Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 02:03 AM - FW: booking forms Wickenby Wings and Wheels Air show 2011 for UK and European fliers. (Bob Harrison)
2. 02:36 AM - Re: Re: Fuel Tank Capacity (Kingsley Hurst)
3. 02:45 AM - Re: Fuel Tank Capacity (Remi Guerner)
4. 02:51 AM - French Fly-in July 3rd (David Lewendon)
5. 03:29 AM - 912 quit (Glenn Rainey)
6. 04:54 AM - DOTH Gloucestershire Thu.12th (Paddy Clarke)
7. 05:10 AM - Re: 912 quit (Karl Heindl)
8. 10:33 AM - Re: 912 quit (Terry Seaver (terrys))
9. 11:55 AM - Re: French Fly-in July 3rd (europapa)
10. 03:21 PM - Re: Re: Fuel Tank Capacity (Bud Yerly)
11. 07:32 PM - Re: 912 quit (GRAHAM SINGLETON)
12. 10:09 PM - Re: Re: Fuel Tank Capacity (Fred Klein)
13. 11:27 PM - Re: fuel pressure problem, urgent (europapa)
Message 1
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| Subject: | FW: booking forms Wickenby Wings and Wheels Air show 2011 |
for UK and European fliers.
Hi! All.
Hopefully you will put our event in your "things to do places to go" diary
and we will get a good turn out of Europa aircraft to a more Northern venue
for a change.? The air show promises to be "something else" and stringent
efforts have been made to keep the Saturday night event price tight which
will be in a conventional Marquee this year. Visit www.wickenbyairfield.com
for more details .....pilots will need to attend to Notam requirements
concerning display no fly times.
(apologies to those in receipt of duplicated copies of this message due to
including the Europa Matronics Forum address.)
Best regards
Bob Harrison G-PTAG Europa .
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Fuel Tank Capacity |
> Keep in mind, the tail dragger will hold less because of the trapped
air in the front of the tank, unless there is some shacking and tail
lifting involved.
Bud,
Just pointing out that this problem was address by Mod 34 dated 3
October 1996.
Cheers
Kingsley
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Fuel Tank Capacity |
Hi Bud,
Regarding capacitance fuel gauges, you mentioned the error caused by the dielectric
characteristics of different fuels. Does the gauge read more with 100LL Avgas
than with unleaded Mogas, with ethanol or not, or is it the opposite?
Regards
Remi
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=339294#339294
Message 4
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| Subject: | French Fly-in July 3rd |
I am a new member of the Europa club having recently bought a Europa
XS Trigear Turbo.
My local airfield in France is having their annual "Portes Ouvertes"
or open day on July the 3rd.
If any club members or other flying friends fancy coming to a grass
roots French airfield for a nice lunch then you are welcome to come to
the event at La Rogerie, Mayenne.
The airfield ident is LF5322 and can be used on this web site for
flight planning (Many UK airfields are also in their database but they
don't show on the map).
http://navigeo.org/LOG
This is our airfield:
http://web.mac.com/comancheman/iWeb/Airfield/Airfield%20pics.html
Everyone is welcome and I am happy to help with finding accommodation
or car hire if required. Camping on the airfield is alright. The RSA
homebuilders rally takes place over the same weekend 1st-3rd July at
Blois on the Loire so why not go there and call in to our event on the
way home?
The town of Mayenne is only 4 kms from the airfield. It is located on
the river Mayenne that runs through the middle of the town. There are
plenty of Hotels, shops and supermarkets etc.
If anyone needs more information then please let me have a land line
number and I will gladly call them.
Regards
David Lewendon
Message 5
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07/05/2011 we experienced an engine stop with the 912 in our monowheel - this
happened just as the throttle was being advanced at the commencement of the takeoff
sequence, so we rolled only a hundred feet or so and coasted to a halt.
After less than a minute, a first restart attempt was successful, and we taxied
back to the apron uneventfully, tail between legs, where my second action was
to put on the kettle for a cup of tea.
Perhaps relevent, I had heard a sharp 'bump' about 10 seconds earlier, as we were
turning on the threshold to line up, and thought I had hit a light or something
with the outrigger, but nothing was seen. The ambient conditions were about
21C and some showers were in the area with a convective active frontal system;
we had just completed 1 circuit to land after a reasonably expeditious departure,
but on backtracking from the first landing, had to hold for about 5-6
minutes on the main apron, then backtrack the second half of the active.
