---------------------------------------------------------- Europa-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sun 10/13/13: 18 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 11:44 AM - Re: Sub Panels....thanks (Alan Carter) 2. 11:53 AM - Re: Re: Sub Panels....thanks (houlihan) 3. 11:57 AM - Re: Re: Sub Panels....thanks (Kevin Challis) 4. 12:11 PM - Re: Sub Panels....thanks (Alan Carter) 5. 12:14 PM - =?utf-8?B?UmU6IEV1cm9wYS1MaXN0OiBSZTogU3ViIFBhbmVscy4uLi50aGFua3M=? (=?utf-8?B?cGV0ZUBsYXdsZXNzLmluZm8=?=) 6. 12:24 PM - NDB Let downs (Gerry Holland) 7. 12:31 PM - Re: NDB Let downs (DAVID JOYCE) 8. 12:33 PM - Re: Re: Sub Panels....thanks (DAVID JOYCE) 9. 12:38 PM - Re: NDB Let downs (houlihan) 10. 12:40 PM - Re: NDB Let downs (Alan Carter) 11. 12:56 PM - Re: NDB Let downs (Gerry Holland) 12. 02:18 PM - Fan Panel, maybe helpfull to those who are not builders (Alan Carter) 13. 02:34 PM - Re: Re: Re: Sub Panels....thanks (Kevin Challis) 14. 02:43 PM - Re: Fan Panel, maybe helpfull to those who are not builders (Fred Klein) 15. 02:48 PM - Re: Re: Re: Sub Panels....thanks (Kevin Challis) 16. 03:00 PM - Re: {Spam?} Re: Re: Re: Sub Panels....thanks (Pete Lawless) 17. 03:03 PM - Re: Re: Re: Sub Panels....thanks (Bob Hitchcock) 18. 09:55 PM - Re: {Spam?} Re: Re: Re: Sub Panels....thanks (Kevin Challis) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 11:44:34 AM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Re: Sub Panels....thanks From: "Alan Carter" Hi, Met my Examiner friend today, and he said the IMC rating is a 15 course with a test and written examine , it must be done on an aircraft with a C of A, with the appropriate equipment including a VOR and ADF, also you can not even do it on an American registered aircraft even with the gear, guess he had someone who wanted to do one on a N reg, and checked it out He seemed quit confident in his facts, I am just posting his comments not mine as I have not checked myself. Alan Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=410429#410429 ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 11:53:32 AM PST US Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re: Sub Panels....thanks From: houlihan Hi Alan. So you can't do it on a current C172 ? ADF is so last century I doubt if any aircraft made this century has a VOR and ADF. BTW Airbus 319;s certainly do not have either a VOR or an ADF. I could be wrong but. tim On 13 October 2013 19:43, Alan Carter wrote: > > > > Hi, > Met my Examiner friend today, and he said the IMC rating is a 15 course > with a test and written examine , it must be done on an aircraft with a C > of A, with the appropriate equipment including a VOR and ADF, also you can > not even do it on an American registered aircraft even with the gear, guess > he had someone who wanted to do one on a N reg, and checked it out > He seemed quit confident in his facts, I am just posting his comments not > mine as I have not checked myself. > Alan > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=410429#410429 > > ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 11:57:18 AM PST US Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re: Sub Panels....thanks From: Kevin Challis I have just completed the IMC on my Europa. Kev On 13 Oct 2013, at 20:43, "Alan Carter" wrote: > > Hi, > Met my Examiner friend today, and he said the IMC rating is a 15 course with a test and written examine , it must be done on an aircraft with a C of A, with the appropriate equipment including a VOR and ADF, also you can not even do it on an American registered aircraft even with the gear, guess he had someone who wanted to do one on a N reg, and checked it out > He seemed quit confident in his facts, I am just posting his comments not mine as I have not checked myself. > Alan > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=410429#410429 > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 12:11:34 PM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Re: Sub Panels....thanks From: "Alan Carter" Hi Kevin. Well congratulations in passing the test, I must say I find it hard to believe my Examiner is wrong, as he is usually right, I am going back to him with my tail between my legs. Many thanks. Alan Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=410434#410434 ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 12:14:44 PM PST US From: "=?utf-8?B?cGV0ZUBsYXdsZXNzLmluZm8=?