---------------------------------------------------------- Europa-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Mon 09/20/10: 23 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 01:43 AM - Re: Top fuselage- rear flange gap problem (David Joyce) 2. 05:53 AM - Link to photo's of 2nd Annual Dutch light aircraft flyin (houlihan tim) 3. 06:33 AM - Re: Rough River (h&jeuropa) 4. 07:15 AM - Rough River - my compliments to Jeff Roberts (John Wigney) 5. 07:18 AM - Re: Top fuselage- rear flange gap problem (jglazener) 6. 08:04 AM - DOTH Fenland Wed. 22nd. (Paddy Clarke) 7. 08:07 AM - Re: Rough River - my compliments to Jeff Roberts (Jeff B) 8. 09:23 AM - Swiss Conventional Taildragger Mod (flyingphil2) 9. 11:03 AM - Re: DOTH Fenland Wed. 22nd. (Trevor Pond) 10. 11:50 AM - Low voltage (david miller) 11. 12:50 PM - Re: Low voltage (Paul McAllister) 12. 12:51 PM - RR Wrap up! Wow! (JEFF ROBERTS) 13. 12:57 PM - RR Wrap up! #2 (JEFF ROBERTS) 14. 01:06 PM - RR Wrap up! #3 (JEFF ROBERTS) 15. 01:49 PM - Re: Rough River - my compliments to Jeff Roberts (jimpuglise@comcast.net) 16. 01:56 PM - RR Wrap up! #4 (JEFF ROBERTS) 17. 03:10 PM - Re: Rough River - my compliments to Jeff Roberts (Jeff B) 18. 03:12 PM - Re: Low voltage (Jeff B) 19. 03:14 PM - Re: RR Wrap up! Wow! (Jeff B) 20. 03:37 PM - Re: Low voltage (Rehn) 21. 06:12 PM - Rough River (Fred Klein) 22. 06:30 PM - Next steps - (Cleve Lee) 23. 08:48 PM - Re: Next steps - Honda Fit (Fred Klein) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 01:43:12 AM PST US From: "David Joyce" Subject: Re: Europa-List: Top fuselage- rear flange gap problem Jeroen, It's a long time ago now, but I seem to remember that I had a fair sized gap in the outer surfaces, which was eventually filled. The overlap as I remember it was fairly considerable. No doubt your inspector would know exactly how much overlap he requires for structural integrity, and as long as you have that I don't think there is any problem about filling the odd gap. Regards, David Joyce, G-XSDJ ----- Original Message ----- From: "jglazener" Sent: Sunday, September 19, 2010 8:02 PM Subject: Europa-List: Top fuselage- rear flange gap problem > > I am trying to get my top fuselage to fit to the bottom. This is a > necessity for most before bonding it on, but since I need to incorporate a > Hi-top mod, it is even more important to get it right before I start > cutting it into pieces. > > I find that even with the front flanges aligned to those in the firewall, > and the trimline on the back of the tail lined up with the end of the > fuselage, I still have a gap at the rear flanges of 9-10 mm (see > attached). If I then raise the front fuselage as per mod 64B it only gets > worse, with some 11mm at the bottom. > > Is this normal? If not, what can I do about it? > > Suggestions welcome, Jeroen > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=312941#312941 > > > Attachments: > > http://forums.matronics.com//files/19092010483_727.jpg > > > ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 05:53:37 AM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Link to photo's of 2nd Annual Dutch light aircraft flyin From: houlihan tim Photos taken at Texel of the Dutch flyin can be seen on the link below http://picasaweb.google.nl/fam.hroelofs/FotoSFlyIn2010# For the flyin web site goto www.flyin.nl regards Tim Houlihan G-BZTH ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 06:33:50 AM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Re: Rough River From: "h&jeuropa" Hi All, Wonderful weekend! Great to see everyone and admire the planes. During the tech session, when most everyone was there, we wrote down the names, and came up with these numbers: 33 people and 14 Europas (5 tri gear & 9 monos)!! Including the first one flying in the US, and the most recent 1st flight (April '10). Can't wait 'til next year! Jim & Heather Butcher N241BW Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=313026#313026 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/009_326.