Immediately after parking first action was to pull the top (XS) cowl when we noticed
fuel boiling up the vent tubes which run into the airbox, both sides.
My take on this is fuel vaporisation due to high carb temps. Our (second owner)
europa is NOT fitted with drip trays under the carbs - now an item of concern,
nor is there any exhaust manifold insulation. The more I read the greater my
concern about in-cowl temps and comprehensive action to prevent a repeat of this
experience.
Fuel pressure indications were normal, and coolant temp was showing about 40C,
although we now suspect the Temp sender is malfunctioning. Oil and CHTs where
nominal.
Ours may be just another data point, but while we trawl this archive and worry
the problem, any comments would be most welcome. My own last engine quit, also
on the ground, was due carb ice in an O-200; but this was much more 'exciting'
coming as it did at the moment of truth .. "G-HL, rolling" - phut!
The climb-out to our east is lacking a good escape option.
Glenn Rainey
Cumbernauld, Scotland
G-OJHL
Message 6
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| Subject: | DOTH Gloucestershire Thu.12th |
Hi Folks,
I feel a DOTH is overdue, so how about Gloucestershire on Thursday 12th.?
Voucher in Flyer - 1200ish,
All the Best, Paddy
Paddy Clarke
Europa G-KIMM
Message 7
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Glenn=2C
My engine never quit=2C but I observed identical boilover on a hot day. It
was fixed by putting heat shields below the carbs. On the port side I have
a plate made of firewall material=2C attached to the top bolt of the exhaus
t. On the starboard side I now have a larger and flexible asbestos plate (f
rom ACS)=2C not attached to anything=2C but firmly wedged into place=2C and
easy to remove for inspections. There is even more heat starboard because
of the oil tank etc.
Karl
> Date: Mon=2C 9 May 2011 11:24:13 +0100
> From: nimbusaviation@YAHOO.COM
> Subject: Europa-List: 912 quit
> To: europa-list@matronics.com
>
>
>
> 07/05/2011 we experienced an engine stop with the 912 in our monowheel -
this happened just as the throttle was being advanced at the commencement
of the takeoff sequence=2C so we rolled only a hundred feet or so and coast
ed to a halt. After less than a minute=2C a first restart attempt was succe
ssful=2C and we taxied back to the apron uneventfully=2C tail between legs
=2C where my second action was to put on the kettle for a cup of tea.
>
> Perhaps relevent=2C I had heard a sharp 'bump' about 10 seconds earlier
=2C as we were turning on the threshold to line up=2C and thought I had hit
a light or something with the outrigger=2C but nothing was seen. The ambi
ent conditions were about 21=B0C and some showers were in the area with a c
onvective active frontal system=3B we had just completed 1 circuit to land
after a reasonably expeditious departure=2C but on backtracking from the fi
rst landing=2C had to hold for about 5-6 minutes on the main apron=2C then
backtrack the second half of the active.
>
> Immediately after parking first action was to pull the top (XS) cowl when
we noticed fuel boiling up the vent tubes which run into the airbox=2C bot
h sides.
>
> My take on this is fuel vaporisation due to high carb temps. Our (second
owner) europa is NOT fitted with drip trays under the carbs - now an item o
f concern=2C nor is there any exhaust manifold insulation. The more I read
the greater my concern about in-cowl temps and comprehensive action to prev
ent a repeat of this experience.
>
> Fuel pressure indications were normal=2C and coolant temp was showing abo
ut 40=B0C=2C although we now suspect the Temp sender is malfunctioning. Oil
and CHTs where nominal.
>
> Ours may be just another data point=2C but while we trawl this archive an
d worry the problem=2C any comments would be most welcome. My own last engi
ne quit=2C also on the ground=2C was due carb ice in an O-200=3B but this w
as much more 'exciting' coming as it did at the moment of truth .. "G-HL=2C
rolling" - phut!
>
> The climb-out to our east is lacking a good escape option.
