---------------------------------------------------------- Europa-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Thu 02/05/09: 24 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 02:00 AM - Re: First Flight Kit #A221 - N914XL (JR Gowing) 2. 02:17 AM - Re: First Flight Kit #A221 - N914XL () 3. 02:25 AM - Re: First Flight Kit #A221 - N914XL (Raimo Toivio) 4. 02:40 AM - Re: First Flight Kit #A221 - N914XL (craig bastin) 5. 02:46 AM - FW: AIRCRAFT - PICTURES - (90204) - Salvage exercise on the frozen Hudson! (Robert C Harrison) 6. 03:09 AM - Re: First Flight Kit #A221 - N914XL (Robert C Harrison) 7. 04:49 AM - Re: Re;- Trial Flight - UK Owners (flyingphil2) 8. 07:09 AM - Re: First Flight Kit #A221 - N914XL (Jeff B) 9. 07:24 AM - Re: FW: AIRCRAFT - PICTURES - (90204) - Salvage exercise on the frozen Hudson! (rparigor@suffolk.lib.ny.us) 10. 07:35 AM - Re: First Flight Kit #A221 - N914XL (JEFF ROBERTS) 11. 07:48 AM - Re: First Flight Kit #A221 - N914XL (josok) 12. 07:56 AM - Re: First Flight Kit #A221 - N914XL (Jeff B) 13. 08:22 AM - Re: First Flight Kit #A221 - N914XL (JEFF ROBERTS) 14. 08:40 AM - Re: First Flight Kit #A221 - N914XL (Bob Borger) 15. 09:07 AM - Re: First Flight Kit #A221 - N914XL (Peter Zutrauen) 16. 12:38 PM - 914 - 912? (Fergus Kyle) 17. 01:19 PM - Re: Europa-List Digest: 18 Msgs - 02/04/09 (Fergus Kyle) 18. 01:49 PM - Re: Re: Europa-List Digest: 18 Msgs - 02/04/09 (Robert Borger) 19. 01:52 PM - Re: First Flight Kit #A221 - N914XL (karelvranken) 20. 03:30 PM - Re: First Flight Kit #A221 - N914XL (danbish) 21. 03:42 PM - Re: 914 - 912? (ALAN YERLY) 22. 05:47 PM - Europa Kits (Graham Singleton) 23. 07:56 PM - Re: Europa-List Digest: 18 Msgs - 02/04/09 (Ferg Kyle) 24. 08:05 PM - Re: 914 - 912? (Ferg Kyle) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 02:00:40 AM PST US From: "JR Gowing" Subject: Re: Europa-List: First Flight Kit #A221 - N914XL Dear Bob I agree with the "YEEEEEEEEE HAAAWWWWWWW!" congratulations from JR Bob Gowing UK Kit 327 in Oz do not archive ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robert Borger" Sent: Thursday, February 05, 2009 2:18 PM Subject: Europa-List: First Flight Kit #A221 - N914XL > > My Friends, > > Today, 2009 02 04, at 1845 hrs CST (0045Z) Europa Kit #A221 registered > in the U.S.A. as N914XL took to flight for the first time from Denton > County Municipal Airport (KDTO), Denton, Texas. N914XL was piloted > most ably by Gary Platner, one of the finest pilots known by the > builder. Mr. Platner flew the aircraft for 15 minutes overhead the > airport performing a series of control tests as well as stalls gear/ > flaps up and gear/flaps down. The stalls broke straight ahead with no > tendency to fall off to either side and the aircraft was in proper > trim at all speeds tested (up to 130 kts indicated). > > Winds were from 150D at 5 kts gusting to 8 kts, temperature was 55F > (13C), altimeter setting 29.87. > > The sun set before the builder was able to fly. I expect that I shall > make my own first flight this weekend. > > Pics and videos of the first flight will be posted as soon as possible. > > As they say in Texas "YEEEEEEEEE HAAAWWWWWWW!) > > Check six, > Bob Borger > Europa Kit #A221 N914XL, XS Mono, Intercooled 914, Airmaster C/S > http://www.europaowners.org/N914XL > Now Flying! > 3705 Lynchburg Dr. > Corinth, TX 76208 > Home: 940-497-2123 > Cel: 817-992-1117 > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 16:35:00 -- We are a community of 5.9 million users fighting spam. The Professional version does not have this message ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 02:17:34 AM PST US From: Subject: Re: Europa-List: First Flight Kit #A221 - N914XL Congraulations on a job well done, now the fun will begin:-) best wishes Ivor ---- Robert Borger wrote: > > My Friends, > > Today, 2009 02 04, at 1845 hrs CST (0045Z) Europa Kit #A221 registered > in the U.S.A. as N914XL took to flight for the first time from Denton > County Municipal Airport (KDTO), Denton, Texas. N914XL was piloted > most ably by Gary Platner, one of the finest pilots known by the > builder. Mr. Platner flew the aircraft for 15 minutes overhead the > airport performing a series of control tests as well as stalls gear/ > flaps up and gear/flaps down. The stalls broke straight ahead with no > tendency to fall off to either side and the aircraft was in proper > trim at all speeds tested (up to 130 kts indicated). > > Winds were from 150D at 5 kts gusting to 8 kts, temperature was 55F > (13C), altimeter setting 29.87. > > The sun set before the builder was able to fly. I expect that I shall > make my own first flight this weekend. > > Pics and videos of the first flight will be posted as soon as possible. > > As they say in Texas "YEEEEEEEEE HAAAWWWWWWW!) > > Check six, > Bob Borger > Europa Kit #A221 N914XL, XS Mono, Intercooled 914, Airmaster C/S > http://www.europaowners.org/N914XL > Now Flying! > 3705 Lynchburg Dr. > Corinth, TX 76208 > Home: 940-497-2123 > Cel: 817-992-1117 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 02:25:06 AM PST US From: "Raimo Toivio" Subject: Re: Europa-List: First Flight Kit #A221 - N914XL Bob, you shouted "YEEEEEEEEE HAAAWWWWWWW!" after N914XLs first flight. What are you going to say after your first flight??? Congratulations from Finland. Live this moment carefully through and save it. That feeling is hard to copy later. Raimo OH-XRT ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robert Borger" Sent: Thursday, February 05, 2009 5:18 AM Subject: Europa-List: First Flight Kit #A221 - N914XL > > My Friends, > > Today, 2009 02 04, at 1845 hrs CST (0045Z) Europa Kit #A221 registered > in the U.S.A. as N914XL took to flight for the first time from Denton > County Municipal Airport (KDTO), Denton, Texas. N914XL was piloted > most ably by Gary Platner, one of the finest pilots known by the > builder. Mr. Platner flew the aircraft for 15 minutes overhead the > airport performing a series of control tests as well as stalls gear/ > flaps up and gear/flaps down. The stalls broke straight ahead with no > tendency to fall off to either side and the aircraft was in proper > trim at all speeds tested (up to 130 kts indicated). > > Winds were from 150D at 5 kts gusting to 8 kts, temperature was 55F > (13C), altimeter setting 29.87. > > The sun set before the builder was able to fly. I expect that I shall > make my own first flight this weekend. > > Pics and videos of the first flight will be posted as soon as possible. > > As they say in Texas "YEEEEEEEEE HAAAWWWWWWW!) > > Check six, > Bob Borger > Europa Kit #A221 N914XL, XS Mono, Intercooled 914, Airmaster C/S > http://www.europaowners.org/N914XL > Now Flying! > 3705 Lynchburg Dr. > Corinth, TX 76208 > Home: 940-497-2123 > Cel: 817-992-1117 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 02:40:07 AM PST US From: "craig bastin" Subject: RE: Europa-List: First Flight Kit #A221 - N914XL Congrats you must be very proud craig Kit 577 -----Original Message----- From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Robert Borger Sent: Thursday, 5 February 2009 1:18 PM Subject: Europa-List: First Flight Kit #A221 - N914XL My Friends, Today, 2009 02 04, at 1845 hrs CST (0045Z) Europa Kit #A221 registered in the U.S.A. as N914XL took to flight for the first time from Denton County Municipal Airport (KDTO), Denton, Texas. N914XL was piloted most ably by Gary Platner, one of the finest pilots known by the builder. Mr. Platner flew the aircraft for 15 minutes overhead the airport performing a series of control tests as well as stalls gear/ flaps up and gear/flaps down. The stalls broke straight ahead with no tendency to fall off to either side and the aircraft was in proper trim at all speeds tested (up to 130 kts indicated). Winds were from 150D at 5 kts gusting to 8 kts, temperature was 55F (13C), altimeter setting 29.87. The sun set before the builder was able to fly. I expect that I shall make my own first flight this weekend. Pics and videos of the first flight will be posted as soon as possible. As they say in Texas "YEEEEEEEEE HAAAWWWWWWW!) Check six, Bob Borger Europa Kit #A221 N914XL, XS Mono, Intercooled 914, Airmaster C/S http://www.europaowners.org/N914XL Now Flying! 3705 Lynchburg Dr. Corinth, TX 76208 Home: 940-497-2123 Cel: 817-992-1117 Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 08:24:00 ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 02:46:52 AM PST US From: "Robert C Harrison" Subject: Europa-List: FW: AIRCRAFT - PICTURES - (90204) - Salvage exercise on the frozen Hudson! Aircraft related scoop ! -----Original Message----- From: Stan Parr [mailto:stan.parr@btinternet.com] Sent: 04 February 2009 22:03 Subject: AIRCRAFT - PICTURES - (90204) - Salvage exercise on the frozen Hudson! My thanks to Delphine for these dramatic pictures of the plane being lifted from the Hudson River. Pictures taken by the crane driver - note the times on the snaps! 