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/007_297.jpg ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 07:15:07 AM PST US From: John Wigney Subject: Europa-List: Rough River - my compliments to Jeff Roberts Hi Jeff, Just a note to thank you for pulling together an excellent event. The weather in Kentucky and on the trip was outstanding. Great to see the many friends from Texas, Tennessee, Florida, Wisconsin, Kentucky, North Carolina, Michigan, California, Louisiana, Washington, Vermont, Nevada - I hope I have them all. Anyway, I hope this is the start of a new trend of Europa fly-ins in the US where aircraft actually fly in. Cheers, John N262WF, mono XS, 912S ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 07:18:06 AM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Re: Top fuselage- rear flange gap problem From: "jglazener" David, Thanks for the reply. I am already feeling a bit better. As for the inspector, we don't really have them in Holland. Everything is based on the principle of self inspection. I do have someone assigned to me, but he is building a wooden plane, and just signed off on my workshop. Sounds easy, but to be honest I would much prefer the UK system, where you have someone you can actually fall back on. Luckily I have the forum.... Regards, Jeroen Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=313035#313035 ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 08:04:39 AM PST US From: Paddy Clarke Subject: Europa-List: DOTH Fenland Wed. 22nd. Hi Folks, I'm finally back in the loop, so how about a DOTH on Wednesday? There is a voucher in Pilot for Fenland, so I suggest there at 1200ish. All the best, Paddy Paddy Clarke Europa G-KIMM ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 08:07:26 AM PST US From: Jeff B Subject: Re: Europa-List: Rough River - my compliments to Jeff Roberts Mary and I had a great time, also. Weather was great, except the last 100 miles of our journey back south. Numerous thunderstorms were popping up, all around. XM weather, onboard allowed us to pick our way around them and arrive home, safe and sound, only a little late. Great to see all who showed. Looking forward to it again, next year... Steve Pitt: I have some raw video footage I'm going to send to you, of the "tech" stuff. I'll leave it to you to edit it the way you want... Now we need a volunteer, not myself, to write an article for the Europa Club mag... ;) Jeff - Baby Blue On 9/20/2010 9:06 AM, John Wigney wrote: > > Hi Jeff, > > Just a note to thank you for pulling together an excellent event. The > weather in Kentucky and on the trip was outstanding. > > Great to see the many friends from Texas, Tennessee, Florida, Wisconsin, > Kentucky, North Carolina, Michigan, California, Louisiana, Washington, > Vermont, Nevada - I hope I have them all. Anyway, I hope this is the > start of a new trend of Europa fly-ins in the US where aircraft actually > fly in. > > Cheers, John > N262WF, mono XS, 912S > > > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 09:23:28 AM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Swiss Conventional Taildragger Mod From: "flyingphil2" Hi, If anyone is considering doing this mod and haven't yet got the carbon leg then please could you contact me. Thanks, Phil Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=313059#313059 ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 11:03:55 AM PST US Subject: Re: Europa-List: DOTH Fenland Wed. 22nd. From: Trevor Pond See you there Paddy Trev G- LINN Sent from my iPhone On 20 Sep 2010, at 15:27, Paddy Clarke wrote: > > Hi Folks, > I'm finally back in the loop, so how about a DOTH on Wednesday? > There is a voucher in Pilot for Fenland, so I suggest there at 1200ish. > All the best, Paddy > Paddy Clarke > Europa G-KIMM > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 11:50:50 AM PST US From: david miller Subject: Europa-List: Low voltage Coming back to home base yesterday I noticed voltage was indicated at 11.5 rather than the usual 14. The ammeter was showing a slight discharge with the strobes on. Readings were not affected by engine RPM. I'd made a couple of stops along the way and had no trouble re-starting. I'm hoping that this is nothing more than an indication that my 6 year old Odyssey battery has suffered a partial failure. As always suggestions on probable cause from