Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 03:06 AM - Re: Sealing the water and oil coolers in a Classic (zwakie)
2. 03:09 AM - Re: Re: Need an LAA mod for wing tip strobe - really (G-IANI)
3. 03:21 AM - Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle (K BURNS)
4. 04:00 AM - Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle (Justin Kennedy)
5. 07:01 AM - Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle (Raimo Toivio)
6. 07:37 AM - Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle (zwakie)
7. 07:46 AM - Re: Need an LAA mod for wing tip strobe - really (stephen vestuti)
8. 09:03 AM - Re: Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle (Raimo Toivio)
9. 09:24 AM - Re: Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle (Bill Henderson)
10. 09:27 AM - Re: Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle (Ivan Midwing)
11. 12:52 PM - Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle (Tim Ward)
12. 01:28 PM - Re: Need an LAA mod for wing tip strobe - really (Kelvin Weston)
13. 01:33 PM - Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle (Bill Sisley)
14. 02:01 PM - Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle (Kingsley Hurst)
15. 02:09 PM - Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle (zwakie)
16. 02:30 PM - Re: Bungee (Bryan Allsop)
17. 02:33 PM - Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle (Trevpond@aol.com)
18. 02:58 PM - Heavy in-flight vibration (Frank Mycroft)
19. 03:11 PM - Re: Bungee (Bob Harrison)
20. 04:14 PM - Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle (Luc Michaud)
21. 04:17 PM - Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle (GRAHAM SINGLETON)
22. 04:17 PM - Re: Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle (GRAHAM SINGLETON)
23. 06:02 PM - Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle (Robert Borger)
24. 06:21 PM - Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle (keith hickling)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Sealing the water and oil coolers in a Classic |
frans(at)privatepilots.nl wrote:
> You are aware that it is mandatory to replace all rubber hoses every five year,
regardless of condition? Have you checked when it was last done?
Yes, on both (due in 2 years).
frans(at)privatepilots.nl wrote:
> You should try to avoid creating "high spots" in the coolant lines where air
or vapour can collect.
Port coolant rad is 'cold' side, currently the hose runs from this port rad in
a distinct upward slope (20-30 degrees), then appr. horizontally over the engine,
then down behind the engine to the coolant pump.
I was thinking to keep this routing and put the heat exchanger at the lower part
of this upward sloping section of the hose (close to the coolant rad). A mounting
bracket will be required to retain distance between heat exchanger and some
underlying bits and pieces.
By doing so, from the coolant system perspective, only one thing will change: a
short section of rubber hose will be replaced with the metal bore of the heat
exchanger (and of course two added clips). Everything else remains unchanged.
frans(at)privatepilots.nl wrote:
> Keep routing as simple as possible and keep it as low as possible.
This was exactly what triggered me to pop the question, thanks for clarifying.
frans(at)privatepilots.nl wrote:
> Oil won't siphon out, unless there is the tiniest air leak somewhere in the system.
(I am trying to understand the physics at work in the section between oil tank
and sucking oil pump, hence following questions - please forgive my ignorance
[Wink] )
(let's assume no leaks anywhere) I would expect siphoning in either direction can
only be avoided if and when both of the following are true in case engine is
not running:
1. oil pump does not allow air from inside engine to creep back into this section
nor does it allow oil to flow into the engine
2. oil tank does not allow air to creep into this section either
Can anyone confirm that the oil pump indeed prevents air from creeping back into
the hose and prevent oil from flowing into the engine - is it by any chance
the hydraulic valve tappet that takes care of this?.
If I am misunderstanding this part completely, can anyone please explain what physics
are at work to close down this end of the section?
Assuming that the oil pump does indeed stop oil and air from flowing in either
direction, I would think that the 'pipe' that sucks oil from the oil tank prevents
siphoning from that end because it sits well below the oil tank's oil level
(preventing air from entering that section). Is this reasoning correct?
--------
Marcel
(Europa Classic Tri-Gear PH-MZW)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=353854#353854
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Need an LAA mod for wing tip strobe - really |
Greame, Richard
I do not know who was advising from the LAA regarding wingtip strobes but I
think the point has been missed.
Essentially the LAA is not interested in your strobes. What is of concern
are structural changes getting the wiring to the wing tip. So, as I see it,
you need the mod for that. I rewrote this (SM10713) for the LAA back in
April but I have not heard anything since. I have checked the LAA site and
it is not in the Europa list (so I assume it is sitting on Andy's desk). I
will chase it up.
Ian Rickard G-IANI XS Trigear, 300hours
Europa Club Mods Specialist
e-mail g-iani@ntlworld.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Europa
Sent: 30 September 2011 08:55
Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re: Need an LAA mod for wing tip strobe - really
Graham
We fitted whelan wing tip nav/stobes driven by an Airworld strobe unit into
XS wings on G-GIDY. Unfortunately I don't have the paperwork for the mods
but it is PFA approved. Another of our group - Hugh Carmichael has the PFA
paperwork and I'm sure would be able to quote you the relevant approval
number.
Essentaially the mod involved running nav and stobe wires through the wing
ribs with BID reinforcement of the ribs. A splash molding of the whelan unit
base glassed to the wingtip such that the unit lay flush with the wingtip
skin. BID reinforcement of the wing tip. Wiring brought out through the root
rib to 5 pin connectors.
The Airworld unit is mounted on the rear of the baggage bay bulkhead and
powered through a suitable fuse ands 3 position switch(off/stobes/nav &
stobe).
Regards
Paul
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle |
=C2-=0AMy thoughts would carb related=C2-maybe choke, maybe one choke c
able slipped causing rich mixture and plugs to foul on one pair of cylinder
s, or some litter, bag , leaf etc ingested in to air intake, or colapsed ai
r filter in to one carb intake or other ,=0A=C2-But a more simple reason
could be:-=C2-more simply we are driven mad by a banging flap of plastic
on our hanger door in 10 knot + breeze so sugest a flap of some sort, plast
ic, caught up on some part of the airframe banging in turbulent air at vair
ious prop speed/ angular=C2-settings !=0A=C2-=0AKevin.=0A=0A=0A________
________________________=0AFrom: Tim Ward <ward.t@xtra.co.nz>=0ATo: "europa
-list@matronics.com" <europa-list@matronics.com>=0ASent: Sunday, 2 October
2011, 19:40=0ASubject: Re: Europa-List: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle=0A
=0A=0ARaimo,=0A=0AThe other is carb heat left on for take off?=0A=0ACheers,
=0A=0AToby,=0A=0ATim's other son=0A=0ATim Ward =0A12 Waiwetu Street=0AFenda
lton,=0AChristchurch, =C2-8052=0ANew Zealand.=0A=0Award.t@xtra.co.nz=0A
=0APh 64 3 3515166=0AMob 0210640221=0A=0A=0AOn 3/10/2011, at 4:58 AM, "Raim
o Toivio" <raimo.toivio@rwm.fi> wrote:=0A=0A=0AAll=0A>=0A>I have got plenty
of good guesses via list and also direct.=0A>Some of you have hoped I will
not publish them with their names and do not worry I wont=C2=B4t.=0A>=0A>G
raham =93 I /we got an empty message from you =93 please retype
it =93 I am sure it will be a good info.=0A>=0A>One of you have gues
sed the problem was because a broken de-icing rubber in the prop blade. Tha
t=C2=B4s good but unfortunately my Europa is so far still missing de-icing
systems totally. They would be soon very useful in Finland.=0A>=0A>***=0A>
=0A>No one has so far found a reason for my vibra.=0A>=0A>So there are stil
l a possibility to get an Xmas packet from Finland.=0A>I quarantee the ship
ment will be worth of making a good guess.=0A>=0A>***=0A>Tips: =0A>=0A>- th
e reason was off /on or black /white =93type and very easy to repair;
it was fixed in seconds. =0A>- when finally found it was not invisible at
all. =0A>=0A>Go On!=0A>=0A>Cheers, Raimo OH-XRT=0A>=0A>=0A>=C2-=C2-=C2
- =C2-=0A>From: Raimo Toivio =0A>Sent: Saturday, October 01, 2011 10:44
PM=0A>To: europa-list@matronics.com =0A>Subject: Europa-List: Heavy In-fli
ght Vibration Riddle=0A>All=0A>=0A>I have hope-so a nice riddle for you.
