Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 02:35 AM - MONOlogue (Kingsley Hurst)
2. 04:49 AM - touring in Greece (Glenn Rainey)
3. 06:32 AM - Re: MONOlogue (david park)
4. 11:35 AM - Re: MONOlogue (Mike Parkin)
5. 11:53 AM - Re: outrigger wheels (Robert Hatton)
6. 01:02 PM - Re: outrigger wheels (Fred Klein)
7. 01:49 PM - Re: outrigger wheels (Jim Brown)
8. 03:55 PM - Re: MONOlogue (GRAHAM SINGLETON)
9. 10:43 PM - Re: MONOlogue (Mike Parkin)
10. 10:45 PM - Re: outrigger wheels (Fred Klein)
Message 1
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Dear Mono Fraternity
I have struck upon an idea which I thought might interest other Mono
believers.
The revelation that my flaps no longer retracted as nicely once the
outrigger legs were installed caused me some angst and disappointment to the
extent that I investigated more closely the geometry of the outrigger
mechanism. Whilst adjusting the flaps to go home more firmly yielded
a slight improvement, I found the outriggers still wanted to hang down
slightly.
My calculations revealed (subsequently confirmed with a spring balance)
that the force exerted by the flaps through the push rod OR5 to hold an
outrigger fully up (horizontally) is in the order of 18kg (40 lbs).
I found that this amount of force causes spring in the train from the flap
drive pin to the outrigger mechanism significant enough to cause the
outrigger to sag somewhat from the fully up position. By fully up, I mean
the nylon leg touching the bottom of the flap hinge.
My solution has been to install a small gas strut as depicted in the
attached photos.
If you haven't witnessed how much better the operation of the outriggers are
with this set-up, you would probably find it hard to believe the difference
it makes to the whole operation of the flaps and outriggers.
Expected advantage achieved:-
Only that the outrigger leg would be fully supported by the gas strut when
the leg is up (no force required by the flap at all)
Unexpected advantages achieved:-
When the wing is removed, because the outrigger is held up by the gas
strut, the flap does not want to fall down and is in fact quite positively
held up. Have you never removed a wing and had the flap fall down?
When the outrigger leg extends, the gas strut goes slightly over centre
and to a small degree assists the leg to lock down.
The force required to extend or retract the outrigger leg seems to be
about the same in both directions. It needs a slight force to start it on
its way down and likewise, a small force to start it on its way up again.
Disadvantage:-
The only one I can see is the extra weight of the two gas struts
which I am prepared to wear.
The only caveat is that I have not flight tested it yet unfortunately
but I have a high degree of confidence it will be every bit as good as the
standard set-up if not better. One thing that will be better for sure is
that the outriggers will not hang down resembling a lame duck!
Cheers
Kingsley in Oz
Message 2
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| Subject: | touring in Greece |
Recently someone here in the group was asking about touring in Greece? I see a
brave compatriot is _very_ shortly to transit that country by gyro', on his way,
um, Around. Perhaps he could be contacted by email in due course for the skinny
on his experiences there, by anyone planning to visit Greece in a Permit
aircraft. One would expect his flying machine to attract the natives, perhaps
the folks wearing hats.
Norman Surplus tracking
http://share.findmespot.com/shared/faces/viewspots.jsp?glId=0M3Zb2VvSqGOOKr8faf6ltSR80lVr0C4h
also at ...
http://www.gyroxgoesglobal.com/
I'm not planning this trip myself, other than by KLM shortly... less burocracy
..... :-)
cheers,
Glenn Rainey
Classic monowheel G-OJHL
Cumbernauld, Scotland
Message 3
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Does your speek kit! still fit over it?
Dave
> From: hurstkr@redzone.com.au
> To: europa-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Europa-List: MONOlogue
> Date: Wed=2C 31 Mar 2010 19:24:08 +1000
>
> Dear Mono Fraternity
>
> I have struck upon an idea which I thought might interest other Mono
> believers.