those who have been there would be appreciated. Dave C-FBZI ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 12:50:17 PM PST US Subject: Re: Europa-List: Low voltage From: Paul McAllister Hi Dave, I would start with a discharge test on your battery. Stores like Batteries Plus do this as a free service. Paul ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 12:51:33 PM PST US From: JEFF ROBERTS Subject: Europa-List: RR Wrap up! Wow! Wow! Talk about a perfect day! The 13 Europas in one setting was outstanding to see. Here are a few photos and I'll post a few more later so I don't over burden the lists server. To all that made the flight near and a lot from far. Thanks for making this a great gathering. Jeff R. N128LJ Gold Rush... She will not miss next year! ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 12:57:07 PM PST US From: JEFF ROBERTS Subject: Europa-List: RR Wrap up! #2 Here are a few more. ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 01:06:46 PM PST US From: JEFF ROBERTS Subject: Europa-List: RR Wrap up! #3 Here are a few more. We call this Cowl Pulling! The most important... 3 Europa Wives ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 01:49:30 PM PST US From: jimpuglise@comcast.net Subject: Re: Europa-List: Rough River - my compliments to Jeff Roberts Jeff- I took a bunch of pictures also.=C2- If you don't get another volunteer, I'll try to put a few paragraphs together for the Club Newspaper.=C2- Jim Puglise ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jeff B" Sent: Monday, September 20, 2010 10:32:01 AM Subject: Re: Europa-List: Rough River - my compliments to Jeff Roberts Mary and I had a great time, also. =C2-Weather was great, except the last 100 miles of our journey back south. =C2-Numerous thunderstorms were popping up, all around. =C2-XM weather, onboard allowed us to pick our wa y around them and arrive home, safe and sound, only a little late. Great to see all who showed. =C2-Looking forward to it again, next year.. . Steve Pitt: =C2-I have some raw video footage I'm going to send to you, o f the "tech" stuff. =C2-I'll leave it to you to edit it the way you want... Now we need a volunteer, not myself, to write an article for the Europa Club mag... ;) Jeff - Baby Blue On 9/20/2010 9:06 AM, John Wigney wrote: > > > Hi Jeff, > > Just a note to thank you for pulling together an excellent event. The > weather in Kentucky and on the trip was outstanding. > > Great to see the many friends from Texas, Tennessee, Florida, Wisconsin, > Kentucky, North Carolina, Michigan, California, Louisiana, Washington, > Vermont, Nevada - I hope I have them all. Anyway, I hope this is the > start of a new trend of Europa fly-ins in the US where aircraft actually > fly in. > > Cheers, John > N262WF, mono XS, 912S > > > > > > > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > =========== =========== MS - =========== e - =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2--Matt Dralle, List Admin. =========== ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 01:56:59 PM PST US From: JEFF ROBERTS Subject: Europa-List: RR Wrap up! #4 Here are a few more. Erich Trombly's classic with XS modified Cowl. Nice! The newest in the USA fleet. Troy Maynor and his nice Mono classic Hey who invited him? John Lawton's nice Jab powered tri. ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 03:10:28 PM PST US From: Jeff B Subject: Re: Europa-List: Rough River - my compliments to Jeff Roberts When you get the chance, I'd like to have a copy of the pictures. Actually, I'd be obliged to get any pictures that were taken this weekend. I know there were a ton of shutterbugs out there... ;) Thanks, Jeff - Baby Blue On 9/20/2010 3:44 PM, jimpuglise@comcast.net wrote: > > Jeff- > > I took a bunch of pictures also. If you don't get another volunteer, > I'll try to put a few paragraphs together for the Club Newspaper. > > Jim Puglise > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jeff B" > To: europa-list@matronics.com > Sent: Monday, September 20, 2010 10:32:01 AM > Subject: Re: Europa-List: Rough River - my compliments to Jeff Roberts > > > Mary and I had a great time, also. Weather was great, except the