---------------------------------------------------------- Europa-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Tue 04/28/09: 16 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 05:26 AM - DOTH Lashenden Wed. 29th (Paddy Clarke) 2. 07:52 AM - Fuel valve open or close between flights (Raimo Toivio) 3. 08:10 AM - Re: Fuel valve open or close between flights (Robert Borger) 4. 08:29 AM - SV: Fuel valve open or close between flights (Sidsel og Svein Johnsen) 5. 08:39 AM - Re: Cleaning windshield - how to do it safely? (Raimo Toivio) 6. 08:55 AM - Re: new servers, high speed internet (martymason) 7. 08:55 AM - Re: new servers, high speed internet (martymason) 8. 09:27 AM - Re: Fuel valve open or close between flights (Raimo Toivio) 9. 09:40 AM - Re: Fuel valve open or close between flights (Raimo Toivio) 10. 09:58 AM - Re: Fuel valve open or close between flights (rick) 11. 11:06 AM - SV: Fuel valve open or close between flights (Sidsel og Svein Johnsen) 12. 02:12 PM - Re: DOTH Lashenden Wed. 29th (Ray Wren) 13. 03:38 PM - Re: Fuel valve open or close between flights (Robert Borger) 14. 06:03 PM - Re: Cleaning windshield - how to do it safely? (Greg Fuchs) 15. 06:14 PM - Re: Fuel valve open or close between flights (Greg Fuchs) 16. 07:27 PM - Re: Cleaning windshield - how to do it safely? (David Glauser) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 05:26:28 AM PST US From: Paddy Clarke Subject: Europa-List: DOTH Lashenden Wed. 29th Hi Folks, For one reason or another I've not been able to get away flying recently, so I apologise for the lack of DOTHs. Tomorrow ( Wednesday 29th.) looks workable so how about Lashenden ( Headcorn). Voucher in Pilot - 1200ish, though I may be a little late. All the best, Paddy Paddy Clarke Europa G-KIMM ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 07:52:46 AM PST US From: "Raimo Toivio" Subject: Europa-List: Fuel valve open or close between flights All Sveins answer below gave me a new topic. After flights do you close or not main fuel selector valve? I have elected to keep it always open! I understand there is an other side also. Anyway when it is always open I never forget to open it before take offs. I tested and it is possible to make a fast take off with closed valve. That means EFATO situation. To prevent jamming or seizing I move it couple of times in a year between ON-RESERVE-CLOSED positions. Other visions please. Raimo OH-XRT ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sidsel & Svein Johnsen" Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2009 6:55 PM Subject: RE: Europa-List: Re: Fuel return line attachment point with 912UL > > Raimo, > > gear is down? ;) > > My gear is always down, it's a tri-gear! ;-) > > returnlines? > > On most flights, I do not touch the fuel return close-off valve - it is left > wide open to ensure full fuel return to minimize risk of vapour lock. > During the test flying, I used it to find the best speed vs. fuel > consumption. I then operated over farm fields that with some skill and luck > would allow a reasonably safe landing in case the engine stopped due to > vapour lock (it never coughed). Now I use just once in a seldom while. > Nobody reading this should install such a valve without establishing where > you are with respect to the authorities. It is a critical interference in > the fuel system - if you forget to open it again you might be in > difficulties at some stage. When I close the valve, I keep my hand on the > valve until I have registered the reading and opened the valve again. > > > Instead of the standard Europa fuel tank selector valve, I have an Andair > valve recessed in the top of the cocpit module tunnel immediately aft of the > throttle to select Main/Reserve/Off. > I have used the Europa supplied valve in the fuel return line instead > (blocked off one valve branch) and fitted it in the standard fuel selector > valve location, on the left side of the tunnel. I have fitted stoppers to > prevent turning the valve too far in either direction (i.e. only 90 degr > turn). > > Regards, > Svein > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 08:10:55 AM PST US From: Robert Borger Subject: Re: Europa-List: Fuel valve open or close between flights Raimo, I too have tried the closed position to see how long the noise maker continues to run and was surprised by how long it works. Scary thought of taking off with valve in one of the many OFF positions and having the noise maker go quiet as you reach altitude for the first turn. So I leave my valve in the MAIN position at all times and will include instructions to rotate the valve 360 degrees at each oil change interval and inspection. Bob Borger Europa Kit #A221 N914XL, XS Mono, Intercooled 914, Airmaster C/S http://www.europaowners.org/N914XL Aircraft Flying! 