---------------------------------------------------------- Europa-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Thu 08/19/10: 7 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 07:35 AM - Rough River Up-Date # 8 (JEFF ROBERTS) 2. 11:21 AM - Rough River Up-Date/ Appoliogies (JEFF ROBERTS) 3. 11:22 AM - Seen at Oshkosh (Steven Pitt) 4. 02:02 PM - Re: Seen at Oshkosh (Robert Borger) 5. 03:50 PM - Re: Airmaster Prop. (Bud Yerly) 6. 05:15 PM - Re: Airmaster Prop. (Robert Borger) 7. 06:32 PM - Fw: prop (Fred Klein) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 07:35:36 AM PST US From: JEFF ROBERTS Subject: Europa-List: Rough River Up-Date # 8 RR Attendees, I just received a call from Rough River. She reminded me that she was going to release the rest of the cabins this coming Friday to general sale. She will hold 1 of each kind which is 3 till then. So just another reminder. If you haven't done so yet book it Danno. Thanks for the up-dates to all that have checked in this week. Jeff R. Jeff & Mary Buhrans - N55XS Flying Baby Blue in. Jeff & Karen Roberts - N128LJ Gold Rush Flying In Troy & Donna Maynor - Flying his brand new Mono Classic ;o).. Jim & Lynne Puglise - Driving the air conditioned control tower, beer bar, meeting place/motor home. ;o) Fred Kline.... All the way from Orcas Island, WA John & Susan Lawton - N245E Flying his Jab powered Europa Bob & Maureen Borger N914XL Flying In from Texas in... Little Dragon Lady. Paul McAllister... N378PJ Back in the country and getting new cowl mods ready. Jim & Heather Butcher - Flying in Bud Yearly - N12AY Flying in... Yea Bud! Jim Brown - N398JB - AKA JimBob. Flying up with Bud in formation. Keep em separate boys! Bob Lindsay - Flying in N77EU Turbo Toy from Coronado California. See Below. John & Paddy Wigney - Flying in the good ship N262WF Annual Rough River Fly In. September 17th & 18th 2010 and beyond! ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 11:21:55 AM PST US From: JEFF ROBERTS Subject: Europa-List: Rough River Up-Date/ Appoliogies My apologies... The fine looking mono aircraft below belongs to John & Paddy Wigney. Thanks for the correction Bob. Now you have to send me a picture of Turbo Toy! This what happens when your doing 10 things at once and your pushing 58 years old. Man I need a vacation!! Jeff R Jeff & Mary Buhrans - N55XS Flying Baby Blue in. Jeff & Karen Roberts - N128LJ Gold Rush Flying In Troy & Donna Maynor - Flying his brand new Mono Classic ;o).. Jim & Lynne Puglise - Driving the air conditioned control tower, beer bar, meeting place/motor home. ;o) Fred Kline.... All the way from Orcas Island, WA John & Susan Lawton - N245E Flying his Jab powered Europa Bob & Maureen Borger N914XL Flying In from Texas in... Little Dragon Lady. Paul McAllister... N378PJ Back in the country and getting new cowl mods ready. Jim & Heather Butcher - Flying in Bud Yearly - N12AY Flying in... Yea Bud! Jim Brown - N398JB - AKA JimBob. Flying up with Bud in formation. Keep em separate boys! Bob Lindsay - Flying in N77EU Turbo Toy from Coronado California. See Below. John & Paddy Wigney - Flying in the good ship N262WF ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 11:22:49 AM PST US From: "Steven Pitt" Subject: Europa-List: Seen at Oshkosh Rumour had it that Warp Drive were in discussions with Airmaster to develop a new and more flexible propeller in place of the exisiting installations. I met with the Warp Drive team at Oshkosh and they agreed to me publishing the attached photo of their 'work in progress'. Looks radical to me but no doubt others may have views on whether this is the way to go. BTW was anyone else from the Europa fraternity at Oshkosh? Regards Steve Pitt G-SMDH Your message is ready to be sent with the following file or link attachments: DSCN2461 ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 02:02:25 PM PST US From: Robert Borger Subject: Re: Europa-List: Seen at Oshkosh Steve, I was at KOSH. Did not see the Warp Drive folks. Must not have wandered through the muck and mire into the right area. Yup, it looks pretty radical to me. I did stop at the Airmaster booth and talked to Martin. There was a nice looking prop with light weight, composite, blades from Sensenich. Martin said that they were working on both 2-blade and 3-blade versions. He also said that Bud was testing