---------------------------------------------------------- Europa-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Mon 02/20/12: 13 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 12:35 AM - Re: Removing magnetic plug from Rotax 912 gearbox (tennant) 2. 01:24 AM - Re: Removing magnetic plug from Rotax 912 and 914 gearbox's (Bob Harrison) 3. 07:36 AM - Lack of space between exhaust and coolant hose. (kees de bussy) 4. 08:57 AM - Re: Removing magnetic plug from Rotax 912 and 914 gearbox's (Frans Veldman) 5. 11:29 AM - Re: Removing magnetic plug from Rotax 912 gearbox (Remi Guerner) 6. 01:08 PM - fuel hose (Frans Veldman) 7. 03:59 PM - Re: Lightning Strike K21 and Puma (K BURNS) 8. 04:20 PM - Re: Re : Lightning Strike (K BURNS) 9. 06:55 PM - Smooth Prime (Fred Klein) 10. 07:41 PM - Re: Smooth Prime (Robert Borger) 11. 08:07 PM - Re: EuropaOwners Move (Robert Borger) 12. 09:16 PM - Re: Removing magnetic plug from Rotax 912 gearbox (Richard Lamprey) 13. 10:24 PM - Re: Smooth Prime (William McClellan) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 12:35:28 AM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Re: Removing magnetic plug from Rotax 912 gearbox From: "tennant" And there was me thinking that I was the only dumbo to round off my plug. I think they made the first batch from chewing gum they are so soft! Barry -------- Barry Tennant D-EHBT At EDLM - Germany Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=366683#366683 ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 01:24:12 AM PST US From: Bob Harrison Subject: RE: Europa-List: Removing magnetic plug from Rotax 912 and 914 gearbox's Hi! All .....and Robert B Rotax do a hexagon drive modified magnetic plug to replace your wrecked Torx original. Yet another example of "if it ain't broke don't fix it by Rotax after your pocket money again ! Regards Bob Harrison G-PTAG Kit 337 . -----Original Message----- From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert Borger Sent: 20 February 2012 02:06 Subject: Re: Europa-List: Removing magnetic plug from Rotax 912 gearbox Fellow Europaphiles, Yes, heat gun, impact device or impact wrench and proper drive. I used a heat gun, #40 Torx and impact device (all from Sears) to remove the magnetic plug from my engine the first time. The impact device was a strange black thing with a square 3/8" drive on one end and the other end was round to hammer upon. Heated the block around the plug with the heat gun, put the Torx drive on the impact device, made sure it was properly and firmly seated in the plug and then whacked it a good one with a 2 lb hammer. The impact simultaneously applied both an inward force and a loosening torque force. Took several good whacks (take care not to crack the block) to get it loose enough to remove with a ratchet. I have since acquired a nice little Makita cordless impact wrench that I would use for the plug removal should it be necessary. Hopefully, by using anti-sieze and proper torque upon last reinstallation, it will not be necessary later this week when I begin the annual condition ! inspection. If you have buggered up the hole in the plug such that your Torx or hex wrench will no longer work, Sears has a set of removal tools with a strong left-hand bite that do not require one to drill out the hole. They could possibly be used to remove the plug. I have used them to remove other messed up screws that I though would be impossible to get out. I can provide pictures of these tools should you want to see what they actually look like before you go searching for them. Blue skies & tailwinds, Bob Borger Europa XS Tri, Rotax 914, Airmaster C/S Prop. Little Toot Sport Biplane, Lycoming Thunderbolt AEIO-320 EXP 3705 Lynchburg Dr. Corinth, TX 76208-5331 Cel: 817-992-1117 rlborger@mac.com On Feb 19, 2012, at 5:21 PM, Kingsley Hurst wrote: > > Gentlemen, > > When removing the magnetic plug, in addition to the heating, cooling and impacting methods, it is important to use the correct tool. > > Early engines had a 6 mm Allen fitting. Later engines have a #40 Torx fitting requiring a #40 Torx socket. The latest engines of course now have the Hex headed plug. > > Look carefully because the Torx fitting looks very much like an Allen key one at first sight. > > Also, don't use a cheap Torx socket, a Snap-on one may prove to be cheap in the long run! > > Cheers > Kingsley from Oz - Enjoying my first real cross country trip in a 914 Mono. 800nm from home at the moment but still in the same State! Truly is a great cross country aircraft. ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 07:36:10 AM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Lack of space between exhaust and coolant hose. From: "kees de bussy" Hi all, This is about a Europa XS with the 912S and the oval exhaust silencer. 2 years ago I had a burned coolant hose (to cylinder 2) because the hose runs too close over the exhaust. This was a very scaring experience because it happened just after take-off at low altitude. So the replacement was well protected with heat shielding. But doing so makes the o.d. larger and therefor the heatshielded hose is actually quite heavily pressing on the silencer. Now I like to solve this properly and I plan to cut the 2 rear downstacks to allongate them by 1-2 cm. But before doing so I would like to know if others recognizes this lack of space too. I hardly can imagine that my Europa is the only one with this problem, but I could not find a topic about it in this forum. So any suggestions how others have solved it, or reasons why not to cut the rear stacks are most welcome. Kees de Bussy Europa XS TG PH-SBR Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=366709#366709 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/waterslangen_portside_125.jpg ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 08:57:40 AM PST US From: Frans Veldman Subject: Re: Europa-List: Removing magnetic plug from Rotax 912 and 914 gearbox's Hi everyone, I just started the annual check. I noticed that the hose that connects the two tank outlets with the outleg sockets has deteriorated. Has anyone found a better material for this purpose than just rubber hose? What about the oil grade silicone hoses? Would that stand ethanol blended fuel? Can anyone confirm that the hose required has an inner diameter of 25mm (1 inch)? Thanks, Frans ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 11:29:08 AM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Re: Removing magnetic plug from Rotax 912 gearbox From: "Remi Guerner" After I wrecked the torks hole, I cut two flats using a hand saw blade. Then I was able to use a regular wrench to remove the magnetic plug. I bought a good quality torks wrench for use with the new plug and never had the problem ever since. Regards Remi Guerner Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=366728#366728 ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 01:08:03 PM PST US From: Frans Veldman Subject: Europa-List: fuel hose Oops, I forgot to change the subject when I posted the message below. Please disregard it in the other thread. > Hi everyone, > > I just started the annual check. I noticed that the hose that connects > the two tank outlets with the outleg sockets has deteriorated. > Has anyone found a better material for this purpose than just rubber hose? > > What about the oil grade silicone hoses? Would that stand ethanol > blended fuel? > > Can anyone confirm that the hose required has an inner diameter of 25mm > (1 inch)? > > Thanks, > Frans ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 03:59:54 PM PST US From: K BURNS Subject: Re: Europa-List: Lightning Strike K21 and Puma I agree with Frans, avoid Cu nims, one response on this subject suggested 2 0 miles,- I would suggest observing (preferably from the ground) how far away the effect of a large cu nim- can be felt , ie downdrafts, swirling winds, gusts etc and preferably fly another day!=0A-=0AAs a glider pilot for 37 years I have been fortunate to not encountered lightning, with high performance "glass ships" suddenly becoming bricks (when laminar flow wings get wet) common sense results in heading for a safe landing if rain / or a ssociated storm clouds approach.=0A-=0AWhen early gliding records were at tempted, flights inside cu,nims were used to gain height, and one particula r Skylark 3 (wooden built Slingsby glider)-that soared from southern Engl and to- Scotland, was struck by lightning that later examination found da mage to wood that had its moisture vaporised damaging structures-and also -fusing of various metal parts.=0A-=0ACross bonding of- control junct ures in sailplanes has been in practise since back-then (1958 ish) .=0AMy aircraft have cross bonding ( that I am sure would not protect from much o ther than a very-low energy- lightning strike, if at all).=0A-=0AOne of the suggestions considered in the AAIB report on the K21 glider break up , was to have non conductive materials at the extreme control connections ( ailerons specifically studied in this report),my thoughts are that such- a massive- energy discharge would find an alternative path.=0A-=0AAnoth er AAIB-statistic is 1 strike per 100,000 flight hours ( is that more cha nce than winning the lottery)?