=0A>=0A>Maybe all the answers are useful =93 let=C2=B4s collect them
all:=0A>=0A>***=0A>=0A>Yesterday I took off from a very remote /small /wind
y (90 degrees 12 knots and gusting MUCH) grass strip. Soon until well over
the ground at altitude +500 feet with full power and 2nd fuel pump still on
and gears up I felt suddenly let us say medium or more shake and vibration
. My immediate reaction was to go around and land immediately but abandoned
because wind was so furious and I felt I cannot do that (a succesful landi
ng). =0A>=0A>I decided to try to fly to the next possible sensible airfield
EFHV which was 10 minutes apart.=0A>=0A>Those minutes were long: I put my
prob (Airmaster CS) to manual and drived it from fine to coarse, tried all
the power settings and also a 2nd fuel filter. Finally I noticed that when
prop was in a climb mode (in my case 5400 rpm /Rotax 912S) and MAP around 2
0 inches I got quite a comfortable flying mode and I headed straight home.
My airspeed was w that selection about 110 knots but because of a strong he
adwind GS was only about 70 knots (wanted to be clearly over the ground at
3000 ft because it was well over sunset and totally dark, yesterday we got
sunset around 1600 Zulutime and time was well over 1630 when flying). =0A>
=0A>So, I pushed home one looooong hour. All the aerodynamics were well. I
was a bit worried my engine will separate or so. When trying to push more p
wr it was more vibra and when trying to pull less pwr same. I Followed a ma
in highway and decided to land there if feeling so. Cars there with lights
are almost like a lighted runway...=0A>=0A>Finally landing to the EFTP flaw
lesly.=0A>=0A>***=0A>=0A>Today we had a FHGP (Family Hangar Grill Party). I
tried to check my plane as well as I can. I found something. Very small ev
idence but something anyway. I tried to fix it and had a test run. I electe
d to go to fly =93 hey I am a test pilot who else =93 and She w
as better than ever!=0A>=0A>I managed to do 2 touches and goes when C172 di
d one with same runway.=0A>=0A>140 knots during downwind makes me always ha
ppy.=0A>=0A>***=0A>=0A>So =93 dear Ladies and Gentlemen =93 wha
t was wrong? =0A>=0A>It would be nice and very life-useful to hear your opi
nions or guesses what was wrong.=0A>=0A>***=0A>=0A>The Rules: one single gu
ess per person, please.=0A>=0A>The Prize: The Best Guess will get a Very Sp
ecial Xmas Present from Finland!=0A>=0A>***=0A>=0A>I will let you know a so
lution after a week =93 be patient.=0A>=0A>Have a nice weekend and=0A
>=0A>=0A>=0A>Cheers, Raimo Toivio=0A>=0A><Europa%20A2A-ala2OK[1].png>=0A>
=0A>Europa XS Mono OH-XRT #417=0A>Updated flight hours /landings: 258,3=0A>
=0A>37500 Lempaala=0A>FINLAND=0A>=0A>p +358-3-3753 777=0A>f +358-3-3753 100
=
Message 4
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| Subject: | Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle |
Hey,
How about a spinner bolt missing?
Justin
G-ZTED Classic Monowheel
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle |
Hanna,
are you sure you are Hanna or in fact Tim, Hanna=C2=B4s dad (who is
going to try to win desperately the shipment from Finland) ? ;)
If you really are Hanna; you may try 2nd time, because you are a
pilot=C2=B4s daughter.
Please read my first mail once again carefully: I wrote
=9CSoon until well over the ground at altitude +500 feet with full
power and 2nd fuel pump still on ... =9C
Notice also, these words below are really essential info, something
maybe to do with prop/pwr =93settings:
=9CThose minutes were long: I put my prob (Airmaster CS) to manual
and drived it from fine to coarse, tried all the power settings and also
a 2nd fuel filter. Finally I noticed that when prop was in a climb mode
(in my case 5400 rpm /Rotax 912S) and MAP around 20 inches I got quite a
comfortable flying mode and I headed straight home. =9C
***
All,
One of you is now really close, physically say 50 mm /2" inches.
Cheers, Raimo OH-XRT Finland
From: Tim Ward
Sent: Sunday, October 02, 2011 9:39 PM
Subject: Re: Europa-List: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle
Raimo,
Two thoughts.
Fuel starvation with the fuel pumps not turned on for take off?
Cheers,
Hannah
Tim daughter
Tim Ward
12 Waiwetu Street
Fendalton,
Christchurch, 8052
New Zealand.
ward.t@xtra.co.nz
Ph 64 3 3515166
Mob 0210640221
On 3/10/2011, at 4:58 AM, "Raimo Toivio" <raimo.toivio@rwm.fi> wrote:
All
I have got plenty of good guesses via list and also direct.
Some of you have hoped I will not publish them with their names and do
not worry I wont=C2=B4t.
Graham =93 I /we got an empty message from you =93 please
retype it =93 I am sure it will be a good info.
One of you have guessed the problem was because a broken de-icing
rubber in the prop blade. That=C2=B4s good but unfortunately my Europa
is so far still missing de-icing systems totally. They would be soon
very useful in Finland.
***
No one has so far found a reason for my vibra.
So there are still a possibility to get an Xmas packet from Finland.
I quarantee the shipment will be worth of making a good guess.
***
Tips:
- the reason was off /on or black /white =93type and very easy
to repair; it was fixed in seconds.
- when finally found it was not invisible at all.
Go On!
Cheers, Raimo OH-XRT
From: Raimo Toivio
Sent: Saturday, October 01, 2011 10:44 PM
To: europa-list@matronics.com
Subject: Europa-List: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle
All
I have hope-so a nice riddle for you.
Maybe all the answers are useful =93 let=C2=B4s collect them
all:
***
Yesterday I took off from a very remote /small /windy (90 degrees 12
knots and gusting MUCH) grass strip. Soon until well over the ground at
altitude +500 feet with full power and 2nd fuel pump still on and gears
up I felt suddenly let us say medium or more shake and vibration. My
immediate reaction was to go around and land immediately but abandoned
because wind was so furious and I felt I cannot do that (a succesful
landing).
I decided to try to fly to the next possible sensible airfield EFHV
which was 10 minutes apart.
Those minutes were long: I put my prob (Airmaster CS) to manual and
drived it from fine to coarse, tried all the power settings and also a
2nd fuel filter. Finally I noticed that when prop was in a climb mode
(in my case 5400 rpm /Rotax 912S) and MAP around 20 inches I got quite a
comfortable flying mode and I headed straight home. My airspeed was w
that selection about 110 knots but because of a strong headwind GS was
only about 70 knots (wanted to be clearly over the ground at 3000 ft
because it was well over sunset and totally dark, yesterday we got
sunset around 1600 Zulutime and time was well over 1630 when flying).
So, I pushed home one looooong hour. All the aerodynamics were well. I
was a bit worried my engine will separate or so. When trying to push
more pwr it was more vibra and when trying to pull less pwr same. I
Followed a main highway and decided to land there if feeling so. Cars
there with lights are almost like a lighted runway...
Finally landing to the EFTP flawlesly.
***
Today we had a FHGP (Family Hangar Grill Party). I tried to check my
plane as well as I can. I found something. Very small evidence but
something anyway. I tried to fix it and had a test run. I elected to go
to fly =93 hey I am a test pilot who else =93 and She was
better than ever!
I managed to do 2 touches and goes when C172 did one with same runway.
140 knots during downwind makes me always happy.
***
So =93 dear Ladies and Gentlemen =93 what was wrong?
It would be nice and very life-useful to hear your opinions or guesses
what was wrong.
***
The Rules: one single guess per person, please.
The Prize: The Best Guess will get a Very Special Xmas Present from
Finland!
***
I will let you know a solution after a week =93 be patient.
Have a nice weekend and
Cheers, Raimo Toivio
<Europa%20A2A-ala2OK[1].png>
Europa XS Mono OH-XRT #417
Updated flight hours /landings: 258,3
37500 Lempaala
FINLAND
p +358-3-3753 777
f +358-3-3753 100
toivio@fly.to
www.rwm.fi
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle |
Some sort of contamination found it's way into the spinner hole of one of the prop
blades, preventing full travel for just this blade's pitch?
Jet
(Marcel's wife) [Wink]
--------
Marcel
(Europa Classic Tri-Gear PH-MZW)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=353877#353877
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Need an LAA mod for wing tip strobe - really |
Well that's good timing Ian!