>
> The revelation that my flaps no longer retracted as nicely once the
> outrigger legs were installed caused me some angst and disappointment to
the
> extent that I investigated more closely the geometry of the outrigger
> mechanism. Whilst adjusting the flaps to go home more firmly yielded
> a slight improvement=2C I found the outriggers still wanted to hang down
> slightly.
>
> My calculations revealed (subsequently confirmed with a spring balance)
> that the force exerted by the flaps through the push rod OR5 to hold an
> outrigger fully up (horizontally) is in the order of 18kg (40 lbs).
> I found that this amount of force causes spring in the train from the fla
p
> drive pin to the outrigger mechanism significant enough to cause the
> outrigger to sag somewhat from the fully up position. By fully up=2C I me
an
> the nylon leg touching the bottom of the flap hinge.
>
> My solution has been to install a small gas strut as depicted in the
> attached photos.
>
> If you haven't witnessed how much better the operation of the outriggers
are
> with this set-up=2C you would probably find it hard to believe the differ
ence
> it makes to the whole operation of the flaps and outriggers.
>
> Expected advantage achieved:-
>
> Only that the outrigger leg would be fully supported by the gas strut whe
n
> the leg is up (no force required by the flap at all)
>
> Unexpected advantages achieved:-
>
> When the wing is removed=2C because the outrigger is held up by the gas
> strut=2C the flap does not want to fall down and is in fact quite positiv
ely
> held up. Have you never removed a wing and had the flap fall down?
>
> When the outrigger leg extends=2C the gas strut goes slightly over centre
> and to a small degree assists the leg to lock down.
>
> The force required to extend or retract the outrigger leg seems to be
> about the same in both directions. It needs a slight force to start it on
> its way down and likewise=2C a small force to start it on its way up agai
n.
>
> Disadvantage:-
>
> The only one I can see is the extra weight of the two gas struts
> which I am prepared to wear.
>
>
> The only caveat is that I have not flight tested it yet unfortunately
> but I have a high degree of confidence it will be every bit as good as th
e
> standard set-up if not better. One thing that will be better for sure is
> that the outriggers will not hang down resembling a lame duck!
>
> Cheers
> Kingsley in Oz
Message 4
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Kingsley,
The mod looks great. The one concern I would have is that quite a few monos
are quite late in the approach before the outriggers lock down, the effect
of air loads I think. Your gas strut combined with the air loads .... , are
you quite sure they will lock down in flight.
Regards,
Mike
Do not archive
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: outrigger wheels |
Hello Fred,
I know this is an old thread, but did you go with these wheels and if so,
what did you think? I am about to replace mine and I too am looking for a
better outrigger wheel.
Rob
A128
On Wed, Sep 23, 2009 at 7:56 PM, Fred Klein <fklein@orcasonline.com> wrote:
> Guys...I've been looking into substitutes for the kit-provided outrigger
> wheel, and thought I'd found the answer with a Colson Performa wheel whic
h
> comes w/ sealed ball bearings. After Kingsley acquainted me w/ the
> distinction between "sealed ball bearings" and "maintenance-free precisio
n
> ball bearings" I found the following in the McMaster catalogue (I hope th
e
> text and graphics gets thru the matronics server). This "Easy-Roll
> Rubber-Tread Wheel" (McMaster part # 2439T42) which comes with "maintenan
ce-free
> precision ball bearings" has a ridiculous low price of $7.81. I've querie
d
> McMaster, and they confirm that yes, it does come w/ these bearings. I'm
> wondering if anyone has tried them and can comment on their performance.
>
> Or...has anyone found the ultimate outrigger wheel?
>
> Fred
> A194
>
> Easy-Roll Rubber-Tread Wheels
> 3 1/2" to 6" Dia.
> 8" to 10" Dia.