=0A-=0AI will still choose to fly (when the weather is suitable) including winch launching-gliders, with up to 3000 feet of steel cable from an earthed drum-attached to a chunk of metal wit hin a foot of my gonads,(ottfur tow hook)-but with a parachute and good w eather information and observation.=0A-=0AI would-enquire with the-bo ffin types out there with an understanding of electrical static discharges creates a compact personal device to warn us of this possible threat.=0A- =0AAfter the K 21 incident the AAIB called for and received information on the electrical activity / energy levels so some one-out there already-h as an interest in producing- a related product.=0A-=0ALink to the AAIB K21 incident ( and mention of Puma helicopter Carbon fibre rotor strike). =0Ahttp://www.aaib.gov.uk/cms_resources.cfm?file=/dft_avsafety_pdf_500699 .pdf=0A-=0AMy aircraft have cross bonding ( that I am sure would not prot ect from much other than a low level lightning strike).=0A-=0A-=0AFair weather !=0A-=0AKevin Burns=0A-=0A-=0A-=0A =0A=0A__________________ ______________=0A From: Frans Veldman =0ATo: europa -list@matronics.com =0ASent: Tuesday, 14 February 2012, 10:37=0ASubject: Re rans Veldman =0A=0AOn 02/13/2012 11:17 AM, Martin O lliver wrote:=0A=0A> Hi All. Has anyone experienced a lightning strike in a Europa? If not=0A> what is the perceived result of such a strike?=0A=0AThe result is impossible to predict. Lightning stikes comes in all sizes=0Aand shapes. You can get a little protection against very light strikes=0A(for of course a weight penalty), but since you don't know what is going=0Ato st rike you there is just one effective measure: stay away from=0Aanything tha t looks like a TS.=0A=0AIf you embed copper mesh in your wings it will make your wings much=0Aheavier, and of course if the strike is heavy enough the mesh will melt=0Aanyway and take the wing with it. Any strike generates he at, and as we=0Aall know our Europa's can not tolerate much heat, not much what we can=0Ado about it except for using aluminium instead of glass fiber .=0A=0AAs much as the size and direction of lightning strikes vary, so do t he=0Aresults. The best in terms of survivability are vertical strikes. They =0Adon't search for your airplane, you just have to fly through a strike in =0Aprogress. Alas, they are the least occuring stikes in airplanes. Much=0A more occuring are spanwise and lenghtwise strikes. Your airplane offers=0Aa n electric charge a comfortable path to find its opponent. Also, your=0Aexh aust fumes leave a trail of extra conductive air, due to the carbon=0Aand e xtra moisture in it. Any charge following that trail will find your=0Aairpl ane. Spanwise strikes bring the risk of welding the aileron=0Acontrols, and of course the heat expands the air in the wings and the=0Awings may just b low apart. Lenghtwise strikes will likely travel via the=0Arudder cables. A part from taking the ruddder out when the tiny cables=0Amelt, they might me lt through the fuel tank which is just an inch away.=0AHeat and fuel don't go along very well. And of course the rudder cables=0Aend at the rudder ped als, so I hope you don't have wet feet when it happens.=0AThe avionics and electric systems are the least of your concerns, but=0Aanything might fail, if not everything. It is likely you can't talk to=0Aanyone anymore, have n o navigation anymore, and have to land your=0Acrippled airplane trimmed for cruise speed and possibly without rudder=0Aor aileron control without assi stance. If you survived the initial=0Astrike at all of course.=0A=0AI remem ber the story of someone who got hit by lightning. They found his=0Aairplan e with all the controls welded. Some research revealed that the=0Apoor pilo t had flown for at least 10 minutes after all the controls=0Awhere welded i nmovable before he crashed...=0A=0ASo, I will avoid thunderstorms at all co sts.=0AIn my airplane I installed a stormscope. If it indicates anything=0A threatening closer than 100nm, I will just land and fly another day.=0A=0AF ================== ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 04:20:55 PM PST US From: K BURNS Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re : Lightning Strike Meet the guys that had to bail out of the K 21 Glider :-=0A-=0Ahttp://www .youtube.com/watch?v=HeLl_Clxf1g=0A =0A=0A_______________________________ _=0A From: John Wigney =0ATo: martflynut@aol.com ; Europa-List =0ASent: Tuesday, 14 February 201 2, 15:52=0ASubject: Europa-List: Re : Lightning Strike=0A =0A=0AHi Martin, =0A=0AYou may have heard this before but for small planes, the conventional wisdom in the US is to stay a minimum of 20 miles from a thunderstorm. Thi s might seem a long way but I am pretty sure it was developed at the school of hard knocks.