevation of field is bout 80MSL. It was the thickness of air, hot and humid makes spin entry very easy, cold and dry far harder. After learning plane and understanding what was going on, I can adjust CG to make it perform as I want. Ron Parigoris Andy mentioned in a letter I saw some time ago that if you fly above 1370 up to 1450, limit CG less aft by 1" and less forward by 1". Probably not a bad idea, but if you are at aft CG for 1370 and flying at 1525 you better be on your best behavior. If you are flying into Denver at 1525 and 1370 aft CG when it is very hot and humid, better best your best behavior. Not much different than flying a tailwheel sometimes, strong gusty cross from right on hard runway comes to mind, if you don't let things get out of hand things work out nicely. For those that things worked out nicely for, I am sure they knew what they were in for, and compensated. Of course you could try and avoid undesirable things as hard as you can, but be prepared in case you must deal with. Checked by AVG. 19:23 ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 11:30:40 AM PST US From: DuaneFamly@aol.com Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re: Spins I have had the privilege of doing "unusual attitude recovery" training when I lived in San Jose, CA in a Citabria with Amelia Reid. After 10 or so different spins I was getting cocky. So she told me that she would enter the next spin and for me to watch her recovery method. After three turns she fully released all controls and the plane slowed out of the spin and simply remained in a shallow descent waiting for me to fly her home. So don't always think that you are the one recovering the plane, it may be the plane recovering you. So to those that have done spins in their Europas......what is it like? how does it handle? any areas to stay away from? The advice of keeping CG 1" closer to center from forward and rear when fully loaded are the things that I look for. Mike Duane A207A Redding, California XS Conventional Gear Jabiru 3300A Sensenich R64Z N Ground Adjustable Prop **************Looking for a car that's sporty, fun and fits in your budget? Read reviews on AOL Autos. (http://autos.aol.com/cars-BMW-128-2008/expert-review?ncid=aolaut00050000000017 ) ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 11:37:16 AM PST US From: david miller Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re: Safety matters including stall and AOA warning units I could have used this unit on the weekend, when a gusting crosswind gave me a push from behind as I came over the numbers. The groundspeed convinced me that my airspeed was way high, when the the stall warner squealed it took a while for its warning to make it through to my brain, as at that point I was more concerned with tracking straight and wondering why the end of the runway was getting closer so quickly. Not one of my most elegant arrivals. Rather than a polite lady's voice, at that point I probably needed an instructors voice bellowing that " you are about to make a complete cock up of this landing" Dave Do not archive On 5-Aug-08, at 3:59 AM, Mark Burton wrote: > > Folks, > > Although it is neither an AOA system or a stall warner, my SmartASS > unit (www.smartavionics.com) will help the pilot to maintain a safe > margin of speed above the stall on approach. I sincerely believe > that if such a system had been in use, it may well have been > sufficient to prevent some of the stall/spin on approach accidents > that have occurred. > > With a SmartASS working in "speed director mode", on approach, a > calm (female) voice talks to you about your speed. If the speed is > about right, she occasionally, says "speed good". If the speed is > wrong, she says "slow" (or "fast"), if the speed is very wrong, she > says "very slow", (or "very fast"). The voice is normally not very > intrusive. If the speed is insanely slow/fast you get a loud DING > as well. The unit is G sensitive so it factors the vertical > acceleration into the speed calculation so if you are pulling G, it > reports slowness even if the actual airspeed is correct. > > When you start using the speed director it seems quite fussy, > always telling you to slow down or speed up. But once you have > flown a few approaches with it and smoothed out your flying it > becomes completely normal to have this little voice in the > background making comments and because you are used to listening > and reacting to what she tells you (makes a change, eh?), you > follow the suggestions and so the approach speed is maintained > close to the chosen value with very little effort on the part of > the pilot. > > The point I am making is that once you are used to using it, taking > in and reacting to the information presented by the SmartASS > becomes so easy it's almost subliminal. From a flight safety point > of view, I believe that is good because it frees up some valuable > pilot mental effort and allows the pilot to concentrate more on > lookout/spatial awareness. > > A stall warning system is better than nothing because you may hear > it and react, but then again, (when the pressure is on) you may not. > > I have not used an AOA system but I would expect with a good HUD > they would be OK when the pilot is looking straight ahead. The > audio option could be useful as long as the brain hasn't switched > off due to overload. > > Mark > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=196563#196563 > > ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 11:52:49 AM PST US From: "Duncan & Ami McFadyean" Subject: Re: Europa-List: Maximum flap extension? Or not. The mono is limited to 27 degrees of flap extension in order to prevent is taking off before the controls are effective. Which confirms that more 27 degrees of flap extension is effective! There is at least one trigear flying with more than the standard flap movement (30+); this was achieved by a longer-stroke servo. Theoretically, fowler flaps don't like more than about 30 degrees, although G-YURO tested to more than this. The non Mono Europa, which has its own speed break (the monowheel swing arm) could certainly do with more drag at full flap. And sideslipping has little effect! Duncan McF. ----- Original Message ----- From: "G-IANI" Sent: Tuesday, August 05, 2008 10:00 AM Subject: RE: Europa-List: Maximum flap extension? > > > As David says it should be 26-27 degrees. Mine ended up dead on 27. > > Ian Rickard G-IANI XS Trigear, 200 hours > Europa Club Mods Rep (Trigear) > e-mail mods@europaclub.org.uk > or direct g-iani@ntlworld.com > -----Original Message----- > > Frans, For the XS mono kit 402 the manual says the aim is to get the flaps > to extend to 26-27 degrees. The supplied Europa final inspection sheet > stipulates minimum 25 and max 27 degrees. Hope this helps. regards, David > Joyce > > ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 12:00:41 PM PST US From: "Duncan & Ami McFadyean" Subject: Re: Europa-List: Ducatti Rectifier/Regulator That mode of (slow) regulator failure is common. And not just on Europas. I have it creeping up on me too, but can confirm that the regulator does not see more than 40C (as measured on the body of the regulator), except perhaps after shutdown, at which time there would be no greater junction temperature, which should be able to endure in excess of 100C . So the failure mode may not necessarily be related to temperature. Duncan McF. ----- Original Message ----- From: Bryan Allsop To: europa-list@matronics.com Sent: Tuesday, August 05, 2008 9:56 AM Subject: RE: Europa-List: Ducatti Rectifier/Regulator Hi Steve, My regulator is positioned on the firewall behind the plenum chamber, without a heat sink. Last time he did an annual inspection Graham Singleton looked at it oddly, and asked if I had experienced problems with the regulator. Apparently overheating had been common problem. I told him that I had not, and forgot about it. Only last week I had a radio failure in flight. I noticed that the voltage had dropped and returned to investigate. Sure enough, there was no voltage from the Ducati regulator to the battery. After an hour or two trying to prove to myself that I did not need to buy a new regulator, I failed, and had to spend =A375 + del. to purchase a new one. Retrospectively, I can look back and recognise that the failure has been taking place intermittently for more than a year. I can recall odd times when the voltage had dropped, and I put it down to other things. More recently it has taken a little time for the voltage to come up to the charging level. It is a bit like old age, you begin to accept that visiting the bathroom in the middle of the night is normal. My recent investigations illustrate that there is quite a history overheating problems with Ducati regulators. Hopefully the later models have been improved. Certainly the back of my unit does not give a good heat sink area. Despite this, the regulator has been installed and working for over eight years. This all leads me to suggest that you would be well advised to position the regulator in a way which will minimise heating problems. A good heat sink would be an advantage. Hope this helps. Bryan > From: steven.pitt2@ntlworld.com > To: europa-list@matronics.com > Subject: Europa-List: Ducatti Rectifier/Regulator > Date: Sun, 3 Aug 2008 19:33:01 +0100 > > > Dear All, > I hope I am not repeating a thread but I would appreciate input from the > forum on where builders have positioned their regulators. My reason for > asking is that I may have an intermittent fault in the electrical generation > system and having done some fault tracing with Conrad Beale and Skydrive it > is pointing to the rectifier and the possibility that it has become 'cooked' > and thus developed the intermittent workings. > My fitment is on the flat above the pilot's footwell, but the opinion > expressed so far is that there is not enough air circulation to keep it > cool, especially after landing. I still have the side gills to the top > cowling. > Thanks in anticipation. > Steve Pitt > G-SMDH Trigear XS. > > > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > > &g=========== > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Get more from your digital life. Find out how. ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 12:20:17 PM PST US From: "Bill Henderson" Subject: Re: Europa-List: Ducatti Rectifier/Regulator For what it's worth, I got John Wigney's rectifier/regulator when his died and disected it. Only parts I could find bad were the two rectifier diodes (MR2510) and they are directly mounted to the heat sink. You can't repair though as the whole thing is potted and you basically tear it up when you open it....... I guess the answer is to watch Ebay for a cheap replacement. Bill A010 Classic Monowheel 60% Done 150% to go ----- Original Message ----- From: Duncan & Ami McFadyean To: europa-list@matronics.com Sent: Tuesday, August 05, 2008 2:59 PM Subject: Re: Europa-List: Ducatti Rectifier/Regulator That mode of (slow) regulator failure is common. And not just on Europas. I have it creeping up on me too, but can confirm that the regulator does not see more than 40C (as measured on the body of the regulator), except perhaps after shutdown, at which time there would be no greater junction temperature, which should be able to endure in excess of 100C . So the failure mode may not necessarily be related to temperature. Duncan McF. ----- Original Message ----- From: Bryan Allsop To: europa-list@matronics.com Sent: Tuesday, August 05, 2008 9:56 AM Subject: RE: Europa-List: Ducatti Rectifier/Regulator Hi Steve, My regulator is positioned on the firewall behind the plenum chamber, without a heat sink. Last time he did an annual inspection Graham Singleton looked at it oddly, and asked if I had experienced problems with the regulator. Apparently overheating had been common problem. I told him that I had not, and forgot about it. Only last week I had a radio failure in flight. I noticed that the voltage had dropped and returned to investigate. Sure enough, there was no voltage from the Ducati regulator to the battery. After an hour or two trying to prove to myself that I did not need to buy a new regulator, I failed, and had to spend =A375 + del. to purchase a new one. Retrospectively, I can look back and recognise that the failure has been taking place intermittently for more than a year. I can recall odd times when the voltage had dropped, and I put it down to other things. More recently it has taken a little time for the voltage to come up to the charging level. It is a bit like old age, you begin to accept that visiting the bathroom in the middle of the night is normal. My recent investigations illustrate that there is quite a history overheating problems with Ducati regulators. Hopefully the later models have been improved. Certainly the back of my unit does not give a good heat sink area. Despite this, the regulator has been installed and working for over eight years. This all leads me to suggest that you would be well advised to position the regulator in a way which will minimise heating problems. A good heat sink would be an advantage. Hope this helps. Bryan > From: steven.pitt2@ntlworld.com > To: europa-list@matronics.com > Subject: Europa-List: Ducatti Rectifier/Regulator > Date: Sun, 3 Aug 2008 19:33:01 +0100 > > > Dear All, > I hope I am not repeating a thread but I would appreciate input from the > forum on where builders have positioned their regulators. My reason for > asking is that I may have an intermittent fault in the electrical generation > system and having done some fault tracing with Conrad Beale and Skydrive it > is pointing to the rectifier and the possibility that it has become 'cooked' > and thus developed the intermittent workings. > My fitment is on the flat above the pilot's footwell, but the opinion > expressed so far is that there is not enough air circulation to keep it > cool, especially after landing. I still have the side gills to the top > cowling. > Thanks in anticipation. > Steve Pitt > G-SMDH Trigear XS. > > > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > > &g=========== > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- --- Get more from your digital life. Find out how. href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List">http://www.matron href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 12:23:43 PM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Bose X Aviation Headset For Sale From: "Geico266" I have a nice Bose X Aviation headset for sale on e-Bay. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ih=020&sspagename=STRK%3AMESE%3AIT&viewitem=&item=300247651009&rd=1 Happy bidding! Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=196714#196714 ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 01:51:04 PM PST US From: "Robert C Harrison" Subject: RE: Europa-List: Re: Safety matters including stall and AOA warning units Hi! Dave. On a light note in line with your "instructors voice" suggestion. There is a voice option on some "Sat nav's" which is Ossie Osbourne's voice with a few choice "F.....F.....'s" in the appropriate places. I'm sure Mark's partner Helen wouldn't mind stepping her voice aside for the Ossie option! Regards Bob Harrison G-PTAG Do not archive. -----Original Message----- From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of david miller Sent: 05 August 2008 19:42 Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re: Safety matters including stall and AOA warning units I could have used this unit on the weekend, when a gusting crosswind gave me a push from behind as I came over the numbers. The groundspeed convinced me that my airspeed was way high, when the the stall warner squealed it took a while for its warning to make it through to my brain, as at that point I was more concerned with tracking straight and wondering why the end of the runway was getting closer so quickly. Not one of my most elegant arrivals. Rather than a polite lady's voice, at that point I probably needed an instructors voice bellowing that " you are about to make a complete cock up of this landing" Dave Do not archive On 5-Aug-08, at 3:59 AM, Mark Burton wrote: > > Folks, > > Although it is neither an AOA system or a stall warner, my SmartASS > unit (www.smartavionics.com) will help the pilot to maintain a safe > margin of speed above the stall on approach. I sincerely believe > that if such a system had been in use, it may well have been > sufficient to prevent some of the stall/spin on approach accidents > that have occurred. > > With a SmartASS working in "speed director mode", on approach, a > calm (female) voice talks to you about your speed. If the speed is > about right, she occasionally, says "speed good". If the speed is > wrong, she says "slow" (or "fast"), if the speed is very wrong, she > says "very slow", (or "very fast"). The voice is normally not very > intrusive. If the speed is insanely slow/fast you get a loud DING > as well. The unit is G sensitive so it factors the vertical > acceleration into the speed calculation so if you are pulling G, it > reports slowness even if the actual airspeed is correct. > > When you start using the speed director it seems quite fussy, > always telling you to slow down or speed up. But once you have > flown a few approaches with it and smoothed out your flying it > becomes completely normal to have this little voice in the > background making comments and because you are used to listening > and reacting to what she tells you (makes a change, eh?), you > follow the suggestions and so the approach speed is maintained > close to the chosen value with very little effort on the part of > the pilot. > > The point I am making is that once you are used to using it, taking > in and reacting to the information presented by the SmartASS > becomes so easy it's almost subliminal. From a flight safety point > of view, I believe that is good because it frees up some valuable > pilot mental effort and allows the pilot to concentrate more on > lookout/spatial awareness. > > A stall warning system is better than nothing because you may hear > it and react, but then again, (when the pressure is on) you may not. > > I have not used an AOA system but I would expect with a good HUD > they would be OK when the pilot is looking straight ahead. The > audio option could be useful as long as the brain hasn't switched > off due to overload. > > Mark > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=196563#196563 > > ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 01:51:04 PM PST US Subject: Re: Europa-List: Ducatti Rectifier/Regulator From: "josok" Mine failed just over 150 h. It's mounted inside the panel, to keep it out of the heat of the engine. I really do not believe the error rate of this component is environmental heat related. It's more of a quality issue. Some time ago there was a similar thread, and if i remember correctly there was a German origin alternative offered. Anyhow, in my case there happened more then bargained for. The red lamp came during flight, and