5.22pm - 1.03am. All evening - they did well! Aircraft List only - no sound required. (Thanks, Delphine, get well soon..that's going some! Go steady on the "up and running" bit! Kind regards, Stan. XX) ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 03:09:38 AM PST US From: "Robert C Harrison" Subject: RE: Europa-List: First Flight Kit #A221 - N914XL Well done Bob looking forward to the pics. Bob Harrison G-PTAG Kit 337 Do not archive. -----Original Message----- From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert Borger Sent: 05 February 2009 03:18 Subject: Europa-List: First Flight Kit #A221 - N914XL ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 04:49:22 AM PST US Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re;- Trial Flight - UK Owners From: "flyingphil2" Ian, I've contacted John at Europa. I'm in Northampton and he's welcome to look at my build/rebuild if he likes. Regards, Phil Visit - www.EuropaOwners.org ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 07:09:56 AM PST US From: Jeff B Subject: Re: Europa-List: First Flight Kit #A221 - N914XL WOW! Roger... It's about time... :) Congratulations on a job well done. The real fun begins, now... Jeff - Baby Blue Robert Borger wrote: > > My Friends, > > Today, 2009 02 04, at 1845 hrs CST (0045Z) Europa Kit #A221 registered > in the U.S.A. as N914XL took to flight for the first time from Denton > County Municipal Airport (KDTO), Denton, Texas. N914XL was piloted most > ably by Gary Platner, one of the finest pilots known by the builder. > Mr. Platner flew the aircraft for 15 minutes overhead the airport > performing a series of control tests as well as stalls gear/flaps up and > gear/flaps down. The stalls broke straight ahead with no tendency to > fall off to either side and the aircraft was in proper trim at all > speeds tested (up to 130 kts indicated). > > Winds were from 150D at 5 kts gusting to 8 kts, temperature was 55F > (13C), altimeter setting 29.87. > > The sun set before the builder was able to fly. I expect that I shall > make my own first flight this weekend. > > Pics and videos of the first flight will be posted as soon as possible. > > As they say in Texas "YEEEEEEEEE HAAAWWWWWWW!) > > Check six, > Bob Borger > Europa Kit #A221 N914XL, XS Mono, Intercooled 914, Airmaster C/S > http://www.europaowners.org/N914XL > Now Flying! > 3705 Lynchburg Dr. > Corinth, TX 76208 > Home: 940-497-2123 > Cel: 817-992-1117 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 07:24:11 AM PST US Subject: Re: Europa-List: FW: AIRCRAFT - PICTURES - (90204) - Salvage exercise on the frozen Hudson! From: rparigor@suffolk.lib.ny.us No attachments came through. I have a sequence of the lift if anyone wants to have a look: http://www.europaowners.org/modules.php?set_albumName=album258&op=modload&name=gallery&file=index&include=view_album.php It's in the album with LEDs shining on the hangar door. Not only did theymanage to fish out plane, but must be anal as well. Notice pic where they are cleaning off river grunge so they do not dirty deck more than needed! Ron Parigoris ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 07:35:01 AM PST US From: JEFF ROBERTS Subject: Re: Europa-List: First Flight Kit #A221 - N914XL Roger, Let us all know that feeling you have when you fly her for the first time. I need a boost to get mine out of the add mods and annual phase! Congratulations Roger!!! Jeff R. A258 - N128LJ / Gold Rush 176 hours and down for the winter annual. On Feb 4, 2009, at 9:18 PM, Robert Borger wrote: > > My Friends, > > Today, 2009 02 04, at 1845 hrs CST (0045Z) Europa Kit #A221 registered > in the U.S.A. as N914XL took to flight for the first time from Denton > County Municipal Airport (KDTO), Denton, Texas. N914XL was piloted > most ably by Gary Platner, one of the finest pilots known by the > builder. Mr. Platner flew the aircraft for 15 minutes overhead the > airport performing a series of control tests as well as stalls > gear/flaps up and gear/flaps down. The stalls broke straight ahead > with no tendency to fall off to either side and the aircraft was in > proper trim at all speeds tested (up to 130 kts indicated). > > Winds were from 150D at 5 kts gusting to 8 kts, temperature was 55F > (13C), altimeter setting 29.87. > > The sun set before the builder was able to fly. I expect that I shall > make my own first flight this weekend. > > Pics and videos of the first flight will be posted as soon as possible. > > As they say in Texas "YEEEEEEEEE HAAAWWWWWWW!) > > Check six, > Bob Borger > Europa Kit #A221 N914XL, XS Mono, Intercooled 914, Airmaster C/S > http://www.europaowners.org/N914XL > Now Flying! > 3705 Lynchburg Dr. > Corinth, TX 76208 > Home: 940-497-2123 > Cel: 817-992-1117 > > ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 07:48:55 AM PST US Subject: Re: Europa-List: First Flight Kit #A221 - N914XL From: "josok" Congratulations Bob, So nice to hear and enjoy now! Regards, Jos Okhuijsen Visit - www.EuropaOwners.org ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 07:56:43 AM PST US From: Jeff B Subject: Re: Europa-List: First Flight Kit #A221 - N914XL No, no, it was "roger" like in roger that... :) Sorry, must have been the long Tiger Woods golf game last night... :) Jeff - Baby Blue JEFF ROBERTS wrote: > > Roger, > Let us all know that feeling you have when you fly her for the first > time. I need a boost to get mine out of the add mods and annual phase! > Congratulations Roger!!! > > Jeff R. > A258 - N128LJ / Gold Rush 176 hours and down for the winter annual. > > > On Feb 4, 2009, at 9:18 PM, Robert Borger wrote: > >> >> My Friends, >> >> Today, 2009 02 04, at 1845 hrs CST (0045Z) Europa Kit #A221 registered >> in the U.S.A. as N914XL took to flight for the first time from Denton >> County Municipal Airport (KDTO), Denton, Texas. N914XL was piloted >> most ably by Gary Platner, one of the finest pilots known by the >> builder. Mr. Platner flew the aircraft for 15 minutes overhead the >> airport performing a series of control tests as well as stalls >> gear/flaps up and gear/flaps down. The stalls broke straight ahead >> with no tendency to fall off to either side and the aircraft was in >> proper trim at all speeds tested (up to 130 kts indicated). >> >> Winds were from 150D at 5 kts gusting to 8 kts, temperature was 55F >> (13C), altimeter setting 29.87. >> >> The sun set before the builder was able to fly. I expect that I shall >> make my own first flight this weekend. >> >> Pics and videos of the first flight will be posted as soon as possible. >> >> As they say in Texas "YEEEEEEEEE HAAAWWWWWWW!) >> >> Check six, >> Bob Borger >> Europa Kit #A221 N914XL, XS Mono, Intercooled 914, Airmaster C/S >> http://www.europaowners.org/N914XL >> Now Flying! >> 3705 Lynchburg Dr. >> Corinth, TX 76208 >> Home: 940-497-2123 >> Cel: 817-992-1117 >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 08:22:39 AM PST US From: JEFF ROBERTS Subject: Re: Europa-List: First Flight Kit #A221 - N914XL No no, it was my multitasking skills or lack of. I've been on the phone, writing scripts, answering e-mails, and putting out fires all morning! I tell you it seems I'm working twice as hard to make half as much thru this recession! My apologies Bob and Congratulations to you... not Roger! I have not a clue where the roger thing came from. Toooo much stuff going on!! Anyway let us know when you fly yourself. Jeff R. A258 - N128LJ / Gold Rush 176 hours and down for the annual. On Feb 5, 2009, at 9:55 AM, Jeff B wrote: > > No, no, it was "roger" like in roger that... :) > > Sorry, must have been the long Tiger Woods golf game last night... :) > > Jeff - Baby Blue > > JEFF ROBERTS wrote: >> Roger, >> Let us all know that feeling you have when you fly her for the first >> time. I need a boost to get mine out of the add mods and annual >> phase! >> Congratulations Roger!!! >> Jeff R. >> A258 - N128LJ / Gold Rush 176 hours and down for the winter annual. >> On Feb 4, 2009, at 9:18 PM, Robert Borger wrote: >>> >>> My Friends, >>> >>> Today, 2009 02 04, at 1845 hrs CST (0045Z) Europa Kit #A221 >>> registered in the U.S.A. as N914XL took to flight for the first time >>> from Denton County Municipal Airport (KDTO), Denton, Texas. N914XL >>> was piloted most ably by Gary Platner, one of the finest pilots >>> known by the builder. Mr. Platner flew the aircraft for 15 minutes >>> overhead the airport performing a series of control tests as well as >>> stalls gear/flaps up and gear/flaps down. The stalls broke straight >>> ahead with no tendency to fall off to either side and the aircraft >>> was in proper trim at all speeds tested (up to 130 kts indicated). >>> >>> Winds were from 150D at 5 kts gusting to 8 kts, temperature was 55F >>> (13C), altimeter setting 29.87. >>> >>> The sun set before the builder was able to fly. I expect that I >>> shall make my own first flight this weekend. >>> >>> Pics and videos of the first flight will be posted as soon as >>> possible. >>> >>> As they say in Texas "YEEEEEEEEE HAAAWWWWWWW!) >>> >>> Check six, >>> Bob Borger >>> Europa Kit #A221 N914XL, XS Mono, Intercooled 914, Airmaster C/S >>> http://www.europaowners.org/N914XL >>> Now Flying! >>> 3705 Lynchburg Dr. >>> Corinth, TX 76208 >>> Home: 940-497-2123 >>> Cel: 817-992-1117 >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >> -- >> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > > ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 08:40:52 AM PST US From: Bob Borger Subject: Re: Europa-List: First Flight Kit #A221 - N914XL Phred, I mean Jeff, No problem. I seem to get that Roger thing on a regular basis. I hope to post video of the first flight and first landing on You Tube this evening. If I get the pics from Tommy, I'll post some stills on Europa Owners as well. Will let the Forum know when all are posted and available for viewing. Check six, Bob On Thursday, February 05, 2009, at 10:20AM, "JEFF ROBERTS" wrote: > >No no, it was my multitasking skills or lack of. I've been on the >phone, writing scripts, answering e-mails, and putting out fires all >morning! I tell you it seems I'm working twice as hard to make half as >much thru this recession! > >My apologies Bob and Congratulations to you... not Roger! I have not a >clue where the roger thing came from. Toooo much stuff going on!! >Anyway let us know when you fly yourself. > >Jeff R. >A258 - N128LJ / Gold Rush 176 hours and down for the annual. ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 09:07:35 AM PST US Subject: Re: Europa-List: First Flight Kit #A221 - N914XL From: Peter Zutrauen A Hearty Congrats Bob! You provide yet another inspiring story to motivate my pile of parts :-) I'm looking forward to the vids and pics! It would be great if you could title/tag the youtube vids with "Europa" and "homebuilt" somewhere in their name so they come up with a quick search. Blue skies and best wishes for a snag-free fly-off. Cheers, Pete A239 On Wed, Feb 4, 2009 at 10:18 PM, Robert Borger wrote: > > My Friends, > > Today, 2009 02 04, at 1845 hrs CST (0045Z) Europa Kit #A221 registered in > the U.S.A. as N914XL took to flight for the first time from Denton County > Municipal Airport (KDTO), Denton, Texas. N914XL was piloted most ably by > Gary Platner, one of the finest pilots known by the builder. Mr. Platner > flew the aircraft for 15 minutes overhead the airport performing a series of > control tests as well as stalls gear/flaps up and gear/flaps down. The > stalls broke straight ahead with no tendency to fall off to either side and > the aircraft was in proper trim at all speeds tested (up to 130 kts > indicated). > > Winds were from 150D at 5 kts gusting to 8 kts, temperature was 55F (13C), > altimeter setting 29.87. > > The sun set before the builder was able to fly. I expect that I shall make > my own first flight this weekend. > > Pics and videos of the first flight will be posted as soon as possible. > > As they say in Texas "YEEEEEEEEE HAAAWWWWWWW!) > > Check six, > Bob Borger > Europa Kit #A221 N914XL, XS Mono, Intercooled 914, Airmaster C/S > http://www.europaowners.org/N914XL > Now Flying! > 3705 Lynchburg Dr. > Corinth, TX 76208 > Home: 940-497-2123 > Cel: 817-992-1117 > > ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 12:38:46 PM PST US From: "Fergus Kyle" Subject: Europa-List: 914 - 912? Cheers, I'm not sure the 912 doesn't have the same 914 dynamo regulator, but (914) I'm having the d@#$%^st time attaching bottom plug with the plethora of "quick-connect" females imbedded to receive the male counterparts. It seems there's too much play in the design to enable every male to join inside. If you had this symptom as well, perhaps you have a favourite insertion method to overcome the slop? If that's the case, would you kindly share what subterfuge you use? It might just save me one of hundreds of provoking delays I seem to enjoy. Please, Ferg ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 01:19:41 PM PST US From: "Fergus Kyle" Subject: Europa-List: RE: Europa-List Digest: 18 Msgs - 02/04/09 Congratulations, Bob! Ferg -----Original Message----- From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Europa-List Digest Server Sent: 5-Feb-09 2:58 AM Subject: Europa-List Digest: 18 Msgs - 02/04/09 * ================================================= Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive ================================================= Today's complete Europa-List Digest can also be found in either of the two Web Links listed below. The .html file includes the Digest formatted in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked Indexes and Message Navigation. The .txt file includes the plain ASCII version of the Europa-List Digest and can be viewed with a generic text editor such as Notepad or with a web browser. HTML Version: http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=html&Chapter 09-02-04&Archive=Europa Text Version: http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=txt&Chapter 2009-02-04&Archive=Europa =============================================== EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive =============================================== ---------------------------------------------------------- Europa-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Wed 02/04/09: 18 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 12:09 AM - Re: Grand Rapids EIS Problem (Rowland Carson) 2. 02:18 AM - Re: More testing videos (Greg Fuchs) 3. 10:19 AM - Re;- Trial Flight - UK Owners (G-IANI) 4. 10:35 AM - GPS NMEA data transfer to the autopilot (Raimo Toivio) 5. 10:50 AM - Re: GPS NMEA data transfer to the autopilot (Pete Lawless) 6. 11:29 AM - Re: GPS NMEA data transfer to the autopilot (Raimo Toivio) 7. 11:31 AM - Re: GPS NMEA data transfer to the autopilot (JEFF ROBERTS) 8. 12:05 PM - Re: GPS NMEA data transfer to the autopilot (Raimo Toivio) 9. 12:43 PM - Re: GPS NMEA data transfer to the autopilot (JEFF ROBERTS) 10. 01:10 PM - Re: Re;- Trial Flight - UK Owners (Robert C Harrison) 11. 01:11 PM - Re: GPS NMEA data transfer to the autopilot (Pete Lawless) 12. 01:41 PM - Re: GPS NMEA data transfer to the autopilot (Raimo Toivio) 13. 02:07 PM - Re: GPS NMEA data transfer to the autopilot (Raimo Toivio) 14. 05:03 PM - Re: Wing Walk Tape (Troy Maynor) 15. 05:40 PM - Re: Re: Wing Walk Tape (Fred Klein) 16. 07:20 PM - First Flight Kit #A221 - N914XL (Robert Borger) 17. 07:49 PM - Re: First Flight Kit #A221 - N914XL (rparigor@suffolk.lib.ny.us) 18. 11:21 PM - Re: First Flight Kit #A221 - N914XL (Fred Klein) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 12:09:26 AM PST US From: Rowland Carson Subject: Re: Europa-List: Grand Rapids EIS Problem At 2009-02-03 20:51 -0600 Martin Tuck wrote: >Upon closer inspection I found that the earth connector and wire was >being held together by the heatshrink tube and some flexing >indicated a fracture - caused by vibration no doubt - although I am >surprised at that. > >Anyhow, all is soldered up Martin - it sounds as though the solder joint was the cause of the fracture. That's why crimps are preferred for most aircraft wiring terminations. If you have to make a solder joint, it needs to be supported well back along the insulation. This is because the solder "wicks" along the wire back from the joint and thus makes it inflexible. The usual point of failure is at the interface between the solder-stiffened length and the original flexible state, and this can be a surprisingly long way from the termination. As you've found, heatshrink is not enough support, it really needs to be secured for some length onto something rigidly attached to the thing it's soldered onto. regards Rowland -- | Rowland Carson LAA #16532 http://home.clara.net/rowil/aviation/ | 1180 hours building Europa #435 G-ROWI e-mail ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 02:18:15 AM PST US From: "Greg Fuchs " Subject: RE: Europa-List: More testing videos LOVE all the Europa videos on youtube. Wish there were more. DO NOT ARCHIVE ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 10:19:13 AM PST US From: "G-IANI" Subject: Europa-List: Re;- Trial Flight - UK Owners The Factory has a serious buyer who would like a trial flight and possibly to talk to a local builder. John would like to arrange this as soon as possible but the buyer is aware that the weather will largely dictate when this takes place. He is located at Milton Kenyes. Can anyone, located near to his home, offer to do this? If so please contact me on 01483 714096 or talk to John Wheeler at the Factory. Ian Rickard G-IANI XS Trigear, 200 hours Europa Club Mods Rep (Trigear) e-mail mods@europaclub.org.uk or direct g-iani@ntlworld.com ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 10:35:41 AM PST US From: "Raimo Toivio" Subject: Europa-List: GPS NMEA data transfer to the autopilot All who have been there I am just now connecting my autopilot (Trio) to GPS (Garmin 