---------------------------------------------------------- Europa-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sun 06/07/09: 6 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 01:21 AM - Re: Noisy Europa (nwcmc@tiscali.co.uk) 2. 01:34 AM - Fuel System Vents (flyingphil2) 3. 05:12 AM - Re: Fuel System Vents (Rowland Carson) 4. 06:12 AM - Re: Wire marking (Rick Stockton) 5. 06:12 AM - Re: Fuel System Vents (Rick Stockton) 6. 10:43 PM - Europa XS Motorglider Trigear Stage 1 ~ 3 70 % done for Sale (Thomas Scherer) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 01:21:10 AM PST US From: "nwcmc@tiscali.co.uk" Subject: Re: Europa-List: Noisy Europa I will do when I get a chance. I am away from home at the moment. The most important thing to appreciate is that any hole cut in the roof section needs substantial reinforcing as this is a strength critical area. This wasn't difficult to achieve. It required a layup of 6 plies of 'bid' over a 3mm ply panel which was about 150mm square. The work was definitely worthwhile as it ensures ventilation to the face rather than the knees. Even with the UK climate there are times in summer when it makes the difference. Nigel ----Original Message---- From: n914va@bvunet.net Subj: Re: Europa-List: Noisy Europa Clean DocumentEmail MicrosoftInternetExplorer4 @font-face { font-family: Tahoma; } @page Section1 {size: 21.0cm 842.0pt; margin: 72.0pt 2.0cm 72.0pt 2.0cm; mso-header-margin: 35.45pt; mso-footer-margin: 35.45pt; mso-paper-source: 0; } P.MsoNormal { MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; FONT-FAMILY: "Times New Roman"; FONT-SIZE: 12pt; mso-style-parent: ""; mso-pagination: widow-orphan; mso-fareast-font-family: "Times New Roman" } LI.MsoNormal { MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; FONT-FAMILY: "Times New Roman"; FONT-SIZE: 12pt; mso-style-parent: ""; mso-pagination: widow-orphan; mso-fareast-font-family: "Times New Roman" } DIV.MsoNormal { MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; FONT-FAMILY: "Times New Roman"; FONT-SIZE: 12pt; mso-style-parent: ""; mso-pagination: widow-orphan; mso-fareast-font-family: "Times New Roman" } A:link { COLOR: blue; TEXT-DECORATION: underline; text-underline: single } SPAN.MsoHyperlink { COLOR: blue; TEXT-DECORATION: underline; text-underline: single } A:visited { COLOR: purple; TEXT-DECORATION: underline; text-underline: single } SPAN.MsoHyperlinkFollowed { COLOR: purple; TEXT-DECORATION: underline; text-underline: single } P.MsoPlainText { MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; FONT-FAMILY: "Courier New"; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; mso-pagination: widow-orphan; mso-fareast-font-family: "Times New Roman" } LI.MsoPlainText { MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; FONT-FAMILY: "Courier New"; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; mso-pagination: widow-orphan; mso-fareast-font-family: "Times New Roman" } DIV.MsoPlainText { MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; FONT-FAMILY: "Courier New"; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; mso-pagination: widow-orphan; mso-fareast-font-family: "Times New Roman" } PRE { MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; FONT-FAMILY: "Courier New"; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; mso-pagination: widow-orphan; mso-fareast-font-family: "Times New Roman" } SPAN.EmailStyle19 { FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; mso-style-type: personal-reply; mso-style-noshow: yes; mso-ansi-font-size: 10.0pt; mso-bidi-font-size: 10.0pt; mso-ascii-font-family: Arial; mso-hansi-font-family: Arial; mso-bidi-font-family: Arial } DIV.Section1 { page: Section1 } Could you post some pictures of how you constructed this vent and how you control the opening width? Vaughn Teegarden ----- Original Message ----- From: nigel charles Sent: Saturday, June 06, 2009 16:39 Subject: RE: Europa-List: Noisy Europa My overhead eyeball vents are fed from an outward opening flap in the roof. I have the flap fully open for take-off and landing but