3705 Lynchburg Dr. Corinth, TX 76208 Home: 940-497-2123 Cel: 817-992-1117 On Apr 28, 2009, at 9:57, Raimo Toivio wrote: > > > All > > Sveins answer below gave me a new topic. > > After flights do you close or not main fuel selector valve? > > I have elected to keep it always open! > I understand there is an other side also. > Anyway when it is always open I never forget to open it before take > offs. > I tested and it is possible to make a fast take off with closed valve. > That means EFATO situation. > > To prevent jamming or seizing I move it couple of times in a year > between ON-RESERVE-CLOSED positions. > > Other visions please. > > Raimo OH-XRT ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 08:29:55 AM PST US From: "Sidsel og Svein Johnsen" Subject: SV: Europa-List: Fuel valve open or close between flights Raimo, I forgot to answer that question, so here it comes: I see no reason to close the fuel valve while the aircraft is parked. Rather to the contrary, if there is a leak downstream from the valve there is a chance to detect it while still on the ground, by the smell. My routine, reflected in the check list, is to switch to RESERVE before starting the engine, and keep it there during warm-up and taxi. Reason: I wish to flow fuel through the reserve side of the system and the filter in that line to make sure it is not blocked, and so that any debris in the reserve line is caught by the filter and can be inspected there (nothing found so far in either line). At run-up, first check is to switch to MAIN, and first check before take-off roll is to verify that it has been switched to MAIN. Once in a while, I switch to OFF and back on the ground just to check free movement. Regards, Svein LN-SKJ -----Opprinnelig melding----- Fra: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] P vegne av Raimo Toivio Sendt: 28. april 2009 16:57 Til: europa-list@matronics.com Emne: Europa-List: Fuel valve open or close between flights All Sveins answer below gave me a new topic. After flights do you close or not main fuel selector valve? I have elected to keep it always open! I understand there is an other side also. Anyway when it is always open I never forget to open it before take offs. I tested and it is possible to make a fast take off with closed valve. That means EFATO situation. To prevent jamming or seizing I move it couple of times in a year between ON-RESERVE-CLOSED positions. Other visions please. Raimo OH-XRT ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 08:39:57 AM PST US From: "Raimo Toivio" Subject: Re: Europa-List: Cleaning windshield - how to do it safely? Bob I went there and had a nice chat with Neith Good. Unfortunately they are classified to be dangerous items so delivery costs are Huge to Europe. Price for one can only was 175$ plus the product itself. Try to find some good stuf here. The maintenance instructions were great, thank you. Raimo OH-XRT ----- Original Message ----- From: Robert Borger To: europa-list@matronics.com Sent: Monday, April 20, 2009 1:48 AM Subject: Re: Europa-List: Cleaning windshield - how to do it safely? Raimo, I use the stuff recommended by LP Aero Plastics, the folks who make the windows for Europa (at least here in the U.S. anyway). Go to their web site ( http://www.lpaero.com/ ) and click on the "Products" tab. >From there go to the "Accessories" section. All their recommended products are listed and available there. I will also send a copy of their care and maintenance instructions directly to you. Check six, Bob Borger Europa Kit #A221 N914XL, XS Mono, Intercooled 914, Airmaster C/S http://www.europaowners.org/N914XL Aircraft Flying! 3705 Lynchburg Dr. Corinth, TX 76208 Home: 940-497-2123 Cel: 817-992-1117 On Apr 19, 2009, at 12:54, Raimo Toivio wrote: All I have a problem - I cannot find any safe way to clean the wind shield. As you all know it gets very easily hair scratches. With those scrathes it is not fun to fly against sun - I do not wanna have them any more! Have seen nightmares "hey I am going to replace Europa=B4s windshield". I have tried to rinse it with plenty of warm water and cleaning detergents but that is not enough. I am not brave enough to wipe it clean or touch it at all. Insects are the main problem - as Bob and Ivor well know sometimes during summer here in Scandinavia exists two or even more little insects (they claimed mosquitos). How do you do the job? Raimo OH-XRT http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c ontribution ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 08:55:39 AM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Re: new servers, high speed internet From: "martymason" WOW!!! I check the forum every day. This is HIGH Speed. Thanks Jos. Marty Mason Visit - www.EuropaOwners.org ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 08:55:39 AM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Re: new servers, high speed internet From: "martymason" WOW!!! I check the forum every day. This is HIGH Speed. Thanks Jos. Marty Mason Visit - www.EuropaOwners.org ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 09:27:35 AM PST US From: "Raimo Toivio" Subject: Re: Europa-List: Fuel valve open or close between flights ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robert Borger" Sent: Tuesday, April 28, 2009 6:08 PM Subject: Re: Europa-List: Fuel valve open or close between flights Raimo, I too have tried the closed position to see how long the noise maker continues to run and was surprised by how long it works. Scary thought of taking off with valve in one of the many OFF positions and I have only three possible positions with one OFF position: - pointer to fore position means MAIN (because I wanna fly usually forward!) - pointer to up