last > 100 miles of our journey back south. Numerous thunderstorms were > popping up, all around. XM weather, onboard allowed us to pick our way > around them and arrive home, safe and sound, only a little late. > > Great to see all who showed. Looking forward to it again, next year... > > Steve Pitt: I have some raw video footage I'm going to send to you, of > the "tech" stuff. I'll leave it to you to edit it the way you want... > > Now we need a volunteer, not myself, to write an article for the Europa > Club mag... ;) > > Jeff - Baby Blue > > On 9/20/2010 9:06 AM, John Wigney wrote: > > > > > Hi Jeff, > > > > Just a note to thank you for pulling together an excellent event. The > > weather in Kentucky and on the trip was outstanding. > > > > Great to see the many friends from Texas, Tennessee, Florida, Wisconsin, > > Kentucky, North Carolina, Michigan, California, Louisiana, Washington, > > Vermont, Nevada - I hope I have them all. Anyway, I hope this is the > > start of a new trend of Europa fly-ins in the US where aircraft actually > > fly in. > > > > Cheers, John > > N262WF, mono XS, 912S > > > > > > > sp; -Matt Dralle, Li-================================== > > > * > > > * > > > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 03:12:25 PM PST US From: Jeff B Subject: Re: Europa-List: Low voltage Dave, First thing I'd check is that big old 30 amp fuse, then go to the battery. If that don't get it, check the regulator... Jeff - Baby Blue On 9/20/2010 1:50 PM, david miller wrote: > > Coming back to home base yesterday I noticed voltage was indicated at > 11.5 rather than the usual 14. > The ammeter was showing a slight discharge with the strobes on. > Readings were not affected by engine RPM. > I'd made a couple of stops along the way and had no trouble re-starting. > > I'm hoping that this is nothing more than an indication that my 6 year > old Odyssey battery has suffered a partial failure. > As always suggestions on probable cause from those who have been there > would be appreciated. > > Dave C-FBZI > > > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 03:14:06 PM PST US From: Jeff B Subject: Re: Europa-List: RR Wrap up! Wow! That's what I'm talking about... Rows and rows of Europa. Next year I'd like to see that doubled... Great job of lighting a fire under everyone's butts and getting them out to the show... Jeff - Baby Blue On 9/20/2010 2:48 PM, JEFF ROBERTS wrote: > Wow! > Talk about a perfect day! The 13 Europas in one setting was outstanding > to see. Here are a few photos and I'll post a few more later so I don't > over burden the lists server. To all that made the flight near and a lot > from far. Thanks for making this a great gathering. > > Jeff R. N128LJ Gold Rush... She will not miss next year! > > > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 03:37:24 PM PST US From: Rehn Subject: Re: Europa-List: Low voltage Dave The Odyssey battery is likely what kept you going, I would suspect the regulator/rectifier. Mine went out and it sounds very similar to what you experienced. I also have the Odyssey it's like the energizer bunny! The battery would be the relative cheap fix so maybe? Jerry Sent from my iPad On Sep 20, 2010, at 11:50 AM, david miller wrote: > > Coming back to home base yesterday I noticed voltage was indicated at 11.5 rather than the usual 14. > The ammeter was showing a slight discharge with the strobes on. > Readings were not affected by engine RPM. > I'd made a couple of stops along the way and had no trouble re-starting. > > I'm hoping that this is nothing more than an indication that my 6 year old Odyssey battery has suffered a partial failure. > As always suggestions on probable cause from those who have been there would be appreciated. > > Dave C-FBZI > > > > ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 06:12:00 PM PST US From: Fred Klein Subject: Europa-List: Rough River Hey yu'all...got back on island just a few moments ago, still savoring the weekend...I heartily agree w/ all posted comments...special thanks for the efforts made by the 4 intrepids who flew their birds from the west coast (Kim Prout, Erich Trombley, Kevin Kleinfelder, and Bob Lindsay)...quite a trek, but