=" Subject: Europa-List: =?utf-8?B?UmU6IEV1cm9wYS1MaXN0OiBSZTogU3ViIFBhbmVscy4uLi50aGFua3M=? 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I'm presuming it's probably the same with EasyJet. The young lad in my Hangar just gone professional and now has his CPL/IR (self funded!) and the IR certainly involved NDB letdowns. Regards Gerry Gerry Holland gholland@content-stream.co.uk +44 (0)7808 402404 White Ox Mead Airstrip, Bath. England ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 12:31:25 PM PST US From: DAVID JOYCE Subject: Re: Europa-List: NDB Let downs NDB usage is certainly part of the UK IMC test and training. VOR is also of course part of it.=0A-=0AAnd to finalise this discussion it is not legal to fly in IMC or train on our LAA permit Europa aircraft! which are cleare d for daylight VFR use only.=0A-=0Argds=0ADavid Joyce=0AThe other one.... =0A=0ASent to you from David Joyce=0Awww.eastmidsspas.com=0A=0A =0A=0A_____ ___________________________=0A From: Gerry Holland =0ATo: europa-list@matronics.com =0ASent: Sunday, 13 October 2013, 2 1:24=0ASubject: Europa-List: NDB Let downs=0A =0A=0A=0AA local Ryan Air Ca ptain here tells me that he does NDB letdowns regularly as some of their de stinations are not ILS equipped.=0AI'm presuming it's probably the same wit h EasyJet.=0AThe young lad in my Hangar just gone professional and now has his CPL/IR (self funded!) and the IR certainly involved NDB letdowns.=0AReg ards=0AGerry=0AGerry Holland=0A=0Agholland@content-stream.co.uk=0A+44 (0)78 08 402404=0A=0AWhite Ox Mead Airstrip, Bath. England ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 12:33:41 PM PST US From: DAVID JOYCE Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re: Sub Panels....thanks Wouldn't advertise this to the CAA=0A-=0A......=0A=0ASent to you from Dav id Joyce=0Awww.eastmidsspas.com=0A=0A =0A=0A_______________________________ _=0A From: Kevin Challis =0ATo: "europa-list@m atronics.com" =0ASent: Sunday, 13 October 2013, 19:55=0ASubject: Re: Europa-List: Re: Sub Panels....thanks=0A =0A=0A--> E uropa-List message posted by: Kevin Challis =0A=0AI have just completed the IMC on my Europa.=0A=0AKev=0A=0A=0AOn 13 Oc t 2013, at 20:43, "Alan Carter" wrote:=0A=0A> -- =0A> =0A> Hi,=0A> Met my Examiner friend today, and he said the IMC rating is a 15 course with a test and written examine , it must be done on an airc raft with a C of A, with the appropriate equipment including a VOR and ADF, also you can not even do it on an American registered aircraft even with t he gear, guess he had someone who wanted to do one on a N reg, and checked it out=0A> He seemed quit confident in his facts, I am just posting his com ments not mine as I have not checked myself.=0A> Alan=0A> =0A> =0A> =0A> =0A> Read this topic online here:=0A> =0A> http://forums.matronics.com/view topic.php?p=410429#410429=0A> =0A> =0A> =0A> =0A> =0A> =0A> =0A> =0A> =0A ================== ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 12:38:25 PM PST US Subject: Re: Europa-List: NDB Let downs From: houlihan Hi Gerry. I bet you will find that his Ryanair bomber has a simulated ADF derived from INS and GPS systems I doubt they have an ADF receiver fitted. Knowing Ryanair I bet they charge the crew to use the equipment installed. Tim On 13 October 2013 21:24, Gerry Holland wrote: > A local Ryan Air Captain here tells me that he does NDB letdowns regularly > as some of their destinations