I have just completed a series of drawings of various Mods to submit
to the LAA and one of them was the wing conduit Mod!
Thank you for bringing that up.
I will need to check with you about the other Mods.
Steve.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=353878#353878
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle |
Jet,
you may also guess twice (because you are pilots
wife):
- notice that shaking and vibration was not
momentary! Every time I tried to change
powersettings up or down, more or less, an awful
trembling came back. Maybe I am a bit sensitive
(for trembling planes!) but that was really
alarming.
- 5400 rpm & 20 inches were in the lowest point of
that vibration curve
Cheers, Raimo OH-XRT Finland
-----Alkuperinen viesti-----
From: zwakie
Sent: Monday, October 03, 2011 5:34 PM
Subject: Europa-List: Re: Heavy In-flight
Vibration Riddle
<mz@cariama.nl>
Some sort of contamination found it's way into the
spinner hole of one of the prop blades, preventing
full travel for just this blade's pitch?
Jet
(Marcel's wife) [Wink]
--------
Marcel
(Europa Classic Tri-Gear PH-MZW)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=353877#353877
browse
Un/Subscription,
FAQ,
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List
Forums!
List Admin.
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle |
Ramio,
Sounds like a throttle cable to one carb was loose causing the spring to
hold full throttle on the carb while you could vary the other as it was
connected properly.
Bill
A010 Classic Monowheel
----- Original Message -----
From: "Raimo Toivio" <raimo.toivio@rwm.fi>
Sent: Monday, October 03, 2011 12:00 PM
Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle
>
> Jet,
>
> you may also guess twice (because you are pilots wife):
>
> - notice that shaking and vibration was not momentary! Every time I tried
> to change powersettings up or down, more or less, an awful trembling came
> back. Maybe I am a bit sensitive (for trembling planes!) but that was
> really alarming.
> - 5400 rpm & 20 inches were in the lowest point of that vibration curve
>
> Cheers, Raimo OH-XRT Finland
>
>
> -----Alkuperinen viesti-----
> From: zwakie
> Sent: Monday, October 03, 2011 5:34 PM
> To: europa-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Europa-List: Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle
>
>
> Some sort of contamination found it's way into the spinner hole of one of
> the prop blades, preventing full travel for just this blade's pitch?
>
> Jet
>
> (Marcel's wife) [Wink]
>
> --------
> Marcel
> (Europa Classic Tri-Gear PH-MZW)
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=353877#353877
>
>
> browse
> Un/Subscription,
> FAQ,
> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List
> Forums!
> List Admin.
>
>
>
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle |
Spark Plugs...?
Cheers!
-----Ursprungligt meddelande-----
From: Raimo Toivio
Sent: Monday, October 03, 2011 6:00 PM
Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle
Jet,
you may also guess twice (because you are pilots
wife):
- notice that shaking and vibration was not
momentary! Every time I tried to change
powersettings up or down, more or less, an awful
trembling came back. Maybe I am a bit sensitive
(for trembling planes!) but that was really
alarming.
- 5400 rpm & 20 inches were in the lowest point of
that vibration curve
Cheers, Raimo OH-XRT Finland
-----Alkuperinen viesti-----
From: zwakie
Sent: Monday, October 03, 2011 5:34 PM
Subject: Europa-List: Re: Heavy In-flight
Vibration Riddle
<mz@cariama.nl>
Some sort of contamination found it's way into the
spinner hole of one of the prop blades, preventing
full travel for just this blade's pitch?
Jet
(Marcel's wife) [Wink]
--------
Marcel
(Europa Classic Tri-Gear PH-MZW)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=353877#353877
browse
Un/Subscription,
FAQ,
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List
Forums!
List Admin.
__________ Information frn ESET Smart Security, version av
virussignaturdatabas 6513 (20111003) __________
Meddelandet har kontrollerats av ESET Smart Security.
http://www.esetscandinavia.com
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle |
Hi Raimo,
Yes I am Tim=99s daughter, Hannah, and my second guess is;
Was the Airmaster Auto/Man switch left on Man for the Take-off?
Cheers,
Hannah
Tim Ward,
12 Waiwetu Street,
Fendalton,
Christchurch 8052
New Zealand
Ph; 03 3515166
Mob; 0210640221
email; ward.t@xtra.co.nz
From: Raimo Toivio
Sent: Tuesday, October 04, 2011 2:58 AM
Subject: Re: Europa-List: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle
Hanna,
are you sure you are Hanna or in fact Tim, Hanna=C2=B4s dad (who is
going to try to win desperately the shipment from Finland) ? ;)
If you really are Hanna; you may try 2nd time, because you are a
pilot=C2=B4s daughter.
Please read my first mail once again carefully: I wrote
=9CSoon until well over the ground at altitude +500 feet with full
power and 2nd fuel pump still on ... =9C
Notice also, these words below are really essential info, something
maybe to do with prop/pwr =93settings:
=9CThose minutes were long: I put my prob (Airmaster CS) to manual
and drived it from fine to coarse, tried all the power settings and also
a 2nd fuel filter. Finally I noticed that when prop was in a climb mode
(in my case 5400 rpm /Rotax 912S) and MAP around 20 inches I got quite a
comfortable flying mode and I headed straight home. =9C
***
All,
One of you is now really close, physically say 50 mm /2" inches.
Cheers, Raimo OH-XRT Finland
From: Tim Ward
Sent: Sunday, October 02, 2011 9:39 PM
Subject: Re: Europa-List: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle
Raimo,
Two thoughts.
Fuel starvation with the fuel pumps not turned on for take off?
Cheers,
Hannah
Tim daughter
Tim Ward
12 Waiwetu Street
Fendalton,
Christchurch, 8052
New Zealand.
ward.t@xtra.co.nz
Ph 64 3 3515166
Mob 0210640221
On 3/10/2011, at 4:58 AM, "Raimo Toivio" <raimo.toivio@rwm.fi> wrote:
All
I have got plenty of good guesses via list and also direct.
Some of you have hoped I will not publish them with their names and do
not worry I wont=C2=B4t.
Graham =93 I /we got an empty message from you =93 please
retype it =93 I am sure it will be a good info.
One of you have guessed the problem was because a broken de-icing
rubber in the prop blade. That=C2=B4s good but unfortunately my Europa
is so far still missing de-icing systems totally. They would be soon
very useful in Finland.
***
No one has so far found a reason for my vibra.
So there are still a possibility to get an Xmas packet from Finland.
I quarantee the shipment will be worth of making a good guess.
***
Tips:
- the reason was off /on or black /white =93type and very easy
to repair; it was fixed in seconds.
- when finally found it was not invisible at all.
Go On!
Cheers, Raimo OH-XRT
From: Raimo Toivio
Sent: Saturday, October 01, 2011 10:44 PM
To: europa-list@matronics.com
Subject: Europa-List: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle
All
I have hope-so a nice riddle for you.
Maybe all the answers are useful =93 let=C2=B4s collect them
all:
***
Yesterday I took off from a very remote /small /windy (90 degrees 12
knots and gusting MUCH) grass strip. Soon until well over the ground at
altitude +500 feet with full power and 2nd fuel pump still on and gears
up I felt suddenly let us say medium or more shake and vibration. My
immediate reaction was to go around and land immediately but abandoned
because wind was so furious and I felt I cannot do that (a succesful
landing).
I decided to try to fly to the next possible sensible airfield EFHV
which was 10 minutes apart.
Those minutes were long: I put my prob (Airmaster CS) to manual and
drived it from fine to coarse, tried all the power settings and also a
2nd fuel filter. Finally I noticed that when prop was in a climb mode
(in my case 5400 rpm /Rotax 912S) and MAP around 20 inches I got quite a
comfortable flying mode and I headed straight home. My airspeed was w
that selection about 110 knots but because of a strong headwind GS was
only about 70 knots (wanted to be clearly over the ground at 3000 ft
because it was well over sunset and totally dark, yesterday we got
sunset around 1600 Zulutime and time was well over 1630 when flying).
So, I pushed home one looooong hour. All the aerodynamics were well. I
was a bit worried my engine will separate or so. When trying to push
more pwr it was more vibra and when trying to pull less pwr same. I
Followed a main highway and decided to land there if feeling so. Cars
there with lights are almost like a lighted runway...