shortly after a low voltage warning. Since i can switch everything over to the second power system, i was not worried, and did the 3 hrs 30 mins leg to the rotax dealer as intended. There the engine was checked for damage after the wheel up landing, and i mentioned the probable regulator failure. However, the charge lamp was and stayed out. During the test flight thereafter i noticed that there was still no charge. My assumption was that the red lamp had burned out, and that everything would be fine after i would have replaced the regulator. That assessment was wrong, as later turned out. After about one hour in the next flight, smoke appeared in the cockpit, and i asked for an immediate landing at a nearby airport. In the 5 minutes it took to land the plane, the smoke started to vanish. The smell was something i had smelled before, but could not immediately place. Examination sho wed that the large smoothing capacitor had cooked itself empty. The sequence of events has been, that this regulator developed a fault, and put AC current to the battery and capacitor. After a while the 30 amp battery fuse had blown, with the result that the charge control lamp does not light. After that fuse had blown, the full AC power of the charging coils was released on the capacitor, which gave way, causing an emergency landing. Lessons learned: Do not keep flying with a red lamp on. Do not assume anything, check and correct before the next flight. Having an alternative system is great, but creates overconfidence on the downside. Question unanswered: There is text on the regulator: Do not take the battery off line with a running engine. If you look at the Rotax manual, that is exactly what the main switch or contactor does. Maybe the regulator blew up dangerously when i tried to recycle the main switch. Also a blown battery fuse takes the battery off line. On the other hand, there is no fuse in the charge coil circuit. In this case, the connector shows melting marks, and solder has dripped from the one of the AC connector tabs. In other words: There is no protection from defect rectifiers in the regulator. IMHO there should be a fuse in the circuit too. Unless i get contradictionary information, that fuse will be there after the next service stop. Regards, Jos Okhuijsen Visit - www.EuropaOwners.org ________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________ Time: 03:38:08 PM PST US From: GTH Subject: Re: Europa-List: Ducatti Rectifier/Regulator Bill Henderson a crit : > For what it's worth, I got John Wigney's rectifier/regulator when his > died and disected it. Only parts I could find bad were the two > rectifier diodes (MR2510) and they are directly mounted to the heat > sink. You can't repair though as the whole thing is potted and you > basically tear it up when you open it....... > Hi all, For what it's worth, I made some investigation with the help of a friend, and opened a few failed Rotax regulators. It appears that the more power you draw from the regulator, the higher the junction temperature, and the more likely the failure. Bob Nuckolls provides a nice circuit proposition for the Rotax alternator/regulator, with overvoltage protection. I personnally would and did shun the Rotax circuit proposition. Also, I would like to point out that the alarm lamp is driven by the regulator, and so can't be expected to provide any degree of protection. Some pictures and thermal info here http://contrails.free.fr/elec_ducati_en.php Best regards, -- Gilles http://contrails.free.fr ________________________________ Message 25 ____________________________________ Time: 04:08:49 PM PST US From: Graham Singleton Subject: Re: Europa-List: Ducatti Rectifier/Regulator Gilles that study was fascinating! Thank you. Graham GTH wrote: > > Hi all, > > For what it's worth, I made some investigation with the help of a > friend, and opened a few failed Rotax regulators. > It appears that the more power you draw from the regulator, the higher > the junction temperature, and the more likely the failure. > > Bob Nuckolls provides a nice circuit proposition for the Rotax > alternator/regulator, with overvoltage protection. > I personnally would and did shun the Rotax circuit proposition. > > Also, I would like to point out that the alarm lamp is driven by the > regulator, and so can't be expected to provide any degree of protection. > > Some pictures and thermal info here > http://contrails.free.fr/elec_ducati_en.php > > Best regards, ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message europa-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Europa-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/europa-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/europa-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.