Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 02:05 AM - Re: Realistic price for 914F3? (zwakie)
2. 03:35 AM - Re: Europa News (jglazener)
3. 04:45 AM - Re: Re: Realistic price for 914F3? (Jim Brown)
4. 06:20 AM - Re: Realistic price for 914F3? (rampil)
5. 06:24 AM - Re: Realistic price for 914F3? (rampil)
6. 09:37 AM - Re: Re: Realistic price for 914F3? (David Joyce)
7. 09:48 AM - Re: Re: Realistic price for 914F3? (Frans Veldman)
8. 10:19 AM - Re: Re: Realistic price for 914F3? (Tony Renshaw)
9. 12:34 PM - Re: Re: Realistic price for 914F3? (Pete Lawless)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Realistic price for 914F3? |
Anyone out there who can give me some direction on this?
zwakie wrote:
> Someone informed me about a Rotax 914F3 that will be coming up for sale in the
near future.
>
> I was told that this fully certified engine:
> - currently runs on a certified airplane
> - will be taken off due to TBO coming up shortly (year of build: 1998)
> - is in perfect shiny state ("looks like brand new")
> - has 400 hours TT on the clock
> - will be delivered with all parts and documentation that you would get when
buying a new 914F3
> - will receive a 600 hrs interval inspection and maintenance before it is being
sold
> - has all SB's/TM's completed
> - has flown appr. 30 hours each year, without extended periods of non-running
> - has always been maintained according to Rotax maintenance schedules
>
> To me this sounds like a perfect opportunity to have a certified engine for a
homebuilt. But.... since I have not built my Europa myself, I have no clue about
prices of engines.
>
> I would therefore highly appreciate all input I can get from the Europa-community
on the subject of price: what do you think would be a realistic price for
this engine based on above description?
--------
Marcel
(Classic Tri-Gear PH-MZW - formerly G-BWON)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=299335#299335
Message 2
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The way KW ended up claiming 1000 kits sold was the same as his bookkeeping: very
creative. I know for one thing that every tail kit, even if the customer never
came back, was noted as a plane sold. I don't know the exact further details,
but if everyone who buys something from you is put down as someone who will
eventually buy a full plane, you can rack up sales pretty quickly. At least
he was honest in listing kits sold, not kits delivered...
I was also disappointed to see EA 2004 only sold four. That would mean I am responsible
for an impressive 25% of their turnover, but for all our benefit I would
rather that had not been the case!
Jeroen
http://www.europaowners.org/forums/gallery2.php?g2_itemId=44165
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=299339#299339
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Realistic price for 914F3? |
I do not think that Rotax had any "certified" engines in 1998.... Check the
serial number, if it has UL after the serial number then it is not certifi
ed...at least to my thinking....- =0A=0AHere in the U.S. if you install a
"certified" engine in a experimential airplane then the engine becomes a n
on certified engine..Or words to that effect.=0A=0AI know some of the 912 S
series of engines installed in the Light Sport airplanes are certified, I
have not seen any 914 engines installed in certified light sport airplanes.
....=0A=0AIn 1998 Rotax did not have any TBO's on their engines, sometime i
n the mid-2000 they started showing TBO on the light sport aircraft and I t
hink all of the Light Sport a/c are equiped with the 912 S series of engine
s.=0A=0AThese are my thoughts, as to your questions... I have operated a 91
4 since 2000 when I started flying a monowheel with a 914..At that time Rot
ax did- not have any certified engines..=0A=0AJim Brown=0AN398JB=0A=0A=0A
=0A________________________________=0AFrom: zwakie <mz@cariama.nl>=0ATo: eu
ropa-list@matronics.com=0ASent: Sun, May 30, 2010 5:03:37 AM=0ASubject: Eur
opa-List: Re: Realistic price for 914F3?=0A=0A--> Europa-List message poste
d by: "zwakie" <mz@cariama.nl>=0A=0AAnyone out there who can give me some d
irection on this?=0A=0A=0Azwakie wrote:=0A> Someone informed me about a Rot
ax 914F3 that will be coming up for sale in the near future.=0A> =0A> I was
told that this fully certified engine:=0A> - currently runs on a certified
airplane=0A> - will be taken off due to TBO coming up shortly (year of bui
ld: 1998)=0A> - is in perfect shiny state ("looks like brand new")=0A> - ha
s 400 hours TT on the clock=0A> - will be delivered with all parts and docu
mentation that you would get when buying a new 914F3=0A> - will receive a 6
00 hrs interval inspection and maintenance before it is being sold=0A> - ha
s all SB's/TM's completed=0A> - has flown appr. 30 hours each year, without
extended periods of non-running=0A> - has always been maintained according
to Rotax maintenance schedules=0A> =0A> To me this sounds like a perfect o
pportunity to have a certified engine for a homebuilt. But.... since I have
not built my Europa myself, I have no clue about prices of engines. =0A>
=0A> I would therefore highly appreciate all input I can get from the Europ
a-community on the subject of price: what do you think would be a realistic
price for this engine based on above description?=0A=0A=0A--------=0AMarce
l=0A(Classic Tri-Gear PH-MZW - formerly G-BWON)=0A=0A=0A=0A=0ARead this top
ic online here:=0A=0Ahttp://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=299335#2
=========================0A
=0A=0A
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Realistic price for 914F3? |
I believe the F models were indeed certificated, although I was unaware
of a 914F.