Finally landing to the EFTP flawlesly.
***
Today we had a FHGP (Family Hangar Grill Party). I tried to check my
plane as well as I can. I found something. Very small evidence but
something anyway. I tried to fix it and had a test run. I elected to go
to fly =93 hey I am a test pilot who else =93 and She was
better than ever!
I managed to do 2 touches and goes when C172 did one with same runway.
140 knots during downwind makes me always happy.
***
So =93 dear Ladies and Gentlemen =93 what was wrong?
It would be nice and very life-useful to hear your opinions or guesses
what was wrong.
***
The Rules: one single guess per person, please.
The Prize: The Best Guess will get a Very Special Xmas Present from
Finland!
***
I will let you know a solution after a week =93 be patient.
Have a nice weekend and
Cheers, Raimo Toivio
<Europa%20A2A-ala2OK[1].png>
Europa XS Mono OH-XRT #417
Updated flight hours /landings: 258,3
37500 Lempaala
FINLAND
p +358-3-3753 777
f +358-3-3753 100
toivio@fly.to
www.rwm.fi
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List">http://www.matron
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Need an LAA mod for wing tip strobe - really |
Ian
I recently emailed Andy Draper at the LAA about strobe mods and was also told that
I would need a mod to cover the Airworld wingtip strobes.
I have fitted the conduit mod but my understanding was that a mod would be needed
to cover the reinforcement of the wing tip and installation of the driver box.
I reinforced the tip on the inside with a small oval of thin aluminium covered
with 2 ply bid. This allowed the fitting of Rivnuts to secure the strobe head.
These can be easily replaced from the outside should a thread go in the future.
The cable hole also allowed me to insert a pip pin mounted on a stand to
allow the wing to be rotated during build / painting.
Also, SM 10713 does not take into account the possibility that Mod 69 - wing tie
downs might be fitted. I took the outboard conduit through the middle of the
rib similar to the inboard conduit.
--------
Regards
Kelv Weston
Kit 497
kelv@kdweston.biz
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=353923#353923
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle |
Hi Raimo,
I suggest your spinner cracked at the rear and lost a piece of metal or
the retaining screw.
Cheers from New Zealand
ZK CHV
MONO XS. 914. Airmaster.
950hrs
Sue& Bill
On 4/10/2011 8:49 a.m., Tim Ward wrote:
> Hi Raimo,
> Yes I am Tims daughter, Hannah, and my second guess is;
> Was the Airmaster Auto/Man switch left on Man for the Take-off?
> Cheers,
> Hannah
> Tim Ward,
> 12 Waiwetu Street,
> Fendalton,
> Christchurch 8052
> New Zealand
>
> Ph; 03 3515166
> Mob; 0210640221
>
> email; ward.t@xtra.co.nz
> *From:* Raimo Toivio <mailto:raimo.toivio@rwm.fi>
> *Sent:* Tuesday, October 04, 2011 2:58 AM
> *To:* europa-list@matronics.com <mailto:europa-list@matronics.com>
> *Subject:* Re: Europa-List: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle
> Hanna,
> are you sure you are Hanna or in fact Tim, Hannas dad (who is going
> to try to win desperately the shipment from Finland) ? ;)
> If you really are Hanna; you may try 2nd time, because you are a
> pilots daughter.
> Please read my first mail once again carefully: I wrote
> *Soon until well over the ground at altitude +500 feet with full
> power and_2nd fuel pump still on ... _*
> _**_
> _Notice also, _these words below are really essential info, something
> maybe to do with prop/pwr settings:
> **
> *Those minutes were long: I put my prob (Airmaster CS) to manual and
> drived it from fine to coarse, tried all the power settings and also a
> 2nd fuel filter. Finally I noticed that when prop was in a climb mode
> (in my case 5400 rpm /Rotax 912S) and MAP around 20 inches I got quite
> a comfortable flying mode and I headed straight home. *
> ***
> All,
> One of you is now really close, physically say 50 mm /2" inches.
> Cheers, Raimo OH-XRT Finland
> **
> **
> *From:* Tim Ward <mailto:ward.t@xtra.co.nz>
> *Sent:* Sunday, October 02, 2011 9:39 PM
> *To:* europa-list@matronics.com <mailto:europa-list@matronics.com>
> *Subject:* Re: Europa-List: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle
> Raimo,
> Two thoughts.
>
> Fuel starvation with the fuel pumps not turned on for take off?
> Cheers,
> Hannah
> Tim daughter
> Tim Ward
> 12 Waiwetu Street
> Fendalton,
> Christchurch, 8052
> New Zealand.
> ward.t@xtra.co.nz <mailto:ward.t@xtra.co.nz>
> Ph 64 3 3515166
> Mob 0210640221
>
> On 3/10/2011, at 4:58 AM, "Raimo Toivio" <raimo.toivio@rwm.fi
> <mailto:raimo.toivio@rwm.fi>> wrote:
>
>> All
>> I have got plenty of good guesses via list and also direct.
>> Some of you have hoped I will not publish them with their names and
>> do not worry I wontt.
>> Graham I /we got an empty message from you please retype it I
>> am sure it will be a good info.
>> One of you have guessed the problem was because a broken de-icing
>> rubber in the prop blade. Thats good but unfortunately my Europa is
>> so far still missing de-icing systems totally. They would be soon
>> very useful in Finland.
>> ***
>> No one has so far found a reason for my vibra.
>> So there are still a possibility to get an Xmas packet from Finland.
>> I quarantee the shipment will be worth of making a good guess.
>> ***
>> Tips:
>> - the reason was off /on or black /white type and very easy to
>> repair; it was fixed in seconds.
>> - when finally found it was not invisible at all.
>> Go On!
>> Cheers, Raimo OH-XRT
>> *From:* Raimo Toivio <mailto:raimo.toivio@rwm.fi>
>> *Sent:* Saturday, October 01, 2011 10:44 PM
>> *To:* europa-list@matronics.com <mailto:europa-list@matronics.com>
>> *Subject:* Europa-List: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle
>> All
>> I have hope-so a nice riddle for you.
>> Maybe all the answers are useful lets collect them all:
>> ***
>> Yesterday I took off from /a very/ remote /small /windy (90 degrees
>> 12 knots and gusting MUCH) grass strip. Soon until well over the
>> ground at altitude +500 feet with full power and 2nd fuel pump still
>> on and gears up I felt suddenly let us say medium or more shake and
>> vibration. My immediate reaction was to go around and land
>> immediately but abandoned because wind was so furious and I felt I
>> cannot do that (a succesful landing).
>> I decided to try to fly to the next possible sensible airfield EFHV
>> which was 10 minutes apart.
>> Those minutes were long: I put my prob (Airmaster CS) to manual and
>> drived it from fine to coarse, tried all the power settings and also
>> a 2nd fuel filter. Finally I noticed that when prop was in a climb
>> mode (in my case 5400 rpm /Rotax 912S) and MAP around 20 inches I got
>> quite a comfortable flying mode and I headed straight home. My
>> airspeed was w that selection about 110 knots but because of a strong
>> headwind GS was only about 70 knots (wanted to be clearly over the
>> ground at 3000 ft because it was well over sunset and totally dark,
>> yesterday we got sunset around 1600 Zulutime and time was well over
>> 1630 when flying).
>> So, I pushed home one looooong hour. All the aerodynamics were well.
>> I was a bit worried my engine will separate or so. When trying to
>> push more pwr it was more vibra and when trying to pull less pwr
>> same. I Followed a main highway and decided to land there if feeling
>> so. Cars there with lights are almost like a lighted runway...
>> Finally landing to the EFTP flawlesly.
>> ***
>> Today we had a FHGP (Family Hangar Grill Party). I tried to check my
>> plane as well as I can. I found something. Very small evidence but
>> something anyway. I tried to fix it and had a test run. I elected to
>> go to fly hey I am a test pilot who else and She was better than
>> ever!
>> I managed to do 2 touches and goes when C172 did one with same runway.
>> 140 knots during downwind makes me always happy.
>> ***
>> So dear Ladies and Gentlemen what was wrong?
>> It would be nice and very life-useful to hear your opinions or
>> guesses what was wrong.
>> ***
>> The Rules: one single guess per person, please.