have it only just cracked open in the cruise even on a hot day. The noise level drops dramatically with it like this so perhaps if you can control the input flow to the eyeball vents you will control the noise as well as the flow. High pressure air against a partially open eyeball vent is likely to be noisier than if the source is controlled before it gets to the eyeball. Nigel Charles http://www.matronhref="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c Value your online security. Get 50% off Norton Security 2009 only from Tiscali - http://www.tiscali.co.uk/securepc _______________________________________________________ ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 01:34:37 AM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Fuel System Vents From: "flyingphil2" I'm in the process of making the fuel vent pipes. I have two pieces of stainless steel tubing, each 150mm long. I need to bend them through 90deg, drill 2 holes in the back and bond them into the fuselage. The manual has no dimensions for this and I guess it's not too critical but what have other people done? Dimensions I'm looking for would be: 1. Length from vent forward tip to start of bend. 2. Approx radius of bend. 3. Height of horizontal vent tube above the fuselage skin 4. How much tubing ends up protruding through the lower skin? Rough dimensions would be great if anyone has a few minutes to spare. Thanks, Phil Visit - www.EuropaOwners.org ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 05:12:56 AM PST US From: Rowland Carson Subject: Re: Europa-List: Fuel System Vents At 2009-06-07 11:31 +0300 flyingphil2 wrote: >I'm in the process of making the fuel vent pipes. I have two pieces >of stainless steel tubing, each 150mm long. I need to bend them >through 90deg, drill 2 holes in the back and bond them into the >fuselage. The manual has no dimensions for this and I guess it's >not too critical but what have other people done? > >Dimensions I'm looking for would be: >1. Length from vent forward tip to start of bend. >2. Approx radius of bend. >3. Height of horizontal vent tube above the fuselage skin >4. How much tubing ends up protruding through the lower skin? > >Rough dimensions would be great if anyone has a few minutes to spare Phil - I can't give you any dimensions as I haven't an example to hand, but i can offer some observations. When Tim Houlihan & I were preparing for the Europa Club tour of Ireland last year, he was having a lot of trouble getting sensible readings from both his sight gauge (exactly as the manual) and his electronic gauge (which uses a pressure sensor like Tony K's but at present has a different display device. We fiddled about with the vent system, found and cured some leaks at joints, but nothing seemed to improve the reliability of the indications. By blowing or sucking carefully on the vent pipe on the ground, we could demonstrate that the sight gauge and the electric one were telling the same story. Aloft, both gave off-scale indications at certain parts of the flight envelope - and my memory is a bit hazy here, but it seemed that the fuselage angle of attack appeared to affect whether we got sensible or silly answers. I don't think we ever got around to it before getting fed up with test flights, but I wanted to try taping over the holes at the back because I suspected they were so close to the fuselage top surface that they might have been going in and out of the boundary layer and thus affecting the pressure seen in the vent pipe. Another test would be to block the main end of the vent and leave the back holes open to see how indications differed. For what it's worth, I'm intending to use Graham Singleton's version of the fuel system (with ali pipes) and have the vent pointing down at the bottom of the fuselage (so that vented fuel from over-filling goes on the grass rather than over the fuselage), which should also eliminate any of the above issues. I'll tell you later if it doesn't! regards Rowland -- | Rowland Carson LAA #16532 http://home.clara.net/rowil/aviation/ | 1280 hours building Europa #435 G-ROWI e-mail ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 06:12:54 AM PST US From: Rick Stockton Subject: Re: Europa-List: Wire marking You are the mechanic/engineer in change.