Europa-List Digest Archive

Sun 07/24/11


Total Messages Posted: 4



Today's Message Index:
----------------------
 
     1. 02:25 PM - Re: Tire /tyre landing incident /accident (Raimo Toivio)
     2. 02:42 PM - Re: Re: Europa Ladies!!! (Raimo Toivio)
     3. 02:55 PM - Re: Tire /tyre landing incident /accident (rparigoris)
     4. 03:07 PM - Europa - a family affair - a great tourer (Raimo Toivio)
 
 
 


Message 1


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    Time: 02:25:28 PM PST US
    From: "Raimo Toivio" <raimo.toivio@rwm.fi>
    Subject: Re: Tire /tyre landing incident /accident
    Hi Frans, thanks for your thoughts - they are more or less a careful analysis (as your mails usually always are). I will comment a bit between lines with *** : -----Alkuperinen viesti----- From: Frans Veldman Sent: Thursday, July 21, 2011 7:45 PM Subject: Re: Europa-List: Tire /tyre landing incident /accident <frans@privatepilots.nl> On 07/21/2011 04:49 PM, Raimo Toivio wrote: > I purchased and got today a tyre *pre-puncture* > liquid from Netherlands. > I have it 25 liter = about 6 gallons and I need > it only 0,25 liters. Just a few thoughts: 1) It is available in 1/4 liters bottles as well, so you could have saved quite some money. *** They have 25 liters and 1 liters botles only. They sell also 1/4 liters "pump pushes direct from the canister" but no botles. As I wrote earlier, I do not fly to save money. 25 liters of that staff will go sooner or later. Maybe some day we will put 3x0,25 liter to your trike... 2) According to the website it is only for punctures in the thread, not in the sidewalls. But if I remember correctly the sidewalls is where the monowheels usually develop the leaks. *** Correct, mostly for punctures in the thread. I have had four (4) tube punctures; two times in the sidewalls, two times in the threads. So, I counted it could prevent some puncture cases. 3) According to the website it is for slow moving vehicles only. But I wouldn't exactly describe an Europa as a slow moving vehicle. *** When taxiing my speed is around 20 knots. I feel it is quite slow. During typical flight I taxi about 2-4 km before dep and after arr using that (slow) speed via all kind of taxiways and grass and what so ever surface. During take off with "high speed" max 60 knots only let us say 200 m and during landing another 200 m with "high" speed and using most cases high quality asphalt without sharp rocks, nails and other possible shit making punctures. 10% high speed, 90% low speed taxi. So... 4) They also say that it can be washed away with water if you want to repair the tire. I'm not sure what to think about this: Does it also mean that when you fly through the rain the stuff dissolves? You might not even know that you had a leak previously but suddenly the tire empties and you are in for a surprise when you land on the wet runway. ***Come on! Those "slow moving vehicles" are moving also when raining. If the stuff dissolved when wet it would be totally unusefull! It cannot do that, not possible. When it fills the hole, it will not dissolve any more. They claim it will fill the hole diameter even 16 mm! 5) The stuff remains liquid inside the tire. During landing the wheel accelerates in a very short time when the wheel makes initial contact with the runway. The liquid stuff inside the tire has inertia and I'm not sure what the effect will be. For sure it will have a lot of friction for a short moment, and it may give a massive imbalance when it has piled up on the bottom of the tire during flight and suddenly has to rotate very fast, just like a washing machine that starts to hop when the laundry piled up on one side. You might be the inventor of the "self-bouncing monowheel". This imbalance may be the reason why it is described as "for slow moving vehicles only". *** That is something what I have wondered also. The radius of the tube is around 0,2 m. The mass of the stuff is around 0,3 kg. The max speed of the tire is about 60 knots = 31 m/s. That means the tyre is revolving about 1500 rpm = 25 r/s. But only a short moment. The stuff itself BTW is not so liquid, it is more or less like let us say micro slurry or it has a form of existence like porridge. That means it will be always more or less everywhere in the tube. "Self-bouncing monowheel": I liked that much! Let us wish that effect will compensate so common "Pilot induced bouncing effect". So, be careful here! *** I promise! You might want to add the stuff in stages and test each stage with an actual landing to see how it behaves. *** Good idea but I am too lazy to do that! Also, what is the effect of temperature on that liquid stuff? Will it become a jelly like lump inside the tire if it gets too cold? Maybe put it overnight in a freezer and see what becomes of it. ***They claimed -40C but it is a good idea to put some of it to the freezer. > Price: 550 euros /canister. As I wrote I am not > saveing when it is the > question of my or my familys (flight) safety. I fully agree but you should make sure you are not trading one risk for another. *** There are almost always double sides, blacks and whites. I have decided to do my everything to not suffer any more punctures. Maybe I will get other problems instead of that. That is my way to go anyway. If this stuff really works one would expect that it would be used already widely in the airplane industry. *** Why not: 1) it is not certified for aviation use. 2) there are many let us say "good and well known safety manners or products" but they are not in use, from one reason or other. For example BRS and airbags really works but they are not widely used so far. 3) I had C172 more than 12 years and never tyre punctures. That problem is not so common obviously. 4) money, labour 5) large planes with many tires, loosing one is maybe a minor case. *** I am almost sure the main problem is the tube brand name Deli and their low level production quality. It is so cheap that how it could be good? Frans, please comment Rob Robsons ( Sales Manager - General Aviation Goodyear Aviation Tires Phone: 330.796.1596 Cell: 330.283.8704 www.goodyearaviation.com ) idea below (that brand name is something I could trust): 1. Try a G15/6.00-6 tube with a TR-67 valve (which is a bent 90-deg valve). The 7.00-6 tire is roughly 1 1/4" taller and 3/4" wider than a 6.00-6 tire, so the tube will most likely stretch to fit. Thanks, Raimo BTW: tomorrow I will head to Utsjoki, which is practically northernmost point in Finland and about 370 km north from Polar Circle. I will fly all together +2000 km with my 10-years old daughter Tuuli. Wish us safe landings with a full tube! I have no spare tube with me, the shipment was unfortunately late. We will met Jos (you remember) in Ivalo. May I tell wishes for him from all of you? Raimo OH-XRT Finland Frans browse Un/Subscription, FAQ, http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List Forums! List Admin.