position means RES (because I do NOT wanna go down!) - pointer to aft position means CLOSED (because I do not wanna fly anymore!) - pointer to down position is not possible to select. There is a good visible sign also but in emergency there is maybe no time to read. I think the up position for RES is natural mentally. I have tested it once in a real life when my main filter was blocked and a noisemaker went silent. Raimo OH-XRT ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 09:40:21 AM PST US From: "Raimo Toivio" Subject: Re: Europa-List: Fuel valve open or close between flights ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sidsel og Svein Johnsen" Sent: Tuesday, April 28, 2009 6:26 PM Subject: SV: Europa-List: Fuel valve open or close between flights "My routine, reflected in the check list, is to switch to RESERVE before starting the engine, and keep it there during warm-up and taxi. At run-up, first check is to switch to MAIN, and first check before take-off roll is to verify that it has been switched to MAIN." So you are switching it lets say couple of hundreds times in a year? Maybe your Andair is good enough for that but what about a poor mans original selector? I assume I would have soon a broken valve and a separated selector in my hand! Raimo OH-XRT Got a permit to test fly Airmaster and Trio. ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 09:58:27 AM PST US From: "rick" Subject: RE: Europa-List: Fuel valve open or close between flights Hi Guys I think that before you change tanks after taxi but before power checks you should be aware that the Rotax runs for a little while before stopping........ P.S S & F was great. Well done Europa. Rick Morris G-RIKS Tri 912s -----Original Message----- From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Raimo Toivio Sent: 28 April 2009 17:44 Subject: Re: Europa-List: Fuel valve open or close between flights ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sidsel og Svein Johnsen" Sent: Tuesday, April 28, 2009 6:26 PM Subject: SV: Europa-List: Fuel valve open or close between flights "My routine, reflected in the check list, is to switch to RESERVE before starting the engine, and keep it there during warm-up and taxi. At run-up, first check is to switch to MAIN, and first check before take-off roll is to verify that it has been switched to MAIN." So you are switching it lets say couple of hundreds times in a year? Maybe your Andair is good enough for that but what about a poor mans original selector? I assume I would have soon a broken valve and a separated selector in my hand! Raimo OH-XRT Got a permit to test fly Airmaster and Trio. ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 11:06:27 AM PST US From: "Sidsel og Svein Johnsen" Subject: SV: Europa-List: Fuel valve open or close between flights If it only were so well, Raimo! Nowhere close to that number of flights per year! Svein Do not archive "My routine, reflected in the check list, is to switch to RESERVE before starting the engine, and keep it there during warm-up and taxi. At run-up, first check is to switch to MAIN, and first check before take-off roll is to verify that it has been switched to MAIN." So you are switching it lets say couple of hundreds times in a year? Maybe your Andair is good enough for that but what about a poor mans original selector? I assume I would have soon a broken valve and a separated selector in my hand! Raimo OH-XRT ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 02:12:31 PM PST US From: "Ray Wren" Subject: Re: Europa-List: DOTH Lashenden Wed. 29th Paddy, Now that's what I call a Drop Of The Hat - just 24 hours notice. Likewise I'll probably be a bit late - about mid afternoon. Ray Liberty XL2 - N518XL -------------------------------------------- On Tue, 28 Apr 2009 13:25 +0100, "Paddy Clarke" wrote: Hi Folks, For one reason or another I've not been able to get away flying recently, so I apologise for the lack of DOTHs. Tomorrow ( Wednesday 29th.) looks workable so how about Lashenden( Headcorn). Voucher in Pilot - 1200ish, though I may be a little late. All the best, Paddy Paddy Clarke Europa G-KIMM References 1. http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List 2. http://forums.matronics.com/ 3. http://www.matronics.com/contribution -- Ray raymondwren@fastmail.co.uk ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 03:38:12 PM PST US From: Robert Borger Subject: Re: Europa-List: Fuel valve open or close between flights Raimo, I said "many" off positions because my fuel selector valve is a simple, 90 degree, ball valve which will rotate 360 degrees as many times as you want to turn it. And in any position besides forward or up it is effectively (greatly reduced flow) or fully off. That is why the fuel selector back plate is thus: Check six, Bob Borger Europa Kit #A221 N914XL, XS Mono, Intercooled 914, Airmaster C/S http://www.europaowners.org/N914XL Aircraft Flying! 