-- Its what you want it to be. - I took the system I was working on "Navigation -lites" became LN-1, R N-1 in the wings, "Aileron trim" system- became AT-1 through AT-5,- Str obe system became RS-1 through RS-4 and LS-1 - LS-4. - I printed these up on a sheet of paper then cut them out and placed them- on the wires then cover with clear heat shrink tubing.- - I have two terminals strips back the back of the fire wall.- Ones positiv e the other is ground or for our English friends Earth ground.- I place o ne more in the panel just behind the trim switches.- This handles panel l ites, trim power- aileron/elevator, flaps power up/down.- I used plastic cannon plugs -for the trim system, but found out the hard way that I didn 't have enough space between the wing and fuselage to use the cannon plugs and will go to three Molex plugs.- - Hope this ups. - - _filtered #yiv1914089700 { font-family:Tahoma;} _filtered #yiv1914089700 {margin:72.0pt 2.0cm 72.0pt 2.0cm;} #yiv1914089700 P.MsoNormal { MARGIN:0cm 0cm 0pt;FONT-FAMILY:"Times New Roman";FONT-SIZE:12pt;} #yiv1914089700 LI.MsoNormal { MARGIN:0cm 0cm 0pt;FONT-FAMILY:"Times New Roman";FONT-SIZE:12pt;} #yiv1914089700 DIV.MsoNormal { MARGIN:0cm 0cm 0pt;FONT-FAMILY:"Times New Roman";FONT-SIZE:12pt;} #yiv1914089700 A:link { COLOR:blue;TEXT-DECORATION:underline;} #yiv1914089700 SPAN.MsoHyperlink { COLOR:blue;TEXT-DECORATION:underline;} #yiv1914089700 A:visited { COLOR:purple;TEXT-DECORATION:underline;} #yiv1914089700 SPAN.MsoHyperlinkFollowed { COLOR:purple;TEXT-DECORATION:underline;} #yiv1914089700 P.MsoPlainText { MARGIN:0cm 0cm 0pt;FONT-FAMILY:"Courier New";FONT-SIZE:10pt;} #yiv1914089700 LI.MsoPlainText { MARGIN:0cm 0cm 0pt;FONT-FAMILY:"Courier New";FONT-SIZE:10pt;} #yiv1914089700 DIV.MsoPlainText { MARGIN:0cm 0cm 0pt;FONT-FAMILY:"Courier New";FONT-SIZE:10pt;} #yiv1914089700 PRE { MARGIN:0cm 0cm 0pt;FONT-FAMILY:"Courier New";FONT-SIZE:10pt;} #yiv1914089700 SPAN.EmailStyle19 { FONT-FAMILY:Arial;COLOR:navy;} #yiv1914089700 DIV.Section1 { } Here I go into the electric abyss: I am about to start the assembly of my instrument panel. -I wonder:-How are the wires marked - physically? A ny convention for assigning wire "names" base on purpose?-How about conne ctors between the panel and airframe? Multiple molex or something larger c ombining multiple feeds?-Any use for terminal strips inside the panel?- Pictures are always appreciated.-Thanks-GRobertsA187Tucson, AZ-- ____________________________________________________________ You have a right to seek justice! Click here to find experienced lawyers ac ross the USA. ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 06:12:54 AM PST US From: Rick Stockton Subject: Re: Europa-List: Fuel System Vents Take a look at Bub's website. - http://www.customflightcreations.com/id21.html ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 10:43:54 PM PST US From: "Thomas Scherer" Subject: Europa-List: Europa XS Motorglider Trigear Stage 1 ~ 3 70 % done for Sale With heavy heart I have to sell my partly built Europa XS MG Kit, Stages 1,2,3. All flying surfaces are done (need filling and sanding). Standing on Trigear Top not yet bonded on One wing (Carbon) done, one wing to build. Cockpit module bonded in Doors on Fuselage-top with shootbolt mechanism done. All parts neccessary available (including tinted windows). In my guess you'd need 1 year of build-time and an engine of your choice to produce the finest travelling machine available. Located near Berlin, Germany. Asking price 20 % under factory new. Contact me offlist at Thomas@Scherer.com Sincerely, ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message europa-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Europa-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/europa-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/europa-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.