=0A=0AIn poor weather afew years ago in Arkansas, I inadver tently strayed much closer and was startled with a large lightning bolt muc h too close for comfort. Once is enough; I try not to repeat that. =0A=0ACh eers, John=0AN262WF, mono XS, 912S=0AMooresville, North Carolina=0A=0A=0A =0A=0A________________________________=0A =0ASubject: Europa-List: Lightnin g Strike=0AFrom: "Martin Olliver" Hi All. Has anyone e xperienced a lightning strike in a Europa? If not what is the=0Aperceived r esult of such a strike? A few years ago in the south of England=0Aa plastic glider was struck and broke up in flight both occupants survived as=0Apara chutes were deployed. A luxury I am unable to have due to size issues (not =0Asaying I am fat just well built!) My concern with the Europa is the lack of bonding=0Abetween components and conductors to ensure components don't explode apart,=0Aas happened with the glider. If as I suspect we all take a risk with this issue has any one considered any=0Apossible remedial action == ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 06:55:48 PM PST US From: Fred Klein Subject: Europa-List: Smooth Prime To those of you who have used Smooth Prime on their Europa XS... Have you used it JUST on the filled/foam control surfaces?...or on the ENTIRE airframe? In either case, how much material is necessary for the required THREE (undiluted) COATS before sanding? Thanks in advance, Fred - ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 07:41:26 PM PST US Subject: Re: Europa-List: Smooth Prime From: Robert Borger Fred, I used it. It goes on the entire airframe after a very light scuff sanding to perfect the initial bond to the surface. It helps the final surface coat to adhere, especially if you are using other Poly-Fiber products. I don't remember how many gallons were required for the first three coats. That first coat that goes on by roller goes on pretty thick. And after the sanding, you'll be applying more in any case. And sanding more and applying more And when you finally get it super slick and you are totally sick of sanding, you paint or have it painted. Blue skies & tailwinds, Bob Borger Europa XS Tri, Rotax 914, Airmaster C/S Prop. Little Toot Sport Biplane, Lycoming Thunderbolt AEIO-320 EXP 3705 Lynchburg Dr. Corinth, TX 76208-5331 Cel: 817-992-1117 rlborger@mac.com On Feb 20, 2012, at 8:54 PM, Fred Klein wrote: > > To those of you who have used Smooth Prime on their Europa XS... > > Have you used it JUST on the filled/foam control surfaces?...or on the ENTIRE airframe? > > In either case, how much material is necessary for the required THREE (undiluted) COATS before sanding? > > Thanks in advance, > > Fred ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 08:07:47 PM PST US Subject: Re: Europa-List: EuropaOwners Move From: Robert Borger Steve and Jos, A huge thanks for your work and service to the group. I'll echo Steve's special thanks to Jos, Best wishes to Jos and his family and long, healthy retirement. I went in and added a new picture to my album. Worked great. Now I have to gather up pictures of subsequent work and get them posted and up to date. Blue skies & tailwinds, Bob Borger Europa XS Tri, Rotax 914, Airmaster C/S Prop. Little Toot Sport Biplane, Lycoming Thunderbolt AEIO-320 EXP 3705 Lynchburg Dr. Corinth, TX 76208-5331 Cel: 817-992-1117 rlborger@mac.com On Feb 19, 2012, at 7:44 AM, SteveD wrote: > > Hello Folks, > EuropaOwners.org has completed it's move. First and foremost I would like to thank Jos for his support of the site for so many years. While we were on his servers we had unlimited space, unlimited use of available memory, and he would install any software that made the site process images faster. He also provided this service to the Europa community for free! If you ever tried pricing that kind of product on the internet, you would find it rapidly becomes very, very expensive. > > So, Jos, Thank you. Best of health and good luck in your retirement. > > Changes to the site: > I've removed the forum. > I've removed the parts database. > I'm running the gallery in it's native mode and will make it "look pretty" when I get it running 100% > We are having some trouble processing Thumbnails and Scaling images and that is being worked on. > > I'd like to thank Ron P and Steve V and the others who are helping with troubleshooting and identifying problems from the move. > > All files from the old sites are available and nothing has been deleted. If you had something