>
> - Blue rubber on nylon core
> - Durometer is 70A
> - Temperature range is -40=B0 to +200=B0 F
>
> Resilient rubber tread rebounds quickly, so you can roll and turn
> easily on most surfaces. The maintenance-free precision ball bearings
> require minimal effort to get these wheels rolling.
> *Wheel Size,* *For Axle* *Hub* *Cap. Ea.,* *Dia. x Wd.* *Dia.* *Lg.
*
> *lbs.* *Each* 3 1/2" x 1 1/4" 3/8" 1 5/8" 225 2439T41 $7.10 4" x 1 1/
4
> " 3/8" 1 5/8" 250 2439T42 7.81
>
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: outrigger wheels |
On Mar 31, 2010, at 11:51 AM, Robert Hatton wrote:
> I know this is an old thread, but did you go with these wheels and
> if so, what did you think?
Rob,
No I did not...as w/ so many aspects of our passion, there is a whole
world, if not a universe, to be explored w/ respect to wheels and
bearings, in particular the distinction between bearing types (seems
there are varying grades of "precision").
I ended up with the following, purchased online at www.skates.com:
2 - 100 mm inline skate wheels w/ ABEC 5 bearings (installed); these
wheels, weighing 0.6 pounds each, somewhat harder (82 durometer) than
the Colson wheels (65 durometer) but resilient nonetheless, are fine
silent spinners, noticeably quieter, and much easier to spin up, much
longer running than wheels w/ non-precision bearings.
4 - ABEC 9 bearings which can be substituted for the ABEC 5s...the
best bearings I could find short of going to ceramics.
8 - aluminum 8 mm spacers...4 of each of two types...potentially
useful when installing the wheels on the Europa forks...to center the
wheels on the forks will require shortening of the spacers.
A hint at how these bearings are removed and changed: Insert one of
the spacers w/ the reducers on each end into the installed wheel
bearing...gently "rock" the bearing from side to side...they will move
outward from the wheel hub in small increments...work patiently, and
they will then "pop out". This technique was recommended by the wheel
sellers and I've found that it does in fact work, though patience is
key.
Enjoy,
Fred
PS: ZERO FLIGHT EXPERIENCE OR TESTING !!
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: outrigger wheels |
I'm on my second set of the Performa wheels, and I have nothing but good to
say..=0A=0AI fly off paved runway's 99 % of the time, The bearings are nee
dle bearings, they are full length in the hub. Much more robust than the wh
eels with ball bearings on each side of the wheel...=0A=0AGrease the bearin
g when you install the wheel, and they will be good to next annual.... The
wheel will wear out before -the bearings do, on paved runways...=0A=0AJim
Brown=0AMonowheel N398JB=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A________________________________=0A
From: Robert Hatton <roberthatton1@googlemail.com>=0ATo: europa-list@matron
ics.com=0ASent: Wed, March 31, 2010 2:51:28 PM=0ASubject: Re: Europa-List:
outrigger wheels=0A=0A=0AHello Fred,=0A=0AI know this is an old thread, but
did you go with these wheels and if so, what did you think? I am about to
replace mine and I too am looking for a better outrigger wheel.=0A=0ARob=0A
A128=0A=0A=0AOn Wed, Sep 23, 2009 at 7:56 PM, Fred Klein <fklein@orcasonlin
e.com> wrote:=0A=0AGuys...I've been looking into substitutes for the kit-pr
ovided outrigger wheel, and thought I'd found the answer with a Colson Perf
orma wheel which comes w/ sealed ball bearings. After Kingsley acquainted m
e w/ the distinction between "sealed ball bearings" and "maintenance-free p
recision ball bearings" I found the following in the McMaster catalogue (I
hope the text and graphics gets thru the matronics server). This "Easy-Roll
Rubber-Tread Wheel" (McMaster part # 2439T42) which comes with-"maintena
nce-free precision ball bearings" has a ridiculous low price of $7.81. I've
queried McMaster, and they confirm that yes, it does come w/ these bearing