296). Doing it in a hangar - no seenable satellites. Question: when GPS is in a simulation mode, is there NMEA 0183 data out then? I have tried data out 1 /violet wire /com 1 and data out 2 /blue wire /com 2 but "No GPS" message in autopilots display. Tried also all the possible NMEA "advanced settings". Any ideas? Should I find an oscilloscope? Cannot go out to find real satellites... Thanks, Raimo OH-XRT ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 10:50:31 AM PST US From: "Pete Lawless" Subject: RE: Europa-List: GPS NMEA data transfer to the autopilot Hi Raimo There is non from my 496 in simulation mode so I would assume the 296 is the same. Pete -----Original Message----- From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Raimo Toivio Sent: 04 February 2009 18:35 Subject: Europa-List: GPS NMEA data transfer to the autopilot All who have been there I am just now connecting my autopilot (Trio) to GPS (Garmin 296). Doing it in a hangar - no seenable satellites. Question: when GPS is in a simulation mode, is there NMEA 0183 data out then? I have tried data out 1 /violet wire /com 1 and data out 2 /blue wire /com 2 but "No GPS" message in autopilots display. Tried also all the possible NMEA "advanced settings". Any ideas? Should I find an oscilloscope? Cannot go out to find real satellites... Thanks, Raimo OH-XRT -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 11:29:31 AM PST US From: "Raimo Toivio" Subject: Re: Europa-List: GPS NMEA data transfer to the autopilot Pete, thats good to know, thanks. Strange why there is not? I have to obviously find an external antenna with 30 feet cabel to see real satellites and test NMEA trafic. ***What about Garmin NMEA then when GPS unit is not moving actually any knots? For example King KLN-XX models will not output a valid data link signal until a certain groundspeed has been attained. Wanna be sure about my connections before closing my panel. It has been said many times but again: this forum is great. And fast! Raimo ----- Original Message ----- From: "Pete Lawless" Sent: Wednesday, February 04, 2009 8:49 PM Subject: RE: Europa-List: GPS NMEA data transfer to the autopilot Hi Raimo There is non from my 496 in simulation mode so I would assume the 296 is the same. Pete -----Original Message----- From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Raimo Toivio Sent: 04 February 2009 18:35 Subject: Europa-List: GPS NMEA data transfer to the autopilot All who have been there I am just now connecting my autopilot (Trio) to GPS (Garmin 296). Doing it in a hangar - no seenable satellites. Question: when GPS is in a simulation mode, is there NMEA 0183 data out then? I have tried data out 1 /violet wire /com 1 and data out 2 /blue wire /com 2 but "No GPS" message in autopilots display. Tried also all the possible NMEA "advanced settings". Any ideas? Should I find an oscilloscope? Cannot go out to find real satellites... Thanks, Raimo OH-XRT -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 11:31:56 AM PST US From: JEFF ROBERTS Subject: Re: Europa-List: GPS NMEA data transfer to the autopilot Ramio, You will need a satellite signal to test it. Mine wouldn't work with the GPS in it's simulation mode. I too have a trio and it works great but... I had a lot of intermittent trouble of losing the GPS NMEA output signal. After changing out the head of the autopilot and the GPS and all the wiring and flying without it for months it became apparent that I needed a ground. The instructions said if your GPS power is coming from the plane then you didn't need the ground for the auto pilot signal. But I think they we're just so use to putting these things in metal planes. Anyway I take my signal from an av-map 4 so it's NMEA out was a yellow wire only. Once I ran a signal ground everything worked perfectly. Get it working because the product is a very good and the support from them is even better. Jeff R. A258 - N128LJ / Gold Rush 176 hours and climbing slowly. Down for annual and mods. On Feb 4, 2009, at 12:34 PM, Raimo Toivio wrote: > > All who have been there > > I am just now connecting my autopilot (Trio) to GPS (Garmin 296). > Doing it in a hangar - no seenable satellites. > > Question: when GPS is in a simulation mode, is there NMEA 0183 data > out then? > > I have tried data out 1 /violet wire /com 1 and data out 2 /blue wire > /com 2 but "No GPS" message in autopilots display. Tried also all the > possible NMEA "advanced settings". > > Any ideas? Should I find an oscilloscope? Cannot go out to find real > satellites... > > Thanks, Raimo > OH-XRT > > ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 12:05:09 PM PST US From: "Raimo Toivio" Subject: Re: Europa-List: GPS NMEA data transfer to the autopilot Jeff, thanks for support! Do you remember did you connect Trios pin 8 which is black and twisted with green (pin 7) to the plane ground or to the GPS Data In TXD or both? This question is really confusing also me. As you said Trios support is great but they cannot help me because they have a wrong (old) wiring diagram for Garmin 296. Obviously 296 is only Garmin model using violet wire to the NMEA output - all the other use blue one they say. Raimo My plane looks now like it has never been airborne (and never will) ;((( ----- Original Message ----- From: "JEFF ROBERTS" Sent: Wednesday, February 04, 2009 9:30 PM Subject: Re: Europa-List: GPS NMEA data transfer to the autopilot Ramio, You will need a satellite signal to test it. Mine wouldn't work with the GPS in it's simulation mode. I too have a trio and it works great but... I had a lot of intermittent trouble of losing the GPS NMEA output signal. After changing out the head of the autopilot and the GPS and all the wiring and flying without it for months it became apparent that I needed a ground. The instructions said if your GPS power is coming from the plane then you didn't need the ground for the auto pilot signal. But I think they we're just so use to putting these things in metal planes. Anyway I take my signal from an av-map 4 so it's NMEA out was a yellow wire only. Once I ran a signal ground everything worked perfectly. Get it working because the product is a very good and the support from them is even better. Jeff R. A258 - N128LJ / Gold Rush 176 hours and climbing slowly. Down for annual and mods. On Feb 4, 2009, at 12:34 PM, Raimo Toivio wrote: > > All who have been there > > I am just now connecting my autopilot (Trio) to GPS (Garmin 296). > Doing it in a hangar - no seenable satellites. > > Question: when GPS is in a simulation mode, is there NMEA 0183 data > out then? > > I have tried data out 1 /violet wire /com 1 and data out 2 /blue wire > /com 2 but "No GPS" message in autopilots display. Tried also all the > possible NMEA "advanced settings". > > Any ideas? Should I find an oscilloscope? Cannot go out to find real > satellites... > > Thanks, Raimo > OH-XRT > > ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 12:43:14 PM PST US From: JEFF ROBERTS Subject: Re: Europa-List: GPS NMEA data transfer to the autopilot Raimo, I used my navaid servo so I had a harness to wire to but the same data eventually goes to the same pin on the trio head. My notes say that the GPS or NMEA out signal is to go into pin 7 on the head. The ground coming from the GPS is to go to a ground then to the black wire only and it goes to pin 10 on the trio head. The servo ground goes to pin 9 on the head as they are separate. I see nothing about twisting two wires together or using pin 8. I'm assuming you have the wiring harness from trio that has the head connector wired but the other end is the exposed wires right? Jeff R. A258 - N128LJ / Gold Rush 176 hours and climbing slowly. On Feb 4, 2009, at 2:07 PM, Raimo Toivio wrote: > > Jeff, thanks for support! > > Do you remember did you connect Trios pin 8 which is black and > twisted with green (pin 7) to the plane ground or to the GPS Data In > TXD or both? This question is really confusing also me. > > As you said Trios support is great but they cannot help me because > they have a wrong (old) wiring diagram for Garmin 296. Obviously 296 > is only Garmin model using violet wire to the NMEA output - all the > other use blue one they say. > > Raimo > > My plane looks now like it has never been airborne (and never will) > ;((( > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "JEFF ROBERTS" > To: > Sent: Wednesday, February 04, 2009 9:30 PM > Subject: Re: Europa-List: GPS NMEA data transfer to the autopilot > > > Ramio, > You will need a satellite signal to test it. Mine wouldn't work with > the GPS in it's simulation mode. I too have a trio and it works great > but... I had a lot of intermittent trouble of losing the GPS NMEA > output signal. After changing out the head of the autopilot and the GPS > and all the wiring and flying without it for months it became apparent > that I needed a ground. The instructions said if your GPS power is > coming from the plane