>> The Prize: The Best Guess will get a Very Special Xmas Present from
>> Finland!
>> ***
>> I will let you know a solution after a week be patient.
>> Have a nice weekend and
>>
>>
>> Cheers, Raimo Toivio
>>
>> <Europa%20A2A-ala2OK[1].png>
>>
>> Europa XS Mono OH-XRT #417
>>
>> Updated flight hours /landings: 258,3
>>
>> 37500 Lempaala
>> FINLAND
>>
>> p +358-3-3753 777
>> f +358-3-3753 100
>>
>> toivio@fly.to <mailto:toivio@fly.to>
>> www.rwm.fi <http://www.rwm.fi/>
>>
>>
> *
>
> href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List">http://www.matronhref="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
> href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
> *
> *
>
> href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List">http://www.matronhref="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
> href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
> *
> *
>
>
> *
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle |
Raimo,
I don't know if you use tapes to seal any of the flying surfaces but if
so, I suspect one might have come unstuck.
Cheers
Kingsley
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle |
Thanks Raimo for offering me a second chance (Marcel already told me you seem to
have a weak spot for women [Wink] )
My second guess: one of the carb venting tubes got detached from the plenum chamber.
Jet
--------
Marcel
(Europa Classic Tri-Gear PH-MZW)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=353931#353931
Message 16
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Thanks for that Kingsley=2C Even if I had been able to assemble the 12mm bu
ngee supplied by Europa through the available gaps It would have been a big
mistake=2C The extra tension multiplied by 14 strands would have made lowe
ring the undercarriage impossible. Replacing the bungee is not a minor task
. It involves removing the engine=2C and the panels behind the engine. I do
not want to do it again. I was able to buy 10mm from a local tarpaulin su
pplier. It went in without too much trouble=2C but I would recommend purcha
sing at least 8 meters ( or yards ) and marking the original 20 ft length o
n it. The spare length makes it much easier to pull through. Thanks again.
Bryan From: kingsnjan@westnet.com.au
Subject: Re: Europa-List: Bungee
> can anyone confirm that 10 mm is the correct
size?
Bryan=2C
The bungee cord supplied to me by Europa many years ago is
indeed 10mm.
Cheers
Kingsley
Message 17
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| Subject: | Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle |
Hi Raimo,
Sticky carbuerettor slide.
regards
Trev
G-LINN
In a message dated 03/10/2011 21:33:37 GMT Daylight Time,
bill.sue@orcon.net.nz writes:
Hi Raimo,
I suggest your spinner cracked at the rear and lost a piece of metal or
the retaining screw.
Cheers from New Zealand
ZK CHV
MONO XS. 914. Airmaster.
950hrs
Sue & Bill
On 4/10/2011 8:49 a.m., Tim Ward wrote:
Hi Raimo,
Yes I am Tim=99s daughter, Hannah, and my second guess is;
Was the Airmaster Auto/Man switch left on Man for the Take-off?
Cheers,
Hannah
Tim Ward,
12 Waiwetu Street,
Fendalton,
Christchurch 8052
New Zealand
Ph; 03 3515166
Mob; 0210640221
email; _ward.t@xtra.co.nz_ (mailto:ward.t@xtra.co.nz)
From: _Raimo Toivio_ (mailto:raimo.toivio@rwm.fi)
Sent: Tuesday, October 04, 2011 2:58 AM
Subject: Re: Europa-List: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle
Hanna,
are you sure you are Hanna or in fact Tim, Hanna=C2=B4s dad (who is going t
o
try to win desperately the shipment from Finland) ? ;)
If you really are Hanna; you may try 2nd time, because you are a pilot=C2
=B4s
daughter.
Please read my first mail once again carefully: I wrote
=9CSoon until well over the ground at altitude +500 feet with full p
ower and
2nd fuel pump still on ... =9C
Notice also, these words below are really essential info, something maybe
to do with prop/pwr =93settings:
=9CThose minutes were long: I put my prob (Airmaster CS) to manual a
nd
drived it from fine to coarse, tried all the power settings and also a 2nd
fuel
filter. Finally I noticed that when prop was in a climb mode (in my case
5400 rpm /Rotax 912S) and MAP around 20 inches I got quite a comfortable
flying mode and I headed straight home. =9C
***
All,
One of you is now really close, physically say 50 mm /2" inches.
Cheers, Raimo OH-XRT Finland
From: _Tim Ward_ (mailto:ward.t@xtra.co.nz)
Sent: Sunday, October 02, 2011 9:39 PM
Subject: Re: Europa-List: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle
Raimo,
Two thoughts.
Fuel starvation with the fuel pumps not turned on for take off?
Cheers,
Hannah
Tim daughter
Tim Ward
12 Waiwetu Street
Fendalton,
Christchurch, 8052
New Zealand.
_ward.t@xtra.co.nz_ (mailto:ward.t@xtra.co.nz)
Ph 64 3 3515166
Mob 0210640221
On 3/10/2011, at 4:58 AM, "Raimo Toivio" <_raimo.toivio@rwm.fi_
(mailto:raimo.toivio@rwm.fi) > wrote:
All
I have got plenty of good guesses via list and also direct.
Some of you have hoped I will not publish them with their names and do not
worry I wont=C2=B4t.
Graham =93 I /we got an empty message from you =93 please retyp
e it =93 I am
sure it will be a good info.
One of you have guessed the problem was because a broken de-icing rubber
in the prop blade. That=C2=B4s good but unfortunately my Europa is so far
still
missing de-icing systems totally. They would be soon very useful in Finlan
d.
***
No one has so far found a reason for my vibra.
So there are still a possibility to get an Xmas packet from Finland.
I quarantee the shipment will be worth of making a good guess.
***
Tips:
- the reason was off /on or black /white =93type and very easy to re
pair; it
was fixed in seconds.
- when finally found it was not invisible at all.
Go On!
Cheers, Raimo OH-XRT
From: _Raimo Toivio_ (mailto:raimo.toivio@rwm.fi)
Sent: Saturday, October 01, 2011 10:44 PM
Subject: Europa-List: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle
All
I have hope-so a nice riddle for you.
Maybe all the answers are useful =93 let=C2=B4s collect them all:
***
Yesterday I took off from a very remote /small /windy (90 degrees 12 knots
and gusting MUCH) grass strip. Soon until well over the ground at altitude
+500 feet with full power and 2nd fuel pump still on and gears up I felt
suddenly let us say medium or more shake and vibration. My immediate
reaction was to go around and land immediately but abandoned because wind
was so
furious and I felt I cannot do that (a succesful landing).
I decided to try to fly to the next possible sensible airfield EFHV which
was 10 minutes apart.
Those minutes were long: I put my prob (Airmaster CS) to manual and drived
it from fine to coarse, tried all the power settings and also a 2nd fuel
filter. Finally I noticed that when prop was in a climb mode (in my case
5400 rpm /Rotax 912S) and MAP around 20 inches I got quite a comfortable
flying mode and I headed straight home. My airspeed was w that selection a
bout
110 knots but because of a strong headwind GS was only about 70 knots
(wanted to be clearly over the ground at 3000 ft because it was well over
sunset
and totally dark, yesterday we got sunset around 1600 Zulutime and time wa
s
well over 1630 when flying).
So, I pushed home one looooong hour. All the aerodynamics were well. I was
a bit worried my engine will separate or so. When trying to push more pwr
it was more vibra and when trying to pull less pwr same. I Followed a main
highway and decided to land there if feeling so. Cars there with lights ar
e
almost like a lighted runway...
Finally landing to the EFTP flawlesly.
***
Today we had a FHGP (Family Hangar Grill Party). I tried to check my plane
as well as I can. I found something. Very small evidence but something
anyway. I tried to fix it and had a test run. I elected to go to fly
=93 hey I
am a test pilot who else =93 and She was better than ever!
I managed to do 2 touches and goes when C172 did one with same runway.
140 knots during downwind makes me always happy.
***
So =93 dear Ladies and Gentlemen =93 what was wrong?
It would be nice and very life-useful to hear your opinions or guesses
what was wrong.
***
The Rules: one single guess per person, please.
The Prize: The Best Guess will get a Very Special Xmas Present from
Finland!
***
I will let you know a solution after a week =93 be patient.
