Europa-List Digest Archive

Tue 02/24/09


Total Messages Posted: 10



Today's Message Index:
----------------------
 
     1. 12:31 AM - wing root fairings (craig bastin)
     2. 07:44 AM - Antennas for Europas (Fergus Kyle)
     3. 09:52 AM - Re: tank support layups (Rowland Carson)
     4. 09:52 AM - Re: Antennas for Europas (Rowland Carson)
     5. 11:06 AM - Antennas for Europas (Fergus Kyle)
     6. 04:18 PM - Re: tank support layups (Greg Fuchs)
     7. 04:18 PM - Sun N Fun (Erich Trombley)
     8. 05:57 PM - wing root fairings (Fred Klein)
     9. 06:36 PM - Re: Sun N Fun (grroberts3@juno.com)
    10. 06:55 PM - Re: wing root fairings (JR Gowing)
 
 
 


Message 1


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    Time: 12:31:47 AM PST US
    From: "craig bastin" <craigb@onthenet.com.au>
    Subject: wing root fairings
    Fred you mentioned in the antenna discussions, you have made some more progress on wing root fairings. I am sure must of the guys would be interested in those pics. craig


    Message 2


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    Time: 07:44:49 AM PST US
    From: "Fergus Kyle" <VE3LVO@rac.ca>
    Subject: Antennas for Europas
    Hi, Frans Veldman did a superb job of explaining the practicality of the half-wave dipole in particular for a Europa because of its great vertical fin area. As he said, the 'gain' attributed to other forms is always at the cost of overall effectiveness where contact with ground stations is a concern. The flashlight ( 'torch) is the perfect example. It doesn't light up areas behind it very well, but the forward gain is excellent. Perhaps another antenna could be a fullwave circular wire inside the aft fuselage and fed at the fuselage join halfway up, but then you'd need to point the Europa to fire ahead or behind. Thanks, Frans Ferg


    Message 3


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    Time: 09:52:12 AM PST US
    From: Rowland Carson <rowil@clara.net>
    Subject: tank support layups
    At 2009-02-23 22:46 -0800 Greg Fuchs wrote: >I would suggest (if you haven't already) making sure to soak the tank with >fuel for awhile, before fitting and glassing it, since it will expand >slightly Greg - I thought the gassing process was supposed to prevent this. Certainly the new tank I have has been subject to that process. In my conversation with Roger at the factory yesterday about several aspects of tank mounting he was careful to mention that one side-effect of the treatment is to make the epoxy more likely to stick to the tank. He recommended a layer of polyethylene or similar film between tank and layup to allow relative movement. However, he didn't suggest soaking the tank with fuel beforehand. Looks like another call to check could be worthwhile. Thanks for all your tips about where interference between tank and other structures might arise. >I am sorry about your loss Thanks for your kind words. It's a big change being without someone who's shared your life for 40 years, and even worse (for the survivor) when it comes rather suddenly. The period of adjustment appears open-ended at present. As well as getting back to aeroplane work, I am thinking about how Wilma's paintings might be published, as inspiration to others who might be on the same spiritual journey. regards Rowland -- | Rowland Carson LAA #16532 http://home.clara.net/rowil/aviation/ | 1190 hours building Europa #435 G-ROWI e-mail <rowil@clara.net>


    Message 4


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    Time: 09:52:18 AM PST US
    From: Rowland Carson <rowil@clara.net>
    Subject: Re: Antennas for Europas
    At 2009-02-24 10:42 -0500 Fergus Kyle wrote: >Perhaps another antenna could be a fullwave circular wire inside the >aft fuselage and fed at the fuselage join halfway up, but then you'd need to >point the Europa to fire ahead or behind Fergus - apparently the directionality of a loop is not quite as strong as one would assume. The "Morris Loop" has been around for a while; see info at: http://www.davemorris.com/dave/MorrisDFLoop.html The author reckons that the theoretical null abeam may not be a real disadvantage in practice. It's certainly another interesting possibility for composite fuselages. regards Rowland -- | Rowland Carson http://home.clara.net/rowil/ | <rowil@clara.net> ... that's Rowland with a 'w' ...