stored in the forums or parts database, let me know and I'll make it accessible. > > Chat Later, > SteveD > EuropaOwners ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 09:16:08 PM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Re: Removing magnetic plug from Rotax 912 gearbox From: "Richard Lamprey" Many thanks to all for your comments. Lots of ideas, I'll try with the least brutal and work upwards. All best Richard Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=366803#366803 ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 10:24:03 PM PST US From: William McClellan Subject: Re: Europa-List: Smooth Prime Fred, Probably the best answer is, "it depends". Any of your pre-molded parts that have the green/tan factory gelcoat also has some amount of mold release that has to be sanded off so it is safe to say you should sand the whole plane surface and apply your primer. It might be a little picky but the gelcoat provides not structural benefit but does add weight. It goes without saying, you can sand the gelcoat but not any of the thin layer of glass layup. What ever filler you used first, maybe Superfil, is the rough fill, likely with many pin holes. SmoothPrime is the finer fill. Any raw sanded fiberglass/resin area will have even more pin holes. SmoothPrime, one of its key purposes, is to eliminate the pin holes. Make sure the surface to be finish painted is clean. Sanding of the SmoothPrime leaves a clean paint-able surface but likely some parts have been around some time since sanding and handled a good amount and therefor could have contamination that needs to be removed. Sanding removes the contamination very well. I found that if you rub/clean off the sanded SmoothPrime with acetone or lacquer thinner just before painting, there is some residue that soaks into the SmoothPrime and affects how the paint goes on and leaves the pattern showing the wipe marks through the paint. You also want to make sure you have eliminated the sub-gelcoat bubble voids that are inevitably in the fiberglass layups which will likely give way later and ruin your paint job. Anyway, depending on how "perfect" you want your final paint job, how many time you reapply SmoothPrime and re-sand, you could use three gallons and probably more in getting it just right. A caution for you because you are in a coastal climate. Smooth prime will retain moisture so make sure it is completely dry before you finish paint, you don't want any moisture under the paint. Some moisture in the SmoothPrime does not matter when adding additional coats of SmoothPrime. You might have heard in the distant past, someone had a real bad result and ! had to r emove a bad paint job because it did not stick. What is nice about SmoothPrime is it goes on so easily, cleans up with water. Rolling on is so easy...but leaves a rougher finish to then sand off. I used a small fine foam roller and wrapped it with cellophane after use until the next use. If wrapped well and I then could use the roller again even a week or more later. Spraying is more of a pain but gives a smoother finish requiring less sanding but more equipment cleanup. Don't sand in your shop or the great amount of sand dust will be all over everything. I found that 320 grit sand paper was a bit too rough and shows through if you use an expert painter, i.e., who applies just thick enough of paint coats to cover. Myself being well less than an expert painter applied considerably more paint, so I had to do considerable wet sanding of the finish paint... but that had the effect of erasing the 320 grit sand paper scratches that showed through. SmoothPrime, though being water based, adheres very well and sands very well, while drying to a harder surface than the Europa kit filler (epoxy based fillers) and even slightly harder than SuperFil. Hope this helps, sanding and filling is a big project. Bill -----Original Message----- >From: Fred Klein >Sent: Feb 20, 2012 6:54 PM >To: europa-list@matronics.com >Subject: Europa-List: Smooth Prime > > >To those of you who have used Smooth Prime on their Europa XS... > >Have you used it JUST on the filled/foam control surfaces?...or on the >ENTIRE airframe? > >In either case, how much material is necessary for the required THREE >(undiluted) COATS before sanding? > >Thanks in advance, > >Fred > >- > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message europa-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Europa-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/europa-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/europa-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.