then you didn't need the ground for the auto > pilot signal. But I think they we're just so use to putting these > things in metal planes. > Anyway I take my signal from an av-map 4 so it's NMEA out was a yellow > wire only. Once I ran a signal ground everything worked perfectly. > Get it working because the product is a very good and the support from > them is even better. > > Jeff R. > A258 - N128LJ / Gold Rush 176 hours and climbing slowly. Down for > annual and mods. > > On Feb 4, 2009, at 12:34 PM, Raimo Toivio wrote: > >> >> >> All who have been there >> >> I am just now connecting my autopilot (Trio) to GPS (Garmin 296). >> Doing it in a hangar - no seenable satellites. >> >> Question: when GPS is in a simulation mode, is there NMEA 0183 data >> out then? >> >> I have tried data out 1 /violet wire /com 1 and data out 2 /blue wire >> /com 2 but "No GPS" message in autopilots display. Tried also all the >> possible NMEA "advanced settings". >> >> Any ideas? Should I find an oscilloscope? Cannot go out to find real >> satellites... >> >> Thanks, Raimo >> OH-XRT >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 01:10:14 PM PST US From: "Robert C Harrison" Subject: RE: Europa-List: Re;- Trial Flight - UK Owners A week ago he would have been welcome to Wickenby but I've grounded for a couple of months to fit Mode S. Let me know if you aren't fixed up by then,. Regards Bob H -----Original Message----- From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of G-IANI Sent: 04 February 2009 18:15 Subject: Europa-List: Re;- Trial Flight - UK Owners The Factory has a serious buyer who would like a trial flight and possibly to talk to a local builder. John would like to arrange this as soon as possible but the buyer is aware that the weather will largely dictate when this takes place. He is located at Milton Kenyes. Can anyone, located near to his home, offer to do this? If so please contact me on 01483 714096 or talk to John Wheeler at the Factory. Ian Rickard G-IANI XS Trigear, 200 hours Europa Club Mods Rep (Trigear) e-mail mods@europaclub.org.uk or direct g-iani@ntlworld.com ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 01:11:03 PM PST US From: "Pete Lawless" Subject: RE: Europa-List: GPS NMEA data transfer to the autopilot Raimo The 496 feed is there all the time when it has a valid signal. The over a speed bit is only for recording airborne time on Garmin as far as I am aware. Why no feed in simulation mode? Well suppose the autopilot followed a simulated signal? There are plenty of people out there who are stupid enough to sit and let it! Regards Pete -----Original Message----- From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Raimo Toivio Sent: 04 February 2009 19:32 Subject: Re: Europa-List: GPS NMEA data transfer to the autopilot Pete, thats good to know, thanks. Strange why there is not? I have to obviously find an external antenna with 30 feet cabel to see real satellites and test NMEA trafic. ***What about Garmin NMEA then when GPS unit is not moving actually any knots? For example King KLN-XX models will not output a valid data link signal until a certain groundspeed has been attained. Wanna be sure about my connections before closing my panel. It has been said many times but again: this forum is great. And fast! Raimo ----- Original Message ----- From: "Pete Lawless" Sent: Wednesday, February 04, 2009 8:49 PM Subject: RE: Europa-List: GPS NMEA data transfer to the autopilot Hi Raimo There is non from my 496 in simulation mode so I would assume the 296 is the same. Pete -----Original Message----- From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Raimo Toivio Sent: 04 February 2009 18:35 Subject: Europa-List: GPS NMEA data transfer to the autopilot All who have been there I am just now connecting my autopilot (Trio) to GPS (Garmin 296). Doing it in a hangar - no seenable satellites. Question: when GPS is in a simulation mode, is there NMEA 0183 data out then? I have tried data out 1 /violet wire /com 1 and data out 2 /blue wire /com 2 but "No GPS" message in autopilots display. Tried also all the possible NMEA "advanced settings". Any ideas? Should I find an oscilloscope? Cannot go out to find real satellites... Thanks, Raimo OH-XRT -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by Houxou, and is believed to be clean. ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 01:41:58 PM PST US From: "Raimo Toivio" Subject: Re: Europa-List: GPS NMEA data transfer to the autopilot OK Pete, Now I have a road to go further in this adventure, thanks! "Why no feed in simulation mode? Well suppose the autopilot followed a simulated signal? There are plenty of people out there who are stupid enough to sit and let it!" But there is a warning " do not use simulation mode for navigation purposes"... Raimo ----- Original Message ----- From: "Pete Lawless" Sent: Wednesday, February 04, 2009 11:10 PM Subject: RE: Europa-List: GPS NMEA data transfer to the autopilot Raimo The 496 feed is there all the time when it has a valid signal. The over a speed bit is only for recording airborne time on Garmin as far as I am aware. Why no feed in simulation mode? Well suppose the autopilot followed a simulated signal? There are plenty of people out there who are stupid enough to sit and let it! Regards Pete -----Original Message----- From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Raimo Toivio Sent: 04 February 2009 19:32 Subject: Re: Europa-List: GPS NMEA data transfer to the autopilot Pete, thats good to know, thanks. Strange why there is not? I have to obviously find an external antenna with 30 feet cabel to see real satellites and test NMEA trafic. ***What about Garmin NMEA then when GPS unit is not moving actually any knots? For example King KLN-XX models will not output a valid data link signal until a certain groundspeed has been attained. Wanna be sure about my connections before closing my panel. It has been said many times but again: this forum is great. And fast! Raimo ----- Original Message ----- From: "Pete Lawless" Sent: Wednesday, February 04, 2009 8:49 PM Subject: RE: Europa-List: GPS NMEA data transfer to the autopilot Hi Raimo There is non from my 496 in simulation mode so I would assume the 296 is the same. Pete -----Original Message----- From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Raimo Toivio Sent: 04 February 2009 18:35 Subject: Europa-List: GPS NMEA data transfer to the autopilot All who have been there I am just now connecting my autopilot (Trio) to GPS (Garmin 296). Doing it in a hangar - no seenable satellites. Question: when GPS is in a simulation mode, is there NMEA 0183 data out then? I have tried data out 1 /violet wire /com 1 and data out 2 /blue wire /com 2 but "No GPS" message in autopilots display. Tried also all the possible NMEA "advanced settings". Any ideas? Should I find an oscilloscope? Cannot go out to find real satellites... Thanks, Raimo OH-XRT -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by Houxou, and is believed to be clean. ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 02:07:50 PM PST US From: "Raimo Toivio" Subject: Re: Europa-List: GPS NMEA data transfer to the autopilot Jeff "I'm assuming you have the wiring harness from trio that has the head connector wired but the other end is the exposed wires right?" Yes I have and in my Trio wiring diagram pin 10 is for servo cables shield, not for GPS ground. Servo ground is pin 9 like yours. They are also connected together in the servo connector. Gold servo and Navaid servo diagrams are same when looking connector J1. Servo connector diagrams are different: Navaid has three and Gold has four but green one is unconnected. NMEA out to pin 7 like you wrote. GPS data ground to pin 8. I assume "GPS data ground" is same as Garmins GPS data in TXD? I hope I had problems only because I assumed (Garmin) GPS simulation mode is ok for testing NMEA. Thanks, Raimo (who said this should be easy for "a man in the deep forest") ----- Original Message ----- From: "JEFF ROBERTS" Sent: Wednesday, February 04, 2009 10:41 PM Subject: Re: Europa-List: GPS NMEA data transfer to the autopilot Raimo, I used my navaid servo so I had a harness to wire to but the same data eventually goes to the same pin on the trio head. My notes say that the GPS or NMEA out signal is to go into pin 7 on the head. The ground coming from the GPS is to go to a ground then to the black wire only and it goes to pin 10 on the trio head. The servo ground goes to pin 9 on the head as they are separate. I see nothing about twisting two wires together or using pin 8. I'm assuming you have the wiring harness from trio that has the head connector wired but the other end is the exposed wires right? Jeff R. A258 - N128LJ / Gold Rush 176 hours and climbing slowly. On Feb 4, 2009, at 2:07 PM, Raimo Toivio wrote: > > Jeff, thanks for support! > > Do you remember did you connect Trios pin 8 which is black and > twisted with green (pin 