the kind of trek the Europa is designed for. Special thanks to Jeff & Karen Roberts and Jeff & Mary Behrens for letting me bunk on the couch in their cabin... Special thanks to Jeff B. & John Wigney for some right seat time and inspiration to continue my build process as the days begin to shorten and fall sets in here in the Pacific NW. ...wonderful to commune with the brethren... Fred A194 ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 06:30:37 PM PST US From: "Cleve Lee" Subject: Europa-List: Next steps - Hi All, I've recently undergone some brain surger yfor an AVM which gave me a 3% chance of brain re-bleed if not fixed. I considered the Sport Pilot route (given that 97% odds are still pretty good) but then opted for the surgery which has been 100% effective in eliminating all problems. This reopens the option of my full flight medical (which anything over 1% problems is iffy to get.) I had used the 'opportunity' to sell my Jab 3300 which with an early S/N had potential for being problematic. Now to get to my point. What has anyone heard about the BMW R1200 which has potential for being linked to a Rotax C gear box since the trans and engine are separate, and what ever happened to the testing done with the R 1100? by Europa? Still plan to build the bird to meet LSA specs though. Anyone have any comments on the Honda Fit/Jazz engine conversion? ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 08:48:59 PM PST US From: Fred Klein Subject: Re: Europa-List: Next steps - Honda Fit On Sep 20, 2010, at 6:15 PM, Cleve Lee wrote: > Still plan to build the bird to meet LSA specs though. > > Anyone have any comments on the Honda Fit/Jazz engine conversion? Cleve, I do not consider myself to be an "engine guy", and by that I mean to say that I have no breadth nor depth of knowledge, but as you've asked for "comments", I do have some opinions. Others may have differing opinions (as well as real expertise)! I have no reason to doubt that the 1.4L Honda Fit engine is a superb engine, and Eggenfellner (I've seen some of his videos) seems to know what he's doin with the exception of his treatment of the radiator setup. IMO, it appears that Eggenfellner is putting together a generic setup with a large radiator which may be problematic for the Europa and which ignores what I believe is a fundemental requirement for 100% liquid-cooled aircraft engines, namely, properly contoured inlet and exit ducting for the radiator. Location of the radiator(s) is key to allowing for inlet air to expand (and slow down), ensure non-turbulent airflow, and radiator efficiency...location must also allow for exit ducting to accelerate as it enters the airflow around the airframe, preferably in a zone of low pressure. But if the Eggenfellner engine/ PSRU serves, perhaps the radiator set up can be altered to suit. Glenn Crowder flies his Classic w/ a beautiful cowl which incorporates an inlet (and I think ducting setup) for a single large radiator (for his Sube). Alex Bowman flies his XS mono w/ a Honda derivative, the CAM 125...back in 2004 I posted some pixs of his plane on the Europa-list, matronics-photoshare which may be a useful datapoint. The pixs show a twin radiator setup w/ excellent inlet/exit ducting. That engine is an earlier 1.6L Honda fitted w/ a belt-drive PSRU; it was built by an outfit in Canada called Firewall Forward Aero Engines which has gone out of business. The FFAE website is still up and may direct you to new owners who contacted me recently saying that they were going to resume production and use the Honda Fit engine, but as of this moment, I would not call them a "going concern". As I recall, the Eggenfellner Honda Fit setup weighs 207 pounds...which would not bode well for your intentions to have your plane comply w/ LSA limitations. With a Europa-LSA, why would you not consider the 80 hp Rotax 912? Your mileage may vary, Fred ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message europa-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Europa-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/europa-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/europa-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.