---------------------------------------------------------- Europa-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Tue 02/10/09: 16 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 12:13 AM - Re: Master Brake Cylinder (Richard Iddon) 2. 01:17 AM - Re: Plenum socketsPlenum socket (stephan@scassel.se) 3. 01:22 AM - Re: Cooling Shroud (rparigor@suffolk.lib.ny.us) 4. 01:39 AM - Re: Cooling Shroud (rparigor@suffolk.lib.ny.us) 5. 03:29 AM - Re: Master Brake Cylinder (Trevpond@aol.com) 6. 03:34 AM - Re: Master Brake Cylinder (Trevpond@aol.com) 7. 04:57 AM - Re: Outrigger mod. (h&jeuropa) 8. 06:06 AM - Re: Cooling Shroud (rampil) 9. 07:06 AM - Re: Plenum sockets (John & Paddy Wigney) 10. 07:21 AM - New Zealand Builders (jimpuglise@comcast.net) 11. 07:37 AM - New Zealand Trip (jimpuglise@COMCAST.NET) 12. 08:19 AM - Re: Cooling Shroud (danbish) 13. 09:06 AM - Re: Cooling Shroud (Mike Toft) 14. 09:39 AM - Re: Re: Cooling Shroud (rparigor@suffolk.lib.ny.us) 15. 10:16 AM - Re: Re: Cooling Shroud (JEFF ROBERTS) 16. 01:23 PM - Re: New Zealand Trip (Bill Sisley) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 12:13:30 AM PST US From: "Richard Iddon" Subject: RE: Europa-List: Master Brake Cylinder Hi Mike. I had endless problems with the Jaymar cylinders including sticking pistons, problems with bleeding and at one point the failure of one side. I have thrown them away and replaced them with the Matco ones available from the factory and have had absolutely no problems since. Richard Iddon G-RIXS -----Original Message----- From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of DuaneFamly@aol.com Sent: 09 February 2009 22:38 Subject: Europa-List: Master Brake Cylinder Good day All, I was attempting to bleed my brake system but wasn't having too much luck. So I pulled my Jamar master cylinder and found that the large seal nearest the spring was torn to pieces....on BOTH side! I am hoping that this was just an error in insufficient lubrication when reassembling after I tore the master cylinder down to clean out the crude that seemed to be left over after the manufacturing. The part number off the seal is 220-L-4502 along with a 54. If my resources were correct then this should be made of Buna-N (Nitrile) and is compatible with my Hydraulic Fluid 41 Mil-H 5606G. The other seal is marked ADM-45 2110....also Nitrile? So here are my questions: 1) Am I right about the material and the compatibility? 2) Is there a source for me to order replacement seals in the US? 3) Is there a lubricant that I should be using when I reassemble the cylinders? 4) Are people still sanding down the outer edge of the white disc to prevent sticking? 5) Are builders replacing the spring with a stronger one or adding another spring? Thanks in advance for any replies. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 02/08/09 17:57:00 ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 01:17:00 AM PST US Subject: Re: Europa-List: Plenum socketsPlenum socket From: stephan@scassel.se Hi All I had the same problem a year ago. The socket was totally deformed. I bought a new one from Europa. Not expensive. The new one was of much better quality. (Completely different) John, at Europa, thought that the plenum chamber was from a bad batch. New one is also a bit lighter. Mine is from 2005 My advice is to buy a new one from Europa. I have also changed the hoses (2) between carbs and plenum chamber. Standard is not good at all. It looks ok from outside but from inside it was a nightmare!! Cracks and small rubber parts missing!! They must be exchanged. I bought 2 silicon rubber. Same sort that racing car use. No sign of wear Same very bad rubber is used for cooling hoses between engine and radiator. Stefan Ingermarsson, from Sweden, sells a hose kit for 912/914 made of silicon. Very good. Regrds Stephan LN-STE #556 Mono. 143 hour and very happy :-) ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 01:22:02 AM PST US Subject: Re: Europa-List: Cooling Shroud From: rparigor@suffolk.lib.ny.us Hi Jeff Good lick on your cooling air baffle. One note, my factory cooling air baffle I bought for my 914 is made out of polyester resin. Polyester is better for high temperatures compared to Aeropoxy. Don't know if TG of Aeropoxy is high enough if thats what you used?? Aeropoxy has a sister company with a laminating resin good for some pretty high temperatures. It will semi cure at room temperature, then you need to ramp up temps in an oven to get max TG. A home oven will work well. Ron P. ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 01:39:11 AM PST US Subject: Re: Europa-List: Cooling Shroud From: rparigor@suffolk.lib.ny.us Hi Jeff Forgot to mention on my first post, the cooling air baffle I got looks pretty new, perhaps only the factory run time. It has some brown/burnt areas developing. Ron Parigoris ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 03:29:54 AM PST US From: Trevpond@aol.com Subject: Re: Europa-List: Master Brake Cylinder Me too Richard, The original units were totally unacceptable, with sticking and even worse, lacking the ability to hold the aircraft still when doing pre-takeoff engine checks. I bought the new Matco units from the factory and since then, absolutely no problems; now have to watch brake applications when landing in case of lock-ups! regards Trev Pond G-LINN ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 03:34:46 AM PST US From: Trevpond@aol.com Subject: Re: Europa-List: Master Brake Cylinder Me too Richard, The original units were totally unacceptable, with sticking and even worse, lacking the ability to hold the aircraft still when doing pre-takeoff engine checks. I bought the new Matco units from the factory and since then, absolutely no problems; now have to watch brake applications when landing in case of lock-ups! regards Trev Pond G-LINN ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 04:57:22 AM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Re: Outrigger mod. From: "h&jeuropa" Hi Jim The Mod is on the Europa Club website. It is Mod 10661 Version 2, May 2007. Version 2 changes the pivot bolt to AN5. We've done this Mod and it works fine. Jim & Heather Butcher N241BW Hoping for warm weather!! Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=229516#229516 ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 06:06:43 AM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Re: Cooling Shroud From: "rampil" The Tg for Aeropoxy is 194-196F depending on which hardener is used. see:http://pages.sbcglobal.net/ccanedy/aeropoxy_main.html The only Tg for polyester resins I could find on the web were in the range of 53C or about 112F Post cure baking pushes the layup towards the final Tg. Fortunately an engine shroud is small enough to actually bake with reasonable equipment, unlike a wing. -------- Ira N224XS Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=229521#229521 ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 07:06:58 AM PST US From: John & Paddy Wigney Subject: Europa-List: Re: Plenum sockets Hi Richard, I had the same problem. I fixed it with aluminium tubes glassed into place. Cheers, John N262WF ORIGINAL MESSAGE From: "Richard Iddon" Subject: Europa-List: Plenum sockets Thanks to all for the ideas re door gas struts. Should be sorted now. Next problem. The sockets on the plenum chamber for my 912S, where they go into the rubber hoses to connect to the carbs, have collapsed somewhat. I guess it is the combination of the heat from the engine softening the glass and it being under compression from the hose clips. I was considering cutting them off and reduxing in a couple of short pieces of 2in. aluminium tube as replacements. Any one else had this problem and how solved? Richard Iddon G-RIXS ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 07:21:15 AM PST US From: jimpuglise@comcast.net Subject: Europa-List: New Zealand Builders ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 07:37:49 AM PST US From: jimpuglise@COMCAST.NET Subject: Europa-List: New Zealand Trip Do not archive (It appears that the server stripped out my attached .PDF, so I have insert ed our schedule.) Lynne and I will be visiting New Zealand from February 21 through March 22. =C2- It would be nice to get together with other builders for the purpose of lifting a beer or several and comparing notes.=C2- I plan to bring a printed copy of my builder's log and photos.=C2- I am building an XS tri- gear with a Jabiru 3300, and am about 75% done.=C2- I have attached our s chedule and contact information.=C2- We will try to have Skype up as much as possible, and should also be checking e-mail daily.=C2- We have a car , but the schedule is quite full, so maybe we can get together in the eveni ng.=C2- I have attached our schedule and contact information.