are not ILS equipped. > I'm presuming it's probably the same with EasyJet. > The young lad in my Hangar just gone professional and now has his CPL/IR > (self funded!) and the IR certainly involved NDB letdowns. > Regards > Gerry > > *Gerry Holland* > *gholland@content-stream.co.uk > +44 (0)7808 402404* > > * > White Ox Mead Airstrip, Bath. England* > > ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 12:40:57 PM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Re: NDB Let downs From: "Alan Carter" Hi. No problem with NDB approaches, a higher minima in ALT and Vis are used. Sometimes it VFR only landing, with an instrument approach with a break off height, then circle to land, often in mountainous terrain. Alan Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=410441#410441 ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 12:56:01 PM PST US From: Gerry Holland Subject: Re: Europa-List: NDB Let downs Tim Hi! You could be right on all counts! They seem to be fitted with Honeywell Quantum Line which does have VOR and ADF in the range somehow. Regards Gerry ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 02:18:25 PM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Fan Panel, maybe helpfull to those who are not builders From: "Alan Carter" Hello All. I am posting this article mainly for the Europa owner who have not built there aircraft and have limited tools, Just a Ruler, Hammer, Hack Saw ,Drill and Files, and about 8 to 16 hours of time. I also thing it would be nice if others posted and shared little projects and ideas to do with the Europa. I have a converted Classic to Tri gear the builder used lock nuts and bolts on the instrument sub panels, as i work totally on my own with little confidence i did not want to remove the whole instrument panel. So cut a hole in the top of the instrument panel big enough to get my hand down, i practised first by cutting different size panels in a cardboard box , this end up with me choosing a panel size of two 92 mm fans as i could then remove my instrument if needed through the hole, I ended up being able to remove the lock nuts and re make my main instrument main sub panel removable, however my little fan panel hole is still very useful. Two 92 mm Fans, Two Fan grills, Piece of alloy sheet, 6 Allen Bolts and lock nuts, Araldite, and maybe some little bits of Wood. You can my parts in Photo, Mark out and Cut the letter box out, with an opening to take the two fans. Mark out and Make the Fan plate, mark out and cut out the shapes, Drill the holes and fit the Fans and grills, to the plate. Drop into letter box and drill fixing holes for Allen bolts, Allen bolts are used as you can remove with the windscreen in place. To anchor these bolts, i used a strip of alloy drilling and filing the shape of each of the six nuts in the strip and bonding with Araldite. As the fans are 25 mm in depth i had to raise the fan plate about 1/4 by Aralditing a strip of wood round the edge to raise the fan clear of an instrument. Clean up and paint, Does not look much but it took me about 8 hours so far. Then. Mask Windscreen , work carefully use letter box to mark, then cut hole, thought this was plastic, Stanley Knife did not work, ended up cutting with half an hack Saw Blade small file, and sand paper,its actually made of Glass Fibre and a bit tougher than i thought. Make the six fixing holes in Glass fibre, then slid Letter Box underside and Araldite up, hold in place with bull dog clips, When set screw in Fan plate and wire up. Serves two purposes, maintenance panel and demister, I hope this is useful and of help to some none builders. The other bit is my FFM Panel goes in where the gear lever was, Cardboard denotes skin. Regards. Alan Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=410443#410443 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/cimg1086_477.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/cimg1089_204.