Have a nice weekend and
Cheers, Raimo Toivio
<Europa%20A2A-ala2OK[1].png>
Europa XS Mono OH-XRT #417
Updated flight hours /landings: 258,3
37500 Lempaala
FINLAND
p +358-3-3753 777
f +358-3-3753 100
_toivio@fly.to_ (mailto:toivio@fly.to)
_www.rwm.fi_ (http://www.rwm.fi/)
href=_"http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List"_
(http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List) >_http://www.matronhref=
_
(http://www.matronhref=/) _"http://forums.matronics.com"_ (http://forums.
matronics.com/)
>_http://forums.matronics.com_ (http://forums.matronics.com/)
href=_"http://www.matronics.com/contribution"_
(http://www.matronics.com/contribution) >_http://www.matronics.com/c_ (http
://www.matronics.com/c)
href=_"http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List"_
(http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List) >_http://www.matronhref=
_
(http://www.matronhref=/) _"http://forums.matronics.com"_ (http://forums.
matronics.com/)
>_http://forums.matronics.com_ (http://forums.matronics.com/)
href=_"http://www.matronics.com/contribution"_
(http://www.matronics.com/contribution) >_http://www.matronics.com/c_ (http
://www.matronics.com/c)
(http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List)
(http://www.matronics.com/contribution)
Message 18
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| Subject: | Heavy in-flight vibration |
I suffered heavy in-flight vibration the other day. By the time I had
checked t's and p's and voltage, and before I had time to switch on the
fuel pump everything was back to normal. So I left everything as it was
and returned to base with no further trouble. I checked engine
mountings, propellor and fuel filter and carb float chambers and found
quite severe felting of fine fibres round the filter, which I changed,
and a minute amount of dirt in the bottom on one float chamber. The
nature of the vibration felt as though the cylinders on one side of the
engine had stopped firing; it did not feel like misfiring due to,eg,
carb ice, and if it had been a blocked filter I think the engine would
have stopped, and not started again until I changed tanks. If so that
could only be a carburettor problem and I wondered if there had been a
momentary vapour lock on one side, or possibly a sticking float valve
stopping fuel flow to that side, perhaps cured by the vibration.
Neither the OAT nor the engine were hot enough to make vapour a likely
answer. I also wondered if I had picked up a child's helium balloon in
the prop which blew off after a second or two. The next day I climbed
straight up to 6,000' with no hint of trouble, so I have stopped
worrying about it.
Frank Mycroft G-BWYD
Message 19
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.......And use mountaineering crampons to push one leg of bungee up and pull
the the opposing leg down after which you will have shoulders like "Charles
Atlas"!
Regards
Bob Harrison G-PTAG.
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bryan Allsop
Sent: 03 October 2011 22:28
Subject: RE: Europa-List: Bungee
Thanks for that Kingsley,
Even if I had been able to assemble the 12mm bungee supplied by Europa
through the available gaps It would have been a big mistake, The extra
tension multiplied by 14 strands would have made lowering the undercarriage
impossible.
Replacing the bungee is not a minor task. It involves removing the engine,
and the panels behind the engine. I do not want to do it again.
I was able to buy 10mm from a local tarpaulin supplier. It went in without
too much trouble, but I would recommend purchasing at least 8 meters ( or
yards ) and marking the original 20 ft length on it. The spare length makes
it much easier to pull through.
Thanks again.
Bryan
_____
From: kingsnjan@westnet.com.au
Subject: Re: Europa-List: Bungee
> can anyone confirm that 10 mm is the correct size?
Bryan,
The bungee cord supplied to me by Europa many years ago is indeed 10mm.
Cheers
Kingsley
target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List
http://forums.matronics.com
="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
Message 20
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| Subject: | Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle |
Hello this is Fran=E7oise, Luc's wife.
Could it be something that obstructed the airflow to the airbox in an
intermittent manner ? Such as a leaf flapping ?
I assume that now, as all spouses, I do get a 2nd chance... I will use it
soon...
Regards from Montreal,
Fran=E7oise, Luc and little Iris...
On Mon, Oct 3, 2011 at 09:58, Raimo Toivio <raimo.toivio@rwm.fi> wrote:
> Hanna,
>
> are you sure you are Hanna or in fact Tim, Hanna=B4s dad (who is going to
try
> to win desperately the shipment from Finland) ? ;)
>
> If you really are Hanna; you may try 2nd time, because you are a pilot=B4
s
> daughter.
>
> Please read my first mail once again carefully: I wrote
>
> *=93Soon until well over the ground at altitude +500 feet with full power
> and 2nd fuel pump still on ... =93*
> **
> *Notice also, *these words below are really essential info, something
> maybe to do with prop/pwr 'settings:
> **
> *=93Those minutes were long: I put my prob (Airmaster CS) to manual and
> drived it from fine to coarse, tried all the power settings and also a 2n
d
> fuel filter. Finally I noticed that when prop was in a climb mode (in my
> case 5400 rpm /Rotax 912S) and MAP around 20 inches I got quite a
> comfortable flying mode and I headed straight home. =93*
>
> ***
>
> All,
>
>
> One of you is now really close, physically say 50 mm /2" inches.
>
>
> Cheers, Raimo OH-XRT Finland
> **
> **
> **
> **
>
>
> *From:* Tim Ward <ward.t@xtra.co.nz>
> *Sent:* Sunday, October 02, 2011 9:39 PM
> *To:* europa-list@matronics.com
> *Subject:* Re: Europa-List: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle
>
> Raimo,
> Two thoughts.
>
> Fuel starvation with the fuel pumps not turned on for take off?
>
> Cheers,
>
> Hannah
>
> Tim daughter
>
> Tim Ward
> 12 Waiwetu Street
> Fendalton,
> Christchurch, 8052
> New Zealand.
>
> ward.t@xtra.co.nz
>
> Ph 64 3 3515166
> Mob 0210640221
>
>
> On 3/10/2011, at 4:58 AM, "Raimo Toivio" <raimo.toivio@rwm.fi> wrote:
>
> All
>
> I have got plenty of good guesses via list and also direct.
> Some of you have hoped I will not publish them with their names and do no
t
> worry I wont=B4t.
>
> Graham ' I /we got an empty message from you ' please retype it ' I
am sure
> it will be a good info.
>
> One of you have guessed the problem was because a broken de-icing rubber
in
> the prop blade. That=B4s good but unfortunately my Europa is so far still
> missing de-icing systems totally. They would be soon very useful in Finla
nd.
>
> ***
>
> No one has so far found a reason for my vibra.
>
> So there are still a possibility to get an Xmas packet from Finland.
> I quarantee the shipment will be worth of making a good guess.
>
> ***
> Tips:
>
> - the reason was off /on or black /white 'type and very easy to repair;
it
> was fixed in seconds.
> - when finally found it was not invisible at all.
>
> Go On!
>
> Cheers, Raimo OH-XRT
>
>
> *From:* Raimo Toivio <raimo.toivio@rwm.fi>
> *Sent:* Saturday, October 01, 2011 10:44 PM
> *To:* <europa-list@matronics.com>europa-list@matronics.com
> *Subject:* Europa-List: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle
>
> All
>
> I have hope-so a nice riddle for you.
>
> Maybe all the answers are useful ' let=B4s collect them all:
>
> ***
>
> Yesterday I took off from *a very* remote /small /windy (90 degrees 12
> knots and gusting MUCH) grass strip. Soon until well over the ground at
> altitude +500 feet with full power and 2nd fuel pump still on and gears u
p I
> felt suddenly let us say medium or more shake and vibration. My immediate
> reaction was to go around and land immediately but abandoned because wind
> was so furious and I felt I cannot do that (a succesful landing).
>
> I decided to try to fly to the next possible sensible airfield EFHV which
> was 10 minutes apart.
>
> Those minutes were long: I put my prob (Airmaster CS) to manual and drive
d
> it from fine to coarse, tried all the power settings and also a 2nd fuel
> filter. Finally I noticed that when prop was in a climb mode (in my case
> 5400 rpm /Rotax 912S) and MAP around 20 inches I got quite a comfortable
> flying mode and I headed straight home. My airspeed was w that selection
> about 110 knots but because of a strong headwind GS was only about 70 kno
ts
> (wanted to be clearly over the ground at 3000 ft because it was well over
> sunset and totally dark, yesterday we got sunset around 1600 Zulutime and
> time was well over 1630 when flying).