7) to the plane ground or to the GPS Data In > TXD or both? This question is really confusing also me. > > As you said Trios support is great but they cannot help me because > they have a wrong (old) wiring diagram for Garmin 296. Obviously 296 > is only Garmin model using violet wire to the NMEA output - all the > other use blue one they say. > > Raimo > > My plane looks now like it has never been airborne (and never will) > ;((( > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "JEFF ROBERTS" > To: > Sent: Wednesday, February 04, 2009 9:30 PM > Subject: Re: Europa-List: GPS NMEA data transfer to the autopilot > > > Ramio, > You will need a satellite signal to test it. Mine wouldn't work with > the GPS in it's simulation mode. I too have a trio and it works great > but... I had a lot of intermittent trouble of losing the GPS NMEA > output signal. After changing out the head of the autopilot and the GPS > and all the wiring and flying without it for months it became apparent > that I needed a ground. The instructions said if your GPS power is > coming from the plane then you didn't need the ground for the auto > pilot signal. But I think they we're just so use to putting these > things in metal planes. > Anyway I take my signal from an av-map 4 so it's NMEA out was a yellow > wire only. Once I ran a signal ground everything worked perfectly. > Get it working because the product is a very good and the support from > them is even better. > > Jeff R. > A258 - N128LJ / Gold Rush 176 hours and climbing slowly. Down for > annual and mods. > > On Feb 4, 2009, at 12:34 PM, Raimo Toivio wrote: > >> >> >> All who have been there >> >> I am just now connecting my autopilot (Trio) to GPS (Garmin 296). >> Doing it in a hangar - no seenable satellites. >> >> Question: when GPS is in a simulation mode, is there NMEA 0183 data >> out then? >> >> I have tried data out 1 /violet wire /com 1 and data out 2 /blue wire >> /com 2 but "No GPS" message in autopilots display. Tried also all the >> possible NMEA "advanced settings". >> >> Any ideas? Should I find an oscilloscope? Cannot go out to find real >> satellites... >> >> Thanks, Raimo >> OH-XRT >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 05:03:24 PM PST US From: "Troy Maynor" Subject: Europa-List: Re: Wing Walk Tape All, Thanks for all the great ideas on wing walk. NOW all I have to do is make up my mind, since they all make perfect sense. ;) Troy Maynor > ORIGINAL MESSAGE > From: "Troy Maynor" > Subject: Europa-List: Wing Walk Tape > Hey Fellow Europa Folks, > Hope all are flying or building well. Question: for you that have put > wing walk on, how wide a path is best up the wing? ACS sell some that is > clear and is 16" x 30" and another variety that comes in 6" or 12" wide, > sold by the lineal foot. I was thinking of buying one of the 16" x 30" > and splitting it down the middle to do both wings. I think the clear or > translucent would be preferable to white or black. White would most > likely not be the matching shade to the white on the plane and black > would cook the wing. Thoughts? > Troy Maynor > ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 05:40:10 PM PST US From: Fred Klein Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re: Wing Walk Tape On Feb 4, 2009, at 5:00 PM, Troy Maynor wrote: > NOW all I have to do is make up my mind, It beats sorting oranges...just think about it, all day long...decisions, decisions, decisions. Fred do not archive -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 07:20:10 PM PST US From: Robert Borger Subject: Europa-List: First Flight Kit #A221 - N914XL My Friends, Today, 2009 02 04, at 1845 hrs CST (0045Z) Europa Kit #A221 registered in the U.S.A. as N914XL took to flight for the first time from Denton County Municipal Airport (KDTO), Denton, Texas. N914XL was piloted most ably by Gary Platner, one of the finest pilots known by the builder. Mr. Platner flew the aircraft for 15 minutes overhead the airport performing a series of control tests as well as stalls gear/ flaps up and gear/flaps down. The stalls broke straight ahead with no tendency to fall off to either side and the aircraft was in proper trim at all speeds tested (up to 130 kts indicated). Winds were from 150D at 5 kts gusting to 8 kts, temperature was 55F (13C), altimeter setting 29.87. The sun set before the builder was able to fly. I expect that I shall make my own first flight this weekend. Pics and videos of the first flight will be posted as soon as possible. As they say in Texas "YEEEEEEEEE HAAAWWWWWWW!) Check six, Bob Borger Europa Kit #A221 N914XL, XS Mono, Intercooled 914, Airmaster C/S http://www.europaowners.org/N914XL Now Flying! 3705 Lynchburg Dr. Corinth, TX 76208 Home: 940-497-2123 Cel: 817-992-1117 ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 07:49:30 PM PST US Subject: Re: Europa-List: First Flight Kit #A221 - N914XL From: rparigor@suffolk.lib.ny.us Hi Bob "Today, 2009 02 04, at 1845 hrs CST (0045Z) Europa Kit #A221 registered > in the U.S.A. as N914XL took to flight for the first time from Denton > County Municipal Airport (KDTO), Denton, Texas." CONGRATULATIONS! Ron Parigoris ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 11:21:55 PM PST US From: Fred Klein Subject: Re: Europa-List: First Flight Kit #A221 - N914XL A very hearty Congratulations Bob! Just yesterday I was perusing your build albums...you've really done a wonderful...and thorough...job. Now the real fun begins...I am quite envious. Happy landings,j Fred A194 On Feb 4, 2009, at 7:18 PM, Robert Borger wrote: > > My Friends, > > Today, 2009 02 04, at 1845 hrs CST (0045Z) Europa Kit #A221 > registered in the U.S.A. as N914XL took to flight for the first time > from Denton County Municipal Airport (KDTO), Denton, Texas. -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 01:49:11 PM PST US From: Robert Borger Subject: Re: Europa-List: RE: Europa-List Digest: 18 Msgs - 02/04/09 Ferg, Thanks! As for the plug, make sure the female plugs are fully inserted into the big plug. The little plugs must be fast on the big plug for them to align properly. Hope this helps, Bob Sent from my iPhone On Feb 5, 2009, at 15:17, Fergus Kyle wrote: > > Congratulations, Bob! > Ferg > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Europa- > List > Digest Server > Sent: 5-Feb-09 2:58 AM > To: Europa-List Digest List > Subject: Europa-List Digest: 18 Msgs - 02/04/09 > > * > > ================================================= > Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive > ================================================= > > Today's complete Europa-List Digest can also be found in either of the > two Web Links listed below. The .html file includes the Digest > formatted > in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked > Indexes > and Message Navigation. The .txt file includes the plain ASCII > version > of the Europa-List Digest and can be viewed with a generic text editor > such as Notepad or with a web browser. > > HTML Version: > > > http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=html&Chapter > 09-02-04&Archive=Europa > > Text Version: > > > http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=txt&Chapter > 2009-02-04&Archive=Europa > > > =============================================== > EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive > =============================================== > > > ---------------------------------------------------------- > Europa-List Digest Archive > --- > Total Messages Posted Wed 02/04/09: 18 > ---------------------------------------------------------- > > > Today's Message Index: > ---------------------- > > 1. 12:09 AM - Re: Grand Rapids EIS Problem (Rowland Carson) > 2. 02:18 AM - Re: More testing videos (Greg Fuchs) > 3. 10:19 AM - Re;- Trial Flight - UK Owners (G-IANI) > 4. 10:35 AM - GPS NMEA data transfer to the autopilot (Raimo > Toivio) > 5. 10:50 AM - Re: GPS NMEA data transfer to the autopilot (Pete > Lawless) > 6. 11:29 AM - Re: GPS NMEA data transfer to the autopilot (Raimo > Toivio) > 7. 11:31 AM - Re: GPS NMEA data transfer to the autopilot (JEFF > ROBERTS) > 8. 12:05 PM - Re: GPS NMEA data transfer to the autopilot (Raimo > Toivio) > 9. 12:43 PM - Re: GPS NMEA data transfer to the autopilot (JEFF > ROBERTS) > 10. 01:10 PM - Re: Re;- Trial Flight - UK Owners (Robert C > Harrison) > 11. 01:11 PM - Re: GPS NMEA data transfer to the autopilot (Pete > Lawless) > 12. 01:41 PM - Re: GPS NMEA data transfer to the autopilot (Raimo > Toivio) > 13. 02:07 PM - Re: GPS NMEA data transfer to the autopilot (Raimo > Toivio) > 14. 05:03 PM - Re: Wing Walk Tape (Troy Maynor) > 15. 05:40 PM - Re: Re: Wing Walk Tape (Fred Klein) > 16. 07:20 PM - First Flight Kit #A221 - N914XL (Robert Borger) > 17. 07:49 PM - Re: First Flight Kit #A221 - N914XL > (rparigor@suffolk.lib.ny.us) > 18. 