---------------------------------------------------------- Europa-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sat 06/27/09: 12 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 01:40 AM - =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Re=3A__Europa-List=3A_Landing_gear_?= =?ISO-8859-1?Q?frame? (Carl Pattinson) 2. 02:05 AM - Europa - folding bikes (Carl Pattinson) 3. 06:55 AM - Re: Europa - folding bikes (Paul McAllister) 4. 07:41 AM - Re: Europa - folding bikes (Karl Heindl) 5. 09:09 AM - Re: Landing gear frame (Duncan & Ami McFadyean) 6. 10:21 AM - NACA duct and overhear vents (Rick Stockton) 7. 11:10 AM - Re: Europa - folding bikes (david miller) 8. 11:21 AM - Fuel Smell, Gone? (david miller) 9. 12:40 PM - Re: NACA duct and overhear vents (Fred Klein) 10. 04:20 PM - Re: Re: Landing gear frame (Greg Fuchs) 11. 04:36 PM - Re: Landing gear frame (Greg Fuchs) 12. 10:14 PM - Re: Europa - folding bikes (RoddyEuropa@aol.com) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 01:40:25 AM PST US From: "Carl Pattinson" Subject: Europa-List: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Re=3A__Europa-List=3A_Landing_gear_?= =?ISO-8859-1?Q?frame? X-mailer: iAVMailScanner 1.5.6.4 Hammerite sticks to just about anything or alternately Waxoyl (or similar) will keep steel parts free from corrosion. ----- Original Message ----- From: Greg Fuchs To: europa-list@matronics.com Sent: Saturday, June 27, 2009 6:46 AM Subject: Europa-List: Landing gear frame Europa Listers, I have found some corrosion and rust in a few areas of my landing gear frame, so I will have to deal with that. My first consideration is powder coating. It would be nice to powder coat over the gold-colored corrosion protection that is there, but based on previous listings, I may need to get down to bare metal to get it to stick. If I simply scuff-sanded the frame, will anything stick to it? If anyone has painted or powder-coated over the original corrosion protection, and had results (negative or positive), let me know. Thanks in advance, Greg Fuchs ========= ========= ========= ========= _______________________________________ No viruses found in this outgoing message Scanned by iolo AntiVirus 1.5.6.4 http://www.iolo.com ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 02:05:05 AM PST US From: "Carl Pattinson" Subject: Europa-List: Europa - folding bikes X-mailer: iAVMailScanner 1.5.6.4 I am considering buying a folding bike to carry in our Europa and wondered if any owners had experience of this. Please note we have the old style non extended baggage bay. I have just changed jobs recently and my companys head office is about a 150 mile drive away. I only have to visit occasionally but I thought it might be fun to drop in by air - 70 nautical miles from our local airfield Bicester. Problem is the nearest airfield at the other end, Earls Colne is 5 miles from the company. If I had a small folding bike I could ride there (just me, no passenger). Question is how easy is it to get a folding bike into the aircraft (passenger seat or baggage bay) and if so what would be the best size/ make. Any advice appreciated. Carl Pattinson G-LABS _______________________________________ No viruses found in this outgoing message Scanned by iolo AntiVirus 1.5.6.4 http://www.iolo.com ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 06:55:11 AM PST US Subject: Re: Europa-List: Europa - folding bikes From: Paul McAllister Hi Carl, I purchased a pair of Dahon folding bikes in 2003 and they are excellent. The frame is aluminum with 20" wheels and the fold / unfold operation is simple and fast. The all up weight is 24lbs each. The down side is that they cost a lot, over $400 US, and that was when the dollar was actually worth something with lower commodity prices. The new style has a different frame and comes in at 22 lbs. Take a look at http://www.dahon.com/us/muuno.htm I have do idea at the cost. I have an XS and the two bikes will fit in laying down, I am fairly certain that you could fit one bike standing up in a classic baggage bay. Paul On Sat, Jun 27, 2009 at 4:00 AM, Carl Pattinson wrote: > carl@flyers.freeserve.co.uk> > > I am considering buying a folding bike to carry in our Europa and wondered > if any owners had experience of this. Please note we have the old style non > extended baggage bay ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 07:41:40 AM PST US From: Karl Heindl Subject: RE: Europa-List: Europa - folding bikes Carl=2C Your best bet might be a Bickerton=2C as it has a nice ride (my daughter ha s one)=2C and your trip is 5 miles x 2. But when you consider the cost and the number of times you would acually be using it=2C you are probably far b etter off to take taxis. I bought a perfectly good titanium bike from Walmart for about 150 dollars. It weighs 21 pounds. I tried to use it at Oshkosh=2C where it would have been ideal=2C but it is forbidden to use bikes there. I assume it's the same at Sun'n Fun. So it was a complete waste of money. Karl Subject: Re: Europa-List: Europa - folding bikes From: paul.the.aviator@gmail.com Hi Carl=2C I purchased a pair of Dahon folding bikes in 2003 and they are excellent. T he frame is aluminum with 20" wheels and the fold / unfold operation is sim ple and fast. The all up weight is 24lbs each. The down side is that they cost a lot=2C over $400 US=2C and that was when the dollar was actually w orth something with lower commodity prices. The new style has a different frame and comes in at 22 lbs. Take a look at http://www.dahon.com/us/muuno.htm I have do idea at the cost. I have an XS and the two bikes will fit in laying down=2C I am fairly cert ain that you could fit one bike standing up in a classic baggage