3705 Lynchburg Dr. Corinth, TX 76208 Home: 940-497-2123 Cel: 817-992-1117 On Apr 28, 2009, at 11:33, Raimo Toivio wrote: > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Robert Borger" > To: > Sent: Tuesday, April 28, 2009 6:08 PM > Subject: Re: Europa-List: Fuel valve open or close between flights > > > > Raimo, > > I too have tried the closed position to see how long the noise maker > continues to run and was surprised by how long it works. Scary > thought of taking off with valve in one of the many OFF positions and > > I have only three possible positions with one OFF position: > > - pointer to fore position means MAIN (because I wanna fly usually > forward!) > - pointer to up position means RES (because I do NOT wanna go down!) > - pointer to aft position means CLOSED (because I do not wanna fly > anymore!) > - pointer to down position is not possible to select. > > There is a good visible sign also but in emergency there is maybe no > time to read. > I think the up position for RES is natural mentally. > I have tested it once in a real life when my main filter was blocked > and a noisemaker went silent. > > Raimo OH-XRT > > ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 06:03:40 PM PST US From: "Greg Fuchs " Subject: RE: Europa-List: Cleaning windshield - how to do it safely? In the motorcycle world, I have heard of spray-on Lemon Pledge being used on Plexiglas windshields. It is not for cleaning or repairing scratches, but might provide a slick surface barrier (on an already clean windshield) to protect against them. It should also allow the bugs to come off easily, or stick less to begin with. It is not supposed to go yellow either, like Rain-X is supposed to do to it, over time. It has the added benefit of allowing the water to slip right off. Granted, I have never used it on aircraft, but maybe someone has? I figure aircraft Plexi is similar to motorcycle Plexi, though. Regards, Greg Fuchs A050 XS Tri 1100 Hours into it On Apr 19, 2009, at 12:54, Raimo Toivio wrote: All I have a problem - I cannot find any safe way to clean the wind shield. As you all know it gets very easily hair scratches. With those scrathes it is not fun to fly against sun - I do not wanna have them any more! Have seen nightmares "hey I am going to replace Europa=B4s windshield". I have tried to rinse it with plenty of warm water and cleaning detergents but that is not enough. I am not brave enough to wipe it clean or touch it at all. Insects are the main problem - as Bob and Ivor well know sometimes during summer here in Scandinavia exists two or even more little insects (they claimed mosquitos). How do you do the job? Raimo OH-XRT ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 06:14:40 PM PST US From: "Greg Fuchs " Subject: RE: Europa-List: Fuel valve open or close between flights Funny, I chose the same convention, but for ergonomic reasons. I figured with the main tank selection pointing forward, it would be a little more out of the way, and less prone to leaning against. Seated in the normal fasion while flying, the fuel selector valve is out of the way, anyway. It is opposite the normal convention (main and reserve are swapped -normally main points up), but only if I remember correctly. Works for me, though. >- pointer to fore position means MAIN (because I wanna fly usually forward!) >- pointer to up position means RES (because I do NOT wanna go down!) ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 07:27:32 PM PST US Subject: Re: Europa-List: Cleaning windshield - how to do it safely? From: David Glauser I used Pledge on my motorcycle visor for years - it works well to cover small scratches. Regular Pledge is better than the lemon variety. It seems to leave less residue. dg On Tue, Apr 28, 2009 at 5:57 PM, Greg Fuchs wr ote: > In the motorcycle world, I have heard of spray-on Lemon Pledge being use d > on Plexiglas windshields. It is not for cleaning or repairing scratches, but > might provide a slick surface barrier (on an already clean windshield) to > protect against them. It should also allow the bugs to come off easily, o r > stick less to begin with. > > It is not supposed to go yellow either, like Rain-X is supposed to do to > it, over time. It has the added benefit of allowing the water to slip rig ht > off. Granted, I have never used it on aircraft, but maybe someone has? > > I figure aircraft Plexi is similar to motorcycle Plexi, though. > > > Regards, > > Greg Fuchs A050 XS Tri 1100 Hours into it > > > On Apr 19, 2009, at 12:54, Raimo Toivio wrote: > > > All > > > I have a problem - I cannot find any safe way to clean the wind shield. > > As you all know it gets very easily hair scratches. > > With those scrathes it is not fun to fly against sun - I do not wanna hav e > them any more! > > Have seen nightmares "hey I am going to replace Europa=B4s windshield". > > > I have tried to rinse it with plenty of warm water and cleaning detergent s > but that is not enough. > > I am not brave enough to wipe it clean or touch it at all. > > > Insects are the main problem - as Bob and Ivor well know sometimes during > summer here in Scandinavia exists two or even more little insects > (they claimed mosquitos). > > > How do you do the job? > > > Raimo OH-XRT > > * * > > * > =========== =========== =========== =========== > > * > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message europa-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Europa-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/europa-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/europa-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.