11:21 PM - Re: First Flight Kit #A221 - N914XL (Fred Klein) > > > ________________________________ Message 1 > _____________________________________ > > > Time: 12:09:26 AM PST US > From: Rowland Carson > Subject: Re: Europa-List: Grand Rapids EIS Problem > > > At 2009-02-03 20:51 -0600 Martin Tuck wrote: > >> Upon closer inspection I found that the earth connector and wire was >> being held together by the heatshrink tube and some flexing >> indicated a fracture - caused by vibration no doubt - although I am >> surprised at that. >> >> Anyhow, all is soldered up > > Martin - it sounds as though the solder joint was the cause of the > fracture. That's why crimps are preferred for most aircraft wiring > terminations. If you have to make a solder joint, it needs to be > supported well back along the insulation. This is because the solder > "wicks" along the wire back from the joint and thus makes it > inflexible. The usual point of failure is at the interface between > the solder-stiffened length and the original flexible state, and this > can be a surprisingly long way from the termination. As you've found, > heatshrink is not enough support, it really needs to be secured for > some length onto something rigidly attached to the thing it's > soldered onto. > > regards > > Rowland > -- > > > ________________________________ Message 2 > _____________________________________ > > > Time: 02:18:15 AM PST US > From: "Greg Fuchs " > Subject: RE: Europa-List: More testing videos > > > LOVE all the Europa videos on youtube. Wish there were more. > > DO NOT ARCHIVE > > > ________________________________ Message 3 > _____________________________________ > > > Time: 10:19:13 AM PST US > From: "G-IANI" > Subject: Europa-List: Re;- Trial Flight - UK Owners > > > The Factory has a serious buyer who would like a trial flight and > possibly > to talk to a local builder. John would like to arrange this as soon > as > possible but the buyer is aware that the weather will largely > dictate when > this takes place. > > He is located at Milton Kenyes. Can anyone, located near to his > home, offer > to do this? > > If so please contact me on 01483 714096 or talk to John Wheeler at the > Factory. > > > Ian Rickard G-IANI XS Trigear, 200 hours > Europa Club Mods Rep (Trigear) > e-mail mods@europaclub.org.uk > or direct g-iani@ntlworld.com > > > ________________________________ Message 4 > _____________________________________ > > > Time: 10:35:41 AM PST US > From: "Raimo Toivio" > Subject: Europa-List: GPS NMEA data transfer to the autopilot > > > All who have been there > > I am just now connecting my autopilot (Trio) to GPS (Garmin 296). > Doing it in a hangar - no seenable satellites. > > Question: when GPS is in a simulation mode, is there NMEA 0183 data > out > then? > > I have tried data out 1 /violet wire /com 1 and data out 2 /blue > wire /com 2 > but > "No GPS" message in autopilots display. Tried also all the possible > NMEA > "advanced > settings". > > Any ideas? Should I find an oscilloscope? Cannot go out to find real > satellites... > > Thanks, Raimo > OH-XRT > > > ________________________________ Message 5 > _____________________________________ > > > Time: 10:50:31 AM PST US > From: "Pete Lawless" > Subject: RE: Europa-List: GPS NMEA data transfer to the autopilot > > > Hi Raimo > > There is non from my 496 in simulation mode so I would assume the > 296 is the > same. > > Pete > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Raimo > Toivio > Sent: 04 February 2009 18:35 > Subject: Europa-List: GPS NMEA data transfer to the autopilot > > > All who have been there > > I am just now connecting my autopilot (Trio) to GPS (Garmin 296). > Doing it in a hangar - no seenable satellites. > > Question: when GPS is in a simulation mode, is there NMEA 0183 data > out > then? > > I have tried data out 1 /violet wire /com 1 and data out 2 /blue > wire /com 2 > but "No GPS" message in autopilots display. Tried also all the > possible > NMEA "advanced settings". > > Any ideas? Should I find an oscilloscope? Cannot go out to find real > satellites... > > Thanks, Raimo > OH-XRT > > > -- > This message has been scanned for viruses and > dangerous content by MailScanner, and is > believed to be clean. > > > ________________________________ Message 6 > _____________________________________ > > > Time: 11:29:31 AM PST US > From: "Raimo Toivio" > Subject: Re: Europa-List: GPS NMEA data transfer to the autopilot > > > Pete, > > thats good to know, thanks. Strange why there is not? > > I have to obviously find an external antenna with 30 feet cabel to > see real > satellites > and test NMEA trafic. > > ***What about Garmin NMEA then when GPS unit is not moving actually > any > knots? > > For example King KLN-XX models will not output a valid data link > signal > until a > certain groundspeed has been attained. > > Wanna be sure about my connections before closing my panel. > > It has been said many times but again: this forum is great. And fast! > > Raimo > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Pete Lawless" > Sent: Wednesday, February 04, 2009 8:49 PM > Subject: RE: Europa-List: GPS NMEA data transfer to the autopilot > > > Hi Raimo > > There is non from my 496 in simulation mode so I would assume the > 296 is the > same. > > Pete > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Raimo > Toivio > Sent: 04 February 2009 18:35 > Subject: Europa-List: GPS NMEA data transfer to the autopilot > > > All who have been there > > I am just now connecting my autopilot (Trio) to GPS (Garmin 296). > Doing it in a hangar - no seenable satellites. > > Question: when GPS is in a simulation mode, is there NMEA 0183 data > out > then? > > I have tried data out 1 /violet wire /com 1 and data out 2 /blue > wire /com 2 > but "No GPS" message in autopilots display. Tried also all the > possible > NMEA "advanced settings". > > Any ideas? Should I find an oscilloscope? Cannot go out to find real > satellites... > > Thanks, Raimo > OH-XRT > > > -- > This message has been scanned for viruses and > dangerous content by MailScanner, and is > believed to be clean. > > > ________________________________ Message 7 > _____________________________________ > > > Time: 11:31:56 AM PST US > From: JEFF ROBERTS > Subject: Re: Europa-List: GPS NMEA data transfer to the autopilot > > > Ramio, > You will need a satellite signal to test it. Mine wouldn't work with > the GPS in it's simulation mode. I too have a trio and it works great > but... I had a lot of intermittent trouble of losing the GPS NMEA > output signal. After changing out the head of the autopilot and the > GPS > and all the wiring and flying without it for months it became apparent > that I needed a ground. The instructions said if your GPS power is > coming from the plane then you didn't need the ground for the auto > pilot signal. But I think they we're just so use to putting these > things in metal planes. > Anyway I take my signal from an av-map 4 so it's NMEA out was a yellow > wire only. Once I ran a signal ground everything worked perfectly. > Get it working because the product is a very good and the support from > them is even better. > > Jeff R. > A258 - N128LJ / Gold Rush 176 hours and climbing slowly. Down for > annual and mods. > > On Feb 4, 2009, at 12:34 PM, Raimo Toivio wrote: > >> >> All who have been there >> >> I am just now connecting my autopilot (Trio) to GPS (Garmin 296). >> Doing it in a hangar - no seenable satellites. >> >> Question: when GPS is in a simulation mode, is there NMEA 0183 data >> out then? >> >> I have tried data out 1 /violet wire /com 1 and data out 2 /blue wire >> /com 2 but "No GPS" message in autopilots display. Tried also all the >> possible NMEA "advanced settings". >> >> Any ideas? Should I find an oscilloscope? Cannot go out to find real >> satellites... >> >> Thanks, Raimo >> OH-XRT >> >> > > > ________________________________ Message 8 > _____________________________________ > > > Time: 12:05:09 PM PST US > From: "Raimo Toivio" > Subject: Re: Europa-List: GPS NMEA data transfer to the autopilot > > > Jeff, thanks for support! > > Do you remember did you connect Trios pin 8 which is black and > twisted with > green > (pin 7) to the plane ground or to the GPS Data In TXD or both? This > question > is really confusing also me. > > As you said Trios support is great but they cannot help me because > they have > a > wrong (old) wiring diagram for Garmin 296. Obviously 296 is only > Garmin > model > using violet wire to the NMEA output - all the other use blue one > they say. > > Raimo > > My plane looks now like it has never been airborne (and never > will) ;((( > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "JEFF ROBERTS" > Sent: Wednesday, February 04, 2009 9:30 PM > Subject: Re: Europa-List: GPS NMEA data transfer to the autopilot > > > Ramio, > You will need a satellite signal to test it. Mine wouldn't work with > the GPS in it's simulation mode. I too have a trio and it works great > but... I had a lot of intermittent trouble of losing the GPS NMEA > output