>
> Glenn Rainey
> Cumbernauld=2C Scotland
> G-OJHL
>
>
>
>
===========
===========
===========
===========
>
>
>
Message 8
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Hi Glenn,
I had what might be a similar experience a few years ago with our 912S powered
XS, which I believe was caused by vapor lock. At about 9,000 feet altitude I
shut down the engine to do some glide tests, and when I restarted a few minutes
later the engine ran rough. When I turned on the boost pump, the engine quit.
I believe that the extra flow created when the boost pump went on forced a
'vapor bubble' into the carbs and killed the engine. It restarted moments later
and I made a precautionary landing to check things out. We had noticed rough
running on a few other occasions, and came to a few conclusions.
1) This seemed to happen following a start with the engine already hot.
2) It only seemed to happen in the winter when auto fuel has more volatiles in
it.
3) It was more likely (but not always) to happen at higher elevation, where the
vapor pressure is lower.
We assumed the problem was vapor lock caused by the close proximity of the exhaust
to the carbs and associated lines.
We fitted aluminized heat shield material to the bottoms of the carbs and the associated
fuel lines and have not had the problem since.
Regards,
Terry Seaver
A135 / N135TD
Monowheel XS with 912S
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Glenn Rainey
Sent: Monday, May 09, 2011 3:24 AM
Subject: Europa-List: 912 quit
07/05/2011 we experienced an engine stop with the 912 in our monowheel - this
happened just as the throttle was being advanced at the commencement of the takeoff
sequence, so we rolled only a hundred feet or so and coasted to a halt.
After less than a minute, a first restart attempt was successful, and we taxied
back to the apron uneventfully, tail between legs, where my second action was
to put on the kettle for a cup of tea.
Perhaps relevent, I had heard a sharp 'bump' about 10 seconds earlier, as we were
turning on the threshold to line up, and thought I had hit a light or something
with the outrigger, but nothing was seen. The ambient conditions were about
21C and some showers were in the area with a convective active frontal system;
we had just completed 1 circuit to land after a reasonably expeditious departure,
but on backtracking from the first landing, had to hold for about 5-6
minutes on the main apron, then backtrack the second half of the active.
Immediately after parking first action was to pull the top (XS) cowl when we noticed
fuel boiling up the vent tubes which run into the airbox, both sides.
My take on this is fuel vaporisation due to high carb temps. Our (second owner)
europa is NOT fitted with drip trays under the carbs - now an item of concern,
nor is there any exhaust manifold insulation. The more I read the greater my
concern about in-cowl temps and comprehensive action to prevent a repeat of this
experience.
Fuel pressure indications were normal, and coolant temp was showing about 40C,
although we now suspect the Temp sender is malfunctioning. Oil and CHTs where
nominal.
Ours may be just another data point, but while we trawl this archive and worry
the problem, any comments would be most welcome. My own last engine quit, also
on the ground, was due carb ice in an O-200; but this was much more 'exciting'
coming as it did at the moment of truth .. "G-HL, rolling" - phut!
The climb-out to our east is lacking a good escape option.
Glenn Rainey
Cumbernauld, Scotland
G-OJHL
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: French Fly-in July 3rd |
Hello David,
thank you for your kind invitation, I would appreciate to make some flying experiences
in France and I love this part of your country.
But Im afraid to have some other commitments this very weekend.
Maybe next year?
Juergen
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=339335#339335
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Fuel Tank Capacity |
Kingsley,
True, With Mod 34 (the extension of the vent tube to the front of the
tank) now standard, I still find the tail dragger forward tank section
has a large air bubble on normal refuel without coaxing, whereas the
trigear will tend to fill completely. It is not much gas, a half to one
gallon, but you can never have enough gas, unless you are on fire.
Bud
----- Original Message -----
From: Kingsley Hurst<mailto:kingsnjan@westnet.com.au>
To: europa-list@matronics.com<mailto:europa-list@matronics.com>
Sent: Monday, May 09, 2011 5:15 AM
Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re: Fuel Tank Capacity
> Keep in mind, the tail dragger will hold less because of the trapped
air in the front of the tank, unless there is some shacking and tail
lifting involved.
Bud,
Just pointing out that this problem was address by Mod 34 dated 3
October 1996.