    Message 5


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    Time: 11:06:47 AM PST US
    From: "Fergus Kyle" <VE3LVO@rac.ca>
    Subject: Antennas for Europas
    Rowland, Quite right - not as critical as a flashlight, but my full-wave quad on 7 megs got 15db less off the sides, made it worthwhile to aim. I once flew a piper J3 which was equipped with an antenna that made it almost impossible to contact without aiming - made the tower elves furious, as I had to swivel to talk on ground control. Cheers, Ferg PS: The owner was an antenna designer for Bombardier's daddy, Canadair, and kept playing with things.


    Message 6


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    Time: 04:18:22 PM PST US
    From: "Greg Fuchs " <gregoryf.flyboy@comcast.net>
    Subject: tank support layups
    Rowland, >Greg - I thought the gassing process was supposed to prevent this. >Certainly the new tank I have has been subject to that process. My tank only swelled a few millimeters (on the back face of the tank). If the swelling is constant over the entire surface of the tank, then the long straight faces would give the worst-case example of tank expansion. Hence the back face of the tank is the extreme example. I wish I knew how much the old tanks expanded, then it would be easier to know for sure. (If anyone has measured their tank expansion who had the old tank, feel free to contribute). I can only assume that I have the new tank, since a few millimeters is not much. Some might consider it negligible. Still (if I DO in fact have the new tank) a few extra millimeters of clearance to the controls will be necessary, if you don't soak the tank, initially. Actually (based on my experience), if allowances are given, and the tank is not bonded directly, you would probably be fine without pre-soaking the tank. I will try to measure it today, to see if I can get a better idea on the amount of shrinkage. >Thanks for your kind words. It's a big change being without someone >who's shared your life for 40 years, and even worse (for the >survivor) when it comes rather suddenly. The period of adjustment >appears open-ended at present. My thoughts are with you. I don't have much experience in this area. My 'separation' experience has to do with that ugly divorce word, and that was very tough on me too, but no passing away was involved. The memories stay, and the acute emotional pain does diminish, and the sunlight shining through the clouds can be seen again, eventually. Greg


    Message 7


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    Time: 04:18:22 PM PST US
    From: "Erich Trombley" <erichdtrombley@juno.com>
    Subject: Sun N Fun
    Folks, With less than two months to go before Sun-N-Fun I was wondering if we c an start a list of who all will be attending, when, and contact info. I can start off with myself and others can join in. Erich Trombley Classic 914 April 22nd - 26th Flying into Tampa commercial Camping 702-682-0219 Do not archive ____________________________________________________________ Click to get free auto insurance quotes from top companies. http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2131/fc/BLSrjnsHEaDMACvw0IAuS4f6QiJ3 uCiNaTwnbGZi5RJHxoajevhipgpSpAc/


    Message 8


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    Time: 05:57:58 PM PST US
    From: Fred Klein <fklein@orcasonline.com>
    Subject: wing root fairings
    > > > > > Fred you mentioned in the antenna discussions, you have made some more > progress > on wing root fairings. I am sure must of the guys would be > interested in > those pics. > > craig Sure Craig: The "news" on my fairings follows: The design remains the same; they mate with the stock fairing at the spar, and would be able to be easily added to a completed aircraft. As these photos show, there is now a companion piece which deals with the underside and tucks under the trailing edge of the stock Europa fairing...at the trailing edge of the wing (underside) and the leading edge of the flap. Of course, the airflow in flight is just as interested in the underside of the wing as it is the upper surface...the more I looked at the stock situation, the more I realized that something had to be done. I am currently (very cautiously) trial fitting a set on my aircraft, attempting to assure that, as the fairing is cut into the portions which bond to the wing, the flap, and the aft fuselage, the smooth and continuous curvature is maintained. (Thank God for clecos, hot glue, and tongue depressors!). Note that the flap drive slot is now covered. I am also dealing with the issue of air flow over and around the aft portion of the fairing when the flaps are deployed. Just how to close the volume opened up when the flaps are deployed and configure the resulting surface is not yet resolved. I have shipped a full set (uncut) to a fellow flyer (tri-gear) who is going to use some magic adhesives and tape to attach them to his wing and fuselage. (He plans to do some zero flap takeoffs and landings.) He will fly some specific profiles with and without the fairings so we will have some idea how they affect performance and efficiency of flight...I'm hoping these tests will be performed prior to Sun N Fun. I've been holding back on offering them to builders until I have some idea of performance. Also, I've wanted to go thru the installation process so I could write up some recommendations on how to position and install them. At this point, it seems clear to me that the positioning of the fairing can only be accomplished w/ reasonable precision and symmetry when the top molding is in one piece; thus, I expect to make up the top and bottom moldings, trim them, mark them for cutting, and ship them so. It will be up to the builder to do the cutting, make up and fit the flanges, and do the finishing, etc. They come off the molds pretty smooth, they are within a gnat's a__ of being perfectly symmetrical, but they are not vacuum-bagged. Off the molds and trimmed, the upper and lower shells (together) weigh just under one pound port and starboard. I will be bringing a fairing to Sun N Fun. So...that's where things stand at the moment, Fred -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean.