>
> So, I pushed home one looooong hour. All the aerodynamics were well. I wa
s
> a bit worried my engine will separate or so. When trying to push more pwr
it
> was more vibra and when trying to pull less pwr same. I Followed a main
> highway and decided to land there if feeling so. Cars there with lights a
re
> almost like a lighted runway...
>
> Finally landing to the EFTP flawlesly.
>
> ***
>
> Today we had a FHGP (Family Hangar Grill Party). I tried to check my plan
e
> as well as I can. I found something. Very small evidence but something
> anyway. I tried to fix it and had a test run. I elected to go to fly '
hey I
> am a test pilot who else ' and She was better than ever!
>
> I managed to do 2 touches and goes when C172 did one with same runway.
>
> 140 knots during downwind makes me always happy.
>
> ***
>
> So ' dear Ladies and Gentlemen ' what was wrong?
>
> It would be nice and very life-useful to hear your opinions or guesses wh
at
> was wrong.
>
> ***
>
> The Rules: one single guess per person, please.
>
> The Prize: The Best Guess will get a Very Special Xmas Present from
> Finland!
>
> ***
>
> I will let you know a solution after a week ' be patient.
>
> Have a nice weekend and
>
>
> Cheers, Raimo Toivio
>
> <Europa%20A2A-ala2OK[1].png>
>
> Europa XS Mono OH-XRT #417
>
> Updated flight hours /landings: 258,3
>
> 37500 Lempaala
> FINLAND
>
> p +358-3-3753 777
> f +358-3-3753 100
>
> toivio@fly.to
> www.rwm.fi****
>
> *
>
> href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List">http://www.matron
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
> href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
*
>
> *
>
===========
===========
===========
===========
> *
>
>
Message 21
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| Subject: | Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle |
Could be Trev. One carb on fixed power and the other on variable therefore
only =0Asmooth at one power setting. Must have been a glide approach when y
ou got home =0ARaimo?=0AGraham=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A___________________________
_____=0AFrom: "Trevpond@aol.com" <Trevpond@aol.com>=0ATo: europa-list@matro
nics.com=0ASent: Monday, 3 October, 2011 22:31:05=0ASubject: Re: Europa-Lis
t: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle=0A=0AHi Raimo,=0A =0ASticky carbueretto
r slide.=0A =0Aregards=0A =0A =0A =0ATrev=0AG-LINN=0A =0AIn a message dated
03/10/2011 21:33:37 GMT Daylight Time, bill.sue@orcon.net.nz =0Awrites:
=0AHi Raimo,=0A>=0A>I suggest your spinner cracked at the rear and lost
a piece of metal or the =0A>retaining screw.=0A>=0A>Cheers from New Zeal
and=0A>ZK CHV=0A>MONO XS. 914. Airmaster.=0A>950hrs=0A>=0A>Sue & Bill=0A
>On 4/10/2011 8:49 a.m., Tim Ward wrote: =0A>Hi Raimo,=0A>>Yes I am Tim
=99s daughter, Hannah, and my second guess is;=0A>>Was the Airmaster
Auto/Man switch left on Man for the Take-off?=0A>>Cheers,=0A>>Hannah=0A>>
=0A>>Tim Ward,=0A>>12 Waiwetu Street,=0A>>Fendalton,=0A>>Christchurch
8052=0A>>New Zealand=0A>>=0A>>Ph; 03 3515166=0A>>Mob; 0210640221=0A>>
=0A>>email; ward.t@xtra.co.nz=0A>> =0A>>From: Raimo Toivio =0A>>Sent: Tuesd
ay, October 04, 2011 2:58 AM=0A>>To: europa-list@matronics.com =0A>>Subject
: Re: Europa-List: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle=0A>> Hanna,=0A>>
=0A>>are you sure you are Hanna or in fact Tim, Hanna=C2=B4s dad (who is go
ing to try =0A>>to win desperately the shipment from Finland) ? ;)=0A>
> =0A>>If you really are Hanna; you may try 2nd time, because you are a
pilot=C2=B4s =0A>>daughter.=0A>> =0A>>Please read my first mail once agai
n carefully: I wrote=0A>> =0A>>=9CSoon until well over the ground at
altitude +500 feet with full power =0A>>and2nd fuel pump still on ...
=9C=0A>> =0A>>Notice also, these words below are really essential inf
o, something maybe =0A>>to do with prop/pwr =93settings:=0A>>
=0A>>=9CThose minutes were long: I put my prob (Airmaster CS) to
manual and drived =0A>>it from fine to coarse, tried all the power setting
s and also a 2nd fuel =0A>>filter. Finally I noticed that when prop wa
s in a climb mode (in my case =0A>>5400 rpm /Rotax 912S) and MAP aroun
d 20 inches I got quite a comfortable =0A>>flying mode and I headed st
raight home. =9C=0A>> =0A>>***=0A>> =0A>>All,=0A>> =0A>> =0A>>One of
you is now really close, physically say 50 mm /2" inches.=0A>> =0A>> =0A>>
=0A>>Cheers, Raimo OH-XRT Finland =0A>> =0A>> =0A>> =0A>> =0A>> =0A>>From
: Tim Ward =0A>>Sent: Sunday, October 02, 2011 9:39 PM=0A>>To: europa-list@
matronics.com =0A>>Subject: Re: Europa-List: Heavy In-flight Vibration
Riddle=0A>> Raimo,=0A>>Two thoughts.=0A>>=0A>>Fuel starvation with the fu
el pumps not turned on for take off?=0A>> =0A>>Cheers,=0A>> =0A>>Hanna
h =0A>> =0A>>Tim daughter=0A>>Tim Ward =0A>>12 Waiwetu Street=0A>>Fendalton
,=0A>>Christchurch, 8052=0A>>New Zealand.=0A>> =0A>>ward.t@xtra.co.nz=0A>>
=0A>>Ph 64 3 3515166=0A>>Mob 0210640221=0A>> =0A>>=0A>>On 3/10/2011, at 4:
58 AM, "Raimo Toivio" <raimo.toivio@rwm.fi> wrote:=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>All=0A>>>
=0A>>>I have got plenty of good guesses via list and also direct.=0A>>>Some
of you have hoped I will not publish them with their names and do
=0A>>>not worry I wont=C2=B4t.=0A>>> =0A>>>Graham =93 I /we got an em
pty message from you =93 please retype it =93 I am =0A>>
>sure it will be a good info.=0A>>> =0A>>>One of you have guessed the probl
em was because a broken de-icing rubber =0A>>>in the prop blade. Tha
t=C2=B4s good but unfortunately my Europa is so far =0A>>>still miss
ing de-icing systems totally. They would be soon very useful in =0A>
>>Finland.=0A>>> =0A>>>***=0A>>> =0A>>>No one has so far found a reason for
my vibra.=0A>>> =0A>>>So there are still a possibility to get an Xmas pack
et from Finland.=0A>>>I quarantee the shipment will be worth of maki
ng a good guess.=0A>>> =0A>>>***=0A>>>Tips: =0A>>> =0A>>>- the reason was o
ff /on or black /white =93type and very easy to repair; =0A>>>
it was fixed in seconds. =0A>>>=0A>>>- when finally found it was not invisi
ble at all. =0A>>> =0A>>>Go On!=0A>>> =0A>>>Cheers, Raimo OH-XRT=0A>>> =0A>
>> =0A>>> =0A>>>From: Raimo Toivio =0A>>>Sent: Saturday, October 01, 20
11 10:44 PM=0A>>>To: europa-list@matronics.com =0A>>>Subject: Europa-List:
Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle=0A>>> All=0A>>> =0A>>>I have hope-
so a nice riddle for you. =0A>>> =0A>>>Maybe all the answers are useful
=93 let=C2=B4s collect them all:=0A>>> =0A>>>***=0A>>> =0A>>>Yesterday I
took off from a very remote /small /windy (90 degrees 12 =0A>>>knot
s and gusting MUCH) grass strip. Soon until well over the ground at
=0A>>>altitude +500 feet with full power and 2nd fuel pump still on
and gears =0A>>>up I felt suddenly let us say medium or more shake and
vibration. My =0A>>>immediate reaction was to go around and land immedia
tely but abandoned =0A>>>because wind was so furious and I felt I ca
nnot do that (a succesful =0A>>>landing). =0A>>>=0A>>> =0A>>>I decid
ed to try to fly to the next possible sensible airfield EFHV which
=0A>>>was 10 minutes apart.=0A>>> =0A>>>Those minutes were long: I put my p
rob (Airmaster CS) to manual and =0A>>>drived it from fine to coarse
, tried all the power settings and also a 2nd =0A>>>fuel filter. Fin
ally I noticed that when prop was in a climb mode (in my =0A>>>case
5400 rpm /Rotax 912S) and MAP around 20 inches I got quite a =0A>>>c
omfortable flying mode and I headed straight home. My airspeed was w that
=0A>>>selection about 110 knots but because of a strong headwind GS w
as only =0A>>>about 70 knots (wanted to be clearly over the ground a
t 3000 ft because it =0A>>>was well over sunset and totally dark, ye
sterday we got sunset around 1600 =0A>>>Zulutime and time was well o
ver 1630 when flying). =0A>>>=0A>>> =0A>>>So, I pushed home one looooong ho
ur. All the aerodynamics were well. I =0A>>>was a bit worried my eng
ine will separate or so. When trying to push more =0A>>>pwr it was m
ore vibra and when trying to pull less pwr same. I Followed a =0A>>>
main highway and decided to land there if feeling so. Cars there wit
h =0A>>>lights are almost like a lighted runway...=0A>>> =0A>>>Finally land
ing to the EFTP flawlesly.=0A>>> =0A>>>***=0A>>> =0A>>>Today we had a FHGP
(Family Hangar Grill Party). I tried to check my =0A>>>plane as well
as I can. I found something. Very small evidence but =0A>>>somethin
g anyway. I tried to fix it and had a test run. I elected to go to
=0A>>>fly =93 hey I am a test pilot who else =93 and She was be
tter than ever!=0A>>> =0A>>>I managed to do 2 touches and goes when C172 di
d one with same runway.=0A>>> =0A>>>140 knots during downwind makes
me always happy.=0A>>> =0A>>>***=0A>>> =0A>>>So =93 dear Ladies and G
entlemen =93 what was wrong? =0A>>> =0A>>>It would be nice and very l
ife-useful to hear your opinions or guesses =0A>>>what was wrong.=0A
>>> =0A>>>***=0A>>> =0A>>>The Rules: one single guess per person, please.