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/cimg1089_194.jpg ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 02:34:59 PM PST US Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re: Europa-List: Re: Sub Panels....thanks From: Kevin Challis Still NDB, SRA, DME ARC, ILS using ADF, VOR, DME. But NOT GPS. Even though I understand they are switching These aids are off in the future. Kev On 13 Oct 2013, at 21:14, "pete@lawless.info" wrote: > Congratulations Kev > > What sort of IFR approaches do you have to fly these days? presumably you were not required to fly an ndb - the vintage nonsence we used to have to p erform. > > Pete > > > ----- Reply message ----- > From: "Kevin Challis" > To: "europa-list@matronics.com" > Subject: Europa-List: Re: Sub Panels....thanks > Date: Sun, Oct 13, 2013 19:55 > .uk> > > I have just completed the IMC on my Europa. > > Kev > > > On 13 Oct 2013, at 20:43, "Alan Carter" wrote: > et> > > > > Hi, > > Met my Examiner friend today, and he said the IMC rating is a 15 course w ith a test and written examine , it must be done on an aircraft with a C of A , with the appropriate equipment including a VOR and ADF, also you can not e ven do it on an American registered aircraft even with the gear, guess he ha d someone who wanted to do one on a N reg, and checked it out > > He seemed quit confident in his facts, I am just posting his comments no t mine as I have not checked myself. > > Alan > > > > > > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=410429#410429 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ========================== ========= ========================== ========= ========================== ========= ========================== ========= > > > > > -- > This message has been scanned for viruses and > dangerous content by Houxou, and is > believed to be clean. > > )=C2=AD=C3=C3=9F=C2=A2{l=B97=C2=B6r=B0h=C2=AFM4=C3=93M=1Fi=C3 =87=C5=93=C2=A2=C3=C3=A2z=C2=B9=C3=9E=C3=81=C3=8A.=C2=AE'=C2=ABN=17 =9E=C2=BA=C2=BA)h=C2=B8=C2=AC=C2=B4I=C5=A1=C5-Qh=C2=AE=C3=A9=9D=C2=B1 =C3=ABax=C3=86=C2=AD=C2=AE=B0=C3=A2r=C3=82=C3=A2=C2=B2=C3=91^j=C3=9B=C2 =ABz=C3=83Z=C2=BE(=1A=C2=B6=C5-=C3=AD=C2=A1=C2=BA=C3=A8=C3=82=C3=87=C2=AD =C3=A9=C5=A1=C5=B8"=C3=A2=C2=B2=C3=9B=C2=AD=C5-X=C2=AD=B0=C3=AB ,=C2=B9=C3=88Z=C2=B0=C2=B8=C2=AC=C2=B5I=C3J=C3=C3=ACr=C2=B8=C2=A9=C2=B6 *'=02=C2=B7!=C5-=C3=B7=99y=C2=C3=9C=9E:0=C5=BEZ=1Aw=C2=B0=C3 =9A=C3=88=1A=C3=A8=C3=82=C3=87=9A=C2=ABE=01=03=C3=A1=C2=A2=C3 =9A,=C2=C3=9Ejwf=C2=B9=C3=88f=C2=B9=C3=88f=C2=A2=C2=B7=C5=A1 -=C2=B7=C5=B8-=C3=9Bi=C3=C3=BC0=C3=82f=C2=AD=C2=AE=B0=C3=A2 r=C3=87(=BA=C3=B3Z=C2=BE(=1A=C2=B6=C5-=C3=84=C2=BA=C2=BA)h=C2=B8=C2=AC =C2=B6=1Bm=C2=A7=C3=C3=B0=C3=83 =C5=A1=C2=B6=C2=BA'=B0=C3=8B=1C =C2=A2o=C3=8Dj=C3=B8 j=C3=9A+=12=C3=C3=A8=C2=A5=C2=A2=C3=A2=C2=B2=C3=9F=C3 =9A0=04=C3=918=C3=92=02Ia=01=14=C3=A4T1$=C5=A1=84=A2=C3=A8+y=C2=AB\=C2=A2 {^=C5=BE=C3'=C2=A5=C2=B2-=C2=AFj)ZnW=C2=AF=B0=C2=ABayg =BA=16=C5-=C3=AE=C5=A1=C3=86=C2=A1=C2=AD=C3=A7=C3=A1=C2=B6=C3=9A=7F=C3=BD=C3 =BA+=C2=BAk&j=C3=9A=C3=A8=C5=BE',r=B0=C2=A1=C2=B6=C3=9A=7F=C3=BD=C3=BA +=C2=BAk&j=C3=9A=C3=A8=C5=BE',r=B0=C2h=C2=B8=C2=AC=C2=B4*'=C2=B6=C2 =B8=BA=C2=BA=C3=98=C2=A8=C2=9Dg=BAJ+^N=16=C2=A7=9C*.~=C5- =C3=B2=C2=A2=C3=C3-zw=C2=AB=C2=A2=C3=AB,=C2=BA=C5=A1h=C2=AE=C3=93=1A=C2 =B6=C3=90=C3=ABjY^.+-=01=C3=99=C2=A2=C2=9D=C2=A8ky=C3=B8m=C2=B6=C5=B8=C3=C3 =83=0C&j=C3=9A=C3=A8=C5=BE',r=B0=C2r=B0=C3=AD=C2=AE&=C3=AE=C2 =B6*'-=C3=9Bi=C3=C3=BC0=C3=82f=C2=AD=C2=AE=B0=C3=A2r=C3=87( =BA=C3=B7(=C5=BE=C3=9A=C3=A2n=C3=ABb=C2=A2=7F=C3=9A=C3=BD=C2=C3=9F=C2 =A2{=7F=C2=C2=B7=C2n=A1r=C3=BE=1Bf ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 02:43:07 PM PST US Subject: Re: Europa-List: Fan Panel, maybe helpfull to those who are not builders From: Fred Klein Alan, Impeccable work...makes me wonder what a whole plane under your hand would be like... Envious that you're flying, Fred On Oct 13, 2013, at 2:17 PM, Alan Carter wrote: > > Hello