    Message 9


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    Time: 06:36:48 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: Sun N Fun
    From: grroberts3@juno.com
    On Wed, 25 Feb 2009 00:13:34 GMT "Erich Trombley" <erichdtrombley@juno.com> writes: Folks, With less than two months to go before Sun-N-Fun I was wondering if we can start a list of who all will be attending, when, and contact info. I can start off with myself and others can join in. Erich Trombley Classic 914 April 22nd - 26th Flying into Tampa commercial Camping 702-682-0219 Do not archive Gary R. Roberts Conventional 914 April 21 to 25 Flying into Tampa commercial 520 307-7231 Do not archive ____________________________________________________________ Click to get free auto insurance quotes from top companies. ____________________________________________________________ Click to get free auto insurance quotes from top companies. http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/BLSrjpTImHaCNYbrVWqigpaHmscpcG9v2ylSCdxwrsiXQuiiNH6aL4kCE1q/


    Message 10


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    Time: 06:55:13 PM PST US
    From: "JR Gowing" <jrgowing@bigpond.net.au>
    Subject: Re: wing root fairings
    Fred Thank you for the inspiring photos...... That is unbelievable work! JR (Bob) Gowing 327 in Oz Do not archive ----- Original Message ----- From: Fred Klein To: europa-list@matronics.com Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2009 12:53 PM Subject: Europa-List: wing root fairings au> Fred you mentioned in the antenna discussions, you have made some more progress on wing root fairings. I am sure must of the guys would be interested i n those pics. craig Sure Craig: The =22news=22 on my fairings follows: The design remains the same; they mate with the stock fairing at the spar , and would be able to be easily added to a completed aircraft. As these photos show, there is now a companion piece which deals with the underside and tucks under the trailing edge of the stock Europa fairing.. .at the trailing edge of the wing (underside) and the leading edge of the f lap. Of course, the airflow in flight is just as interested in the undersid e of the wing as it is the upper surface...the more I looked at the stock s ituation, the more I realized that something had to be done. I am currently (very cautiously) trial fitting a set on my aircraft, atte mpting to assure that, as the fairing is cut into the portions which bond t o the wing, the flap, and the aft fuselage, the smooth and continuous curva ture is maintained. (Thank God for clecos, hot glue, and tongue depressors !). Note that the flap drive slot is now covered. I am also dealing with th e issue of air flow over and around the aft portion of the fairing when the flaps are deployed. Just how to close the volume opened up when the flaps are deployed and configure the resulting surface is not yet resolved. I have shipped a full set (uncut) to a fellow flyer (tri-gear) who is goi ng to use some magic adhesives and tape to attach them to his wing and fuse lage. (He plans to do some zero flap takeoffs and landings.) He will fly so me specific profiles with and without the fairings so we will have some ide a how they affect performance and efficiency of flight...I'm hoping these t ests will be performed prior to Sun N Fun. I've been holding back on offering them to builders until I have some ide a of performance. Also, I've wanted to go thru the installation process so I could write up some recommendations on how to position and install them. At this point, it seems clear to me that the positioning of the fairing c an only be accomplished w/ reasonable precision and symmetry when the top m olding is in one piece; thus, I expect to make up the top and bottom moldin gs, trim them, mark them for cutting, and ship them so. It will be up to th e builder to do the cutting, make up and fit the flanges, and do the finish ing, etc. They come off the molds pretty smooth, they are within a gnat's a =5F=5F of being perfectly symmetrical, but they are not vacuum-bagged. Off the molds and trimmed, the upper and lower shells (together) weigh just under o ne pound port and starboard. I will be bringing a fairing to Sun N Fun. So...that's where things stand at the moment, Fred -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- --- Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 13:35:00 -- We are a community of 6 million users fighting spam. The Professional version does not have this message




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