=0A>>> =0A>>>The Prize: The Best Guess will get a Very Special Xmas Present
from =0A>>>Finland!=0A>>> =0A>>>***=0A>>> =0A>>>I will let you know
a solution after a week =93 be patient.=0A>>> =0A>>>Have a nice week
end and=0A>>> =0A>>>=0A>>>=0A>>>Cheers, Raimo Toivio=0A>>>=0A>>><Eur
opa%20A2A-ala2OK[1].png>=0A>>> =0A>>>Europa XS Mono OH-XRT #417=0A>>
>Updated flight hours /landings: 258,3=0A>>>=0A>>>37500 Lempa
ala=0A>>>FINLAND=0A>>>=0A>>>p +358-3-3753 777=0A>>>f +358-3-3753 100=0A>>>
=0A>>>toivio@fly.to=0A>>>www.rwm.fi=0A>>>=0A> =0A>href="http://www.matro
nics.com/Navigator?Europa-List">http://www.matronhref="http://forums.matr
onics.com">http://forums.matronics.com=0A> href="http://www.matronics.com
/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c =0A>=0A>> =0A>>href="http://ww
w.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List">http://www.matronhref="http://foru
ms.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com=0A>> href="http://www.matro
nics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c =0A>>=0A =0Aef="htt
p://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navig
ator?Europa-List=0A s.matronics.com/">http://forums.matronics.com =0Ap://ww
w.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contribution =0A
============== =0A
Message 22
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| Subject: | Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle |
that's what I guessed too=0AGraham=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A_______________________
_________=0AFrom: zwakie <mz@cariama.nl>=0ATo: europa-list@matronics.com=0A
Sent: Monday, 3 October, 2011 22:07:19=0ASubject: Europa-List: Re: Heavy In
mz@cariama.nl>=0A=0AThanks Raimo for offering me a second chance (Marcel al
ready told me you seem to =0Ahave a weak spot for women [Wink] )=0A=0AMy s
econd guess: one of the carb venting tubes got detached from the plenum =0A
chamber.=0A=0AJet=0A=0A--------=0AMarcel=0A(Europa Classic Tri-Gear PH-MZW)
=0A=0A=0A=0A=0ARead this topic online here:=0A=0Ahttp://forums.matronics.co
========
Message 23
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| Subject: | Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle |
Raimo,
I think that Graham is very close. I was thinking that on advancing the
throttle only one carb was advancing, that's why it ran better at low
throttle setting and with a light load (high rpm setting on prop). One
cable kinked in the throttle box so only one carb advanced.
Blue skies & tail winds,
Bob Borger
On Oct 1, 2011, at 2:44 PM, Raimo Toivio wrote:
> All
>
> I have hope-so a nice riddle for you.
>
> Maybe all the answers are useful ' let=B4s collect them all:
>
> ***
>
> Yesterday I took off from a very remote /small /windy (90 degrees 12
knots and gusting MUCH) grass strip. Soon until well over the ground at
altitude +500 feet with full power and 2nd fuel pump still on and gears
up I felt suddenly let us say medium or more shake and vibration. My
immediate reaction was to go around and land immediately but abandoned
because wind was so furious and I felt I cannot do that (a succesful
landing).
>
> I decided to try to fly to the next possible sensible airfield EFHV
which was 10 minutes apart.
>
> Those minutes were long: I put my prob (Airmaster CS) to manual and
drived it from fine to coarse, tried all the power settings and also a
2nd fuel filter. Finally I noticed that when prop was in a climb mode
(in my case 5400 rpm /Rotax 912S) and MAP around 20 inches I got quite a
comfortable flying mode and I headed straight home. My airspeed was w
that selection about 110 knots but because of a strong headwind GS was
only about 70 knots (wanted to be clearly over the ground at 3000 ft
because it was well over sunset and totally dark, yesterday we got
sunset around 1600 Zulutime and time was well over 1630 when flying).
>
> So, I pushed home one looooong hour. All the aerodynamics were well. I
was a bit worried my engine will separate or so. When trying to push
more pwr it was more vibra and when trying to pull less pwr same. I
Followed a main highway and decided to land there if feeling so. Cars
there with lights are almost like a lighted runway...
>
> Finally landing to the EFTP flawlesly.
>
> ***
>
> Today we had a FHGP (Family Hangar Grill Party). I tried to check my
plane as well as I can. I found something. Very small evidence but
something anyway. I tried to fix it and had a test run. I elected to go
to fly ' hey I am a test pilot who else ' and She was better than
ever!
>
> I managed to do 2 touches and goes when C172 did one with same runway.
>
> 140 knots during downwind makes me always happy.
>
> ***
>
> So ' dear Ladies and Gentlemen ' what was wrong?
>
> It would be nice and very life-useful to hear your opinions or guesses
what was wrong.
>
> ***
>
> The Rules: one single guess per person, please.
>
> The Prize: The Best Guess will get a Very Special Xmas Present from
Finland!
>
> ***
>
> I will let you know a solution after a week ' be patient.
>
> Have a nice weekend and
>
>
>
> Cheers, Raimo Toivio
>
> <Europa%20A2A-ala2OK[1].png>
> Europa XS Mono OH-XRT #417
>
> Updated flight hours /landings: 258,3
>
> 37500 Lempaala
> FINLAND
>
> p +358-3-3753 777
> f +358-3-3753 100
>
> toivio@fly.to
> www.rwm.fi
>
>
>
<Europa_2011_vibration_grill_party.jpg><Europa_2011_just_before_test_fligh
t.jpg><Europa_2011_just_before_shakeing.jpg><Europa_2011_going_fast.jpg>
Message 24
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|
| Subject: | Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle |
Or one of the springs that open the throttles come off - it only took 2
seconds to fix remember, and was quite visible. I think the springs come
off quite easily.
Keith Hickling,
New Zealand.
"I was thinking that on advancing the throttle only one carb was
advancing, that's why it ran better at low throttle setting and with a
light load (high rpm setting on prop). One cable kinked in the throttle
box so only one carb advanced. "
Blue skies & tail winds,
Bob Borger
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