All. > I am posting this article mainly for the Europa owner who have not built there aircraft and have limited tools, ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 02:48:41 PM PST US Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re: Europa-List: Re: Sub Panels....thanks From: Kevin Challis You don't have to be in IMC to train, you use a Sight limiting device I used plastic glasses that only allow you to see the panel. It would be illegal to fly in cloud in a Europa but if I get stuck I would p refer to break the law and land than crash! The IMC is a get out of trouble r ating anyway. Kev On 13 Oct 2013, at 23:34, Kevin Challis wrote: > Still NDB, SRA, DME ARC, ILS using ADF, VOR, DME. But NOT GPS. Even though I understand they are switching These aids are off in the future. > > Kev > > > On 13 Oct 2013, at 21:14, "pete@lawless.info" wrote: > >> Congratulations Kev >> >> What sort of IFR approaches do you have to fly these days? presumably yo u were not required to fly an ndb - the vintage nonsence we used to have to p erform. >> >> Pete >> >> >> ----- Reply message ----- >> From: "Kevin Challis" >> To: "europa-list@matronics.com" >> Subject: Europa-List: Re: Sub Panels....thanks >> Date: Sun, Oct 13, 2013 19:55 >> o.uk> >> >> I have just completed the IMC on my Europa. >> >> Kev >> >> >> On 13 Oct 2013, at 20:43, "Alan Carter" wrote: >> net> >> > >> > Hi, >> > Met my Examiner friend today, and he said the IMC rating is a 15 course with a test and written examine , it must be done on an aircraft with a C o f A, with the appropriate equipment including a VOR and ADF, also you can no t even do it on an American registered aircraft even with the gear, guess he had someone who wanted to do one on a N reg, and checked it out >> > He seemed quit confident in his facts, I am just posting his comments n ot mine as I have not checked myself. >> > Alan >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > Read this topic online here: >> > >> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=410429#410429 >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> >> >> ========================= ========= >> tp://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List >> ========================= ========= >> cs.com >> ========================= ========= >> matronics.com/contribution >> ========================= ========= >> >> >> >> >> -- >> This message has been scanned for viruses and >> dangerous content by Houxou, and is >> believed to be clean. >> >> )=C2=AD=C3=C3=9F=C2=A2{l=B97=C2=B6r=B0h=C2=AFM4=C3=93M=1Fi =C3=87=C5=93=C2=A2=C3=C3=A2z=C2=B9=C3=9E=C3=81=C3=8A.=C2=AE'=C2=ABN=17 =9E=C2=BA=C2=BA)h=C2=B8=C2=AC=C2=B4I=C5=A1=C5-Qh=C2=AE=C3=A9=9D=C2 =B1=C3=ABax=C3=86=C2=AD=C2=AE=B0=C3=A2r=C3=82=C3=A2=C2=B2=C3=91^j=C3=9B =C2=ABz=C3=83Z=C2=BE(=1A=C2=B6=C5-=C3=AD=C2=A1=C2=BA=C3=A8=C3=82=C3=87=C2=AD =C3=A9=C5=A1=C5=B8"=C3=A2=C2=B2=C3=9B=C2=AD=C5-X=C2=AD=B0=C3 =AB,=C2=B9=C3=88Z=C2=B0=C2=B8=C2=AC=C2=B5I=C3J=C3=C3=ACr=C2=B8=C2=A9=C2 =B6*'=02=C2=B7!=C5-=C3=B7=99y=C2=C3=9C=9E:0=C5=BEZ=1Aw=C2=B0 =C3=9A=C3=88=1A=C3=A8=C3=82=C3=87=9A=C2=ABE=01=03=C3=A1=C2=A2 =C3=9A,=C2=C3=9Ejwf=C2=B9=C3=88f=C2=B9=C3=88f=C2=A2=C2=B7=C5=A1 -=C2=B7=C5=B8-=C3=9Bi=C3=C3=BC0=C3=82f=C2=AD=C2=AE=B0=C3 =A2r=C3=87(=BA=C3=B3Z=C2=BE(=1A=C2=B6=C5-=C3=84=C2=BA=C2=BA)h=C2=B8=C2 =AC=C2=B6=1Bm=C2=A7=C3=C3=B0=C3=83 =C5=A1=C2=B6=C2=BA'=B0=C3=8B=1C =C2=A2o=C3=8Dj=C3=B8 j=C3=9A+=12=C3=C3=A8=C2=A5=C2=A2=C3=A2=C2=B2=C3=9F=C3 =9A0=04=C3=918=C3=92=02Ia=01=14=C3=A4T1$=C5=A1=84=A2=C3=A8+y=C2=AB\=C2=A2 {^=C5=BE=C3'=C2=A5=C2=B2-=C2=AFj)ZnW=C2=AF=B0=C2=ABayg =BA=16=C5-=C3=AE=C5=A1=C3=86=C2=A1=C2=AD=C3=A7=C3=A1=C2=B6=C3=9A=7F=C3=BD=C3 =BA+=C2=BAk&j=C3=9A=C3=A8=C5=BE',r=B0=C2=A1=C2=B6=C3=9A=7F=C3=BD=C3=BA +=C2=BAk&j=C3=9A=C3=A8=C5=BE',r=B0=C2h=C2=B8=C2=AC=C2=B4*'=C2=B6=C2 =B8=BA=C2=BA=C3=98=C2=A8=C2=9Dg=BAJ+^N=16=C2=A7=9C*.~=C5- =C3=B2=C2=A2=C3=C3-zw=C2=AB=C2=A2=C3=AB,=C2=BA=C5=A1h=C2=AE=C3=93=1A=C2 =B6=C3=90=C3=ABjY^.