s. I'm wondering if anyone has tried them and can comment on their performa
nce. =0A>=0A>=0A>Or...has anyone found the ultimate outrigger wheel?=0A>=0A
>=0A>Fred=0A>A194=0A>=0A>=0A>Easy-Roll Rubber-Tread Wheels =0A> =0A>3-1/2
" to 6" Dia. =0A>8" to 10" Dia. * Blue rubber on nylon core=0A>*
Durometer is 70A=0A>* Temperature range is -40=B0 to +200=B0 F=0A>--
-Resilient rubber tread rebounds quickly, so you can roll and turn easily
on most surfaces. The maintenance-free precision ball bearings require min
imal effort to get these wheels rolling. =0A>Wheel-Size, For-Axle Hub C
ap. Ea., - =0A>Dia.-x-Wd. Dia. Lg. lbs. Each =0A>3-1/2"-x-1-
1/4" -3/8" 1-5/8" 225 2439T41 $7.10 =0A>4"-x-1-1/4" -3/8" 1-
5/8" 250 2439T42 7.81 =0A=0A=0A=0A
Message 8
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Mike=0Anot sure I agree re air loads, the flaps were designed so that lift
reacts straight up the support through the pivot so there should be no forc
e raising or lowering the flap. Certainly if the gear bungie is correctly a
djusted you can put the flap anywhere in flight and it doesn't move. Sure t
here might be some bias from the gear but flaps down I suspect air loads ar
e balanced by the loads in the flap hangers and can't affect fore and aft m
ovement of the flap? Comments?=0AGraham=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A_____________________
___________=0AFrom: Mike Parkin <mikenjulie.parkin@btinternet.com>=0ATo: eu
ropa-list@matronics.com=0ASent: Wednesday, 31 March, 2010 19:33:38=0ASubjec
Parkin" <mikenjulie.parkin@btinternet.com>=0A=0AKingsley,=0A=0AThe mod loo
ks great. The one concern I would have is that quite a few monos=0Aare qui
te late in the approach before the outriggers lock down, the effect=0Aof ai
r loads I think. Your gas strut combined with the air loads .... , are=0Ay
ou quite sure they will lock down in flight.=0A=0ARegards,=0A=0AMike=0A=0AD
======================
Message 9
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Graham,
I think you missed my point. The air load I was referring to was the
airstream acting on the lower part of the outrigger leg, preventing the
leg from moving forward that last bit to allow the outrigger latch to
operate. It may not be airloads, but there certainly is something that
occasionally prevents the outrigger locking down until the IAS reduces.
It has occurred a couple of times on G-JULZ and I recall other people
reporting similar happenings on the this site.
My concern with the air strut is that its action is in an opposite
direction to the forward locking motion. But what do I know, it may
work brilliantly. In flight, G-JULZ does not appear to have any
noticeable droop. The problem is only an aesthetic one for outside
observers, you cannot see the outriggers from the cockpit.
Regards,
Mike
Do not archive.
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of GRAHAM
SINGLETON
Sent: 31 March 2010 23:54
Subject: Re: Europa-List: MONOlogue
Mike
not sure I agree re air loads, the flaps were designed so that lift
reacts straight up the support through the pivot so there should be no
force raising or lowering the flap. Certainly if the gear bungie is
correctly adjusted you can put the flap anywhere in flight and it
doesn't move. Sure there might be some bias from the gear but flaps down
I suspect air loads are balanced by the loads in the flap hangers and
can't affect fore and aft movement of the flap? Comments?
Graham
_____
From: Mike Parkin <mikenjulie.parkin@btinternet.com>
Sent: Wednesday, 31 March, 2010 19:33:38
Subject: RE: Europa-List: MONOlogue
<mikenjulie.parkin@btinternet.com>
Kingsley,
The mod looks great. The one concern I would have is that quite a few
monos
are quite late in the approach before the outriggers lock down, the
effect
of air loads I think. Your gas strut combined with the air loads .... ,
are
you quite sure they will lock down in flight.