one of them. I'll be at Custom Flight Creations in about a week and a half. Maybe Bud will have some "poop" to share by that time. Personally, I like the idea of lighter blades. Since the present WD blades will already push the Europa to near VNE, not much advantage in going faster. BUT, lighter blades should have lower rotational inertia and be easier on the gearbox. Maybe allow one to cruise at a lower MP at the same RPM and airspeed for better fuel economy? Check six, Bob Borger http://www.europaowners.org/N914XL Europa XS, Short Wing, Intercooled Rotax 914 rlborger@mac.com Cel: 817-992-1117 On Aug 19, 2010, at 1:13 PM, Steven Pitt wrote: > Rumour had it that Warp Drive were in discussions with Airmaster to develop a new and more flexible propeller in place of the exisiting installations. > I met with the Warp Drive team at Oshkosh and they agreed to me publishing the attached photo of their 'work in progress'. Looks radical to me but no doubt others may have views on whether this is the way to go. > BTW was anyone else from the Europa fraternity at Oshkosh? > Regards > Steve Pitt > G-SMDH > Your message is ready to be sent with the following file or link attachments: > DSCN2461 > ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 03:50:23 PM PST US From: "Bud Yerly" Subject: Re: Europa-List: Airmaster Prop. Bud is up to his neck in a poop full of testing. Right now I have the AP332 and 420 in build up in the shop and will be starting side by side testing. LSA testing is in write up. I figure by Rough River I may have some data and the new 420 hanging on the front of my test mule 12AY. So far on the slower planes like the Rans S-6, the 420 is ten knots faster at the 72 inch length and the performance of the AP420 is better only on the top end vs. the AP332. It appears the AP420 will tend to have a top end more like the Whirlwind prop or a little faster. However, the prop pulses across the windscreen on the Rans are very noisy at the 72 inch lengths. You can see the windscreen move. It is quite a stump climber. Hopefully, it is not as noisy with our shorter 64 inch prop. The AP420 Prop weighs about 20 lbs. Sensenich is a light prop blade by some standards, but others are still lighter such as the Kiev, Neuform and other recent designs from the old Soviet Block. They are much lighter and flexible blades, which means a potential for harmonic problems. Martin has accumulated quite a stack of test blades and is methodically going through them. It is a work in progress as we are adding the AP430 which is a 3 blade, large ferrule bore hole for the newer hollow core blades. Warp Drive was not interested in a wider chord blade or a more refined blade for the shorter lengths. The problem is the initial inertia on start up with the solid blades. A Wider blade for them means more torque on the sprag clutch and possibly very expensive engine repairs. A hollow blade is the way to go, but the Warp Drive is still the toughest prop. Airplanes are 20,000 compromises flying in close formation and we really try not to disappoint customers so the testing continues... More to follow. Bud ----- Original Message ----- From: Robert Borger To: europa-list@matronics.com Sent: Thursday, August 19, 2010 5:01 PM Subject: Re: Europa-List: Seen at Oshkosh Steve, I was at KOSH. Did not see the Warp Drive folks. Must not have wandered through the muck and mire into the right area. Yup, it looks pretty radical to me. I did stop at the Airmaster booth and talked to Martin. There was a nice looking prop with light weight, composite, blades from Sensenich. Martin said that they were working on both 2-blade and 3-blade versions. He also said that Bud was testing one of them. I'll be at Custom Flight Creations in about a week and a half. Maybe Bud will have some "poop" to share by that time. Personally, I like the idea of lighter blades. Since the present WD blades will already push the Europa to near VNE, not much advantage in going faster. BUT, lighter blades should have lower rotational inertia and be easier on the gearbox. Maybe allow one to cruise at a lower MP at the same RPM and airspeed for better fuel economy? Check six, Bob Borger http://www.europaowners.org/N914XL Europa XS, Short Wing, Intercooled Rotax 914 rlborger@mac.com Cel: 817-992-1117 On Aug 19, 2010, at 1:13 PM, Steven Pitt wrote: Rumour