The Diamond Katana aircraft used a certificated 912 starting in about 1994
--------
Ira N224XS
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=299352#299352
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| Subject: | Re: Realistic price for 914F3? |
Just out of curiousity, what certified aircraft used this Rotax 914?
A Stemme? A super Dimona?
In the US at least, the certification status of an engine adds nothing
to its value in homebuilt applications
--------
Ira N224XS
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=299353#299353
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| Subject: | Re: Realistic price for 914F3? |
Marcel
Second user engines are really difficult to value and its really what are
you prepared to pay?
However personally I would have thought that between 5K and 8 for what
you have described, am sure that someone will chip in with either more or
less of a figure, anyhow have chucked a stone in the pond so let's see where
the ripples go?
As far as I am aware certainly here in UK if you put a certified engine into
a permit aircraft it then becomes non certified? Will have a great
maintenance record though, probably better than most permit engines? A
flying buddy of mine replaced a 912UL from his certified aircraft with a
replacement exchange engine from Austria/Germany and they were credited less
than 3K for it (had done 800Hrs)!
rgds
Dave Joyce (The other one, former co owner of G-BWON)
Sent to you from David Joyce
www.eastmidsspas.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of zwakie
Sent: 30 May 2010 10:04
Subject: Europa-List: Re: Realistic price for 914F3?
Anyone out there who can give me some direction on this?
zwakie wrote:
> Someone informed me about a Rotax 914F3 that will be coming up for sale in
the near future.
>
> I was told that this fully certified engine:
> - currently runs on a certified airplane
> - will be taken off due to TBO coming up shortly (year of build: 1998)
> - is in perfect shiny state ("looks like brand new")
> - has 400 hours TT on the clock
> - will be delivered with all parts and documentation that you would get
when buying a new 914F3
> - will receive a 600 hrs interval inspection and maintenance before it is
being sold
> - has all SB's/TM's completed
> - has flown appr. 30 hours each year, without extended periods of
non-running
> - has always been maintained according to Rotax maintenance schedules
>
> To me this sounds like a perfect opportunity to have a certified engine
for a homebuilt. But.... since I have not built my Europa myself, I have no
clue about prices of engines.
>
> I would therefore highly appreciate all input I can get from the
Europa-community on the subject of price: what do you think would be a
realistic price for this engine based on above description?
--------
Marcel
(Classic Tri-Gear PH-MZW - formerly G-BWON)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=299335#299335
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Realistic price for 914F3? |
On 05/30/2010 03:24 PM, rampil wrote:
>
> Just out of curiousity, what certified aircraft used this Rotax 914?
>
> A Stemme? A super Dimona?
>
> In the US at least, the certification status of an engine adds nothing
> to its value in homebuilt applications
It will devaluate the engine, as the maintenance of homebuilt aircraft
is not considered "certified maintenance", hence the engine will loose
its certification.
There is no technical difference between a certified Rotax and a
non-certified Rotax.
Frans
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Realistic price for 914F3? |
Hello Jim,
I am an Australian builder about to install a 914. Could you pls tell
Me if yours uses a standard Europa fuel supply setup? If u built your
a/c
And have any specific advice about this engine install
I am like a dry sponge at the moment.
Reg
Tony Renshaw
Sydney Aussie
On 30/05/2010, at 9:44 PM, Jim Brown <acrojim7534@YAHOO.COM> wrote:
> I do not think that Rotax had any "certified" engines in 1998....
> Check the serial number, if it has UL after the serial number then
> it is not certified...at least to my thinking....