bay. Paul On Sat=2C Jun 27=2C 2009 at 4:00 AM=2C Carl Pattinson wrote: co.uk> I am considering buying a folding bike to carry in our Europa and wondered if any owners had experience of this. Please note we have the old style non extended baggage bay ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 09:09:53 AM PST US From: "Duncan & Ami McFadyean" Subject: Re: Europa-List: Landing gear frame Powder coating looks nice but is poor at corrosion protection, commonly because of inadequate preparation. For best protection, copy the way that steel bridges etc are repainted; which is not an activity that wants to be repeated often. For this , epoxy-based primers are applied to clean, freshly abraded steel (usually grit blasted) at ambient humidity of <50%. Better still is an epoxy chromate primer eg the Polyfiber stuff. I used this on Kitfox weldments 20 years ago and there is no corrosion or paint lifting. Meanwhile, a nearby later Mark 4 of half the age needs its fabric stripping so that the flaking powder coated finish can be replaced; presuming that the corrosion under that is not too serious as to write-off the a/c. Duncan McF do not archive its all been said before. ----- Original Message ----- From: Greg Fuchs To: europa-list@matronics.com Sent: Saturday, June 27, 2009 6:46 AM Subject: Europa-List: Landing gear frame Europa Listers, I have found some corrosion and rust in a few areas of my landing gear frame, so I will have to deal with that. My first consideration is powder coating. It would be nice to powder coat over the gold-colored corrosion protection that is there, but based on previous listings, I may need to get down to bare metal to get it to stick. If I simply scuff-sanded the frame, will anything stick to it? If anyone has painted or powder-coated over the original corrosion protection, and had results (negative or positive), let me know. Thanks in advance, Greg Fuchs ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 10:21:01 AM PST US From: Rick Stockton Subject: Europa-List: NACA duct and overhear vents I'm trying to figure out the best place to place my rear NACA duct for the overhead ventation system.- N55XL has it behind the rear bulkhead and the duct system requires a lot of work in getting to it.- I'd like to see if somebody has a simple solation. ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 11:10:50 AM PST US From: david miller Subject: Re: Europa-List: Europa - folding bikes I've got a wal-mart bike, like Karl's, but mine has a steel frame and comes in at about 28lbs. If I did it again I would get one smaller, lighter, and also of course much more expensive. As it is it's a bit of a bother and I've only used it a couple of times, here it is much easier to use the airport bikes or airport car, if available, or take a taxi. Dave C-FBZI do not archive On 27-Jun-09, at 5:00 AM, Carl Pattinson wrote: > > > I am considering buying a folding bike to carry in our Europa and > wondered if any owners had experience of this. Please note we have > the old style non extended baggage bay. > > I have just changed jobs recently and my companys head office is > about a 150 mile drive away. I only have to visit occasionally but > I thought it might be fun to drop in by air - 70 nautical miles > from our local airfield Bicester. Problem is the nearest airfield > at the other end, Earls Colne is 5 miles from the company. If I had > a small folding bike I could ride there (just me, no passenger). > > Question is how easy is it to get a folding bike into the aircraft > (passenger seat or baggage bay) and if so what would be the best > size/ make. > > Any advice appreciated. > > Carl Pattinson > G-LABS > > _______________________________________ > No viruses found in this outgoing message > Scanned by iolo AntiVirus 1.5.6.4 > http://www.iolo.com > > ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 11:21:29 AM PST US From: david miller Subject: Europa-List: Fuel Smell, Gone? I've been searching for the source of an elusive whiff of autogas that normally occurs about 20 minutes or so into the flight. No trace of any leaks can be found, however I've suspected the venting system, as when I had an unwashed plane, a trail in the dust led from the vent, along the port side of the fuselage, under the tail and into the slot for the trim tab/anti servo arm. Seemed too unlikely to be the source of a smell in the cockpit, however I just completed the fuel venting mod back into the tank and today 1.5 hours in hot bumpy conditions, with a full tank, produced not a trace of a smell. I'm probably being to optimistic, too soon, but here's hoping! Dave C-FBZI ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 12:40:56 PM PST US From: Fred Klein Subject: Re: Europa-List: NACA duct and overhear vents On Jun 27, 2009, at 10:17 AM, Rick Stockton wrote: > I'm trying to figure out the best place to place my rear NACA duct > for the overhead ventation system. N55XL has it behind the rear > bulkhead and the duct system requires a lot of work in getting to > it. I'd like to see if somebody has a simple solation. Rick...John Wigney has a simple and straightforward solution... John? How 'bout some pixs? Fred A194 -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 04:20:24 PM PST US From: "Greg Fuchs " Subject: RE: Europa-List: Re: Europa-List: Landing gear frame Thanks Carl, It looks like Hammerite might be an easy solution while being able to be painted right over rust. If it sticks to the corrosion protection that is there already, it would really be a treat. Regards, Greg _____ From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Carl Pattinson Sent: Saturday, June 27, 2009 1:36 AM Subject: Europa-List: Re: Europa-List: Landing gear frame Hammerite sticks to just about anything or alternately Waxoyl (or similar) will keep steel parts free from corrosion. ----- Original Message ----- From: Greg Fuchs Sent: Saturday, June 27, 2009 6:46 AM Subject: Europa-List: Landing gear frame Europa Listers, I have found some corrosion and rust in a few areas of my landing gear frame, so I will have to deal with that. My first consideration is powder coating. It would be nice to powder coat over the gold-colored corrosion protection that is there, but based on previous listings, I may need to get down to bare metal to get it to stick. If I simply scuff-sanded the frame, will anything stick to it? If anyone has painted or powder-coated over the original corrosion protection, and had results (negative or positive), let me know. Thanks in advance, Greg Fuchs ========= ="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List">http://www.matronics.com/N avigator?Europa-List ========= ="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com ========= ="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contributi on ========= _____ No viruses found in this outgoing message Scanned by iolo AntiVirus 1.5.6.4 http://www.iolo.com ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 04:36:38 PM PST US From: "Greg Fuchs " Subject: RE: Europa-List: Landing gear frame Thanks for the ideas, Duncan. It looks like the epoxy based primers will need the same surface preparation as the powder coating. Epoxy chromate primer does seem to be Cadillac. I hope to not need Cadillac, I think something simple but effective is in the thought process -at least right now. If I can find something that doesn't require sand-blasting the whole part, that would be good. its all been said before. Yes, I think I have been too lazy to search hard enough. :0 Thanks for the help, Greg _____ From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Duncan & Ami McFadyean Sent: Saturday, June 27, 2009 9:06 AM Subject: Re: Europa-List: Landing gear frame Powder coating looks nice but is poor at corrosion protection, commonly because of inadequate preparation. For best protection, copy the way that steel bridges etc are repainted; which is not an activity that wants to be repeated often. For this , epoxy-based primers are applied to clean, freshly abraded steel (usually grit blasted) at ambient humidity of <50%. Better still is an epoxy chromate primer eg the Polyfiber stuff. I used this on Kitfox weldments 20 years ago and there is no corrosion or paint lifting. Meanwhile, a nearby later Mark 4 of half the age needs its fabric stripping so that the flaking powder coated finish can be replaced; presuming that the corrosion under that is not too serious as to write-off the a/c. Duncan McF do not archive its all been said before. ----- Original Message ----- From: Greg Fuchs Sent: Saturday, June 27, 2009 6:46 AM Subject: Europa-List: Landing gear frame Europa Listers, I have found some corrosion and rust in a few areas of my landing gear frame, so I will have to deal with that. My first consideration is powder coating. It would be nice to powder coat over the gold-colored corrosion protection that is there, but based on previous listings, I may need to get down to bare metal to get it to stick. If I simply scuff-sanded the frame, will anything stick to it? If anyone has painted or powder-coated over the original corrosion protection, and had results (negative or positive), let me know. Thanks in advance, Greg Fuchs href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List">http://www.matronhref "http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 10:14:35 PM PST US From: RoddyEuropa@aol.com Subject: Re: Europa-List: Europa - folding bikes I think in this area you very much get what you pay for. I had a cheap eba y folding bike and you could get it in the plane, with some difficulty, but it was thoroughly unpleasant to ride. I now have a Brompton and I think it is brilliant - marvel of design and engineering, light, very easy to ride and fits very easily in the back. But at a price (I think about =A3500). Roddy Kesterton #220 PS Carl - happy to show you if you are in the area - home airfield Andrewsfield is close by to Earl's Colne. In a message dated 27/06/2009 10:05:30 GMT Daylight Time, carl@flyers.freeserve.co.uk writes: --> Europa-List message posted by: "Carl Pattinson" I am considering buying a folding bike to carry in our Europa and wondere d if any owners had experience of this. Please note we have the old style non extended baggage bay. I have just changed jobs recently and my companys head office is about a 150 mile drive away. I only have to visit occasionally but I thought it might be fun to drop in by air - 70 nautical miles from our local airfield Bicester. Problem is the nearest airfield at the other end, Earls Colne is 5 miles from the company. If I had a small folding bike I could ride there (just me, no passenger). Question is how easy is it to get a folding bike into the aircraft (passenger seat or baggage bay) and if so what would be the best size/ make. Any advice appreciated. Carl Pattinson G-LABS _______________________________________ No viruses found in this outgoing message Scanned by iolo AntiVirus 1.5.6.4 http://www.iolo.com ======================== =========== ======================== =========== ======================== =========== ======================== =========== ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message europa-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Europa-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/europa-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/europa-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.