signal. After changing out the head of the autopilot and the > GPS > and all the wiring and flying without it for months it became apparent > that I needed a ground. The instructions said if your GPS power is > coming from the plane then you didn't need the ground for the auto > pilot signal. But I think they we're just so use to putting these > things in metal planes. > Anyway I take my signal from an av-map 4 so it's NMEA out was a yellow > wire only. Once I ran a signal ground everything worked perfectly. > Get it working because the product is a very good and the support from > them is even better. > > Jeff R. > A258 - N128LJ / Gold Rush 176 hours and climbing slowly. Down for > annual and mods. > > On Feb 4, 2009, at 12:34 PM, Raimo Toivio wrote: > >> >> All who have been there >> >> I am just now connecting my autopilot (Trio) to GPS (Garmin 296). >> Doing it in a hangar - no seenable satellites. >> >> Question: when GPS is in a simulation mode, is there NMEA 0183 data >> out then? >> >> I have tried data out 1 /violet wire /com 1 and data out 2 /blue wire >> /com 2 but "No GPS" message in autopilots display. Tried also all the >> possible NMEA "advanced settings". >> >> Any ideas? Should I find an oscilloscope? Cannot go out to find real >> satellites... >> >> Thanks, Raimo >> OH-XRT >> >> > > > ________________________________ Message 9 > _____________________________________ > > > Time: 12:43:14 PM PST US > From: JEFF ROBERTS > Subject: Re: Europa-List: GPS NMEA data transfer to the autopilot > > > Raimo, > I used my navaid servo so I had a harness to wire to but the same data > eventually goes to the same pin on the trio head. My notes say that > the GPS or NMEA out signal is to go into pin 7 on the head. The ground > coming from the GPS is to go to a ground then to the black wire only > and it goes to pin 10 on the trio head. The servo ground goes to pin 9 > on the head as they are separate. I see nothing about twisting two > wires together or using pin 8. I'm assuming you have the wiring > harness > from trio that has the head connector wired but the other end is the > exposed wires right? > Jeff R. > A258 - N128LJ / Gold Rush 176 hours and climbing slowly. > On Feb 4, 2009, at 2:07 PM, Raimo Toivio wrote: > >> >> Jeff, thanks for support! >> >> Do you remember did you connect Trios pin 8 which is black and >> twisted with green (pin 7) to the plane ground or to the GPS Data In >> TXD or both? This question is really confusing also me. >> >> As you said Trios support is great but they cannot help me because >> they have a wrong (old) wiring diagram for Garmin 296. Obviously 296 >> is only Garmin model using violet wire to the NMEA output - all the >> other use blue one they say. >> >> Raimo >> >> My plane looks now like it has never been airborne (and never will) >> ;((( >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "JEFF ROBERTS" >> To: >> Sent: Wednesday, February 04, 2009 9:30 PM >> Subject: Re: Europa-List: GPS NMEA data transfer to the autopilot >> >> >> >> Ramio, >> You will need a satellite signal to test it. Mine wouldn't work with >> the GPS in it's simulation mode. I too have a trio and it works great >> but... I had a lot of intermittent trouble of losing the GPS NMEA >> output signal. After changing out the head of the autopilot and the >> GPS >> and all the wiring and flying without it for months it became >> apparent >> that I needed a ground. The instructions said if your GPS power is >> coming from the plane then you didn't need the ground for the auto >> pilot signal. But I think they we're just so use to putting these >> things in metal planes. >> Anyway I take my signal from an av-map 4 so it's NMEA out was a >> yellow >> wire only. Once I ran a signal ground everything worked perfectly. >> Get it working because the product is a very good and the support >> from >> them is even better. >> >> Jeff R. >> A258 - N128LJ / Gold Rush 176 hours and climbing sl ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 01:52:19 PM PST US From: "karelvranken" Subject: Re: Europa-List: First Flight Kit #A221 - N914XL Bob, it's only a flea jump, but we like it. And you will too. Congratulations. Karel Vranken. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bob Borger" Sent: Thursday, February 05, 2009 5:37 PM Subject: Re: Europa-List: First Flight Kit #A221 - N914XL > > Phred, I mean Jeff, > > No problem. I seem to get that Roger thing on a regular basis. > > I hope to post video of the first flight and first landing on You Tube > this evening. If I get the pics from Tommy, I'll post some stills on > Europa Owners as well. > > Will let the Forum know when all are posted and available for viewing. > > Check six, > Bob > > On Thursday, February 05, 2009, at 10:20AM, "JEFF ROBERTS" > wrote: >> >>No no, it was my multitasking skills or lack of. I've been on the >>phone, writing scripts, answering e-mails, and putting out fires all >>morning! I tell you it seems I'm working twice as hard to make half as >>much thru this recession! >> >>My apologies Bob and Congratulations to you... not Roger! I have not a >>clue where the roger thing came from. Toooo much stuff going on!! >>Anyway let us know when you fly yourself. >> >>Jeff R. >>A258 - N128LJ / Gold Rush 176 hours and down for the annual. > > > ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 03:30:45 PM PST US Subject: Re: Europa-List: First Flight Kit #A221 - N914XL From: "danbish" Bob, Just getting on here after a few days scrambling to take care of business issues. CONGRATULATIONS MAN!! Your photo album has been of immense help as I go about trying to shape the heap of parts in the garage into something meaningful. Many thanks to you and for all the speedy replys to my inquiries. I'm looking forward to the photos and videos! :mrgreen: ALL THE BEST FOR A JOB WELL DONE - YOU DESERVE IT! :mrgreen: Dan Visit - www.EuropaOwners.org ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 03:42:42 PM PST US From: "ALAN YERLY" Subject: Re: Europa-List: 914 - 912? Ferg, The 912/914 are the same regulator and plug. I too have gotten fed up with the plug from time to time. I take the time to put nutplates on the back of the fire wall for the regulator and you will find that rolling on the plug in your hand is far easier. Once it is trained, it is not so bad. Of course disconnecting is even more fun. I did not put the Rotax all in one connector on last time. I just plug them in one at a time. Of course since gravity works 24/7, you must wire tie the bundle so it holds pressure to keep the pins from disconnecting under G if you mount the regulator vertical. Highly unlikely but possible. Bud Yerly ----- Original Message ----- From: Fergus Kyle To: EUROPALIST ; ROTAXnet Sent: Thursday, February 05, 2009 3:34 PM Subject: Europa-List: 914 - 912? Cheers, I'm not sure the 912 doesn't have the same 914 dynamo regulator, but (914) I'm having the d@#$%^st time attaching bottom plug with the plethora of "quick-connect" females imbedded to receive the male counterparts. It seems there's too much play in the design to enable every male to join inside. If you had this symptom as well, perhaps you have a favourite insertion method to overcome the slop? If that's the case, would you kindly share what subterfuge you use? It might just save me one of hundreds of provoking delays I seem to enjoy. Please, Ferg ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 05:47:45 PM PST US From: Graham Singleton Subject: Europa-List: Europa Kits A friend of mine is looking for a part finished kit in the UK, anyone know of one for sale at a negotiable price? Would prefer an XS tri gear but any Europa considered, he has flown a one briefly and is very keen to own one before he gets too old. Graham ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 07:56:16 PM PST US Subject: Europa-List: RE: Europa-List Digest: 18 Msgs - 02/04/09 From: "Ferg Kyle" Bob: Many thanks. I did insert the small fast-ons fully, but the plastic in the big plug allows them to twist to their own desires- just enought to thwart the inserting. Visit - www.EuropaOwners.org ________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________ Time: 08:05:21 PM PST US Subject: Re: Europa-List: 914 - 912? From: "Ferg Kyle" Bud: Thanks for the advice. Two good points - I too realised that it's easier to insert with the plug and socket in the hand, but the b$%^&r still won't align. and at the same time the flathead machine bolts loosened and clattered to the cockpit floor and bounced into the underseat locker.....like most of my events. I believe I will follow your suggestion and insert the fast-ons singly without the big plug - and perhaps rotate the regulator. It is cooled by a small NACA dut built into the cowling roof but needs protection in case of rain enroute I suppose. I guess I could smother the contacts with ShoeGoo and cut them free later on if needed. 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