Regards,
Mike
Do not archive
<-List"
target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-Lista
href="http://forums.matronics.com"
target="_blank">http://forums.matr= Thank you for your generous
nbsp; -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
07:32:00
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: outrigger wheels |
Jim...nuthin like an endorsement by someone who's had some real
experience...thanks for your comment..I'll hang onto my set of
Performa wheels...just in case.
=46rom my armchair, I got to thinkin about those wheels...after
ordering a set of Performas, by chance I happened to notice that it's
the same wheel used on the carts at Costco, a use where robustness and
maintenance (and cost) were doubtless considered. Still, the forward
speed for those carts can't be more than 2 mph, and at the time I
believe I figured that our outriggers were spin up to approx. 5000 rpm
at TO and landing speeds if memory serves...a very different
performance environment...that realization made me look further.
I do know of two mono drivers who swear by their skate wheels...so
there's doubtless more than one way to skin this cat...
Fred
A194
still a'buildin
On Mar 31, 2010, at 1:42 PM, Jim Brown wrote:
> I'm on my second set of the Performa wheels, and I have nothing but
> good to say..
>
> I fly off paved runway's 99 % of the time, The bearings are needle
> bearings, they are full length in the hub. Much more robust than the
> wheels with ball bearings on each side of the wheel...
>
> Grease the bearing when you install the wheel, and they will be good
> to next annual.... The wheel will wear out before the bearings do,
> on paved runways...
>
> Jim Brown
> Monowheel N398JB
>
> From: Robert Hatton <roberthatton1@googlemail.com>
> To: europa-list@matronics.com
> Sent: Wed, March 31, 2010 2:51:28 PM
> Subject: Re: Europa-List: outrigger wheels
>
> Hello Fred,
>
> I know this is an old thread, but did you go with these wheels and
> if so, what did you think? I am about to replace mine and I too am
> looking for a better outrigger wheel.
>
> Rob
> A128
>
> On Wed, Sep 23, 2009 at 7:56 PM, Fred Klein <fklein@orcasonline.com>
> wrote:
> Guys...I've been looking into substitutes for the kit-provided
> outrigger wheel, and thought I'd found the answer with a Colson
> Performa wheel which comes w/ sealed ball bearings. After Kingsley
> acquainted me w/ the distinction between "sealed ball bearings" and
> "maintenance-free precision ball bearings" I found the following in
> the McMaster catalogue (I hope the text and graphics gets thru the
> matronics server). This "Easy-Roll Rubber-Tread Wheel" (McMaster
> part # 2439T42) which comes with "maintenance-free precision ball
> bearings" has a ridiculous low price of $7.81. I've queried
> McMaster, and they confirm that yes, it does come w/ these bearings.
> I'm wondering if anyone has tried them and can comment on their
> performance.
>
> Or...has anyone found the ultimate outrigger wheel?
>
> Fred
> A194
>
> Easy-Roll Rubber-Tread Wheels
> <2439tp1s.gif>
> 3 1/2" to 6" Dia.
> <2439tp2s.gif>
> 8" to 10" Dia.
> Blue rubber on nylon core
> Durometer is 70A
> Temperature range is -40=B0 to +200=B0 F
> Resilient rubber tread rebounds quickly, so you can roll and turn
> easily on most surfaces. The maintenance-free precision ball
> bearings require minimal effort to get these wheels rolling.
> Wheel Size, For Axle Hub Cap. Ea.,
> Dia. x Wd. Dia. Lg. lbs. Each
> 3 1/2" x 1 1/4" 3/8" 1 5/8" 225
> 2439T41 $7.10
> 4" x 1 1/4" 3/8" 1 5/8" 250
> 2439T42 7.81
>
>
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