Cheers
Kingsley
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List<http://www.matronics.com/N
avigator?Europa-List>
http://www.matronics.com/contribution<http://www.matronics.com/contributi
on>
Message 11
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Sounds like vaporization. Check that you have adequate bleed back, the fuel
gets =0Ahot in the fuel pump which is attached to the gearbox in hot engin
e oil. Are all =0Athe in cowl pipes firesleeved?=0Afit the carb drip trays
if you can, although if you have the water heated carbs =0A(recommended) th
at might be tricky=0AGraham=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A______________________________
__=0AFrom: Glenn Rainey <nimbusaviation@YAHOO.COM>=0ATo: europa-list@matron
ics.com=0ASent: Monday, 9 May, 2011 11:24:13=0ASubject: Europa-List: 912 qu
oo.com>=0A=0A07/05/2011 we experienced an engine stop with the 912 in our m
onowheel - this =0Ahappened just as the throttle was being advanced at the
commencement of the =0Atakeoff sequence, so we rolled only a hundred feet
or so and coasted to a halt. =0AAfter less than a minute, a first restart a
ttempt was successful, and we taxied =0Aback to the apron uneventfully, tai
l between legs, where my second action was to =0Aput on the kettle for a cu
p of tea. =0A=0A=0APerhaps relevent, I had heard a sharp 'bump' about 10 se
conds earlier, as we =0Awere turning on the threshold to line up, and thoug
ht I had hit a light or =0Asomething with the outrigger, but nothing was se
en. The ambient conditions were =0Aabout 21=B0C and some showers were in t
he area with a convective active frontal =0Asystem; we had just completed 1
circuit to land after a reasonably expeditious =0Adeparture, but on backtr
acking from the first landing, had to hold for about 5-6 =0Aminutes on the
main apron, then backtrack the second half of the active. =0A=0A=0AImmediat
ely after parking first action was to pull the top (XS) cowl when we =0Anot
iced fuel boiling up the vent tubes which run into the airbox, both sides.
=0A=0AMy take on this is fuel vaporisation due to high carb temps. Our (sec
ond owner) =0Aeuropa is NOT fitted with drip trays under the carbs - now an
item of concern, =0Anor is there any exhaust manifold insulation. The more
I read the greater my =0Aconcern about in-cowl temps and comprehensive act
ion to prevent a repeat of this =0Aexperience. =0A=0A=0AFuel pressure indic
ations were normal, and coolant temp was showing about 40=B0C, =0Aalthough
we now suspect the Temp sender is malfunctioning. Oil and CHTs where =0Anom
inal. =0A=0A=0AOurs may be just another data point, but while we trawl this
archive and worry =0Athe problem, any comments would be most welcome. My o
wn last engine quit, also =0Aon the ground, was due carb ice in an O-200; b
ut this was much more 'exciting' =0Acoming as it did at the moment of truth
.. "G-HL, rolling" - phut! =0A=0A=0AThe climb-out to our east is lacking a
good escape option.=0A=0AGlenn Rainey=0ACumbernauld, Scotland=0AG-OJHL=0A
-========================
==================
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Fuel Tank Capacity |
On May 9, 2011, at 3:08 PM, Bud Yerly wrote:
> Keep in mind, the tail dragger will hold less because of the trapped
> air in the front of the tank, unless there is some shacking and tail
> lifting involved.
"shacking" you say...hmmmmm...shacking indeed...would that be some
kind of dance, or an old F-4 fighter jock term?
Is it getting pretty hot already down your way Bud?
Fred
do not archive
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: fuel pressure problem, urgent |
Problem solved!
Yesterday I replaced all fuel hoses and had my first planed landing for weeks.
Today I cut the replaced hose all the length from the electrical pump to the mechanical
pump and found a desquamation that worked like a valve, closing when
the fuel flow was high.
Fine but some questions remain:
The restrictor int the return line was not absent as the mechanics supposed but
the ordered one from Europa Aircraft is so much tighter than the one once delivered
with the kit. The hole in the first one is about 2mm and the new one is
0,2mm!
Now with the tighter restrictor I achieve a bit more than 0,2bar fuel pressure
in the full power setting.
I never had a working fuel pressure gage till now so I do not know what the pressure
was with the original restrictor.
What kind of restrictor do you have installed and how high is your fuel pressure?
Thank you so much for your assistance so far!
Juergen
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=339400#339400
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