+-=01=C3=99=C2=A2=C2=9D=C2=A8ky=C3=B8m=C2=B6=C5=B8=C3=C3 =83=0C&j=C3=9A=C3=A8=C5=BE',r=B0=C2r=B0=C3=AD=C2=AE&=C3=AE=C2 =B6*'-=C3=9Bi=C3=C3=BC0=C3=82f=C2=AD=C2=AE=B0=C3=A2r=C3=87( =BA=C3=B7(=C5=BE=C3=9A=C3=A2n=C3=ABb=C2=A2=7F=C3=9A=C3=BD=C2=C3=9F=C2 =A2{=7F=C2=C2=B7=C2n=A1r=C3=BE=1Bf > > ========================== ========= ========================== ========= ========================== ========= ========================== ========= > ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 03:00:15 PM PST US From: "Pete Lawless" Subject: RE: {Spam?} Re: Europa-List: Re: Europa-List: Re: Sub Panels....thanks Kev What have you got installed by way of avionics in the aeroplane? Sounds like you have a full fit. Pete -----Original Message----- From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Kevin Challis Sent: 13 October 2013 22:34 Subject: {Spam?} Re: Europa-List: Re: Europa-List: Re: Sub Panels....thanks Still NDB, SRA, DME ARC, ILS using ADF, VOR, DME. But NOT GPS. Even though I understand they are switching These aids are off in the future. Kev On 13 Oct 2013, at 21:14, "pete@lawless.info" wrote: Congratulations Kev What sort of IFR approaches do you have to fly these days? presumably you were not required to fly an ndb - the vintage nonsence we used to have to perform. Pete ----- Reply message ----- From: "Kevin Challis" Subject: Europa-List: Re: Sub Panels....thanks I have just completed the IMC on my Europa. Kev On 13 Oct 2013, at 20:43, "Alan Carter" wrote: > > Hi, > Met my Examiner friend today, and he said the IMC rating is a 15 course with a test and written examine , it must be done on an aircraft with a C of A, with the appropriate equipment including a VOR and ADF, also you can not even do it on an American registered aircraft even with the gear, guess he had someone who wanted to do one on a N reg, and checked it out > He seemed quit confident in his facts, I am just posting his comments not mine as I have not checked myself. > Alan > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=410429#410429 > > > > > > > > > > ========= tp://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List ========= cs.com ========= matronics.com/contribution ========= -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by Houxou, and is believed to be clean. )=C2=AD=C3=C3=9F=C2=A2{l=B97=C2=B6r=B0h=C2=AFM4=C3=93M=C2=AD i=C3=87=C5=93=C2=A2=C3=C3=A2z=C2=B9=C3=9E=C3=81=C3=8A.=C2=AE'=C2=ABN =9E=C2=BA=C2=BA)h=C2=B8=C2=AC=C2=B4I=C5=A1=C5-Qh=C2=AE=C3=A9=9D =C2=B1=C3=ABax=C3=86=C2=AD=C2=AE=B0=C3=A2r=C3=82=C3=A2=C2=B2=C3=91^ j=C3=9B=C2=ABz=C3=83Z=C2=BE(=C2=B6=C5-=C3=AD=C2=A1=C2=BA=C3=A8=C3=82=C3 =87=C2=AD=C3=A9=C5=A1=C5=B8"=C3=A2=C2=B2=C3=9B=C2=AD=C5-X=C2=AD =B0=C3=AB,=C2=B9=C3=88Z=C2=B0=C2=B8=C2=AC=C2=B5I=C3J=C3=C3=AC r=C2=B8=C2=A9=C2=B6*'[1]=C2=B7!=C5-=C3=B7=99y=C2=C3=9C=9E :0=C5=BEZw=C2=B0=C3=9A=C3=88=C3=A8=C3=82=C3=87=9A=C2=ABE _____ =C3=A1=C2=A2=C3=9A,=C2=C3=9Ejwf=C2=B9=C3=88f=C2=B9=C3=88f=C2=A2 =C2=B7=C5=A1-=C2=B7=C5=B8-=C3=9Bi=C3=C3=BC0=C3=82f=C2=AD =C2=AE=B0=C3=A2r=C3=87(=BA=C3=B3Z=C2=BE(=C2=B6=C5-=C3=84=C2 =BA=C2=BA)h=C2=B8=C2=AC=C2=B6m=C2=A7=C3=C3=B0=C3=83 =C5=A1=C2=B6=C2=BA'=B0=C3=8B=1C=C2=A2o=C3=8Dj=C3=B8 j=C3=9A+=12=C3=C3=A8=C2=A5=C2=A2=C3=A2=C2=B2=C3=9F=C3=9A0 _____ =C3=918=C3=92[1]Ia=14=C3=A4T1$=C5=A1=84=A2=C3=A8+y=C2=AB\=C2=A2{^=C5=BE =C3'=C2=A5=C2=B2-=C2=AFj)ZnW=C2=AF=B0=C2=ABayg=BA=C5 -=C3=AE=C5=A1=C3=86=C2=A1=C2=AD=C3=A7=C3=A1=C2=B6=C3=9A=7F=C3=BD=C3=BA+ =C2=BAk&j=C3=9A=C3=A8=C5=BE',r=B0=C2=A1=C2=B6=C3=9A=7F=C3=BD=C3=BA+ =C2=BAk&j=C3=9A=C3=A8=C5=BE',r=B0=C2h=C2=B8=C2=AC=C2=B4*'=C2=B6=C2 =B8=BA=C2=BA=C3=98=C2=A8=C2=9Dg=BAJ+^N=C2=A7=9C*.~=C5- =C3=B2=C2=A2=C3=C3-zw=C2=AB=C2=A2=C3=AB,=C2=BA=C5=A1h=C2=AE=C3=93=C2 =B6=C3=90=C3=ABjY^.+-=C3=99=C2=A2=C2=9D=C2=A8ky=C3=B8m=C2=B6=C5=B8=C3=C3 =83 &j=C3=9A=C3=A8=C5=BE',r=B0=C2r=B0=C3=AD=C2=AE&=C3=AE=C2=B6 *'-=C3=9Bi=C3=C3=BC0=C3=82f=C2=AD=C2=AE=B0=C3=A2r=C3=87( =BA=C3=B7(=C5=BE=C3=9A=C3=A2n=C3=ABb=C2=A2=7F=C3=9A=C3=BD=C2=C3=9F =C2=A2{=7F=C2=C2=B7=C2n=A1r=C3=BEf -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by Houxou, and is believed to be clean. ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 03:03:46 PM PST US Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re: Europa-List: Re: Sub Panels....thanks From: Bob Hitchcock http://www.lightaircraftassociation.co.uk/2012/Magazine/July/instruments%20q ualifications.pdf On 13 Oct 2013, at 22:48, Kevin Challis wrote: > You don't have to be in IMC to train, you use a Sight limiting device I us ed plastic glasses that only allow you to see the panel. > > It would be illegal to fly in cloud in a Europa but if I get stuck I would prefer to break the law and land than crash! The IMC is a get out of troubl e rating anyway. > > Kev > > > On 13 Oct 2013, at 23:34, Kevin Challis wrot e: > >> Still NDB, SRA, DME ARC, ILS using ADF, VOR, DME. But NOT GPS. Even thoug h I understand they are switching These aids are off in the future. >> >> Kev >> >> >> On 13 Oct 2013, at 21:14, "pete@lawless.info" wrote: >> >>> Congratulations Kev >>> >>> What sort of IFR approaches do you have to fly these days? presumably y ou were not required to fly an ndb - the vintage nonsence we used to have to perform. >>> >>> Pete >>> >>> >>> ----- Reply message ----- >>> From: "Kevin Challis" >>> To: "europa-list@matronics.com" >>> Subject: Europa-List: Re: Sub Panels....thanks >>> Date: Sun, Oct 13, 2013 19:55 >>> co.uk> >>> >>> I have just completed the IMC on my Europa. >>> >>> Kev >>> >>> >>> On 13 Oct 2013, at 20:43, "Alan Carter" wrote : >>> .net> >>> > >>> > Hi, >>> > Met my Examiner friend today, and he said the IMC rating is a 15 cours e with a test and written examine , it must be done on an aircraft with a C o f A, with the appropriate equipment including a VOR and ADF, also you can no t even do it on an American registered aircraft even with the gear, guess he had someone who wanted to do one on a N reg, and checked it out >>> > He seemed quit confident in his facts, I am just posting his comments n ot mine as I have not checked myself. >>> > Alan >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > Read this topic online here: >>> > >>> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=410429#410429 >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> >>> >>> ======================== >>> tp://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List >>> ======================== >>> cs.com >>> ======================== >>> matronics.com/contribution >>> ======================== >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> This message has been scanned for viruses and >>> dangerous content by Houxou, and is >>> believed to be clean. >>> >>> )=C2=AD=C3=C3=9F=C2=A2{l=B97=C2=B6r=B0h=C2=AFM4=C3=93M=1F i=C3=87=C5=93=C2=A2=C3=C3=A2z=C2=B9=C3=9E=C3=81=C3=8A.=C2=AE'=C2=ABN=17 =9E=C2=BA=C2=BA)h=C2=B8=C2=AC=C2=B4I=C5=A1=C5-Qh=C2=AE=C3=A9=9D=C2 =B1=C3=ABax=C3=86=C2=AD=C2=AE=B0=C3=A2r=C3=82=C3=A2=C2=B2=C3=91^j=C3=9B =C2=ABz=C3=83Z=C2=BE(=1A=C2=B6=C5-=C3=AD=C2=A1=C2=BA=C3=A8=C3=82=C3=87=C2=AD =C3=A9=C5=A1=C5=B8"=C3=A2=C2=B2=C3=9B=C2=AD=C5-X=C2=AD=B0=C3 =AB,=C2=B9=C3=88Z=C2=B0=C2=B8=C2=AC=C2=B5I=C3J=C3=C3=ACr=C2=B8=C2=A9=C2 =B6*'=02=C2=B7!=C5-=C3=B7=99y=C2=C3=9C=9E:0=C5=BEZ=1Aw=C2=B0 =C3=9A=C3=88=1A=C3=A8=C3=82=C3=87=9A=C2=ABE=01=03=C3=A1=C2=A2 =C3=9A,=C2=C3=9Ejwf=C2=B9=C3=88f=C2=B9=C3=88f=C2=A2=C2=B7=C5=A1 -=C2=B7=C5=B8-=C3=9Bi=C3=C3=BC0=C3=82f=C2=AD=C2=AE=B0=C3 =A2r=C3=87(=BA=C3=B3Z=C2=BE(=1A=C2=B6=C5-=C3=84=C2=BA=C2=BA)h=C2=B8=C2 =AC=C2=B6=1Bm=C2=A7=C3=C3=B0=C3=83 =C5=A1=C2=B6=C2=BA'=B0=C3=8B=1C =C2=A2o=C3=8Dj=C3=B8 j=C3=9A+=12=C3=C3=A8=C2=A5=C2=A2=C3=A2=C2=B2=C3=9F=C3 =9A0=04=C3=918=C3=92=02Ia=01=14=C3=A4T1$=C5=A1=84=A2=C3=A8+y=C2=AB\=C2=A2 {^=C5=BE=C3'=C2=A5=C2=B2-=C2=AFj)ZnW=C2=AF=B0=C2=ABayg =BA=16=C5-=C3=AE=C5=A1=C3=86=C2=A1=C2=AD=C3=A7=C3=A1=C2=B6=C3=9A=7F=C3=BD=C3 =BA+=C2=BAk&j=C3=9A=C3=A8=C5=BE',r=B0=C2=A1=C2=B6=C3=9A=7F=C3=BD=C3=BA +=C2=BAk&j=C3=9A=C3=A8=C5=BE',r=B0=C2h=C2=B8=C2=AC=C2=B4*'=C2=B6=C2 =B8=BA=C2=BA=C3=98=C2=A8=C2=9Dg=BAJ+^N=16=C2=A7=9C*.