>
> Here in the U.S. if you install a "certified" engine in a
> experimential airplane then the engine becomes a non certified
> engine..Or words to that effect.
>
> I know some of the 912 S series of engines installed in the Light
> Sport airplanes are certified, I have not seen any 914 engines
> installed in certified light sport airplanes.....
>
> In 1998 Rotax did not have any TBO's on their engines, sometime in
> the mid-2000 they started showing TBO on the light sport aircraft
> and I think all of the Light Sport a/c are equiped with the 912 S
> series of engines.
>
> These are my thoughts, as to your questions... I have operated a 914
> since 2000 when I started flying a monowheel with a 914..At that
> time Rotax did not have any certified engines..
>
> Jim Brown
> N398JB
>
> From: zwakie <mz@cariama.nl>
> To: europa-list@matronics.com
> Sent: Sun, May 30, 2010 5:03:37 AM
> Subject: Europa-List: Re: Realistic price for 914F3?
>
>
> Anyone out there who can give me some direction on this?
>
>
> zwakie wrote:
> > Someone informed me about a Rotax 914F3 that will be coming up for
> sale in the near future.
> >
> > I was told that this fully certified engine:
> > - currently runs on a certified airplane
> > - will be taken off due to TBO coming up shortly (year of build:
> 1998)
> > - is in perfect shiny state ("looks like brand new")
> > - has 400 hours TT on the clock
> > - will be delivered with all parts and documentation that you
> would get when buying a new 914F3
> > - will receive a 600 hrs interval inspection and maintenance
> before it is being sold
> > - has all SB's/TM's completed
> > - has flown appr. 30 hours each year, without extended periods of
> non-running
> > - has always been maintained according to Rotax maintenance
> schedules
> >
> > To me this sounds like a perfect opportunity to have a certified
> engine for a homebuilt. But.... since I have not built my Europa
> myself, I have no clue about prices of engines.
> >
> > I would therefore highly appreciate all input I can get from the
> Europa-community on the subject of price: what do you think would be
> a realistic price for this engine based on above description?
>
>
> --------
> Marcel
> (Classic Tri-Gear PH-MZW - formerly G-BWON)
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=299335#299335
>
>
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Realistic price for 914F3? |
Just a thought if it was certified and the aeroplane used for training in
the UK then it will have been run on AVGAS 100LL for its entire life. Not
good!
Pete
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of David Joyce
Sent: 30 May 2010 17:34
Subject: RE: Europa-List: Re: Realistic price for 914F3?
Marcel
Second user engines are really difficult to value and its really what are
you prepared to pay?
However personally I would have thought that between 5K and 8 for what
you have described, am sure that someone will chip in with either more or
less of a figure, anyhow have chucked a stone in the pond so let's see where
the ripples go?
As far as I am aware certainly here in UK if you put a certified engine into
a permit aircraft it then becomes non certified? Will have a great
maintenance record though, probably better than most permit engines? A
flying buddy of mine replaced a 912UL from his certified aircraft with a
replacement exchange engine from Austria/Germany and they were credited less
than 3K for it (had done 800Hrs)!
rgds
Dave Joyce (The other one, former co owner of G-BWON)
Sent to you from David Joyce
www.eastmidsspas.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of zwakie
Sent: 30 May 2010 10:04
Subject: Europa-List: Re: Realistic price for 914F3?
Anyone out there who can give me some direction on this?
zwakie wrote:
> Someone informed me about a Rotax 914F3 that will be coming up for sale in
the near future.
>
> I was told that this fully certified engine:
> - currently runs on a certified airplane
> - will be taken off due to TBO coming up shortly (year of build: 1998)
> - is in perfect shiny state ("looks like brand new")
> - has 400 hours TT on the clock
> - will be delivered with all parts and documentation that you would get
when buying a new 914F3
> - will receive a 600 hrs interval inspection and maintenance before it is
being sold
> - has all SB's/TM's completed
> - has flown appr. 30 hours each year, without extended periods of
non-running
> - has always been maintained according to Rotax maintenance schedules
>
> To me this sounds like a perfect opportunity to have a certified engine
for a homebuilt. But.... since I have not built my Europa myself, I have no
clue about prices of engines.
>
> I would therefore highly appreciate all input I can get from the
Europa-community on the subject of price: what do you think would be a
realistic price for this engine based on above description?
--------
Marcel
(Classic Tri-Gear PH-MZW - formerly G-BWON)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=299335#299335
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