=C2- Pleas e pass on your phone numbers and other contact information if an evening wi ll work out for you. Jim Puglise - A-283 Jim and Lynne Puglise Skype contact jim.puglise jimpuglise@comcast.net NZ Schedule Feb. 21, 22 =C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2 -=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2- =C2-=C2- Te Anu Feb. 23, 24 =C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2 -=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2- =C2-=C2- Dunedin Feb. 25, 26 =C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2 -=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2- =C2-=C2- Wanaka Feb. 27, 28 =C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2 -=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2- =C2-=C2- Franz Joseph March 1, 2 =C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2 -=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2- =C2-=C2-=C2- Christchurch March 3 =C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2- =C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2 -=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2- Kaikoura March 4, 5 =C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2 -=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2- =C2-=C2-=C2- Nelson March 7, 8 =C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2 -=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2- =C2-=C2-=C2- Wellington March 9, 10 =C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2 -=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2- =C2- Napier March 11, 12 =C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2- =C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2- Ro torua March 13, 14 =C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2- =C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2- Te Awamutu March 15, 16 =C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2- =C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2- Wa rkworth March 17, 18, 19 =C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2 -=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2- Russell March 20, 21, 22 =C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2 -=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2- Auckland ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 08:19:05 AM PST US Subject: Re: Europa-List: Cooling Shroud From: "danbish" Hi, I'd be interested as well, for the 914. Thanks, Dan Visit - www.EuropaOwners.org ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 09:06:20 AM PST US From: "Mike Toft" Subject: RE: Europa-List: Cooling Shroud You can count me in to Regards Mike Toft ZU CTG Tri Gear 914 XS From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Paul Boulet Sent: 10 February 2009 07:12 AM Subject: Re: Europa-List: Cooling Shroud Simply beautiful. I'd like to have one too Paul Boulet, N914PB Rotax 914 tri gear --- On Mon, 2/9/09, JEFF ROBERTS wrote: From: JEFF ROBERTS Subject: Europa-List: Cooling Shroud HI All, After dealing with the uneven cooling issues under the Europa cowl, and after looking at how all the new LSA planes are cooling the rotax, I decided to make a cooling shroud or baffle as rotax calls it. I know something like this came with some of the Kits but not mine. After seeing the RV-12 at KOSH I decided to call Lockwood to see what one would cost. We'll the rotax version was $900 + US dollars. So I got the clay out and started making one. It turned out quite nice. All the air from the right intake will be funneled up a 2 inch scat tube to feed the thing. After talking with Jeff B. of Baby Blue fame he thought it would be nice if we could fashion a mold for anyone else wanting one. So before I start the process I thought I'd test the waters on this list. Here is a picture of it. Jeff & I thought if we made such a mold that we could send it around to others wanting to lay up such a shroud. A mold would be a lot easier than the process I went through to make this so if you are interested let me know. Jeff gets first crack at it but we could send it on from there. All interested parties please respond back and we'll see what we can do. It seems to me that better and more even cooling will make a happier engine. Best Regards, Jeff R. A258 - N128LJ / Gold Rush 176 hours and down for the annual, Mod 71 and a lot of others. D======================== ========= D======================== ========= D======================== ========= D======================== ========= ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 09:39:15 AM PST US Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re: Cooling Shroud From: rparigor@suffolk.lib.ny.us Hi Ira "> The only Tg for polyester resins I could find on the web were in the > range of 53C or about 112F" I made my comment based on what Nev told me. He said thatone reason the Europa cowl is made out of polyester is the higher TG. My Rotax cooling air baffle sure does smell like polyester. Anyway, PTM+W sells an amber laminating system: http://www.ptm-w.com/index.asp?pgid TG of PT2846 is308F to 370F depending on hardener. I spoke at length to engineer about that product, and the biggest problem is the minimum buy (especially the hardener). I have the guys name that will sell me reasonable amounts, but still would be more than my needs for my custom electric fan shrouding before radiators. There is