had it that Warp Drive were in discussions with Airmaster to develop a new and more flexible propeller in place of the exisiting installations. I met with the Warp Drive team at Oshkosh and they agreed to me publishing the attached photo of their 'work in progress'. Looks radical to me but no doubt others may have views on whether this is the way to go. BTW was anyone else from the Europa fraternity at Oshkosh? Regards Steve Pitt G-SMDH Your message is ready to be sent with the following file or link attachments: DSCN2461 Note: To protect against computer viruses, e-mail programs may your e-mail class="Apple-converted-space"> ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 05:15:39 PM PST US From: Robert Borger Subject: Re: Europa-List: Airmaster Prop. Bud, Thanks for the update. Sounds like some interesting developments on the prop front. I'm looking forward to our trip East for lots of reasons. Check six, Bob Borger http://www.europaowners.org/N914XL Europa XS, Short Wing, Intercooled Rotax 914 rlborger@mac.com Cel: 817-992-1117 On Aug 19, 2010, at 5:17 PM, Bud Yerly wrote: > Bud is up to his neck in a poop full of testing. > Right now I have the AP332 and 420 in build up in the shop and will be starting side by side testing. LSA testing is in write up. I figure by Rough River I may have some data and the new 420 hanging on the front of my test mule 12AY. So far on the slower planes like the Rans S-6, the 420 is ten knots faster at the 72 inch length and the performance of the AP420 is better only on the top end vs. the AP332. It appears the AP420 will tend to have a top end more like the Whirlwind prop or a little faster. However, the prop pulses across the windscreen on the Rans are very noisy at the 72 inch lengths. You can see the windscreen move. It is quite a stump climber. Hopefully, it is not as noisy with our shorter 64 inch prop. > The AP420 Prop weighs about 20 lbs. Sensenich is a light prop blade by some standards, but others are still lighter such as the Kiev, Neuform and other recent designs from the old Soviet Block. They are much lighter and flexible blades, which means a potential for harmonic problems. Martin has accumulated quite a stack of test blades and is methodically going through them. > It is a work in progress as we are adding the AP430 which is a 3 blade, large ferrule bore hole for the newer hollow core blades. > > Warp Drive was not interested in a wider chord blade or a more refined blade for the shorter lengths. The problem is the initial inertia on start up with the solid blades. A Wider blade for them means more torque on the sprag clutch and possibly very expensive engine repairs. A hollow blade is the way to go, but the Warp Drive is still the toughest prop. Airplanes are 20,000 compromises flying in close formation and we really try not to disappoint customers so the testing continues... > > More to follow. > > Bud ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 06:32:55 PM PST US From: Fred Klein Subject: Europa-List: Fwd: prop When I saw Steve Pitts' post, I followed up with a quick email to a "Ron" at Hoverhawk Corp. which handles world-wide sales for Warp Drive...response below: Fred A194 Begin forwarded message: > You will have to speak with Daryl at the factory on the scimitar > shaped blades prop. > 641-357-6000. > > Thank You > Ron > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Fred Klein > To: WarpDriveProps.com > Sent: Thursday, August 19, 2010 1:46 PM > Subject: Re: prop > > Ron...just saw the following...Would these exotic new blades be > available w/ your GA hub? Any timetable on availability? > > Fred > >>> From: "Steven Pitt" >>> Date: August 19, 2010 11:13:41 AM PDT >>> To: >>> Subject: Europa-List: Seen at Oshkosh >>> >>> Rumour had it that Warp Drive were in discussions with Airmaster >>> to develop a new and more flexible propeller in place of the >>> exisiting installations. >>> I met with the Warp Drive team at Oshkosh and they agreed to me >>> publishing the attached photo of their 'work in progress'. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message europa-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Europa-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/europa-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/europa-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.