    Message 2


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    Time: 02:42:41 PM PST US
    From: "Raimo Toivio" <raimo.toivio@rwm.fi>
    Subject: Re: Europa Ladies!!!
    Great Troy, this charming Lady "Donna Belle" really likes flying and you. Talking about EMHC during flight is a valuable habit before overnighting at the beach. Attached a pix of my almost-too-much-loving wife Marke and my Mono in a very remote, lonely and alluring airfield EFRN. Cheers, Raimo Toivio Europa XS Mono OH-XRT #417 Updated flight hours: 222,0 37500 Lempaala FINLAND p +358-3-3753 777 f +358-3-3753 100 toivio@fly.to www.rwm.fi -----Alkuper=E4inen viesti----- From: Troy Maynor Sent: Saturday, July 09, 2011 2:48 AM Subject: Europa-List: Re: Europa Ladies!!! <wingnut54@charter.net> Hi Fellow Europaphiles, Here are some pix of my lovely wife Donna, (I sometimes call her "Donna Belle"). She enjoys flying with me every chance she gets. We don't hesitate to abandon things at home if the weather is good, for a $100 hamburger or an overnighter at the beach. We have talked much about the EMHC but have yet to figure out the inflight anatomical geometry of said deed. No videos for sure Raimo. Best Regards, Troy and Donna Maynor Lil' Grace Europa Monowheel Classic 120 101 hours and climbing Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=345500#345500 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/img00013_20100808_1913_169.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/img00012_20100808_1911_352.jpg browse Un/Subscription, FAQ, http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List Forums! List Admin.


    Message 3


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    Time: 02:55:41 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: Tire /tyre landing incident /accident
    From: "rparigoris" <rparigor@suffolk.lib.ny.us>
    FWIW I have been told by several IAs and A+Ps to never use an old tube if it is removed from an aircraft tire. They say it grows in size with use and pressure and reinstalling can cause folds that can "work" and turn to leaks. I owned a Cessna 170 for 19 years and never had a flat. I had tires that were 600 x 6, 700 x 6 and 800 x 6. I always changed tubes with the tires, talc the tube and filled and emptied several times to get the tube sitting nice and flat. I don't know the mfg of the tubes, I don't remember if the stems were 90 degree? Ron Parigoris Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=347600#347600


    Message 4


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    Time: 03:07:59 PM PST US
    From: "Raimo Toivio" <raimo.toivio@rwm.fi>
    Subject: Europa - a family affair - a great tourer
    Some of you may wonder has Europa anything to do with family or touring with family? Maybe these pics give clarification it really has! We have always fun together when flying our XRT. Because of massive amount of stuff for weekend with three Ladies I usually have to perform first a passenger flight and then after a cargo flight. That doubles my flights but =93 that is flying! The girls are growing anyway and this will be the last summer we can fly all four together (their weight is now 60 kgs and that is a limited maximum load in the back seat of The RT=C2=B4s case). So, I have a positive problem to solve. A 2nd Europa and a flying licence for my wife? Cheers, Raimo Toivio Europa XS Mono OH-XRT #417 Updated flight hours /landings: 222,0 /447 37500 Lempaala FINLAND p +358-3-3753 777 f +358-3-3753 100 toivio@fly.to www.rwm.fi




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