~=C5- =C3=B2=C2=A2=C3=C3-zw=C2=AB=C2=A2=C3=AB,=C2=BA=C5=A1h=C2=AE=C3=93=1A=C2 =B6=C3=90=C3=ABjY^.+-=01=C3=99=C2=A2=C2=9D=C2=A8ky=C3=B8m=C2=B6=C5=B8=C3=C3 =83=0C&j=C3=9A=C3=A8=C5=BE',r=B0=C2r=B0=C3=AD=C2=AE&=C3=AE=C2 =B6*'-=C3=9Bi=C3=C3=BC0=C3=82f=C2=AD=C2=AE=B0=C3=A2r=C3=87( =BA=C3=B7(=C5=BE=C3=9A=C3=A2n=C3=ABb=C2=A2=7F=C3=9A=C3=BD=C2=C3=9F=C2 =A2{=7F=C2=C2=B7=C2n=A1r=C3=BE=1Bf >> >> >> ========================= ========= >> tp://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List >> ========================= ========= >> cs.com >> ========================= ========= >> matronics.com/contribution >> ========================= ========= >> > > ========================== ========= ========================== ========= ========================== ========= ========================== ========= > ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 09:55:53 PM PST US Subject: Re: {Spam?} Re: Europa-List: Re: Europa-List: Re: Sub Panels....thanks From: Kevin Challis Pete I am very poor, I didn't build the plane. The previous owner / builder was v ery rich and fitted the plane out with ILS, VOR, DME etc. Unfortunately he d idn't seem to spend very much on the paint job but I bought it for a good pr ice so I can't moan. Kev On 13 Oct 2013, at 23:59, "Pete Lawless" wrote: > Kev > > What have you got installed by way of avionics in the aeroplane? =C3=82 So unds like you have a full fit. > > Pete > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-ser ver@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Kevin Challis > Sent: 13 October 2013 22:34 > To: europa-list@matronics.com > Subject: {Spam?} Re: Europa-List: Re: Europa-List: Re: Sub Panels....thank s > > =C3=82 Still NDB, SRA, DME ARC, ILS using ADF, VOR, DME. But NOT GPS. Even though I understand they are switching These aids are off in the future. > > Kev > > > On 13 Oct 2013, at 21:14, "pete@lawless.info" wrote: > >> Congratulations Kev >> >> What sort of IFR approaches do you have to fly these days? presumably yo u were not required to fly an ndb - the vintage nonsence we used to have to p erform. >> >> Pete >> >> >> ----- Reply message ----- >> From: "Kevin Challis" >> To: "europa-list@matronics.com" >> Subject: Europa-List: Re: Sub Panels....thanks >> Date: Sun, Oct 13, 2013 19:55 >> >> o.uk> >> >> I have just completed the IMC on my Europa. >> >> Kev >> >> >> On 13 Oct 2013, at 20:43, "Alan Carter" wrote: >> net> >> > >> > Hi, >> > Met my Examiner friend today, and he said the IMC rating is a 15 course with a test and written examine , it must be done on an aircraft with a C o f A, with the appropriate equipment including a VOR and ADF, also you can no t even do it on an American registered aircraft even with the gear, guess he had someone who wanted to do one on a N reg, and checked it out >> > He seemed quit confident in his facts, I am just posting his comments n ot mine as I have not checked myself. >> > Alan >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > Read this topic online here: >> > >> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=410429#410429 >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> >> >> ========================= ========= >> tp://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List >> ========================= ========= >> cs.com >> ========================= ========= >> matronics.com/contribution >> ========================= ========= >> >> >> >> >> -- >> This message has been scanned for viruses and >> dangerous content by Houxou, and is >> believed to be clean. >> >> )=C3=82=C2=AD=C3=83=C2=C3=83=C5=B8=C3=82=C2=A2{l=C3=A2=82=AC=C2=B97 =C3=82=C2=B6r=C3=A2=82=AC=C2=B0h=C3=82=C2=AFM4=C3=83=9CM=C3=82=C2=AD i=C3=83=A1=C3=85=9C=C3=82=C2=A2=C3=83=C2=C3=83=C2=A2z=C3=82=C2 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