a ramp up procedure I have, somethinglike let it cure at room or slightly higher temp for half a day, then bake for 2 hours at ??, then 1 hour at ??, etc. etc. My shroud will fit in my oven so that is my plan. Ron P. > ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 10:16:17 AM PST US From: JEFF ROBERTS Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re: Cooling Shroud We'll guys. It looks like one or two are interested in this shroud so I bought some plaster of paris and I'm going to attempt to make a mold of some sort. I may have to make a negative mold out of the glass and resin instead but we'll see. On the issue of the mold melting I would suggest that if cooled properly the slight amount of this that touches the fins shouldn't be a problem. What I have done is where the shroud goes between the outer outside and second cooling fin i used a lay-up of RTV and bid. You can buy at any auto parts store the red RTV stuff thats supposed to be good up to 650F. lay a 1" X 10 strip of bid on plastic. Start working the RTV into the bid just as you would a regular lay-up. I went 4 layers thick then on the last one I didn't work any RTV on the outside of it just worked it into the previous layer's excess. This will allow you to glue the one side of this onto the side of the shroud. After the lay up add another piece of polyurethane just like when you made tapes of bid in the build. You can then let it cure about a half hour trim it to shape and glue it with epoxy to the side of the shroud. This will stay slightly flexible and be the part that touches the motor most. I could be all wet here but a good friend of mine made all his own baffling on his EZ using this stuff and it's still working 800+ hours. Here is a picture of the shroud off the engine so you can see what I mean. I'll keep yas'all posted as to my progress on the mold. Hey maybe I should just make a bunch of these and sell em;) After all I am a capitalist! Let the bidding start! Regards, Jeff R. A258 - N128LJ / Gold Rush 176 hours and climbing slowly. On Feb 10, 2009, at 8:04 AM, rampil wrote: > > The Tg for Aeropoxy is 194-196F depending on which hardener is used. > see:http://pages.sbcglobal.net/ccanedy/aeropoxy_main.html > > > The only Tg for polyester resins I could find on the web were in the > range of 53C or about 112F > > Post cure baking pushes the layup towards the final Tg. > > Fortunately an engine shroud is small enough to actually bake with > reasonable equipment, unlike a wing. > > -------- > Ira N224XS > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=229521#229521 > > ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 01:23:45 PM PST US From: Bill Sisley Subject: Re: Europa-List: New Zealand Trip Hi Jim, I am based near Tauranga in the North Island and would be very pleased to meet you during your visit. Suggest you call me when in NZ and we can set up a rendezvous. Home 07 5491855 Mobile 0273033131 Skype europaxs1 Regards Sue & Bill Sisley XS Mono Airmaster Rotax 914 750 Hrs jimpuglise@comcast.net wrote: > > Do not archive > > > > (It appears that the server stripped out my attached .PDF, so I have > inserted our schedule.) > > > > Lynne and I will be visiting New Zealand from February 21 through > March 22. It would be nice to get together with other builders for > the purpose of lifting a beer or several and comparing notes. I plan > to bring a printed copy of my builder's log and photos. I am building > an XS tri-gear with a Jabiru 3300, and am about 75% done. I have > attached our schedule and contact information. We will try to have > Skype up as much as possible, and should also be checking e-mail > daily. We have a car, but the schedule is quite full, so maybe we can > get together in the evening. I have attached our schedule and contact > information. Please pass on your phone numbers and other contact > information if an evening will work out for you. > > > > Jim Puglise - A-283 > > Jim and Lynne Puglise > > Skype contact jim.puglise > > jimpuglise@comcast.net ** > > > *NZ Schedule* > > Feb. 21, 22 Te Anu > > Feb. 23, 24 Dunedin > > Feb. 25, 26 Wanaka > > Feb. 27, 28 Franz Joseph > > March 1, 2 Christchurch > > March 3 Kaikoura > > March 4, 5 Nelson > > March 7, 8 Wellington > > March 9, 10 Napier > > March 11, 12 Rotorua > > March 13, 14 Te Awamutu > > March 15, 16 Warkworth > > March 17, 18, 19 Russell > > March 20, 21, 22 Auckland > > > > > * > > > * ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message europa-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Europa-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/europa-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/europa-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.